Yay I fixed it!!!
See below for Taliadu
http://www.facet5global.com/lifecycle.html
http://www.alittlebitofpersonality.com/
http://lesswrong.com/lw/1xq/let_there_be_light/
http://greatexpectations8553.blogspot.ie/2014/07/temperaments-and-ninjas_21.html ??????? noooo do not
http://similarminds.com/cattell-16-factor.html ??
matter stuff
mindstuff/skillstuff
telepathy/communicationstuff/peoplestuff
luckstuff
forcefields/protections/immortality
mover stuff
bodystuff/enhancement
timestuff
knowledgestuff
illusions
scripts
cinematicstuff
Taliadu
Puzzle World = Taliadu
Magic System = Kaluno
Explaining from scratch:
Taliadu is the name of the world
Kaluno is the name of the magic system initially acquired by going to Taliadu
When you arrive in Taliadu your first time, you are stuck there until you become a Master of Puzzles and make your own version of it
The version you arrive in also has a Master of Puzzles
They are not at all guaranteed to be paying attention or intervening - the main thing is that they created the world and made it to contain various situations and circumstances in which to them there is an Obviously Correct way to act
And it's a sort of path/sequential journey thing where you must find the thing they intended you to do and to it to go forward (you can still go back to a previous part to remind yourself what happened but by default if you try to turn around and go back where you came from without specifically intending to go visit an already solved part you end up in a sort of "safe room" thing kind of like a house in terraria or whatnot)
also does """side quests"""
when you are at the end you become a Master of Puzzles and then you create your own version and then you can totally teleport away or Taliadu might even help you with that if you didn't develop that power
if anyone is teleported/portalsnaked/etc to any part of Taliadu, no matter where exactly, Taliadu itself kind of randomly decides which particular implementation of it the person will be stuck in. If you are a Puzzle Master you can filter out people to some extent but only very little. You can filter out omnicidal maniac and some very strong categories like it but you can't do like, male/female/etc or "prone to sadness" or "altruistic"
>>>[can the master of puzzles] either show them the area they've designed or set them up with their own puzzle-stuff[?] (or, for that matter, both :P)
for the former they can figure out some virtual realityish thing,
for the latter if they just teleport a person there then the person will vanish into whatever version of itself Taliadu assigns them and the Puzzle Master / Master of Puzzles can visit them while they're not solving but can't help them solve
the safe room is cute and has fluffy things and provides material needs things and a bed and a "refreshener" for dealing with all bathroom-related and clothes-related and cleanliness-related things at once
you can tell it's my setting
yes XD
:smile:
>books? computer? tools? (like, does it have those things? does it customize for person?)
former: No, it actually doesn't! Because there's improv and you can conjure any specific thing you want!
latter: it does in fact customize by color preferences and food preferences and triggers and things but not by having objects people can just as easily get by figuring out improv (which is pretty easy), if you know what I mean?
>how do you figure out Improv?
If you want something, you get a sort of feedbacky thing, and if you pay attention to the feedbacky thing you can kind of figure out things to try (the correct thing is just wanting something and saying something to that effect, whether it be saying "I demand this thing" or "I kind of want this thing, can I get it" or just naming the thing)
so i got off track on the explaining in a good order part so I'ma do that again but do feel free to ask, i like
Kaluno is the magic system you get, as stated above
It has five aspects, and each works a different way and has different effects or the same effects but manifesting in a different way
Improv
The simplest is improv - basically want and say so
It does conjuration and vanishing and teleportation and changing temperature and some other very straightforward one-time effects with some maybe-odd things creeping in such as "remind" (retrieve a single specific memory (phone number, title of song, etc))
Drama
Then there's drama, which is more ritual-y,
and manipulates time and luck as a sort of side effect of being in a ritual which is occasionally useful,
and also does temporary experience-y (basically fun to use kind of?) powers
and also creation of intelligent artifacts/Basically Person-Smart Pokemon ("familiars")/created out of nowhere people with magic ("helpers").
They sometimes have multiple forms, including book-to-staff style and also occasionally Brilliance-style where they go from looking human to looking like an object or any other combination.
Familiars can also be more abstract than pokemon normally are (cloud of sparkles, whatever).
They are guaranteed to be, at the moment of creation, not suicidal, not homicidal, not actively hating (displeased is a yes) their creator in particular
(possibly other things that have not occured to me but basically they are by default more or less safe (NO SAURON NO NAHIRA-ALT)
but they can be like the one ring defanged or a Jean or whatever the hell).
They have powers on their own sufficient for self defence and not being stuck without a bearer but the bigger part of their power is when they cooperate with a bearer (not necessarily their creator). Cooperate also includes like, cutting them off if they're about to do something extremely stupid even if they want to, though. There is also consensual summoning.
half an hour and i'm back, the mystery in the mystery shack
so i think i should do lists first and then explain each thing in the list
Aesthetic
the peopleishness of the powers
the thing where there is autonomousness but not personhood
what kinds of powers are aesthetic powers
the for-the-aesthetic
how the synesthesia works/
aaanyway uh did I miss anything in the aesthetic list?
you can see magic
>>>--like metamancer kaede?
and you can also channel this seeing magic
no wait
it's originally just seeing magic
but you can channel it/turn it into
being synesthetic
and it's a specific brand of synesthesia that is personally suited to you and will translate well to just magic patterns
>>>--like /Lazarus/?
yes I think that's closer probably
except it's a conscious switch
>>>so you have that
>>>with two modes
yes and it's set up such that if it looks aesthetic/pretty/etc in one mode it'll be that in another mode
additionally, if a magic looks aesthetic it'll be something that... works/is a coherent magic/etc
>>>so you have this sense
>>>and then...[?]
and then you can alter things
and you probably want to alter them in a way that is aesthetic
>>>how intuitive is being able to alter them / how you do that?
extremely so in the "do anything at all" case (think moving limbs at all in any way doesn't matter where they end up), and you have to practice and focus to get things ~exactly right~ but it doesn't take much (think connecting dots - you will with practice do neater curves and lines but you can probably connect the dots right off the bat if you don't rush and pay a little attention to make sure line and dot join up)
Puzzle
the young wizards materials thing
the prodding a power to expand it
(the getting a 'thing' and prodding it)
the weird physics
conceptually simple stuff
enhancement, protection, body things
you know what i already have an explanation somewhere
ok here:
"It's kiind of once and done but it gets you a permamagic thing (power or artifact) and you can tweak it reasonable amounts and 'apply' it, so, say you get a puzzle power of making things be the consistency of play-do, you'd have to figure out how to apply it to wood and then tweak it to also be appliable to metal and your own blood and to undo and etc" "Oh I did not say! You can create, like, perpetual fire/ice/engines with puzzle! Also it is particularly useful for things like shields. And other protections."
But also recently I figured out that it also has body things and enhancements in the general area of haut/vampires and stuff and also it does things like resurrection and improving how various technological things work (computer overheating, speed - or way lower tech than that, chalk doesn't make the annoying noise on the blackboard)
Also it does Weird Physics and you can if you get the right power make magical improvements to normal objects contagious
Also it does things with less of the - heartsong and Felix Felicis and etc vibe to them? The seeming to be designed by and run on primarily human brain architecture. Like I'm pretty sure my initial statement of "telepathy goes to aesthetic" was right in the case of the fancy designed by me telepathy but brainphone totally goes to puzzle (even maybe osanwe) and so do things like Bags of Holding and resurrection and the more or less complete but less thoroughly aesthetic form of telekinesis
one example of a magical improvement would be "looking at something through a ring or the kind that is worn on a finger penetrates illusions"
>>>"it's kiind of once and done"? like, you can only use the magic system once?
there are many possible effects and you get them by solving puzzles of magic and you can tell the magic which effects you want but ultimately you don't get to pick but they're more powers and amulets so you do the puzzle solving once and then the power or artifact persists
explaining concepts -
young wizards materials thing is - you know Syntropy in Effulgence? that setting is taken from the Young Wizards series, but it's slightly different
and in that series (and possibly in Syntropy too i forget) wizards can make (well, persuade, but that element is not present in puzzle) materials act differently (like, wood behaving like play-doh or something like that)
heartsong is kind of like there being a song in a musical, where everyone knows the lyrics and the moves and automatically dances and sings well, but then right afterward the Fourth Wall is broken by "we just randomly began singing what the hell" and also you can refrain from participating
Code
Code either "doesn't compile" or has bugs - does not do the thing it is supposed to be doing, or if it's major does something completely crazy, but it will definitely be safe
Even if the spell is like "set x on fire if y or z is true"
>>>so there's a debug layer in code that makes sure it doesn't do anything too awful?
(In some cases it'll do charming randomness) And yes probably that seems like the right concept
Also spells have version control
And as i mentioned you can import from the other aspects and even reverse engineer some puzzle or drama stuff (but not really aesthetic stuff, from that it's really only snippets) and also if you integrate a magic system you can import that too
(gosh i want mori to comment on this)
how persony is improv?
improv is... it goes by what you mean and aims for actual objects that exist and things
what are some good examples on which I could explain further
Altpoof Plot Ideas
yeah I'm just consulting her... I guess people call it "meta instance"
the way I see it, here are the ways she'd be interesting
- some "hard" world (Worm Arda etc you know the ones) where she just figures things out and solves them
- some world with things where she can't directly affect the problem and has to solve it some nonmagical way (something like Downside basically where you would need to talk to the admin, though maybe not that in particular)
- some world where she can eventually just solve it with magic but things are not urgent enough she feels the need to fork+time dilate+etc
- some world with characters that would be interesting with her, particularly people who want magic and sure seem like they're gonna do good things with it but how would you know? There is no 'mint containment protocol' with Kaluno. Constructed sub magic systems you can do that but they probably won't be able to do as many things as Kaluno... Also particularly people who seem likely to interact interestingly with her nonmagical weirdness
[3:36 PM] dilnu: as a writing tip, you maybe only need to have her consider the relevant powers or those she's specifically considering
[3:36 PM] dilnu: but I have a fair number of lists in my stories so yeah it's sometimes needed
Altpoof powers
major:
aesthetic
perfect memory thing - very fancy, also includes other mental enhancements and editing
heartsongs. but I am not going to come up with lyrics probably unless I think of an existing song that fits
an announce-y thing that announces important and convenient things
fancy water aura thing
cleaning thing
time dilation, called "time to think" - very fancy
off by default flowers where she walks
puzzle
a bunch of protections she's trying to unify into all one thing so they won't be distracting but so far no dice
a subspace pockety sort of thing
a body power that is in fact satisfactory - a sort of Ghosty thing except while she's inhabiting her body it is not biological it is just kind of - made of the same material behaving differently
-needlessness
-enhancements
off by default
forking, teleportation, forcefields, thoroughly multimedia illusions, various change-properties powers, a plant prodding power, various amulet+symbol stuff, all sorts of body-manipulation things, messing with taste and nutritional content of food
drama
a spidey sense/earthbending sense thing
an optimised flight ritual
a sneaking thing
a spotlight thing
turning into several animals incl snake and cat
(oath??? Bobby-type)
Ring
a ring artifact that does same things as in my dream, plus good telepathy with it in particular and as mentioned magical girlness
(an aesthetic power that synergises with the ring's magical girlness and does the whole proper transformation thing)
(
both of those help out with composing/remembering/not tripping over/not being distracted while she says it magical-girl-style phrases
and the kind of magical girlness that comes from the ring
which is:
feedbacky-like-Rainbow complex matter manipulation (+tk),
combatty-stuff like [Suranse (Force Stun Lightning etc, with fwm sfx as is right and proper) and HP (Somnium! Petrificus Totalus! Stupefy! Expelliarmus! ...) (I mean the effects) and Rainbow/Wish (beams of light, iirc)] - these all have the composed magical girly (and not HP-spell-y) things but those are not actually necessary but she keeps it secret as long as her brain brains well enough
info handling like the orange ring(!)
access to puzzle powers
more freestyle things like Gem's fudging the monitors and the Be Okay spell and the walking-is-like-flying thing and the barriers I think those might exist because there isn't nearly enough Rainbow glowfic so. also barrier jacket which is (secretly) redundant with the protections
)
code
an alert-her-to-illusions thing
detecting various things spells (£)
finding various things spells (£)
things for enhancing senses all kinds
turning into a chair and turning into a lamp post - interacts with bodything
anti-bugs thing
improv
practice quickly conjuring and using firearms (see: the aaaa that was insisted on)
giant slingshots
fire
teleportation
how ring happened, story:
but then it turned out i had this magic which was a combo of Suranse, Effulgence Rainbow (Devices), and Wish.
i had a "mood ring" (literally what it was called and also it accurately showed my mood) that, if worn, can turn into a Suranse-combat-casting type staff at a moment's notice
and also lets me transform into a magical girl (but that needs a few seconds and apparently the villains i was used to dealing with were very speedy so it was not a good idea to give them that long if already in the middle of combat)
and that was very aesthetic (the magical girlness was both like Rainbow and Wish)
Altpoof magical girl outfit:
Transparent and insubstantial hideable on request wings fading into nonexistence where they would meet her back, hair in intricate braid, lengthened from where my hair is and going in this fancy way all around her head, light pink very deep gloves
braiding is something in the genre of
https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQw7e5gF4JEN_fM7VX7dCvqiro524pxnPVVNYOK0D2Kj231xuZlOA
/files/justpaste/d416/a15279581/36697219272e318f20433af78a7ebe92.jpg
/files/justpaste/d416/a15279581/1be46447eabf3d7ada1eca9c950891b9.jpg
https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRwvEblcfjHcUTk3cc4ETh2F0zYe3a-xXY_pgxTIGwbG1aYQCjl
/files/justpaste/d416/a15279581/cfaa940de115ed0099d56a742c77b276.jpg
it's like, they do something fancy on top of her head and then they go down into two thick braids
(there is ~convenience magic~ involved in them not being all over the everything shhh)
and then there's fancy-looking boots plus loooong socks going up to halfway across the thigh and then from the hips there is an almost-but-not-quite-knee-length skirt which is very very swooshy and also convenience magicked
plus something form-fitting on top with bows and frilly short sleeves
I think it's colorful but well-integrated/well designed
also she can and she will probably regulate it a bunch
like Mami's costume ( /files/justpaste/d416/a15279581/e5ffca5c2989cec9cc89565dbfcfc95d.jpg )
I'm actually thinking making the gloves mostly not call attention to themselves
and then having some sort of ...... arm thing liiiike Kyoko's
either almost entirely transparent or precisely skin color long-glove (enchantix thing), not quite clear, glimmers/glints
wrist sleeve (winx 1 thing) on top of that
long socks halfway up the thighs
knee-length skirt, very swishy, managing to reveal
wings insp
/files/justpaste/d416/a15279581/b7f93bae218105e09b10b805c19f8c39.png
/files/justpaste/d416/a15279581/2bf9f25916be61d35f203363bfb3ec2e.png
/files/justpaste/d416/a15279581/27fd167ade92d466c2e4687f28265842.jpg
Color Scheme(s):
http://paletton.com/#uid=1000u0kllllaFw0g0qFqFg0w0aF
Altpoof changes/differences?:
things i want to keep:
my sometimes randomness
my sometimes incoherentness and wordbox failure
my cute
my referenciness and fandominess and the way my memory works
my aesthetic, definitely
her having read something that had the same effects on her that hpmor+glowfic+who knows whatever else had on me
my attitude towards forking, mind magic, etc - oh ha she wouldn't be alone would she ofc (but possibly she'd be the only fork that travelled and if she needed more herselves in some worlds she'd fork on the spot?)
my cleanness thing
my being understood thing
things i could change:
the people she knows - (i really do not want to try and write real people so that's a really good idea)
the foods that she will accept
how she feels about Outdoors?
art? singing? ...working with textiles? .......having had a Russian education with textiles and birdhouses and whateverthehell else
....her not being an only child?
her enjoying them lessons?
for example relation to sport, which would be probably either worse or much much better, not entirely sure which, probably the latter
and she'd probably find meat okay, gosh, that's very alienating
and she'd play chess, a lot, ha
and she'd be deeper into the whole spy special interest, the more physical side
and possibly better at, uh, physics, Russian history, Russian
and she'd be, like, more. more independent ?
and possibly worse at singing but she'd patch it with magic just as I would patch my being not very good at dancing with magic
...better at the kind of social that he is?
[1:08 PM] timepoof: also also
[1:09 PM] timepoof: I think she would be way more averse to the initial interdimensional kidnapping than I would! but she would be more inclined to explore the multiverse. not that i'm not but she is even more so, if you get what i mean
[1:12 PM] timepoof: and I think she lands in some Puzzle Master's world that is pretty bad and then when she comes out she decides to fork and have one fork erase those memories from the other fork
[1:13 PM] dilnu: huh, I didn't realize Puzzle Master's were allowed to be cruel with their puzzles
[1:18 PM] timepoof: they aren't allowed to be thoroughly cruel but uh me and her we're kind of - flagile/picky/etc
and it was designed just the right way to be something that basically amounts to psychological torture?
[1:19 PM] timepoof: most puzzle masters come up with something more or less okay, just
[1:19 PM] timepoof: she insisted there be more aaaaa
[1:19 PM] timepoof: that's new to me
moriwen
<askmepoof> So you have this mental mode you can access, in which you see this magic and you can manipulate it to your aesthetic directly but only after lots and lots of experience figuring out your magic aesthetic because it is a completely novel mode of input and it's safer to rely on synesthesia which is in fact pretty reliable
<askmepoof> I bet i know what jean does though, he does the magic directly. And it works and he has an aesthetic sense instead of a conscience but Zari tells him off because that was still risky
Altpoof name?:
unlock_understanding
spark-of-understanding
https://www.vulgarlang.com/index.html ?
22:19 < timepoof> reprise iris melody tempo a cappella current wave magic
22:19 < timepoof> crystal 22:20 < timepoof> crystal is a neat word
22:20 < timepoof> mineral atom molecule
22:20 < timepoof> element galaxy
22:21 < timepoof> circles are neat?
22:21 < timepoof> orbit
22:21< Teceler> mm, what's the word for that tool you use to draw circles?
22:21 < timepoof> elaborate
22:21 < timepoof> er
22:21 < timepoof> compass?
22:21 < timepoof> i think
22:22 < Teceler> possibly?
22:22 < Teceler> oh, huh
22:22 < Teceler> yeah
22:22 < Teceler> spiral?
22:22 < timepoof> spiral!!! <3
22:24 < timepoof> things are random and yet they happen to fit in, fit a pattern, fit elaborate models constructed from the simplest rules, but it does not constrain, only strengthens
22:24 < Teceler> :)
22:25 < Teceler> tetrahendron
22:25 < Teceler> penrose fractal
22:27 < timepoof> infinity, fractal, geometry
22:28 < timepoof> precision
22:28 < timepoof> things snapping into place?
22:28 < Teceler> puzzle
22:29 < timepoof> pf
22:29 < Teceler> my brain is going 'specific kind of puzzle' but is not telling me what so XD
22:29 < timepoof> no
22:29 < timepoof> you mean jigsaw
22:29 < Teceler> possibly
22:29 < Teceler> something about how locks work too?? ok brain
22:30 < timepoof> unlock lock
22:30 < timepoof> knowing not knowing
22:30 < Teceler> oo
22:30 < timepoof> understanding
Lightwave ?
light
confused/confusion
brain
art
ashes
drum
the beat
smooth
pearl
magnet
sonic
wave
skyline
sky
energy
glamour
spirit
branch
rain
bright
fuzzy
ray
delicious
herb
frequency
passion
miami
http://www.spinxo.com/tumblr-names
https://www.buzzfeed.com/amphtml/danieldalton/ever-embasan http://m.mentalfloss.com/article.php?id=50698
https://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/1bulro/what_is_the_nicest_sounding_word_you_know_all/
i think i'd like the being able to hear and tell the location of anybody speaking a very specific phrase
[10:01 PM] Tekeler: --kinda like Elcenia dragon names?
[10:01 PM] timepoof: the puzzle thing can maaaybe do that and yes. like Voldemort and things.
17:03 < Starbridge> <timepoof> for the record, if i figured out a nickname for altpoof i'd be able to put her on the mwf2
Things. About Code. And Stuff.
so I said way back when that if Kaluno ends up associated with Taliadu there'd be a mechanic that has magic pollution accumulating specifically if:
you are in Taliadu
you have not yet completed it
you have not solved in a while
(behind-the-curtain: ) if you use Kaluno in some particularly unasthetic to the Timepoof way
(in-front-of-the-curtain: ) if you use Kaluno in a way particularly against your own, your Master of Puzzles', or the whole world's aesthetic
you can still totally do it as long as you don't do it so much that you, er, "fill up" "the place where it accumulates" (metaphors)
Decoration is the technical term for [the for-the-aesthetic synaesthesia creation thing] that leads to an aesthetic power if you do it right
puzzle talks about defences, aesthetic I think does that less on the level of protect me from thing and more on the level of, say, censoring and keeping out unpleasant smells for altpoof
she has /strong feelings/ about defenses
which seems to be relevant to what you can get from aesthetic
does the book advise you to make a list of magic powers you would like? yes.
you have this mental mode you can access, in which you see this magic and you can manipulate it to your aesthetic directly but only after lots and lots of experience figuring out your magic aesthetic because it is a completely novel mode of input and it's safer to rely on synesthesia which is in fact pretty reliable
The chapter on aesthetic advises one to make a list of powers they would like and details how to transfer that list into the magic! It contains a footnote that this is also needed for puzzle, even more so than aesthetic.
Aesthetic apparently works by you entering this list of powers in advance, and then you have to "Decorate", but only for the aesthetic - you have to sort of forget that you're doing it to get a power.
To Decorate means to get into this mental mode (here's how to do it) and switch to synesthesia mode (here's how to do it - why to do it and when not to is detailed on page 394, chapter 10, Advanced Usage Of Aesthetic And Theory Behind Synesthesia).
Then, you create an image/music/texture/smell/taste/vestibular stimulation/concept/etc that is aesthetic to you. Once you are done Decorating, you will get a power that is definitely aesthetic/cool to you, but its usefulness varies with how aesthetic you managed to make your Decoration. If you didn't make it particularly aesthetic, it'll give you something not on your list and mostly just pretty or useful in a very limited number of situations or just convenient but not useful beyond that (flowers spring up where you walk, mirrors reflect better and more precisely around you, soap doesn't get in your eyes).
Right so I think some things you have to start from very low level but some things'll "have been implemented" "in your programming language" if that makes sense
And some things you can rely on one of the other aspects to tell things are minds and stuff and also you can make a function that is just "let aesthetic's .... power take over" or "construct a drama diagram" or whatever
Same way you can let an aesthetic heartsong partially carry you through a drama ritual or use puzzle and improv together to create a magic castle
You need paper for this
Or i guess some parts could use a computer but some are really actually paper
Computer: compose algorithm
Paper: translate it to code which to outsiders looks like 'runes'/symbols taken out of nowhere mixed with some words
Paper: use 'magic ink' that you can just conjure to draw a spell diagram thing (which looks similar to a circuit but also taking some elements from Agents of Shield's Writing On The Wall)
"finish" the diagrams (primitive action, two parts - wave hand over, then touch (during both doing the appropriate magical thing))
Questions? Things that seem obvious to me but are not clear from outside perspective?
Improv is - you have to want something the right way just before you say it, and if it won't work you get a sense of either "no" or "that's not quite right" and your want "falls through" and in the latter case you can not do that in particular but probably can do something similar. More of a "try again" thing
DRAMA
drama is - usually you get a sense of the universe/unseen people/etcetc watching / listening / paying attention to you, Because That's Dramatic
And if a ritual is wrong then you do not get that sense
There's also a sort of - you know how they say go with the flow? There's that kind of flow in rituals.If you're doing everything right you won't suddenly sneeze or mispronounce something in the middle of a proper ritual unless it'd be dramatic
(as in, Kalunu Villain doing one of those, Our Heroes show up just as he's about to finish)
[12:34 AM] <timepoof> (and taunt him out of concentration or tickle him or whatever)
[12:35 AM] <timepoof> Or, like, The Heroes doing the spell to timestop Angband, but Sauron gets news just in time and orders all the nearby orcs to interrupt at all costs
[12:35 AM] <timepoof> Etc etc
[12:36 AM] <timepoof> It's, uh
[12:36 AM] <timepoof> Deliberate intervention by another party
[12:36 AM] <timepoof> Seems to be what I mean
[12:37 AM] <timepoof> well-timed
[12:38 AM] dilnu: huh
[12:39 AM] dilnu: so something outside of the person interferes with the ritual if it shouldn't succeed
[12:40 AM] <timepoof> And sufficiently skilled Kaluni (that appears to be the pluralization) (also Taliadi to distinguish puzzle worlds under various Masters of Puzzles)
[12:40 AM] <timepoof> Uh
[12:42 AM] <timepoof> sufficiently skilled Kaluni can sometimes turn the aforementioned flow even while in the middle of a ritual not specifically designed for that (remember the rituals that go on as long as you want them to and are primarily for the effects of being in one?)
[12:43 AM] <timepoof> And dilnu yes! Except, wait, define shouldn't succeed?
[12:44 AM] dilnu: as judged by the puzzlmaster
[12:44 AM] dilnu: or the world
[12:56 AM] <timepoof> Oh, yeah. Inside Taliadu it's pretty much just the Puzzle Master but outside it's more the Kaluno itself, with a full Felix-Felicis-y view of events and kind of Eru-y goals except much more on the drama and much less on the tragedy.
CODE
: so I want to hear about things that are implemented in the relevant programming language and what low level stuff there is and what aspect you use to tell things are minds and how you call that, and why you need paper / to draw it. or Anikyu does. Or both. Probably both.
[3:23 AM] Tekeler: @timepoof when you wake up you have induced Much Curiosity XD
numbers, loops, conditionals
heat
areas of various shapes, locations (in relation to the world, an object, yourself)
objects, some
some matter things with elements, complicated molecules are correspondingly more complicated
copying things
you could make things properly and proportionally larger if you put some thought into it but it's not implemented yet
creating things (easy is one spell per type of thing - a lots of things pick a thing spell could be done but would be harder and a literally-everything would be very hard)
enhancing senses has a library and is a little hard to code but not to cast and you're mostly enhancing various signals or else you'd get hearing only your own very loud heartbeat or something
portals are easyish to code but harder to cast - a lot of things to keep in mind, is all (edges of the portal and how they behave, what things go through it and what don't)
existence of things
discrepancies between things, ex: light and matter
comparing materials/objects
searching for the nearest whatever/checking if area contains some thing
sorting objects!
forces, work
electricity, magnetism
the page with magical ink is something between java's main() method and a circuit? ish?
it kind of decides the flow of the code spell and also a bit of what the spell has imported and it is the place where you would import other magic and there are two ways to do it
one way is just black box - oh look [puzzle spell]! here's what's going on, the person casting me trusts you to do something useful.
the other way is importing the other spell and trying, from magic patterns, to see what the algorithm is, what the components are, which bits of magic are doing what
the page with symbols and words is a transcription, kind of, of the magic patterns/algorithm+implementation of the code spell
it makes the spell exist?
it's the - the source file? the place where the implementation of the spell is stored.
the thing you have to keep in your mind as you cast the spell is a bird's eye overview of the algorithm, plus the 'arguments' you are 'passing in'
the reason why you need to put them on paper is that -
the magical ink part of the first paper is important, and the magical ink works best on paper out of normalish materials. you can in fact convince me that some science fictiony material is better but like metal/plastic/etc don't cut it
and the second paper it matters that it be a paper for the part where you finish it (wave hand over, touch)
clarification, you need to 'finish' both papers, but for the magical ink the thing it's on doesn't matter and for the symbols it does, because the thing you write the symbols with is not and cannot be magical ink
Anikyu thinks not having a dedicated development enviroment is silly and wants to build one, and part of that would be making something to export the code to paper when it's done
development enviroment isn't quite words - an IDE? a thing you write the code in that does helpful things.
so the symbols thing will cooperate with this! but the magic ink you have to do yourself, make it directly on the paper, and things. You can totally develop the what it is going to look like on a computer though!
The ink is kind of - conjured
but sequentially, like writing (not at once like stamps or old printing)
[11:18 PM] <Teceler> but you have to run over it yourself to compile? or is that to cast, I forget how the compiling works
[11:19 PM] <Teceler> nods
[11:19 PM] <timepoof> cast is just mental
[11:19 PM] <Teceler> aha
[11:19 PM] <Teceler> the magic ink is to compile?
[11:20 PM] <timepoof> to compile slash "finish" you wave a hand and do a magic and then touch and do a magic (both papers in sequence)
[11:21 PM] <Teceler> ah
[11:21 PM] <Teceler> and that fails if you have a logic error, obviously
[11:21 PM] <timepoof> yes!
[11:21 PM] <Teceler> is there an easy way to edit the magic ink writing?
[11:21 PM] <Teceler> or do you have to do the whole thing over again?
[11:22 PM] <Teceler> suppose that incentivises you to make discrete modules and hook them together, which is good practice anyway
[11:27 PM] <timepoof> (or you wrote something wrong) you can edit it the same way you initially conjure it! the magic ink writing is the thing controlling the flow of your code + imports, the actual functions/methods are the other page! the other page is easy to edit in some cases but hard in others, because the magic lives on the whole page instead of just the ink!
[11:27 PM] <Teceler> huh, cool
[11:27 PM] <Teceler> how do you conjure it?
[11:28 PM] <timepoof> (sometimes you will need to totally redo the thing that is whole page.)
[11:28 PM] <Teceler> and it's just the magic ink writing that can't be automated with an IDE, right?
[11:29 PM] <Teceler> (this is so interesting and I predict Anikyu will attempt to import the other kinds of magic and puzzle them out through it. with presumably mixed success XD)
[11:30 PM] <timepoof> it's just a primitive action same way Decorating and Constructing (the puzzle aspect counterpart!) and going with the flow (drama) and wanting are
[11:30 PM] <timepoof> and yes
[11:30 PM] <Teceler> aha, cool
[11:31 PM] <Teceler> but presumably you have to like -- have the code in mind or something
[11:33 PM] <timepoof> yes. it also needs you to have already done the other inkless page (but possibly not compiled or even finished yet for easier errorthings - it just needs to exist in /some/ form)
[11:33 PM] <timepoof> because both pages refer to each other
[11:33 PM] <Teceler> nods
[11:34 PM] <timepoof> and that be why a Kalunu needs one of them only to do thing
[11:34 PM] <Teceler> and it gives you fairly-easy-to-figure-out error messages?
[11:34 PM] <Teceler> hm?
[11:35 PM] <timepoof> a Kalunu needs only one of the pages to reverse engineer a spell
[11:35 PM] <Teceler> a/ha/
[11:35 PM] <Teceler> because they can get the other from the references?
[11:35 PM] <timepoof> yes
[11:36 PM] <Teceler> nods
[11:36 PM] <timepoof> and yes to above though in some cases they will be odd if the error is obscure or odd itself
[11:39 PM] <Teceler> nods
If a Kalunu (Kaluno user, apparently) gets either of the papers they can also cast the spell and then if a non Kalunu gets both and a telepathied version of the spell (needs a bit of memorisation and obviously benefits from but does not require perfect memory) they can also do the spell
For the former, that is meant to be a Kalunu other than the one who invented the spell
And it'd require some reverse engineering but it's more straightforward than a non Kalunu would think
) Macalaure and Feanaro (+ Findekano + Emily) are the magic help people, hmmmm adds to brackets
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<poof> I want to say things to someone
<FacelessWork> what sort of things?
<poof> things about the puzzle world I've been kicking around in my head, things about this one personality thing I found that is really cool, things about, like, whatever
<FacelessWork> what puzzle world and personality thing?
<poof> http://www.alittlebitofpersonality.com
<poof> and
<poof> It's just a world I thought of that doesn't require me to do characters
<poof> only the reactions of the other person's character and the world itself
<poof> It's like
<poof> there's The Master of The Puzzles and they design the world to be like they want it to be by their aesthetic and then they get to travel between their home
<poof> and the Puzzle World
<poof> and eventually the Puzzle World, through Glowfic Shenanigans
<poof> catches another person
<poof> who is kind of stuck in the puzzle world until they 'solve' it in the way the original Master of Puzzles intended
<poof> and then they become a Master of Puzzles and have to design their own Puzzle World according to their sensibilities/aesthetic
<poof> and then they can go back and forth between that and their home world/whatever world they got caught by glowfic shenanigans from
<poof> and along the way they get, like, powers and such
<poof> details subject to change
<poof> also my brain immediately generated a magic system but I dunno if that one will fit with the objectives/incentives I had in mind for that world
<FacelessWork> huh, why not?
<poof> I have no specific reasons for expecting this, I have not cross-analysed it in detail, I dunno, maybe it will, I just have a feeling -- not very strong evidence but a little bit of evidence. I will figure it out later, probably.
<poof> I dunno literally means I dunno :P
<FacelessWork> ah, ok xD
<poof> so, because my brain recently went "eeeee so aesthetic very magical wow" at the cardverse+runecasting combo (also Temple!!! :D) and has been going "aesthetic" at taieli and terraria for a while now and has been kicking around a magic-based-on-aesthetic thing for forever ever since that jean-aesthetic-sense tumblr post
<poof> it attempted to mash all those together
<poof> into a result that would in itself be aesthetic to my brain
<poof> and it's like
<poof> there are multiple ways of doing magic and each one gets you the result, eventually, after a lot of detours in some cases, but it all kind of manifests differently
<poof> and is kind of weird
<poof> and some of them are kind of really bad at certain results but only because of the way they manifest
<poof> the types so far are
<poof> guess/improvise - in actually doing the magic kind of like cards mixed with sorcery, simple commands but with calling on concepts for optimal performance, easy to improvise with, in results more like one-off effect, usually a matter thing but will handle some mind stuff that's one-off and teleportationy things
<FacelessWork> (matter thing like creating a pound of gold or creating a book or healing a person?)
<poof> drama with materials - basically Galatea arcanism except with required dramatics like cardverse sorcery and cardverse-type foci and also the sort of stuff Sunnyverse Chrises work with like stones and geometric arrangements
<poof> pound of gold: yep
<poof> creating a book: empty book or existing book yes, getting info out of nowhere no
<poof> healing a person: uh. depends how complicated their ailment is. if complicated, you might need either multiple guess/improvise things, some medical knowhow, or just a drama with materials spell
-!- poof is now known as explpoof
<FacelessWork> what do you mean with "a drama"?
<explpoof> it says: a "drama with materials" spell
<explpoof> except without quotes
<explpoof> see above
<explpoof> already explained those
<FacelessWork> I think if you show this to mori the meta-jean in her head is going to salivate
-!- Kaylin changed the topic of #glowfic to: Puzzle World and Possibly Related Possibly Not Magic System!
<Bobby> Ooh, capital letters.
<Kaylin> they are Important. for Emphasis.
<explpoof> then there's remember+put together bits of other spells and construct almost magical code kind of
<explpoof> which I will shorten to 'memory code spells'
<explpoof> and they are pure function and they handle edge cases weirdly unless you are very good at this thing
<explpoof> but they have this cool thing where they're like code and that lets them have things like while loops and if statements and various very computer-flavoured tasks
<explpoof> also they have more sciency-computery information about things to work with, so
<explpoof> a drama spell will remove all things that taste bad from your food but a memory code spell can be constructed to do poison and things like that!
<explpoof> also memory code spells are weird in that you have to want to use them
<explpoof> and the remaining two are weird in that you have to be doing the thing that results in magic, not for the magic but for the thing itself
<Kaylin> hm, can you clarify that?
<explpoof> the remaining two, the way you do magic with them, is respectively tweaking magic according to your aesthetic, and tweaking magic in a very logic-puzzle-thing way and you have to do both for the fun of doing the tweaking and not to get a result
<explpoof> if you do it to get a result you don't get a result
<Kaylin> so what you get from those is at least partly random?
<Kaylin> or at least not deliberately chosen
<explpoof> yeah. you have a list of what things you want (mostly that-type-of-magic-flavoured powers or artefacts) and you can sort of want a 'difficulty level' and the more difficult it is the more likely you are to get one of your list/something good/something specifically good for the situation
<explpoof> the list is also a magic thing and is set in advance of doing any actual solving and goes away when you solve and things
<explpoof> the 'difficulty level' in the aesthetic case is not set though, I lied, it is determined by you and your aesthetic and the end result
<explpoof> in particular, how intricate the 'magic art' is, and how aesthetic it is for you
<explpoof> those two can be done entirely in head/via illusions specifically for that purpose only visible to you
<explpoof> memory code gets you a very good memory for spell bits and a unique way of writing them down but you will need to use paper for it because it do not give illusions
<explpoof> drama and improvise both need you to speak
<explpoof> therefore drama and memory code both need materials
<explpoof> memory code and puzzle need you to think
<explpoof> puzzle and aesthetic, the process of doing them is entirely secret
<explpoof> and oh last thing
<explpoof> it is inadvisable to share/transfer both aesthetic and improvised magic
<explpoof> like
<explpoof> it is ok to get ideas
<explpoof> from another person
<explpoof> but do not try to use any copying thing, any magic-pattern telepathy, any exact words with exact meanings telepathed and attached
<explpoof> so now if you've been keeping track, if you draw five dots corresponding to the magics you get (probably) a pentagon thing with edges as pair connection things
<Kaylin> So we've got puzzle magic, code magic, improv magic, aesthetic magic and...what was the fifth?
<explpoof> drama
<Kaylin> I'm gonna tag that as "ritual magic" in my head?
<explpoof> sure
<Bobby> I got completely lost at some point, I'll read it again later.
<explpoof> drama with materials - basically Galatea arcanism except with required dramatics like cardverse sorcery and cardverse-type foci and also the sort of stuff Sunnyverse Chrises work with like stones and geometric arrangements
<Kaylin> ritual magic
<explpoof> but they are short-ish rituals, make no mistake imagining hour-long stuff
<explpoof> but not too short either
<Kaylin> ballpark? 5 minutes, 10, 15?
<explpoof> normal range is probably from 3 up to 15 but you can get crazy complicated and up to 30 and possibly but very rarely beyond
<explpoof> total average is probably 5
<explpoof> you kind of compose these speeches and dance things and you can take advantage of ambient effects rituals sometimes provide and you can in fact use other magic *while* casting a drama-ritual
<explpoof> so if it'd be dramatic to dance and then conjure a rose at the very last seconds of the ritual via improvised type magic then go ahead!
* explpoof brain is very pleased by this thing
<dilnu|work> hm, is there some common principle connecting all these magic systems?
<explpoof> if they end up being part of puzzle world there's going to be some kind of puzzle solving reward system, possibly an unmana thing that only accumulates if you do not solve puzzles/do situation things while in puzzle world and blocks usage of magic when there's enough but does not bother you once you've gotten out of puzzle world
<explpoof> otherwise it's probably going to be something else but idk what
<explpoof> now my brain is looking at the diagram thing and going "those two are jean, those two are zari" etc
<Kaylin> yes
<explpoof> i am so pleased with this
You can share Kaluno with someone who's never been to Taliadu - the procedure to be sure it'll stick on them involves doing magic in a particular order. There is also a procedure for bare minimum "this person has magic, for now, without interference, with upkeep".
First you get the Kaluno-having person (p1) to do a longer than average drama ritual with the currently-muggle (p2) providing assistance (handing things, holding fans for Dramatic Wind, etc etc). Then a longer than average where p2 is an active participant (inside any magic diagrams on the floor, dancing, etc). Then an average length with p2 leading and p1 assistance. Then average length p2 alone.
The next thing is to get some telepathy and for p1 to transmit a code spell and their notes to p2. P2 casts it. P2 gets just the thoughts, writes their own notes, casts. P2 composes own code spell and notes, casts.
P2 intensely wants something (something improv can do), says an improv spell while wanting