„Większa część obecnej legitymacji politycznej dzisiejszego rządu amerykańskiego i jego różnych europejskich państw wasali opiera się na konkretnej narracyjnej historii II wojny światowej, a kwestionowanie tej koncepcji może mieć tragiczne konsekwencje polityczne” – Ron Unz
Pytanie 1: Hitler
Zacznijmy od Hitlera. Na Zachodzie powszechnie przyjmuje się, że:
- Hitler rozpoczął II wojnę światową
- Inwazja Hitlera na Polskę była pierwszym krokiem w szerszej kampanii mającej na celu dominację nad światem
Czy taka interpretacja II wojny światowej jest prawdziwa czy fałszywa? A jeśli to nieprawda, to – Twoim zdaniem – co Hitler chciał osiągnąć w Polsce i czy można było uniknąć II wojny światowej?
Ron Unz — Mniej więcej przez ostatnie kilkanaście lat moje poglądy na temat wydarzeń historycznych były zawsze dość konwencjonalne, ukształtowane na podstawie zajęć, na które uczęszczałem na studiach, oraz jednolitej narracji medialnej, którą wchłaniałem przez dziesięciolecia. Obejmuje to moje rozumienie II wojny światowej, największego konfliktu zbrojnego w historii ludzkości, którego wynik ukształtował nasz współczesny świat.
Jednak w latach po atakach z 11 września i wojnie w Iraku stawałem się coraz bardziej podejrzliwy co do uczciwości naszych mediów głównego nurtu i zacząłem zdawać sobie sprawę, że książki historyczne często przedstawiają jedynie zamrożoną wersję takich zniekształceń mediów z przeszłości. Rozwój Internetu wyzwolił ogromną ilość niekonwencjonalnych pomysłów we wszystkich możliwych odsłonach i od 2000 roku pracowałem nad projektem digitalizacji archiwów naszych czołowych publikacji z ostatnich 150 lat, co dało mi wygodny dostęp do informacji nie tylko łatwo dostępne dla kogokolwiek innego. Więc jak później napisałem :
Oprócz dowodów naszych własnych zmysłów, prawie wszystko, co wiemy o przeszłości lub dzisiejsze wiadomości, pochodzi z kawałków atramentu na papierze lub kolorowych pikseli na ekranie i na szczęście w ciągu ostatniej dekady lub dwóch rozwój Internetu ogromnie poszerzył zakres dostępnych nam informacji w tej ostatniej kategorii. Nawet jeśli przytłaczająca większość niekonwencjonalnych twierdzeń dostarczonych przez takie nietradycyjne źródła internetowe jest nieprawdziwa, przynajmniej obecnie istnieje możliwość wydobycia istotnych okruchów prawdy z ogromnych gór kłamstwa. Z pewnością wydarzenia ostatnich kilkunastu lat zmusiły mnie do całkowitej ponownej kalibracji mojego własnego aparatu do wykrywania rzeczywistości.
W wyniku tych wszystkich wydarzeń dziesięć lat temu opublikowałem swój oryginalny artykuł American Pravda, który zawierał ten fragment. W artykule tym podkreśliłem, że to, co nasze podręczniki historii i media mówią nam o świecie i jego przeszłości, może być często równie nieuczciwe i zniekształcone, jak osławiona „ Prawda” nieistniejącego ZSRR.
- Nasza amerykańska prawda
Ron Unz • Amerykański konserwatysta • 29 kwietnia 2013 r. • 4500 słów
Na początku skupiałem się na nowszych wydarzeniach historycznych, ale wkrótce zacząłem dużo czytać i badać historię II wojny światowej, stopniowo zdając sobie sprawę, że duża część wszystkiego, co zawsze akceptowałem na ten temat, wojna była całkowicie błędna.
Być może nie powinienem był być zbyt zaskoczony, gdy to odkryłem. W końcu, jeśli nasze media mogły tak bezczelnie kłamać na temat wydarzeń tu i teraz, dlaczego mielibyśmy im ufać w sprawach, które miały miejsce dawno i daleko?
W końcu doszedłem do wniosku, że prawdziwa historia II wojny światowej nie tylko zupełnie różniła się od tego, w co większość z nas zawsze wierzyła, ale była w dużej mierze odwrócona. Nasze mainstreamowe książki historyczne opowiadały tę historię do góry nogami i od tyłu.
Jeśli chodzi o Hitlera i wybuch wojny, myślę, że doskonałym punktem wyjścia byłoby „ Początki drugiej wojny światowej” , klasyczne dzieło opublikowane w 1961 roku przez znanego historyka z Oksfordu, AJP Taylora. Jak opisałem jego wnioski z 2019 roku:
Ostateczne żądanie Hitlera, aby 95% niemieckiego Gdańska zostało zwrócone Niemcom, tak jak tego pragnęli jego mieszkańcy, było całkowicie rozsądne i dopiero straszliwa dyplomatyczna pomyłka Brytyjczyków skłoniła Polaków do odrzucenia tej prośby, prowokując w ten sposób wojnę. Powszechne później twierdzenie, że Hitler dążył do podboju świata, było całkowicie absurdalne, a niemiecki przywódca faktycznie dołożył wszelkich starań, aby uniknąć wojny z Wielką Brytanią lub Francją. Rzeczywiście, był ogólnie dość przyjazny wobec Polaków i miał nadzieję, że zwerbuje Polskę jako niemieckiego sojusznika przeciwko groźbie stalinowskiego Związku Radzieckiego.
Niedawna 70. rocznica wybuchu konfliktu, który pochłonął tak wiele dziesiątek milionów istnień ludzkich, w naturalny sposób sprowokowała liczne artykuły historyczne, a dyskusja, która wynikła, skłoniła mnie do odkopania mojego starego egzemplarza krótkiego tomu Taylora, który po raz pierwszy przeczytałem ponownie w prawie czterdzieści lat. Wydało mi się równie mistrzowskie i przekonujące jak za czasów, gdy byłem w akademiku, a olśniewające napisy na okładkach sugerowały, że dzieło zyskało natychmiastowe uznanie. „Washington Post” wychwalał autora jako „najwybitniejszego żyjącego historyka Wielkiej Brytanii”, „ World Politics” nazwał go „mocnie uzasadnionym, znakomicie napisanym i zawsze przekonującym”, „ The New Statesman” , wiodący brytyjski magazyn lewicowy, opisał go jako „arcydzieło: przejrzyste, pełne współczucia , pięknie napisany”, a sierpniowy „Times Literary Suplement” scharakteryzował go jako „prosty, druzgocący, znakomicie czytelny i głęboko niepokojący”. Jako międzynarodowy bestseller z pewnością plasuje się na liście najsłynniejszych dzieł Taylora i z łatwością rozumiem, dlaczego prawie dwie dekady po pierwotnej publikacji nadal znajdowała się na mojej liście lektur obowiązkowych w college'u.
Jednak przeglądając ponownie przełomowe badanie Taylora, dokonałem niezwykłego odkrycia. Pomimo całej międzynarodowej sprzedaży i uznania krytyków, ustalenia zawarte w książce wkrótce wzbudziły ogromną wrogość w niektórych kręgach. Wykłady Taylora w Oksfordzie cieszyły się ogromną popularnością przez ćwierć wieku, ale w bezpośrednim wyniku kontrowersji „najwybitniejszy żyjący historyk Wielkiej Brytanii” został wkrótce potem usunięty z wydziału. Na początku swojego pierwszego rozdziału Taylor zauważył, jak dziwne wydało mu się to, że ponad dwadzieścia lat po rozpoczęciu najbardziej kataklizmicznej wojny na świecie nie stworzono żadnej poważnej historii, która szczegółowo analizowałaby wybuch. Być może odwet, z jakim się spotkał, pozwolił mu lepiej zrozumieć część tej zagadki.
Wielu innych czołowych uczonych i dziennikarzy, zarówno współczesnych, jak i nowszych, doszło do bardzo podobnych wniosków, lecz zbyt często spotykali się z surowym odwetem za swoje uczciwe oceny historyczne. Przez dziesięciolecia William Henry Chamberlin był jednym z najbardziej cenionych amerykańskich dziennikarzy zajmujących się polityką zagraniczną, ale po opublikowaniu w 1950 r. Drugiej krucjaty Ameryki zniknął z większości publikacji głównego nurtu. David Irving prawdopodobnie zalicza się do grona brytyjskich historyków, którzy odnieśli największy sukces na arenie międzynarodowej w ciągu ostatnich 100 lat, a jego przełomowe książki o II wojnie światowej spotkały się z ogromnym uznaniem krytyków i sprzedały się w milionach egzemplarzy; ale został doprowadzony do osobistego bankructwa i ledwo uniknął spędzenia reszty życia w austriackim więzieniu.
Pod koniec lat trzydziestych Hitler wskrzesił Niemcy, które pod jego rządami na nowo rozkwitły, a także udało mu się ponownie zjednoczyć je z kilkoma oddzielnymi populacjami niemieckimi. W rezultacie zyskał powszechne uznanie za jednego z odnoszących największe sukcesy i popularnych przywódców na świecie i miał nadzieję, że ostatecznie rozstrzygnie spór graniczny z Polską, oferując ustępstwa znacznie hojniejsze, niż kiedykolwiek rozważał którykolwiek z jego demokratycznie wybranych poprzedników w Weimarze. Zamiast tego polska dyktatura przez miesiące odrzucała jego próby negocjacji, a także rozpoczęła brutalne złe traktowanie mniejszości niemieckiej, ostatecznie zmuszając Hitlera do wypowiedzenia wojny. I jak omawiałem w 2019 r. , prowokowanie tej wojny mogło być zamierzonym celem niektórych wpływowych postaci.
Być może najbardziej oczywistą z nich jest kwestia prawdziwych początków wojny, która spustoszyła znaczną część Europy, zabiła około pięćdziesięciu do sześćdziesięciu milionów i dała początek późniejszej epoce zimnej wojny, w której reżimy komunistyczne kontrolowały połowę całej Europy Kontynent światowy Eurazji. Taylor, Irving i wielu innych dokładnie obalili absurdalną mitologię, jakoby przyczyną było szalone pragnienie podboju świata przez Hitlera , ale jeśli niemiecki dyktator najwyraźniej ponosił jedynie niewielką odpowiedzialność, czy rzeczywiście był tam jakiś prawdziwy winowajca? A może ta masowo niszczycielska wojna światowa wybuchła w podobny sposób jak jej poprzedniczka, którą w naszych konwencjonalnych historiach traktujemy głównie jako skutek zbioru błędów, nieporozumień i bezmyślnej eskalacji?
W latach trzydziestych John T. Flynn był jednym z najbardziej wpływowych dziennikarzy postępowych w Ameryce i chociaż zaczynał jako zdecydowany zwolennik Roosevelta i jego Nowego Ładu, stopniowo stał się ostrym krytykiem, dochodząc do wniosku, że różnym programom rządowym FDR nie udało się ożywić gospodarkę amerykańską. Następnie w 1937 r. nowe załamanie gospodarcze spowodowało powrót bezrobocia do tego samego poziomu, co w chwili objęcia urzędu przez prezydenta, co potwierdziło jego surowy werdykt Flynna. I tak jak pisałem w zeszłym roku:
Flynn rzeczywiście twierdzi, że pod koniec 1937 r. Roosevelt zwrócił się w stronę agresywnej polityki zagranicznej, mającej na celu wciągnięcie kraju w poważną wojnę zagraniczną, przede wszystkim dlatego, że wierzył, że jest to jedyna droga wyjścia z jego rozpaczliwej sytuacji gospodarczej i politycznej , co było podstępem, którego nie nieznane wśród przywódców narodowych w całej historii. W swojej kolumnie w Nowej Republice z 5 stycznia 1938 roku ostrzegł swoich niedowierzających czytelników o zbliżającej się perspektywie dużego rozrostu sił morskich i działań wojennych na horyzoncie, po tym jak czołowy doradca Roosevelta prywatnie przechwalał się przed nim, że wielki atak „wojskowego keynesizmu” ”, a wielka wojna wyleczyłaby pozornie nieprzezwyciężalne problemy gospodarcze kraju. W tamtym czasie zamierzonym celem wydawała się wojna z Japonią, prawdopodobnie o interesy Ameryki Łacińskiej, ale rozwój wydarzeń w Europie szybko przekonał Roosevelta, że najlepszym sposobem działania będzie wzniecenie powszechnej wojny przeciwko Niemcom. Wspomnienia i inne dokumenty historyczne uzyskane przez późniejszych badaczy wydają się zasadniczo potwierdzać oskarżenia Flynna, wskazując, że Roosevelt nakazał swoim dyplomatom wywarcie ogromnej presji zarówno na rządy brytyjski, jak i polski, aby uniknąć jakiegokolwiek wynegocjowanego porozumienia z Niemcami, co doprowadziło do wybuchu II wojny światowej w 1939.
Ostatni punkt jest istotny, gdyż poufnym opiniom osób najbliższych ważnym wydarzeniom historycznym należy przypisać dużą wagę dowodową. W niedawnym artykule John Wear zebrał liczne współczesne oceny, które wskazywały, że FDR jest kluczową postacią w organizowaniu wojny światowej poprzez jego ciągłe naciski na brytyjskie przywództwo polityczne , a polityka, która nawet prywatnie przyznał, może oznaczać jego impeachment, jeśli zostanie ujawniona. Wśród innych świadectw znajdują się wypowiedzi ambasadorów Polski i Wielkiej Brytanii w Waszyngtonie oraz ambasadora amerykańskiego w Londynie, którzy podzielili także zgodną opinię samego premiera Chamberlaina. Rzeczywiście, przechwycenie i publikacja przez Niemców tajnych polskich dokumentów dyplomatycznych w 1939 r. ujawniła już wiele z tych informacji, a William Henry Chamberlin potwierdził ich autentyczność w swojej książce z 1950 r. Ponieważ jednak media głównego nurtu nigdy nie podały żadnych takich informacji, fakty te nawet dzisiaj pozostają mało znane.
Obszernie omówiłem te wydarzenia historyczne w moim artykule z 2019 roku:
- American Pravda: Zrozumienie II wojny światowej
Ron Unz • The Unz Review • 23 września 2019 r. • 20 500 słów
Pytanie 2: Londyński „Blitz”
Niemcy rozpoczęły „Blitz” na Anglię, aby zastraszyć Brytyjczyków i zmusić ich do uległości. Czy zgadzasz się z tym, czy też w grę wchodziły inne czynniki, które zostały pominięte w zachodnich podręcznikach historii? (Jak bombardowanie Berlina przez Churchilla?)
Ron Unz : Po raz kolejny ten standardowy opis II wojny światowej jest w dużej mierze sprzeczny z prawdą. W tamtych czasach bombardowania z powietrza ośrodków miejskich daleko za liniami wojskowymi były nielegalne i uważane za zbrodnię wojenną, a Hitler nie miał absolutnie zamiaru atakować w ten sposób miast Wielkiej Brytanii.
Rzeczywiście, niemiecki przywódca zawsze miał przychylne poglądy wobec Wielkiej Brytanii, a także wierzył, że zachowanie Imperium Brytyjskiego leży w strategicznym interesie Niemiec, ponieważ jego upadek stworzy geopolityczną próżnię, którą mogłoby wypełnić rywalizujące mocarstwo.
Po ataku Niemiec na Polskę Wielka Brytania i Francja wypowiedziały wojnę. Armia polska została pokonana w ciągu zaledwie kilku tygodni, a Hitler zaproponował wówczas wycofanie swoich sił z okupowanych przez nie ziem polskich i zawarcie pokoju, ale oba mocarstwa zachodnie obiecały kontynuować wojnę aż do zniszczenia Niemiec. Niewiele walk toczyło się aż do wiosny 1940 r., kiedy Niemcy w końcu zaatakowali i pokonali ogromną armię francuską, zdobywając Paryż i wyrzucając Francję z wojny.
Siły brytyjskie ewakuowano w Dunkierce i istnieje sporo dowodów na to, że Hitler celowo pozwolił im uciec w geście ratującym twarz, zamiast rozkazać ich schwytanie. Po zwycięstwie we Francji zaproponował rządowi brytyjskiemu niezwykle hojne warunki, nie stawiając mu żadnych żądań, a zamiast tego proponując sojusz Niemiec, obejmujący wsparcie militarne dla ochrony bezpieczeństwa ich światowego imperium. Hitler naturalnie wierzył, że przyjmą tak atrakcyjną ofertę i zakończą wojnę, która, jak przypuszczał, w zasadzie się skończyła.
Kilku czołowych brytyjskich przywódców wydawało się chętnych do zawarcia pokoju na hojnych warunkach Hitlera, a według dowodów znalezionych przez znanego brytyjskiego historyka Davida Irvinga sam premier Winston Churchill wydawał się skłonny to zrobić, zanim zmieni zdanie i się wycofa. Churchill przez dziesięciolecia starał się zostać premierem, a Irving przekonująco twierdzi, że zdał sobie sprawę, że przegrana w katastrofalnej wojnie w ciągu kilku tygodni od ostatecznego osiągnięcia tego stanowiska uczyniłaby go pośmiewiskiem w podręcznikach historii.
Biorąc jednak pod uwagę porażkę militarną Wielkiej Brytanii na kontynencie i bardzo hojne warunki oferowane przez Hitlera, Churchill stanął przed ogromnym problemem, próbując przekonać swój kraj do kontynuowania wojny, którą powszechnie uważano za przegraną. Dlatego zaczął wydawać rozkazy serii nalotów bombowych na stolicę Niemiec, co było nielegalną zbrodnią wojenną, mając nadzieję sprowokować niemiecką reakcję. To doprowadziło Hitlera do wielokrotnego ostrzegania, że jeśli będą kontynuować bombardowania jego miast, będzie zmuszony do odwetu, i w końcu to zrobił. Ponieważ brytyjska opinia publiczna nie była świadoma, że ich własny rząd zainicjował kampanię bombardowań miast, uważała te odwetowe niemieckie ataki powietrzne za potworne, niesprowokowane zbrodnie wojenne i zgodnie z nadzieją Churchilla w pełni zaangażowała się w kontynuowanie wojny przeciwko Niemcom.
Irving i inni wyjaśniają wszystkie te ważne fakty w swoich książkach, a porywający wykład Irvinga podsumowujący jego informacje jest nadal dostępny w Bitchute po usunięciu go z YouTube.
Irving jest kluczowym źródłem wielu ważnych informacji na temat wojny i w 2018 roku wyjaśniłem, dlaczego wyniki głośnego pozwu przeciwko Deborah Lipstadt wykazały, że jego badania historyczne były niezwykle wiarygodne:
Ci gorliwi aktywiści etniczni rozpoczęli skoordynowaną kampanię, mającą na celu wywarcie presji na prestiżowych wydawców Irvinga, aby porzucili jego książki, zakłócając jednocześnie jego częste międzynarodowe podróże z wykładami, a nawet lobbując w krajach, aby zabronić mu wjazdu. W kółko oczerniali media, nieustannie oczerniając jego imię i umiejętności badawcze, posuwając się nawet do potępienia go jako „nazisty” i „miłośnika Hitlera”, tak jak to zrobiono w podobny sposób w przypadku prof. Wilsona.
Ta batalia prawna była z pewnością sprawą Dawida i Goliata, w której bogaci żydowscy producenci filmowi i dyrektorzy korporacji przekazali Lipstadt ogromną skrzynię wojenną w wysokości 13 milionów dolarów, umożliwiając jej finansowanie prawdziwej armii składającej się z 40 badaczy i ekspertów prawnych, dowodzonej przez jeden z odnoszących największe sukcesy brytyjskich żydowskich prawników zajmujących się rozwodami. Z kolei Irving, będąc ubogim historykiem, był zmuszony bronić się bez korzystania z pomocy prawnej.
W prawdziwym życiu, inaczej niż w bajce, Goliaci tego świata niemal zawsze triumfują i ten przypadek nie był wyjątkiem, gdy Irving doprowadził do osobistego bankructwa, co spowodowało utratę jego wspaniałego domu w centrum Londynu. Jednak patrząc z dłuższej perspektywy historii, myślę, że zwycięstwo jego oprawców było wyjątkowo pyrrusowe.
Chociaż celem ich rozpętanej nienawiści było rzekome „negowanie Holokaustu” przez Irvinga, z tego, co wiem, ten konkretny temat był prawie całkowicie nieobecny we wszystkich kilkudziesięciu książkach Irvinga i właśnie to milczenie wywołało ich nabiegłe śliną skandal. Dlatego też, wobec braku tak jasnego celu, ich hojnie finansowany korpus badaczy i osób weryfikujących fakty spędził rok lub dłużej, najwyraźniej dokonując przeglądu linijka po linijce i przypis po przypisie wszystkiego, co Irving kiedykolwiek opublikował, próbując zlokalizować każdy błąd historyczny, który mógłby postawić go w złym świetle zawodowym. Dysponując niemal nieograniczonymi pieniędzmi i siłą roboczą, wykorzystali nawet proces dochodzenia prawnego, aby wezwać do sądu i przeczytać tysiące stron jego osobistych pamiętników i korespondencji, mając w ten sposób nadzieję, że znajdą jakieś dowody jego „nikczemnych myśli”. Denial , hollywoodzki film z 2016 roku, którego współautorem jest Lipstadt, może zapewnić rozsądny zarys sekwencji wydarzeń widzianych z jej perspektywy.
Jednak pomimo tak ogromnych zasobów finansowych i ludzkich najwyraźniej okazały się one prawie całkowicie puste, przynajmniej jeśli można uznać triumfującą książkę Lipstadta z 2005 roku „ Historia procesu” . W ciągu czterdziestu lat badań i pisarstwa, które zaowocowały wieloma kontrowersyjnymi twierdzeniami historycznymi o najbardziej zdumiewającym charakterze, udało im się znaleźć jedynie kilkadziesiąt raczej drobnych rzekomych błędów w faktach lub interpretacji, w większości niejednoznacznych lub spornych. A najgorsze, co odkryli po przeczytaniu każdej strony z wielu metrów bieżących osobistych pamiętników Irvinga, było to, że kiedyś ułożył on krótką piosenkę „niewrażliwą na rasę” dla swojej córeczki, trywialną rzecz, którą oczywiście następnie rozgłoszono jako dowód, że jest "rasistowski." W ten sposób najwyraźniej przyznali, że ogromny zbiór tekstów historycznych Irvinga był być może dokładny w 99,9%.
Myślę, że ta cisza „psa, który nie szczekał” odbija się echem grzmotu. Nie znam żadnego innego uczonego akademickiego w całej historii świata, którego wszystkie dziesięciolecia swojej twórczości poddano tak żmudnej i wyczerpującej, wrogiej analizie. A ponieważ Irving najwyraźniej zdał ten test śpiewająco, myślę, że niemal każde zdumiewające twierdzenie we wszystkich jego książkach – podsumowane w jego filmach – możemy uznać za absolutnie trafne.
- Niezwykła historiografia Davida Irvinga
Rona Unza • The Unz Review • 4 czerwca 2018 r. • 1700 słów
Pytanie 3: Czystka intelektualistów antywojennych
W latach czterdziestych XX wieku miała miejsce czystka w antywojennych intelektualistach i ekspertach, podobna do dzisiejszej czystki w mediach społecznościowych wobec krytyków polityki USA. Czy może pan krótko wyjaśnić, co się stało, kto był celem i czy pierwsza poprawka powinna mieć zastosowanie w czasach kryzysu narodowego?
Ron Unz — Około roku 2000 rozpocząłem projekt mający na celu digitalizację archiwów wielu naszych czołowych publikacji z ostatnich 150 lat i ze zdumieniem odkryłem, że niektóre z naszych najbardziej wpływowych postaci z lat poprzedzających II wojnę światową „zniknęły” ” tak całkowicie, że nigdy o nich nie słyszałem. Odegrało to główną rolę w moich rosnących podejrzeniach, że standardowa narracja, którą zawsze akceptowałem, jest fałszywa , dlatego później opisałem sytuację, używając analogii do znanych kłamstw historycznych starego Związku Radzieckiego:
Czasami wyobrażałem sobie siebie trochę jak poważnego młodego sowieckiego badacza z lat 70., który zaczął grzebać w zatęchłych aktach dawno zapomnianych archiwów Kremla i dokonał kilku oszałamiających odkryć. Trocki najwyraźniej nie był notorycznym nazistowskim szpiegiem i zdrajcą przedstawianym we wszystkich podręcznikach, ale zamiast tego był prawą ręką samego świętego Lenina podczas chwalebnych dni wielkiej rewolucji bolszewickiej i przez kilka lat później pozostawał na szczycie szeregi elity partyjnej. A kim były te inne postacie – Zinowjew, Kamieniew, Bucharin, Rykow – które również spędziły te wczesne lata na samym szczycie komunistycznej hierarchii? Na kursach historii zaledwie wymienili kilka wzmianek o pomniejszych agentach kapitalistycznych, których szybko zdemaskowano i za swoją zdradę zapłacili życiem. Jak wielki Lenin, ojciec rewolucji, mógł być takim idiotą, otaczając się niemal wyłącznie zdrajcami i szpiegami?
Jednak w przeciwieństwie do swoich stalinowskich odpowiedników sprzed kilku lat, amerykańskie ofiary, które zaginęły około 1940 r., nie zostały rozstrzelane ani uwięzione w Gułagu, a jedynie wykluczone z mediów głównego nurtu, które definiują naszą rzeczywistość, w ten sposób wymazane z naszej pamięci, tak że przyszłe pokolenia stopniowo zapomniały że kiedykolwiek żyli.
Wiodącym przykładem takiego „zaginionego” Amerykanina był dziennikarz John T. Flynn , dziś prawdopodobnie prawie nieznany, ale którego pozycja była kiedyś ogromna. Jak pisałem w zeszłym roku:
Wyobraźcie sobie zatem moje zdziwienie, gdy odkryłem, że w latach trzydziestych XX wieku był on jednym z najbardziej wpływowych głosów liberalnych w społeczeństwie amerykańskim, pisarzem zajmującym się ekonomią i polityką, którego status mógł z grubsza przypominać Paula Krugmana, chociaż z silnym zabarwieniem ścierania brudów . Jego cotygodniowa kolumna w „The New Republic” pozwoliła mu służyć jako gwiazda przewodnia dla postępowych elit Ameryki, a regularne występy w „Colliers” , ilustrowanym tygodniku o masowym nakładzie, docierającym do wielu milionów Amerykanów, zapewniły mu platformę porównywalną z platformą głównej osobowości telewizyjnej w późniejszy rozkwit telewizji sieciowej.
Do pewnego stopnia znaczenie Flynna można obiektywnie określić ilościowo. Kilka lat temu przypadkiem wspomniałem jego nazwisko oczytanej i zaangażowanej liberałce urodzonej w latach trzydziestych XX wieku, a ona, co nie było zaskoczeniem, zrobiła zupełną lukę, ale zastanawiała się, czy nie byłby trochę podobny do Waltera Lippmanna , bardzo znanego felietonisty „ tamtej epoki. Kiedy to sprawdziłem, zobaczyłem, że w setkach czasopism w moim systemie archiwizacji znajdowały się zaledwie 23 artykuły Lippmanna z lat trzydziestych XX wieku, ale całe 489 autorstwa Flynna.
Jeszcze silniejszym amerykańskim odpowiednikiem Taylora była historia historyka Harry'ego Elmera Barnesa, postać prawie mi nieznana, ale w jego czasach naukowiec o wielkim wpływie i pozycji:
Wyobraź sobie mój szok, gdy później odkryłem, że Barnes był w rzeczywistości jednym z pierwszych autorów, którzy najczęściej współpracowali z „Foreign Affairs” , służąc jako główny recenzent tej czcigodnej publikacji od jej powstania w 1922 r., podczas gdy wskazywano na jego pozycję jednego z czołowych amerykańskich liberalnych naukowców dzięki dziesiątkom występów w The Nation i The New Republic w ciągu tej dekady. Rzeczywiście, przypisuje się mu, że odegrał kluczową rolę w „rewizji” historii pierwszej wojny światowej, tak aby usunąć karykaturalny obraz niewysłowionej niemieckiej niegodziwości pozostawionej jako dziedzictwo nieuczciwej propagandy wojennej produkowanej przez przeciwstawne sobie siły brytyjskie i amerykańskie. rządy. O jego pozycji zawodowej świadczy trzydzieści pięć lub więcej książek, z których wiele to wpływowe tomy akademickie, a także liczne artykuły w „The American Historical Review” , „Political Science Quarterly” i innych wiodących czasopismach.
Kilka lat temu zdarzyło mi się wspomnieć o Barnesie wybitnemu amerykańskiemu uczonemu, którego ogólne zainteresowania w naukach politycznych i polityce zagranicznej były dość podobne, a mimo to nazwisko nic nie znaczyło. Pod koniec lat trzydziestych Barnes stał się czołowym krytykiem proponowanego zaangażowania Ameryki w II wojnę światową i w rezultacie na stałe „zniknął”, pozbawiony wstępu do wszystkich mediów głównego nurtu, podczas gdy duża sieć gazet znajdowała się pod silną presją, aby nagle zakończyć działalność. jego długoletnią konsorcjalną kolumnę narodową w maju 1940 r.
Wielu przyjaciół i sojuszników Barnesa padło ofiarą tej samej czystki ideologicznej, którą opisał w swoich własnych pismach i która trwała po zakończeniu wojny:
Ponad kilkanaście lat po swoim zniknięciu z naszych krajowych mediów Barnesowi udało się opublikować Perpetual War for Perpetual Peace , obszerny zbiór esejów uczonych i innych ekspertów omawiających okoliczności towarzyszące przystąpieniu Ameryki do II wojny światowej, który został wyprodukowany i rozpowszechniony przez mała drukarka w Idaho. Jego własnym wkładem był esej liczący 30 000 słów zatytułowany „Rewizjonizm i zaciemnienie historii” , w którym omówiono ogromne przeszkody, przed którymi musieli stanąć myśliciele dysydenccyjni tamtego okresu.
Sama książka została poświęcona pamięci jego przyjaciela, historyka Charlesa A. Bearda . Od początku XX wieku Beard był postacią intelektualną o największej randze i wpływach, współzałożycielem The New School w Nowym Jorku i pełniącym funkcję prezesa zarówno Amerykańskiego Stowarzyszenia Historycznego, jak i Amerykańskiego Stowarzyszenia Nauk Politycznych . Jako czołowy zwolennik polityki gospodarczej Nowego Ładu był powszechnie chwalony za swoje poglądy.
Jednak kiedy zwrócił się przeciwko wojowniczej polityce zagranicznej Roosevelta, wydawcy zamknęli przed nim drzwi i dopiero jego osobista przyjaźń z szefem Yale University Press pozwoliła, aby jego krytyczny tom z 1948 r. „ Prezydent Roosevelt i nadejście wojny, 1941” w ogóle ukazał się drukiem . Wydaje się, że od tego momentu znakomita reputacja Bearda zaczęła gwałtownie spadać, tak że w 1968 roku historyk Richard Hofstadter mógł napisać : „Dzisiaj reputacja Bearda przypomina imponującą ruinę w krajobrazie amerykańskiej historiografii. Niegdyś najwspanialszy dom w prowincji, obecnie stanowi ruinę”. Rzeczywiście, niegdyś dominującą „ekonomiczną interpretację historii” Bearda można obecnie niemal odrzucić jako promującą „niebezpieczne teorie spiskowe” i podejrzewam, że niewielu niehistoryków w ogóle o nim słyszało.
Innym ważnym współautorem tomu Barnes był William Henry Chamberlin , który przez dziesięciolecia zaliczał się do czołowych amerykańskich dziennikarzy zajmujących się polityką zagraniczną, mający na swoim koncie ponad 15 książek, z których większość była szeroko i pozytywnie recenzowana. Jednak America's Second Crusade , jego krytyczna analiza przystąpienia Ameryki do II wojny światowej z 1950 roku, nie znalazła głównego wydawcy, a kiedy się ukazała, została powszechnie zignorowana przez recenzentów. Przed publikacją jego nazwisko regularnie pojawiało się w naszych najbardziej wpływowych magazynach krajowych, takich jak The Atlantic Monthly i Harpers . Później jednak jego twórczość niemal całkowicie ograniczała się do biuletynów i czasopism o małym nakładzie, skierowanych do wąskiej publiczności konserwatywnej lub libertariańskiej.
W dzisiejszych czasach Internetu każdy może z łatwością założyć stronę internetową, na której może opublikować swoje poglądy, dzięki czemu będą one natychmiast dostępne dla każdego na świecie. Media społecznościowe, takie jak Facebook i Twitter, mogą za pomocą zaledwie kilku kliknięć myszką zwrócić uwagę milionów ludzi na interesujące lub kontrowersyjne materiały, całkowicie pomijając potrzebę wsparcia pośredników establishmentu. Łatwo jest nam zapomnieć, jak niezwykle wyzwaniem było rozpowszechnianie odmiennych poglądów w czasach druku, papieru i atramentu, i zdać sobie sprawę, że osoba usunięta ze swojego zwykłego gniazdka mogła potrzebować wielu lat, aby odzyskać jakiekolwiek znaczące oparcie dla społeczeństwa. rozpowszechnianie jego twórczości.
Ostatnie słowa napisałem w czerwcu 2018 roku i, jak na ironię, szeroko zakrojone czystki w mediach społecznościowych i zakaz cieni wkrótce pochłonęły wielu współczesnych dysydentów, znacznie ograniczając ich zdolność do rozpowszechniania swoich pomysłów.
- Amerykańska Prawda: nasza wielka czystka lat czterdziestych
Ron Unz • The Unz Review • 11 czerwca 2018 r. • 5500 słów
Pytanie 4: Powojenne Niemcy
Większość Amerykanów uważa, że po zakończeniu działań wojennych naród niemiecki został potraktowany humanitarnie i że Plan Marshalla pomógł odbudować Europę. Czy to dokładny opis tego, co faktycznie miało miejsce? (Freda Utley)
Ron Unz — Freda Utley , choć dziś już dawno zapomniana, była dość znaczącą dziennikarką z połowy stulecia . Urodzona jako Angielka, wyszła za mąż za żydowskiego komunistę i przeniosła się do Rosji Sowieckiej, a następnie uciekła do Ameryki po tym, jak jej mąż zginął w jednej z czystek stalinowskich. Chociaż nie darzyła pokonanych nazistów sympatią, zdecydowanie podzielała pogląd Beaty na temat potwornego wypaczenia sprawiedliwości w Norymberdze, a jej relacja z pierwszej ręki na temat miesięcy spędzonych w okupowanych Niemczech otwiera oczy, ponieważ opisuje straszliwe cierpienia, na jakie narażony był leżący na ziemi cywil ludności nawet wiele lat po zakończeniu wojny.
W 1948 roku spędziła kilka miesięcy podróżując po okupowanych Niemczech, a rok później opublikowała swoje doświadczenia w The High Cost of Vengeance , które otworzyły mi oczy. W przeciwieństwie do zdecydowanej większości innych amerykańskich dziennikarzy, którzy zazwyczaj składali krótkie wizyty pod dużą opieką, Utley rzeczywiście mówił po niemiecku i dość dobrze znał ten kraj, ponieważ często go odwiedzał w epoce weimarskiej. Podczas gdy dyskusja Grenfell była bardzo powściągliwa i niemal akademicka w swoim tonie, jej własne teksty były znacznie bardziej ostre i emocjonalne, co nie było zaskoczeniem, biorąc pod uwagę jej bezpośrednie spotkanie z niezwykle niepokojącym tematem. Zeznania jej naocznego świadka wydawały się dość wiarygodne, a przekazane przez nią informacje oparte na faktach, poparte licznymi wywiadami i niepotwierdzonymi obserwacjami, robiły wrażenie.
Ponad trzy lata po zakończeniu działań wojennych Utley natrafiło na teren wciąż prawie całkowicie zniszczony, a duża część ludności zmuszona była szukać schronienia w zniszczonych piwnicach lub dzielić maleńkie pokoje w zrujnowanych budynkach. Ludność uważała się za „pozbawioną praw”, często poddaną arbitralnemu traktowaniu przez oddziały okupacyjne lub inne elementy uprzywilejowane, pozostające całkowicie poza jurysdykcją prawną zwykłej lokalnej policji. Wielu Niemców regularnie usuwano z domów, w których kwaterowali żołnierze amerykańscy lub inne osoby, które znalazły u nich przychylność, co zostało odnotowane z pewnym oburzeniem w opublikowanych pośmiertnie dziennikach gen. George'a Pattona. Nawet w tym momencie cudzoziemski żołnierz może czasami odebrać niemieckim cywilom wszystko, czego chce, co może mieć potencjalnie niebezpieczne konsekwencje, jeśli zaprotestują przeciwko kradzieży. Utley wymownie cytuje byłego niemieckiego żołnierza, który pełnił obowiązki okupacyjne we Francji, i zauważył, że on i jego towarzysze działali w warunkach najsurowszej dyscypliny i nigdy nie wyobrażali sobie, że zachowują się wobec francuskich cywilów w sposób, w jaki obecne wojska alianckie traktują teraz Niemców.
Niektóre z cytowanych twierdzeń Utleya są dość zdumiewające, ale wydają się solidnie oparte na renomowanych źródłach i w pełni potwierdzone gdzie indziej. Przez pierwsze trzy lata czasu pokoju dzienna racja żywnościowa przydzielana całej ludności cywilnej Niemiec wynosiła około 1550 kalorii, czyli w przybliżeniu tyle samo, co ta dostarczana więźniom niemieckich obozów koncentracyjnych podczas niedawno zakończonej wojny, a czasami spadała znacznie, znacznie mniej . Podczas trudnej zimy 1946–47 cała ludność Zagłębia Ruhry, przemysłowego serca Niemiec, otrzymywała jedynie racje głodowe w wysokości 700–800 kalorii dziennie, a czasami osiągano nawet niższy poziom.
Pod wpływem wrogiej oficjalnej propagandy szeroko rozpowszechniona postawa personelu alianckiego wobec zwykłych Niemców była z pewnością równie zła, jak wszystko, z czym borykali się tubylcy żyjący pod europejskim reżimem kolonialnym. Utley raz po raz zauważa niezwykłe podobieństwa z traktowaniem i postawą, jaką widziała wcześniej mieszkańcy Zachodu wobec rdzennych Chińczyków przez większą część lat trzydziestych XX wieku lub z postawą, jaką Brytyjczycy wyrażali wobec swoich indyjskich poddanych kolonialnych. Mali niemieccy chłopcy, bez butów, pozbawieni środków do życia i głodni, chętnie zdobywali piłki w amerykańskich klubach sportowych za maleńkie grosze. Obecnie czasami dyskutuje się, czy w amerykańskich miastach pod koniec XIX wieku rzeczywiście znajdowały się tabliczki z napisem „Irlandczykom nie trzeba składać wniosków”, ale Utley z pewnością widział tabliczki z napisem „Zakaz wstępu psom i Niemcom” przed licznymi lokalami odwiedzanymi przez personel aliancki.
Opierając się na moich standardowych podręcznikach do historii, zawsze wierzyłem, że istnieje całkowita różnica w zachowaniu wobec miejscowej ludności cywilnej pomiędzy wojskami niemieckimi, które okupowały Francję w latach 1940-44, a wojskami alianckimi, które okupowały Niemcy od 1945 roku. Po przeczytaniu szczegółowych relacji Utleya i innych współczesnych źródeł uważam, że moja opinia była całkowicie słuszna, ale kierunek był odwrotny.
Utley uważał, że jedną z przyczyn tej całkowicie katastrofalnej sytuacji była celowa polityka rządu amerykańskiego. Chociaż Plan Morgenthau – mający na celu wyeliminowanie mniej więcej połowy populacji Niemiec – został oficjalnie porzucony i zastąpiony Planem Marshalla promującym odrodzenie Niemiec, odkryła, że wiele aspektów tego pierwszego nadal obowiązuje w praktyce. Jeszcze w 1948 r. ogromną część niemieckiej bazy przemysłowej nadal demontowano i wysyłano do innych krajów, podczas gdy nadal obowiązywały bardzo surowe ograniczenia na niemiecką produkcję i eksport. Rzeczywiście, poziom biedy, nędzy i ucisku, jaki widziała wszędzie, wydawał się niemal celowo obliczony, aby zwrócić zwykłych Niemców przeciwko Ameryce i jej zachodnim sojusznikom , być może otwierając drzwi komunistycznym sympatiom. Takie podejrzenia z pewnością się wzmocnią, gdy weźmiemy pod uwagę, że system ten został wymyślony przez Harry'ego Dextera White'a, który później okazał się agentem sowieckim.
Szczególnie zjadliwie wypowiadała się na temat całkowitego wypaczenia wszelkich podstawowych pojęć ludzkiej sprawiedliwości podczas Trybunału Norymberskiego i różnych innych procesów o zbrodnie wojenne, czemu poświęciła dwa pełne rozdziały. Te postępowania sądowe wykazały najgorszy rodzaj podwójnych standardów prawnych, a czołowi sędziowie państw sojuszniczych wyraźnie stwierdzili, że ich własne kraje w ogóle nie są związane tymi samymi międzynarodowymi konwencjami prawnymi, które, jak twierdzili, egzekwują wobec niemieckich oskarżonych. Jeszcze bardziej szokujące były niektóre zastosowane środki: oburzeni amerykańscy prawnicy i dziennikarze ujawnili, że regularnie stosowano przerażające tortury, groźby, szantaż i inne całkowicie nielegalne środki w celu uzyskania zeznań lub donosów na innych, co zdecydowanie sugerowało, że bardzo znaczna liczba spośród skazanych i powieszonych było całkowicie niewinnych.
Jej książka obszernie opisała zorganizowane wypędzenia etnicznych Niemców ze Śląska, Sudatenlandu, Prus Wschodnich i różnych innych części Europy Środkowo-Wschodniej, gdzie żyli oni spokojnie przez wiele stuleci, przy czym łączną liczbę takich wypędzonych szacuje się na ogół na 13 do 15 milionów. Czasami rodzinom dawało się zaledwie dziesięć minut na opuszczenie domów, w których mieszkały przez sto lat lub dłużej, a następnie zmuszano je do maszerowania pieszo, czasem setki mil, w kierunku odległego kraju, którego nigdy nie widziały, z jedynym rzeczy, które mogli nosić w swoich rękach. W niektórych przypadkach pozostałych przy życiu mężczyzn oddzielano i wysyłano do obozów pracy niewolniczej, co spowodowało exodus składający się wyłącznie z kobiet, dzieci i osób w podeszłym wieku. Wszystkie szacunki mówiły, że co najmniej kilka milionów zginęło po drodze z głodu, chorób lub narażenia.
W dzisiejszych czasach bez końca czytamy bolesne dyskusje na temat osławionego „Szlaku Łez”, którego doświadczyli Czirokezowie w odległej przeszłości na początku XIX wieku, ale to raczej podobne wydarzenie XX wieku miało prawie tysiąckrotnie większy rozmiar. Pomimo tej ogromnej rozbieżności co do wielkości i znacznie większej odległości w czasie, przypuszczam, że to pierwsze wydarzenie może zyskać tysiąckrotnie większą świadomość społeczną zwykłych Amerykanów. Jeśli tak, oznaczałoby to, że przytłaczająca kontrola mediów może z łatwością zmienić postrzeganą rzeczywistość milion lub więcej.
Wydaje się, że ruch ludnościowy z pewnością był największą czystką etniczną w historii świata i jeśli Niemcy kiedykolwiek zrobiły coś choćby w najmniejszym stopniu podobnego w latach europejskich zwycięstw i podbojów, to przyciągające wzrok sceny tak ogromnej powodzi opis zdesperowanych, wędrujących uchodźców z pewnością stałby się centralnym tematem wielu filmów o II wojnie światowej z ostatnich siedemdziesięciu lat. Ale ponieważ nic takiego się nigdy nie wydarzyło, hollywoodzcy scenarzyści stracili ogromną szansę.
- Wysoka cena zemsty
Freda Utley • 1949 • 125 000 słów
Niezwykle ponury wizerunek Utleya jest silnie potwierdzony przez wiele innych źródeł. W 1946 roku Victor Gollanz, wybitny brytyjski wydawca pochodzenia socjalistycznego, złożył dłuższą wizytę w Niemczech i w następnym roku opublikował In Darkest Germany , w którym opisał swoje ogromne przerażenie z powodu warunków, jakie tam zastał. Jego twierdzenia o przerażającym niedożywieniu, chorobach i całkowitej nędzy zostały poparte ponad setką mrożących krew w żyłach zdjęć , a wstęp do amerykańskiego wydania został napisany przez prezydenta Uniwersytetu w Chicago Roberta M. Hutchinsa, jednego z najbardziej renomowanych intelektualistów publicznych tamtej epoki . Wydaje się jednak, że jego niewielka publikacja wzbudziła stosunkowo niewielkie zainteresowanie w amerykańskich mediach głównego nurtu, chociaż jego nieco podobna książka Our Threatened Values , opublikowana rok wcześniej i oparta na informacjach z oficjalnych źródeł, spotkała się z nieco większym zainteresowaniem. Książka „Makabryczne żniwa” Ralpha Franklina Keelinga, również opublikowana w 1947 r., zawiera dużą liczbę oficjalnych oświadczeń i raportów głównych mediów, które zasadniczo potwierdzają dokładnie ten sam obraz pierwszych kilku lat Niemiec pod okupacją aliantów.
W latach 70. i 80. XX w. ten niepokojący temat podjął Alfred M. de Zayas , który posiadał dyplom prawa na Harvardzie i doktorat z historii, a także miał długą i znakomitą karierę jako czołowy międzynarodowy prawnik zajmujący się prawami człowieka, przez długi czas związany z Organizacją Narodów Zjednoczonych. Jego książki, takie jak Nemezis w Poczdamie , Straszna zemsta i Biuro ds. zbrodni wojennych Wehrmachtu, 1939-1945, skupiały się szczególnie na masowych czystkach etnicznych wśród mniejszości niemieckich i opierały się na ogromnej liczbie badań archiwalnych. Spotkały się z dużym uznaniem i uznaniem naukowców w głównych czasopismach akademickich i sprzedały się w setkach tysięcy egzemplarzy w Niemczech i innych częściach Europy, ale wydaje się, że prawie nie przeniknęły do świadomości Ameryki ani reszty anglojęzycznego świata.
Pod koniec lat 80. ta burzliwa debata historyczna przyjęła nowy, niezwykły obrót. Podczas wizyty we Francji w 1986 roku w ramach przygotowań do napisania niepowiązanej książki kanadyjski pisarz James Bacque natknął się na wskazówki sugerujące, że jedna z najstraszniejszych tajemnic powojennych Niemiec przez długi czas pozostawała całkowicie ukryta i wkrótce rozpoczął szeroko zakrojone badania na ten temat. , ostatecznie publikując „Inne straty” w 1989 r. Opierając się na bardzo znaczących dowodach, w tym aktach rządowych, wywiadach osobistych i nagranych zeznaniach naocznych świadków, argumentował, że po zakończeniu wojny Amerykanie zagłodzili na śmierć aż milion niemieckich jeńców wojennych, pozornie zamierzony akt polityczny, zbrodnię wojenną, która z pewnością zalicza się do największych w historii.
Dyskusja Bacque’a na temat nowych dowodów z archiwów Kremla stanowi stosunkowo niewielką część jego kontynuacji z 1997 r., Zbrodnie i miłosierdzie , która skupiała się na jeszcze bardziej wybuchowej analizie i stała się także międzynarodowym bestsellerem.
Jak opisano powyżej, obserwatorzy z pierwszej ręki powojennych Niemiec w latach 1947 i 1948, tacy jak Gollanz i Utley, bezpośrednio relacjonowali odkryte przez siebie przerażające warunki i stwierdzali, że przez lata oficjalne racje żywnościowe dla całej populacji były porównywalne z racjami żywnościowymi dla całej populacji. więźniów nazistowskich obozów koncentracyjnych, a czasami znacznie mniej, co prowadziło do powszechnego niedożywienia i chorób, których byli świadkami wszędzie wokół siebie. Odnotowali także zniszczenie większości przedwojennych zasobów mieszkaniowych w Niemczech i poważne przeludnienie spowodowane napływem wielu milionów żałosnych etnicznych uchodźców niemieckich wypędzonych z innych części Europy Środkowo-Wschodniej. Jednak tym gościom brakowało dostępu do solidnych statystyk dotyczących populacji i mogli jedynie spekulować na temat ogromnej liczby ofiar śmiertelnych w ludziach, które spowodowały już głód i choroby i które z pewnością będą się powtarzać, jeśli polityka nie zostanie szybko zmieniona.
Lata badań archiwalnych Bacque'a próbują odpowiedzieć na to pytanie, a wniosek, jaki wyciąga, z pewnością nie jest przyjemny. Wydaje się, że zarówno aliancki rząd wojskowy, jak i późniejsze niemieckie władze cywilne podjęły wspólny wysiłek, aby ukryć lub zaciemnić prawdziwą skalę nieszczęść, które dotknęły niemiecką ludność cywilną w latach 1945–1950, a oficjalne statystyki dotyczące śmiertelności zawarte w raportach rządowych są po prostu zbyt fantastyczne, aby mogły być prawdziwe, choć stały się podstawą późniejszych historii tego okresu. Bacque zauważa, że liczby te sugerują, że śmiertelność w strasznych warunkach 1947 r., długo pamiętanym jako „Rok Głodu” ( Hungerjahr ) i obrazowo opisanym w relacji Gollancza, była w rzeczywistości niższa niż w zamożnych Niemczech końca lat sześćdziesiątych. Co więcej, prywatne raporty amerykańskich urzędników, wskaźniki śmiertelności w poszczególnych miejscowościach i inne mocne dowody wskazują, że te od dawna akceptowane zbiorcze liczby były w zasadzie fikcyjne.
Zamiast tego Bacque próbuje przedstawić bardziej realistyczne szacunki w oparciu o badanie całkowitej populacji według różnych niemieckich spisów powszechnych wraz z odnotowanym napływem ogromnej liczby niemieckich uchodźców. Stosując tę prostą analizę, przedstawia dość mocny argument, że nadmierna liczba zgonów w Niemczech w tym okresie wyniosła co najmniej około 10 milionów, a być może wiele milionów więcej. Co więcej, przedstawia istotne dowody na to, że głód był albo zamierzony, albo przynajmniej znacznie się pogorszył w wyniku oporu rządu amerykańskiego wobec zagranicznych wysiłków w zakresie pomocy żywnościowej. Być może liczby te nie powinny być tak całkowicie zaskakujące, biorąc pod uwagę, że oficjalny Plan Morgenthau przewidywał eliminację około 20 milionów Niemców, a jak pokazuje Bacque, czołowi przywódcy amerykańscy po cichu zgodzili się na kontynuowanie tej polityki w praktyce, nawet jeśli wyrzekli się jej w teorii.
Zakładając, że liczby te są choćby w najmniejszym stopniu poprawne, implikacje są dość niezwykłe. Liczba ofiar katastrofy ludzkiej, której doświadczyły powojenne Niemcy, z pewnością zaliczałaby się do największych we współczesnej historii czasów pokoju, znacznie przekraczając liczbę ofiar śmiertelnych, które miały miejsce podczas głodu na Ukrainie na początku lat trzydziestych XX wieku, a być może nawet zbliżając się do całkowicie niezamierzonych strat podczas Wielkiego Skoku Mao z lat 1959-61. Co więcej, powojenne straty niemieckie znacznie przewyższyłyby procentowo którekolwiek z tych niefortunnych wydarzeń i pozostałoby to prawdą, nawet gdyby szacunki Bacque zostały znacznie obniżone. Wątpię jednak, czy choćby niewielki ułamek jednego procenta Amerykanów jest dziś świadomy tej ogromnej ludzkiej katastrofy. Prawdopodobnie wspomnienia są znacznie silniejsze w samych Niemczech, ale biorąc pod uwagę narastające prawne tłumienie niezgodnych poglądów w tym nieszczęsnym kraju, podejrzewam, że każdemu, kto zbyt energicznie omawia ten temat, grozi natychmiastowe więzienie.
W znacznym stopniu ta historyczna ignorancja była mocno wspierana przez nasze rządy, często używając podstępnych lub nawet nikczemnych środków. Podobnie jak w starym, upadającym ZSRR, znaczna część obecnej legitymizacji politycznej dzisiejszego rządu amerykańskiego i jego różnych europejskich państw-wasali opiera się na szczególnej historii II wojny światowej, a kwestionowanie tej koncepcji może mieć tragiczne konsekwencje polityczne. Bacque wiarygodnie relacjonuje niektóre z widocznych wysiłków mających na celu odwiedzenie jakiejkolwiek większej gazety lub magazynu od publikowania artykułów omawiających zaskakujące wnioski z jego pierwszej książki, narzucając w ten sposób „zaciemnienie” mające na celu całkowite zminimalizowanie wszelkich relacji w mediach. Wydaje się, że takie środki były dość skuteczne, ponieważ jeszcze osiem lub dziewięć lat temu nie jestem pewien, czy kiedykolwiek słyszałem choć słowo o tych szokujących pomysłach i z pewnością nigdy nie widziałem ich poważnej dyskusji w żadnej z licznych gazet lub czasopism które uważnie czytałem przez ostatnie trzy dekady.
Oceniając czynniki polityczne, które najwyraźniej spowodowały tak ogromną i pozornie celową liczbę ofiar śmiertelnych wśród niemieckiej ludności cywilnej długo po zakończeniu walk, należy zwrócić uwagę na ważną kwestię. Historycy chcący wykazać ogromną niegodziwość Hitlera lub zasugerować jego wiedzę na temat różnych zbrodni popełnionych podczas II wojny światowej są regularnie zmuszeni przeszukiwać dziesiątki tysięcy jego drukowanych słów tu i ówdzie w poszukiwaniu sugestywnego sformułowania, a następnie interpretować te niejasne aluzje jako absolutnie rozstrzygające oświadczenia deklaratywne. Ci, którzy nie dopasowują słów do swoich potrzeb, jak na przykład znany brytyjski historyk David Irving , czasami mogą w rezultacie zrujnować swoje kariery.
Ale już w 1940 roku amerykański Żyd Theodore Kaufman był tak wściekły z powodu tego, co uważał za złe traktowanie niemieckiego żydostwa przez Hitlera, że opublikował krótką książkę o sugestywnym tytule Niemcy muszą zginąć! , w którym wyraźnie zaproponował całkowitą eksterminację narodu niemieckiego. I najwyraźniej książka ta spotkała się z przychylną, choć może nie całkiem poważną dyskusją w wielu naszych najbardziej prestiżowych mediach, w tym w New York Times , Washington Post i Time Magazine . Jeżeli takie uczucia były swobodnie wyrażane w niektórych kręgach jeszcze przed faktycznym przystąpieniem Ameryki do konfliktu zbrojnego, to być może długo ukrywana polityka, którą, jak się wydaje, odkrył Bacque, nie powinna być dla nas tak całkowicie szokująca.
- American Pravda: powojenna Francja i powojenne Niemcy
Ron Unz • The Unz Review • 9 lipca 2018 r. • 6600 słów
Pytanie 5: Atak na Pearl Harbor
Czy atak Japonii na Pearl Harbor był nieoczekiwany, czy też poprzedziły go liczne prowokacje USA, które zmusiły Japonię do militarnej odpowiedzi?
Ron Unz — 7 grudnia 1941 roku japońskie siły zbrojne przypuściły niespodziewany atak na naszą Flotę Pacyfiku stacjonującą w Pearl Harbor, zatapiając wiele z naszych największych okrętów wojennych i zabijając ponad 2400 Amerykanów. W rezultacie Ameryka została nagle wciągnięta w II wojnę światową, a data ta „przeżyła w niesławie” jako jedna z najsłynniejszych w historii naszego narodu.
W tamtym czasie prawie wszyscy zwykli Amerykanie uważali japoński atak za szokujący, niesprowokowany grom z jasnego nieba, a przez ponad 80 lat nasze mainstreamowe książki historyczne i doniesienia medialne wzmocniły to silne wrażenie. Ale jak wyjaśniłem w 2019 r., faktyczne fakty są zupełnie inne:
Od 1940 roku FDR podejmował wielkie wysiłki polityczne, aby bezpośrednio zaangażować Amerykę w wojnę z Niemcami, ale opinia publiczna była w przeważającej mierze przeciwna, a sondaże wykazały, że aż 80% populacji było przeciwnej. Wszystko to uległo natychmiastowej zmianie, gdy japońskie bomby spadły na Hawaje i nagle kraj znalazł się w stanie wojny.
Biorąc pod uwagę te fakty, istniały naturalne podejrzenia, że Roosevelt celowo sprowokował atak swoimi decyzjami wykonawczymi o zamrożeniu japońskich aktywów, nałożeniu embarga na wszystkie dostawy niezbędnego oleju opałowego i odrzuceniu powtarzających się próśb przywódców Tokio o negocjacje. W tomie z 1953 r. pod redakcją Barnesa znany historyk dyplomacji Charles Tansill podsumował swój bardzo mocny argument, że Roosevelt próbował wykorzystać japoński atak jako najlepsze „tylne drzwi do wojny” przeciwko Niemcom , co przedstawił rok wcześniej w książce pt. to samo imię. Wydaje się, że przez dziesięciolecia informacje zawarte w prywatnych pamiętnikach i dokumentach rządowych niemal ostatecznie potwierdziły tę interpretację, a Sekretarz Wojny Henry Stimson wskazał, że plan polegał na „manewrowaniu [Japonii] tak, aby oddała pierwszy strzał”…
Do 1941 roku Stany Zjednoczone złamały wszystkie japońskie kodeksy dyplomatyczne i swobodnie czytały ich tajne komunikaty. Dlatego od dawna istnieje również powszechne, choć kwestionowane, przekonanie, że prezydent doskonale zdawał sobie sprawę z planowanego japońskiego ataku na naszą flotę i celowo nie ostrzegł swoich lokalnych dowódców, zapewniając w ten sposób, że wynikające z tego ciężkie straty amerykańskie stworzą mściwy naród zjednoczony dla wojna. Tansill i były główny badacz komisji śledczej Kongresu przedstawili tę sprawę w tym samym tomie Barnesa z 1953 r., a rok później były admirał USA opublikował „Ostateczną tajemnicę Pearl Harbor” , podając podobne argumenty w większej obszerności. Książka ta zawierała także wprowadzenie jednego z najwyższych rangą dowódców marynarki amerykańskiej podczas II wojny światowej, który w pełni poparł tę kontrowersyjną teorię.
W 2000 roku dziennikarz Robert M. Stinnett opublikował wiele dodatkowych dowodów potwierdzających, opartych na swoich ośmioletnich badaniach archiwalnych, które omówiono w niedawnym artykule . Wymownym stwierdzeniem Stinnetta jest to, że gdyby Waszyngton ostrzegł dowódców Pearl Harbor, wynikające z nich przygotowania obronne zostałyby zauważone przez lokalnych japońskich szpiegów i przekazane zbliżającej się grupie zadaniowej; a gdyby element zaskoczenia został utracony, atak prawdopodobnie zostałby przerwany , co zniweczyło wszystkie długoterminowe plany wojenne FDR. Chociaż różne szczegóły mogą być kwestionowane, uważam, że dowody na wcześniejszą wiedzę Roosevelta są całkiem przekonujące.
W ubiegłym roku dalej rozwinąłem te argumenty:
Ta rekonstrukcja historyczna jest silnie poparta wieloma dodatkowymi materiałami. W tym okresie prof. Revilo P. Oliver zajmował wysokie stanowisko w wywiadzie wojskowym, a kiedy cztery dekady później opublikował swoje wspomnienia, stwierdził , że FDR celowo oszukał Japończyków, aby zaatakowali Pearl Harbor. Wiedząc, że Japonia złamała kodeksy dyplomatyczne Portugalii, Roosevelt poinformował ambasadora tego ostatniego kraju o swoich planach zaczekania, aż Japończycy nadmiernie się rozciągną, a następnie nakaże Flocie Pacyfiku przeprowadzenie niszczycielskiego ataku z zaskoczenia na ich macierzyste wyspy. Według Olivera późniejsze depesze dyplomatyczne Japonii ujawniły, że udało jej się przekonać, że FDR planuje nagle ich zaatakować.
Rzeczywiście, zaledwie kilka miesięcy przed Pearl Harbor, jeden z najpopularniejszych amerykańskich magazynów Argosy Weekly zamieścił fikcyjną okładkę opisującą dokładnie taki niszczycielski atak z zaskoczenia na Tokio w odwecie za incydent morski, w którym brały udział potężne bombowce naszej Floty Pacyfiku. wyrządzając ogromne szkody nieprzygotowanej stolicy Japonii. Zastanawiam się, czy administracja Roosevelta nie przyłożyła ręki do publikacji tej historii.
Już w maju 1940 roku Roosevelt nakazał przeniesienie Floty Pacyfiku z jej macierzystego portu w San Diego do Pearl Harbor na Hawajach, czemu zdecydowanie sprzeciwił się tej decyzji James Richardson, dowódca admirała James Richardson, który został zwolniony, jako niepotrzebnie prowokacyjną i niebezpieczną. Ponadto:
Bezpośrednio po ataku na Pearl Harbor miał miejsce także bardzo dziwny incydent domowy, który, jak się wydaje, wzbudził zbyt małe zainteresowanie. W tamtych czasach filmy były najpotężniejszym medium popularnym i chociaż nie-Żydzi stanowili 97% populacji, kontrolowali tylko jedno z głównych studiów; być może przypadkowo Walt Disney był także jedyną wysokiej rangi osobistością Hollywood, bezpośrednio związaną z obozem antywojennym. A dzień po niespodziewanym ataku Japonii setki żołnierzy amerykańskich przejęło kontrolę nad Disney Studios , rzekomo po to, aby pomóc w obronie Kalifornii przed siłami japońskimi znajdującymi się tysiące mil dalej, podczas gdy okupacja wojskowa trwała przez następne osiem miesięcy. Zastanówmy się, co pomyślałyby podejrzliwe umysły, gdyby 12 września 2001 roku prezydent Bush natychmiast nakazał swojemu wojsku przejęcie biur sieci CBS, twierdząc, że taki krok jest konieczny, aby pomóc chronić Nowy Jork przed dalszymi atakami islamistycznymi.
Pearl Harbor zostało zbombardowane w niedzielę i gdyby FDR i jego najważniejsi doradcy nie byli w pełni świadomi zbliżającego się japońskiego ataku, z pewnością byliby całkowicie zajęci następstwami katastrofy. Wydaje się wysoce nieprawdopodobne, aby wojsko amerykańskie było gotowe przejąć kontrolę nad studiami Disneya wczesnym poniedziałkowym rankiem po faktycznym „niespodziewanym” ataku.
Pytanie 6: Operacja Pike
Czy Anglia i Francja planowały zaatakować Rosję przed inwazją Hitlera na ten kraj?
Ron Unz : Przez ponad osiemdziesiąt lat jeden z najważniejszych punktów zwrotnych II wojny światowej był pomijany w niemal każdej zachodniej historii napisanej na temat tego konfliktu, w wyniku czego praktycznie żaden wykształcony Amerykanin nie jest nawet tego świadomy.
Niezaprzeczalnym, udokumentowanym faktem jest, że zaledwie kilka miesięcy po rozpoczęciu wojny zachodni alianci – Wielka Brytania i Francja – zdecydowali się zaatakować neutralny Związek Radziecki, który uważali za słaby militarnie i kluczowego dostawcę zasobów naturalnych dla machiny wojennej Hitlera . Opierając się na swoich doświadczeniach z I wojny światowej, przywódcy aliantów wierzyli, że szanse na jakikolwiek przełom militarny na froncie zachodnim są niewielkie, więc uważali, że największą szansą na pokonanie Niemiec jest pokonanie quasi-sojusznika sowieckiego Niemiec.
Jednak rzeczywistość była zupełnie inna. ZSRR był znacznie silniejszy, niż im się wówczas wydawało, i ostatecznie był odpowiedzialny za zniszczenie 80% niemieckich formacji wojskowych, podczas gdy Ameryka i pozostali sojusznicy stanowili jedynie pozostałe 20%. Dlatego atak aliantów na Związek Radziecki w 1940 r. wciągnąłby ich bezpośrednio w wojnę jako pełnego sojusznika wojskowego Hitlera, a połączenie siły przemysłowej Niemiec i zasobów naturalnych Rosji byłoby prawie niepokonane, prawie na pewno odwracając wynik wojny.
Od początków rewolucji bolszewickiej alianci byli bardzo wrogo nastawieni do Związku Radzieckiego, a po ataku Stalina na Finlandię pod koniec 1939 r. stali się jeszcze bardziej wrogo nastawieni. Ta wojna zimowa zakończyła się źle, ponieważ Finowie posiadający znaczną przewagę liczebną bardzo skutecznie stawiali opór siłom sowieckim, co doprowadziło do plan aliantów wysłania kilku dywizji do walki u boku Finów. Według przełomowej książki Seana McMeekina „ Wojna Stalina” z 2021 r . radziecki dyktator zdał sobie sprawę z tego niebezpiecznego zagrożenia militarnego, a jego obawy związane z grożącą interwencją aliantów przekonały go do szybkiego rozstrzygnięcia wojny z Finlandią na stosunkowo hojnych warunkach.
Pomimo tego plany sojuszniczego ataku na ZSRR były kontynuowane, przechodząc obecnie do operacji Pike, polegającej na wykorzystaniu ich eskadr bombowców stacjonujących w Syrii i Iraku do zniszczenia pól naftowych w Baku na sowieckim Kaukazie, przy jednoczesnej próbie wciągnięcia Turcji i Iranu do swoich sił planowany atak na Stalina. Do tego czasu radzieckie rolnictwo stało się silnie zmechanizowane i zależne od ropy, a stratedzy aliantów wierzyli, że pomyślne zniszczenie sowieckich pól naftowych wyeliminuje większość dostaw paliwa dla tego kraju, prawdopodobnie powodując głód, który może obalić niesmaczny reżim komunistyczny.
Jednak praktycznie wszystkie założenia aliantów były całkowicie błędne. Tylko niewielka część niemieckiej ropy pochodziła od Sowietów, więc jej eliminacja miałaby niewielki wpływ na niemiecki wysiłek wojenny. Jak wkrótce wykazały późniejsze wydarzenia, pod względem militarnym ZSRR był raczej niezwykle silny niż słaby. Alianci wierzyli, że zaledwie kilka tygodni ataków kilkudziesięciu istniejących bombowców całkowicie zdewastuje pola naftowe, ale w dalszej części wojny znacznie większe ataki powietrzne miały jedynie ograniczony wpływ na wydobycie ropy w innych miejscach.
Udany czy nie, planowany atak aliantów na ZSRR stanowiłby największą strategiczną ofensywę bombową w historii świata do tego czasu, a został zaplanowany i przełożony na pierwsze miesiące 1940 r., a ostatecznie porzucony dopiero po przekroczeniu przez armie niemieckie granicy francuskiej , otoczył i pokonał siły lądowe aliantów i wyeliminował Francję z wojny.
Zwycięskim Niemcom udało się zdobyć wszystkie tajne dokumenty dotyczące operacji Pike i dokonali poważnego zamachu propagandowego, publikując je w formie faksu i tłumaczenia, tak że wszystkie posiadające wiedzę osoby szybko wiedziały, że alianci byli o krok od ataku na Sowietów . Ten brakujący fakt pomaga wyjaśnić, dlaczego Stalin pozostawał tak nieufny wobec wysiłków dyplomatycznych Churchilla przed atakiem Hitlera na Barbarossę rok później.
Jednakże przez ponad trzy pokolenia niezwykła historia tego, jak alianci byli tak blisko przegranej wojny poprzez atak na ZSRR, była całkowicie wykluczona z praktycznie wszystkich zachodnich historii. Dlatego też, kiedy odkryłem te fakty we wspomnieniach Sisleya Huddlestona z 1952 r., czołowego dziennikarza anglo-francuskiego, początkowo założyłem, że musiał mieć urojenia:
Pogląd, jakoby alianci przygotowywali się do rozpoczęcia wielkiej ofensywy bombowej na Związek Radziecki zaledwie kilka miesięcy po wybuchu II wojny światowej, był w oczywisty sposób absurdalny, tak absurdalny, że ani ślad tej dawno obalanej plotki nigdy nie dotarł do standardowe teksty historyczne, które czytałem na temat konfliktu europejskiego. Jednak fakt, że Huddleston nadal trzymał się takich nonsensownych przekonań, nawet kilka lat po zakończeniu wojny, nasunął poważne pytania dotyczące jego naiwności, a nawet zdrowego rozsądku. Zastanawiałam się, czy mogę zaufać choćby jednemu słowu, które powiedział na jakikolwiek inny temat.
Jednak niedługo potem spotkałem się z nie lada zaskoczeniem w artykule z 2017 roku opublikowanym w niezwykle szanowanym czasopiśmie The National Interest . Krótki artykuł opatrzony był opisowym nagłówkiem „Na początku II wojny światowej Wielka Brytania i Francja planowały zbombardować Rosję”. Treść całkowicie mnie oszołomiła, a gdy wiarygodność Huddlestona została już w pełni ugruntowana – a wiarygodność moich standardowych podręczników do historii została w równym stopniu zniszczona – poszłam dalej i zasadniczo oparłam się na jego relacji w moim długim artykule „American Pravda: Post-War France and Post-War Niemcy."
Jeśli wszystkie nasze książki historyczne dotyczące II wojny światowej mogą wykluczyć w pełni udokumentowaną historię o tak ogromnym znaczeniu, to oczywiście nie można im ufać w niczym innym.
- American Pravda: Jak Hitler ocalił aliantów
Ron Unz • The Unz Review • 13 maja 2019 r. • 8300 słów
Pytanie 7: Holokaust
Jaka jest prawda o Holokauście? Najwyraźniej przeprowadziłeś sporo badań na ten temat i możesz mieć opinię na temat tego, co faktycznie miało miejsce. Czy można z całą pewnością powiedzieć ilu Żydów zostało zamordowanych lub zweryfikować sposób, w jaki zostali zabici? Czy Twoim zdaniem fakty historyczne dotyczące Holokaustu pokrywają się z narracją popieraną przez potężne organizacje żydowskie, czy też istnieją między nimi duże rozbieżności?
Ron Unz : Dla większości Amerykanów i innych mieszkańców Zachodu żydowski Holokaust jest jednym z najważniejszych i najbardziej monumentalnych wydarzeń XX wieku, prawdopodobnie dziś bardziej widocznym niż jakikolwiek inny aspekt II wojny światowej, podczas której do niego doszło.
Samo wspomnienie kultowej liczby „sześć milionów” jest natychmiast zrozumiałe, a w ostatnich dziesięcioleciach wiele krajów zachodnich prawnie chroniło status tego konkretnego wydarzenia historycznego, nakładając surowe grzywny lub kary więzienia na każdego, kto kwestionuje go lub minimalizuje. odpowiednik staromodnych przepisów dotyczących bluźnierstwa.
Jako osoba, która kształciła się w amerykańskim systemie szkolnym, a następnie spędziła całe życie na wchłanianiu informacji z naszych mediów i kultury popularnej, z pewnością zawsze byłam świadoma Holokaustu, chociaż nigdy nie zagłębiałam się zbytnio w jego szczegóły. Wraz z rozwojem Internetu w ciągu ostatnich kilku dekad od czasu do czasu spotykałem osoby, które kwestionowały tę narrację, ale świat jest pełen wszelkiego rodzaju wariatów i wariatów i zwykle nie zwracałem zbytniej uwagi na ich argumenty .
Następnie osiem czy dziewięć lat temu wybuchła poważna kontrowersja dotycząca magazynu „Reason” , sztandarowej publikacji ruchu libertariańskiego. Najwyraźniej w połowie lat 70. „Reason” aktywnie publikował i promował prace czołowych amerykańskich negacjonistów Holokaustu, co było dość szokującym odkryciem. W latach 90. zaprzyjaźniłem się z ludźmi z Powodu i chociaż czasami potrafili być dogmatyczni w pewnych kwestiach ideologicznych, poza tym wydawali się raczej rozsądni. Nie mogłem zrozumieć, dlaczego zaprzeczyli realności Holokaustu, zwłaszcza że tak wielu z nich było Żydami. Później, gdy miałem trochę czasu, postanowiłem dokładniej zbadać tę kontrowersję.
Większość opublikowanych przez „ Reason ” artykułów „Negocjonistów Holokaustu ” w rzeczywistości dotyczyła innych kontrowersji historycznych, ale wszystkie te artykuły wydawały się niezwykle solidne i dobrze wykonane. Postanowiłem więc przeczytać książki Deborah Lipstadt , jednej z czołowych na świecie krytyków negacji Holokaustu, która była mocno cytowana w artykułach atakujących „Reason” . Nazwisko Lipstadt było mi już trochę znajome z jej zaciekłej batalii prawnej z brytyjskim historykiem Davidem Irvingiem pod koniec lat 90.
Czytając książki Lipstadta, byłem bardzo zaskoczony, gdy odkryłem, że podczas samej drugiej wojny światowej niewiele osobistości głównego nurtu w świecie polityki i mediów najwyraźniej wierzyło w realność trwającego Holokaustu, głównie w odniesieniu do szeroko rozpowszechnionych historii promowanych przez żydowskich działaczy i rządów sojuszniczych jako jedynie nieuczciwą propagandę wojenną , podobnie jak śmieszne historie o okrucieństwach z I wojny światowej, w których Niemcy gwałcili belgijskie zakonnice lub zjadali belgijskie dzieci. I rzeczywiście, wiele historii o Holokauście, które Lipstadt potępia media za ignorowanie, było całkowicie absurdalnych, jak na przykład zabicie przez Niemców ponad miliona Żydów poprzez indywidualne wstrzyknięcie im w serce trucizny. Tak jak napisałem :
Lipstadt zatytułowała swoją pierwszą książkę „Beyond Belief” i myślę, że wszyscy możemy zgodzić się, że wydarzenie historyczne, które ona i tak wielu innych ludzi ze środowiska akademickiego i Hollywood uczyniły centralnym punktem swojego życia i kariery, jest z pewnością jednym z najbardziej niezwykłych wydarzeń w całej historii ludzkości. Rzeczywiście, być może tylko inwazja Marsa byłaby bardziej warta zbadania historycznego, ale słynne słuchowisko radiowe Orsona Wellesa „Wojna światów”, które przeraziło tak wiele milionów Amerykanów w 1938 r., okazało się raczej mistyfikacją niż prawdą.
Sześć milionów Żydów, którzy zginęli w Holokauście, z pewnością stanowiło bardzo znaczny ułamek wszystkich ofiar wojennych w Teatrze Europejskim, przewyższając liczebnie 100-krotnie wszystkich Brytyjczyków, którzy zginęli podczas Blitzu, i będąc dziesiątki razy liczniejszymi niż wszyscy Amerykanów, którzy polegli tam w bitwie. Co więcej, sama potworność zbrodni popełnionej na niewinnej ludności cywilnej z pewnością stanowiłaby najlepsze możliwe uzasadnienie wysiłku wojennego aliantów. Jednak wydaje się, że przez wiele, wiele lat po wojnie większość czołowych bohaterów politycznych w tym względzie ogarnął bardzo dziwny rodzaj amnezji.
Robert Faurisson, francuski naukowiec, który w latach 70. stał się wybitnym negacjonistą Holokaustu, poczynił kiedyś niezwykle interesującą obserwację dotyczącą wspomnień Eisenhowera, Churchilla i De Gaulle’a:
Trzy z najbardziej znanych dzieł na temat drugiej wojny światowej to Krucjata generała Eisenhowera w Europie (Nowy Jork: Doubleday [Country Life Press], 1948), Druga wojna światowa Winstona Churchilla (Londyn: Cassell, 6 tomów, 1948–1954). oraz Mémoires de guerre generała de Gaulle’a (Paryż: Plon, 3 tomy, 1954–1959). W tych trzech pracach nie znajdziemy najmniejszej wzmianki o nazistowskich komorach gazowych.
Krucjata Eisenhowera w Europie to książka licząca 559 stron; sześć tomów Drugiej wojny światowej Churchilla liczy łącznie 4448 stron; a trzytomowe Mémoires de guerre de Gaulle'a liczy 2054 strony. W tym natłoku pism, liczącym łącznie 7061 stron (nie licząc części wprowadzających), opublikowanych w latach 1948–1959, nie znajdziemy ani wzmianki o nazistowskich „komorach gazowych”, „ludobójstwie” Żydów, ani o „sześciu milionów” żydowskich ofiar wojny.
Biorąc pod uwagę, że Holokaust można by rozsądnie uznać za najbardziej niezwykły epizod drugiej wojny światowej, takie uderzające pominięcia niemal zmuszają nas do umieszczenia Eisenhowera, Churchilla i De Gaulle’a w szeregach „ukrytych negacjonistów Holokaustu”.
W książkach Lipstadta i innych wybitnych historyków Holokaustu, takich jak Lucy Dawidowicz, ostro potępiono długą listę czołowych amerykańskich historyków i innych naukowców akademickich jako pośrednich lub jawnych negacjonistów Holokaustu, twierdząc, że nawet lata po ich śmierci nadal ignorowali lub kwestionowali rzeczywistość Holokaustu. wojna się skończyła.
Jeszcze bardziej niezwykły był fakt, że wpływowe grupy żydowskie, takie jak ADL, wydawały się niechętne kwestionowaniu lub krytykowaniu nawet najbardziej wyraźnego zaprzeczania Holokaustowi w latach po drugiej wojnie światowej. W trakcie moich badań odkryłem szczególnie uderzający przykład:
Kilka lat temu natknąłem się na zupełnie mało znaną książkę z 1951 roku zatytułowaną „ Żelazna kurtyna nad Ameryką” autorstwa Johna Beaty’ego, powszechnie szanowanego profesora uniwersyteckiego. Beaty spędził lata wojny w wywiadzie wojskowym, gdzie powierzono mu zadanie przygotowywania codziennych raportów informacyjnych rozsyłanych do wszystkich najwyższych urzędników amerykańskich, podsumowujących dostępne informacje wywiadowcze zdobyte w ciągu ostatnich 24 godzin, co oczywiście wiązało się z dużą odpowiedzialnością.
Jako zagorzały antykomunista uważał, że większość ludności żydowskiej w Ameryce jest głęboko uwikłana w działalność wywrotową, co stanowi poważne zagrożenie dla tradycyjnych amerykańskich wolności. W szczególności rosnąca władza Żydów nad wydawnictwami i mediami coraz bardziej utrudniała dotarcie niezgodnych poglądów do narodu amerykańskiego, a ten reżim cenzury stanowił „żelazną kurtynę” opisaną w jego tytule. Obwiniał żydowskie interesy za całkowicie niepotrzebną wojnę z hitlerowskimi Niemcami, które od dawna szukały dobrych stosunków z Ameryką, ale zamiast tego poniosły całkowite zniszczenie z powodu silnego sprzeciwu wobec wspieranego przez Żydów komunistycznego zagrożenia w Europie.
Beaty ostro potępiła także amerykańskie wsparcie dla nowego państwa Izrael, które potencjalnie kosztowało nas dobrą wolę tak wielu milionów muzułmanów i Arabów. A tak na marginesie, skrytykował także Izraelczyków za dalsze twierdzenie, że Hitler zabił sześć milionów Żydów, co jest wysoce nieprawdopodobnym oskarżeniem, które nie ma żadnego widocznego uzasadnienia w rzeczywistości i wydaje się być jedynie oszustwem wymyślonym przez Żydów i komunistów, mającym na celu zatruwanie naszych stosunków z powojennymi Niemcami i wyciąganie pieniędzy dla państwa żydowskiego od długo cierpiącego narodu niemieckiego.
Co więcej, był zjadliwy wobec procesów norymberskich, które określił jako „poważną niezatartą plamę” na Ameryce i „parodię sprawiedliwości”. Według niego postępowanie zdominowali mściwi niemieccy Żydzi, z których wielu zajmowało się fałszowaniem zeznań lub miało nawet przeszłość kryminalną. W rezultacie to „paskudne fiasko” jedynie nauczyło Niemców, że „nasz rząd nie miał poczucia sprawiedliwości”. Bardzo podobne stanowisko zajął senator Robert Taft, republikański przywódca okresu bezpośrednio powojennego, co później przyniosło mu pochwałę Johna F. Kennedy'ego w Profiles in Courage . Fakt, że główny prokurator radziecki w Norymberdze odegrał tę samą rolę podczas osławionych stalinowskich procesów pokazowych pod koniec lat trzydziestych XX wieku, podczas których liczni starzy bolszewicy przyznawali się do najróżniejszych absurdalnych i śmiesznych rzeczy, wcale nie zwiększył wiarygodności postępowania dla wielu osób z zewnątrz obserwatorzy.
Zarówno wówczas, jak i teraz książka zajmująca tak kontrowersyjne stanowiska miała niewielkie szanse na znalezienie głównego nurtu w Nowym Jorku, ale wkrótce została wydana przez małą firmę z Dallas i odniosła ogromny sukces, wydając około siedemnastu nakładów w ciągu następnych kilku lat. Według Scotta McConnella, redaktora-założyciela The American Conservative , książka Beaty stała się drugim najpopularniejszym konserwatywnym tekstem lat pięćdziesiątych, ustępując jedynie kultowemu klasykowi Russella Kirka, The Conservative Mind .
Co więcej, chociaż grupy żydowskie, w tym ADL, ostro potępiły książkę, zwłaszcza w swoim prywatnym lobbowaniu, wysiłki te wywołały reakcję i wielu czołowych amerykańskich generałów, zarówno w służbie, jak i na emeryturze, całym sercem poparło pracę Beaty, potępiając wysiłki ADL zmierzające do cenzury i wzywając wszystkich Amerykanie do przeczytania tomu. Chociaż dość wyraźne Negowanie Holokaustu Beaty'ego mogło zszokować czułą wrażliwość współczesnych czasów, wydaje się, że w tamtym czasie wywołało zaledwie falę niepokoju i zostało prawie całkowicie zignorowane nawet przez zagorzałych żydowskich krytyków tego dzieła.
Ogromny ogólnokrajowy bestseller Beaty'ego wzbudził ogromną uwagę, a także masową krytykę ze strony Żydów i liberałów, chociaż mimo że energicznie atakowali go w każdej innej kwestii, żaden z nich nie rzucił mu wyzwania, gdy odrzucał Holokaust jako jedynie notoryczną mistyfikację propagandową z czasów wojny, w którą niewielu wciąż wierzyło . Co więcej, długa lista naszych czołowych dowódców wojskowych z czasów II wojny światowej zdecydowanie potwierdzała tę tezę w książce Beaty'ego.
Nasze współczesne rozumienie Holokaustu niemal w całości wywodzi się z przełomowej książki historyka Raula Hilberga z 1961 roku . Był dzieckiem, kiedy jego rodzina żydowskich uchodźców przybyła do Ameryki na początku wojny i był oburzony, że całe amerykańskie media ignorują eksterminację europejskich Żydów, jak twierdzą działacze żydowscy. Wiele lat później, gdy uczęszczał do college'u, był jeszcze bardziej oburzony, że jego profesor historii – inny niemiecko-żydowski uchodźca – wydawał się nie akceptować realiów Holokaustu, więc Hilberg postanowił uczynić ten temat głównym tematem swoich badań doktoranckich.
Jak na ironię, czołowi uczeni żydowscy namawiali go, aby unikał tego tematu, aby nie zrujnować swojej kariery akademickiej i przez lata największe wydawnictwa wielokrotnie odrzucały jego książkę. Kiedy jednak w końcu udało mu się ją wydrukować, okazała się niezwykle popularna wśród żydowskich aktywistów i w ciągu następnej dekady lub dwóch dała początek całemu gatunkowi literatury, w tym licznym wspomnieniom o Holokauście, choć niektóre z najwybitniejszych okazały się fałszywe. W dużej mierze żydowskie Hollywood wkrótce zaczęło produkować niekończący się strumień filmów i programów telewizyjnych o tematyce Holokaustu, ostatecznie uznając Holokaust za centralne wydarzenie XX wieku. A kiedy historycy lub inni badacze zaczęli kwestionować te rzekome fakty, energiczne grupy żydowskich aktywistów z powodzeniem przyjęły w Europie i gdzie indziej prawa zakazujące takiego „negowania Holokaustu”, przeprowadzając czystki lub nawet fizycznie atakując takich dysydentów.
Pomimo tych znacznych represji, przez dziesięciolecia powstała pokaźna literatura naukowa, która budzi ogromne wątpliwości co do oficjalnie ustalonej narracji o Holokauście , która, jak się wydaje, została w dużej mierze stworzona przez Hollywood. Rzeczywiście, pierwsza tak kompleksowa analiza, przeprowadzona przez pozornie apolitycznego profesora elektrotechniki Arthura R. Butza, ukazała się prawie pół wieku temu, prawdopodobnie wzbudzając zainteresowanie magazynu „Reason” w tym samym roku i chociaż została zakazana kilka lat temu przez Amazon, praca Butza nadal pozostaje bardzo skutecznym podsumowaniem podstawowego przypadku.
- Oszustwo XX wieku
Sprawa przeciwko domniemanej eksterminacji europejskiego żydostwa
Arthur R. Butz • 1976/2015 • 225 000 słów
Po przeczytaniu tej i prawie tuzina innych książek poświęconych obu stronom spornej kwestii zakończyłem swój długi artykuł następującym werdyktem :
Wszelkie wnioski, które wyciągnąłem, mają oczywiście charakter wstępny, a waga, jaką inni powinni do nich przywiązywać, musi bezwzględnie odzwierciedlać mój status ściśle amatorski. Jednakże, jako osoba z zewnątrz badająca ten kontrowersyjny temat, uważam, że o wiele bardziej prawdopodobne jest, że standardowa narracja o Holokauście jest przynajmniej w dużej mierze fałszywa, a całkiem możliwe, że prawie całkowicie.
Pomimo tej sytuacji, silne skupienie mediów na wspieraniu Holokaustu w ciągu ostatnich kilku dziesięcioleci wyniosło go na centralną pozycję w kulturze Zachodu. Nie zdziwiłbym się, gdyby zajmował on obecnie większe miejsce w umysłach większości zwykłych ludzi niż II wojna światowa, która go obejmowała, i dlatego posiada większą pozorną rzeczywistość.
Jednakże niektóre formy wspólnych przekonań mogą być szerokie na milę, ale głębokie na cal, a przypadkowe założenia osób, które nigdy tak naprawdę nie zajmowały się danym tematem, mogą szybko się zmienić. Ponadto popularna siła doktryn, które od dawna są utrzymywane w mocy poprzez surowe sankcje społeczne i gospodarcze, często poparte sankcjami karnymi, może być znacznie słabsza, niż komukolwiek się wydaje.
Jeszcze trzydzieści lat temu komunistyczne rządy w ZSRR i jego sojusznikach z Układu Warszawskiego wydawały się absolutnie trwałe i niewzruszone, ale korzenie tej wiary całkowicie zgniły, pozostawiając po sobie jedynie pustą fasadę. Pewnego dnia przyszedł podmuch wiatru i cała gigantyczna konstrukcja się zawaliła. Nie zdziwiłbym się, gdyby naszą obecną narrację o Holokauście spotkał w końcu ten sam los, być może z niefortunnymi konsekwencjami dla osób zbyt blisko związanych z jej utrzymywaniem.
- American Pravda: Negowanie Holokaustu
Ron Unz • The Unz Review • 27 sierpnia 2018 r. • 17 600 słów - American Pravda: Sekrety wywiadu wojskowego
Ron Unz • The Unz Review • 10 czerwca 2019 r. • 12 500 słów
Pytanie 8: Nasze rozumienie wojny
Na stronie 202 podałeś następujące stwierdzenie, które pomaga podkreślić ogromne znaczenie dokładności historycznej:
„Musimy także przyznać, że wiele podstawowych idei, które dominują w naszym dzisiejszym świecie, opierało się na szczególnym rozumieniu tej wojennej historii, a jeśli wydaje się, że istnieje dobry powód, aby sądzić, że narracja jest zasadniczo fałszywa, być może powinniśmy zacząć kwestionować ramy wzniesionych na nim wierzeń”.
To dające do myślenia stwierdzenie, które sprawia, że zastanawiam się, czy ostatnie 80 lat krwawych interwencji Stanów Zjednoczonych można przypisać naszemu „szczególnemu zrozumieniu” II wojny światowej. Wydaje mi się, że nasi przywódcy wykorzystali ten wyidealizowany mit „dobrej wojny”, w której „wyjątkowy” naród amerykański walczy ze złem faszyzmu”, aby promować swój wojenny program i usprawiedliwiać swoje nieustające dążenie do globalnej hegemonii.
Jakie jest, Pana zdaniem, największe niebezpieczeństwo wznoszenia „szkieletu przekonań” na fałszywym rozumieniu historii?
Ron Unz — Stworzony przez Hollywood obraz naszego wielkiego światowego triumfu w bohaterskiej wojnie z Hitlerem i nazistowskimi Niemcami zainspirował dziedzictwo kolosalnej amerykańskiej arogancji, która obecnie prowadzi nas w stronę niezwykle lekkomyślnej konfrontacji z Rosją w sprawie Ukrainy i z Chinami w sprawie Tajwanu , rodzaj geopolitycznej pychy , która często prowadzi do nemezis , być może nawet nemezis w skrajnej formie, biorąc pod uwagę arsenały nuklearne tych rywalizujących państw. Jak pisałem wkrótce po wybuchu wojny ukraińskiej:
Przez lata wybitny badacz Rosji Stephen Cohen uznawał prezydenta Republiki Rosyjskiej Władimira Putina za najbardziej znaczącego światowego przywódcę początku XXI wieku. Chwalił ogromny sukces tego człowieka w odrodzeniu kraju po chaosie i nędzy czasów Jelcyna i podkreślał jego pragnienie przyjaznych stosunków z Ameryką, jednak coraz bardziej obawiał się, że wkraczamy w nową zimną wojnę, jeszcze bardziej niebezpieczną niż poprzednia.
Już w 2017 roku nieżyjący już profesor Cohen argumentował, że w najnowszej historii Ameryki żaden zagraniczny przywódca nie był tak bardzo oczerniany jak Putin, a inwazja Rosji na Ukrainę dwa tygodnie temu wykładniczo zwiększyła intensywność takich potępień w mediach, niemal dorównującą histerii czego doświadczył nasz kraj dwie dekady temu po ataku na Nowy Jork z 11 września. Larry Romanoff przedstawił przydatny katalog kilku przykładów.
Do niedawna ta skrajna demonizacja Putina ograniczała się w dużej mierze do Demokratów i centrystów, których dziwaczna narracja Russiagate oskarżała go o zainstalowanie Donalda Trumpa w Białym Domu. Jednak teraz reakcja stała się całkowicie dwustronna – entuzjastyczny zwolennik Trumpa Sean Hannity niedawno w swoim programie w FoxNews w godzinach największej oglądalności nawoływał do śmierci Putina , do czego wkrótce dołączyła senator Lindsey Graham , czołowa republikanka w Senackiej Komisji Sądownictwa. Są to zdumiewające groźby skierowane przeciwko człowiekowi, którego arsenał nuklearny może szybko unicestwić większość amerykańskiej populacji, a retoryka ta wydaje się bezprecedensowa w naszej powojennej historii. Nie przypominam sobie, aby nawet w najciemniejszych dniach zimnej wojny takie nastroje społeczne były kiedykolwiek skierowane w stronę ZSRR lub jego najwyższego kierownictwa komunistycznego.
Pod wieloma względami reakcja Zachodu na atak Rosji była bliższa wypowiedzeniu wojny niż jedynie powrótowi do konfrontacji z czasów zimnej wojny. Ogromne rezerwy walutowe Rosji utrzymywane za granicą zostały przejęte i zamrożone, jej cywilne linie lotnicze wykluczone z zachodniego nieba , a wiodące banki odłączone od globalnych sieci finansowych. Bogatym rosyjskim obywatelom prywatnym skonfiskowano majątki, reprezentacja narodowa w piłce nożnej została wykluczona z mistrzostw świata, a wieloletni rosyjski dyrygent Filharmonii Monachijskiej został zwolniony za odmowę potępienia własnego kraju…
Rzeczywiście, najbliższym porównaniem, jakie przychodzi na myśl, byłaby amerykańska wrogość skierowana przeciwko Adolfowi Hitlerowi i nazistowskim Niemcom po wybuchu II wojny światowej, na co wskazują powszechne porównania między inwazją Putina na Ukrainę a atakiem Hitlera na Polskę w 1939 roku. Proste wyszukiwanie w Google hasła „Putin i Hitler” powoduje wyświetlenie dziesiątek milionów stron internetowych, a najlepsze wyniki obejmują nagłówek artykułu w „Washington Post” po tweety gwiazdy muzyki pop Steviego Nicksa . Już w 2014 roku Andrew Anglin z Daily Stormer dokumentował pojawiający się mem „Putin jest nowym Hitlerem”.
Następnie omówiłem niezwykle niebezpieczne implikacje naszej histerycznej polityki antyrosyjskiej.
- Amerykańska Prawda: Putin jako Hitler?
Ron Unz • Przegląd Unz • 7 marca 2022 r. • 7900 słów - Amerykańska Prawda: III i II wojna światowa?
Ron Unz • The Unz Review • 24 października 2022 r. • 4700 słów - Zabójstwo Władimira Putina?
Ron Unz • The Unz Review • 15 maja 2023 r. • 3700 słów
I jak pisałem w 2019 roku, moja ocena faktycznej historii jest znacząco odmienna:
W następstwie ataków z 11 września żydowscy neokonserwatyści pchnęli Amerykę w kierunku katastrofalnej wojny w Iraku i wynikającego z niej zniszczenia Bliskiego Wschodu, a gadające głowy w naszych telewizorach bez końca twierdziły, że „Saddam Husajn to kolejny Hitler”. Od tego czasu regularnie słyszeliśmy ten sam slogan powtarzany w różnych zmodyfikowanych wersjach, w których mówiono, że „Muammar Kaddafi to kolejny Hitler”, „Mahmoud Ahmadineżad to kolejny Hitler” lub „Władimir Putin to kolejny Hitler”, a nawet „Hugo Chavez to kolejny Hitler”. kolejny Hitler”. Przez ostatnie kilka lat nasze amerykańskie media nieustannie wypełniane są twierdzeniem, że „Donald Trump to kolejny Hitler”.
Na początku XXI wieku oczywiście zdawałem sobie sprawę, że władca Iraku był surowym tyranem, ale śmiałem się z absurdalnej propagandy medialnej, wiedząc doskonale, że Saddam Husajn nie był Adolfem Hitlerem. Jednak wraz ze stałym rozwojem Internetu i dostępnością milionów stron czasopism udostępnionych w ramach mojego projektu digitalizacji, ze zdziwieniem odkryłem stopniowo, że Adolf Hitler nie był Adolfem Hitlerem.
Być może nie do końca słuszne będzie twierdzenie, że II wojna światowa była taka, że Franklin Roosevelt próbował uciec przed problemami wewnętrznymi, organizując wielką europejską wojnę przeciwko zamożnym, miłującym pokój nazistowskim Niemcom Adolfa Hitlera. Myślę jednak, że ten obraz jest prawdopodobnie nieco bliższy rzeczywistej rzeczywistości historycznej niż obraz odwrócony, częściej spotykany w naszych podręcznikach.
Powiązane lektury:
- Amerykańska Prawda: Zrozumienie II wojny światowej
- Niezwykła historiografia Davida Irvinga
- Amerykańska Prawda: powojenna Francja i powojenne Niemcy
- Amerykańska Prawda: nasza wielka czystka lat czterdziestych XX wieku
- Amerykańska Prawda: Negowanie Holokaustu
- American Pravda: Jak Hitler ocalił aliantów
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Unz Fan guymówi:
„Nie chciałem i nawet dzisiaj nie chcę ze zrozumiałych powodów ujawniać, że od października 1928 roku dwoma największymi stałymi współpracownikami partii nazistowskiej byli dyrektorzy generalni dwóch największych banków berlińskich, oba wyznania żydowskiego i jeden z ich przywódcą syjonizmu w Niemczech.”
Heinrich Bruning, były kanclerz Niemiec w latach 1930-1932
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Wszelkie wnioski, które wyciągnąłem, mają oczywiście charakter wstępny, a waga, jaką inni powinni do nich przywiązywać, musi bezwzględnie odzwierciedlać mój status ściśle amatorski.
Absolutne śmieci. Holohoax jest niedorzeczny pod każdym względem. Przez lata mówiono, że w Auschwitz zabijano i kremowano 10 000 Żydów dziennie, a w Treblince 10 000 dziennie. Absolutnie wszystko w tym jest niedorzeczne i nie ma na to ani odrobiny fizycznego dowodu. Żadnych ciał, żadnych narzędzi zbrodni, czyli komór gazowych udających prysznice, nic. Aby uzyskać bardziej szczegółowe informacje… https://t.co/uEEvVAuWws
Poza tym lubię mówić: „wszystko, co wiesz o II wojnie światowej, jest fałszywe” i odnoszę się do WSPANIAŁEJ książki Buchanana „Churchill, Hitler i niepotrzebna wojna”, do której link znajduje się poniżej, więc zdziwiłem się, że tego nie zrobiłem zobacz, o czym mowa w artykule powyżej
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Świetny temat, dużo do dodania. Zacznijmy od tego, że niewielu Amerykanów wie, że priorytetem Roosevelta i Churchilla w 1942 r. był demontaż imperium francuskiego, co zaowocowało kilkoma atakami na siły francuskie na całym świecie.
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Holohoax został stworzony, aby odwrócić naszą uwagę od faktu, że sojusznicy zabili MILIONY CYWILÓW podczas II wojny światowej w wyniku bombardowań miejskich. Usprawiedliwiaj swoje zbrodnie, twierdząc, że twoja ofiara była jeszcze gorsza.
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Peter Akuleyevmówi:
Atak Hitlera na Polskę był gorszy niż niemoralny, był głupi i niepotrzebny. Polska w 1939 roku była krajem bardzo antyrosyjskim, ale nie tak antyniemieckim jak dzisiaj. Sojusz niemiecko-polski naprawdę leżał w najlepszym interesie obu krajów i gdyby Hitler był trochę bardziej cierpliwy, mógłby kultywować stosunki, ale aby uspokoić interesy wewnętrzne (niemiecka gospodarka borykała się z trudnościami z powodu sankcji międzynarodowych) najwyraźniej poczuł się zmuszony do zawarcia porozumienia gigantyczny rzut kostką w niewłaściwym momencie. Podobieństwa z Putinem i Ukrainą są oczywiste.
• Odpowiedzi:@Greta Handel,@Patrick McNally,@Steve Naidamast,@Haxo Angmark,@Bankotsu,@Michael BollingerZGADZAM SIĘ/NIE ZGADZAM SIĘ/ITP. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
RoboMoralFascist 1stmówi:
Powiedzcie dzieci!…. W 1938 roku Adolf Hitler został Człowiekiem Roku magazynu Time… w Stanach Zjednoczonych.
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HeebHuntermówi:
Rzeczywiście, niemiecki przywódca zawsze miał przychylne poglądy wobec Wielkiej Brytanii, a także wierzył, że zachowanie Imperium Brytyjskiego leży w strategicznym interesie Niemiec, ponieważ jego upadek stworzy geopolityczną próżnię, którą mogłoby wypełnić rywalizujące mocarstwo.
Przede wszystkim jest to największa pomyłka mojego narodu. Podła, podludzka rasa Murzynów nigdy nie była przyjacielem Europy. Jak mogą być? Pięć wieków służenia Żydom jako ich najchętsi niewolnicy.
Groteskowe wydarzenia na Zachodzie, a zwłaszcza (((AUKUS))) są po prostu ostatecznym, logicznym zakończeniem tej ctonicznej, owadopodobnej rasy. Nigdy nie posiadali żadnej zdolności do cnót ani doskonałości. Niech gniją w piekle.
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JWaltersmówi:@Unz Fan guy
Kolejny monumentalny wkład Rona Unza w prawdę.
Jeśli mowa o II wojnie światowej, według ujawnionego transkrypcji, III wojna światowa może być w przygotowaniu –
Blinken: OK, ludzie, musimy zaplanować kolejny krok przeciwko Rosji.
Sullivan: Sprawy na Ukrainie wyglądają dość źle, a sankcje przynoszą odwrotny skutek.
Nuland: Bóg nie pozwoli nam przegrać, Jake! Czytaj swoją Torę, czytaj Talmud!
Blinken: Być może, Vicky. Ale tutaj musimy podać Bogu rękę.
Sekretarz: Lord Rothschild przy telefonie, proszę pana.
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Chebyshevmówi:
Biorąc pod uwagę, że jednym z głównych powodów, dla których rozpoczęliśmy wojnę z nazistowskimi Niemcami, była ochrona prawa Żydów do zajmowania niezwykle nieproporcjonalnego udziału w stanowiskach w rządzie, mediach i finansach, logiczne jest, że narracja o Holokauście była tak bardzo promowana. Zaszczepia w białych Gojach odrazę do Hitlera i nazistów, którą Żydzi żywili na długo przed tym, zanim w pełni wymyślono oficjalną opowieść o ludobójstwie.
Jak długo po strasznym Hungerjahr Niemcom opowiadano historię Holokaustu? Czy w latach pięćdziesiątych XX wieku jacyś pisarze niemieccy lub austriaccy wspominali o tym? Czy istniała różnica w sposobie, w jaki uczeni z Niemiec Zachodnich i Niemiec Wschodnich opisywali obozy koncentracyjne lub traktowanie cywilów przez SS/Wehrmacht na froncie wschodnim?
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mijjmówi:
przyjrzyj się żartowi o okropnym kierowcy, który myśli, że jest świetnym kierowcą, a wszyscy inni są okropnymi kierowcami – dowodem jest to, że niezależnie od tego, dokąd jedzie, zdarzają mu się wypadki.
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USA to cnotliwy naród otoczony przez klony Hitlera rozpoczynające wojny.ZGADZAM SIĘ/NIE ZGADZAM SIĘ/ITP. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Premmówi:
Germany financed its entire government and war operations from 1935 to 1945 without gold and without debt, and it took the whole Capitalist and Communist world to destroy the German power over Europe and bring Europe back under the heel of the bankers. Such history of money does not even appear in the text¬ books of public (government) schools today. Germany’s unforgivable crime before the second world war was her attempt to extricate her economic power from the world’s trading system and to create her own exchange mechanism which would deny world finance its opportunity to profit.However—and this is the catch—the U.S.A., Britain and France lost important sectors of the market, which they had hith¬ erto dominated, particularly the U.S.A. in South America. More¬ over, New York and Fondon lost their credit business through the pre-financing of foreign trade in the countries which now engaged in barter with Germany.
It appeared as if Germany was developing from a financial dwarf into an economic giant, namely at the expense of the vic¬ tors of the First World War. President Roosevelt was now concerned about Germany’s success in South America, that U.S. credit busi¬ ness in South America was declining and, lastly, that the German “model” was becoming attractive in the U.S.A. and could affect his—Roosevelt’s—popularity. After all, Hjalmar Schacht, president of the Reichsbank and Minister for Trade, and Hitler’s politics had succeeded in dismantling unemployment in Germany and in dou¬ bling the people’s income, while Roosevelt with his New Deal, de¬ spite thriving foreign trade, was still faced with 10.4 million unemployed. Britain too was affected by Germany’s independent path.
Hitler received support from Jewish banks as well as from sym¬ pathetic industrialists. However, the banks turned against him when he refused to recognize the source of this support or his duty to serve it. “Never believe in foreign help,” as he said in February 1933:
I want bread and work for my people. And certainly I do not wish to have it through the operation of credit guarantees, but through permanent labor, the products of which I can either ex¬ change for foreign goods or for domestic goods in our internal commercial circulation. Germany has an enormous number of men who not only want to work but also to eat. I cannot build the future of the German nation on the assurances of a foreign states¬ man or on any international help, but only on the real basis of steady production, for which I must find a market at home and
abroad. (Adolf Hitler, Paris Soir, January 26, 1936)
Hjalmar Schacht, who was then head of the German central bank, is quoted in a bit of wit that sums up the German version of the “Greenback” miracle. An American banker had commented, “Dr. Schacht, you should come to America. We’ve lots of money, and that’s real banking.” Schacht replied, “You should come to Berlin. We don’t have money. That’s real banking.”
Hitler’s Banker, Great Britain: Warner Books, 1999)
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It’s quite often said that unless a theory or hypothesis is falsifiable it’s not really scientific.
What does that imply for the establishment Holocaust narrative given that it’s been made illegal to question or revise it in any meaningful way in virtually every nation in which it allegedly occurred (except to say the Germans were even more monstrous than already believed)? Furthermore, in those with supposed freedom of speech one is fired from one’s job and kicked off social media (the modern town square) for questioning it. Such strong incentives preclude the possibility of the scientific method. It’s not just just de facto unfalsifiable it’s de jure unfalsifiable.
Most unscientific theories suffer from being merely de facto unfalsifiable, i.e., no one has yet devised an experiment to test them, or any experiment that has been devised is prohibitively expensive or relies on technology not yet invented.
That’s a quite different situation from being de jure unfalsifiable. The most famous (and infamous) example of de jure falsifiability is perhaps the Catholic Church’s assertion geocentricity. But, more broadly, whenever a political or religious institutions punish people for criticizing state leadership or ideology under blasphemy or heresy or “hate speech” laws they’re just rendering de jure unfalsifiable the state ideology and the unerring wisdom of the leaders who impose it. There’s countless examples of that.
Arguably, the whole purpose of freedom of speech is to preserve the scientific method as it applies to the political process in a country. It’s the best method for discovering and ensuring implementation of the best policy.
“When you tear out a man’s tongue, you are not proving him a liar, you’re only telling the world that you fear what he might say.” – George R. R. Martin
It doesn’t seem to be that locking doors to scientific or historical inquiry has an exactly great track record of cultivating or guarding truth. To the contrary, when the critics of a theory are imprisoned and its sycophants rewarded, even when one begins with some semblance of truth one tends to get further and further away from it with time. Theories, like people, must have critics to be kept honest. Had Madoff been audited early and often his fraud never would have grown so large.
Czy powinienem znaleźć się w niebie i czy powinienem móc przygotować się na kilka przydatnych rad przed ponownym narodzeniem, nie znając czasu i miejsca reinkarnacji, rada ta brzmiałaby: nigdy nie wierz w nic, czym nie jesteś wolno zadawać pytania. Z historycznego punktu widzenia wydaje się to całkiem niezłą heurystyką. Dlaczego nasze współczesne czasy i miejsce miałyby być inne? Ale dodałbym: nie opowiadaj się automatycznie po drugiej stronie. Bądź podejrzliwy, ale ostatecznie agnostykiem.
Aby opracować metodę naukową i aby mogła ona działać, wymagana jest wolność słowa. Dopóki wolność słowa nie zostanie przywrócona i utrzymana, nie twórz żadnych mocnych przekonań. Traktuj oficjalną narrację tak, jak wyrok w procesie pokazowym: może był winny, a może niewinny. Kto wie? Ale jeśli rzeczywiście był winny, dlaczego od razu nie przeprowadzili procesu uczciwie? Każdy sędzia lub prawnik procesowy wie, że jeśli tylko jedna strona będzie mogła zabrać głos i przedstawić swoje racje, będzie to za każdym razem parodia sprawiedliwości. Świadkowie oskarżenia, którzy w bezpośrednich wypowiedziach brzmią przekonująco, często rozpadają się w obliczu krzyża. Albo wyobraźcie sobie „próbę kliniczną”, podczas której badacze wiedzą, że wszyscy zostaną wtrąceni do więzienia, jeśli „nie udowodnią”, że nalewka królewska naprawdę leczy raka. Dlatego powtarzają eksperymenty, aż uzyskają „właściwy” wynik. Może rzeczywiście leczy raka? Kto wie? Ale tylko wtedy, gdy w końcu przeprowadzą proces uczciwie i uczciwie, ktoś się o tym dowie. Do tego czasu traktuj go jak każdy inny olej wężowy.
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JonesHenrymówi:
Hitler zawsze był częścią klubu!
https://mega.nz/file/mL5hUajb#2L69ardWPkVdSYSTqOwkG-IgHMc-oxffgJJ_dRREt8I
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Chebyshevmówi:
Stosując tę prostą analizę, [Bacque] przedstawia dość mocny argument, że nadmierna liczba zgonów w Niemczech w tym okresie wyniosła co najmniej około 10 milionów, a być może wiele milionów więcej.
A jeśli przyjmiemy szacunki niemieckich ksiąg zgonów i Czerwonego Krzyża, mówiące o zaledwie setkach tysięcy Żydów, którzy zginęli w obozach koncentracyjnych, to głód Niemców po wojnie był 10 razy bardziej zabójczy niż to, co zrobiono Żydom. I w przeciwieństwie do tego, co zrobili naziści, ta amerykańska polityka miała na celu zabicie ogromnej liczby niewinnych ludzi.
Zastanawiam się, jak to było za kulisami administracji Trumana, gdy przechodziła ona z planu Morgenthau na plan Marshalla. Stany Zjednoczone produkują ogromne ilości żywności – kiedy zaczęliśmy wysyłać jej część do Niemiec, poprawa jakości życia tam musiała być drastyczna.
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Tom Welshmówi:
„Ostateczne żądanie Hitlera, aby 95% niemieckiego Gdańska zostało zwrócone Niemcom, tak jak tego pragnęli jego mieszkańcy, było całkowicie rozsądne i dopiero straszliwa dyplomatyczna pomyłka Brytyjczyków skłoniła Polaków do odrzucenia tej prośby, prowokując w ten sposób wojnę. Powszechne później twierdzenie, że Hitler dążył do podboju świata, było całkowicie absurdalne, a niemiecki przywódca faktycznie dołożył wszelkich starań, aby uniknąć wojny z Wielką Brytanią lub Francją”.
Czytając powyższy fragment, nie mogłem nie zauważyć, że jeśli zastąpimy „Putina” „Hitlerem”, „Krym i Donbas” „Danzig”, „Rosję” „Niemcami”, „Ukrainę” „Polską” i „NATO” zamiast „Wielka Brytania lub Francja”, ma to równie sens i jest równie oparte na faktach.
Co więcej, w obu przypadkach ostatecznym źródłem kłopotów był Waszyngton, który jak zawsze starał się zakłócić spokój reszty świata, aby zyskać na wynikających z tego kłopotach. Grają w tę samą grę od ponad wieku; a dlaczego nie, skoro to się opłaca?
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vox4nonmówi:
Historię piszą zwycięzcy.
Prawda może, ale nie musi, zostać ujawniona przez stulecia, ale niestety dla jej ofiar jest już za późno.Nawet dzisiaj kłamstwa w mediach głównego nurtu są tak wszechobecne i deprawujące, że przeciętny człowiek nie myśli już samodzielnie. Dla tych, którzy mogą, obecna sytuacja przypomina oglądanie katastrofy kolejowej w zwolnionym tempie.
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Ann Nonny Mousemówi:
Wielkie dzięki, Ron. Monumentalny!
Wow! Adolf Hitler nie był Adolfem Hitlerem! Demonizując ich, Hussein to kolejny Adolf Hitler, Ghaddafi to kolejny Adolf Hitler, Putin to kolejny Adolf Hitler! DOWODNIE, że są demoniczne! Udowadnia to!
Ale Adolf Hitler nie był Adolfem Hitlerem!
Wielki Brat nas przygwoździł. Co możemy zrobić?
Monumentalny artykuł. Dzięki jeszcze raz!
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meamjojomówi:
„Dlaczego wszystko, co wiesz o II wojnie światowej, jest błędne”
Nie jestem pewien, dlaczego kogokolwiek poza historykami miałoby interesować jedno czy drugie. Tak naprawdę nikt nie uczy się z historii ani nie zwraca na nią uwagi, więc naprawdę nie ma znaczenia, czy jest ona dobra, czy zła.
Porozmawiajmy o tematach współczesnych, takich jak Ukraina.
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meamjojomówi:
Ludzie tutaj lubią tarzać się w przeszłości, więc oto artykuł, który mnie nie obchodzi, ale wydaje się, że może zainteresować niektórych tutejszych hoi polloi.
——-
Trzy mity o Marksie
Phillipie W. Magnessie
– 10 czerwca 2023 rZGADZAM SIĘ/NIE ZGADZAM SIĘ/ITP. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Leon Hallermówi:
Ron Unz to wspaniały człowiek. Nie ma wątpliwości. Jego teksty są trzeźwe i fascynujące, nawet tam, gdzie się z nim nie zgadzam, na przykład w sprawie imigracji (która była niepohamowaną katastrofą dla białych na całym świecie, a także dla Afroamerykanów i rdzennych Amerykanów), a jego uczciwość jest tak silna, jak kogokolwiek innego. . Robi znacznie więcej niż tylko jeden dobry obywatel, aby utrzymać przy życiu otwarte dociekania intelektualne. Wszyscy patrioci i wolni ludzie mają wobec niego dług wdzięczności.
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Verymuchalivemówi:
Wspomnienia i inne dokumenty historyczne uzyskane przez późniejszych badaczy wydają się zasadniczo potwierdzać oskarżenia Flynna, wskazując, że Roosevelt nakazał swoim dyplomatom wywarcie ogromnej presji zarówno na rządy brytyjski, jak i polski, aby uniknąć jakiegokolwiek wynegocjowanego porozumienia z Niemcami, co doprowadziło do wybuchu II wojny światowej w 1939.
Neville Chamberlain zawsze mnie niepokoił. W roku 1938 szkoda dla brytyjskich interesów była już wyrządzona. Jej największe Dominium, Kanada, przeniosło się do strefy dolarowej, a jej aktywa zagraniczne spadły o 2/3 od 1929 r. Utrata imperium była nieunikniona, ale byłaby powolna i odbywała się w warunkach, na które Wielka Brytania byłaby w stanie sobie poradzić, pod warunkiem, że Wielka Brytania pozostanie w pokoju. Cóż mogłoby zagrozić Rooseveltowi, co byłoby gorsze od wojny z Niemcami?
Wojna z Niemcami spowodowałaby śmierć Brytyjczyków i prawdopodobnie zakończyłaby się porażką. To znacznie pogorszyłoby pozycję Wielkiej Brytanii i przyspieszyłoby koniec imperium na warunkach szkodliwych dla brytyjskich interesów. Zwycięstwo w wojnie z Niemcami byłoby nieprawdopodobne, a nawet to prawdopodobnie pogorszyłoby gospodarkę i politycznie Wielką Brytanię. Wojna z Niemcami była sytuacją, w której obie strony traciły. Racjonalny mąż stanu by to zrozumiał.
Bez Chamberlaina nie byłoby Churchilla, człowieka, który nadzorował bankructwo Wielkiej Brytanii i utratę imperium.
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eahmówi:
Armia polska została pokonana w ciągu zaledwie kilku tygodni, a Hitler zaproponował wówczas wycofanie swoich sił z okupowanych przez nie ziem polskich i zawarcie pokoju , ale oba mocarstwa zachodnie obiecały kontynuować wojnę aż do zniszczenia Niemiec.
Jeśli przez „wycofanie się” rozumiecie poprzednie granice, to nigdy nie widziałem, gdzie Hitler złożył taką propozycję — 6 października 1939 r., po zakończeniu kampanii przeciwko Polsce, wygłosił przemówienie przed Reichstagiem:
Hitler mówi:
Weshalb soll nun der Krieg im Westen stattfinden? Für die Wiederherstellung Polens? Das Polen des Versailler Vertrages wird niemals wieder erstehen. … Die endgültige Gestaltung dieses Raumes, die Frage der Wiedererrichtung eines polnischen Staates sind Probleme, die nicht durch den Krieg im Westen gelöst werden, sondern ausschließlich durch Rußland in einem Fall und durch Deutschland im anderen.
‘Why should there be war with the West? To re-establish Poland? Poland as created by the Versailles Treaty will not exist again. … The ultimate fate of this region, including the question of the re-establishment of a Polish state, are not problems that can be solved by war in the West, but instead only by Russia and Germany.’
Later Hitler says the existence of a Polish state is possible under certain conditions:
1. Die Schaffung einer Reichsgrenze, die – wie schon betont – den historischen, ethnographischen und wirtschaftlichen Bedingungen entspricht.
2. Die Ordnung des gesamten Lebensraumes nach Nationalitäten, d. h. eine Lösung jener Minoritätenfragen, die nicht nur diesen Raum berühren, sondern die darüber hinaus fast alle süd- und südosteuropäischen Staaten betreffen.
…
6. Die Herstellung eines polnischen Staates, der in seinem Aufbau und in seiner Führung die Garantie bietet, daß weder ein neuer Brandherd gegen das Deutsche Reich Reich entsteht noch eine Intrigenzentrale gegen Deutschland und Rußland gebildet wird.
‘The borders of the German Reich must correspond to historical ethnic and economic conditions. New borders must be aligned with the interests of all ethnic minorities living in the region, which involves other nearby nations. … A new Polish state is possible only as long as its existence will not pose a future threat to the German Reich or to Russia.’
I don’t really see this as an offer to ‘withdraw’ — clearly pre-war borders are not acceptable to Hitler, although rhetorically he was open to the creation of a Polish state as part of his general proposal that the borders of the entire region be established along ethnic lines (‘die Ordnung des gesamten Lebensraumes nach Nationalitäten’).
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My father had a multi volume Brutish encyclopaedia published circa 1961, called The Book Of Knowledge. I read much of it as a teenager. The article on WWII had no reference to the Holocaust, none at all.
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Just another serf says:
As a young boy in the 1960’s, I was fascinated with the idea of war and combat. An unfortunate little boy’s preoccupation, having no understanding of the reality of such things.
As the years progressed, I was always anxious to see World War II included in the various history classes in primary school. We learned about the 80 years war, the 50 years war, the Teapot Dome scandal and other such rather irrelevant stories.
It wasn’t until rather recently that I came to the epiphany that the absence of any curriculum explaining the most important event influencing the world, was no innocent oversight.
Kids my age would all learn the facts of the war and the nature of America’s murderous enemies from the only truly reliable source, Hollywood.
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eah says:@eah
In May 1941, about six weeks before the start of Operation Barbarossa, Rudolf Hess flew to England, apparently with a seven point peace plan:
Rudolf Hess — Sieben-Punkte-Friedensplan, 10. Mai 1941
One of the points:
Ein polnischer Staat wird in seinen ethnischen Grenzen wiederhergestellt; diese Zusage kann allerdings nur für den von Deutschen besetzten Teil gemacht werden.
‘A Polish state can be re-established within some ethnic boundaries, but this proposal is valid only for those parts of Poland currently occupied by Germany.’
So this is roughly equivalent to what Hitler offered back in October 1939 — but there is no evidence that in 1941 Hitler knew about or approved of the flight of Hess to England, or his peace proposals.
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neutral says:
It is incredibly simple, just ask the question if you are happy with the world order that you now live in, this world order came out directly from WW2. If you have any amount of reason then you should know that all the propaganda you have been taught about WW2 is wrong.
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Liborio Guaso says:
It was the result of the disinformation work carried out by the United States to devalue the great victory of the Soviet Union over German Nazism as part of the ideological struggle for control of the world.
Perhaps also trying to hide his ties to Nazi plans, since it remains to be discovered who armed Hitler.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER -
Nick Kollerstrom says:
As the author of the little book How Britain Initiated both World Wars, I reckon that everything Ron Unz writes here is correct. It’s especially good to see that very great American historian of the 20th century, Harry Elmer Barnes, properly recognized.
Both the US and UK have got a horrible, evil skill in starting wars, then generating fake rationales for them, making Ron Unz’ comments here especially important.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Greta Handel says:
Kto to czyta na głos i samotnie wersję audio tego „wywiadu”?
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Biker Bobmówi:
Ponieważ byłem dzieckiem w szkole podstawowej, coś w II wojnie światowej/narracji nigdy nie miało sensu, po prostu nie miało to żadnego logicznego sensu. Będąc w liceum, miałem już pewne poglądy, które w ostatecznym rozrachunku wpędzały mnie w „kłopoty” z nauczycielami historii, np. Gdyby Niemcom postawiono ultimatum w sprawie bezwarunkowej kapitulacji i wojna przerodziłaby się w wojnę na wyniszczenie, dlaczego w obozach pracy nie byłoby głodujących „więźniów” tak samo jak strażników? Dlaczego Niemcy mieliby zabić swoje źródło siły roboczej? I różne inne pytania, które ostatecznie zakończyły się pogorszeniem moich ocen… Nikt nie może kwestionować tego, co nie podlega dyskusji! Ani razu nie wierzyłem w tę narrację, a ponieważ dostępność informacji jest taka, jaka jest dzisiaj, nie mam wątpliwości, że cała ta historia jest po prostu… typowym mitem plemiennym. Nigdy też nie słyszałem ani nie czytałem o opinii lub wiedzy AH na temat morderstwa ST. Car Mikołaj II i jego rodzina oraz wpływ tego wydarzenia na opinie AH? Czy nie chciał uniknąć kolejnej prawdziwej kary, takiej jak to, co bolszewicy zrobili rosyjskiemu prawosławnemu chrześcijaninowi? Nie ma mowy, żeby AH o tym nie wiedział i za wszelką cenę wolałby uniknąć takiego wyniku. Chciał po prostu chronić swój naród, granice, naród i kulturę. Jednak gdy „oni” są w to zaangażowani… cóż, z ich narracji nigdy nie wynika nic prawdziwego. Jezus Chrystus mówił o nich i ich Synagodze Szatana, jednak owce po raz kolejny są szczęśliwie prowadzone na własną rzeź, o ile przyjmują syjonizm.
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Rentanamówi:
Francuscy żołnierze Magrebi dokonali masowych gwałtów na niemieckich kobietach cywilnych we francuskiej strefie okupacyjnej (Baden Wattenberg i Saarlannd) w latach 1945-49, kolejny fakt wymazany z historii.
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Ron
OK, przyjmijmy to, co powiedziałeś, zgodnie z ustaleniami. Wszystko się zgadza, a udowodniłeś to imponującymi stypendium.
Prawdą jest również , że Stany Zjednoczone wyłoniły się z II wojny światowej jako „władca świata zachodniego”, ale świat zachodni, który tracił swój kulturowo dominujący status na całym świecie (jak opisano w klasycznym artykule: Martin von Creveld, „The Fate of the State ”, Parametry 26(1), 1996, https://press.armywarcollege.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1764&context=parameters ).
Stany Zjednoczone, ktokolwiek nimi rządzi, miały strategiczne interesy. Jednym z nich było wygranie zimnej wojny bez użycia broni nuklearnej i masowej wojny zmechanizowanej. Stany Zjednoczone wygrały tę wojnę po marginalnie udanych lub nieudanych inicjatywach w Korei obejmujących projekt komercyjny, oferujący członkostwo w światowej sieci handlowej każdemu, kto przyłączył się do sojuszu USA. Za Nixona i Kissingera rozciągnięto to nawet na Chińską Republikę Ludową.
Jednakże zwycięstwo w zimnej wojnie w ten sposób doprowadziło do dezindustrializacji Stanów Zjednoczonych i zakończyło zdolność Stanów Zjednoczonych do egzekwowania amerykańskiej dominacji za pomocą siły militarnej wspieranej przez dużą bazę produkcyjną i lojalną ludność. Samo wymuszenie wsparcia dla dezindustrializacji (utworzenie „pasa rdzy”, zniszczenie amerykańskich związków zawodowych, przekształcenie amerykańskich obszarów miejskich w zubożone plantacje głosów) zniszczyło lojalną populację i zastąpiło ją (z czasem) obecną populacją, która jest zarówno niechętna, jak i fizycznie niezdolny do służby w wojsku [1], ani też do produktywnej służby w przemyśle czy nawet administracji. Oznacza to, że polityka „handlu światowego” doprowadziła do zniszczenia dominacji USA po upadku ZSRR. W efekcie USA stały się liderem koalicji wymuszającej deindustrializację ZSRR i USA. Po rozpadzie ZSRR koalicja pod przewodnictwem USA była w praktyce całkowicie oddana deindustrializacji USA.
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A.J. Smuskiewiczmówi:
Zastanawiam się, czy jest jakaś powszechnie uważana rzecz na temat historii Stanów Zjednoczonych (lub bieżących wydarzeń), która jest dokładna. Wiem, że zawsze otrzymywaliśmy mnóstwo bzdur na temat wojny secesyjnej, co zostało wspaniale wyjaśnione w książce „The South Was Right”! https://www.amazon.com/South-Was-Right-21st-Century-dp-1947660454/dp/1947660454/ref=dp_ob_title_bk
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naiwnymówi:
Hitler jako człowiek miłujący pokój? To bzdury, podobnie jak inna podstawowa teza artykułu.
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@Unz Fan guy
„Nie chciałem i nawet dzisiaj nie chcę ze zrozumiałych powodów ujawniać, że od października 1928 roku dwoma największymi stałymi współpracownikami partii nazistowskiej byli dyrektorzy generalni dwóch największych banków berlińskich, oba wyznania żydowskiego i jeden z ich przywódcą syjonizmu w Niemczech.”
Heinrich Bruning, były kanclerz Niemiec w latach 1930-1932
„Antysemici staną się naszymi najpewniejszymi przyjaciółmi, a kraje antysemickie naszymi sojusznikami” – Theodor Hertzl
Oczywiście nie było czegoś takiego jak partia „nazistowska” i nie było czegoś takiego jak „antysemita”.
Dodaj te terminy do rosnącej listy żydowskich Shibboleth, które usuwasz ze swojego leksykonu.
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Bukowskimówi:
1. W 1939 roku na Polskę napadły 2 kraje – Niemcy i Związek Radziecki. Jeśli Brytyjczykom naprawdę zależało na Polsce, dlaczego nie wypowiedzieli wojny także ZSRR? Myślę, że stało się tak dlatego, że wykorzystali inwazję jako pretekst do rozpoczęcia wojny z Niemcami. O czym świadczy całkowita zdrada Polski przez Brytyjczyków w 1945 roku.
2. Pominąłeś fakt – podobnie jak wielu innych – że Francja jako pierwsza najechała Niemcy podczas II wojny światowej podczas ofensywy na Saarę w 1939 r.
https://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?t=11241
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Irish Savantmówi:
Nominowałbym Rona Unza do Pokojowej Nagrody Nobla, gdyby ta teraz zbrukana nagroda była jego godna.
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Colleenmówi:
Technicznie rzecz biorąc, wojnę rozpoczęła Polska. Wypowiedzieli wojnę Niemcom 30 września o północy. Hitler odpowiedział kilka godzin później, mobilizując swoje wojsko do inwazji na Polskę.
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Jesuitic Ziowahhabizmówi:
Stalin i Rockefellerowie również brali udział w tworzeniu ONZ pod koniec tej wojny. To, co globalne, krwiopijne podmioty biznesowe, takie jak Rockefellerowie i konglomerat reżimów USA/Wielka Brytania, mają wspólnego z „patriotyzmem” „Wielkiej Wojny Ojczyźnianej”, jest tylko spekulacją opartą na preferowanych źródłach, ale fakt, że wojna wyreżyserowana choreografia śmierci i zniszczenia, bardzo utrzymana w duchu dzisiejszej „specjalnej operacji/inwazji wojskowej” na ukraińskim teatrze wojny, w histerycznym krajobrazie studiów historycznych nad wojnami światowymi jest zakazana, aż do „Holokaustu” ” Odmowa wygląda na łagodny temat, w który warto się zagłębić w porównaniu. Wszystko się zmieniło i pozostało tak jak było.
Zabawne, jak ta mapa zaprzeczania „Holokaustowi” skupia się na Europie Zachodniej, spychając Rosję do jakiegoś wschodniego miejsca, które jest ledwo zauważalne, podczas gdy w rzeczywistości jest to największy, najbardziej zasobny w zasoby i zaludniony kraj na świecie, gdzie wskazuje na zapisane historyczne wady opowieści o Holohoaxach jest karane za przestępstwo. To komediowe złoto widzieć, jak fani Putina i cynicznie konserwatywni „rusofile” przemilczają, jeśli nie całkowicie ignorują fakt, że Rosja jest najbardziej instrumentalnym strażnikiem wiedzy o neokolonii Rothschildów w Palestynie sfabrykowanej w porozumieniu z ONZ/Zachodem.
Tak czy inaczej, wschodnie „wielobiegunowe” i zachodnie „jednobiegunowe” cyberfeudalne obozy koncentracyjne, zaprojektowane w celu osiągnięcia „celów zrównoważonego rozwoju” ONZ/WHO/MFW, ułatwią karanie wszelkich myślących przestępców zaprzeczających Holohoaxowi lub „wrogości” pomiędzy USEUNATO a Rosja/Chiny i patriotyczna świętość tańca śmierci, jaki Kreml i Zachód prezentują na Ukrainie, w Syrii i poza nią.
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The Intrepid Ron Unz sailed the Ocean Blue
And Discovered America
In 1992AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER -
Absurdly the West is treating Russia, Iran, and China like the new Axis Powers and openly threatening war against all three.
Ironically you now have unhinged Germans— like Annalena Baerbock— pushing for war against Russia and hostility toward China (over Uighurs, Taiwan, and their support of Russia).
Irrespective of the fact that Russia is a nuclear superpower who could turn the U.S. and Europe into carbon field in under an hour, there no longer exists an industrial base or homogeneous population in the West to shift to a WWII-style economy, production, and footing. Russia, and especially China, have resources and production that dwarf— by orders of magnitude— the U.S. and West combined.
The same people who instigated and brought us WWII, and who are behind the current Russophobia and hostility toward Putin, believed that they could absolutely control the post-WWII world through finance.
Then there were two large countries which emerged from communism into the a global finance-controlled world who— to the consternation of the controllers of global finance— still retained their own national interests rather than pimping out their people to international finance.
And in spring 2022 when international finance went nuclear against the Russian economy, and the Russian economy didn’t buckle, the internationalists become dangerously apoplectic.
This following is from a talk by an Irish priest given in the 1980’s:
“He compelled everybody, small and great, rich and poor, slave and citizen, to be branded on the right hand or on the forehead, and made it illegal for anyone to buy or sell anything unless he had been branded with the name of the beast or with the number.” (Apocalypse 13:16,17).
This, then, is the devil’s plan, to rule the whole world, and his people are almost ready to deliver it to him. The super-capitalists are in control of global high finance, with Zionism as their nationalism, and Communism as their bulldozer to eliminate all other nationalisms.
“Taking him to a high mountain, the devil showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor. ‘I will give you all these,’ he said, ‘if you fall at my feet and worship me’.” (Luke 4:8-10).
As Honore de Balzac once said, “The final battle for Christianity will be over the money problem, and until that is solved there can be no universal application of Christianity.”
Rewolucyjna zmiana w sferze wielkich finansów wymaga odpowiedniej rewolucyjnej zmiany w sferze polityki, ponieważ w pełni umiędzynarodowione wielkie finanse nie mogą współistnieć w harmonii z niezliczonymi narodowymi skupiskami władzy politycznej. Przejęcie całego bogactwa i władzy politycznej na skalę globalną musi z konieczności obejmować kontrolę nad całą ludzkością poprzez warunkowanie i manipulację umysłem i duchem ludzkich istot. Dlatego na przykład przez wiele lat „trening wrażliwości” wkroczył do społeczeństwa i wyrządził tak wiele szkód, szczególnie młodym.
[z Zrób sobie Arkę! przez ks. Andrew O'Brien. https://archive.org/details/make-yourself-an-ark-andrew-o-brien_20201031/page/3/mode/1up%5D
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Blodgiemówi:
To, co było szokujące i nadal szokuje, to wrodzona żądza krwi amerykańskich mężczyzn.
Szukają jakiegokolwiek powodu do zabijania dla rządu.
Mnożą się kompleksy bohatera, a propaganda w rodzaju Szeregowca Ryana nie pomaga.
Ten film powinien mieć podtytuł „Dlaczego śmierć za Izrael uczyni cię wielkim człowiekiem”.
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Chuck Orloskimówi:@Ann Nonny Mouse
Dziękuję Ann Nonny Mysz!
A żebyśmy nie zapomnieli, jak amerykańskie żydowskie media korporacyjne przedstawiały Slobodona Miloszevicia jako „Oblicze zła”.
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Eirikmówi:
Cześć,
komentarz;
Wydaje mi się, że przy opisie rozsądnego Hitlera nie bierze się pod uwagę imperialnych ambicji Hitlera na wschodzie, przedstawionych w Mein Kampf .O ile rozumiem, Hitler dość wyraźnie zarysowuje w swojej książce swoje cele podboju na wschodzie, a konkretne plany Himlerowskiej SS dotyczące eksterminacji głodowej i zniewolenia pozostałej ludności słowiańskiej są z tym całkowicie zgodne. O ile wiem, ta polityka SS jest również całkowicie udokumentowana i bezsporna.
Można by się wahać, czy nazwać to „podbojem świata”, ale wydaje mi się, że gdyby Hitlerowi udało się urzeczywistnić swoje cele, Niemcy z pewnością byłyby wiodącą potęgą europejską i jako takie, w rozsądnym znaczeniu tego słowa, byłyby Władca świata.
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Arthur MacBridemówi:
„Judea wypowiada wojnę Niemcom” (część 2)
60 milionów gojów zginęło podczas żydowskiej II wojny światowej.
Europa zdewastowana od końca do końca.
Kolejne miliony zginęło po zakończeniu działań wojennych w wyniku złego traktowania, głodu itp.Niedorzeczna i absurdalna historia o komorach gazowych, parowaniu, maszynach do masturbacji, „obozach śmierci”, makabrycznych wymyślonych historiach, które ujawniają żydowski umysł.
Kolejna sytuacja ma miejsce obecnie na Ukrainie.
Świat potrzebuje wytchnienia od tych demonów.
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Ron Unzmówi:@saggy
Poza tym lubię mówić: „wszystko, co wiesz o II wojnie światowej, jest fałszywe” i odnoszę się do WSPANIAŁEJ książki Buchanana „Churchill, Hitler i niepotrzebna wojna”, do której link znajduje się poniżej, więc zdziwiłem się, że tego nie zrobiłem zobacz, o czym mowa w artykule powyżej
Ta prezentacja długiego wywiadu jest jedynie podsumowaniem i podsumowaniem tego, co publikowałem w moich poprzednich artykułach na przestrzeni ostatnich pięciu lat, w większości w oparciu o obszerne fragmenty tych ostatnich. Przeczytaj te artykuły, w których chcesz mojego pełnego omówienia tego złożonego tematu:
https://www.unz.com/page/world-war-ii-articles/
W moim bardzo długim artykule dotyczącym II wojny światowej w 2019 r. wspomniałem, że kiedy pierwotnie przeczytałem książkę Buchanana, byłem pod ogromnym wrażeniem, ale kiedy w końcu przeczytałem ją ponownie w 2019 r., byłem raczej rozczarowany:
Całkiem niedawno przeczytałem ponownie książkę Pata Buchanana z 2008 roku, w której ostro potępiam Churchilla za jego rolę w kataklizmicznej wojnie światowej i dokonałem interesującego odkrycia. Irving należy z pewnością do najbardziej autorytatywnych biografów Churchilla, a jego wyczerpujące badania dokumentacyjne stały się źródłem wielu nowych odkryć, a jego książki sprzedały się w milionach egzemplarzy. Jednak nazwisko Irvinga ani razu nie pojawia się ani w tekście Buchanana, ani w jego bibliografii, chociaż możemy podejrzewać, że znaczna część materiału Irvinga została „wyprana” za pośrednictwem innych, wtórnych źródeł Buchanana. Buchanan obszernie cytuje AJP Taylora, ale nie wspomina o Barnesie, Flynnie czy różnych innych czołowych amerykańskich naukowcach i dziennikarzach, których usunięto za wyrażanie współczesnych poglądów, które nie tak bardzo różniły się od poglądów samego autora.
W latach dziewięćdziesiątych Buchanan był jedną z najwybitniejszych postaci politycznych w Ameryce, wywierając ogromny wpływ na media zarówno w prasie, jak i telewizji, a jego niezwykle silne starty w wyborach prezydenckich przez Partię Republikańską w latach 1992 i 1996 ugruntowały jego pozycję narodową. Jednak jego liczni ideologiczni wrogowie niestrudzenie pracowali, aby go osłabić i do 2008 roku jego ciągła obecność jako eksperta w kanale kablowym MSNBC była jednym z ostatnich przyczółków o dużym znaczeniu publicznym. Prawdopodobnie zdawał sobie sprawę, że opublikowanie rewizjonistycznej historii II wojny światowej może zagrozić jego stanowisku i wierzył, że jakiekolwiek bezpośrednie powiązanie z oczyszczonymi i oczernianymi postaciami, takimi jak Irving czy Barnes, z pewnością doprowadzi do jego trwałego wygnania ze wszystkich mediów elektronicznych.
Dziesięć lat temu byłem pod dużym wrażeniem historii Buchanana, ale później dużo czytałem na temat tej epoki i za drugim razem poczułem się nieco rozczarowany. Oprócz często żartobliwego, retorycznego i nienaukowego tonu, moja najostrzejsza krytyka nie dotyczyła kontrowersyjnych stanowisk, jakie zajmował, ale innych kontrowersyjnych tematów i pytań, których tak starannie unikał.
Być może najbardziej oczywistą z nich jest kwestia prawdziwych początków wojny…
Jest więc jasne, że nigdy nie zadał sobie Pan trudu przeczytania lub przynajmniej zapamiętania moich długich poprzednich artykułów, a Pana niezwykle entuzjastyczna pochwała książki Buchanana oznacza, że najwyraźniej nie posiada Pan dobrego zrozumienia poważnej historiografii. Ty i inni możecie rozważyć przeczytanie krótkiej książki, którą opublikowałem:
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Myślę, że największym prezentem, jaki Unz Review oferuje każdemu czytelnikowi, jest otwarty dostęp do serii American Pravda. Czytanie tych esejów z Unz było niesamowitym przeżyciem.
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@meamjojo
Ludzie tutaj lubią tarzać się w przeszłości
Historia to moja ulubiona rozrywka.
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(Jeszcze raz bardzo ci dziękuję, drogi Ronie Unzie, za
twoje niestrudzone wysiłki, by pomóc prawdzie dostać to, co się jej należy!)Anglin w swoim artykule z 2014 roku:
Po raz pierwszy mem w związku z obecnym konfliktem pojawił się 25 lutego (wydaje się, że minęło sto lat, prawda?), kiedy brytyjski Express przeprowadził wywiad z dr Jonathanem Eyalem, międzynarodowym dyrektorem ds. bezpieczeństwa -tank Królewski United Services Institute (RUSI) i twierdził, że wszelka „agresja” na Ukrainę będzie „opcją sudecką”, co będzie nawiązaniem do wyzwolenia przez Hitlera etnicznych Niemców w Czechosłowacji.
Czy to porównanie nie jest „niedopuszczalną trywializacją historycznej osobliwości muhholoklausa”? Nie, jeśli zostanie sprowadzony na świat przez samego wybrańca. https://forebears.io/surnames/eyal
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Ron Unzmówi:@eah
Jeśli przez „wycofanie się” rozumiecie poprzednie granice, to nigdy nie widziałem, gdzie Hitler złożył taką propozycję — 6 października 1939 r., po zakończeniu kampanii przeciwko Polsce, wygłosił przemówienie przed Reichstagiem:
Powinienem był powiedzieć, że zaproponował wycofanie się z większości terytorium Polski okupowanego przez jego armie, przy czym Niemcy prawdopodobnie zaanektowały część w dużej mierze niemieckich części, które Polska zajęła po I wojnie światowej. Oczywiście nie mógł zmusić Sowietów do oddania zajętych części.
Irving wspomina o tym w wykładzie, do którego zalinkowałem, i jest to również pokrótce omówione na s. 240 z jego wojny hitlerowskiej .
Chodziło mi o to, że prawdopodobnie był skłonny przywrócić (zmniejszone) niepodległe państwo polskie w ramach porozumienia pokojowego z aliantami.
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Greta Handelmówi:@Peter Akuleyev
Podobieństwa z Putinem i Ukrainą są oczywiste.
Włącznie z tym z artykułu?
Zamiast tego polska dyktatura przez miesiące odrzucała jego próby negocjacji, a także rozpoczęła brutalne złe traktowanie mniejszości niemieckiej, ostatecznie zmuszając Hitlera do wypowiedzenia wojny.
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@Ron Unz
Jest więc jasne, że nigdy nie zadał sobie Pan trudu przeczytania lub przynajmniej zapamiętania moich długich poprzednich artykułów, a Pana niezwykle entuzjastyczna pochwała książki Buchanana oznacza, że najwyraźniej nie posiada Pan dobrego zrozumienia poważnej historiografii.
KUPA ŚMIECHU. Przynajmniej rozumiem holohoax! Czy możesz wymienić jednego „poważnego” historyka, który to robi?
moja najostrzejsza krytyka nie dotyczyła kontrowersyjnych stanowisk, jakie zajmował, ale innych kontrowersyjnych tematów i pytań, których tak starannie unikał.
Oczywiście Buchanan nawet nie wspomniał o holohoaxie, więc „unikał” go całkowicie. Książka nie jest świetna ze względu na to, czego nie napisał, jest świetna ze względu na to, co napisał. Nie chcę podawać powodów, dla których jest to NIESAMOWITA książka. Opublikuję niesamowite zdjęcie.
Wspomnę jeszcze o innej niesamowitej książce, której unikałeś, ta jest prawie nieznana i kilka razy zalecałem, abyś umieścił ją w swoim repozytorium…
„Lewe skrzydła nad Europą, czyli jak prowadzić wojnę o nic” brytyjskiego pisarza Wyndhama Lewisa, napisaną w 1936 r., cytuje:
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@naiwny
Samo twierdzenie, że coś, czego nie doceniasz, jest „bzdurą” (bez możliwości przedstawienia nawet najmniejszego – z pewnością nieudanego – dowodu przeciwnego) demaskuje ten typ oddychania agonalnego jako zwykłe ogłoszenie bezpodstawnej „opinii”, że ośmiesza siebie.
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Truth Vigilantemówi:
Churchill przez dziesięciolecia starał się zostać premierem, a Irving przekonująco twierdzi, że zdał sobie sprawę, że przegrana w katastrofalnej wojnie w ciągu kilku tygodni od ostatecznego osiągnięcia tego stanowiska uczyniłaby go pośmiewiskiem w podręcznikach historii.
Z pewnością był to czynnik marginalny, który wpłynął na Churchilla przy podjęciu decyzji.
Jednak NAJWAŻNIEJSZYM powodem odrzucenia przez Churchilla wspaniałomyślnej oferty Hitlera był fakt, że ZOG nakazał mu kontynuować wojnę.
I skarpetkową marionetką swoich talmudycznych mistrzów, jaką był Churchill, pozostał na scenariuszu.Tymczasem w nawiązaniu do tej perspektywy Johna T. Flynna:
W swojej kolumnie w Nowej Republice z 5 stycznia 1938 roku ostrzegł swoich niedowierzających czytelników przed wyłaniającą się perspektywą rozbudowania dużej armii morskiej i działań wojennych na horyzoncie, po tym jak czołowy doradca Roosevelta prywatnie przechwalał się przed nim, że wielki atak „keynesizmu wojskowego” ”, a wielka wojna wyleczyłaby pozornie nieprzezwyciężalne problemy gospodarcze kraju.
Nie wątpię, że jako zaangażowany keynesistowski/autorytarny centralny planista, FDR szczerze wierzył, że rozpoczęcie wojny pobudzi działalność gospodarczą i zapewni niemal pełne zatrudnienie. Ale ostatecznie FDR był także niewolniczo służalczą marionetką ZOG.
Bernard Baruch i Henry Morgenthau Jr byli menadżerami FDR, a siedziba ZOG w londyńskim City orzekła, że Stany Zjednoczone będą musiały manewrować, aby zaangażować się w europejską wojnę, aby zneutralizować największe zagrożenie dla syjonistycznego kartelu bankowego lichwy (a tym samym jego uścisku nad całości zachodniego systemu finansowego) w całej jego historii.
Oczywiście tym zagrożeniem była III Rzesza Hitlera.
PODSUMOWANIE: Niezależnie od tego, czy mamy na myśli FDR, czy Winstona „Spendthrifta” Churchilla, WSZYSTKIE ICH GŁÓWNE DECYZJE DOTYCZĄCE POLITYKI ZAGRANICZNEJ były im podyktowane przez ZOG.
W zakresie, w jakim istniały inne względy, które ostatecznie okazały się korzystne w wyniku postępowania, które ostatecznie podjęło tych dwóch zdrajców, te inne czynniki były w rzeczywistości drugorzędne w ogólnym schemacie rzeczy.
Mówiąc najprościej, ponieważ ZOG chciał wojny z Niemcami, ZAWSZE będzie wojna między Hitlerem a imperium anglosyjonistycznym.
Gdyby ZOG rządził na rzecz pokoju, byłby to pokój, niezależnie od sytuacji gospodarczej w USA spowodowanej katastrofalnym Nowym Ładem FDR (który zamienił poważną recesję w przedłużający się kryzys).
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peter mcloughlinmówi:
Istnieje potrzeba – intelektualna i emocjonalna – zrozumienia przeszłości. Historia mówi nam, skąd pochodzimy i, co ważniejsze, dokąd zmierzamy; lub dokąd myślimy lub pragniemy, zmierzamy. Jeśli mamy zdać sobie z tego sprawę (i uniknąć nuklearnego Armagedonu), ludzkość musi stawić czoła surowemu paradoksalnemu sylogizmowi: każde imperium w historii ostatecznie stanęło w obliczu wojny, której próbowało uniknąć; każdy chce uniknąć III wojny światowej; więc będzie kolejna wojna światowa.
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inspector generalmówi:@Prem
Dzięki za to. A ostatnio intelektualny karzeł, który prowadzi TikHistory na YT, nadal wmawia twierdzenie, że Hitler najechał na Polskę, bo musiał odwrócić uwagę od „upadającej” niemieckiej gospodarki.
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inspector generalmówi:@saggy
Niewielu historyków czyta więcej, niż im się wydaje, że muszą, aby inni, którzy czytają w dużej mierze ten sam zakres materiałów, mogli być traktowani poważnie.
Nawet pojedyncze (lub bardzo nieliczne) „świeże” źródła są zwykle więcej niż wystarczające, aby zapewnić reputację historyka, zakładając, że nie obraża on zwykłych podejrzanych.
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Petermxmówi:@Ron Unz
Czytałem także książkę Pata Buchanana, kiedy się ukazała, i choć wywarła na mnie wrażenie, zauważyłem też brak jakiejkolwiek wzmianki o nazwisku Davida Irvinga w tekście i w przypisach. Uważałem, że to niesprawiedliwe. Nie czytałem jej drugi raz, ale nie czytałem też książki Jamesa Bacque’a ani niektórych autorów, o których wspominasz. Powinienem to zrobić. Podejrzewam, że wtedy książka Pata Buchanana po przeczytaniu jej po raz drugi również nie byłabym pod takim wrażeniem.
Jestem już w połowie słuchania Twojego wykładu. Dzięki. Doskonały.
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Truth Vigilantemówi:@Anon
Gdyby Madoffa poddano audytom wcześnie i często, jego oszustwo nigdy nie osiągnęłoby tak dużych rozmiarów.
Jest to tym bardziej prawdziwe w przypadku amerykańskiej Rezerwy Federalnej, której właścicielem jest Zio.
Były kongresman dr Ron Paul od pięciu dekad domagał się przeprowadzenia audytu Fed. Jego syn, senator Rand Paul, zrobił to samo w ostatnich latach.
Poza tymi dwoma libertarianami niewiele słychać w tej sprawie od większości innych stworzeń Kongresu.
To cały dowód, jakiego potrzebujesz, aby ustalić, której kliki talmudycznej podlegają inni.ZGADZAM SIĘ/NIE ZGADZAM SIĘ/ITP. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Coraz częściej w mózgach białych Anglo-Amerykanów, którzy próbują pogodzić z jednej strony najgorliwie kontynuowane propagowanie historycznych mitów o ich jakże „bohaterskich” przodkach, z drugiej strony, w coraz większym stopniu szerzy się rodzaj dysonansu poznawczego. z drugiej strony niezaprzeczalna ambiwalencja co do obecnego stanu ich całkowicie skorodowanych społeczeństw.
Lowe napisał dwie książki historyczne o II wojnie światowej i jej następstwach. Inferno (2007) opisuje Operację Gomora, zbombardowanie Hamburga bombami zapalającymi przez siły brytyjskie i amerykańskie w 1943 r., które zniszczyło miasto i spowodowało około 40 000 ofiar cywilnych. Jego najnowsza książka Savage Continent (2012) to historyczny opis Europy po drugiej wojnie światowej, w szczególności bezprawia, chaosu i niepohamowanej przemocy, które panowały na kontynencie w latach 1944–1949. W tej książce Lowe pisze, że wojna nie zakończyła się czysto po oficjalnym zawieszeniu broni w 1945 r., ale trwała pod różnymi postaciami przez kilka lat. Porusza wiele kontrowersyjnych tematów, takich jak powojenny język, czystki etniczne i liczne wojny domowe, które miały miejsce w Europie.
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Thirdtwinmówi:
„… z czołowymi sędziami Sojuszu wyraźnie stwierdzającymi, że ich własne kraje w ogóle nie są związane tymi samymi międzynarodowymi konwencjami prawnymi, które, jak twierdzili, egzekwują…”
Dla mnie brzmi to bardzo podobnie do „Porządku opartego na przepisach międzynarodowych”.
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Ron Unzmówi:@saggy
Wspomnę jeszcze o innej niesamowitej książce, której unikałeś, ta jest prawie nieznana i kilka razy zalecałem, abyś umieścił ją w swoim repozytorium…
„Lewe skrzydła nad Europą, czyli jak prowadzić wojnę o nic” brytyjskiego pisarza Wyndhama Lewisa, napisaną w 1936 r., cytuje:
Po prostu pokazujesz, dlaczego twoich poglądów nie należy traktować poważnie.
Wyndham Lewis był po prostu dość ekscentrycznym brytyjskim pisarzem i malarzem. Ponieważ zdarzało mu się mówić rzeczy, z którymi się zgadzasz, powołujesz się na niego jako na ogromny autorytet.
Jestem jednak pewien, że mógłbym znaleźć brytyjskich pisarzy i malarzy z tej samej epoki, którzy byliby równie ekscentryczni i twierdzili coś zupełnie przeciwnego.
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Bardzo ładne podsumowanie tych poprzednich artykułów. Części poświęcone Polsce były dla mnie osobiście interesujące, ponieważ mam niewielką wiedzę o tej części świata. Chociaż nie jestem fanem Adolfa Hitlera, wspaniale jest czytać tę rewizjonistyczną historię drugiej wojny światowej i z pewnością jest prawdą, że 80 lat „antyfaszyzmu” przekształciło się w coś naprawdę potwornego.
Nie jestem jednak pewien, czy to prawda, co mówisz o Dunkierce. Kriegsmarine nigdy nie kontrolowała kanału La Manche i przez całą wojnę ograniczała się do najazdów na handel, a Luftwaffe nie zapewniła sobie przewagi powietrznej nad Wielką Brytanią. Nie jestem więc pewien, czy naprawdę mieli możliwość zatopienia floty ewakuacyjnej pod Dunkierką.
Ponadto kampania w Afryce Północnej rozpoczęła się niemal natychmiast po Dunkierce – około tygodnia, gdy Mussolini wypowiedział wojnę Wielkiej Brytanii. Czy to prawda, że Oś planowała pozostawić Imperium Brytyjskie w spokoju, nawet gdy toczyły się bitwy o kontrolę nad Afryką Północną?
Warunki w Japonii bezpośrednio po wojnie były również bardzo złe i obejmowały podobne problemy związane z głodem, masowymi gwałtami i cenzurą mediów. Co ciekawe, Kanada wysłała do tego środowiska swoich internowanych Kanadyjczyków-Japończyków zaraz po wojnie, zadając kłam popularnemu wśród niektórych poglądowi, że Kanada zawsze była swego rodzaju lewicową utopią w porównaniu z USA.
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bert33mówi:
Hitler was a piece of shit and so were his brownshirt nazi goons and WWII is over, having cost some 70 million people their lives. Modern germany is a much better place for having evolved into what it is today, a country where its legal to be jewish or kinda stupid or gay and not have to worry about getting hauled off by the goon squad. No more of that social purity rassenreinheit crap. Neonazies are getting their ashes handed to them in the ukraine, probably more than 3-4 of them ’emigrated’ from germany to join the festivities…and hopefully all of them will stop a russian bullet, and good riddance to the whole sorry lot of them. ”Never again”.
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Mike Whitney’s first question to Ron Unz included: “what was Hitler trying to achieve in Poland?” I looked through the entire long, long, long roundabout answer but didn’t find what Ron himself believed that to be. If it’s there, it got lost in a sea of “I, me mine” re Ron Unz indulging in Unz self-promotion. I could answer it. and so could the original WWII revisionists like Harry Elmer Barnes and David L. Hoggan. And they did. So read them instead.
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@Eirik
As far as I understand it Hitler outlines his goals of conquest in the east quite clearly in his book,
Certainly in keeping with the nature of the German Empire which kept moving East from the time of the five stem duchies of the Holy Roman Empire in the 9th century up until 1945.
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NeNavalny says:
Brawo dla biednych Niemców. I yay dla naszych wspaniałych amerykańskich żołnierzy, którzy wygrali wojnę!
Kolejna sterta garnków, typowa dla anglocentrycznej wizji Świata.
Ani słowa o 27 milionach (oficjalnie) zabitych Sowietów, ani słowa o milionach Jugosłowian, Polaków, wszystko o Żydach i biednych Niemcach, którzy nie zasłużyli na takie traktowanie ze strony prawdziwych wybranych – Anglos (och, więc nieludzkie…), które zawsze są dobre w zabijaniu słabszych. Nie jedna bitwa o jakimkolwiek znaczeniu została wygrana przez siły „sojusznicze”, ale 10 milionów cywilnych Niemców – na pewno tak jest po amerykańsku, tak jak z Hindusami, Latynosami itp. itd.
Indoktrynacja Anglików jest zdumiewająca! Dla tych, którzy mają mózg, jest oczywiste, że WSZYSTKIE wojny na planecie Ziemia w ciągu ostatnich 1000 lat były napędzane przez Brytyjczyków i ich głupszych braci za oceanem.
Zacznę wierzyć w możliwe zbawienie Zachodu, kiedy zobaczę artykuł Rona „Dlaczego wszystko, co wiesz o wszystkim, czego uczono Cię w szkole o historii Zachodu, jest kłamstwem”.
Przerzucanie winy pomiędzy masowych morderców, takich jak Hitler, Churchill, FDR i inni, z których wszyscy są winni blisko 100 milionów zgonów, jest haniebnym ćwiczeniem intelektualnej masturbacji.ZGADZAM SIĘ/NIE ZGADZAM SIĘ/ITP. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Wielgusmówi:@saggy
Brytyjski naczelnik nalotów. Wyraźnie nie traktuję tego poważnie.
Przypadkowo wpychanie ulotek propagandowych aliantów do skrzynek pocztowych było sporadycznie praktykowane w Niemczech jako forma antyhitlerowskiego oporu na raczej niskim szczeblu, chociaż takie akty „podważania wysiłku wojennego” mogły skutkować egzekucją. Według doniesień członkowie luźno utworzonych grup, takich jak „Piraci Edelweiss”, robili takie rzeczy.ZGADZAM SIĘ/NIE ZGADZAM SIĘ/ITP. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Incitatusmówi:@Prem
„Nierozważne wydatki Rzeszy stanowią najpoważniejsze zagrożenie dla waluty. Ogromny wzrost takich wydatków [na zbrojenia] udaremnia każdą próbę opracowania stałego budżetu; doprowadza finanse kraju na skraj ruiny pomimo wielkiego zaostrzenia śruby podatkowej, a tym samym podważa Bank Rzeszy i walutę… Nadszedł czas, aby zaprzestać.”
- Prezes Reichsbanku Hjalmar Schacht (i siedmiu innych prezesów Reichsbanku) 7 stycznia 1939 Notatka do Adolfa Hitlera [Hett „The Nazi Menace” s. 254].
Schacht zostaje zwolniony 13 dni później [20 I 1939]. Oto, czym podzielił się z Amerykanami siedem lat później:
„A zemsta porządnych Niemców będzie znacznie ostrzejsza i dokładniejsza niż cokolwiek, czego mogliby dokonać alianci. Muszę jednak powiedzieć, że Roosevelt jako jedyny widział administrację Hitlera taką, jaka ona była od samego początku i jako jedyny nigdy nie wysyłał swojego przedstawiciela na żadne spotkanie jednej partii – ani na jedno”.
-Były prezes Reichsbanku Hjalmar Schacht 28 lutego 1946 do GM Gilberta [Dziennik Gilberta z Norymbergi] s. 176-77]
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geokat62mówi:@RoboMoralFascist 1st
W 1938 roku Adolf Hitler został Człowiekiem Roku magazynu Time… w Stanach Zjednoczonych.
Oto dowód…
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BAMAmówi:
Ci sami ludzie, którzy monopolizowali fałszowanie historii II wojny światowej, robią to samo teraz z historią Zachodu.
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Observatormówi:
Dzięki za ten wspaniały artykuł. Historyk Murray Rothbard napisał w 1966 roku ważny artykuł na ten temat zatytułowany O znaczeniu rewizjonizmu dla naszych czasów (online pod adresem http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v15/v15n3p35_Rothbard.html ). W swoim nekrologu dla rewizjonistycznego historyka Harry'ego Elmera Barnesa Rothbard tak podsumował prawdziwy, trwały wpływ II wojny światowej: „Nasze przystąpienie do II wojny światowej było kluczowym aktem narzucającym trwałą militaryzację gospodarce i społeczeństwu, sprowadzającym do kraju stałe państwo garnizonowe, zarozumiały kompleks wojskowo-przemysłowy, stały system poboru do wojska. Był to akt kluczowy dla rozszerzenia Stanów Zjednoczonych z republiki w imperium i rozszerzenia tego imperium na cały świat, zastępując przy tym upadające Imperium Brytyjskie. Był to kluczowy akt w tworzeniu gospodarki mieszanej prowadzonej przez duży rząd, systemu państwa-monopolu-kapitalizmu zarządzanego przez rząd centralny we współpracy z wielkim biznesem i wielkim unionizmem. Był to kluczowy akt podniesienia władzy prezydenta, zwłaszcza w sprawach zagranicznych, do roli najbardziej despotycznej osoby w historii świata. I wreszcie II wojna światowa to ostatni mit wojenny, który pozostał, mit, którego stara lewica trzyma się w czystej desperacji: mit, że przynajmniej tutaj była dobra wojna, tutaj była wojna, w której Ameryka była w Prawidłowy. II wojna światowa to wojna rzucona nam w twarz przez wywołujący wojnę establishment, który w każdej wojnie, przed którą stoimy, stara się otulić się płaszczem dobrej i sprawiedliwej II wojny światowej.
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Agent76mówi:
4 lutego 2013 r . *Wszystkie* „Wojny są wojnami bankierów”*
Wiem, że wiele osób ma ogromne trudności ze zrozumieniem, ile wojen rozpoczyna się wyłącznie w celu narzucenia narodom prywatnych banków centralnych, więc pozwólcie, że podam kilka przykładów, abyście zrozumieli, dlaczego rząd USA jest w tak uwikłany wiele wojen przeciwko tak wielu obcym narodom. Istnieje na to wystarczający precedens.
19 stycznia 2021 r. Faszyzm: kiedy wielki rząd i wielki biznes współpracują ramię w ramię
Benito Mussolini powiedział, że „faszyzm powinien być właściwie nazywany korporacjonizmem, ponieważ jest połączeniem władzy państwowej i korporacyjnej”. Czy przyglądając się współczesnym wydarzeniom, a także wydarzeniom ostatniego stulecia, nie jest to główny problem, przed którym stoimy dzisiaj?
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@Anon
Często mówi się, że jeśli teoria lub hipoteza nie jest falsyfikowalna, nie jest ona naprawdę naukowa.
Nie zastanawiałem się głębiej nad tym tematem, jednakże teoria ta została wysunięta przez Karla Poppera i często spotykana jest ona ramię w ramię z establishmentem holokaustu.
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@eah
Cześć, cieszę się, że tu jesteś i bardzo się cieszę, że dodałeś:
nie ma dowodów na to, że w 1941 r. Hitler wiedział o ucieczce Hessa do Anglii lub jego propozycjach pokojowych lub aprobował ją.
Taka jest prawda, według mojej wiedzy i zrozumienia. Ale to wykracza poza zakres Rona Unza i Johna Weara (których Unz lubi promować, co wiele mówi o ograniczeniach i być może zamiarach Unza).
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george 1mówi:@NeNavalny
Bez wątpienia rosyjscy Sowieci zapłacili niszczycielską cenę podczas II wojny światowej. Amerykanie poświęcili się także w Europie i na Pacyfiku, ale nie w takim stopniu jak Związek Radziecki. Głównym sposobem, w jaki Stany Zjednoczone wpłynęły na wojnę, był nasz ówczesny potencjał przemysłowy. Bez ogromnych ilości zasobów wyprodukowanych i wysłanych przez Amerykę, w tym ropy, Sowieci nie byliby w stanie pokonać Niemców. JMHO.
Należy pamiętać, że Stany Zjednoczone nie mają już takich możliwości. To dlatego neokonserwatyści teraz otwarcie płaczą, że nie mamy już potencjału przemysłowego ani wykwalifikowanej siły roboczej, aby przeprowadzić ich misję wojenną z Rosją i Chinami. Czy ci ludzie właśnie spadli z ciężarówki z rzepą? Wiadomo o tym już od ponad dwóch dekad.
Matematyka nie ulegnie zmianie także dla neokonserwatystów. Zapobiegną temu zagłada demograficzna i wycofywanie się przemysłu, któremu tak kibicowali.
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HVMIImówi:
Kolejną książką, o której warto wspomnieć, jest Design for War Sanborna.
Dodałbym, że w odniesieniu do polityki USA Barnes miał rację, mówiąc, że jest to „nieustanna wojna o wieczny pokój”. Tak było od zakończenia II wojny światowej.
Dodałbym jednak, że polityka Stanów Zjednoczonych była interwencjonizmem wojskowym przebranym za demokratyczny liberalizm. Podczas zimnej wojny podtrzymał ostatnie ślady europejskiego imperializmu. Teraz, po okresie jednobiegunowości, Stany Zjednoczone próbują narzucić „liberalny” wielokulturowy globalizm. Z drugiej strony świat powraca do nacjonalizmu, co jest właśnie powodem, dla którego internacjonaliści w pierwszej kolejności wypowiedzieli wojnę Niemcom – podobnie jak tworzą ideologiczną wojnę z Rosją, używając masowej propagandy do kontrolowania zachodniego umysłu.
Komunizm i kapitalizm połączyły siły, aby przeciwstawić się niemieckiemu nacjonalizmowi etnicznemu. Co w końcu mają wspólnego obie ideologie? – internacjonalizm. Jest to program od czasów II wojny światowej i stanowi próbę doprowadzenia do tego, co Kissinger nazwał międzynarodową konwergencją. Jednak Rosja i Chiny (oraz inne narody) zdały sobie sprawę, że nie leży to w ich interesie i otwarcie sprzeciwiają się temu hegemonicznemu zachodniemu ideałowi liberalnemu.
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Nie mogę się doczekać artykułu American Pravda na temat wojny secesyjnej!
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Peter Akuleyevmówi:@Greta Handel
Tak, ponieważ w obu przypadkach prześladowania mniejszości były dalekie od „brutalnych” w prawdziwym życiu i zostały w większości wzmocnione dla celów krajowej propagandy.
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Patrick McNallymówi:
> ostatnie żądanie Hitlera,
To absurdalne sformułowanie i nie przypominam sobie miejsca, w którym sam Taylor go użył. Z pewnością David Irving w książkach takich jak The War Path nie próbuje udawać, że Hitler formułował „ostateczne żądanie”, podnosząc kwestię Gdańska. To po prostu rażąco fałszywe. Z dokumentów wynika, że Hitler miał wiele wielkich ambicji podboju całego terytorium słowiańskiej Europy Wschodniej w celach mieszkalnych.
Jedyne uzasadnione uwagi, jakie można poczynić i w zasadzie jedyne rzeczy, które Taylor próbuje twierdzić, to:
1) Pomimo ogólnych celów ekspansjonistycznych wobec Europy Wschodniej jako źródła przestrzeni życiowej dla rozwijającej się rasy aryjskiej, nie ma dowodów na to, że Hitler zamierzył rok 1939 jako rok rozpoczęcia wielkiej wojny z udziałem wielu mocarstw.
2) Choć z własnych dokumentów Hitlera wynika, że nie uważał on Gdańska za ważną kwestię dla Polski i postrzegał to jako część rywalizacji o aryjską przestrzeń życiową, to prawdopodobnie chcąc nie chcąc, zaakceptowałby porozumienie z Polską w sprawie Gdańska, które było podobne do układu monachijskiego. Nie oznacza to, że Hitler dotrzymywałby warunków takiego porozumienia dłużej niż układ monachijski, ale prawdopodobnie zaakceptowałby coś na wzór Monachium w sprawie Gdańska, przygotowując się do forsowania na początku dalszych żądań Polski. 1940 (podobnie jak to zrobił z Czechosłowacją po Monachium).
Fakt, że rok 1939 okazał się początkiem wojny powszechnej, był niewątpliwie tym, co Ian Kershaw w swojej dwutomowej biografii Hitlera określił mianem „błędnego obliczenia”. We wszystkich tych kwestiach Taylor ma uzasadnione argumenty, a jego pogląd został ogólnie włączony do ortodoksyjnej historii ostatnich pięciu dekad. Jednak udawanie, że Hitler formułował „ostatnie żądanie” w Gdańsku, jest niedorzeczne. Hitler przygotowywał się do wysunięcia dalszych żądań, które otworzyłyby drogę do jego ogólnej ekspansji terytorialnej w Europie Wschodniej. Chciał po prostu, aby Brytyjczycy to zaakceptowali, aby nie mieć na rękach ponownej wojny z Londynem.
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Ahoymówi:
Do wszystkich Amerykanów z otwartym umysłem. Książka Maurice’a Samuela „Wy, poganie” to lektura obowiązkowa. Strona 155 zaskoczy Cię.
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katesiscomówi:
Zadziwia mnie to, że chociaż Stany Zjednoczone ustanowiły ROJAVNĘ jako niepodległy kraj, w komentarzach internetowych całkowicie brakuje potępienia. To tak, jakby świat spał. Cała propaganda i media są skierowane w stronę Rosji/Ukrainy. Czy ta ziemia została skradziona Syrii, na której uprawiane są dzieci wychowywane na potrzeby wojny? Jakie to wstyd.
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Patrick McNallymówi:@Peter Akuleyev
> niemiecka gospodarka borykała się z trudnościami z powodu międzynarodowych sankcji
This is the one error in your comment. The fact is that the German economy was struggling because Hitler had placed so much emphasis on rearmament. Hjalmar Schacht had been an enthusiastic advocate of German rearmament, but by 1936 he felt that Germany needed to develop its export industries. There’s no evidence of sanctions having played much of a role here. It was simply that Hitler was not willing to give the priority to development of export industries which Schacht desired. The determination of Hitler to emphasize rearmament in preparation for eventual intended conquests simultaneously forced Hitler to become more aggressive. The occupation of Czechia in March 1939 provided Germany with the Skoda Works that enhanced rearmament, at the same time that Germany gained the Czech gold. This could have been avoided if Hitler had followed Schacht’s advice from 1936 onward. But it was not seriously influenced by any of the attempts made by New York Jews to advocate for sanctions. The latter were mostly ineffective.
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HT says:
After a lifetime of propaganda called education, I am finally figuring out the truth about WWII. 80 years later our current conditions help reveal the truth as the Jewish Neo-Marxist machine destroys our culture and country. The most important thing we achieved in WWII was making the world safe for Jewish Marxism which is now destroying us from within. I always come back to the alleged General Patton quote that we defeated the wrong enemy.
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Tom Welsh says:@Chebyshev
The Americans had “form” after what they did to the Native Americans. I am always puzzled by the criticism that some colonial regimes get for their ill treatment of the indigenous peoples.
The Americans cleverly avoided any such criticism. “Indigenous peoples? What indigenous peoples?”
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Wim says:
I can agree with many of Run Unz’s points. However, I miss the discussion on what in my opinion are some core points:
– The annexation of Czechia. This greatly undermined any claim that Hitler was just interested in the fate of ethnic Germans and played a role in how countries reacted to his Danzig demands.
- Holokaust. Unz wydaje się skupiony na tym, co się NIE wydarzyło. Chciałbym, żeby doszło do poważniejszej dyskusji na temat tego, co się wydarzyło. Proszę także poświęcić trochę uwagi Czarnej Księdze ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Black_Book_of_Soviet_Jewry ).
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whataliarmówi:
Adolf Hitler nie był Adolfem Hitlerem.
najlepszy cytat wszechczasów.
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Tom Welshmówi:@Verymuchalive
Nie jestem ekonomistą i chociaż studiowałem ten okres na uniwersytecie, przyznaję, że zapomniałem wszystkich szczegółów.
Wiem jednak, że I wojna światowa zrujnowała finansowo Wielką Brytanię i była ona całkowicie zależna od wsparcia USA. Aby uzyskać graficzną ilustrację, wystarczy spojrzeć na nowe brytyjskie pancerniki „Rodney” i „Nelson” zakupione przez Royal Navy około 1928 roku: stać ich było tylko na przednią połowę! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nelson-class_battleship
W ciągu roku od wypowiedzenia przez Wielką Brytanię wojny Niemcom w 1939 roku Wielka Brytania była zupełnie spłukana. Jeśli chodzi o dalszą walkę, była ona całkowicie zależna od Stanów Zjednoczonych, które, jak niektórzy sądzili, byłyby otwarte, gdyby tylko we własnym interesie. W tym przypadku jednak straszliwym błędem było „poleganie na życzliwości przyjaciół”, którzy w istocie byli lichwiarzami o kamiennych sercach. Oprócz determinacji w odzyskaniu każdego czerwonego centa wraz z odsetkami, Stany Zjednoczone – w osobie FDR – miały konkretne plany przejęcia Imperium Brytyjskiego i wszystkich jego aktywów oraz zastąpienia funta szterlinga dolarem jako główną walutą rezerwową świata.
Nawet po tym, jak Churchill sam udał się do Kanady, aby osobiście spotkać się z FDR, nie zaproponowano mu niczego w prezencie. Wszystko zostało spisane w księgach rachunkowych, a Wielka Brytania ostatecznie spłaciła swoje długi z czasów II wojny światowej wobec USA około 2003 roku (z pamięci). Pierwszym zadaniem po 1945 roku była spłata przez Wielką Brytanię zaległych długów wobec USA z czasów I wojny światowej!
Byłby to interesujący (choć wybuchowy) projekt dla każdego, kto ma dość odwagi, aby zbadać dokument na temat wielu sposobów, w jakie Wielka Brytania odwdzięczyła się USA po 1939 r. Nie da się przeczytać książki Jamesa Hamiltona-Pattersona „Imperium chmur” bez zapoznania się z szerokim zarysy polityki, zgodnie z którą powojenne rządy Wielkiej Brytanii konsekwentnie kończyły wiodące na świecie projekty lotnicze, często zwalniając personel, sprzedając sprzęt i niszcząc całą dokumentację projektową z wyjątkiem tych, które zostały dostarczone bezpłatnie amerykańskim korporacjom.
Coś podobnego stało się z komputerami, a większość wczesnych prac projektowych wykonano w Wielkiej Brytanii. Z pewnością Stany Zjednoczone miały znacznie więcej wszelkiego rodzaju zasobów, ale Wielka Brytania miała ludzi takich jak Alan Turing. (Nawiasem mówiąc, jak dokładnie umarł Turing? Jego wyjątkowo przedwczesną śmierć w 1955 roku przypisano samobójstwu, ale nie było absolutnie żadnego powodu, aby się zabił. To prawdopodobnie tylko zbieg okoliczności, że CIA rozpoczęła swoją karierę morderstwa i zniszczenia w tym czasie po zorganizowaniu pierwszych dwóch zamachów stanu w Gwatemali i Iranie w 1953 i 1954 r.).
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Sollipsistmówi:
Greenwald poczynił obserwację, że według mediów Trump był faktycznie gorszy od Hitlera, a teraz DeSantis jest gorszy od Trumpa. Zatem następnym liderem Partii Republikańskiej prawie na pewno będzie musiał być jakiś Super Mega Hitler na sterydach.
Gdzie to stawia Putina-Hitlera? Lepszy czy gorszy od DeSantisa? A o ile gorszy będzie następny bete noire teraz, gdy Hitler spadł na trzecie lub czwarte miejsce w rankingach?
To trochę jak Chłopiec, który krzyczał wilk, z tą różnicą, że morał jest taki, że chłopiec kończy na lukratywnym i wpływowym stanowisku w wiejskim biurze propagandowym.
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Ron Unzmówi:@Rurik
Czy Twoim zdaniem II wojna światowa miałaby miejsce, gdyby Bank Rezerwy Federalnej nie został autoryzowany/wdrożony?
Czy jedno miało coś wspólnego z drugim?
Bardzo wątpię, aby utworzenie Rezerwy Federalnej miało cokolwiek wspólnego z II wojną światową lub I wojną światową.
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che guavamówi:@saggy
Dziękuję za link. Nie czytałem tej książki, podoba mi się wiele prac Lewisa, sztuka i poezja wizualna, inni wortycyści, nawet jeśli przypominają szarą, zimną i przesiąkniętą deszczem wersję włoskiego futuryzmu.
Lewis zaproponował także artystyczne projekty kamuflażu okrętowego, w tym był on najwspanialszym kamuflażem. projektant aż do projektów SS kamuflażu piechoty, wśród wielu niemieckich wynalazków, które są obecnie wszechobecne, ale ich pochodzenie jest ignorowane.
Przeczytałem też jedną powieść i kilka esejów. Jednak nie ten, z którego cytujesz, więc muszę skopiować link do pliku notatki i go przeczytać.
„Pakt rumuńsko-sowiecki” – nieudana przepowiednia, z pewnością nadszedł, ale dopiero po tym, jak ten pierwszy stał się zdrajcą Państw Osi pod koniec 1944 r., a Sowieci szybko wyeliminowali zdrajców wszystkich wyższych szczebli.
Naprawdę nie mogę się powstrzymać od przeczytania tego artykułu, dobrze, przeczytałem prawie wszystko wcześniej.
Jeśli chodzi o wojnę w Europie, prawie zawsze nie wspomina się o aneksji terytoriów przez Polskę w 1938 r. i nieudanym ataku Francji na Niemcy pod koniec 1938 r. lub na początku 1939 r. IIRC dr Irving (uznając go za doktorat z historii, którego nigdy nie otrzyma, ale na który naprawdę zasługuje) wspomina o obu. Sprawa Polski jest zbyt dobrze znana, ale zwykle pomijana, francuski atak na Niemcy jest inny, wciąż traktowany jako temat tabu , choć fakt.
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Flomówi:@Ann Nonny Mouse
To dobrze znana taktyka debaty – Reductio ad Hitlerum . Trzeba przyznać, że zwykle służy ono do zakończenia dyskusji.
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Socratesjrmówi:
Ron, bardzo dobrze, ale musimy być ostrożni, nazywając przedstawione dowody FAKTAMI.
Nie zgadzam się z Pana rozumieniem historii operacji Pike i tak zwanych Faktów przez innych. Czy należy rozważyć i zmierzyć dalsze dowody?
Jeśli możesz poświęcić trochę czasu na dodatkową recenzję i może dodać kilka komentarzy:
Z PAMIĘTNIKÓW MAJORA JORDANA (obejrzyj wideo, przeczytaj jego książkę na Archive.com )
FRANKLIN DELANO ROOSEVELT – MÓJ WYKORZYSTANY OJCIEC – TEŚCIE przez Curtisa Dall 1968
CZERWONA SYMFONIA Jose Landowskiego
Dziękuję bardzo za Twoje wysiłki.
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@Tom Welsh
Czytając powyższy fragment, nie mogłem nie zauważyć, że jeśli zastąpimy „Putina” „Hitlerem”, „Krym i Donbas” „Danzig”, „Rosję” „Niemcami”, „Ukrainę” „Polską” i „NATO” zamiast „Wielka Brytania lub Francja”, ma to równie sens i jest równie oparte na faktach.
Tak, a kretyni próbowali także wrobić Putina jako „antysemitę” i „faszystę”, podczas gdy w rzeczywistości są, byli i zawsze byli judeofaszystami/marksistami/butthurtowymi „ofiarami” Mojżesza, którzy zasłużyli na dobrą kryjówkę i ją dobrze ukryli .
Ale mali głupcy, którzy wyrosli na wielkich Kike’ów, to niebezpiecznie karłowate debile, błąkający się jak bogowie, podczas gdy w rzeczywistości to tylko mali głupcy z marksistowsko-syjonistycznym kompleksem boga i przewrotną, sadystyczną, sztywną stroną, która lubi w szatański sposób wyciera twarz religijnego świata degeneracją Kike’a.
Ale świat religijny ma swoje własne zdanie na temat teistycznie satanistycznych głupków i tego, że należy im ponownie dać wielką lekcję. A ateistyczne warzywa lepiej usuńcie z drogi, bo wylądują w piekle z głupkami.
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Brás Cubasmówi:@saggy
Co dziwne, nie odwołujesz się do późniejszej zmiany opinii Lewisa:
W 1931 roku, po wizycie w Berlinie, Lewis opublikował Hitler (1931), książkę przedstawiającą Adolfa Hitlera jako „człowieka pokoju”, którego członkom partii groziła komunistyczna przemoc uliczna. Jego niepopularność wśród liberałów i antyfaszystów wzrosła, zwłaszcza po dojściu Hitlera do władzy w 1933 r. Po drugiej wizycie w Niemczech w 1937 r. Lewis zmienił swoje poglądy i zaczął wycofywać swoje poprzednie uwagi polityczne. Po wizycie w Berlinie w 1937 r. rozpoznał realia nazistowskiego traktowania Żydów. W 1939 r. opublikował atak na antysemityzm zatytułowany Żydzi, czy oni są ludźmi? , [a], który został pozytywnie zrecenzowany w The Jewish Chronicle . Opublikował także Kult Hitlera (1939), w którym stanowczo odwołał jego wcześniejsze poparcie dla Hitlera.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wyndham_Lewis
Nie mam pojęcia, czy to jest prawdziwy powód, dla którego Ron Unz nie docenił, że poruszyłeś tego „ekscentrycznego brytyjskiego pisarza i malarza”; w każdym razie Unz najwyraźniej preferuje jeszcze bardziej ekscentrycznego przyjaciela Lewisa, amerykańskiego modernistycznego poetę Ezrę Pounda, którego nazywa „jednym z najbardziej znanych amerykańskich intelektualistów literackich”, cytując jeden ze swoich słynnych dowcipów.
https://www.unz.com/isteve/my-new-taki-column-on-the-secret-pentagon-report-the-strategic-consequences-of-chinese-racism/#comment-5166121ZGADZAM SIĘ/NIE ZGADZAM SIĘ/ITP. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
John Wearmówi:@Carolyn Yeager
W komentarzu nr 77 piszesz: „Witam — cieszę się, że tu jesteś i bardzo się cieszę, że dodałeś, że nie ma dowodów na to, że w 1941 roku Hitler wiedział o ucieczce Hessa do Anglii lub o jego propozycjach pokojowych lub aprobował ją.
Taka jest prawda, według mojej wiedzy i zrozumienia. Ale to wykracza poza zakres Rona Unza i Johna Weara (których Unz lubi promować, co wiele mówi o ograniczeniach i być może zamiarach Unza).”
Moja odpowiedź: Nie ma ostatecznego dowodu na to, że Hitler wiedział lub nie wiedział, że Rudolf Hess zamierza lecieć do Szkocji. To szarawy obszar historii.
Wiemy, że Hitler nigdy nie chciał wojny z Wielką Brytanią. Dla Hitlera Wielka Brytania była naturalnym sojusznikiem Niemiec i narodu, który najbardziej podziwiał. Hitler nie miał ambicji wobec Wielkiej Brytanii ani jej imperium i wszystkie zdobyte dokumenty solidnie to potwierdzają. (Źródło: Irving, David, Hitler's War, Nowy Jork: Avon Books, 1990, s. 3).
Hitlerowi zależało na zawarciu pokoju, gdy Wielka Brytania i Francja wypowiedziały wojnę Niemcom. Jednak Churchill i inni brytyjscy przywódcy odrzucili wszystkie liczne oferty pokojowe Hitlera. Hitler nadal szukał sposobu na zakończenie wojny z Wielką Brytanią.
5 maja 1941 roku Hitler i Hess spotkali się na cztery godziny w Kancelarii Rzeszy – sami, bez sekretarzy i współpracowników. Po maratonie adiutant Alfred Leitgen powiedział, że obaj mężczyźni wykazali się szczególną czułością. Leitgen powiedział: „Hitler trzymał Hessa za rękę przez kilka minut. W milczeniu patrzyli sobie w oczy.” Leitgen przypomniał sobie również, że słyszał fragmenty dyskusji, takie jak dziwne sformułowanie „Żadnych problemów z samolotem” oraz nazwiska „Albrecht Haushofer” i „Hamilton”. (Źródło: Kilzer, Louis C., Churchill's Deception: The Dark Secret that Destroyed Nazi Germany: New York: Simon & Schuster, 1994, s. 275).
Chociaż zarówno Hitler, jak i Hess zaprzeczyli, że Hess poleciał do Szkocji za wiedzą i zgodą Hitlera, dostępne dowody sugerują, że Hitler wiedział i aprobował misję Hessa. Relacje między Hessem a Hitlerem były tak bliskie, że można logicznie założyć, że Hess nie podjąłby tak ważnego kroku bez uprzedniego poinformowania Hitlera. Ponadto Hessowi zakazano publicznego wypowiadania się na temat swojej misji podczas późniejszego 40-letniego okresu pozbawienia wolności w więzieniu Spandau. Ten „nakaz milczenia” został oczywiście nałożony, ponieważ Hess wiedział o rzeczach, które, gdyby zostały ujawnione publicznie, byłyby wysoce zawstydzające dla rządów aliantów. (Źródło: Hess, Wolf Rüdiger, „The Life and Death of My Father, Rudolf Hess”, The Journal of Historical Review, tom 13, nr 1, styczeń/luty 1993, s. 29, 31).
Wiele innych osób doszło do wniosku, że Hess poleciał do Szkocji za pełną wiedzą i zgodą Hitlera. Na przykład Georg Bernhard napisał w „The New York Times”: „Teraz dla wszystkich jest jasne, że Rudolf Hess poleciał do Anglii za pełną zgodą Adolfa Hitlera. Jego zadaniem było zaprowadzenie pokoju między Niemcami a Anglią”. (Źródło: Kilzer, Louis C., Churchill's Deception: The Dark Secret that Destroyed Nazi Germany, Nowy Jork: Simon & Schuster, 1994, s. 55).
Willis Carto napisał również: „Dowody są mocne, że Hess ryzykował życie dla pokoju na rozkaz Adolfa Hitlera”. (Źródło: Melaouhi, Abdallah, Rudolf Hess: His Betrayal and Murder, Washington, DC: The Barnes Review, 2013, s. 7).
Zatem nie mamy pewności, czy Hitler wiedział, że 10 maja 1941 r. Hess poleci do Szkocji, aby zaproponować Brytyjczykom plan pokojowy. Uważam jednak, że jest wysoce prawdopodobne, że Hitler zarówno wiedział, jak i akceptował ucieczkę Hessa do Szkocji.
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Sollipsistmówi:@Blodgie
To nie takie proste. Ludzie skądkolwiek mają skłonność do żądzy krwi, tak samo jak mają skłonność do strachu i konformizmu. Po prostu każde rządzące imperium opracowuje subtelne i jawne metody wzbudzania i wykorzystywania tych pragnień wśród społeczeństwa. Rzym miał swoje igrzyska, USA swoje media.
Jedynym skutecznym antidotum jest to, aby ludzie faktycznie cierpieli na wojnie, a Stany Zjednoczone nie miały wystarczającego doświadczenia w tej dziedzinie (ani się z niego nie nauczyły), z wyjątkiem krótkiej współpracy z Wietnamem lub ogólnie rzecz biorąc, w czasach zimnej wojny „kacząc i ukrywając się”.
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Truth Vigilantemówi:@the Man Behind the Curtain
Nie jestem pewien …. jeśli to prawda, co mówisz o Dunkierce.
Kriegsmarine nigdy nie kontrolowała kanału La Manche i przez całą wojnę ograniczała się do najazdów na handel, a Luftwaffe nie zapewniła sobie przewagi powietrznej nad Wielką Brytanią.
Nie jestem więc pewien, czy naprawdę mieli możliwość zatopienia floty ewakuacyjnej pod Dunkierką.Nie miało to nic wspólnego z zatopieniem floty ewakuacyjnej.
Wszystko zależało od decyzji Hitlera o zatrzymaniu nacierających formacji pancernych w krytycznym momencie i umożliwieniu ewakuacji.
Gdyby Hitler tego nie zrobił i nie pozwolił Brytyjczykom „zachować twarzy” (jak twierdzą niektórzy), Niemcy ŁATWO by ich otoczyli, zanim rozpoczęła się większa część ewakuacji i zajęli prawie całą BEF.A co do tej Twojej uwagi:
Ponadto kampania w Afryce Północnej rozpoczęła się niemal natychmiast po Dunkierce
Nie jestem pewien, o której kampanii w Afryce Północnej tu mówisz. Czy chodzi o kampanię niemiecką (pierwsze oddziały Rommla z późniejszego Korpusu Afrykańskiego przybyły do Afryki Północnej w lutym 1941 r.).
Jeśli z drugiej strony masz na myśli Operację Torch (siły anglo-amerykańskie, które wylądowały we francuskim Maroku i francuskiej Algierii), która miała miejsce w listopadzie 1942 roku.
Ewakuacja Dunkierki miała miejsce na przełomie maja i czerwca 1940 r.
Innymi słowy, oba zdarzenia miały miejsce sporo czasu po klęsce Wielkiej Brytanii pod Dunkierką.
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conatusmówi:
z artykułu:
„W niedawnym artykule John Wear zebrał liczne współczesne oceny, które wskazywały, że FDR jest kluczową postacią w organizowaniu wojny światowej poprzez jego ciągły nacisk na brytyjskie przywództwo polityczne”,Herbert Hoover, Prezydent USA w latach 1928-1932, opublikował książkę historyczną zatytułowaną „Wolność zdradzona” pięćdziesiąt lat po swojej śmierci. Nie chciał zemsty na swojej rodzinie. To, co powiedział, było sprzeczne z narracją tamtych czasów.
Herberta Hoovera s. 818 w swojej długiej historii drugiej wojny światowej „Zdradzona wolność”
„Kennedy, ambasador w Wielkiej Brytanii, powiedział Hooverowi, że FDR nieustannie lobbował, aby Wielka Brytania udzieliła Polsce gwarancji wojennej, wzmacniając w ten sposób polską determinację i powodując wciągnięcie Wielkiej Brytanii w wojnę, która doprowadziła do utraty jej imperium”. Kennedy powiedział to później Niemcy zajęli Pragę i na świecie rozległ się wielki krzyk ułagodzenia, a po tym, jak Niemcy nacisnęli swoje żądania dotyczące Gdańska i przejścia przez Korytarz, Roosevelt i Bullitt byli głównymi czynnikami, które spowodowały, że Brytyjczycy złożyli gwarancje Polsce i włączenia się w wojnę. Kennedy powiedział, że Bullitt, zgodnie z instrukcjami Roosevelta, nieustannie namawiał Polaków, aby nie zawierali stosunków z Niemcami i że on Kennedy, zgodnie z instrukcjami Roosevelta, nieustannie nalegał, aby Brytyjczycy złożyli Polakom gwarancje. Kennedy powiedział, że otrzymał telegram od Roosevelta, w którym „wbił Chamberlainowi pogrzebacz w plecy i zmusił go do wstania”. Kennedy wielokrotnie spotykał się z Chamberlainem, namawiając go w imieniu Roosevelta, aby zrobił to wszystko, sugerując, że Stany Zjednoczone udzielą Wielkiej Brytanii wsparcia. Powiedział, że po tym, jak Chamberlain udzielił tych gwarancji, Chamberlain powiedział mu (Kennedy), że ma nadzieję, że Amerykanie i Żydzi będą teraz usatysfakcjonowani, ale on (Chamberlain) czuł, że podpisał zagładę cywilizacji”.
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Hrw-500mówi:@RoboMoralFascist 1st
A także prezydent Ukrainy Zełenski został Człowiekiem Roku lub Człowiekiem Roku magazynu Time, jak wiemy teraz. Jak pewnie powiedziałby Mark Twain: „Historia się nie powtarza, ale często się rymuje”.
Swoją drogą, kolejną książką, o której warto wspomnieć, jest „The Holocaust Industry” Normana Finkelsteina, która ukazała się w 2000 roku, wątpliwe, czy wtedy ukazałaby się dzisiaj.
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No white guiltmówi:
Kiedy obejrzałem 10-częściowy dokument Europa: ostatnia bitwa i nagrania audio przemówień George'a Lincolna Rockwella, byłem przekonany, że w rzeczywistości przegraliśmy II wojnę światową, a Hitler nie był taki zły, jak nam mówiono, a ci radykalni Żydzi są źródłem całego Problemy na świecie. Ważne jest tylko, jak rozwiązać ten problem, jeśli w ogóle da się go naprawić w tym momencie.
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Patrick McNallymówi:@John Wear
> dostępne dowody sugerują, że Hitler wiedział i aprobował misję Hessa
Dzienniki Goebbelsa kategorycznie zaprzeczają twierdzeniu, że Hitler kiedykolwiek aprobował wyjazd Hessa do Wielkiej Brytanii. Gdyby to była prawda, Goebbels najprawdopodobniej słyszałby o aprobacie Hitlera. Nie zrobił. Nawet jeśli założymy, że nie powie się Goebbelsowi wszystkiego, należałoby przynajmniej zachować ostrożność ze strony Hitlera w jakichkolwiek uwagach, które kierował do Goebbelsa. Wrażenie, jakie odnotowuje Goebbels, jest takie, że Hitler był zaskoczony i rozgniewany całym wydarzeniem. Trudno sobie wyobrazić, że Hitler udawał to wszystko przed Goebbelsem.
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Rurikmówi:@Ron Unz
Dziękuję Panie Unz,
I jeśli mogę zadać pytanie uzupełniające (jeśli chcesz po prostu zgodzić się lub nie zgodzić),
Czytałem, że „cud” gospodarczy Hitlera, dzięki któremu ożywił pogrążoną w kryzysie gospodarkę i stworzył system bankowy, który uznawano za rywala lub potencjalne nawet zagrożenie dla centralnego systemu bankowego świata anglojęzycznego, był jednym z nich ( być może głównym) powodem wojny.
Tyle ile słyszałem o Złotym Dinarze Kaddafiego i dlaczego on (i dinar) zostali usunięci jako zagrożenie?
Czy w obu przypadkach jest w tym prawda?
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Kali Elmówi:
„Hamilton Fish Armstrong, redaktor „Foreign Affairs” (oficjalnego magazynu The Council on Foreign Relations) i Walter H. Mallory, dyrektor wykonawczy CFR, udali się do Departamentu Stanu, gdzie jako ochotnicy przekazali zasoby rady na „ciągłe badanie przebiegu wojny i jej skutków dla Stanów Zjednoczonych pod względem politycznym, gospodarczym, geograficznym oraz w kwestiach bezpieczeństwa i uzbrojenia”. Radzili, że w konflikcie będą brały udział Stany Zjednoczone, a wcześniejsze przygotowania są niezbędne nie tylko pod względem militarnym, ale także z punktu widzenia szerszych celów polityki zagranicznej. Wojna stworzyła w rzeczywistości „wielką szansę” dla Stanów Zjednoczonych, aby wyłonić się jako „największa potęga na świecie”. Zastępca sekretarza stanu George Messersmith, który sam był członkiem rady, okazał się entuzjastyczny i jeszcze tego samego dnia uzyskał akceptację planu”.
Z: Imperium Amerykańskie: Geograf Roosevelta i preludium do globalizacji autorstwa Neila Smitha
Przed II wojną światową różne amerykańskie elity biznesowe poczyniły znaczne inwestycje w niemiecką industrializację po dewastacji niemieckiej gospodarki po I wojnie światowej. Inwestowali także dużo w ZSRR po przejęciu imperium rosyjskiego przez komunistów. Od zakończenia I wojny światowej amerykańskie elity biznesowe odegrały kluczową rolę w fenomenalnym rozwoju przemysłowym Niemiec i ZSRR, sprzedając technologię przemysłową, finanse, wiedzę specjalistyczną itp. Po rozpoczęciu II wojny światowej Anglia również uzależniła się od elit amerykańskich z powodu dewastacji ich gospodarkę od walki z Niemcami i państwami Osi.
„Jeśli zobaczymy, że Niemcy wygrywają, powinniśmy pomóc Rosji, a jeśli Rosja wygrywa, powinniśmy pomóc Niemcom i w ten sposób pozwolić im zabić jak najwięcej, chociaż w żadnym wypadku nie chcę, aby Hitler zwyciężył”.
-Prezydent Harry Truman na kilka lat przed swoją prezydenturą, 1941
Po tym, jak podczas wojny wyrządzili sobie nawzajem ogromne szkody, amerykańskim elitom biznesowym ułatwiło stworzenie i kontrolowanie całkowicie nowego systemu gospodarczego niekomunistycznego świata. Zostało to wypracowane podczas słynnych spotkań w Bretton Woods, podczas których utworzono MFW, Bank Światowy i system rezerw dolarowych pod kierownictwem amerykańskich elit biznesowych. Od do Agendy 2030 i później
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Patrick McNallymówi:@conatus
> „Kennedy, ambasador w Wielkiej Brytanii, powiedział Hooverowi, że FDR nieustannie lobbował, aby Wielka Brytania udzieliła Polsce gwarancji wojennej, wzmacniając w ten sposób polską determinację i powodując wciągnięcie Wielkiej Brytanii w wojnę, która doprowadziła do utraty jej imperium.
W najlepszym przypadku jest to bardzo mylące. Polska nigdy nie rozważała ustąpienia w sprawie Gdańska, po tym jak zobaczyła, jak Hitler najechał Czechy 15 marca 1939 r. W tej kwestii nie trzeba było hartować polskiej determinacji i jej kretyńskiej sugestii sugerującej, że Wielka Brytania mogła przekonać Polskę do zaakceptowania własnego Monachium Porozumienie po tym, jak Hitler zniszczył to z Czechosłowacją.
Ponadto Brytyjczycy nigdy nie rozważali umożliwienia Hitlerowi bieżnikowania porozumienia monachijskiego. Jedyne, co ktokolwiek był w stanie zasugerować, to to, że gdyby Roosevelt był dyktatorem na wzór Hitlera, wówczas mógłby obiecać sojusz Stanów Zjednoczonych przeciwko Hitlerowi po tym, jak ten ostatni zniweczył wszelkie porozumienia zawarte w sprawie Polski podobne do Monachium . Gdyby Roosevelt był w stanie nakłonić Stany Zjednoczone do przyłączenia się do jakiejkolwiek przyszłej wojny, to przynajmniej można sobie wyobrazić, że Chamberlain mógłby zasugerować Polakom, aby spróbowali osiągnąć porozumienie w sprawie Gdańska, podczas gdy Stany Zjednoczone są obecnie zobowiązane do wypowiedzenia wojny Niemcom, jeśli Hitler kiedykolwiek naruszył takie. Roosevelt nie mógł w ten sposób dać słowa, więc Chamberlain nie miał innego wyjścia, jak tylko złożyć własną, jednostronną deklarację poparcia dla Polski.
Udawanie, że Roosevelt w jakiś sposób zmusił do tego Chamberlaina, jest jednak rażącym wypaczeniem. Jedynym powodem, dla którego Chamberlain w ogóle zadał sobie trud wysłuchania czegokolwiek, co powiedział Roosevelt, było to, że zdawał sobie sprawę, że Hitler będzie wywierał nacisk na Polskę w sposób, który prawdopodobnie wywoła wojnę, i w takim przypadku mogłoby się przydać USA jako sojusznik. Gdyby Chamberlain szczerze wierzył, że Hitler po prostu zamierzał osiągnąć porozumienie w sprawie Gdańska, zignorowałby wszystko, co kiedykolwiek powiedział Roosevelt. Jednak od 15 marca było jasne, że Hitler miał o wiele ważniejsze cele.
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dimplesmówi:
To proste. Rosnący od czasu drugiej wojny światowej marketing Holokaustu jako najświętszego ludobójstwa w historii odzwierciedla jedynie rosnącą kontrolę jidysz nad FatMerica. Teraz, gdy FatMerica i FatAnglo są państwami niewolniczymi w języku jidysz, Holokaust stał się przede wszystkim powodem, dla którego państwa te rozpoczęły wojnę. Zapytaj kogokolwiek w dzisiejszych czasach o przyczynę II wojny światowej. Miało to powstrzymać Holokaust!
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@whataliar
Nawet nie jest to błędne, ponieważ w Żydowskim Porządku Światowym
absolutnie nic nie jest takie, jakim się wydaje ! Holokaust
nie był Holokaustem, pandemia nie pandemią.ZGADZAM SIĘ/NIE ZGADZAM SIĘ/ITP. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Ashton Cruzemówi:
Na ukrytą historię Hitlera polecam dwie wybitne książki:
Ukryty Hitler:
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Kakmówi:
Abyśmy nie zapomnieli, że przyczyną II wojny światowej była I wojna światowa, a PRAWDZIWĄ PRZYCZYNĄ I wojny światowej była ropa naftowa.
Cel I wojny światowej przez Rothschildów i ich wasali amerykańskich, brytyjskich, rosyjskich i francuskich:
1) Uniemożliwić Niemcom niezależność energetyczną dzięki ropie od Turków
2) Uniemożliwić eksport ropy naftowej oraz wzbogacić Otomanów i Niemców i uczynić ich potężnymi i potężnymi poprzez zniszczenie Imperium Osmańskiego i zajęcie Iraku oraz zrzeczenie się roszczeń islamskiego kalifatu nad Zatoką Perską
3) potęgi, o których wiedziano, że ropa znajdowała się w Zatoce Perskiej, zanim została „odkryta”
4) Utworzenie państwa Izrael zgodnie z postanowieniami deklaracji Balfoura
5) Utrzymanie globalnej dominacji anglo-żydowskiejZGADZAM SIĘ/NIE ZGADZAM SIĘ/ITP. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Tom Welshmówi:@Just another serf
Pamiętam, jak czytałem artykuł profesora historii na wiodącym amerykańskim uniwersytecie, który z niedowierzaniem wspomniał, że kiedy podczas wykładu stwierdził pewien fakt, przerwał mu student, protestując, że wydarzyło się coś zupełnie innego.
Na pytanie profesora, skąd student to wie, odpowiedź brzmiała: „tak było w filmie”.
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Chebyshevmówi:@Chebyshev
Zwolnienie przez Hitlera w latach 30. wielu Żydów z rządu i sąsiednich instytucji musiało być dla Żydów ODCZUWANE jako Shoah, ponieważ zwalniani musieliby znaleźć bardziej wymagającą fizycznie pracę, co stanowiłoby precedens dla innych krajów europejskich i Stany Zjednoczone. Przypominało to sytuację w Rosji w latach 70. i 80. XIX w., gdzie populacja żydowska eksplodowała tak bardzo ze względu na swój dobrobyt, że nie było wystarczającej liczby stanowisk umysłowych. Więc Żydzi wymyślili opowieści o strasznych pogromach, aby ułatwić żydowską migrację do Ameryki. Mogę współczuć temu, że nie chcę pracować jako rolnik lub robotnik w fabryce.
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Realistmówi:@Tom Welsh
Coś podobnego stało się z komputerami, a większość wczesnych prac projektowych wykonano w Wielkiej Brytanii. Z pewnością Stany Zjednoczone miały znacznie więcej wszelkiego rodzaju zasobów, ale Wielka Brytania miała ludzi takich jak Alan Turing. (Nawiasem mówiąc, jak dokładnie umarł Turing? Jego wyjątkowo przedwczesną śmierć w 1955 roku przypisano samobójstwu, ale nie było absolutnie żadnego powodu, aby się zabił. To prawdopodobnie tylko zbieg okoliczności, że CIA rozpoczęła swoją karierę morderstwa i zniszczenia w tym czasie po zorganizowaniu pierwszych dwóch zamachów stanu w Gwatemali i Iranie w 1953 i 1954 r.).
To interesująca myśl i nie wykluczam udziału CIA w śmierci Turinga. Ale Turing (homoseksualista) w sposób pozbawiony sumienia stanął przed wyborem między chemiczną kastracją a karą więzienia… chore, nieludzkie zachowanie wobec każdego, nie mówiąc już o tym, kto zrobił wiele, aby ocalić Wielką Brytanię. Być może wybór chemicznej kastracji był czymś więcej, niż mógł znieść.
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Franzmówi:
Dziękuję bardzo za histeryczny artykuł ARGOSY na temat wojny amerykańsko-japońskiej.
Zaczęło się dużo wcześniej. Mały klejnot w mojej kolekcji, tylko dla fanów antycznych techno-thrillerów i, o dziwo, wciąż sprzedający się na Amazon.
Nazywa się Banzai! – Japońska inwazja na Stany Zjednoczone , opublikowana po raz pierwszy w 1909 roku. Wielkim odkryciem jest to, że… atakują Stany Zjednoczone w Pearl Harbor!
Albo historia ma poczucie humoru, albo dawni szefowie Departamentu Wojny przygotowywali swoje przyszłe bezpieczeństwo. Tak czy inaczej, ciekawa i bardzo archaiczna lektura
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Brosimówi:@Agent76
Najwyraźniej Rivero i Paul nie potrafią wymienić Żyda. Zamiast tyrady o bankierach i faszystach.
Bankowość oparta na rezerwie cząstkowej, będąca podstawą prywatnych banków centralnych, jest symptomem większego problemu. Faszyzm jest reakcją na ten sam większy problem.
Ron Paul milczał, gdy władza żydowska, wykorzystując kontrolę nad bankami centralnymi, ukradła mu dwa wybory. Jednak nadal nie potrafi wskazać Żyda.
Mimo całej swojej prawości jest po prostu kolejnym cwaniakiem.
Wezmę nad sobą Andrew Anglina w każdy dzień tygodnia.
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Franzmówi:@Patrick McNally
Dzienniki Goebbelsa kategorycznie zaprzeczają twierdzeniu, że Hitler kiedykolwiek aprobował wyjazd Hessa do Wielkiej Brytanii.
No dobrze, ale czy Hitler pozwoliłby Goebbelsowi (lub właściwie komukolwiek innemu) pozostać poza kręgiem wydarzeń?
Za dużo o locie Hessa to strasznie zła historia.
Najpierw Hess, człowiek ustępujący jedynie Hitlerowi, musi ukraść samolot. Kiedy cała sprawa poszła na marne, Hitler stwierdza, że Hess oszalał – i to jest to, co Hess POWIEDZIAŁ Hitlerowi, żeby zrobił, gdyby wszystko się popsuło.
Jeszcze gorsza jest wiedza, że Hitler był światowej klasy chowającym urazę. Gdyby Hess rzeczywiście uciekł i zostawił Adolfa z torbą, pamięć o Hessa zostałaby wyśmiana przed narodem i partią, dopóki nie miałby takiej samej reputacji jak Benedict Arnold na początku Stanów Zjednoczonych.
Hitler nie tylko niewiele z tym zrobił, ale zamiast tego zadbał o to, aby rodzina Hessów otrzymała hojną emeryturę – wypisaną na pseudonim, który Hess nadał w Szkocji.
Oczywiście, że nadal możesz mieć rację. Hitler mógł mieć słabość do jednego ze swoich pierwotnych marszałków. Bardzo mało ufałbym temu, co jest napisane. Brytyjski wywiad oczyścił Hessa z niczego innego niż „zły nazista”, a niemieccy komentatorzy, w tym Goebbels, nie musieli o tym wiedzieć i po prostu papugowali oficjalną bzdurę.
Coś w locie Hessa mocno zawstydziło niektórych wysokich rangą Brytyjczyków. Nie jestem pewien co. Ale do dziś pozostaje to tematem tabu.
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@Agent76
Oto książki Lowe'a ( jeszcze żadnej nie przeczytałem , tylko przejrzałem).https://docdro.id/g38E72D
https://docdro.id/XzXM1G8
https://docdro.id/GIYiLkD
https://docdro.id/SxOIragW każdym razie – jak mogłoby być inaczej! – akceptuje powszechną holonarrację jako prawdziwą (choć może nie jest „hardkorowym shoaistą”). Niemniej jednak w jego dziełach może być więcej prawdy niż w przypadku innych „przedstawicieli” jego gildii koszernej, opartej na systemie ZOG. https://www.c-span.org/video/?455202-5/conttling-memories-world-war-ii
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Robinskimówi:
Mam pytanie: jeśli prawdziwe imię Stalina, Dzugashvilli, naprawdę oznacza syna Żyda i jeśli matki Franklina Roosevelta i Winstona Churchilla były Żydówkami, czy to oznacza, że Hitler dosłownie walczył z Żydami, czy też jest to „teoria spiskowa”?
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Canutemówi:@Rurik
Rurik…..first off, I fully agree with your line of questioning. And, yes – Gaddafi’s, gold Dinar was a serious threat to Mayer Amschel Rothschild’s maxim about, “so long as I control the currency.” If you go back through Ron’s many works, you will find occasional comments regarding his faith in central banking and the notion of debt as a basis of currency valuation. It is the one item that troubles be about his thinking and lines of investigation. I continue to give him the benefit of the doubt and accept the notion that he just hasn’t gotten that far yet. Anyone who fails to see the connection between the creation of the Federal Reserve, the Balfour Declaration and the sudden US entry into WWI, simply isn’t paying attention, or has no desire to continue down the very obvious rabbit hole.
Hitler had indeed moved away from the debt-based central bank concept and was on a new course that the Jewish bankers referred to as “barter.” The problem is of course that it worked magnificently and therefore removed Jewish control over money. Their primary move was to “purchase” the mind and actions of Winston Churchill, by which they succeeded – likely beyond their own expectations. They had long ago purchased FDR and Woodrow Wilson had been created from whole cloth.
If you have not found it yet, there is an excellent book by Richard Tedor that neatly explains what Hitler and his economic braintrust, were able to pull off between 1932 and 1938 – “Hitler’s Revolution.” Remarkably, it is still available on Amazon, though the price has doubled.• Replies: @RurikAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Wielgus says:@Realist
One of his biographers, Copeland, raises the issue of murder while suggesting that we will never know. The “therapy” had ended over a year before his death and as far as I am aware its effects were not permanent.
He had been severed from secret work (before being charged he had worked for GCHQ or its predecessor organisation) but he still had a lot of secret information in his head, which might have been a motive to kill him. It need not have been the CIA – British agencies could have killed him, if murder it was.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Anudda (very true) “holocaust” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_fire_of_Hamburg
“The fire began in Eduard Cohen’s cigar factory…”
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@Truth Vigilante
It was all about Hitler’s decision to stop his advancing Panzer formations at a critical moment and ALLOW the evacuation to occur.
I see.
Nie jestem pewien, o której kampanii w Afryce Północnej tu mówisz. Czy chodzi o kampanię niemiecką (pierwsze oddziały Rommla z późniejszego Korpusu Afrykańskiego przybyły do Afryki Północnej w lutym 1941 r.).
Pierwsi do walki rozpoczęli Włosi i Brytyjczycy. Włochy wypowiedziały wojnę Wielkiej Brytanii tydzień po Dunkierce, a następnie Wielka Brytania zaatakowała pozycje włoskie w Libii iirc. Egipt był niezwykle strategiczny dla Imperium Brytyjskiego ze względu na Kanał Sueski. Siły brytyjskie przygotowywały się do wojny w teatrze działań od jakiegoś czasu, wiedząc, że jest to luka w zabezpieczeniach, a ze względu na odległe położenie były niedostatecznie wyposażone. Autor książek dla dzieci Roald Dahl opisał te doświadczenia w jednej ze swoich książek (myślę, że nazywało się to „podróżą solo”), w której opowiadał o lataniu dwupłatowcami podczas patrolu na krótko przed wybuchem działań wojennych w kinie.
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meamjojomówi:@Fiendly Neighbourhood Terrorist
„Mój ojciec miał wielotomową brutalną encyklopedię opublikowaną około 1961 roku, zatytułowaną Księga wiedzy. Dużo z tego czytałam jako nastolatka. W artykule o II wojnie światowej nie było odniesienia do Holokaustu, w ogóle. ”
Co Twoim zdaniem o czymś świadczy, ale nie jestem pewien, co to jest i jestem pewien, że nie jestem sam.
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Patrick McNallymówi:@Franz
> Coś w locie Hessa mocno zawstydziło niektórych wysokiej rangi Brytyjczyków.
Nie bardzo. Historia Hessa była właściwie bardzo wygodna w czasie, gdy Stalin krytykował aliantów za nieuruchomienie drugiego frontu. Brytyjska propaganda propagowała historię, jakoby Hess oferował Wielkiej Brytanii pokój i wycofanie się z Europy Zachodniej w zamian za pozwolenie na pożarcie ZSRR. Wersja tej historii, która wyciekła, ukazała się w „The American Mercury” z maja 1943 r., tom 56, numer 233. Została ona opublikowana jako pro-brytyjska propaganda i miała pokazać, jak lojalnym sojusznikiem była Wielka Brytania w czasie, gdy Stalin sugerował, że Wielka Brytania po prostu czeka, żeby nakarmić zwłoki.
Wpis Goebbelsa z 14 maja 1941 roku mówi nam:
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Hess wylądował na spadochronie w Szkocji… Fuehrer na mnie czeka. Czytam listy, które pozostawił Hess… Fuehrer jest całkowicie zdruzgotany. Nic mu nie oszczędzono. Potępia Hessa w najsurowszych słowach, ale przyznaje mu pewien stopień idealizmu.
—–
— The Goebbels Diaries 1939-1941, przetłumaczone i zredagowane przez Freda Taylora, s. 363-4.Nie ma sensu, aby Hitler tak szybko odrzucił przedsięwzięcie Hessa (od pierwszej chwili, gdy Goebbels mu o tym opowiada), gdyby było to coś, na co wcześniej zgodził się z Hessem. Można by się spodziewać, że Hitler po prostu zasugeruje, aby poczekali i zobaczyli, jaki będzie wynik. Wyraźnie tego nie zrobił.
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Marshall Dillonmówi:@Tom Welsh
Amerykanie sprytnie unikali takiej krytyki. "Ludności rdzennej? Jakie ludy tubylcze?”
The very same tactic employed by the Zionists and Israelis no less.
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InnerCynic says:
The parallels between prewar WW2 and today are disturbing.
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Verymuchalive says:@Tom Welsh
I accept that the British Government allowed itself to be blackmailed by the Americans, but can’t see how any rational British statesman would have permitted it. Remaining at peace would ensure that Britain remained a Great Power for some considerable time, even if a declining one. But at least there was an opportunity to reverse that decline.
War with Germany meant a rapid decline at best or even loss of Great Power status completely. Events confirmed this view. What could the Americans do to threaten Britain. They could organise a run on Sterling and put restrictions on British-American trade. These would largely be short term, and Britain could take counter measures. Also, there would be a furious backlash from the British public, which a skillful British statesman could use to his advantage. Likewise, the strongly isolationist American public would be outraged at the Roosevelt Government’s attempt to incite Britain into war with Germany so that America could enter that war too.
At present, any documents relating to this subject are embargoed and will be for a long time. It would be depressing, but not unexpected, if Chamberlain and his Government did what they did out of fear of short term American trade sanctions. This is all too typical of British politicians who put short term financial interests before the general and long term good.
PS Turing was a mathematician, not a computer scientist and had nothing to do with it. The guy you should respect for the early British computer industry is Prof Tom Kilburn.
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Canute says:@meamjojo
What it proves is that the Britannica publishing house had not yet been purchased by a group of Jewish investors.
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@Kak
Lest we forget that the cause of WW2 was WW1 and the REAL CAUSE of WW1 was OIL. The purpose of WW1 by the Rothschilds and their American, British, Russian, and French vassals…
What is the oil of the future? The mineral components that go into producing and powering EV’s and other battery reliant technology. The mineral components of semiconductors.
To właśnie na tym teraz skupiają się świry, oprócz utrzymywania monopolu walutowego bankstera Ponzi.
Należy poszerzyć listę grzechów głównych: pycha, IGNORANCJA, chciwość, obżarstwo, lenistwo, gniew, próżność, zazdrość, żądza, rozwiązłość. ŚWINIE WVELL. Nigdy więcej religijnego samozadowolenia zrodzonego z ignorancji. Zawsze bądź o krok przed Kike'em.
A gniew nie jest gniewem, jeśli Kike zasługuje na to, co nadchodzi. To sprawiedliwość.
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Brosimówi:@Carlton Meyer
Dziękuję za ten wspaniały i pouczający film, panie Meyer. Twój następny film o Operacji Torch jest prawie tak samo potępiający. Dziękuję i za to….
Nigdy nie zgadzałem się z Ronem Unzem w sprawie Operacji Pike i w przeszłości twierdziłem, że był to zwód. Ten film dodaje wiarygodności mojemu stanowisku.
Perfidna Anglia oszukała cara, aby zmobilizował i rozpoczął I wojnę światową w oparciu o obietnicę złożoną w Konstantynopolu. Bitwa pod Gallipoli była podobnym wyczynem perfidnej Anglii, mającym na celu przekonanie cara, że anglo-syjoniści nie oszukują go i naprawdę zamierzają dotrzymać swoich zobowiązań wynikających z potrójnej Ententy, aby pomóc Rosji w podboju Bosforu.
Francja i Anglia udzieliły Polsce w 1939 r. takich samych gwarancji, jakie udzieliły Ukrainie w 2022 r. Francja nawet najechała Niemcy we wrześniu 1939 r., ale potem stchórzyła. Armia niemiecka była całkowicie zaangażowana w inwazję na Polskę, a Francja mogła z łatwością wkroczyć do Zagłębia Ruhry, uzasadniając to tym, że zdemilitaryzowany obszar Renu był obowiązkiem Wersalu. Jednak Francja stchórzyła.
Tak jak anglosyjoniści machali lizakiem Konstantynopola, aby wciągnąć Rosję w swoją I wojnę światową dla Izraela, tak najwyraźniej machali obietnicą odcięcia rosyjskiej ropy Niemcom i dostępu do niej we francuskiej kolonii w Syrii, aby nakłonić Francję do przeznaczenia na Dalekim Wschodzie niezbędnych zasobów, które byłyby niezwykle potrzebne dla obrony Francji.
W maju 1940 roku armia niemiecka wkroczyła do Francji, a brytyjskie siły ekspedycyjne upadły w kierunku Dunkierki bez zapowiedzi, niszcząc lewą flankę i pozostawiając całą armię francuską nagą i bezbronną. Śmiem twierdzić, że to wszystko było zaplanowane. Twój film dodaje amunicji do mojej pozycji.
Głównym celem wojny anglosyjonistycznej podczas II wojny światowej było utworzenie Izraela. Francja kontrolowała Syrię i Liban i nigdy nie pozwoliłaby na coś takiego. Poza tym anglosyjoniści również walczyli w I wojnie światowej, aby zniszczyć konkurencję imperiów niemieckiego, rosyjskiego, austriackiego i tureckiego. Pozostało jedynie Cesarstwo Francuskie.
Pan Meyer wyjaśnia, w jaki sposób francuskie statki chroniły Brytyjczyków podczas wycofywania się z Dunkierki. USA nie brały jeszcze udziału w wojnie. Ale gdy tylko Francuzi się poddali, perfidna Anglia zwróciła się przeciwko francuskiej marynarce wojennej. Następne były polskie i francuskie rezerwy złota, które znajdowały się w Dakarze. Oczywiście nawet dzisiaj Żydzi i Anglicy uwielbiają gadać o tym, że Niemcy zabrali czeskie złoto, które Żydzi zrabowali Austrii po Wersalu. Jednak żaden Anglik nie wspomni, jak Anglia chciała zrabować polskie i francuskie złoto z Dakaru. Dziękuję panu Meyerowi za ujawnienie tego istotnego faktu.
Twój film omawia także, jak Holandia i USA nałożyły embargo na Japonię, ponieważ Francja zgodziła się współpracować z Japończykami w Wietnamie. Koło się zamyka. Japonia współpracowała z Vichy, więc oba musiały zostać zniszczone.
W twoim filmie wspomina się także, jak Churchill odebrał Francuzom Madagaskar, dokąd Hitler chciał wysłać Żydów. Madagaskar nie miał znaczenia strategicznego, a te angielskie siły morskie były rozpaczliwie potrzebne do obrony Hongkongu i Singapuru. Nie było żadnego motywu strategicznego, chyba że zda się sobie sprawę, że Hitler chciał wysłać Żydów na Madagaskar. Nagle staje się jasne, że odbierając Madagaskar Francuzom, anglo-syjoniści torowali drogę całej narracji o Holofraudzie. Wszystko to zostało zaplanowane zanim anglo-syjoniści rozpoczęli wojnę.
Jeszcze raz dziękuję, panie Meyer.
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Agent76mówi:@Brosi
Najwyraźniej nie czytałeś go ani nie śledziłeś go, tak jak ja, mieszkający pod koniec lat 80. w Teksasie.
Wszystkie przewidywania Rona Paula na rok 2002 się spełniły – niesamowite wideo!
Ten film to słynne przemówienie Rona Paula z 24 kwietnia 2002 r., w którym przedstawia on serię przepowiedni, zestawione z rzeczywistymi nagłówkami wiadomości z lat późniejszych, które potwierdzają, że wszystkie jego przewidywania się sprawdziły.
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HbutnotGmówi:@Just another serf
Wiem dokładnie o czym mówisz. (i mam dobrą pamięć do dawnych wydarzeń – jak słoń)
W programie nauczania w mojej szkole publicznej tylko jeden rok (dwa semestry, 9. klasa) był zatytułowany „Historia świata”. W ciągu ostatnich 2 lat ('63 – '65) nastąpiła (muszę powiedzieć tajemnicza, ale nigdy nie kwestionowana) rotacja wielu nauczycieli w tym Jr High. Nauczyciele, wielu pracujących tam od ponad 12 lat, nagle zniknęli.
A więc „Historia świata” w 9. klasie wyglądała tak (i, kochanie, wymieniam nazwiska!):
WH I: Pan Baskerville: Mały Murzyn, który kiedy nie spał przy biurku, był na zewnątrz wrogo nastawiony do chłopców. Rzeczywiste nauczanie historii? Pamiętam, że mniej niż tydzień. Dotarłem może do strony 15 tej książki historycznej (coś o starożytnym Egipcie). Przespałem resztę semestru; kiedy nie śpię, po prostu dyscyplinuję białych chłopców – Nauczono prawie zero. Wartość rozrywkowa dla 14-latków była dość wysoka.
WH II (następnej jesieni; była to połowa klasy [druga połowa dziewiątej klasy] składająca się głównie z dzieciaków, które oblały tę naukę i kilkorga (tak jak ja), które dostały do niej podwójny awans, reszta to po prostu zimowe dzieci, które, w tym okręgu szkolnym rozpoczął działalność kinniegarden pod koniec stycznia)): pan Boyter. około 40-latka, ubrana w klasyczny garnitur i krawat w stylu Carnaby, mieszkająca w nowych Lafayette Towers [wskazówka, podpowiedź] często niezdolna do utrzymania porządku w tej klasie, pamiętam tylko 2 rzeczy (żadna z nich nie dotyczyła nauczania historii świata, chociaż czasami wydaje mi się, że rzeczywiście próbował): 1) Johna Kroteca nazwano na głos „lachociągiem” przez nikogo innego jak Lindę Flaherty. Pan Boyter był wyraźnie zdenerwowany, a jego głos drżał, gdy udzielał reprymendy za to okropne zachowanie; 2) pod koniec tego semestru ogłosił, że czterech uczniów, których zabierze na lunch ze względu na ich najlepsze wyniki w klasie – w oparciu o to, czego nie mogę sobie wyobrazić – poza jedną rzeczą: co najmniej trzech z nich to chłopcy wystawiający najbardziej „rozwój tam na dole”, o czym świadczy fakt, że nosili stosunkowo obcisłe spodnie i najwyraźniej bokserki [lol], coś, co rozpoznaliśmy tylko ja i pan Boyter (3% – ers).
Nauczyłem się zerowej historii świata przez 12 lat szkoły publicznej, to była połowa lat 50. i koniec lat 60., powinieneś zdać sobie sprawę.
W ówczesnych starych gazetach natknąłem się na coś jeszcze: dyrektor (do 1962 r. – pan Hartung) był wizytówką komunisty – o czym wspomniano w jego nekrologu. Niektóre dzieci twierdziły, że są ast. dyrektorze, panna Jungwirth była facetem w dragach. Nie wiem – nie mogę za to ręczyć. Ale patrząc wstecz, nie byłoby to dla mnie zaskoczeniem.
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Joe Levantinemówi:@Ron Unz
Według Eustace’a Mullinsa PTB podżegała do I wojny światowej od 1895 r., ale zadbała o jej wdrożenie w 1914 r., zaraz po ponownym utworzeniu Rezerwy Federalnej, co umożliwiło Stanom Zjednoczonym finansowanie handlu między walczącymi stronami, a później przyłączenie się do wojny poprzez dekret. pieniądze.
Nie trzeba ekonomisty, aby zauważyć, że lichwa na wielką skalę wymaga finansowania dużych deficytów budżetowych, a wojny okazały się największym źródłem deficytów i inflacji. Fortunę Rothschildów można przypisać przede wszystkim temu, że przez stulecia finansowali oni wszelkiego rodzaju konflikty międzyeuropejskie.
Na marginesie: Powell zaczął podnosić stopy procentowe nie wtedy, gdy inflacja podniosła swoją okropną głowę w związku z kryzysem Covid-19 i towarzyszącym mu spadkiem produktywności w połączeniu z darmowymi pieniędzmi dla zamkniętych osób, ale kiedy na Ukrainie rozpoczęła się wojna między NATO a Rosją, bo wiedział o tym wojny oznaczają inflację.
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Agent76mówi:@Munga Bulga
Tutaj zaczynam od Wojen Światowych. 12 KWIETNIA 2017 I WOJNA ŚWIATOWA I KARTA PRAW
Historians talked about American motivations for entering World War I, how the country mobilized for war, and government restrictions on free speech and the press in response to protests.
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@Patrick McNally
Here, and in comment #82, you’re so full of crap its oozing out of your ears. But don’t expect me to engage with an a-hole like you. I just needed to say something stronger than “Disagree.”
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Arthur MacBride says:@John Wear
Melaouhi, Abdallah, Rudolf Hess: His Betrayal and Murder, Washington, D.C.: The Barnes Review, 2013, p. 7).
Thank you John for reference to Abdallah Melahoui, Rudolf Hess’s Tunisian nurse in Spandau. I purchased Melahoui’s book when it came out and can recommend it strongly, not least for his day to day account of caring for his Spandau patient.
Melahoui’s care throws into sharp focus the gross inhumanity of the “victorious” allies who imprisoned a man for 46 years who risked his life for peace.
Alas, dealing with the British govt.
Adolf Hitler also thought they were trustworthy.There is evidence that the probable murderer of Rudolf Hess (at age 93) was the American “soldier” Tony Jordan. Maybe he got a medal for doing it.
A British guard at Spandau, Steven Timson, attempted to extort 5000.000 deutschmarks from Hess’s son Wolf-Rüdiger for personal items of his father that he Timson had stolen.
https://jailingopinions.com/realhistory/2022/07/06/solving-the-murder-of-rudolf-hess/
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Arthur MacBride says:@Arthur MacBride
JFYI
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Ron Unz says:@ricpic
I listened to the whole Ron Unz discourse on how bass akwards the official history of WW II is. But he never addressed Operation Barbarossa. Who FORCED Hitler to attack the Soviet Union? No one.
Look. Over the last few years I’ve published over 100,000 words of articles on World War II and couldn’t possibly squeeze everything into this particular interview, especially since none of Mike Whitney’s questions dealt with that particular topic.
If you’re interested in my full analysis, just read my other articles:
https://www.unz.com/page/world-war-ii-articles/
And this one from 2018 addresses the exact issue you raised:
https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-when-stalin-almost-conquered-europe/
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Joe Levantine says:@Rurik
“ Germany’s unforgivable crime before WW2 was its attempt to loosen its economy out of the world trade system and to build up an independent exchange system from which the world-finance couldn’t profit anymore.”
Winston Churchill
Little did Winston realise that he was the PTB’s useful idiot.
We are told to follow the money trail. But I do believe that the World Wars had more than money as a motive. From Adam Weishaupt’s declaration of the the illuminati protocol on May 1st 1776, the PTB has been fomenting wars and revolutions leading the world on the progressive trail of the One World Government. Notice that only the English revolution, that opened the gates of England to the Jewish financiers of Holland and the establishment of the Bank of England, preceded the date of 1776, which was followed by the American, the French and the Bolshevik revolutions which largely did away with the old monarchist order in favour of the corrupt republics and the Left/Right paradigm that allows the puppet masters to pull the strings from the shadow under the veneer of a “democratic” vote. Napoleon stemmed the French Revolution by reimposing a strong state, but fell out of grace with the Freemasons who revoked his membership in 1809. After that date, Napoleon has been on a downward path, from the failed continental trade boycott of the UK, to the Russian invasion all the way to Waterloo.
Now that the PTB is in almost total control of money, soon to be in full control through CBDC, they are pursuing far more ambitious projects like transhumanism with the beehive as their model. Covid was their opening salvo towards their 2030 agenda.
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Steve Naidamast says:@Peter Akuleyev
Adolf Hitler and his lieutenants tried every negotiation tactic they could think of with Poland to reach a negotiated settlement to stop the Polish from violently oppressing their German minority and return Danzig to The Reich.
These negotiations went on for around 18 months with German concessions that were quite extraordinary but the Poles would not budge.
And Poland was as much anti-German at the time as it was anti-Russian. It was Marshal Pilsudski who kept the Polish state neutral towards both Germany and Russia. But when he died in 1935 the delusional Polish leadership once again had a free hand to recreate their 17th century fantasy of a Polish Empire and began provoking both Germany and Russia with Germany getting the worst of it.
I would suggest you read some in depth history before spouting off such righteous nonsense…
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Ron Unz says:@Patrick McNally
I wouldn’t pay any attention to “Patrick McNally.” He’s a notorious fraud who hangs around this website, regularly making absurd claims such as that few of the early Bolshevik leaders were Jewish.
But everyone knows that the most powerful Bolshevik leaders after Lenin were Trotsky, Sverdlov, Zinoviev, Kamenev, Stalin, and Bukharin, perhaps roughly in that order. The first four out of six in that list were Jewish, while Lenin himself was part Jewish. Indeed, Putin has publicly stated that roughly 80-85% of the early Bolshevik leadership was Jewish, which is probably only a slight exaggeration.
People who go around claiming that 2+2=17 don’t attract a lot of credibility on more complex matters.
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Emil Nikola Richard says:@conatus
Kennedy, the Ambassador to Great Britain, told Hoover that FDR lobbied incessantly for Britain to give a war guarantee to Poland, thus steeling the Polish resolve and causing Britain to be drawn into a war that would lose its Empire.
The British Empire was doomed in 1918 when the survivor colonial troops got home and let everybody know how stupid the British were. They believed in white supremacy until they saw officers on the battlefield leading attacks against entrenched fortifications. It was like their fairy godmother removed an evil witch’s curse.
Not that Roosevelt was not a snake but Hoover has that part totally goofed up.
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Tom Welsh says:@Realist
Reasonable, Realist. I have read a bit about the circumstances, and Turing – who was a tough-minded individualist – laughed off the treatment, boasting about his well-developed new breasts. Moreover, at the time he died he was involved in at least one important new line of research, and had a meeting with a graduate student the morning his body was found.
Reading between the lines of his biographies, one sees a quintessential maverick – who, as a schoolboy, made a point of paying little attention during classes and then getting top marks in the exams. He was seen as a “boffin”, a strange exotic person who was at home with mathematical and technical complexities that most people could not begin to grasp.
Two anecdotes that cast much light on his mind:
“His high pitched voice already stood out above the general murmur of well-behaved junior executives grooming themselves for promotion within the Bell corporation. Then he was suddenly heard to say: ‘No, I’m not interested in developing a powerful brain. All I’m after is just a mediocre brain, something like the President of the American Telephone and Telegraph Company.’” (In the Bell Labs cafeteria, New York, 1943).
– Alan Hodges (Alan Turing: the Enigma of Intelligence, page 251).‘Turing was thoroughly dismissive of the EDSAC. He wrote: “The ‘code’ which he [Wilkes] suggests is however very contrary to the line of development here, and much more in the American tradition of solving one’s difficulties by means of much equipment rather than by thought”’.
– David Leavitt “The Man Who Knew Too Much: Alan Turing and the Invention of the Computer”The British authorities, and no doubt even more so the security people, were worried about him: a known open homosexual who knew secrets that virtually no one else was cleared for (because he had invented them). A man who scoffed at authority, who cut his own trail. What if the Soviets should somehow wheedle secrets out of him?
I doubt if the British would have gone so far as to murder Turing. But the new-born CIA, already feeling its strength and seeing how far it could go? Largely made up of bankers, lawyers and other spoiled rich men longing to try on the role of James Bond? They would have just adored the idea of a faked suicide by cyanide. The apple would have been the cherry on top.
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Arthur MacBride says:@Arthur MacBride
A British guard at Spandau, Steven Timson, attempted to extort 5000.000 deutschmarks from Hess’s son Wolf-Rüdiger for personal items of his father that he Timson had stolen.
Apologies for typo.
Attempted extortion by Timson was for 500,000 dm.
There is an explanation in the link as to how far the British Army investigation went.
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Dr. Rock says:@Ron Unz
@Ron Unz
I don’t recall having seen it, so I apologize if you have, but would you consider a classic “Ron Unz style deep dive” of the concept that “Abraham Lincoln was actually a traitor to America”?
Along with many other historical fallacies you have illuminated, I’d love to see you examine the real Lincoln, since he’s another “revered icon” with an arguable totally false narrative surrounding his supposed greatness.
Cheers!
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Tom Welsh says:@Verymuchalive
“Turing was a mathematician, not a computer scientist and had nothing to do with it”.
Oh dear.
‘Between 1945 and 1947, Turing lived in Hampton, London, while he worked on the design of the ACE (Automatic Computing Engine) at the National Physical Laboratory (NPL). He presented a paper on 19 February 1946, which was the first detailed design of a stored-program computer. Von Neumann’s incomplete First Draft of a Report on the EDVAC had predated Turing’s paper, but it was much less detailed and, according to John R. Womersley, Superintendent of the NPL Mathematics Division, it “contains a number of ideas which are Dr. Turing’s own”‘.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_TuringTen opis ledwo zarysowuje powierzchnię. Jak prawdziwy geniusz, Turing zignorował bariery klasowe istniejące między naukowcami a robotnikami, matematykami i elektrykami. Zgorszył establishment uniwersytecki, ponieważ po napisaniu bardzo szczegółowego projektu faktycznie działającego komputera, zakasał rękawy, wziął lutownicę i pomógł ją zbudować.
Jeśli kogokolwiek można było określić mianem „matematyka, a nie informatyka”, był to John von Neumann.
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Guciamówi:@Patrick McNally
Według mnie pan Unz podąża za zachodnią geopolityką i mentalnością.
To jest źle.
spróbuj przeczytać, co to znaczy DRANG NACH OSTEN,https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drang_nach_Osten
TYLKO JEDNA STRONA, A DUŻO SIĘ DOWIESZ
zapomnij o miłym Hitlerze i miłych Krzyżakach.
zabij wszystkich niewolników, zdobądź więcej Lebensraum dla Niemców.
W Warszawie po wojnie ludzie mieszkają w ruinach zrobionych przez Niemców, a w Warszawie nie było rosyjskiej UNRA. Głód był taki sam, a może i gorszy niż w Berlinie.
mam nadzieję, że jakoś to zrozumiałeś.ZGADZAM SIĘ/NIE ZGADZAM SIĘ/ITP. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
anarchystmówi:@Emil Nikola Richard
Jest więcej. „ Deklaracja Balfoura” była nielegalnym „zawłaszczeniem ziemi”, na które Wielka Brytania zgodziła się w zamian za finansowanie I wojny światowej przez Rothschildów (żydów). Sfinalizowanie „umowy” wymagało kolejnej wojny światowej.
Rdzenna ludność (Palestyńczycy) nie miała w tej sprawie nic do powiedzenia. Rezultatem była ludobójcza „Nakba” (która trwa do dziś), wyrzucenie Palestyńczyków z ich ziemi.
Warto zauważyć, że zanim powstało (nielegalne) „państwo” Izrael, nie mieliśmy wrogów na Bliskim Wschodzie.
Wiedz, że Izrael=nie ma pokoju…
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Brosimówi:@Agent76
Ron Paul nigdy nie wymienia Żyda w tym filmie. Mówi trochę o ofiarach żydowskiej żądzy zemsty (Palestyńczykach) i raz wspomina Izrael, ale w połączeniu z USA, w związku z czym w równym stopniu zrzuca winę na Amerykanów, jak i na Hebrajczyków.
Podobnie jak jego syn Rand Paul, Ron Paul nigdy bezpośrednio nie zwracał się bezpośrednio do władzy żydowskiej. Dlatego nazywam go kretynem. Twierdzi, że jest wielkim patriotą, ale przez dziesięciolecia obserwował, jak Żydzi psują kraj i konstytucję, którą, jak twierdzi, kocha. To jest definicja kucyka.
W 2008 roku powiedziałam mojej siostrzenicy z pokolenia X i jej mężowi, że Ron Paul jest ostatnią nadzieją dla Stanów Zjednoczonych, a oni mnie wyśmiali. Byli całkowicie odurzeni Obamą. W takim razie podtrzymuję swoją wypowiedź. Ale spójrzmy prawdzie w oczy, Ron Paul, choć był odważny, nie miał odwagi ani moralności Adolfa Hitlera. Nawet gdyby Ron Paul wygrał wybory w 2008 lub 2012 r., Żydzi albo zmusiliby go do ustąpienia, albo wyeliminowaliby go, tak jak to zrobili JFK.
Dopiero Hitler wyzwolił Niemcy spod Weimaru. Niestety nawet Hitlerowi nie udało się uwolnić planety od synogogi szatana.
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Rurikmówi:@Canute
. Nadal daję mu korzyść w postaci wątpliwości
Tak, dziękuję Kanucie, czuję to samo.
Nie lubię zbyt często i zbyt często wystawiać na próbę hojność pana Unza. Po prostu doszedłem do wniosku, że biorąc pod uwagę jego szerokie i rosnące zrozumienie takich kwestii, warto o to zapytać.
Każdy, kto nie widzi związku pomiędzy utworzeniem Rezerwy Federalnej, Deklaracją Balfoura i nagłym przystąpieniem USA do I wojny światowej
Zwykle się z tym zgadzam, podobnie jak oczywiste interesy ZOG w zabezpieczeniu Palestyny, zniszczeniu carskiej Rosji, stworzeniu podatku dochodowego, ułatwieniu roli Trockiego w Rosji i tak dalej. Wydaje mi się, że wszystkie one są ze sobą powiązane, podobnie jak nadejście II wojny światowej, zniszczenie Niemiec i narzucenie bolszewickich, sowieckich rządów na większości Europy. Nie wszystko to jest produktem intrygi syjonistycznej, ale moim zdaniem wystarczające, aby było niezwykłe.
Staram się dostrzegać trendy i to, co widzę dzisiaj na Ukrainie, wydaje mi się niesamowicie podobne do tego, co działo się wtedy. Skorumpowane rządy Zachodu organizują wojny z opornymi rządami, które uważa się za niewystarczająco służalcze wobec „Porządku opartego na zasadach”. I potencjalnie (wtedy Niemcy, teraz Rosja) zagrażając systemowi bankowości centralnej, który jest źródłem całej ich nikczemnej władzy.
znowu deja vu..
Jeśli dzieje się to teraz z Anglią i Stanami Zjednoczonymi, tak samo jak miało to miejsce z Anglią podczas wojny burskiej na początku XX wieku, dlaczego wydarzenia z połowy XX wieku miałyby być anomalią w stosunku do szablonu – wcześniej i Po?
Oczywiście nie tak działa stypendium, za co jestem wdzięczny panu Unzowi i Johnowi Wearowi oraz innym osobom, takim jak pan.
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@Ron Unz
Krytykujesz Buchanana…
Być może najbardziej oczywistą z nich jest kwestia prawdziwych początków wojny…
Chociaż Buchanan nie wyjaśnia, dlaczego Wielka Brytania przystąpiła do wojny i nie ma o tym pojęcia, nie sądzę, żeby ktokolwiek rzucił na to jakiekolwiek światło. Miałem nadzieję, że Quigley to zrobi, ale… nie mógłbym tego znaleźć, gdyby tak było. Myślę, że Buchanan świetnie opisuje wydarzenia z roku poprzedzającego wojnę, z cytatami wielu graczy. Jedyną osobą, która daje pewien wgląd w to, co naprawdę działo się w brytyjskiej klasie rządzącej, jest….. W. Lewis. Planowali to z wieloletnim wyprzedzeniem. I nazwał to wiele lat wcześniej. Tak jak Mearsheimer opisuje, jak Stany Zjednoczone od lat manewrowały ku wojnie z Rosją.
Wyndham Lewis był po prostu dość ekscentrycznym brytyjskim pisarzem i malarzem. Ponieważ zdarzało mu się mówić rzeczy, z którymi się zgadzasz, powołujesz się na niego jako na ogromny autorytet.
Nie cytuję go jako autorytetu, cytuję go jako jasnowidza. Napisał to w 1936 roku! I miał rację.
Czy zdawałeś sobie z tego sprawę?
To, co napisał Lewis, jest całkowicie wyjątkowe w literaturze przedwojennej AFAIK, czy też literaturze powojennej.
Jestem jednak pewien, że mógłbym znaleźć brytyjskich pisarzy i malarzy z tej samej epoki, którzy byliby równie ekscentryczni i twierdzili coś zupełnie przeciwnego.
Świetny Scott! Nie trzeba ograniczać się do ekscentryków i malarzy, każdy znany historyk od 70 lat twierdzi dokładnie coś przeciwnego – Hitler był szaleńcem nastawionym na podbój świata.
Twój „szacunek” dla historiografii akademickiej jest absurdalny. Historycy akademiccy zajmujący się kwestią mężczyzny/kobiety propagowali największe oszustwo, jakie świat widział od 70 lat, i wszystko inne na temat II wojny światowej również było błędne. Ten całostronicowy obraz pochodzi z podręcznika historii McGraw-Hill, który uczęszczał do 11. klasy mojego dziecka, „Tradycje i spotkania”… dokładnie sprawdzonego przez historyków akademickich…
https://ibb.co/WPQLfgx
Użyj obrazu Google, aby go poszukać, nie znajdziesz go. Musiałem to sam opublikować.Lewis jest mądry, więc to, co napisał, jest mądre, ale w tekście jest wiele obserwacji faktycznych. Nawet się do nich nie przyznałeś, zamiast tego osobiście zaatakowałeś Lewisa, myśląc, że nazywając go ekscentrykiem, załatwiłeś sprawę.
To standardowa taktyka …….
CY – co Barnes powiedział o mistyfikacji?
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Brosimówi:
Pan Unz kilka razy wspomina (lub cytuje innych), że w latach 1945-1948 Niemcy otrzymywali w racjach żywnościowych tę samą ilość kalorii, co internowani w obozach „koncentracyjnych”.
Pan Unz wspomina także, jak bardzo Hitler szanował Anglię i Anglików.
Jednym z aspektów, na który zwraca uwagę niewielu rewizjonistów, jest to, że zmieniają się ludzie, społeczeństwo i moralność. Mein Kampf powstał w 1923 roku, po puczu w Beer Hall, kiedy Hitler był jeszcze młodym mężczyzną.
Wielu czytelników tego wątku, podobnie jak ja, prawdopodobnie wierzyło, że Arabowie zaatakowali USA 11 września 2001 roku i że Oswald zamordował Kennedy'ego. Założę się, że większość czytelników już w to nie wierzy.
Twierdzę, że Hitler miał 3 fazy w swoim światopoglądzie po I wojnie światowej. Jego skrajna gorycz wobec Wersalu, sojuszników i Słowian trwała prawdopodobnie od 1923 r. do zdobycia władzy w 1933 r. W latach 1933-1941 był wielkim mężem stanu działającym dla dobra niemieckiego Volku. W latach 1942-1945 desperacko próbował uniemożliwić władzy żydowskiej realizację planów Kaufmana/Morgentau/Hootena.
Podobnie w okresie poprzedzającym wojnę internowani i obozy pracy/reedukacji z pewnością mieli racje żywnościowe znacznie przewyższające te, które nałożyli Morgentau i Eisenhower podczas denazyfikacji.
Każdy, kto spogląda wstecz na osiągnięcia Hitlera, musi zrozumieć, że po 1941 r. judeo-bolszewicy odmówili honorowania Konwencji Genewskiej i nie tylko torturowali niemieckich żołnierzy i dopuszczali się przeciwko nim aktów terroryzmu, ale także terroryzowali Rosjan pod rozkazami Stalina Pochodników i byli potem zwalił winę na Niemców. Churchill i Roosevelt aktywnie bombardowali cywilów tysiącami. Hitler wiedział, że jeśli przegra, niemiecki Volk stanie w obliczu żydowskich kłamstw w Norymberdze i Armii Czerwonej Gwałcicieli.
Ocenę warunków w niemieckich obozach pracy należy oceniać mniej surowo niż warunki w obozach Gułag i obozach Rhine Meadows. W tym świetle niemieckie traktowanie więźniów w Auschwitz i innych obozach koncentracyjnych było znacznie mniej zbrodnicze i bardziej uzasadnione niż traktowanie przez Sowietów więźniów w Gułagu i traktowanie przez USA więźniów w obozach Rhine Meadows.
Co ważniejsze dla potomności, Hitler był znacznie mniejszym zbrodniarzem wojennym niż Roosevelt, Stalin czy Churchill.
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RockaBoatusmówi:@bert33
„Hitler był kupą gówna, podobnie jak jego nazistowscy bandyci w brązowych koszulach” – co za niewiarygodnie głupie stwierdzenie. Naprawdę powinieneś zadać sobie pytanie, jaki rodzaj pasożytniczych ludzi spowodował powstanie człowieka takiego jak Hitler, który był w rzeczywistości całkiem przyzwoitym człowiekiem, którego prawdziwymi intencjami było odwrócenie całkowicie niesprawiedliwych narzuceń Traktatu Wersalskiego.
Ponadto, gdybyś miał choć odrobinę obiektywizmu, zdałbyś sobie sprawę, że powszechnie akceptowany wizerunek Hitlera został rażąco zniekształcony. To wszystko jest częścią propagandy żydowskiej i alianckiej. Dla mniej emocjonalnej i zrównoważonej perspektywy polecam pracę historyka wojskowości RHS Stolfiego w jego książce Hitler: Beyond Evil and Tyranny. Ale oczywiście przeczytanie takiej książki wymaga otwartego umysłu i chęci ponownego przemyślenia swoich założeń na temat tego najbardziej oczernianego człowieka.
Te „Brązowe Koszule” były bezpośrednim skutkiem działania grup żydowsko-komunistycznych, które uniemożliwiały narodowym socjalistom organizowanie spotkań, podobnie jak robią to dzisiaj kierowane przez Żydów grupy Antify.
Tak, wojna się skończyła. Jednak skutki tej niepotrzebnej wojny są nadal odczuwalne. W wyniku zniszczenia Hitlera i Niemiec powstał zdominowany przez Żydów Zachód, co było złe dla nas wszystkich. Dzisiejsze Niemcy to wykorzeniony i całkowicie przeklęty kraj rządzony przez takich ludzi jak Merkel i jej podobni.
Neonaziści to najmniejszy z twoich problemów. To samo można powiedzieć o grupach takich jak KKK. Większym problemem są Żydzi i mniejszości, których użyli przeciwko białym.
Prawdą jest, że istnieją uzasadnione powody, aby wierzyć, że gdyby Hitler i narodowi socjaliści zwyciężyli nad aliantami, nie byłoby Globo-Homo, obchodów gejów i trannie, nie byłoby potrzeby stosowania blokad dojrzewania dla małych dzieci, parad gejów, masowa imigracja z Trzeciego Świata na Zachód i wszystkie inne perwersje, które sprowadzili do nas wywrotowi Żydzi.
Kiedy zniszczyliśmy Hitlera i jego naród, zniszczyliśmy siebie. Większość ludzi jest zbyt głupia, żeby to zrozumieć.
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Joe Wongmówi:@Unz Fan guy
Wojny Światowe to nic innego jak brutalna zabawa polegająca na zjadaniu psów i walce z monopolem na plądrowanie reszty świata. Zachód twierdził, że w wojnach światowych chodziło o wolność, która nie jest niczym innym jak kłamstwami mającymi na celu ukrycie niewybaczalnych niegodziwych zbrodni wojennych, zbrodni przeciwko ludzkości i zbrodni przeciwko pokojowi.
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Deadbeatmówi:@Unz Fan guy
Może to być prawdą w przypadku tych dwóch darczyńców, ale większość pieniędzy zebranych przez NSDAP pochodziła od niemieckich przemysłowców i niemieckiej oddolnej klasy robotniczej.
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gay trollmówi:@Robinski
Hitler nie był tak naprawdę imieniem jego ojca. Ojcem Adolfa był bękart imieniem Alois Shiklgruber. Dziadek Adolfa był nieznany. Jednak Fritz Thyssen twierdził, że babcia Hitlera zaszła w ciążę z jego ojcem podczas pracy dla Rothschilda w Wiedniu.
Jeśli nie zauważyłeś, naziści byli syjonistami, a teraz syjoniści są nazistami.
Hitler zniszczył Niemcy dla Izraela.
To jest prawdziwy holokaust.
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Rurikmówi:@Joe Levantine
Dużo do wyjaśnienia w tym komentarzu, Joe.
Zgadzam się, nie chodzi i nie chodziło wyłącznie o pieniądze. Pieniądze są oczywiście ich narzędziem, władza ich celem, a ostatecznie ich ostatecznym celem jest darwinowski triumf nad resztą z nas.
Mimo wszystkich tych fantazyjnych zwojów, filakteriów i oznak czci wszystko sprowadza się do Darwina, „czerwonego w zębach i pazurach”. I komu pozostanie dopisanie ostatniego rozdziału księgi ludzkiego szaleństwa.
Już wcześniej wyglądało to ciemno, z pewnością w Rosji podczas Czerwonego Terroru lub „reform” Mao i tak dalej.
Ale myślę, że masz rację co do „pełnej kontroli poprzez CBDC”, z całkowitym nadzorem w pełnym spektrum i tak dalej. Jednak nie jesteśmy Niemcami po wojnie, kiedy doszło do okrucieństwa i ludobójstwa, które otępiały duszę za niewypowiedziany sadyzm. Cieszę się, że żyłem wtedy i nie musiałem oglądać ludzkości w najgorszym wydaniu, ale jak wspomniałeś, mogło to być tuż za rogiem.
Jak już wiele razy mówiłem, niech Bóg śpieszy do Włada Putina.
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Ron Unzmówi:@Robinski
I have a question: if Stalin’s real name, Dzugashvilli really does mean son of the Jew and if Franklin Roosevelt’s and Winston Churchill’s mothers were Jews, does that mean that Hitler was literally fighting the Jews or is this a “conspiracy theory”?
You shouldn’t believe all the nonsense you see floating around on the Internet.
(1) That’s not the meaning of Stalin’s real name.
(2) While it’s possible that Churchill’s mother had Jewish ancestry, most of the evidence I’ve seen is against it.
(3) It’s quite possible that FDR had very slight Jewish ancestry, but probably something like one great-great-great-great-grandparent, which is hardly significant.
So instead of 3-and-0, it’s 0-and-3.
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Sulu says:@HeebHunter
You seriously need to consider cutting out caffeine from your diet.
Sulu
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Haxo Angmark says:@Unz Fan guy
1. by 1929, the German Nazi party was borderline bankrupt.
2. in 1929, the Jewish colony in Palestine actually lost population.
1+2: Nazi-Zionist collaboration.
a good intro here, tho he treads carefully re the Jews, is Guido Preparata,
Conjuring Hitler – How Britain and America Made the Third Reich (London, 2005)
if you read it, simply substitute (((Rothschild))) for his bete noir, Bank of England governor Montagu Norman.
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@John Wear
Well, knock me over with a feather. Ron Unz puts a gold box around John Wear’s comment which is entirely made up of quoted material from various books, exactly as is JW’s style, and limitation.
The only thing John himself can say is: “There is no definitive proof that Hitler did or did not know that Rudolf Hess was going to fly to Scotland. It is a greyish area of history.” That’s it! All the rest is direct quotes from none other than Louis Kilzer, a writer of cheap, popular books, who started out as a journalist, and a couple other authors. Kilzer’s bio tells us he’s the son of a Wyoming rodeo operator who entered the newspaper business in Colorado, and continued in successive positions around the United States and the world. Lou and his wife, Liz, now live in Costa Rica where he and writing partner, Mark Boyden, continue to work on novels featuring the heroine Sally Will, a beautiful but flawed investigative journalist. How could a man who titles his book on Hitler “Churchill’s Deception: The Dark Secret that Destroyed Nazi Germany” … as though there is one thing that did it, and he can reveal it! This tells you everything about John Wear’s intellect.
But Ron Unz loves him. I’ll let each of you figure that one out.
John also quotes from David Irving, Wolf Ruediger Hess and Willis Carto (a single sentence as quoted from an article in the Barnes Review by Abdallah Melaouhi, not exactly a source that engenders confidence). John concludes with another sentence of his own writing: “So, we do not know for certain that Hitler knew Hess was going to fly to Scotland on May 10, 1941 to propose a peace plan to the British. However, I think it is highly probable that Hitler both knew and approved of Hess’s flight to Scotland.” Highly probably based on what, John? The few sentences you quoted here? But they don’t contain enough content for you to conclude that.
I would suggest John read The Hitler/Hess Deception by Martin Allen. I don’t even remember exactly what Allen’s final decision was on Hitler’s knowledge, but I know that mine is that Hitler didn’t know and would NOT have approved, and that’s why Hess made his secret flight. One has to understand both men, which JW does not along with most everyone else here, and elsewhere, to grasp why Hitler would never have confidence in such a plan. When he learned about it, he was FURIOUS! It was not an act. JW’s poor sources are not telling the story as it really took place.
I put this in podcasts during the time in question, not articles. Some are https://carolynyeager.net/heretics-hour-why-did-rudolf-hess-fly and https://carolynyeager.net/heretics-hour-who-started-wwii and https://carolynyeager.net/heretics-hour-turks-jews-roma-and-revisiting-hess. I would have to do a thorough search to find what else I may have done.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Brosi
Maybe Mr. Paul and Mr. Paul, Jr. are trying to avoid that lonely trip downriver. You can’t effect change from the afterlife.
The sneaky weasels have been playing the long game. Maybe we need to be a bit weasely ourselves, and take a page from the weasel playbook. “Informed” people have got to get in, in a substantial number, to get things going in a new direction.
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Kumbaresu says:@Canute
Well said! I could not agree more. Also, the strategy of Jewish elite to buy everybody and everything may turn out to have a flaw. History shows that sometimes people change their behaviors drastically based on some pervasive idea, which appears to be extremely compelling and supplant the mercantile interests. Human creativity needs inspiration, not money. There must be a reason we have music, art, and science – it is not money. Perhaps, our society is temporarily programmed to worship the Golden Calf, and this epoch will be over soon. Our species will have to change if we want to survive.
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John1955 says:@Brosi
-Unfortunately, even Hitler could not free the planet from the synogogue of satan.-
My friend, don’t exaggerate… Let’s not talk about the WHOLE f…ng planet…
Here are 2 counter-examples. A while ago I met a Russian guy who fought in Afghanistan during the 80’s. He told me that every school library had Mein Kampf in Arabic (or whatever language they speak down there). Results are encouraging:
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24th Alabama says:
Without revisions we would never know the truth.
But can anyone explain how six million dead can
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@Carolyn Yeager
In the 2nd paragraph, this sentence didn’t get finished.
How could a man who titles his book on Hitler “Churchill’s Deception: The Dark Secret that Destroyed Nazi Germany” — as though there is one thing that did it, and he can reveal it — be considered an expert on such a sensitive question as whether Hitler approved of Hess’ disastrous flight to Scotland?
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Haxo Angmark says:@Peter Akuleyev
wrong, Pete:
Germany and Poland ALREADY WERE formal allies in 1938-39, via the 10-Year Pact signed by Pilsudski before his death.
Hitler and his diplomats ran themselves ragged trying to cut a deal with the Poles, but Beck and Smigly-Ridz, a couple of stupid crooks bribed off by the Brits, simply would not budge.
see: Documents on German Foreign Policy, 1918-1945, Series D (1937-1945), Vol. V, Poland; The Balkans, Latin America, The Smaller Powers, June 1937 – March 1939 (Washington, 1953, pp. 1-183. And in general:
David L. Hoggan, The Forced War – When Peaceful Revision Failed (Costa Mesa, 1989)
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Haxo Angmark says:@Carolyn Yeager
Carolyn Yeager is correct:
Hitler had no foreknowledge of Hess’s crackpot mission, and hit the ceiling when it happened. It made the Third Reich look like a lunatic asylum.
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WingsofaDove says:
Great article full of key reference works to keep serious investigators busy for years!
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@Steve Naidamast
Thank you Steve Naidamast. I’ve seen several intelligent comments from you that I can fully agree with in recent weeks. Keep up the good work!
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The leader of the Nation of Islam was also against the war. Elijah Muhammad was locked up in 1942 for sedition after he encouraged draft resistance, and was kept in jail until 1946.
Irving’s prestigious publishers into dropping his books, while also disrupting his frequent international speaking tours and even lobbying countries to bar him from entry.
A great clip of Irving speaking about dastardly Churchill in Toronto is in this video:
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Tallest Skil says:@Unz Fan guy
And then whoops! All the jews were kicked the fuck out and the bankers arrested. So fuck off with this narrative.
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John Wear says:@Haxo Angmark
You write: “Hitler had no foreknowledge of Hess’s crackpot mission, and hit the ceiling when it happened.”
My response: What is your evidence to back up your statement?
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Argosy Weekly, one of America’s most popular magazines, carried a fictional cover story describing exactly such a devastating surprise attack on Tokyo in retaliation for a naval incident, with the powerful bombers of our Pacific Fleet inflicting huge damage upon the unprepared Japanese capital. I wonder whether the Roosevelt Administration didn’t have a hand in getting that story published.
Roosevelt had already approved the bombing of Tokyo several months before Pearl Harbor. This was opposed by most Generals who delayed sending bombers and crews to China for this attack, so they were not ready before December 7th. This is not a rumor, there is hard evidence.
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iamnow-anon says:
Hey Unz….are you catching hell for spilling the beans?? If I wrote this, I would be considered an antisemite and my career/livelihood ruined. As I have been aware of this truth for some time, it is good to see that it is coming from your lips. I can’t wait to see what type of response you receive from your brethren.
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@John Wear
What’s interesting, John, is that you didn’t produce any evidence for your statements. I know you think quoting from some author, any author, is “evidence.” But it’s not. It’s just someone else’s opinion. I’ve been telling you this for years, but you don’t “hear it.”
I’m looking forward to what Haxo Angmark comes up with.
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Operation Pike, the planned British and French attack on the Soviet Union, is mentioned in this short video:
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Patrick McNally says:@Carolyn Yeager
It’s a fact that Schacht’s advice about developing an export economy was rejected by Hitler because he was committed to rearmament in order to accomplish territorial expansion. You read like a classic example of the potentially reasonably intelligent person whose brain rots because of ideology.
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Patrick McNally says:@Joe Levantine
That’s just another fake Churchill quote. He never said it.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@24th Alabama
There are several sources invoking the 6 million figure as some sort of prophecy. Such as:
“Heddesheimer cogently documents the slew of previous attempts by Jews to disseminate deceitful and untrue atrocity propaganda before, during and after World War I. The First Holocaust features an amazing collection of press clippings and propaganda articles dating back to the late 19th century that make claims of the suffering and imminent extermination of European Jewry. Among such articles we find that Jews have, dozens of times before WWII, invoked the cabalisitc “6,000,000″ number as the amount of Jews on the verge of death and destruction during various periods of turmoil and conflict in Europe and Russia.”
I’ve only read excerpts from the Talmud, in English, so I can’t swear it’s true, but some say it is. There’s always arguments over verifying sources, but the above referenced seems solid.
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Patrick McNally says:@Ron Unz
Putin’s bogus claim was derived from the fake report made by Robert Wilton. Specifically, from Wilton’s phony list of names for the Council of People’s Commissars. Wilton created multiple fake lists, but in that case, it was the fake list for the Council which Putin was referencing. The actual membership of that Council is given here:
https://alphahistory.com/russianrevolution/decree-forming-soviet-government-1917/
Wilton’s phony lists can be found here:
https://wikispooks.com/wiki/Document:The_Jewish_role_in_the_early_Soviet_Regime
Every one of them is fake.
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Wokechoke says:@Fiendly Neighbourhood Terrorist
May I?
In England veterans used to laugh when little boys would say “we beat the nazis” instead of just saying “we beat Germany.” Rescuing Kikes wasn’t something veterans advertised about fighting that war. It’s a total blind spot but it’s also obviously what the British were doing. Rescuing Jews from Nazis.
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Zane says:
Excellent stuff by the eponymous RU.
History as taught is basically a pack of lies.
Why? Because no one can be allowed to question the narrative and derail the globalitarian agenda, is my best guess. One world dictatorship arriving in 3,2,1…
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@vox4non
“History is written by the victors.”
Axiomatic with the notable exception of the Spanish Civil War of 1936-39.
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iamnow-anon says:
This is exactly why history must be fact-based and not be written by the victors. But nevertheless, history is easily ignored since no one seems to care that the largest concentration camp is now the USA, and there are many more around the world. The latest genocide technique was the gene therapy jab. Tens of millions dead and probably in the hundreds. Zelenskiiii is cleansing Ukraine of the Ukrainians with unnecessary war and shipping the widows with their families to Poland. How lovely.
Weather wars and starvation on the horizon. It just keeps on piling up!! But, hey….so what! At least I’m not called antisemetic!!
Not that I would give a sh#t.
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Mike Whitney’s first question to Ron Unz included: “what was Hitler trying to achieve in Poland?”
Here are the basics.
1. The Germans agreed to an Armistice in 1918 based on Wilson’s 14 points that included not following the European tradition of the victors grabbing some land. The British and French ignored that and killed a million Germans via starvation with their naval blockade until the Germans agreed to their terms a year later.
Poland got areas that were mostly Germans, some over 90%. There were lots of stories of ethnic Germans abused by the Polish government. The Germans wanted this injustice corrected, but Poland refused to give back an inch.
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Zane says:@Anonymous
Sorry, a country with the GDP of Canada is not any kind of superpower.
As for manufacturing, Russia can’t even build a vacuum cleaner for export.
There is evidence emerging that nuclear weapons are far less formidable than supposed. They were a great fear propaganda tool. Japan? Japan was never nuked. That was a hoax. Refer Michael Palmer’s work. The Japanese elite were scared of being occupied by the USSR when Stalin finally declared war on them late in the day in 1945. That would have been a death sentence for the Emperor so they colluded with the Americans in the fake nuking (but real firebombing and mustard gassing) of Hiroshima and Nagasaki before surrendering on cue.
Just another false narrative about WW2 to add to the above article.
The lies don’t stop in Europe.
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Ivor Biggun says:
Don’t forget that the “SIX MILLION” hoax was first tried immediately after WW1…
but even ZION’s professional boot-licker – Perfidious Albion – knew it was too preposterous for even for its “Dark Art” propagandists to sell.. and would therfore have to wait until another Word War could be engineered at a later date.. when a suitable script would be available…
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@Wim
– The annexation of Czechia. This greatly undermined any claim that Hitler was just interested in the fate of ethnic Germans and played a role in how countries reacted to his Danzig demands.
This myth appeared several years after the end of the war and remains strong. Hungary was seeking a return of land lost in 1920 and threatened to invade Slovakia and Czechia. Both nations sought protection from Germany. Germany agreed to allow free trade as they became protectorates. Their governments and armies remained as crowds cheered the arrival of German troops to deter Hungary.
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Patrick McNally says:@Steve Naidamast
> Adolf Hitler and his lieutenants tried every negotiation tactic they could think of with Poland to reach a negotiated settlement
Total nonsense. Hitler had stated his aims for Poland on May 23, 1939:
—–
Living space proportionate to the greatness of the state is fundamental to every power. One can do without it for a time but sooner or later the problems will have to be solved by hook or by crook… It is not Danzig that is at stake. For us it is a matter of expanding our living space in the East… There is therefore no question of sparing Poland and we are left with the decision: To attack Poland at the first suitable opportunity. We cannot expect a repetition of Czechia. There will be war. Our task is to isolate Poland. Success in isolating her will be decisive.
—–
— Max Domarus, Hitler: Speeches & Proclamations, Volume 3, pp. 1618-9.Hitler’s ambitions were not about negotiating anything with Poland. The only legitimate point one can make is that Hitler was not seeking a general European war and would probably have been happiest if Poland had simply allowed to do things the way he had with Czechoslovakia. That means make a territorial agreement in September, consolidate one’s position, then throw out the agreement in March and advance your troops further. That was exactly the schedule which Hitler had followed in 1938-9 with the Czechs. But the Poles refused to play the game.
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Mefobills says:@Deadbeat
That may be true for those two contributors but most of the money raised by the NSDAP came from German industrialists and the German grassroots working class.
Fascism and National Socialism was a movement to bring the finance corporatocracy of the day into control.
So, why would corporations vote with their money (by funding NSDAP), to then reduce their power and control?
You can’t have it both ways. People have not really changed, and they don’t vote against their own interests. Giving money to a political party is a form of voting. NSDAP was funded by passing the hat, it was a grass roots movement.
Read this:
https://nationalvanguard.org/2018/05/funding-a-movement-german-big-business-and-the-rise-of-hitler/
excerpt:
The Left has long maintained that Hitler was put into power by wealthy White capitalists. This narrative was constructed in the 1920s and ’30s by Communists and Leftists dominant in Germany, the West, and, of course, the Soviet Union, and promoted by academics and the media ever since.
The narrative was challenged by Atlanta-born Yale University historian Henry Ashby Turner in his best-known book, German Big Business and the Rise of Hitler (New York: Oxford University Press, 1985), translated into German as Die Grossunternehmer und der Aufstieg Hitlers (Berlin: Siedler Verlag, 1985). It covers the period up to 1933. Turner, who died in 2008 at age 76, was married and had three children and six grandchildren.
The 1985 book rebuts the standard claim that German big business financed and promoted the attainment of power by Adolf Hitler. It demonstrates that the extent of big business support for Hitler and the National Socialist Party has been greatly exaggerated, even falsified.
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Kratoklastes says:@Anon
To the best of my knowledge, none of the Sages ever made the following deduction – perhaps because they probably took it as self-evident:
ἐπιστήμη → ἀφίστημι
Knowledge leads to apostasy.
In Greek it even rhymes: epi-stemi → afi-stemi (φ is more like ‘f’ than ‘ph’, even though φ’s slightly aspirated).
Actually – long story – it’s odd that ἀπό (apo-) + ἵστημι (-istemi) should contract to aFistemi.
It would be so much more poetic if the difference between “knowledge” and “apostasy” reduced to a single letter, like
ἐπιστήμη → ἀπίστημι
They missed a trick there.
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The British royal family were from Germany. King Edward thought it made sense to ally with Germany against the Soviet threat. Many others agreed, but a powerful force of (bankers?) strongly opposed this. Some think Hess planned to meet with Edward. Anyway, Edward is now treated as a traitor and villain, even though history proved Britain would have been far better off as a German ally.
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Kratoklastes says:@Tom Welsh
The correspondence of the two situations is not lost on people who have been paying attention since 2004 (the ‘Orange Revolution’).
An non-partisan reading of history shows, as a corollary, the completion of a circle:
Putin is Hitler
However neither Putin nor #ShoutyMoustacheMan are/were the ‘cartoon Hitler’ that is drummed into every young person’s skull from the moment they are first exposed to the media.
Also, Putin’s been much more patient regarding Donbas, than Naughty Uncle Dolfie was with Danzig.
The NAFO-Nazis killed heaps more Russians in Donbas between 2004 and 2022, than the German victims of the Poles in the 1930s.
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@Patrick McNally
What’s a fact is that Schacht said that Hitler rejected Schacht’s advice bc he wanted to rearm. But not to accomplish expansion, but to show strength equal to the others.
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The US proxy war against Russia in Ukraine is a Neocon war. It is brought to us by the same group of people that brought us the Iraq war.
Remember that the Neocons are largely Jewish.
It appears to me – and recent columns by Philip Giraldi have also pointed this out – that the Jewish US Neocons have a thing for Russia. They hate Russia. I suspect this is due to the poor treatment, the various pogroms, etc. that historically occurred.
I read that Jews in Israel are not quite so rabidly anti-Russian. There is more migration and travel. Israel also relies on Russia for a certain level of peace in the Middle East. Relations between Russia and Israel are more practical.
It is unfortunate that we cannot discuss Jewish influence on our foreign policy more openly in this country.
It is one thing to go after Iran and make us non-neutral arbiters in the Middle East. It is another thing entirely to go after Russia, bring a major war to Europe, and risk destroying the planet.
*Mr. Unz – thank you again for your site. You are a brave man for challenging official narratives.
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@Carlton Meyer
This question was asked of Ron Unz. He never did answer it.
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Patrick McNally says:@Carlton Meyer
> Hungary was seeking a return of land lost in 1920 and threatened to invade Slovakia and Czechia.
That is the myth here. It’s really funny the way that this board loves to reference David Irving, but never seems to actually read anything which he wrote in his prime. In The War Path Irving describes how:
“… in faraway Bled the Hungarian delegation had apparently formally renounced all use of force against Czechoslovakia; the wiretaps showed that Horthy, Kánya and his prime minister, Bela von Imrédy, had retrospectively sanctioned this. This cast a cloud over the entire state visit.
“The secret meetings which began the next day, during a sea trip to Heligoland, were stormy. In the morning Hitler conferred privately with Horthy, while Ribbentrop and Weizsäcker took on Imrédy and Kánya. Ribbentrop accused Kánya of stabbing Germany in the back with the Bled agreement, and refused to accept Kánya’s explanations.”
— Irving, The War Path, pp. 125-6, 2013 edition.The Bled agreement showed that Hungary and Czechoslovakia could have resolved things on their own. But Hitler aimed to conquer the main portion of Czechoslovakia as a way of easing the eventual conquest of living space in the broader east. For that he needed to abort the Bled agreement and reincite the Czech-Hungarian conflict.
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Mefobills says:@Carolyn Yeager
What’s a fact is that Schacht said that Hitler rejected Schacht’s advice bc he wanted to rearm. But not to accomplish expansion, but to show strength equal to the others.
It was more complicated.
All of the Mefobills issued starting in late 33 were starting to stack up in the private banks.
Mefobills were bills of credit and they were paid interest. When a corporation received a bill, it was a form of credit, and said corporation would go about making goods. In the case of Mefobills, they were mostly aimed at armament industry. The corporation would turn the bill in at the end of the “goods making” cycle.
When the bill is turned in – it is discounted. When discounting, it is done so at a private bank. (The private bank gives Reichsmarks to the corporation equal to, I think, face value of the bill.)
The private bank can then hold onto the bill, and the longer they do so, the more interest they can collect. They collect the interest over time. When private bank turns around and turns it into the Reichsbank it is a second discounting. In terms of money magic, new Reichsmarks from the Reichsbank flux outward to the private bank.
Schacht was mostly worried about another inflation, as he already had first hand experience taming the hyperinflation.
If all of the “stacked up” Mefobills were discounted by the private bankers, as they were coming due, then the new money issued by the Reichsbank (state bank) would have indeed caused inflation – especially if the private bankers went on a buying spree.
In defense of Hitler, he probably knew things that Schacht didn’t, about threats facing Germany. Schacht understood things that Hitler didn’t. Schacht was fired by Hitler in 38, hence the Jews controlling the show trials could not kill Schacht.
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@John1955
My Brahmin pal (Chief Priest at the local Hindu Temple) confirms that Adolf Hitler and Savitri Devi (Adolf Hitler’s Priestess) are like Deities in India and Hindus diasporas abroad.
Does not surprise me in the least.
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Sarita says:
Mr Unz, regarding
Question 7: the Holocaust
You never mention a possible number of Jewish people deaths.
If the Holocaust story is mostly drama specially the 6 million figure then what’s in your opinion an approximate number?
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Truth Vigilante says:@Brosi
Ron Paul stood silent as Jewish Power, leveraged by their control of Central Banks, stole two elections from him. Yet he still cannot name the Jew.
For all his righteousness he is just another cuck.
There is a reason that people like Ron Paul, Tucker Carlson, RFK Jr, Glenn Greenwald etc (and I suspect Ron Unz also), don’t name the Jew or come right out and say there was Zio orchestration of the JFK coup d’etat, the 9/11 False Flag or the Covid Psyop.
Because, if they were ever to do so, they would be DEAD MEAT.
So, in the case of Ron Paul for example, it was better that he show some discretion on that, and stay alive, because a dead Ron Paul would be of no use to anyone.
This enabled him to get the message across on the Federal Reserve and countless other issues (he has produced around 2000 episodes of The Ron Paul Liberty Report since his retirement, been interviewed by countless high profile individuals that were widely disseminated and made scores of speeches as keynote speaker – not to mention the establishment of the Ron Paul Institute for Peace and Prosperity that has a wide readership.All of this has been achieved since his retirement alone and, in aggregate, has done MUCH MORE to enlighten the ignorant masses.
You go on to say:
I’ll take Andrew Anglin over him any day of the week.
I like Andrew Anglin too but at the end of the day, he is known only to a tiny minority of hard core truthers.
If ever Anglin was able to attract a critical threshold of the American public amongst his readership, you can be certain that as surely as night follows day, he would meet the same fate as James Forrestal, Hugo Chavez, JFK, RFK, JFK Jr etc.
Brosi, I’ve liked a hell of a lot of your output in the past but you are DEAD WRONG about Dr Ron Paul.
That you should be calling him, of all people, a cuck (Ron Paul is the 21st century reincarnation of Thomas Jefferson – only BETTER), is shameful.Bottom Line: Dr Ron Paul does NOT need to name the Jew.
Ron Pail IS the ‘End the Fed’ movement. He, AND HE ALONE, has been banging on about the malfeasance of the ZOG owned Federal Reserve for 50 years and demanding that it be audited*.
(*He knows that an audit would reveal financial chicanery on a biblical scale that would immediately entail its dissolution.
Simultaneously, it would so anger the American public, that they’d demand that its Zionist Usury Banking Cartel owners be lynched).Ron Paul has done all the hard work in leading the world to water.
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Wokechoke says:@Patrick McNally
The Poles ought to have in fact thrown their lot in with Germany and attack the USSR. There are mysteries within mysteries here. Polish ambitions are like Kryptonite for the rest of Europe though.
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Pierre de Craon says:@JWalters
The internet is far too leaky, especially in America with that 1st Amendment crap.
The First Amendment has effectively become a dead letter. Perhaps it hasn’t been repealed, but it has certainly been emasculated.
If the amendment were not already a moribund aspect of American legal and political functioning, it would have been cited by every state and federal court in the nation as each one in turn struck down every piece of so-called hate crime legislation as a plain assault on that amendment’s black-letter guarantees of freedom of speech, the press, assembly, and the free exercise of religion.
On the contrary, America’s legislative and judicial branches have become a closed shop: those who aren’t Jewish, black, foreign-born, or some other species of aggrieved creature need not apply for admission or employment.
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Ron Unz says:@Carolyn Yeager
This question was asked of Ron Unz. He never did answer it.
This very lightly moderated website attracts numerous elderly eccentrics, some of whom apparently have serious problems with reading comprehension.
My response to that question had included the following statement, with the boldface in the original:
Hitler’s final demand, that 95% German Danzig be returned to Germany just as its inhabitants desired, was an absolutely reasonable one..
Hitler also requested a highway or other transit route to East Prussia, but I think his demand for the return of Danzig was by far the more important flashpoint in the conflict.
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Ron Unz says:@Patrick McNally
Putin’s bogus claim was derived from the fake report made by Robert Wilton.
I sometimes wonder whether you’re related to Bernie Madoff or perhaps trained under him. He was an extraordinarily bold fraudster, and you seem much the same.
We’ve gone back and forth many times on the degree to which the early Bolshevik leadership was Jewish, and as far as I can tell, every solid contemporaneous source, including leading journalists, and Western diplomatic and intelligence experts agrees it was absolutely overwhelming. Leading modern scholars say the same thing, as does Putin. A large majority of the top Bolshevik figures prominent in mainstream histories were Jewish. Whether it was 60% or 70% or 85% can be disputed, but all relative to a Soviet Jewish population of perhaps 3%.
You, however, blandly assert that they’re all lying, and only you know the truth.
That’s as ridiculous as your other repeated claim that the gigantic famine caused by Mao’s Great Leap Forward never happened, and is merely a Western intelligence hoax. You’ve also claimed that the PRC government doctored all their own official population statistics to make it look like there had been a gigantic famine, presumably because they were in cahoots with the CIA.
I’m not sure I’ve ever encountered so boldly arrogant and delusional a troll anywhere on the Internet.
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Truth Vigilante says:@the Man Behind the Curtain
The Italians and British started fighting first. Italy declared war on the UK a week after Dunkirk, then UK attacked Italian positions in Libya iirc.
Egypt was extremely strategic for the British Empire due to the Suez CanalI’m aware of the military exchanges between the Italians and British/Commonwealth* forces in Nth Africa, but they did not encounter one another IN EARNEST until quite a while later when the British/Commonwealth forces launched Operation Compass in December 1940.
ie: six (6) months after Dunkirk.(*The stand-out units amongst the Commonwealth forces were the 6th Australian Division and the 7th Armoured Division that were instrumental in the capture of Tobruk, Bardia, Sollum, Halfaya and Fort Capuzzo, Derna–Mechili, Giarabub, Kufra and Uweinat, exploits in the Battle of Beda Fomm etc.
Pictured below are men of the Australian 2/11th Battalion, 6th Australian Division after the capture of Tobruk:
To put it in a nutshell, the ‘British’ victories against the Italians in late 1940/early 1941 were disproportionately the handiwork of the Aussies.
Importantly, Hitler would have been aware that the ENTIRETY of the equipment/heavy military hardware that the British possessed in the European theatre of operations had been abandoned by the BEF as they threw down their weapons and ran for the lives in the debacle of Dunkirk.
Hitler would also have known that the Italians far outnumbered the British in Nth Africa in late 1940 and would have hoped that the few British/Commonwealth forces and Italians would tie each other up for a year or two and not bother him, while he got on with the serious business at hand.Simply put, Hitler had every reason to believe that the machinations in Nth Africa would not affect him.
Of course, that venture of the Italians turned into a debacle and, faced with the prospect that the Italians would suffer a humiliating defeat, and the geostrategic consequences of that (ie: possible overthrow of Mussolini’s government and loss of a strategic ally), Hitler was forced to intervene in early 1941 to salvage the situation.• Thanks: the Man Behind the CurtainAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Tiptoethrutulips says:@Truth Vigilante
Let’s not forget poor James Traficant. Imprisoned and then killed by “accidentally “ falling off his tractor.
I imagine Mr. Traficant to be the modern day Andrew Jackson.
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HVMII says:
Another book to recommend is Hoggan’s Forced War – if you can get it.
It really explains the complicated situation in Central Europe that existed as a result of the Inquiry’s (Wilson’s socialists – Colonel House’s protegees) remaking of the Central European map.
Germany was one of a number of countries including Poland and Hungary that were pursuing ethnic nationalist interests. One of the greatest questions surrounding the partitioning of Czechoslovakia was what would Hungary and Poland get? After the partition, ethnic trouble started between the Slovaks, the Czechs, and Ruthenians drawing Germany, Hungary, Romania, and Poland back into the picture. Thus Hitler’s demand to meet with Hacha.
According to Hoggan, the British policy of Appeasement was designed to draw a line by which Britain could make war on Germany and assert its hegemony over the Central European heartland. To pretend that Poland was a simple victim of German aggression is to not know history – especially of the choices facing Poland, meaning Russia, Germany or Pilsudski nationalism.
Of course a major role was played by the British aristocracy and British Tories towing the line for international Jewry. Too bad Mosley did not become PM! The half Jew Churchill himself was up to his neck in debt owed to the Zionist Focus organization.
After Germany annexed Czechia, the Jewish controlled Fleet street whipped up public sentiment for war against against Germany, but not all Britons wanted war. The problem with British policy was that it ignored the ethnic conflicts in Central Europe and gave a blank check to the Poles who then drew Britain into war which they were not ready to fight. Certainly, France did not want that war if Bonnet’s view is considered. Reynaud betrayed the AD by agreeing to the British demand that France not make a separate peace with Germany once the war started.
Of course, with all of this said, I am omitting Soviet Russia’s role in the whole picture (which the Poles and every other Central European despised more than they did Germany) because they knew Russia was looking westward and had been building up an offensive army since 1935 (which of course, Germany could not have while all of its neighbors re-armed – hence its departure from the League of Nations as well as its open violation of Versailles as Russia and France entered into military talks between 1933-1935 and from which Russia added Czechoslovakia to its defense arrangement).
It seems to me that one lesson to take from World War II and apply it to modern times is that the Poles seem to have a way of dragging people into their wars. While the blank check has been given to the Ukraine, the Poles are rabid Russophobes itching for war with Russia with an eye on Ukrainian territory much like they had during the Russo Polish War of 1919-1922.
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John1955 says:@the Man Behind the Curtain
My friend, here is another article with interesting pics. None of the people featured there are Brahmins though… Hindu Brahmins probably abide by the ironclad rule of our American Boston Brahmins: “Your name could be seen in the newspaper exactly 3 times 1.When you are born 2.When you get married 3. When you die”
Hitler’s Hindus: The Rise and Rise of India’s Nazi-loving Nationalists
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NotAnonymousHere says:@HbutnotG
#138
So you’re a world famous connoisseur of high school boys’ penises and underwear. We all get the picture.
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Ron Unz says:@HVMII
Another book to recommend is Hoggan’s Forced War – if you can get it.
It’s conveniently available on this website, though lacking the footnotes:
https://www.unz.com/book/david_l_hoggan__the-forced-war/
I’d bought it in hard copy a few years ago and finally read it recently. It’s exceptionally detailed and thorough, and I think mostly reliable, but I can’t see why anyone in his right mind would rely upon it.
As I discussed in my long 2019 article, Hoggan had a very mixed reputation, with lots of people even in his own ideological camp claiming he was a liar:
https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-understanding-world-war-ii/
His conclusions were roughly similar to those of A.J.P. Taylor, an enormously renowned mainstream British historian, whose book was universally lauded. So why rely on Hoggan when Taylor (or Irving) is available?
I sometimes think activist-types prefer citing the most obscure, marginal, and vilified source exactly because it’s so obscure, marginal, and vilified. But no one who’s rational would follow that approach.
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Hitler’s writings of living space for Germans in the East is often misunderstood. Germany was densely populated and this was a problem in agrarian societies. This led to mass German migration to the Americas and less populated Eastern Europe. What we now called Ukraine was a huge lightly populated region with many ethnic groups to include millions of Germans.
Germany often suffered from food shortages and a million starved as a result of the British naval blockade during World War I. The Russians/Soviets had taken over the Ukraine region in the 1920s. Hitler wanted more farmland for Germans, although his plans were never clear. He didn’t want to rule cold Russia, no one does. But Ukraine has rich soil and a warmer climate and Soviet claims were weak.
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BlackFlag says:@Patrick McNally
Regardless of German intentions, all major powers were expansionary.
Britain: controlled a quarter of the globe. Further conquests on hold due to being over-extended.
France: similar to Britain. Recently annexed parts of Germany.
Germany: Czech part of Czechoslovakia. Recently had vassals in Africa.
Japan: colonizing Manchuria.
Soviet Union: East Asia, Central Asia, recently took land from Finland.
USA: The West, Mexico, Hawaii, Philippines.Interestingly, they all had some moralizing rationale. If you look at what *actually had happened* in say the past century, Germany was the least expansionary of the great powers.
In fact, virtually every country/nation/state in all of history has basically expanded until hitting its limit. Though there are still plenty of disputes over territory, currently it’s pretty quiet. Probably due to the relatively low value of land, low and negative population growth, and the extreme destructiveness of modern weapons.
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@Patrick McNally
I am unfamiliar with your confusing quote from Irving about the Hungarian threat, but most basic history books will note that Hungarian troops had already been moving the border posts forward a kilometer north every month or so and already occupied much of the Hungarian area of Slovakia before the Germans arrived. Even after that they invaded the mostly Ukrainian sector in the far east.
An example of truth can be seen in a newsreel from the AP Archive. The Associated Press is a long-standing official American propaganda outlet. AP posted the video on Youtube in 2015 after heavy editing, with an all CAPS title: NAZI INVASION OF CZECHOSLOVAKIA.
These old videos have narration, which was replaced with sinister music that contrasts with the video of locals cheering on arriving German troops. It shows Emil Hacha, Prime Minister of Czechoslovakia, being greeted warmly in Berlin with full diplomatic honors. It shows German troops peacefully marching through Prague with Czech and Slovak leaders and their Generals on the reviewing stand. The editor made an awkward attempt to freeze frame a few shots of people who might be upset.
Here is the video:
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anastasia says:
With the inception of the internet, I began discovering things. I recall looking up something about St. Edith Stein and her inspiring life, and by accident, I found Robert Faurisson’s letter to the pope asking him for the evidence that Edith Stein died in a gas chamber. I wound up reading Revisionist material about the holocaust and WWII. I stayed up all night reading and recall that my distress was almost as great as my distress was when I first learned about the holocaust.
I recall reading AP Taylor’s book in college, but back then I did not fully appreciate the difference between his book and those histories of the event written by others. I have since read many of the books mentioned by Unz.
So, what do we know and will it do us any good? We know that our government has been lying for far longer than we knew. They are simply not now as successful. Today, even those who have not read these books are finding out that their government and country is not as apple pie wholesome as we thought it was. I have wondered for some years now about those pilots who unloaded phosphorous bombs on Dresden and Hamburg, and other German cities, and even engaged in strafe shooting of civilians, women and children, running through the streets of Dresden. I wonder if it ever, then or later, bothered those pilots?
So what becomes of us now? Our chickens are coming home to roost, and it ain’t a pretty sight. What can I or anyone else do about these matters, other than not to listen to them when they tell me to go back in the building – that it is safe.
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Dutch Boy says:@Ron Unz
WWII became inevitable with the creation of the Soviet Union as a result of WWI. No Stalin – no Hitler. The British Christian intellectual C. S. Lewis had the most sensible idea about how Britain should deal with the German-Soviet war: supply both sides until they tore themselves to pieces.
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NotAnonymousHere says:@John1955
#171
See how simple it was – a group of healthy NON-COLLEGE-EDUCATED bearded males carrying PKMs (light machine gun, way above AK-47 in firepower, in the same category as M60 or BAR) said GTFO! and fat sweaty poisonous JUDAIC spider scampered to America.
Screwed because Jooz. You know nothing about guns or buns. PKM fires same round as AK 47, 7.62mm. They’re all firing the same round unless you want to get into nitnoy bookkeeper bullshit.
Maybe try shooting a gun once in a while.
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anastasia says:@Carolyn Yeager
Well, why did they have to kill him then? What cat was he going to let out of the bag?
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Brosi says:@Tiptoethrutulips
Rand Paul was attacked by his lunatic lefty neighbor while riding his garden tractor. Is there something Cabalistic about tractors?
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Alden says:@gay troll
It’s not true at all that Hitler’s paternal grandmother ever lived in Vienna or worked as a servant in a Rothschild home in Vienna.
The paternal grandmother lived at home on the family farm until she married. She never worked as anyone’s maid. Her family was prosperous middle class. The family farm was prosperous and could support an extended family and the farm workers.
Upon her grandparents death, the paternal grandmother inherited government bonds. That paid a decent income in interest to her. So she had both a modest income of her own, the government bonds she could sell and a home on the family farm.
She never had to work as anyone’s maid. And never lived in Vienna
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soll says:@Ron Unz
I sometimes think activist-types prefer citing the most obscure, marginal, and vilified source exactly because it’s so obscure, marginal, and vilified. But no one who’s rational would follow that approach
As shown by your own dependency in Robert Wilton and his fictions. Solzhenitsyn is just as bad. Folklore stories created solely to entertain simple souls.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@anastasia
Welcome to the world of deers in the headlights, my friend.
Some say it’s better late than never; I say ignorance is bliss.
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soll says:@Joe Levantine
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@Ron Unz
The question was, “what was Hitler trying to achieve in Poland?” There was never a direct answer to that. You quote yourself extensively from previous articles, which you apparently think suffices as an answer to Whitney’s questions. Hitler’s “Final Demand” would not be the answer to “what was he trying to achieve in Poland.” So I do not consider that you answered the question.
This article doesn’t strike me as a genuine question-answer article. You have assembled lots of stuff you’ve written in the past that you like to and want to recycle, and then provided “questions” from Mike Whitney to fit them. But they don’t even fit that well. I have the impression you composed the whole thing yourself.
And do you think its good form to try to ridicule/insult a person over 80 for their age when age is not impacting their commentary here at all. I can out-reason 80% of the commenters here and keep up with the other 20%. Hey, you are the one who put a gold border around John Wear’s reply to me that I easily struck down. What does that say about you?
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Brosi says:@Carlton Meyer
That is interesting how many purple areas there are in Crimea. There is even an area named “Zürichtal” on Crimea, implying that Swiss has settled there. There are towns with German names strewn all across southern Ukraine and the Donbas with names like Alt-Danzig, Neu-Danzig and Neu-Stuttgart.
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Alden says:@Mysteerious Rooshian Vooman
General Franco was the absolutely totally greatest man of the 20th century. With the help of the Spanish upper classes and the Roman Catholic Church he beat the Spanish communists and their soviet Jew invaders.
And Franco was hated then and is still hated by all the scum intellectuals and liberals.
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Ron Unz says:@soll
I sometimes think activist-types prefer citing the most obscure, marginal, and vilified source exactly because it’s so obscure, marginal, and vilified. But no one who’s rational would follow that approach
As shown by your own dependency in Robert Wilton and his fictions.
During the period in question, the Times of London was the world’s most influential and authoritative media outlet, and Robert Wilton was its representative in Russia. Partly as a consequence, his books on the Bolshevik Revolution were very widely read worldwide and considered highly credible.
That doesn’t necessarily prove that all of his claimed information was correct, but it does provide a considerable amount of presumption in his favor.
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Robert Dolan says:@Truth Vigilante
I like Ron Paul and I watch his show every day.
“End The Fed” is actually a gateway to the redpill.
Ron doesn’t specifically NTJ, but when he’s talking about the FED you obviously know what tribe he is talking about.
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Brosi says:@Truth Vigilante
After I posted the comment I tried to think of any American who was active on the political scene who had really named the Jew.
Lincoln Rockwell was the only one I could think of.
Of course Jews terrorized him like they terrorized the NSDAP. Eventually the Jews murdered Rockwell, and they made several attempts on Hitler as well. Likely the Jews would have exterminated Ron Paul too if he had stepped to far out of line.
In 2008 I still had a sliver of hope for the US, and it centered around Ron Paul. I watched as the Republican Party ignored him and cheated him while pushing Palin and McCain. It was clear to me that it was all a set up in order to throw the election to the Homo fraudster Barry Soetoro (Obama) and his husband Michael. This was the beginning of the Judeo-Wokeist take over of the US.
Ron Paul said and did nothing about it.
This election was also when the Jews weaponized the IRS through ((Lois Lerner)) and ((Koskinen) and turned it loose on the Tea Party.
Ron Paul said and did nothing about it.
I don’t doubt that Ron Paul is a brave man, and I am certain that he is braver than myself. And sure, he correctly rails on about the FED, and he is correct. But we both know that the FED really represents Jewish Money Power, and Ron Paul couldn’t go there. His railing about the FED is really just avoiding naming the Jew.
It looks to me like he loved the Constitution so much that he was willing to see it trashed rather than really put up a fight that might see it damaged and his political career ruined. The analogy to a man that loves his wife so much he won’t stop her having affairs is appropriate, and this is why I think usage of the word cuck is appropriate here too.
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Haxo Angmark says:@John Wear
@ John Wear –
I’ve got c. 12,000 books in my WWI/II library….about 6 months ago I read an extended essay on the Hess fiasco in one of them which mentioned that before taking off, Rudolf wrote and stashed a long letter to Adolf attempting to explain himself. I’ll try to dig it out for you later tonight. Best regards,
Haxo
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@Kratoklastes
Further, apocalypse or rather ἀποκάλυψις means simply uncovering. The Χριστιανός tell us that the Church will end when the truth is no longer covered by lies. I find they have a consistent message.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Brosi
Apparently not. Unless it’s the Mossad after you instead of your loony, left wing neighbor.
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Teenage Wasteland says:
The defining characteristic of “humanity” is the infinite DESIRE to deceive others, and themselves.
Each generation produces its own creme de la creme.
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Haxo Angmark says:@anastasia
re Anglo-American firebomb attacks on German cities and “if it ever bothered these pilots”.
I have c. 150 book-length firsthand accounts on my shelf by Brit/Empire/American pilots and crews who flew such missions during 1943-45. Re Dresden in particular, here’s a diary entry by a B-17 ball turret gunner who was looking straight down into the Inferno:
“…this is a war crime. But I don’t care. Please God just get me out of here alive.”
and please don’t make me dig it out I’ve got too much to do right now.
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Mefobills says:@Patrick McNally
Total nonsense. Hitler had stated his aims for Poland on May 23, 1939:
Total nonsense to your total nonsense. The death of Pilsduski was yet another tragedy, in a chain of tragedies.
Read this:
https://www.realhistorychan.com/edward-rydz-smigly-started-ww-2.html
As regular readers of Real History Chan well know by now, the ultimate culprits behind the disaster of World War II were the high-level masters of the New World Order crime gang (Rothschild, Rockefeller, Sulzberger, Baruch et al), and their skilled operational henchmen of the political world (FDR, Churchill, Stalin et al). By the way, this is the same self-perpetuating crime syndicate that has, in recent years, been agitating for confrontation against Russia and China. Same game, new players, long story.
But the one thing this dirty gang could never have accomplished by themselves was to trigger the actual war. As even the most geographically illiterate Boobus Americanus or Boobus Europithicus should know, neither the US, nor the USSR, and nor the UK shared a common border from which to make mayhem against Hitler’s Germany.
France does share a border with Germany, but when Hitler permanently renounced any claims to the disputed Alsace-Lorraine region in 1935, a possible flash-point between the two rivals was diffused forever.
Another potential trigger was diffused in 1938 when the Munich Agreement – since dubbed by propagandists and ignoramus parrots alike as “Neville Chamberlain’s appeasement” – fairly settled the German-Czech dispute to the mutual benefit of Czechs, Slovaks and Germans.
Nor was Germany bound to any dangerous entangling alliances, as it had been prior to World War I when the Reich was committed to fight alongside Austria-Hungary after the Russians and French began mobilizing against that nation.
In November of 1938, the U.S. mid-term Congressional elections dealt a crushing blow to Franklin Demono Roosevelt’s Democrat Party. With America still reeling from the decade-long Great Depression, absent some foreign “crisis”, it appeared that the failed two-term President would not be able to seek a third term (He ultimately held office until his death in 1945). It should be noted that at this hard time in American history, prosperous Germany was enjoying full employment, a strong currency, the Autobahn, the Volkswagen, and a happy reconciliation between labor and the entrepreneurial class. But we digress.
Even the claims of Jewish persecution in Germany were no longer valid. Though the dominant Jewish elite had in large measure been stripped of high positions in finance, press, government, law and academia, the truth was, the 330,000 Jews who remained in Hitler’s Germany were unmolested and actually quite prosperous. Indeed, after anti-Jewish riots broke out following the 1938 Paris murder of a German diplomat by a deranged Polish Jew, it was Hitler himself who, via Josef Goebbels, immediately issued an Emergency Order for the anti-Jewish violence (since exaggerated in scope) to cease.
And so, by 1939, the New World Order crime syndicate and the British & French chauvinists had nearly run out of all options and all propaganda pretexts for instigating another war against peaceful and prosperous Germany, as they had done in 1914. The last hopes for starting the war to re-enslave Germany rested on the shoulders of one man, and one man only. His name was Edward Rydz-Smigly — the criminal fool who started World War II. As is to be expected, his name is virtually unknown outside of Poland. It’s high-time this dirty, rotten, ego-maniacal scoundrel gets the posthumous “credit” he so richly deserves.
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1. Poland. Even if Hitler’s offer to Poland was reasonable, the Poles may have been afraid given the context of what had just transpired. After all, Hitler didn’t end with Sudetenland but gobbled up the rest of Czech territory. Give an inch, take a mile. Taking Rhineland, Austria, and Sudetenland all made a certain sense within the nationalist framework as they were either German or heavily populated with Germans(who were being mistreated). And the great powers let Germany have them.
But Germany entering Czech republic was something different, and it set off alarm bells, and the Poles noticed. Would the Germans end with Danzig or regard Polish concession as a weakness and push for more? Had Hitler not gone into Czech, it might have been otherwise. After Sudetenland, he should have pressed for Danzig, and then it would have a straight record of asking ONLY for German lands. After Sudetenland, Hitler should have pressed for Danzig than get embroiled in the Czech affair, in which the UK got involved, favorably to Germany, only to end up with egg on its face when the Polish thing blew up.
Also, one wonders if UK and France would have declared war on Germany if only Danzig was taken. As Germany was many times stronger than Poland, there wasn’t much the Poles could do about it.Hitler also requested a corridor between Germany proper and East Prussia, but Poles were understandably nervous.. Allow free movement of Germans between the two territories and the Polish access to the sea could be cut off.
As for Hitler’s proposition of German-Polish alliance against the USSR, Poles didn’t want to get caught in the middle. They didn’t want to side with Russia against Germany or with Germany against Russia. Either way, they would end up antagonizing a giant. (Ironically, the two giants teamed up to divide Poland among themselves anyway. In retro, maybe Poles should have taken Hitler’s deal. But would Hitler have stopped there or push for war with Russia using the Poles as a battering ram, much like the West is using Ukraine in that manner?) If any nation was caught between a rock and a hard place, it was Poland. But Poles being Polacks, they thought they’d be safe by relying on UK and France to come to their rescue. They wrote their own joke.Given how the events of 39 expanded to a full-blown all-out world war in a few yrs, the German-Russian invasion of Poland has been regarded as the firing shot of WWII. But had Hitler not invaded the USSR, it would have remained a major European war(on a scale smaller than the Great War and the Napoleonic Wars). So, WWII really began in 1941 with the invasion of Russia, and it became truly global with Japan’s attack on the US navy. Had Hitler kept the peace with Russia, there would have been no WWII.
If Germany and Russia had remained at peace, history would remember the events between 39 to 41 as just a European affair. Would the conflict have ended in 41 or thereabouts? It’s possible the war between Germany and UK would have dragged on for few more years. It would have been mostly an air campaign between the two countries until both had enough and came to some kind of truce. Not a world war.But Germany did invade Russia in 1941, greatly expanding the war. Granted, without Japan’s attack on Pearl Harbor, it still wouldn’t have been a global war. Rather, it would have been two separate wars, one in Europe and one in Asia: Germany vs Russia and Japan vs China. But German invasion and the looming victory convinced Japan to be bolder. With German conquest of Russia, Japan would be faced with only one enemy, the US. When Japan hit Pearl Harbor and Germany declared war on the US, it truly became a global war and the European War and the Asian War were joined as a case of Axis vs the Allies.
The Germany vs Russia War totally changed the nature of the conflict. Regardless of which side won among Germany, UK, and France, it was still a war within rules. None had plans to wipe out the losing side. But Germany invaded Russia to conquer and destroy utterly. It was an eliminationist war, and all civilized rules went out the window. Whatever restraints Germans showed in France or Norway didn’t apply in Russia for ideological and realistic reasons. Russians were untermensch deserving of no respect, and beside, Germans didn’t have the means to feed and house all the Russians who fell into their hands.
Now, why did Hitler invade Russia? The dominant narrative says Hitler’s racial worldview was inseparable from lebensraum. It was to fulfill the great German dream of carving out a vast empire in huge swaths of Russian lands.
Of course, Hitler knew Germany lost WWI because it fought a two-front war, and therefore, it would have been foolish to rinse and repeat. But paradoxically it might just work precisely because it’s so crazy, so crazy that no one would expect Hitler to do something so retarded.
And indeed the dominant narrative says Hitler did fool Stalin who was hit with the biggest sucker-punch in history. For awhile that the Wehrmacht was unstoppable. Even Stalin lost heart for a week or two, thinking all was lost. Or so the dominant narrative says.Common senses says it was a safer bet for Germany to keep the peace with the USSR and fend off the British than to engage in total war with Russia. After all, neither the UK nor Germany had the means to defeat the other. UK had a powerful navy and air force, and Germany was dominant on the continent, esp with it allies and satellites. It was a limited war between the two.
But if Germany invaded Russia, it was going to be a winner-takes-all total war. And unless Russia was taken out in a year or two, it had the means to roll back the tide and totally crush Germany.
So, why take the great gamble with Russia?Again, Hitler’s racial ideology was critical. As much as he loathed Churchill, he ideally wanted an alliance or at least amity between Germany and the British Empire. Brits had an empire, Russians had an empire, but Germany did not. If Hitler kept his alliance with Stalin, Russia would only grow stronger over time and greatly overshadow Germany, isolated from the world due to Anglo global blockade.
It would have been safer for Germany not to engage Russia, but time would favor Russia over Germany. However, by taking out Russia and creating a vast German land empire, Hitler could then make peace with Anglos with a vast sea empire. Hitler figured the Anglos were still in the fight with the Germany with the hope that Russia would eventually turn on Germany. But with Russian taken out and with Germany going from a nation to an empire with vast slaves and natural resources at its disposal, the UK would have to give up the fight and cut a deal with Germany. Then, the great dream of German-Anglo understanding could be realized. But for this to happen, Germany had to become an empire, and its only possibility was to grab the lands of Russia.In retro, Hitler should have kept the peace with Stalin. With nearly all of Western Europe allied with Germany, under German occupation, or neutral, and with Germany ‘allied’ with the USSR, the UK would eventually have to negotiate. Brits ruling the seas, Germany dominant in Europe west of the USSR, and Russia as a great land empire. But Hitler’s control over Western Europe wasn’t nearly as total as Stalin’s grip on the Russian Empire. And he wanted validation from the lofty Anglos, not the lowly Slavs led by some Georgian bandit chieftain who swept to power with Jewish Bolsheviks. Just like GOP elites would rather be invited to cocktail parties by the uber-elites than rub shoulders with MAGA Walmart shoppers, Hitler didn’t enjoy the company of the lowly Slavs(something Patton also shared when he refused to drink with a Russian son of a bitch). The partnership with Stalin was one of convenience for both sides, with no love lost between them.
Only by taking out the USSR could Hitler hope to definitively persuade the Anglos that the future is about the Anglo Empire and German Empire. Hitler needed an empire to gain that kind of respect from the imperial-minded Anglos.The most controversial theory says Hitler was forced to preempt Stalin’s great plan to invade westward, but Operation Barbarossa doesn’t seem like a hastily put-together patchwork but something that was long in the plan, something Hitler had been dreaming for all his life. And Stalin wasn’t a gambler. Maybe, if as Stalin predicted, the German-French War was a repeat of WWI with them bleeding each other dry, then the Soviets could move in to pick up the pieces. But the Germans totally destroyed the French, and Stalin couldn’t help but admire and fear the German military. Would he have risked everything with a war with Germany? Even if the Soviets could win, it would have been at great cost.
There’s also a theory that Hitler chose war as the result of economic problems, which makes his situation somewhat similar to FDR’s. Whereas the New Deal didn’t really work, the German recovery did work but at tremendous amount of deficit spending. Much of the recovery depended on debt, and war was a convenient way to effectively wipe out those debts as Germany would be master of Europe.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Ron Unz
I’m not sure I’ve ever encountered so boldly arrogant and delusional a troll anywhere on the Internet.
Your assessment above of the disinfo peddler using the handle ‘Patrick McNally’ (to deflect attention away from his Talmudic background), is a balanced and fair appraisal.
That said, competing with him for most delusional troll in UR, we do have the likes of John’s Johnson, MeanJooJoo, Twink/Twinkie, Corvinus and many others.
I’m sure you’ll concur that these clowns are right up with McNally in terms of their demonstrably false assertions and asinine commentary.
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Stormin Norman says:
As for the Holocaust and the 6 million figure, that number was discussed by the Zionist Conference lead by Theodore Herzl before 1900 that took place in Switzerland. Thus the Zionists were going to concoct a mass murder of Jews story for 1939 to 1945, WW2 even before the turn of the century of 1900. And as Norman Finkelstein, himself a Jew, has said, the Holocaust is a Shoa Business. This despite the fact that his parents died in a labor camp!
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Alden says:@BlackFlag
France had not recently annexed parts of Germany. In 1871, Prussia, not Germany invaded and annexed part of France. 47 years later, after the end of WW1 Germany surrendered Alsace back to France.
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James Scott says:@meamjojo
You jews are desperate for your liar narrative to stay alive. Its already dead and the next pogroms are on the way. This time no one is coming to the rescue.
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Haxo Angmark says:@Carlton Meyer
and some of the captured documents re Pike are in:
Auswartiges Amt 1939/41 No. 6, Secret Documents of the French General Staff (Berlin, 1941, 399 pp.)
it’s just a shame that the French managed to burn all their Secret Service files just before the Germans captured Paris. We’d know a hell of a lot more about the Encirclement Powers (France, Britain, America, Russia et al.) inception of both WWI and the 1939-45 Continuation War.
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Thanks Ron Unz, from Perú. I’m writing an historical novel about my german uncle, who fought in the second world war. On the good side, (die Luftwaffe). His father was married with my great aunt in 1915. When his father and mother dies (1922 and 1930), he traveled to Germany to live with his relatives. So, after the Great War, there we’re many orphans. In the Hitlerjugend he was happy again. On 1943 His plane was shot down in the North of África. He ended up in a concentration camp in Dallas, Texas. After the war, he returned to Germany. But in 1955 he was able to return to South América, Valparaíso, Chile. On his deathbed, 1992, he could say very proud just a phrase: Heil Hitler. He said goodbye to his father. His name was Andreas Hertzer Valdivia.
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Truth Vigilante says:@soll
Soll (I assume your handle is short for ‘Solomon’ ?), you’ve put up that video before in UR (the same video that was prepared by one of your fellow synagogue attendees).
It debunks nothing.
So quit with your nonsense. We know who you are and are all aware of your mischievous ways.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@anastasia
My grandfather served in WW2 as a cargo/personnel pilot and engine mechanic…no combat.
He returned believing the war was a mistake and a disaster for Europe. He said Americans were deceived about what Germany had been up to in Europe. He and many soldiers came to this conclusion while there, but stirring things up about it was near impossible for the average soldier.
The majority of soldiers were young men literally fighting for their lives and watching their comrades killed or blown to bits. This pressure and horror affects every soldier obviously, but no one can bear looking them in the eye and saying they are fighting and dying for a lie. Or telling their parents, wives and children the same.
He predicted that once the surviving soldiers were gone, more and more truth would be revealed.
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NotAnonymousHere says:@Brosi
#156 @Brosi:
This is why I call him a cuck. He claims to be this great patriot, but for decades he has watched Jews screw the country and the constitution he claims to love. This is the definition of a cuck.
The term you mention is a term used by homosexual faggots, boy shorts wearers and really:
Anyone who cannot cope, handle life, is generally afraid, fears life, hasn’t entered the arena, seen the elephant, or made the slightlest effort. You are suck a faggot.
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Shafar Nullifidian says:@Carolyn Yeager
Carol, I love it when you talk “dirty”!
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Truth Vigilante says:@Brosi
Ron Paul said and did nothing about it.
It looks to me like he loved the Constitution so much that he was willing to see it trashed rather than really put up a fight that might see it damaged and his political career ruined.
Damaged his political career ? Willing to see the constitution trashed ?? Are you serious ???
Dr Ron Paul M.D was a specialist obstetrician that delivered over 4000 babies during his career.
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Brosi says:@Truth Vigilante
Jizz of Oz should be on that list. For some reason Mr. Unz always patronizes him.
Fran Taubman should also be on that list too.
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Mefobills says:@Anonymous
Whereas the New Deal didn’t really work, the German recovery did work but at tremendous amount of deficit spending. Much of the recovery depended on debt, and war was a convenient way to effectively wipe out those debts as Germany would be master of Europe.
BS Mr. Anonymous.
The bill system used by Germany was “debt free” money. There was no deficit as there was no debt to be serviced.
You are stuck in a very Jewish way of thinking, such that all money must emanate from a debt instrument, or be borrowed from some sort of international creditor.
Germany prospered because of Oeffa and Mefo Bills, which were bills of credit. This is essentially the same system that the American Colonials ran and prospered under. And of course, the “London Creditor Class” went to war against the Colonials in the same way they aimed their ire at NSDAP Germany. The revolutionary war was precisely because the Bank of England forbade issuance of “Colonial Script” and this then caused a 10 year long depression.
Hitler had much more in common with the Founders than did FDR.
No way is a sovereign to issue its own money for the benefit of the population. The errant nation must be crushed in favor of “international” credit, especially in favor of privateering international credit issued by a corporatocracy. This credit is at debt, and hence international debt instruments are to be attached to the world. This then creates a creditor/debtor relation to the world. The creditor class then lives in finance centers, such as London, Wall Street, and Amsterdam. After French Revolution, they inserted themselves into Paris.
China is the latest example of a large sovereign nation using its own money, and this example to the world cannot be allowed to stand.
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Brosi says:@Carlton Meyer
Here is a link to the article about Operation Pike mentioned in Mr. Meyer’s video. I had to go to archive to access it. The article asserts that there were in reality 3 separate plans.
Britain Planned to Attack USSR on June 12, 1941
On January 19, 1940 French government charged Gamelin to prepare the plan of “direct invasion to Caucasus” (Balkan direction was also taken into consideration). Having reported about the “Southern Plan” — as it was officially dubbed at the French General Staff — General Gamelin has marked out its pros: “General theater of war would expand dramatically. Yugoslavia, Romania, Greece and Turkey would give us a reinforcement of 100 divisions. At the same time Sweden and Norway would hardly be able to give more than 10 divisions”.
Thus, an extensive anti-Soviet coalition of the regional states headed by England and France was about to be formed for the massive military strike against Soviet Union from the Caucasian and Balkan directions. Notably, the great Western powers were going to shed just the blood of their satellites (100 divisions!) that were to play the part of the cannon fodder. England and France conceived their participation in the war mostly as the air forces operations.
This plan was absolutely preposterous.
The third plan of the war against the USSR: ten days before 22nd of June
But even after the surrender of France, part of the British ruling class still continued to mature the plans of the attack against the USSR. In May-June, 1941 England managed to consolidate its positions at the Middle East. During the warfare against France — its former ally — Englishmen consolidated their grip over Syria and Lebanon. As a result of intervention, Iraqi government — that attempted to behave itself independently from England — was overthrown and the military bases of British air forces were reestablished at the north of Iraq once again. English historian J. Butler wrote that “in the end of May, 1941 a specific opinion emerged in London — the one expressing the idea that having created the threat to the Caucasian oil, it would be possible to exert the pressure against Russia in the most suitable way…On the 12th of June Heads of Staff Committee decided to assume the measures that would allow to conduct the strikes against the oil refining plants in Baku using the average bombers from Mosul in Iraqi Kurdistan without any delays”. It was just 10 days before Hitler’s offensive against the USSR…
This plan also seems ridiculous to me.
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John1955 says:@NotAnonymousHere
PK or PKM (M stands for “Modernized”)
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/PK_machine_gun.
Fires 7.62x54R or 7.62×51 NATO
RPK
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/RPK
Fires 7.62×39 5.45×39 5.56×45
Did I mention RPK ?
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Verymuchalive says:@Tom Welsh
Oh dear.
You:
‘Between 1945 and 1947, Turing lived in Hampton, London, while he worked on the design of the ACE (Automatic Computing Engine) at the National Physical Laboratory (NPL). He presented a paper on 19 February 1946, which was the first detailed design of a stored-program computer.Britannica:
Tom Kilburn, (born August 11, 1921, Dewsbury, Yorkshire, England—died January 17, 2001, Manchester), British engineer and coinventor of the first working computer memory. Kilburn also designed and built the first stored-program computer and led a team that produced a succession of pioneering computers over the next 25 years.Wikipedia
Tom Kilburn CBE FRS (11 August 1921 – 17 January 2001) was an English mathematician and computer scientist.[1][2] Over the course of a productive 30-year career, he was involved in the development of five computers of great historical significance. With Freddie Williams he worked on the Williams–Kilburn tube and the world’s first electronic stored-program computer, the Manchester Baby, while working at the University of Manchester. His work propelled Manchester and Britain into the forefront of the emerging field of computer science.[3][4][5]The Williams tube, or the Williams–Kilburn tube named after inventors Freddie Williams and Tom Kilburn, is an early form of computer memory.[1][2] It was the first random-access digital storage device, and was used successfully in several early computers.[3]
Kilburn didn’t present a paper, he actually designed and built actual computers and components of computers over a prolonged period. These were pioneering machines of great historical significance, at the very forefront of world technology. He was of very much greater significance than Alan Turing.
Kilburn didn’t even get a knighthood and there are no statues to him. There’s not even a proper biography of his life. He seems, barely 20 years after his death, to be largely forgotten. But that’s OK. Britain doesn’t have a computer industry anymore, so it’s not important.
Alan Turing's significance and accomplishments have been grossly exaggerated. But that’s OK, too. It’s what the Homoglobalists want.
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Mefobills says:@Carolyn Yeager
The question was, “what was Hitler trying to achieve in Poland?” There was never a direct answer to that.
The answer is that nobody really knows for sure. How is it that you can know, or Ron? It’s not possible.
What we can do is look at Hitler’s actions and infer what he thought about Poland.
You can tell something about a person’s ego:
Rydz, by appointment of Marshal Jozef Pilsudski, became commander of the Polish Military Organization and adopted the ‘nom de guerre’ of “Smigly” (Fast or Agile). He later added ‘Smigly’ as an integral part to his surname, which tells us something about his ego. His self-promoting renaming is similar to that of Loseb Jugashvili, who later took the name “Stalin” – Man of Steel.
Changing your name to cast an image is an ego problem. Egoic people in positions of power are a real problem for humanity. How to keep the defectives from attaching themselves to the levers of power?
Hitler had good relations with Pilsudski. Pilsudski in turn wanted the intermarrium, which would have created a buffer between Germany and Soviet Union.
Just before his death, Pilsudski re-emphasized that Poland should maintain neutral relations with Germany. The death of Pilsudki proved to be a great loss for Germany – a fact which Hitler himself expressed during the closing days of World War II.
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@Ron Unz
This very lightly moderated website attracts numerous elderly eccentrics, some of whom apparently have serious problems with reading comprehension.
LOL. But just young enough to lack living memory of WW2.
Happy 10 years of Unz Review.
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@John1955
Hindu Brahmins probably abide by the ironclad rule of our American Boston Brahmins: “Your name could be seen in the newspaper exactly 3 times 1.When you are born 2.When you get married 3. When you die”
My experience of working with them is that they never shut up. I simply can’t stand Hindu.
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Haxo Angmark says:@John Wear
alright…haven’t yet dredged up from my memory bank the f/h account that details Hess’s preparations for the Flight and, in particular, the long letter he addressed to Hitler explaining himself. Seems to me the mere fact that he did so suggests that H had no foreknowledge. But here’s another:
1. first go to http://winstonchurchill.org/resources/in-the-media/churchill-in-the-news/did-hitler-give-the-ok-for-hess-mission-to-england/
gist: subject is 1948 28-page Soviet interrogation transcript of (captured in 1945) Major Karlheinz Pintsch, who at the time of the Flight was Rudolf Hess’ military adjutant. Excerpt: “Hitler not surprised….read an excerpt from Hess’s letter” etc. etc. Bear in mind that Pintsch was being tortured (the Reds smashed both his hands) when he gave this account “suggesting” that Hitler knew, i.e., the Nazis and Brits were systematically engaged in secret peace negotiations…which was of course the Kremlin’s post-war propaganda line. Now
2. click on the link @ bottom to the original news source, the German (Jew-owned, left-wing) magazine Der Spiegel. Article there (May 5th, 2011) is headlined “Document Suggests Hitler Knew of Hess’ British Flight Plans”. Again, this based on Pintsch’s statements-under-torture. But, toward the end of article, Spiegel admits that in 1963 – when he was finally released back to Germany – Pintsch gave the lie to the Soviet transcript: “Hess said to me, ‘The Fuhrer does not know that I will make this attempt…’”.
you and Carolyn can read this thru, see what you think, and then fight about it some more. For my part, I repeat: if Hitler knew about and approved of Hess’s crackpot machination beforehand….there’s no need for Hess to leave behind a letter to Hitler apologizing for it.
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Verymuchalive says:@Ron Unz
I always thought Churchill’s mother ( Jenny Jerome ) had Amerindian ancestry, specifically Iriquois. Here’s an old story dealing with Churchill’s grandson and his trip to America to research this matter.
https://www.tampabay.com/archive/1999/10/12/churchill-s-grandson-visits-u-s-to-establish-his-indian-roots/Just like Sir Winston Churchill before him, Churchill clings to an old family belief that the clan has American Indian ancestry. Churchill has also recently concluded that his family tree boasts three ancestors who sailed on the Mayflower.
So far there doesn’t seem any evidence for this. But who knows ? At least this is a family tradition going back to the 19th Century at least, not a latter day concoction like Elizabeth Warren’s.
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marylinm says:
The WW2 was played almost a hundred years ago. The Holy Crusades, and Julius the Caesar even more so. Watching morons on the youtube endlessly slicing onions without uttering a single word is more fun, and free of the pulpit cacophony.
There is nothing to learn. Nothing. And never will. Stop lying to yourself.
Maurice de Talleyrand, a bastard, and a fervent Catholic-hater, donated on his death-bed all his ill-gotten wealth to the Catholic Church for the promise of absolution of his sins, and a license to enter heaven. Stupid is as stupid does, don’t it?
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Ann Nonny Mouse says:
There’s another point that I haven’t seem mentioned. The Hollow Hoax is really the Maccabean Ziocaust. The Jews have always exterminated assimilated Jews. That’s what the Maccabees were about in around 300 BC. Thats why they lined up to kill Paul on his return to Jerusalem. And the Talmudists exterminated the Hellenistic Jews for whom the Septuagint, the Bible in Greek, was written. And that Greek-speaking world was enormous: they probably killed over six million.
If there were assimilated Jews in Germany who didn’t want to leave Germany for Palestine, the Zionists had them killed.
The Nazis were not genocidal. The Jews always were.
Why call it the Holocaust when it was really the Maccabean Ziocaust?
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John Wear says:@Carolyn Yeager
You write to Ron Unz: “Hey, you are the one who put a gold border around John Wear’s reply to me that I easily struck down.”
My response: The following is from Rudolf Hess’s son, Wolf Rüdiger Hess:
“No one knows for sure whether my father undertook his flight with the knowledge and blessing of Adolf Hitler. Both men are now dead. All the available evidence, though, suggests that Hitler knew in advance of the flight:
First: Just a few days before his flight, my father had a private meeting with Hitler that lasted four hours. It is known that the two men raised their voices during portions of their talk, and that when they were finished, Hitler accompanied his Deputy to the ante-room, put his arm soothingly around his shoulder, and said: “Hess, you really are stubborn.”
Second: The relationship between Hitler and Hess was so close and intimate that one can logically assume that Hess would not have undertaken such an important step in the middle of a war without first informing Hitler.
Third: Although Hess’ adjutants and secretaries were imprisoned after the flight, Hitler intervened to protect Hess’ family. He saw to it that a pension was paid to Hess’ wife, and he sent a personal telegram of condolence to Hess’ mother when her husband died in October 1941.
Fourth: Among the papers released in June 1992 by the British authorities are two farewell letters my father wrote on June 14, 1941, the day before he tried to commit suicide in Mytchett Place, in England. The letters were written after he realized that his peace mission had definitely failed. One was addressed to Hitler and the other to his family. Both clearly confirm that his close relationship with Hitler still existed. If he had undertaken his now-obviously failed mission without Hitler’s prior knowledge, his relationship with Hitler clearly would no longer still have been one of trust.
And, fifth: Gauleiter Ernst Bohle, the Hess confident and high-ranking official who had helped my father to translate some papers into English, remained convinced until his death that all this was done with Hitler’s knowledge and approval.” (Source: Hess, Wolf R., “The Life and Death of My Father,” The Journal of Historical Review, January/February 1993, p. 31).
So, as Wolf Rüdiger Hess says, no one can say for sure whether Rudolf Hess undertook his flight with the knowledge and blessing of Adolf Hitler. Both men are now dead. However, the available evidence suggests that Hitler knew in advance of Hess’s flight to Scotland.
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Catdompanj says:@Mefobills
Wasn’t he the guy that beat back the joo Bolshevik Army at Warsaw, during the Russo-Polish war, saving Poland and forcing the retreating Communists into interment camps in East Prussia?
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Bankotsu says:@Peter Akuleyev
Poland in 1939 was a very anti-Russian country but was not as anti-German as it is today. A German Polish alliance was really in both countries’ best interests and had Hitler been a little more patient he could have cultivated the relationship…
There is some debate as to whether Poland planned a pre emptive strike against Germany in 1933 in order to overthrow the Nazi regime.
First strike: how the Poles wanted to launch a ‘preventive war’ against Hitler’s Germany
The Polish Blitz, More than a Mere Footnote to History: Poland and Preventive War with Germany, 1933
https://sci-hub.ru/10.1080/09592290903455667
https://libgen.is/scimag/10.1080%2F09592290903455667Did Pilsudski Attempt to Initiate a Preventive War in 1933?
https://sci-hub.ru/10.2307/1874988
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Wielgus says:@Dutch Boy
I wonder if you can supply the exact quote and the source – it seems a little too Machiavellian for Lewis, in my opinion.
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HeebHunter says:@Carlton Meyer
More evidence that the “english” as a race is long gone and whatever is left are just kike-loving cockroaches waiting to get RAIDed.
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Bankotsu says:@Dutch Boy
The British Christian intellectual C. S. Lewis had the most sensible idea about how Britain should deal with the German-Soviet war: supply both sides until they tore themselves to pieces.
That was the actual policy of the british government of Neville Chamberlain.
Chamberlain’s idea was to let Hitler expand eastwards until Germany came to a war with the Soviet Union. He wanted Germany to go eastwards to destroy the Soviet Union and let both Germany and Russia to destroy each other in a war of mutual annihilation. That was the plan.
As Prof Carroll Quigley put it:
…the British Conservative government had reached the fantastic idea that they could kill two birds with one stone by setting Germany and Russia against one another in Eastern Europe.
In this way they felt that the two enemies would stalemate one another, or that Germany would become satisfied with the oil of Rumania and the wheat of the Ukraine. It never occurred to anyone in a responsible position that Germany and Russia might make common cause, even temporarily, against the West. Even less did it occur to them that Russia might beat Germany and thus open all Central Europe to Bolshevism…
…In order to carry out this plan of allowing Germany to drive eastward against Russia, it was necessary to do three things:
(1) to liquidate all the countries standing between Germany and Russia;
(2) to prevent France from honoring her alliances with these countries; and
(3) to hoodwink the English people into accepting this as a necessary, indeed, the only solution to the international problem.The Chamberlain group were so successful in all three of these things that they came within an ace of succeeding, and failed only because of the obstinacy of the Poles, the unseemly haste of Hitler, and the fact that at the eleventh hour…”
http://www.yamaguchy.com/library/quigley/anglo_12b.html
http://www.carrollquigley.net/books.htmSee also pages 284, 559, 576, 608, of this book “Tragedy and Hope’; the entire story is told there.
http://www.carrollquigley.net/pdf/Tragedy_and_Hope.pdf
Unfortunately this truth of WWII history is uncomfortable to the british public so no british person will support such views on origins of WWII. No one will discuss it. No one will debate it. No one will promote it. They prefer complete drivel and fake history.
Only a non British person is able to tell the truth about WWII.
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@Ron Unz
“My point was that he was probably willing to reestablish a (reduced) independent Polish state as part of a peace agreement with the Allies.”
No doubt….
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Zane says:
Wait!!!! Hitler wasn’t the most evil man to ever live???
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Jim Richard says:
Covers these subjects extensively : https://www.inconvenienthistory.com/
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Jim Richard says:@mijj
Police officer ” You’re drunk, lady.” Lady ” Thank God! I thought something was wrong with my car.”
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@bert33
Modern germany is a much better place for having evolved into what it is today, a country where its legal to be jewish or kinda stupid or gay
So which are you: Jewish, Stupid or Gay?
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soll says:@Steve Naidamast
Adolf Hitler and his lieutenants tried every negotiation tactic they could think of with Poland to reach a negotiated settlement to stop the Polish from violently oppressing their German minority and return Danzig to The Reich.
Poland was a poor nation still recovering from their refounding in 1918. Poland’s own economy was dependent upon Germany being its main exporter, you simps believe that both Poland and the Soviet Union were allegedly bullying the supreme master “race” of the Universe?
Some mental gymnastics in cognitive dissonance. Hitler had the only motive of gain by attacking and breaking both his Non Aggression Pacts of 1934 and 1939 with his invasions of both Poland and the USSR. What did either Poland or the Soviet Union have to gain by attacking Germany?
Nothing.
And to return Danzig to the Third Reich? Danzig (Gdańsk) had been established as a Polish city port 800 years before Germany even existed. Hitler, the world’s famous house painter should have created a minority exchange program for his fellow blondies.
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BuelahMan says:
Ron,
Thank you for outlining your thoughts in this way.
You are but one of a very few jewish sources that will admit what you have admitted (that the holohoax is bogus).
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Wokechoke says:@Anonymous
Interesting narrative. One other thing…The British and French establishments were attempting to rescue jews and their assets in Poland.
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Petermx says:@Alden
No, it was France that declared war on Germany first, after mobilizing their army. The territory that Germany took from France, Alsace-Lorraine, is an ethnically German area where their first language is German. After the French took Alsace-Lorraine from Germany at the end of WW I, the French tried to “Frenchify” the population by forcing the French language on them, by changing street signs to the French language and I’m sure in other ways too. The population still speaks German, but I believe many speak French as a second language now. I was there many years ago.
Many people are stupid because they are taught to be stupid, they are lied to and these lies are forced on the whole world until everyone is stupid. That’s what Ron Unz’s article is about. Along those lines, the media has tried to distinguish the Germans that make up Alsace-Lorraine as “Alsatians”, claiming they have their own language – “Alsatian.” This is a deliberate lie. Before Germany became a unified country it was made up of many different states, and there were many different German dialects. Some are so different that one German might not understand another German. This is not unique to Germany. Before Italy was unified, they had many different dialects too. The liars that justified taking Alsace-Lorraine from Germany, while at the same time proclaiming “self-determination” as their justification for stealing parts of Austria and creating Czechoslovakia and Yugoslavia, tried to suggest Alsatians are not German speakers or ethnically German. They are both, just as the German speakers in Switzerland (the majority population in Switzerland) are ethically German. Like Alsatian, Swiss Germans have their own dialect, as all of the German areas had before unifying and creating Germany in 1871. But all Germans, including Alsatians and Swiss Germans, speak hochdeutsch, or High-German, essentially the Prussian dialect, allowing everyone to communicate.
I lived in Ecuador a few years ago and met a young French guy who said something about the Alsatians being “unfriendly” or something like that, to French speakers. I had never heard that before, but I wanted to tell him how France got that area, and that their ethnic Germans. It wouldn’t surprise me if the French are as ignorant as everyone else.
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Wim says:@Carlton Meyer
This myth appeared several years after the end of the war and remains strong. Hungary was seeking a return of land lost in 1920 and threatened to invade Slovakia and Czechia. Both nations sought protection from Germany. Germany agreed to allow free trade as they became protectorates. Their governments and armies remained as crowds cheered the arrival of German troops to deter Hungary.
Can you show any treaty, law or newspaper article from that time proving this?
I read what Chamberlain signed in 1938 in Munich and when I was in his shoes I probably wouldn’t have signed it. Not out of love for Czechoslovakia but because the way it treated ethnic Czechs in the Sudetenland. That gave quite a different image of Hitlers attitude towards the Czechs.
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Munga Bulga says:
Prostitute ZOG-Germoney abused anew as a center of provocation. Not far from there, the NS2 pipes were blown up by the “allies”. Those who are “friends” with Jewrica no longer need any other enemies. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_Defender_23
https://www.dw.com/en/nato-air-defender-23-is-its-biggest-exercise-ever/a-65872291
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@Tiptoethrutulips
Among such articles we find that Jews have, dozens of times before WWII, invoked the cabalisitc “6,000,000″ number as the amount of Jews on the verge of death and destruction during various periods of turmoil and conflict in Europe and Russia.”
“…in the vigorous insurrection led by Bar-Cocheba, the pseudo messiah, in which nearly six million Jews lost their lives together with the famous Rabbi Akiva, one of the pseudo messiah’s most ardent adherents ( 135 A. D. ).” The Open Court, Vol. XI, May, 1897, pgs. 179-180
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soll says:@Mefobills
In defense of Hitler, he probably knew things that Schacht didn’t,
Hitler was known as a house painter, never was he an economist.
about threats facing Germany. Schacht understood things that Hitler didn’t.
In other words, Hitler was a paranoid conspiracy theorist who chased shadows in the dark, while Schacht was an acclaimed economist who had recovered the short-lived hyperinflation of 1922-1923 in 1924 (as caused not by the myth of reparations of 1919–being the excuse used by the Germans in 1922 to avoid paying the French, instead Germany’s hyperinflation had already started prior to 1919 and before reparations was even a idea, caused during the First World War).
https://heimbergecon.substack.com/p/fiscal-austerity-and-the-rise-of uphttps://tobirommel.com/research/hyperinflation/
Schacht was fired by Hitler in 38,
Void of context. Schacht was eventually fired after his many public speeches made against Hitler for running the German economy into the ground. It was long coming. Why did Hitler wait so long to fire Schacht?
Why did Hitler even sideline his own mentor of Feder for Schacht? Feder who learnt Hitler every he knew on economics (not much) was furious that his decade in advocating for monetary reform was IGNORED by Hitler.
Schacht on Hitler and Feder.
“National Socialist agitators led by Gottfried Feder had carried on a vicious campaign against private banking and against our entire currency system. Nationalisation of banks, abolition of bondage to interest payments, and introduction of state Giro ‘Feder’ money, these were the high-sounding phrases of a pressure group which aimed at the overthrow of our money and banking system. To keep this nonsense in check… I succeeded in dissuading Hitler from putting into practice the most foolish and dangerous of the ideas on banking and currency harboured by his party colleagues.” The Magic of Money, p. 49
In 1934 Hitler blocked the Reich budgets from publication so that all throughout 1934-1945 no one in Germany knew of the fiscal policies of the State (done to hide his armement spending); and then Hitler made himself tax-exempt on his then 1.2 million annual income. The feat of Hitler as an “economist.”
hence the Jews controlling the show trials could not kill Schacht.
The usual nameless Jews? You guys have allegedly been exposing this New World Order for decades–and none of you have even learnt the names of these shadowry people! It’s shadow chasing in the dark. The Who’s? Not the “Jews.”
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Ron Unz says:@Carolyn Yeager
This article doesn’t strike me as a genuine question-answer article. You have assembled lots of stuff you’ve written in the past that you like to and want to recycle, and then provided “questions” from Mike Whitney to fit them. But they don’t even fit that well. I have the impression you composed the whole thing yourself.
Look, you’re an elderly crank. The reason you’re spending so much time on this website is because almost nobody visits your own.
Mike Whitney happened to read my WWII book and told me he was totally shocked by the material I had presented, so shocked that he ended up reading the book three separate times.
He therefore suggested that he send me a series of interview questions on the subject, which are exactly the ones you see. I used those questions as a framework for summarizing and distilling much of the previous material I’d published over the last five years, including links to many of the more important underlying articles. I provided him my responses and he bolded those portions of the text that he thought should be emphasized. I then published everything just as he returned it.
The response has been very strong. I think this one article has attracted several times more readership in the last 24 hours than your entire website has drawn in the last 30 days, which is probably the reason you’re being so quarrelsome and disagreeable.
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@Anonymous
It appears to me – and recent columns by Philip Giraldi have also pointed this out – that the Jewish US Neocons have a thing for Russia. They hate Russia. I suspect this is due to the poor treatment, the various pogroms, etc. that historically occurred.
“The Jewish question seems unanswerable…Pogroms were rumored to be taking place, but I considered the rumors to have been grossly exaggerated for there were no ocular proofs of the massacre of thousands of Jews.”—Sir Adrian Carton de Wiart V. C.
“The disorders of November 21 to 23 in Lemberg became, like the excesses in Lithuania, a weapon of foreign anti-Polish propaganda. The press bureau of the Central Powers, in whose interest it lay to discredit the Polish Republic before the world, permitted the publication of articles * * * in which an eye-witness estimated the number of victims between 2,500 and 3,000, although the extreme number furnished by the local Jewish committee was 76.”—BRIGADIER GENERAL JADWIN (The Morgenthau Report)
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Munga Bulga says:
Lord Hopkins is once again seducing his unenlightened islanders into anti-German hate propaganda (that’s what the guy “lives” on). https://off-guardian.org/2023/06/13/new-normal-germany-blues/
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Petermx says:@Anonymous
“Hitler also requested a corridor between Germany proper and East Prussia…” Justifiably so. By right, all that land, from the new German border, all the way up to the Memelland and Memel, the German city Lithuania invaded in 1923 and took for itself, should have been returned to Germany. By right, Poland would be a landlocked country. Hitler also proposed a plebiscite – have the population vote for which country they would want to be part of, but the Poles rejected that, knowing most of the population was ethnically German and would have voted to rejoin Germany. That was when Hitler came up with the idea of a corridor to allow a route through the “Polish Corridor” connecting East Prussia to the rest of Germany. Without it they would be isolated, without fuel, energy and other things they need to survive.
Hitler proposed the people vote for which country they wanted to be a a part of, rejoin their fellow Germans, or become part of Poland. If they decided to rejoin Germany, then Poland would get a route to the sea, if the population opted for Poland, Germany would get a route to East Prussia.
The best solution would have been for France and England to mind their own business and apply their high minded morality to their colonies and serfs in India, Algeria and elsewhere. Then they would still be world powers, and along with Germany, Europe would still rule the world, and 60 million people would not have been killed in WW II.
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Petermx says:@soll
“Hitler was known as a house painter.” He and other Germans are known for many things, thanks to people of your ilk. He was an artist, not a house painter, stupid. He sold paintings to make a meager living and applied to the art academy but was not admitted. He was never a house painter.
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whew says:
if only Hitler had seen the Light of Reason and expanded the living space somewhere where it wouldn’t bother anyone – Africa was underpopulated to the extreme then, and Germany owned quite a bit of land prior to Versaille. had the Germans decided to build a nice sexy navy they could have easily reclaimed their positions there. that land was multiples of what they wanted in Europe, where their claims were weak. Germans had no problem administering land where Germans were a minority, even nonexistent (with the intent of colonizing it); yet, they were upset when others administered land with Germans. it is that hypocrisy that led them to war, and while it is obvious the Rothschilds gang agitated for war too, it would be silly to pretend that Hitler had no role to play in starting the war.
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Dieter Kief says:@Petermx
About the once German, now French Alsace-Lorraine you wrote:
The population still speaks German, but I believe many speak French as a second language now. I was there many years ago.
It is now the other way around: The French languge rules. A few old folks still speak German – the young: Mostly not.
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Wielgus says:@marylinm
He was an ordained priest and was made Bishop of Autun before the French Revolution. Possibly imminent death made him hedge his bets. He was a famous opportunist.
It is said that Voltaire on his own deathbed was told by a priest to renounce the devil. Voltaire replied that this was no time to be making enemies.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Rurik says:@John Wear
… Hitler knew in advance of Hess’s flight to Scotland.
It was the fact that he was treated so uniquely, (as a huge embarrassment to ZOG), that suggests that his offer came from Hitler, (or it would have been meaningless).
Especially since we all know Hitler did not want war with England and the West, as it was eastern ZOG, ((Soviets)) that was the immediate existential threat.
Hitler and Hess simply underestimated (surprisingly) the degree to which ZOG had rotted out the governments of the West- and Perfidious, (and Churchill) in particular- and ZOG’s maniacal fervor to destroy Germany at all costs.
[At least from this layman’s perspective..]
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Aleatorius says:
Between the wise Ron Unz and the weasel Elie Weisel my choice in whom to believe regarding the WWII and its treatment of Jews is rather clear … I choose sanity over insanity.
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@soll
Poland was a poor nation still recovering from their refounding in 1918.
Just about all Poles are liars, just like Jews. You are no exception (there are exceptions — to everything). Poles are the closest thing to Jews that I know. For centuries, Polish territory was filled with more Jews per capita (so-called Polish Jews) than any other nation on earth. That could explain why Poles have so many traits we associate with Jews.
I don’t waste my time ‘arguing’ with lying Jews, nor do I anymore waste my time arguing with lying Poles. You are the latter. In essence, Poland was always a poor nation and no matter how much it is given, it reverts back to a poor, begging nation once again. Because Poles cannot or will not comprehend why this is, they’re in the habit of blaming the big boys on either side of them — Germany and Russia. Those intelligent souls in Poland who try to buck this tide are accused of being anti-Polish.
If Poles want to be taken seriously in adult conversation, they need to overcome all these bad habits.
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Thrallman says:@meamjojo
“Those who control the past control the future.”
–Orwell“No one really learns from or pays attention to history anyway, so it really doesn’t matter if it is right or wrong.”
–meamjojo“Subject change = fail”
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@whew
The problem with colonizing Africa is that native Africans become white civilization adjacent, thereby increasing their populations exponentially. Then Europeans are outnumbered and assailed from all sides. You can not “manage” them in any meaningful way other than by force. And eventually, their numbers are just too great. Eurocentric society in Africa has been an exercise in futility.
Besides, Danzig and much of the disputed territories in Europe were full of ethnic Germans. It made sense to try to bring them back into the fold.
As nearly everyone on this site says, Hitler’s greatest crime was throwing off the yoke of central banking. And, getting the Jews out of positions of influence in Germany.
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Rurik says:@Brosi
always patronizes him.
apparently, they go way back, before even The Unz Review, which is a circumstance that the lizard takes relentless advantage of, and pesters Mr. Unz relentlessly with puerile grumbling, every time the lizard disapproves of some truth Mr. Unz is chasing.
‘hey Ron, hey Ron, how is it good for the Jews that you’re saying that?? Hey Ron, stop talking about 9/11, (NordStream/Holocaust/ect..). Hey Ron… hey Ron…’
It’s painful to watch, because you can just see Mr. Unz’ patience straining under the barrage of pompous idiocy that flows from the lizard.
><
And also, FWIW, I agree with TruthV about Ron Paul. He's a one in a hundred million man of integrity and decency. A throwback to an era when some American leaders had principles.
I don't begrudge him for not saying 'the Jews and treasonous scum like Cheney did 9/11 to get us into wars for Israel', and so forth..
Would you go to a Thanksgiving dinner and say that? Even tho you know you'll alienate a lot of the people there, and destroy the dinner, and make the hostess hate you for being such a jerk and ruining her event?
when you could have waited until the brandy and cigars afterwards and discussed it later with Rand and others, to strategize, and so forth.. 'But how could they get everyone to all lie about 9/11?, (someone's niece might ask). And then Dr. Paul could explain, 'you just don't understand. Congress are basically self-serving scum, (except Thomas Massie and a couple of others..) who take buckets of shekels to serve the special interests, at the direct expense of their constituents and the nation, every time. I know. I've worked with these treasonous snakes for many years, and they're rotten to the core'. Which is why they've been selected.'
And so on.
But you don't have conversations like with a wider audience until people are ready for that message.
It's for us, to prepare the people for that message. IMHO
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Alden says:@Petermx
Alsace was French territory for hundreds of years. Until the end of the Franco Prussian war in 1871. At which time Prussia not Germany squired Alsace. Alsace was returned to France in 1918. 47 years as a Prussian then German possession vs hundreds of years as a French possession. Yes, Alsace was a bilingual country.
But so was southern France, Brittany and the Paris metro region. It wasn’t really until about 1900 that all French people spoke standard public school French. Until the late 19th century any draftee who spoke standard French as well as a local language was made a sergeant as soon as basic training was finished. Until about 1900 every court hearing and deposition had two court reporters One for standard French and one for the local language. Except for Paris metro area. Where standard French has been spoken and taught for hundreds of years.
Brittany Gascony Dordogne and dozens of other areas had their own languages up to 1900. Alsace was dual French German. And not the standard German taught in the public schools of Germany. Most of southern France was still dual standard French and Occitan before 1900. Every country in Europe had more than one language. One of the purposes of compulsory free public schools in the 19th century was to unify the language . So everyone could understand each other.
The ignorance of the men of UNZ never ceases to amaze. 47 years of occupation vs hundreds of years.
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Patrick McNally says:@Wokechoke
Poland had been partitioned between Germany and Russia in times past, and they justifiably remained suspicious of attempts by either power to draw them in too far. But Poland was certainly better off with 4 decades of Soviet dominance than they would have been with a Hitler victory. Hitler’s ambitions went well beyond simply maintaining a foreign political system within Poland.
—–
Once more the Fuehrer underlined that there must be one master for the Poles, and this is the German: two masters could not and must not exist next to each other, hence all representatives of the Polish intelligentsia are to be killed. This may sound harsh, but it is the law of life. The Government General is a reservation for the Poles, one vast Polish labor camp.
—–
— Max Domarus, Hitler: Speeches and Proclamations, Volume 3, p. 2100.Despite the willingness of Soviet authorities to execute Polish officers who refused to declare loyalty to the USSR, there was no general plan by Soviet authorities to turn the Polish populace into uneducated beasts of burden. As long as people remained nominally obedient to the party-line, they could go on developing their own educational system which created the basis for the political movements of the 1980s. This was certainly preferable to a victory by Hitler.
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Alden says:@marylinm
Talleyrand wasn’t a bastard. He resented being forced into the priest hood by his father in his teens. Everyone active in the French Revolution hated the Catholic Church. Because;
1 They were Masons.
2 The church owned massive amounts of real estate. The Masons and revolutionaries wanted to confiscate it. Just as the successful American revolutionaries confiscated the property of the Loyalist Americans after our revolution. And the communists did in Russia, Cuba and other countries where they were successful.
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@Ron Unz
You look. Being elderly has nothing to do with it. You accuse everyone who strongly disagrees with you of being a “crank.” You accuse “conspiracy theorists”, of whom many are here, of being “cranks.” Nor am I jealous of your traffic. I understand Internet traffic and how it’s built. I don’t care about it. For you, numbers are everything. You’re a bean counter. You count the number of words in your articles and judge it’s importance by that. You count how many times certain words are used, no matter how, and judge their importance by that. Of course, you count the number of hits, of visitors, and judge the importance of a web site or a book by that. Not everyone judges in that way.
This site is as popular as it is bc of the commenting option — the ease, the freedom from censorship or banning, the diverse viewpoints. That’s your great achievement. Much more so than your articles and, with them, mostly readers are excited by your take on the holohoax and Hitler/WWII. That’s the big deal here. Admittedly, you’re quite late to the party. That’s alright, but it is shameful if people get the idea/push the idea that Ron Unz is the ground-breaker here. However, I join in with an appreciation for your many articles here on that important subject, but with reservations.
You may have noticed that the interest in Kevin MacDonald’s Occidental Observer has diminished since he cut out free commenting. Internet users tend to be more interested in what they and their friends and enemies say than in the content of the articles presented. They want to enter the dialogue. In my case, I never allowed all comments. If I had, as you do, I would have had scads of them, mostly ugly or dumb, and I didn’t want to host that. I wanted only intelligent discussion.
No hard feelings. I take it as it comes. Age works in my favor in my willingness to simply speak the truth as I see it. I’m actually getting better at it.
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whew says:@Tiptoethrutulips
there is no moral code that dictates Africans should access adjacent White civilization. the South Africans made that mistake, because of the Anglo-Zio influence, they used the Africans as cheap/slave labor only to later get screwed by that policy. the horror show in South Africa today is being committed by non-native Africans in South Africa, all imported labor in the last 1-2 centuries.
i’m not disputing the German desire for Danzig, or the Sudetenland. but it was hypocritical, as i noted: Germans had no qualms ruling over non-Germans, they only became mad about that sort of thing when they were on the receiving end even when they were being treated better than they treated others (there is no evidence that Germans were mistreated in so-called Sudetenland, for example – except that they weren’t allowed to secede, which would’ve been hypocritical of them anyway since they did not tolerate that when others desired it, and the Germans were treated for that desire like they treated others for that same desire when they were in charge, so no complaints are warranted).
yes, Hitler’s greatest crime was throwing out the bankers, and good for him. it would’ve been a better world had the Germans won, no doubt about it. the point, tho, is they were not the pure angels too many in-the-know people make them out to be (in-the-know meaning: understanding the lies of WW2 like the Holohoax). the Germans were not motivated by the pure desire of helping humanity, they were in fact selfish and in it for themselves. they acted hypocritically in their desires. i would’ve preferred if they won, but i’m no fool to believe they were innocent of empire.
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Munga Bulga says:@Munga Bulga
Of course, I could make a joke out of simply manipulating the comment rating using a simple proxy (easy!). But I am not as sneaky as Mr. Hopkins and his stupid readers.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Ron Unz
.
Look, you’re an elderly crank.
Well, it takes one to know one.
I couldn’t resist because that somewhat corny response comes readily to mind as the wit of one almost as eminent and famous as the Führer of Unz Review, a Cardinal no less whom I teased with saying something because he was a well known left-winger, eliciting the “it takes one to know one” response.
At least I won’t chew up your newsprint by raising another insult of yours in a separate comment. I would like you to justify your disparaging and insulting Patrick McNally convincingly. You refer to him (or her or it) as “Patrick McNally” but is he not established as a real person with that name – and skme family connection to a other McNally scholar or journalist?
And your condemnation of him seems to turn on his regarding Robert Wilton as less reliable than you do. That is not very persuasive as Patrick McNally gives evidence of a depth of reading at least as impressive as yours and starting earlier in life and going on longer. You seem to dismiss him as though he’s really a Jewish (probably) hired gun for the ADL or AIPAC who enjoys the game of discrediting your scholarship and judgment.
He could be doing just that if you don’t take counter-attacking more seriously.
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Alden says:@Carlton Meyer
Edward wasn’t pro German. Like most British, he was anti war in the 1930s. The British military, politicians and big business , the Powers That Be were anti war. Because they knew that WW1 was the beginning of the end for Britain. The middle and lower classes were anti war t because of the millions of dead and permanently disabled soldiers from WW1. And memories of the severe depression in the early 1920s caused by the war.
Edward was forced out by his own family, especially his father the previous King. His father made a will that left Edward very little money if he became King. And a very high income if he abdicated. The endless anti Edward propaganda was promulgated by the royal family until his death.
As for his visit to Germany, prominent people from all over Europe visited Germany in the 1930s. Partly because Germany was always a major tourist industrial science and foreign student country. Partly to view the German economic miracle. Germany and Italy were the only European countries that didn’t suffer during the 1930s depression. Because of fascist economics.
I’ve always known that Edward was forced out by his own family. There’s a YouTube titled A very British Coup that corroborates what I’ve learned. You will enjoy it.
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Patrick McNally says:@Ron Unz
> Western diplomatic and intelligence experts agrees it was absolutely overwhelming. Leading modern scholars say the same thing,
No, the latter does not say what you like to claim. Just to take one book which has often been favorably cited by clowns who have never bothered to read it:
“The Jewish share of the Party’s Central Committee in 1919-21 remained steady at about one-fourth.”
— Yuri Slezkine, The Jewish Century, p. 176, Princeton University Press, 2004.This only applies, of course, to a higher-level organization such as the Central Committee. Within the Party as a whole the percentage membership was obviously much less than the one-fourth which Slezkine gives for the Central Committee. You’re way of starting with something like 60% and then working up from there shows that you are completely deluded about what the real data supports. That is exactly clap-trap which fools and liars like David Francis and Robert Wilton used to repeat back in the 1920s. No authentic historical investigation has ever come close to vindicating anything like what you wish to imagine.
If you merely wished to argue that having around 25% of the Central Committee be of Jewish background was an overrepresentation of Jews their share of the population, then no one would dispute that. Of course, when it comes to that we have to acknowledge that any government capable of holding authority in Russia at that time would have at least a similar proportion of Jews. The Social Revolutionaries and the Mensheviks were the only parties had any popular support that was able to compete with the Bolsheviks, and these parties had traditionally had many more Jewish members than the latter. Only White pogroms forced a general turn by the mass of Jews in favor of the Bolsheviks.
If we were going to go beyond the Central Committee which Slezkine was talking about and look at the general party, then Jews as a percentage of the party were 5.2 in 1922 and 4.3 in 1927 (Nora Levin, The Jews in the Soviet Union Since 1917, Volume 2, p. 760, New York University Press, 1988). The higher ratio of one-quarter which Slezkine only applies to something like the Central Committee.
Since you seem to think that you know of some kind of recent academic source which assigns a level of Jewish membership to the party (whether in top ranks or throughout the party as a whole) as starting from a low estimate of 60% and going up from there, then I can only urge you to list whatever reference you believe you have. Rumormongering from Vladimir Putin or David Francis does not count.
In the meantime, let’s go back over some of what Slezkine asserts:
—–
The proportion of Jews in the Cheka as a whole was not very high (compared to what White propaganda often alleged): 3.7 percent of the Moscow apparatus, 4.3 percent of Cheka commissars, and 8.6 percent of senior (“responsible”) officials in 1918, and 9.1 percent of all members of provincial Cheka offices (Gubcheka) in 1920. As in the Party, the majority of Cheka members were Russians, and by far the most over-represented group were the Latvians, consistently and successfully cultivated by Lenin as the Praetorian Guards of the Revolution (35.6 percent of the Moscow Cheka apparatus, 52.7 percent of all Cheka senior officials, and 54.3 percent of all Cheka commissars, as compared to about 0.09 percent in the country as a whole and about 0.5 percent in Moscow). But even in the Cheka, Bolsheviks of Jewish origin combined ideological commitment with literacy in ways that set them apart and propelled them upward. In 1918, 65.5 percent of all Jewish Cheka employees were “responsible officials.” Jews made up 19.1 percent of all central apparatus investigators and 50 percent (6 out of 12) of the investigators employed in the department for combating counter-revolution. In 1923, at the time of the creation of the OGPU (the Cheka’s successor), Jews made up 15.5 percent of all “leading” officials and 50 percent of the top brass (4 out of 8 members of the Collegium’s Secretariat).
—–
— Slezkine, Jewish Century, p. 177.Again, this just squares with what I said already. It doesn’t show anything like the 60+% which you’ve claimed. But it squares simply with an overrepresentation of Jews and other ethnic minorities such as Latvians. With regards to that, of course, it should be kept in mind that Russians had always been underrepresented within the Czarist state. The reason that a Pole like Denikin or a Romanian like Kolchak became leaders of the White forces was because most Russians had always been kept in a state of illiteracy. It took the Soviet government a couple decades to repair this problem left over from Czarist times.
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Wizard of Oz says:@anastasia
It is unfortunate when nice people like you start learning
about some of one s own countries’ evils in the past and then recognising the grossness of some of today’s departures from
the ideal and then have your mind so addled that you cannot see how unnacceptable to you, if you are a liberal (traditional sense) product of the enlightenment and modernity, the existence of regimes such as those of Hitler and Stalin and Putin in powerful countries must be. Even Xi in China, who seems less barbarous, has to be failed because he has monopolised so much power for himself and made himself almost irremovableAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
@John Wear
So is this all a quote from where you write ‘Wolf Rudiger Hess’ all the way to where we read (Source: Hess, Wolf R., “The Life and Death of My Father,” The Journal of Historical Review, January/February 1993, p. 31)? IOW, your entire comment. You imagine this is an answer to my takedown of your previous (first) comment? Dear John, it’s only more of the same from you. You rely on sentiment when you can’t quote from an author who supplies definite facts. Wolf Hess, the son who wants to speak in favor of his father, supplies only speculation and omission of what is inconvenient. You speak of “the available evidence” but the fact of the matter is that you have supplied zero evidence that Hitler knew & approved. Zero.
The fact of the matter is that you are a moron. A moron is defined as a person whose intellectual limit is the equivalent of 12 years of age/6th grade level. This fits you to a tee. You function just fine, and can do a lot as a grown man, but you have your limits. Among your limits is that you can’t do complexity. That’s why you have so many fans who appreciate your very simple approach, simple writing style, simple ideas, and lots of virtue signalling. I gave you some podcast links – did you listen to any? I listened to the relevant parts in two of them last night; it wasn’t difficult nor did it take much time. I actually enjoyed hearing myself and I held my interest.
Come to think of it, I have never heard you in a recorded interview. Are there any?I am not trying to hurt you, but the truth comes first. I have to take some time for myself right now (exercise), and then I’ll return to fill in why I’m right and you’re wrong. Stay tuned.
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@Dieter Kief
The French languge rules. A few old folks still speak German – the young: Mostly not.
I am not sure whether the sentiment matches the linguistics, even if that is true. When I visited a French friend of mine the first thing he told me was his German neighbor got into a lawsuit with him to move the stones lining his driveway over a few centimeters which cost him thousands of euros in order to correct the boundary. I don’t think that place can ever stay peaceful for long.
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pachacuti says:
Cheerleading historian Victor Davis Hanson (R) says America intervened in WW2 because the Axis powers were killing just too many Slavs and Chinese. Now we’ve read a lot about Europe and the Jews, but nothing on the situation of the Japanese in China.
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Patrick McNally says:@BlackFlag
> Regardless of German intentions, all major powers were expansionary.
Without a doubt, but it was still pretty stupid for German leaders to take the path they did. Bismarck seems to have been more sensible on this point. From the time of the founding of the Secon Reich in 1871 it was apparent that Germany was increasingly penetrating world markets without needing colonies. The few colonies which Kaiser Wilhelm II managed to claim after he had dismissed Bismarck didn’t really add that much to the German economy. It would have been better if Wilhelm II had simply adopted an attitude towards Britain and the other powers similar to what Japan and China have done throughout much of the last 70 years with the USA. That is, let Britain remain the Empire on which the sun never sets, don’t attempt to challenge the British navy, but simply keep expanding German trade around the world. There’s no evidence that Britain would have raised a general war if this had been followed.
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@Rurik
apparently, they go way back, before even The Unz Review, which is a circumstance that the lizard takes relentless advantage of, and pesters Mr. Unz relentlessly with puerile grumbling, every time the lizard disapproves of some truth Mr. Unz is chasing.
Classic Punch and Judy. The “dissident” right sock puppet and the “establishment” left sock puppet.
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@Anonymous
Suvarov (pseudonym, see: https://www.unz.com/runz/why-everything-you-know-about-world-war-ii-is-wrong/#comment-6006734 ) points out that the Soviet army, equipped for a war of offense, was at the USSR/Poland border, deployed for an invasion of Germany rather than defense of Soviet territory, when Hitler attacked.
Had Hitler left his army in France for occupation duty or even if the Soviets had attacked 3 weeks earlier, Germany would have quickly lost its heartland, and its surviving forces (even if numerous) would have had no logistical support and would have lost to the Soviets when they ran out of supplies (to include ammunition, but also food, medical support, etc.). See:
and Suvorov, “Icebreaker”. For a counter, see:
, which IMHO is an exercise in Postmodernist rhetoric, essentially a prosecutor’s case with no cross examination. For example, Soviet forces took the “deep penetration and high mobility” idea far more seriously than even the Germans. Their idea was to wait until there was effectively no opposition (originally through war between Western countries as in WW I, or, in the event, wait until almost all Germany’s armed forces were physically in France and then occupy Germany). For this, they did not need heavily armored forces, but rather light and mobile forces — which they had. Note that the German armored force was technically inferior to the French tanks, but was much better deployed as France was relying on WW I firepower to win, but by the time they could deploy it effectively their targets had accomplished their assigned mission and moved on. The Soviet forces would, if they attacked first, have faced even less effective opposition than had the German forces in France.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Patrick McNally
You know how unlikely it is that you will elicit an apology, thanks, or even an admission of the most obvious error but please do not give up on readers who value the product of your eide reading and judgment.
BTW I was glad to see your citing of Yuri Slezkine’s book which I gave to a young family member with Jewish professor grandfather several years ago.
And while I am ensuring this appears as a reply to your Comment allow me to ask if you think Ron is likely to learn something valuable and amend some of his judgments if he reads this brilliant piece of writing
Perhaps a bit too 1930s Freudianfor my tastes, but full of insights as well as sparkling, n’est-ce pas?
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soll says:@Carolyn Yeager
Just about all Poles are liars, just like Jews. You are no exception (there are exceptions — to everything). Poles are the closest thing to Jews that I know.
Hasty generalization fallacy.
For centuries, Polish territory was filled with more Jews per capita (so-called Polish Jews) than any other nation on earth.
Shocking news CY. What does all this mean?
That could explain why Poles have so many traits we associate with Jews.
Which such “traits”? Poles were directly responsible for mass killing of Jews following WW2. While extorting them during the War. see, ‘Golden Harvest’ by Jan Gross (Oxford, 2016).
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Dutch Boy says:@Wielgus
I read the quotation years ago and cannot recall the source. Those who heard it were shocked at Lewis’s blunt Machiavellianism. States are not run with Pater Nosters, according to one of Machiavelli’s contemporaries.
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@the Man Behind the Curtain
First, a metacomment about the comment stream to https://www.unz.com/runz/why-everything-you-know-about-world-war-ii-is-wrong . The comment stream is effectively unanimous that Ron Unz’ thesis is correct. That would have been impossible in 2003 or so, but has happened in 2023. There has been a “sea change” in US opinion since 2008 and seizure of the Executive Branch of the Legislative and Judicial Branch’s power. After such a change, anything could happen.
Back to Popper.
Here’s my usual, more than you probably want to know about Popper, what he thought, and why the “what is a true theory” affair is so important. I mention Postmodernism and ad baculum arguments. I’d suggest that the Holocaust assertion is a prime exemplar of Postmodernism’s very close association with Socialism as a route to absolute power.
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Richard B says:@Ron Unz
Any conclusions I have drawn are obviously preliminary ones, and the weight others should attach to these must absolutely reflect my strictly amateur status.
Amateurism is nothing to sneer at. Far from damaging one’s work, I think their amateur status helps it. And the subject of history is no exception. After all, Western Civilization was almost entirely created by people who today would be classed as amateurs.
Philosophy, for example, was around for well over 2,000 years before its first professional philosopher, Kant, appeared on the scene. And by the end of the century the professionalization of philosophy was not necessarily to its credit. A fact Nietzsche pointed out in his essay Schopenhauer as Educator. His devastating attack on professional philosophy.
And there were scarcely any professional scientists until late in the 19th century.
Though it did get started earlier, Professionalism as we tend to think of it today is a phenomenon of the past 100+ years or so, at the very outside, while professionalism in the study of literature is even younger than that. Professionalism antedates the 20th century, but not by much. Darwin himself was, by modern standards, an amateur naturalist of a very traditional English sort. And the amateur tradition was vital in the life of such figures as Geothe and Coleridge.
The reason I go into this is because, from the point of view of cultural history, I’ve always seen you as operating out of that amateur-virtuoso tradition that goes back to at least the 17th century. That tradition of the man who collected and studied in any area of human knowledge that moved them. Such people were responsible for the assembly of important materials for the future of scholarship and science.
So not only is it a great tradition, but it’s arguably the one that just might save us. In any event, it’s certainly being kept alive at TUR. And for that we should all be grateful.
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Patrick McNally says:@Carlton Meyer
Irving was describing events in 1938:
—–
But when he tried to bribe the Hungarians into promising outright support of his invasion of Czechoslovakia, he was disappointed. Hungary had been severely dismembered and disarmed after the World War, losing slabs of territory to all her neighbours – Romania, Yugoslavia and Czechoslovakia. But a flamboyant week-long state visit by the Hungarians, coupled with window-rattling military parades and the launching of a battlecruiser named Prinz Eugen in their honour, failed to extract more than conditional undertakings from their Regent, Admiral Nikolaus von Horthy…That day, 22 August, passed without incident until evening when the Forschungsamt, routinely monitoring the Hungarians’ telephone conversations between Kiel and Budapest, reported that at a meeting of foreign ministers of the Little Entente in faraway Bled the Hungarian delegation had apparently formally renounced all use of force against Czechoslovakia; the wiretaps showed that Horthy, Kánya and his prime minister, Bela von Imrédy, had retrospectively sanctioned this. This cast a cloud over the entire state visit.
—-
— David Irving, The War Path, pp. 125-6, 2013 edition.The whole matter of Hungary making military gestures towards Czechoslovakia in March 1939 could simply have been avoided if Hitler had allowed the earlier Czech-Hungarian agreements to stand with pressing Horthy that he wanted to move against Czechoslovakia.
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Mefobills says:@soll
To keep this nonsense in check… I succeeded in dissuading Hitler from putting into practice the most foolish and dangerous of the ideas on banking and currency harboured by his party colleagues.” The Magic of Money, p. 49
Good try. I even explained how the Mefobills worked with the discounting. If you examine the mechanism, it actually is Federer money.
Schacht was a difficult person to figure out. The most important economist was Reinhard, and I notice you give him no notice at all, while claiming some sort of inside knowledge.
With regards to armament spending, that was funded by Mefobills – as I said earlier. It was a semi-secret way of re-arming, and why?
Germany had been put into slavery conditions, and wanted to break out. Part of the breaking-out, was to eject the parasite.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@whew
Who’s speaking of a moral code? You can’t deny European technology and culture has increased the native population with medicines, agriculture, infrastructure, etc. White nations send all sorts of aid, whether money, food stuffs, to alleviate their suffering. Regarding intellect and behavior, Bantus, Zulus, and Igbo, IN GENERAL, are essentially the same.
Can you name a country or a people who does not press for their own interests? Not ever? The method and degree to which they press varies, but everyone, everywhere does it or has done it. Can you name a country that seems to always attempt to effect change solely for the good of humanity? I would argue that western countries, IN GENERAL, seem to at least attempt more in this effort.
No one says Hitler was always nice. Everyone knows people/countries at war do things they ordinarily would not do. I don’t think I said or implied otherwise.
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Alden says:@Patrick McNally
Again, the level of ignorance of the Men of UNZ never ceases to amaze. In the late 19th early 20th century the Russians including the former serfs were among the most literate educated common people in the world.
In the 1860s the Czarist government instituted a massive education program for every child in the Empire. Free universities for the intellectuals and free easily accessible public schools in every neighborhood and hamlet.
In fact, during WW1 it was noticed that the Russian privates were far more literate than the Americans, English or Italians. .
I really really really wish ignorant idiots would stop using the word peasant for starving low paid unskilled serfs and farm workers.
In 1900, Russia was one of the 4 biggest industrial countries in the world. America Britain Germany Russia. Stop reading and repeating Jewish historians about backward Czarist Russia.
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Brosi says:@Carlton Meyer
I don’t agree with much of what Alex Krainer writes about Munich agreement because he is such a “Nazi hater”, but his analysis of what the British were up to is quite revealing, and are completely consistent with what England did to France at Dunkirk and afterwards.
https://thenakedhedgie.com/2021/12/18/appeasement-the-betrayal-in-munich-part-2-of-3
The abortive mutiny of the top German generals
Germany’s military leaders were well aware of all this and believed that, even without her alliances, Czechoslovakia could easily defeat German army in any military confrontation. When, on 21 April 1938 Hitler ordered General Wilhelm Keitel to draft plans to invade Czechoslovakia, German military brass were deeply alarmed – so much so that a group of top commanders, clustered around Hitler’s Chief of the General Staff, General Ludwig Beck, hatched a three phase strategy to disrupt Hitler’s reckless pursuit: (1) they would try to dissuade Hitler from pursuing them; (2) they implored the British to stand firmly by Czechoslovakia and warn Hitler that Britain would oppose him; and (3) if Hitler persisted in his resolve to wage war, they would proceed to assassinate him. The date for this act was set for September 28, 1938.
Here we see that Germany was not ready or able to militarily defeat Czechoslovakia and the Wehrmacht was ready to commit mutiny to prevent the invasion. It was England who wanted to create a new power out of Germany in order to fulfill other objectives. Krainer does not mention Israel and the French mandates, but to me it is clear that this was central issue of the war.
As Herbert von Dirksen, Germany’s ambassador to London wrote to foreign minister Joachim von Ribbentrop on June 8, 1938, “Anything which can be got without a shot being fired can count upon the agreement of the British.” To facilitate this, the British maneuvered Czech government to yield without resistance. Avoiding war was important for a number of reasons, but primarily to prevent a strong public outcry in Britain and to preempt Russia and France from coming to their ally’s aid.
So in 1938 the anglo-zionists were playing games to corner not only Czechoslovakia, but her principle ally France as well.
The opening salvo was an article in Lord Rothmere’s Daily Mail, published on 6 May 1938. It denounced Czechoslovakia as an artificial monstrosity and an aberration of 1919. It also falsely accused the hateful Czechs of mistreating the German-speaking population, an outrage that Britain could not tolerate. In addition to demonizing Czechoslovakia, the media also fomented a general war scare. Anxiety about the relentless German mobilization was built up day by day, convincing the public that Germany could easily overwhelm the Czechs in a few days and wipe out Prague.
By late September 1938, the war psychosis was intensified to fever pitch with reports that German air force might imminently launch air raids against Paris and London and bomb the civilian population with poison gas ordnance. As panic set in, the British government began to fit the people of London with Gas masks while the king and Prime Minister called on the Britons to dig trenches in the parks and squares. School children began to be evacuated to secure detention facilities away from London. Every report or rumor that exacerbated the panic and defeatism was played up and any voice that encouraged taking a decisive stand against Germany was sidelined.
We can clearly see that Perfidious Albion was backstabbing “allies” right and left in order to get WWII for Israel of to the right start.
Say what? 5,000 British troops were sent to Sudetenland?
The Munich agreement was utterly worthless; it merely put a thin veil of diplomatic civility over the real agenda, which was a brazen act of destruction of a prosperous central European nation with the premeditated objective of empowering Nazi Germany and pushing the people of Europe closer to one of the greatest tragedies in their history. Almost before the ink could dry on this shameful document, it was violated on every point in favor of Germany which simply occupied whatever areas of Czechoslovakia it chose to.
England stabbed Czechoslovakia the back, just like she would Poland multiple times over the next seven years.
For their neutrality Poland and Hungary were subsequently rewarded with chunks of Czechoslovakia: Hungary obtained a southern portion of Slovakia while Poland took the areas with a Polish minority. Czechoslovakia’s Soviet alliance was abolished and the Communist Party outlawed. As for the plebiscites, they were simply forgotten. Anti-Nazi refugees from the Sudetenland were rounded up by the new government in Prague and handed over to the Germans to be destroyed. The stipulated guarantee of the rump of Czechoslovakia was ignored.
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Petermx says:@Carolyn Yeager
Kevin MacDonald is also posting fewer articles. I haven’t heard anyone call Ron a ground breaker regarding the Holocaust. Your website probably has much more and interesting content on it, but I am happy that this popular website features such articles and I’m happy the guy writing them is the owner of the website. I’m also glad he’s Jewish. I think it could help change things.
First, the US has to suffer a severe economic decline, NATO has to break up, and Germany has to declare it’s no longer under occupation and throw the shits out that currently run the country.
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John Wear says:@Carolyn Yeager
You write: “I am not trying to hurt you, but the truth comes first.”
My response: You don’t have to worry. I am not hurt by your comments.
You write: “I have to take some time for myself right now (exercise), and then I’ll return to fill in why I’m right and you’re wrong. Stay tuned.”
My response: I will be waiting for your comment.
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Patrick McNally says:@Ron Unz
This shows a very gullible attitude towards British propaganda.
“One of the most British agents in Russia, Brigadier George Hill, was to say later that Wilton was indeed a British agent. It is now accepted that at this period, one in four Times correspondents were in intelligence.”
— Anthony Summers & Tom Mangold, The File on the Tsar, pp. 102-3.What distinguishes Wilton above all was that having been sent to join the White forces as a paid agent of the British government, he increasingly adopted the view of the Whites even where this set him against British policy. But he was always a paid propagandist who makes Ahmed Chalabi seem like a shining paragon of honesty.
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Patrick McNally says:@Mefobills
> Total nonsense to your total nonsense. The death of Pilsduski was yet another tragedy, in a chain of tragedies.
Hitler’s aims in conquering Poland and other regions of eastern Europe had been stated many times. The memo of May 23, 1939, is just one of the more pertinent ones as it was made while the crisis leading to World War II was forming. But nothing anywhere suggests that Hitler’s aims would have been any different had Pilsudski still been alive. The issue would have been that Poland, if it did not wish to be colonized itself, would have to subordinate itself to German aims for colonizing the regions further east in Ukraine and Russia. Pilsudski would never have agreed to this, since he accepted that the key to Polish independence was in maintaining a balance between Berlin and Moscow. Hitler would then have been forced to move against Poland in preparing for his greater drive to the east to conquer living space. No Polish government could have avoided this.
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whew says:@Tiptoethrutulips
i mentioned ‘moral code’ simply to point out that it is not a requirement for White civilization to share its wonders. while i personally would have no issue sharing medicine, or at least medical aid (and i’d actually support it), i’m against sharing technology in general and i’m sure most would agree with me. we’re probably on the same page, fyi, i was merely responding to you pointing out that the other Races adjacent to White civilizations have wanted more than just to observe and i pointed out that just because it happened doesn’t mean it’s a necessity nor an inevitability (and i pointed out why it happened in a place like South Africa, cheap/free labor – a sin).
i never disagreed with this point, please reconsider what i wrote. i simply stated that many who understand that the Holohoax did not occur blindly defend the Germans as if they were motivated purely by an angelic empathy (much of their motivation was empathetic, even angelic, but they certainly knew how to be unfair too). too often people ignore the facts as they were and just take the Germans’ story at face value without considering the opinion of, say, the Czechs.
i never said you implied otherwise. perhaps you are reading this as an argument rather than a conversation.
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Petermx says:@Alden
No. German is their language, and it’s their ethnicity. Any of them that learned French, learned it as a second language, and it was strongly encouraged after WW I. Most Europeans speak a second language and both my German parents had French in school in the 1930’s and 40’s. Most German names are different than French names and the Alsatians are definitely German. The famous doctor and humanitarian Albert Schweitzer is just one example. He was born in Alsace. Schweitzer is a 100% German name and 0% French.
Alsace-Lorraine became part of Germany in 1871, but the people were always German, as were the many millions of other Germans before Germany became a country in 1871.
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24th Alabama says:
@Tip ttt Tulips
You may recall that a few years ago the trendy put-down was,”Hope is not a strategy.”
Of course, no one had suggested it was, but without hope and inspiration there will be no plan, strategy or results.The biggest obstacle to change is the corporate media propaganda, only slightly diminished by Musk’s Twitter takeover since Facebook, YT and the MSM still dominate the news and gobble up most of the advertising revenue, leaving the crumbs for their hapless competitors. The evil ones do have a unified strategy and can rely on the money center banks to help.
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Alden says:@soll
The massacres of Polish Jews by evil Polish Catholics is a debunked lie by ADL AJC WZO the communist Soviet occupiers.
There were no massacres of Jews in the post war years. In fact, Polish communists who had spent the war years in Russia being trained to take over Poland after the war assassinated some carefully selected Polish Catholics. To prevent anyone but communist Jews from governing Poland after the war.
WW2 wasn’t just fought on the battlefields. In every country there were organized groups seriously planning to take over in the chaos of 1945 to 1947. And it did happen. All factions from communists to monarchists participated in post war plots and plans.
There was a mini civil war in southern France between de Gualle’s Catholics and the communists. About 10,000 communists were killed. Good! Most of those communist soldiers were actually Spanish communists. Who fled Spain after the loss to General Franco. The Spanish communists poured over the French border. And were allowed to stay in France; given legal residency and huge amounts of welfare and resettlement help. But in the summer if 1944 they tried to invade and create a soviet zone of occupation in southern France.
The Russians had organizations in the German occupied Poland. Those organizations spent the war spying on catholic socialist monarchists labor all Polish organizations planning to control post war Poland. As the communist Russian savages swept west, they hunted down and killed members of those organizations. Leaving nothing but communist Jews to form the post war Polish government.
You’ve obviously been wallowing in Jewish propaganda your entire life. I know the alleged anti Semitic massacre you referred to. It was a propaganda operation. A few polish Jews were murdered by communist polish and Russian Jews. For propaganda purposes to force the allies to agree to Russian communist control of Poland.
You’re either as naive and gullible as most Jews or a communist propagandist
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Wagner was an artist, not a historian or philosopher, but his operas were visionary and prophetic and profoundly impacted Hitler’s worldview.
In Nibelungen, it comes down to the the gods and heroes(Aryans) vs the dwarfs(the Jews). I suppose the giants can stand in for the Slavs. And the 20th century came to just that with WWII where German-Aryans, Jewish-Semites, and Slavs clashed in a titanic battle. And as the opera suggested, Slavs relied on sheer numbers and brute strength, the Germans were inspired by godlike heroism(at least in their own minds), and the Jews relied on cunning and manipulation.
In a way, the Germans vs Jews clash made sense as both were instrumental in the fall of the Roman Empire. Jewish splinter religion of Christianity conquered and wiped out Roman paganism, and soon after the Germanic barbarians pillaged what was left of Rome. Jews defeated Romans spiritually, Germans defeated Rome physically.
And many centuries later, it came down to Aryans vs Semites, and even though the Semites got ravaged really bad in the Holocaust, they won by a combination of clever manipulation of the Anglos and the sheer luck of Hitler invading Russia.
Still, the Jewish domination of the post-Cold War order has less to do with WWII than the dissipation and decline of the Anglo elites, the last bulwark against Jewish power in the West. Anglos at some point just caved totally to Jewish Power.Just as ancient Jews and ancient Germanic barbarians brought down the Roman Empire, their modern heirs brought down the Anglo empire. WWI and WWII bled the UK dry. The British Empire just barely survived WWI but was soon doomed with WWII.
Still, it seemed Anglo-Americans would be the rulers of the world with the 20th Century as the American Century. But just as Jewish imagination of Christianity spiritually conquered Rome, the Jewish imagination of the Holocaust Cult, MLK cult, and then even LGBTQ-mania ‘spiritually’ conquered the Anglo world, and the last vestiges of Anglo puritanism is now committed to washing black feet, waving the homo flag, and lighting candles to Anne Frank(and witch-hunting for any ‘white supremacist’, which could be anyone desiring white preservation in white lands).In the end, the ‘great historical crime’ is less a matter of how many suffered and/or were killed than which group were victimized. By all rights, the genocide museum in the US should be about the American Indians, but it’s about Jews. Indians are stone-faced, lower-IQ, and reticent. Jews are rich, assertive, and verbal. So, the genocide that happened on American land get less attention than something that happened in Europe by Europeans.
Likewise, the horrors of Hiroshima/Nagasaki, Nanking, US bombing of Laos/Cambodia, Rwanda genocide, Khmer Rouge madness, Mao’s mass deaths, and the Ukrainian famine get far less attention than the Holocaust. And of course, Albright’s dead Arabs, what was ‘worth it’.In the end, it’s not so much that Hitler killed many people but he killed Jews. If he had spared Jews or been rather nice to them but killed 6 million Slavs instead, would the Holocaust(of dead Slavs) be such a big thing? In a way, the Holocaust narrative is supremacist in its own right because it places the value of Jewish lives on a much higher pedestal than other lives.
One thing for sure, historical justice isn’t objective. It has to be fought for, tooth and nail. If indeed 6 million Jews were indeed killed by the Nazis BUT the Jews hadn’t pressed on the issue nor made a big deal of it, the Holocaust wouldn’t have amounted to much. (Or suppose Jews were poor and low-IQ and didn’t control the academia/media to impose their narrative on the world.)
So, in that sense, Jewish lives are more precious in the sense that Jews understood nothing is a given or to be taken for granted in history. Just like money doesn’t fall from the sky but has to be earned or taken, historical redress and sense of justice have to be fought for, argued for, and insisted upon. Indeed, prior to the great black civil rights movement, most whites didn’t much care about black problems. White fear and respect blacks because blacks finally did something.In that sense, for all their vileness, Jews are the real doers of history whereas American Indians only sit on their ass and watch TV and drink alcohol. Same goes for white conservatives who bitch about lack of patriotic movies and TV shows but never get off their ass to create their own entertainment. Instead, they whine about Hollywood not making the kind of stuff they want. In contrast, Jews actually made their own industries in movies and media.
In the end, those who push and insist win, and that’s mostly what historical justice is about. It’s not about some abstract force of history righting wrongs but about influential players emphasizing certain narratives at the expense of others. History isn’t about the ultimate victory of the good guys but the tenacious guys.
If historical justice were objective and principled, Germans would not be supporting the neo-nazi elements in Ukraine. After all, Germans vowed to never again be associated with anything so evil. But there they are arming the neo-nazi elements in Ukraine.
Given the number of Russians killed in WWII, where is the German guilt in their current role in Ukraine? But the fact is Germany is part of the US empire, which is ruled by Jews who get to press on Germans and insist what’s what. So, historical justice German Style is merely giving Jews what they want at every turn. Russians did most to defeat Nazi Germany, but here we are in the 21st century with Jews supporting nazi elements in Ukraine against Russia… and Jews got the Germans aboard in this mad enterprise.
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@Anonymous
But could it be Stalin was bluffing? Mounting an offensive position to force Germans into a defensive position? Stalin was an astute student of history and surely he learned that the French mistake in 1940 was to put itself in a purely defensive position. It was like a turtle hiding in a shell, and Germans cracked it open.
Maybe Stalin wanted to send a message to the Germans that the USSR was game for a fight and it’s the Germans who should be on the defensive.
Also, there was the chance that the West might side with Germany if the Soviets were successful in pushing into Germany. While many wanted to see the Nazis defeated, they didn’t want to be conquered by the Soviets either. So, if the Soviets got an upperhand over Germany, US/UK might have decided to back Germany against Russia.
US/UK were squarely on the side of Russia only because it seemed to be on the verge of defeat in 1941. But if the USSR had invaded Germany first and began to move westward, US/UK might have armed the Germans to push back the Red Menace, and many people in the UK and US might have demanded that. One thing for sure, UK and US mostly sat back until 1944 and let Germans and Russian bleed each other dry. It was only when the Red Army was fast moving Westward that the US and UK finally went in hard on the continent.
Prior to the Pearl Harbor attack and Germany declaring war on the US, most Americans(contra the elites) still preferred Nazi Germany over the commie Russkies.
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Brosi says:@Alden
The ignorance of the men of UNZ never ceases to amaze.
LOL. The ignorance of these fetid old estrogen laden second wave feminists and their self assumed higher intelligence never ceases to amaze, especially when the likes of Alden and Yeager appear on the same thread.
Alsace did not speak a French dialect. The names of cities like Mulhouse and Strasbourg have their roots in Germanic dialects. In fact, the area between the Vosges and the Rhine was settled by Alamannic tribes who spoke a German dialect that closely resembles the Swiss German spoken in Basel.
Alsace was Germanic, but conquered and dominated by France long before Napoleon let the Jews come in and plunder the local Volk. If only Alsace could have gotten herself accepted into Switzerland then she might not have been raped and plundered for centuries by French and Germanic empires.
German Land within the Kingdom of France
This situation prevailed until 1639, when most of Alsace was conquered by France to keep it out of the hands of the Spanish Habsburgs, who by secret treaty in 1617 had gained a clear road to their valuable and rebellious possessions in the Spanish Netherlands, the Spanish Road. Beset by enemies and seeking to gain a free hand in Hungary, the Habsburgs sold their Sundgau territory (mostly in Upper Alsace) to France in 1646, which had occupied it, for the sum of 1.2 million Thalers.In any case, Feminists and Witches like Alden and Yeager had absolutely nothing to do with the history of Alsace aside from fulfilling, or not fulfilling, their natural roles as mothers. Now in 2023, we get to listen these arrogant feminists rewrite history to try turn Alsace into another country shaped by self supposed bimbo Amazonian queens like Alden and Yeager.
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@John Wear
“My response: You don’t have to worry. I am not hurt by your comments.”
Good! Thank you for that. I do ‘worry’ about that bc I do not wish to be a nasty person. But I guess I am something of a “no-holds-barred” person when it’s something important to me, and I do have an aggressive streak. It can be seen in my horoscope! So I’m glad I can continue with peace of mind on that count.
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Brosi says:@Petermx
The problem with this statement is that is presupposes that there was one single “German” root to all of the “Germanic” peoples.
If fact the Austro-Prussian war was to a large degree about which country would comprise “Greater Germany”.
Even today, many Bavarians resent what arrogant and militant Prussians did, and continue to do, to Germany.
In fact there were many Germanic tribes as is evidenced by the many Germanic dialects.
Bismark forced the majority of the “Germanic” speaking peoples to accept the Hohenzollerns as their King/Emperor in 1866.
I would assert that this victory of the Prussians over the rest of the German peoples was a tradgedy that lead to the Third Reich and the destruction of German culture.
Hitlers “Gleichschaltung” or “Enabling Act” was in its essence a continuation of the Austro-Prussian war and it was all about forcing all of the German peoples to unite behind the NSDAP.
Switzerland steadfastly refused to join the other Germanic peoples, even though after May 1940 she was totally surrounded by the Axis powers.
Even though Hitler could have walked right into Switzerland and seized all of her industry and resources across the lowlands and into the lower alps, the Swiss knew what German domination would mean to even the German dialect speaking Swiss. Yet Hitler allowed the German speaking part of Switzerland to remain neutral and independent. This is a fact that puts paid to the allegations that Hitler was out to conquer the entire planet.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@whew
Yes, a bit of an argument maybe, but only in a genial sense. I suspect we agree on more than we disagree. IT IS a complicated subject.
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Munga Bulga says:
https://odysee.com/@martinezperspective:2/hitler-imperialist:d
In Martinez, the full force of his Czech – i.e., genetically Slavic – mother comes through with repetitive neuroticism. He says that Hitler hated whites. Without even considering the world political situation at that time. At that time there was no fight “black against white” (he is the true black-white thinker). At least not in Europe.
At that time, there was mainly the struggle against the Bolshevik threat in the East. Were the Allies who destroyed German cities lovers of the white race? He is convinced: National Socialism had been a “purely Germanic religion”, and therefore “not transferable to other peoples”. Just as ignorant. But now he has (mainly by self-programming with Jewish thought a la Ayn Rand) finally recognized the full truth. But he himself does not offer a more probable recipe.
To the great people’s hero (to which “people” does he himself belong: the Canadian, the Spanish or the Czech, or the Bulgarian, which just grants him shelter?) he still lacks a lot, but he just goes through an atavistic regression, he develops from the biped back to the gill-breather, which he actually always was. Once a Slav – always a Slav!
I wonder what was the reason for deleting among others this (btw, totally incomplete) Wikipedia article? https://wiki2.org/en/List_of_Nazis_of_non-Germanic_descent
I can tell you (I strongly suspect Coffman is a – slightly altered – Yiddish form of Kaufman). https://www.wired.com/story/one-womans-mission-to-rewrite-nazi-history-wikipedia/
P.S. Good channel! https://www.youtube.com/@talesoftheamericanempire
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Skeptikal says:
The German people are the most gaslighted people of the 20th and 21st centuries.
Perhaps of all time.
They have been on a left-right Brain Twister ride since ca. 1904.
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Patrick McNally says:@Alden
“… in 1917 literacy extended in all probability to only about 45 per cent of the people.”
— Nicholas Riasanovsky, A History of Russia, Fourth Edition, p. 438.I don’t see anything obviously Jewish about Riasanovsky’s background. Do you?
https://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/29/world/europe/29riasanovsky.html?ref=deathsobituaries
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@Carolyn Yeager
In my podcasts, I go into background such as the Hausehofers (father & son), the British Foreign Office characters, Lord Hamilton (who Hess thought he was dealing with), Lord Kent, Samuel Hoare, etc. Hitler was going along with this in the beginning, it was part of the peace feelers, but as it started to harden into action, his doubts became stronger than his hopes. He said no further and Hess didn’t want to accept that.
Hitler’s relationship w/Hess: Hitler believed in and rewarded loyalty with loyalty. In the early days, Hess was his #1 friend and stalwart ally. Another was Hermann Goering, who was a huge help in the early days of the party, including with fundraising. Hitler kept Goering on as Luftwaffe chief longer than he should have, for that reason. Same with Mussolini, who Hitler saw as a great benefactor from the early struggle, and tried to remain loyal even after M. was only causing problems. So Hitler was not a hard-hearted or scheming guy. By 1940, he no longer had the same faith in Rudolf Hess and had already removed him as a participant in the inner circles of party and govt. decision-making. But he left his titles and appearance of a key role, out of personal friendship, plus respect & appreciation for his former contribution. It’s expressed very well in Hermann Giesler’s memoir, a portion of which was translated by Wm. Kriessmann and me, titled as “The Artist Within the Warlord: An Adolf Hitler You’ve Never Known.” (available at all booksellers)
On page 76 of our book, Giesler meets with Hitler at a restaurant in Munich, as H. was enroute from Spain to Rome to meet with Mussolini:
“It was certainly the word ‘party’ that turned his thoughts.
He worries a great deal about Rudolf Hess. He knows he can talk about it with me. Hess’s nearly occult, airy behavior, his hypochondria and what he is doing for it. He is certainly not against homeopaths and alternative medical practitioners, but strongly against all those Hess trusts with his confidence. He should by all means find a physician with rank. Hitler is really worried, not only because of Hess’s position and tasks, but simply because he is sincerely fond of him. “That I keep him in such high esteem, that I feel an obligation, well, he is the “Faithful” since the beginning of the National Socialist struggle.”This, I think, speaks volumes. It was Oct. 1940; Hitler already did not have confidence in his old friend Hess, and with reason. So all the blah, blah about their “final meeting” and tight handshake & special “look” is misapplied, at the very least. If not made up. But sentiment certainly sells.
Hitler could not afford to be sentimental, and he never did forget that. It was loyalty that sometimes led him off course, but not sentimentality.
This to me is evidence of a worthy nature. Giesler is an honest reporter of his many meetings with Hitler; he has nothing to gain from making things up. He was not seeking absolution or further positions of influence or financial gain as were all others who brought their views to bear on this issue. Giesler put duty first as a good National Socialist. But as good as this is, it’s not my sole reason for holding the view I do. It’s also because I’m not a Libertarian, as John Wear, Ron Unz and hundreds of participants on this Unz site are. I can easily empathize with the National Socialists and put myself or see myself in their place. It’s only logical. It’s not rocket science.
Of course, more could be said, and perhaps Haxo will. But for me, I’ve said enough for now.
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whew says:@Munga Bulga
you take a non-Czech looking guy named “Martinez” (who looks Mediterranean not Slav) and claim he is after his mother, not his father, even though he is a male. perhaps this is more a you problem than a him problem. i’ve encountered more than a few black-white thinkers amongst the Germans, yet i wouldn’t hate all Germans because of it. you seem to be a problematic person, more than Martinez (fyi i had never heard of him before, nor did i bother watching that video you linked, just making a point). it’s people like you that make peace impossible.
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Munga Bulga says:
A true word:
Petain further regarded England as always having been France’s most implacable enemy, with Vichy propaganda mixing Anglophobia with racism and anti-Semitism to portray the British as a racially degenerate “mixed race” working for Jewish capitalists, in contrast to the “racially pure” peoples on the continent of Europe who were building a “New Order.”
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Malla says:@Patrick McNally
Hitler’s aims in conquering Poland and other regions of eastern Europe had been stated many times. The memo of May 23, 1939, is just one of the more pertinent ones as it was made while the crisis leading to World War II was forming.
Pure Bullshit. Hitler’s attack East was a preemptive strike against a very likely Soviet invasion West.
This is a part of the English translation of the private conversion in between the Fuhrer of the Third Reich, Adolf Hitler and the Finnish military leader and statesman, Carl Gustaf Emil Mannerheim . This was secretly recorded.
Adolf Hitler:…a very serious danger, perhaps the most serious one – its whole extent we can only now judge. We did not ourselves understand-just how strong this state [the USSR] was armed.
Carl Gustaf Emil Mannerheim:No, we hadn’t thought of this.Adolf Hitler: No, I too, no.
Carl Gustaf Emil Mannerheim: During the Winter War -during the Winter War we had not even thought of this. Of course….
Adolf Hitler: (Interrupting) Yes.
Carl Gustaf Emil Mannerheim: But so, how they – in reality – and now there is no doubt all they had – what they had in their stocks!
…snip….
I had only this nightmare – but there is even more! Because a war on two fronts – would have been impossible – that would have broken us.
Today, we see more clearly – than we saw at that time – it would have broken us. And my whole – I originally wanted to – already in the fall of ’39 I wanted to conduct the campaign in the west – on the continuously bad weather we experienced hindered us.
Our whole armament – you know, was – is a pure good weather armament. It is very capable, very good, but it is unfortunately just a good-weather armament. We have seen this in the war. Our weapons naturally were made for the West, and we all thought, and this was true’till that time, uh, it was the opinion from the earliest times; you cannot wage war in winter.
And we too, have, the German tanks, they weren’t tested, for example, to prepare them for winter war. Instead we conducted trials to prove it was impossible to wage war in winter.
That is a different starting point [than the Soviet’s]. In the fall of 1939 we always faced the question. I desperately wanted to attack, and I firmly believed we could have finished France in six weeks.
…snip….
This all was inevitable, you see. I had a conversation with Motolov [Soviet Minister] at that time, and it was absolutely certain at that time, and it was absolutely certain that Motolov departed with the decision to begin a war, and I dismissed the decision to have a war, and I dismissed him with the decision to – impossible, to forestall him. There was – this was the only – because the demands that man brought up was clearly aimed to rule Europe in the end. (Practically whispering here.) Then I have him – not publicly… (fades out).
Already in the fall of 1940 we continuously faced the question, uh: shall we, consider a break up [in relations with the USSR]? At that time, I advised the Finnish government, to negotiate and, to gain time and, to act dilatory in this matter – because I always feared – that Russia suddenly would attack Romania in the late fall – and occupy the petroleum wells, and we would have not been ready in the late fall of 1940. If Russia indeed had taken Romanian petroleum wells, then Germany would have been lost. It would have required – just 60 Russian divisions to handle that matter.
In Romania we had of course- at that time – no major units. The Romanian government had turned to us only recently – and what we did there was laughable. They had only to occupy the petroleum wells. Of course, with our weapons I could not start a, war in September or October. That was out of the question. Naturally, the transfer to the east wasn’t that far advanced yet. Of course, the units first had to reconsolidate in the west.
First the armaments had to be taken care of because we too had – yes, we also had losses in our campaign in the west. It would have been impossible to attack – before the spring of 1941. And if the Russians at that time – in the fall of 1940 – had occupied Romania – taken the petroleum wells, then we would have been, helpless in 1941.
…snip….
Therefore I aspired to, bridge the period of negotiations’till we would be strong enough to, counter those extortive demands [from Moscow] because – those demands were simply naked extortion’s. They were extortion’s. The Russians knew we were tied up in the west.
They could really extort everything from us. Only when Molotov visited – then I told him frankly that the demands, their numerous demands, weren’t acceptable to us. With that the negotiations came to an abrupt end that same morning.
There were four topics. The one topic that, involved Finland was, the freedom to protect themselves from the Finnish threat, he said.[I said] You do not want to tell me Finland threatens you! But he said: “In Finland it is – they who take action against the, friends, of the Soviet Union. They would [take action] against [our] society, against us – they would continuously, persecute us and, a great power cannot be threatened by a minor country.”
I said:”Your, existence isn’t threatened by Finland! That is, you don’t mean to tell me….”• Replies: @Patrick McNallyAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
John Wear says:@Patrick McNally
The following is in regard to your comments #197 and #303:
1. Both of your comments come from the book Max Domarus, Hitler: Speeches and Proclamations, Volume 3.
I went to the SMU library this morning and checked out this book. I first read the Prologue to this book on pp. 1377-1388. I next read the Major Events in Summary for the year 1939 on pp. 1389-1410. I will not go into detail here, but both the Prologue and Major Events Summary to this book are extremely biased against Hitler and Germany. They make numerous factual errors.
2. I next read the speech Hitler allegdedly made in private to some of his military leaders on page 1619 of this book. I then looked for the source of this speech. According to page 1618 of this book, it comes from Lieutenant Colonel Schmundt, who took notes on the “general sense” of Hitler’s comments.
When I looked up Lieutenant Colonel Schmundt in Wikipedia, I discovered that he died on October 1, 1944 as a result of injuries incurred from the July 20, 1944 assassination attempt of Hitler. So, Schmundt was not alive when the war ended. I question how anyone can know that Hitler actually made these comments. It would be very easy for the Allies to forge them after the war, especially since Schmundt was not alive to dispute them.
3. I next read the speech Hitler allegedly made in private on October 2, 1940 that you quote in comment #303. This speech appears on page 2100 of the book. Footnote #546 tells us where this quote comes from. Footnote #546 states: “Bormann took notes on Hitler’s exposition at the conference. Published in IMT, Blue Series, VII, pp. 252 ff. (USSR-172).
Again, I question how anyone can know that Hitler actually made these comments. It would be very easy for the Allies to forge them after the war, especially since Bormann was not around after the war to dispute them.
My question to you is: How do you know that the Allies didn’t make up these private speeches, especially since Schmundt and Bormann were not around after the war to dispute them?
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Alexandros says:@Patrick McNally
That’s not a real quote.
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Malla says:
Operation Barbarossa was a pre-emptive strike conducted by six nations, not just Germany because they had all noticed a Soviet build up of forces.
This is the English translation of the speech given by the Fuhrer of the Third Reich Adolf Hitler in Berlin, October 3rd, 1941.Adolf Hitler speaks:
Always in an effort to limit the scope of the war, I decided in 1939 to do something that you, my dear party comrades, know first hand how difficult it was for me to do.
I then sent my Minister to Moscow .That meant the most bitter triumph over my feelings. I tried to reach an understanding. You know best of all how honest and frankly I’ve kept our obligations and commitments. Neither in our press nor at our meetings was a single word about Russia was mentioned. Unfortunately the other side did not observe their obligations from the beginning.
This arrangement resulted in a betrayal which at first liquidated the whole northeast of Europe. You know best what it meant for us to look on in silence as the Finnish people were being strangled. And how it felt for me as a soldier, to stand idly by as a powerful state tries to dominate a small one. Yet I remained silent.
I took a decision only when I saw that Russia had reached the hour to advance against us at a moment when we had only a bare three divisions in East Prussia when twenty-two Soviet divisions were assembled there. We gradually received proof that on our frontiers one airdrome after another was set up and one division after another from the gigantic Soviet Army was being assembled there.
I was then obliged to become anxious for there is no excuse in history for negligence like claiming afterwords that I didn’t think it was possible, or that I didn’t believe it.
I now stand at the top of the Reich, and thus I am responsible for the present German people and its future.
(APPLAUSE)
I was therefore compelled slowly to take defensive measures. But in August and September of last year one thing was becoming clear. A decision in the West with England which would have contained the whole German Luftwaffe was no longer possible, for in my rear there stood a State which was getting ready to proceed against me at such a moment but it is only now that we realize how far the preparation had advanced.
I wanted once again to clarify the whole problem and therefore I invited Molotov to Berlin.[MORE]• Replies: @Patrick McNallyAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
John Wear says:@Carolyn Yeager
You write: “It’s also because I’m not a Libertarian, as John Wear, Ron Unz and hundreds of participants on this Unz site are.”
My response: I would not necessarily call myself a Libertarian. I don’t identify with any particular label.
Is your comment #348 all you have to dispute the notion that Hess did not have Hitler’s consent to fly to Scotland? I don’t find this comment to be very convincing.
As Wolf Rüdiger Hess said, no one can say for sure whether Rudolf Hess undertook his flight with the knowledge and blessing of Adolf Hitler. Both men are now dead.
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Wielgus says:@Dutch Boy
I have read much though not all of his writing and nothing quite like that emerges from what I have read, though he liked his beer and perhaps his pub talk was less morally elevated. He tends to associate Machiavellian attitudes with his targets in his writings, like the senior devil Screwtape in The Screwtape Letters. As opposed to with those who should be imitated.
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Haxo Angmark says:@Patrick McNally
actual, effective post-revolution Politburo c. 1920:
Ulyanov alias Lenin…………………part-Jew
Bronstein alias Trotsky……………………Jew
Radomsylsky alias Zinoviev……………..Jew
Djugashvili alias Stalin…………………….non-Jew
Rosenfeld alias Kamenev…………………Jew
Sverdlov…………………………………………Jew
Bukharin………………………………………..non-Jew, with Jew controller: the wifetop non-PB position, Cheka boss:
Dzerzhinsky…………………………………….non-Jew, with Jew-controler: the wife
I dunno, Pat…..looks kinda Jewy to me.
and there’s Joe Djugashvili’s famous remark, made while gazing out over a sea of recognizeably Khazarian faces at an early pre-revolution Party Congress:
“what we need…is a pogrom in the Party”
later, he took care of that….
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Petermx says:@Brosi
I agree with you, of course, that he was not put to conquer the entire planet. That was a lie used to push a world war against Germany. He also did not ask for the South Tyrol in Italy to be returned to Germany, and he didn’t ask for Alsace-Lorraine to be returned to Germany. The allies stole the Saarland from Germany too, and the French were disappointed when a vote was held and about 99% of the population voted to return to Germany. That’s not an exaggeration. I think Hitler didn’t take Switzerland because the Germans were safe there. They were not mistreated. That was not the case in the German occupied territories in Poland or Czechoslovakia.
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Munga Bulga says:
One can precisely date the moment when the Führer principle began to weaken: It was the moment when the cow doctor and cranker Theo Morell took over the commendo over Hitler. “He who is always strong may also be weak sometimes”, here Mr. Morell came into play, who purposefully exploited this moment of weakness and thus determined world politics.
By the way, any reference to his Jewish background has disappeared from Wikipedia, although even a blind man with a cane can feel this “physiognomy” even in the dark at first glance.
The highest Nazis were apparently not so fastidious. A fatal mistake. Such ridiculous mistakes are usually committed when one believes to be long since bare of any contestation. So the legitimate question is: How could a Jew sneak into the center of power? This question is obsolete, because the world has always been determined by Jews sneaking into power.
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Haxo Angmark says:@Carolyn Yeager
@ in case you missed it, see my comment #265. Major Karlheinz Pintsch (Hess’s military adjutant), in a 1948 document manufactured in a Soviet torture chamber, “agreed” that Hitler had foreknowledge of the Hess Flight. Which was the current communist propaganda line. In 1963, after returning to Germany, he retracted the forced statement and said that Hess told him “Hitler does not know of my flight….”.
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Lies upon lies upon lies. In other words nothing has changed. 911, Hussein, Libya, Certificate of vaccination id 19, “vaccines”, now Ukraine. The scariest part is that millions of people still rely on tv for information. There’s nothing new under the sun. To think that my father and millions of other men marched off to war thinking they were saving democracy is sickening. Hey FDR, the 300,000 men who died in ww2 called, they want their lives back. Hey LBJ, the 58,00 men who died in Vietnam called, they want their lives back. Hey GW Bush, the 4600 men who died in Iraq called, they want their lives back. Hey Joe Biden, the 300,000 men who have died so far in the Ukraine called, they want their lives back. Liars and murderers. There is nothing new under the sun.
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Adolf Smith says:@Anonymous
This is obviously Priss Factor.
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HVMII says:@Ron Unz
Hoggan did release a more recent book titled The Unnecessary War 1939-1945.
I have read Taylor.
I am not sure what is meant by activist type.
The Forced War is very good despite the ideological opposition or Barnes’ attempt to have him revise and roll it back.
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eah says:@John Wear
Hitler was eager to make peace once Great Britain and France had declared war against Germany. … Hitler continued to search for a way to end the war with Great Britain.
In 1940 the Wehrmacht quickly defeated France, and drove the British army off the continent — with such impressive military success, Hitler’s public rhetoric was far less conciliatory — his comments were characterized more by anger and the realization that peace was no longer possible or even desirable.
After the start of Barbarossa on 22 June 1941, Hitler disappeared from public view — he spent his time at Wolfsschanze — he returned to open the Kriegswinterhilfswerk by giving a speech in the Berliner Sportpalast on 03 October 1941 — if you understand German, it is not difficult to find good quality audio of this — here is the text:
Rede vom 3. Oktober 1941 (Adolf Hitler)
No one could read or listen to this speech and believe Hitler is still interested in peace with England, or sees it as a reasonable possibility:
So gelang es leider nicht, Großbritannien, vor allem das englische Volk, mit dem deutschen in jene Verbindung zu bringen, die ich immer erhofft hatte. … Wenn es eben nicht gelingen konnte, die englische Freundschaft zu bekommen, dann war es besser, die Feindschaft traf Deutschland in dem Augenblick, in dem ich selber noch an der Führung des Reiches stand. Denn wenn durch meine Maßnahmen und durch mein Entgegenkommen diese englische Freundschaft nicht zu erwerben war, dann war sie für alle Zukunft nicht zu erwerben, dann blieb nichts anderes übrig als der Kampf. … . Ich bin daher auch der Überzeugung, daß es mit all diesen Männern wirklich keine Verständigung gibt. … Es mußten also die Waffen entscheiden.
Hitler justifies the war against the Soviet Union as necessary due to the threat posed by the Red Army (Präventionskrieg) — in the following passage he seems to see it as fate or providence (Vorsehung) that his earlier peace proposals were not accepted — otherwise Germany may not have been able to fulfill its ordained role as the only nation capable of defending the Abendländer against the menace of jüdischer Bolschewismus:
Ich habe damals gerade Polen gegenüber Vorschläge gebracht, von denen ich heute, nachdem die Ereignisse gegen unseren Willen einen anderen Verlauf genommen hatten, geradezu sagen muß: Es war doch die Vorsehung, die allmächtige Vorsehung, die es damals verhindert hat, daß dieses mein Angebot angenommen wurde. Sie hat wohl gewußt, warum das nicht so sein durfte. … Ich habe mich zur Überzeugung durchgerungen, es kann hier nur eine ganz klare Entscheidung, und zwar eine weltgeschichtliche Entscheidung für die nächsten hundert Jahre erkämpft werden.
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Once again we suggest Mr. Unz be awarded the U.S. Medal of Freedom by some courageous U.S. President, if one can be found!
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John Wear says:@eah
You write” “Hitler justifies the war against the Soviet Union as necessary due to the threat posed by the Red Army (Präventionskrieg).”
My response: Hitler’s attack against the Soviet Union was made for preemptive reasons. I recommend you read the book “The Chief Culprit” for more detailed information. Also, Malla’s comment #352 on this discussion thread provides supporting information for this idea.
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pachacuti says:@Protogonus
maybe the State of Israel can award him a first “just within our nation” award, after all he’s doing more to prevent an anti Z backlash than any otjer within the nation – that I know of
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@John Wear
My response: I would not necessarily call myself a Libertarian.
It makes no difference what you call yourself, you’re a libertarian politically and philosophically, and you make that clear all the time. Most people can understand that.
[Is] #348 all you have to dispute the notion that Hess did not have Hitler’s consent to fly to Scotland? I don’t find this comment to be very convincing.
I don’t need to convince you. All you keep saying is the available evidence suggests that Hitler knew in advance of Hess’s flight to Scotland.
Even though you end each post with that line, you cannot produce such evidence. Yet I have produced a reliable witness to Adolf Hitler’s own words regarding the confidence (i.e. lack of) he had in Rudolf Hess in October 1940. Hess made his solo flight to Scotland secretly in May 1941, seven months later. His condition had not improved.The reason you say “no one can say for sure” is because you are a moron who cannot read the tea leaves, not even a little bit. Everything has to be spelled out for you. Hitler said of Hess that “his nearly occult, airy behavior, his hypochondria,” if untreated, was a problem. Hess needed to listen to a responsible physician. Would H. send such a man on a perilous & uncertain mission, a man who wasn’t even a professional pilot??? Yet you say, “No one can say for sure. Both men are dead.”
John, thank you for confirming/proving to the readers here that you are indeed a moron whose ability to think through something even a little bit complex is nil — just as I said. But take comfort that you have a lot of company here just like yourself.
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HVMII says:@Brosi
Czechoslovakia was unworkable from its creation at Versailles.
Central Europe was turned into a region of ethnic minorities dominating over ethnic minorities. It made the artificial nations in the region unworkable.
Yugoslavia is another example. The only thing that held it together was Tito. When he died it fell apart along ethnic lines.
Britain used Appeasement and Germany’s acquisition of Czechia as a line to make war after Czechoslovakia began to tear itself apart following Munich. I would say Britain’s goal was to assert its hegemony over the Heartland. It was the pro- war Tories like Churchill and Halifax along with their Jewish allies on Fleet Street that whipped up the war scare.
Britain long supported the return of Danzig to Germany prior to Munich. After Munich, and then the subsequent annexation of Czechia (the Protectorate of Bohemia), Poland was used as a wedge to make war following the British war guarantee.
However, when push came to shove, Britain could not back up its promises and turned to Russia to do the fighting for it. Russia laughed in their face and made the Molotov Ribbentrop Pact with Germany. Why should Russia spend its blood and treasure for British interests? If you have read Suvorov’s Ice Breaker or McMeekin’s Stalin’s War, you will know that Stalin had plans of his own for Central Europe and it had nothing to do with nationalist ethnic interests which Germany represented. Stalin’s was preparing for an offensive war since 1935.
Poland had three choices. One was Germany. Another was Russia which it despised since its reincarnation in 1919 and its war with Soviet Russia from 1919-1922. The third was nationalism go it alone. When Britain offered the fateful blank check, the Polish military dictatorship of Colonels gambled that they could defeat Germany. They failed to see their precarious military situation and were over run – but not without provoking Germany first by initiating a program against ethnic Germans living in Polish Silesia and Pomerania. The Poles were offered a good deal by Germany for Dazing and could have maintained economic access to the Vistula. Yet, it was the British promise that made the Poles intransigent to the question of Dazing and the 95% ethnic German population. If a deal could have been reached then Germany and Poland would have been allied against Russia. Either way Poland was caught in the middle and was going to be forced to fish or cut bait.
The reason why this was so was due to the artificial borders created by Wilson and his Inquiry that re-drew the map of Central Europe without knowing the history of the region nor its ethnic make-up. To this day, it is the multicultural globalists who still are trying to reforge the world in opposition to ethnic national interests and it is not working. Think of it this way. Are you going to go to war and die for an idea or are you going to go to war and die for your people. I am sure most people will choose the latter.
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shahnameh says:
An in depth presentation of the Polish ambassador Brzezinski(Tadeuz) and unfiltered presentation on Rapallo(perhaps Stephanie C Salzman) could unwind fallacy.
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HVMII says:@soll
Actually Danzig was an independent city state that had been a tributary state with full autonomy within the Polish kingdom.
It has always been German speaking.
Prior to being affiliated the Polish Kingdom it was a part of the Teutonic Kingdom.
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Munga Bulga says:
If the trunk and root of Europe naturally come from its center, the strong German oak, then the question arises whether “Americans” can ever develop a concept of the origin of their species (just as African Americans do of Africa). Can the falling withering leaves “understand” the tree?
I hear the objection, “Leaves are just as important, they give oxygen to the world!” This is true, but leaves are very short-lived. Now follows: “We are not leaves at all, but the fruits that fall from the tree and bring forth new trees!” As far as I know, “new” trees are very similar to the old ones, but you are deeply unlike them (to put it kindly).
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@Petermx
I’m also glad he’s Jewish. I think it could help change things.
It won’t change anything. You are naive to think so.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@John Wear
I don’t want to wade into the fray over what Hitler knew, but did Hess ever comment on it directly? If so, to whom?
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Malla says:
From the Book: America Has no Enemies in Asia written in 1938 by Ralph Townsend
https://digitalrepository.trincoll.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1047&context=moore“The Soviet Union has long sought control of China. It has backed the Communist faction within China. Japan opposes the prospect of a red China. This makes Japan an enemy of the Soviet Union.’ The Soviet Union wants American aid against Japan. This partly explains why reds were eager to see conflict between China and Japan. Such a war, it was hoped, would ally America and Moscow. Warrant for this statement may be found in writings of bolshevik leaders, too lengthy to quote here.”
…snip….
“In 1904-05 US papers lavishly favored Japan. Many Americans didn’t know then that such press praise for Japan was partly stirred by organized forces here working for revolution Russia. Above item appeared 12 years later, in 1917. Backing Japan to defeat the Czar from without aided revolutionaries seeking his overthrow from within. Such facts show how newspaper campaigns of hate or praise may be influenced by interests not suspected at the time. U. S. papers on the whole favored Japan as long as Japan opposed Czarist Russia, but turned anti-Japanese after 1917 when Japan became a potential enemy of revolutionary Russia.””• Replies: @MallaAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Malla says:@Malla
Chiang Kai-shek realised the risks Communism posed to China had said that Japanese are eczema, CCP is cancer. But Chiang Kai-shek was kidnapped in the Xi’an incident and delivered to the CCP. There he was “convinced” to fight the Japanese Empire instead. This convincing was easy as Chiang Kai-shek’s son was hostage in Soviet Russia. The CCP benefited with the KMT and Japanese fighting out each other while the CCP “gained strength”. Stalin was happy as this would mean Japanese Empire would be engaged in China so he could concentrate towards his conquests of Europe. He had fears of the Japanese Empire to its East but a Japanese Empire locked in war in China proper, would be advantageous to him. After convincing Chiang Kai-shek (with “Daddy I am prisoner in Moscow”, note) Stalin via the CCP, promised him lots of weapons. Within six months we get the mysterious Marco Polo Bridge incident, with mysterious firing in between Chinese and Japanese troops.
Through the 1930s, USSR had been planting agents in China, and what Chiang did not know was that Zhang Zhizhong was among them. To Chiang Kaishek, Shanghai was strategically important, for it guarded the mouth of the Yangtze River, upstream of which lay the capital city Nanjing, and it was a major industrial center. Chiang’s first attempt at safeguarding this city was to prevent the war from escalating to that location. Stalin, however, ordered the opposite, demanding Zhang to provoke the Japanese. Obeying Stalin’s orders, Zhang repeatedly sent Chiang plans for invasions into the Japanese zone in Shanghai, which was guarded by only 300 Special Naval Landing Forces troops with no sign of being reinforced in the future. Chiang rejected every request, and Zhang knew that the only way to achieve his orders from Moscow was to create a situation in which the Japanese would fire the first shot, so that he could advance without disobeying Chiang’s orders.
Thus their agent staged the assassination of Lt Isao Oyama. The Omaya Incident, the murder of Lt Isao Oyama, commander of the Western Detachment, Shanghai Special Naval Landing Force, is the incident that precipitated the Second Battle of Shanghai and the full scale escalation of war between Japan and the KMT in China, and thus WW2.
“At about 1830 on 9 August, Lt Isao Oyama, commander of the Western Detachment, Shanghai Special Naval Landing Force together with Seaman 1st Class Saito, the driver, were murdered by the Chinese Peace Preservation Corps while riding in an official car on the road outside Hung-Chiao Airfield in the western part of Shanghai. Diplomatic negotiations, as usual, made no progress. The incident was used as an excuse by both sides, however, and a sharp increase was made in the forces. Eventually this resulted in the clash in Shanghai.”
Lt. Isao Oyama (27 years old), commander of the 1st Company of the Shanghai Special Naval Landing Force and 1st Seaman Yozo Saito were killed by (allegedly) members of the Chinese Peace Preservation Corps on Monument Road in the extension of the common concession at about 18:30 hours on 9 August 1937 (fact). It is still unknown whether Oyama attempted to enter the military airport there. But as it was told in Peter Harmsen’s book “Shanghai 1937: Stalingrad on the Yangtze” Zhang Fakui, the commander of the Chinese right wing, said the Japanese marines fell in a Chinese ambush and were killed, after that in order to simulate it was self-defense action, they brought a Chinese convicted to death dressed in military clothing and executed him with a shot in his neck.
The Japanese already controlled most of North China. The Imperial Japanese Army (IJA) was more concerned with the Soviet Union which they regarded as the primary military threat. The IJA had no desire at that time to expand the war into eastern and central China. It was hoped that a confrontation with the Japanese in Shanghai with it’s large international community and significant foreign business interests, would engender sympathy and support for the Chinese cause.
There were 30,000 Japanese civilians in Shanghai and considerable business interests, including a large number of factories and warehouses. When the Oyama incident occurred there were only about 300 Japanese SNLF troops guarding the Japanese interests in the city, but Zhang Zhizhong had approximately 30,000 KMT troops outside of town. If you were Japan would you provoke an incident at this time or wait until you had more troops on the ground?
In Moscow, Soviet Union, however, Soviet leader Joseph Stalin had a different design. He wanted to expand the Second Sino-Japanese War as quickly as possible in order to mire the Japanese Army in the vast Chinese interior, thus reducing the chance that Japan could divert its resources to attack Soviet Russia so that he could move West towards Europe. Until the powerful Japanese threat in the East was diverted elsewhere, he could not move towards Central and Western Europe.“Mao: The Unknown Story” Jung Chang and Jon Halliday, 2005
“..Zhang staged an incident outside Shanghai airport, where a Chinese army unit,which he himself specially stationed there, shot dead a Japanese marine lieutenant and a private. A Chinese prisoner under sentence of death was then dressed in Chinese uniform and shot dead at the airport gate, to make it seemed the Japanese had fired first.”Chinese did a lot other a–hole things to instigate the Japanese Empire anyways:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jinan_incident
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nanking_incident_of_1927
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tongzhou_mutiny
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Malla says:@Malla
As we have seen, Stalin (as well as CCP) wanted a Sino (KMT)- Japanese war as this will solve his Japanese Empire threat from the East so that he could concentrate on what he was really interested first, Europe.
Interesting thing to look into is the Sino Japanese war starts in 1937 and thus the Japanese Empire is to be stuck up in China’s vast hinterland according to Stalin’s plan, something strange happens immediately in the Soviet Union. Within one years, the Soviet Union starts mobilising its men for some major offensive it seems. How do we know this? Well some interesting information I came to know. There is this channel called Ushanka Show by a person born in the USSR, Sergai Sputnikov and he finds something interesting about 1938.
Comrade Stalin vs. Soviet Women. Strange events of 1938 — Ushanka Show
In between 1938/39 and 1956 maternity leave for women was cancelled in the USSR. January 1939, Stalin drastically reduces maternity leave of Soviet women. 112 days to just 63 days. At the same time interestingly a new Soviet heroine becomes very famous and is celebrated in the USSR, Pasha Angelina was a celebrated as one of the first female tractor-operators in the USSR and was made a symbol of the technically educated female Soviet worker. In 1938 a slogan came out with 100000 girlfriends on tractors and all newspapers as well as posters were pushing this propaganda in the USSR. So the Soviet Union wanted women to become tractor drivers. About 200000 women were trained as tractor drivers. But what about the male tractor drivers? They were needed in the army. At the same time a comedy Soviet movie is released (basically pre-war Soviet propaganda), the movie is called Tractor Driver but it has a song called “March of the Soviet tankman“. Basically Soviet tractor drivers were slowly sent to the army and they needed to be replaced by Soviet women. So this Pasha Angelina women tractor movement nad cutting down on female maternity leave. The USSR was already preparing for war. In 1938-39 just shortly after the Sino Japanese war (1937) is successfully triggered, USSR becomes ready for action in Europe.
Well in 1939 the USSR invades Poland from the East, we have the Soviet invasion of Finland, Soviet conquests of Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia as well as Moldovia, all only after the Sino-Japanese war started. In other words, a Japanese-China war leads to greater Soviet activity in Europe as Stalin’s objective of keeping the Japanese Empire busy in China is realized. But the mobilization seems something for something bigger. In 1940-41, we see Romania and Hungary telling Germany, busy fighting the British, of a huge Soviet build up on its borders and Germany realizes the same. We have Soviet Foreign Minister Vyacheslav Molotov’s four demands from Hitler in November 1940 which included Soviet influence in Finland, Romania, Bulgaria and Turkey. Now Romania was Germany’s major oil supply while the USSR had a lot of oil in its territory. It were these demands which spooked Hitler because if the Soviets suddenly took Romania, Germany would be lost without oil for its huge war machine and there would not be any other real power in Western Europe (except Britain) which could stop Soviet tanks from reaching the Atlantic Ocean. Hitler told Finnish leader Carl Gustaf Emil Mannerheim that he was in a state of shock after his meeting with Molotov as it suddenly dawned upon him that that Stalin might be already preparing to conquer all of Europe. Also (16:29 minutes in above video) in October of 1940, Stalin passes an executive order (Ukaz), for State labour reserves or labour was converted into military reserve. Same month and year, Oct 1940, Comrade Stalin passes one more executive order, where he cancelled free education in Soviet high schools and colleges, now you had to pay. And to mobilise youth to go to trade school. Already as early from 1938, Stalin was preparing for a huge war.
In the above video, at 15:27 minutes, he says in the book In the Name of the Victory, by Marshal Ustinov who later became Minister of Dept of Defence, by the beginning of 1940, that 41% of all industrial workers had suddenly became women. In other words the USSR was mobilising for something big, 41%, that is huge. With such a huge population, this mobilisation was for something bigger than Finland or Poland, something like all of Europe. In other words it further supports the fact that Hitler and his allies (Hungary, Romania, Slovakia, Italy Finland) via Operation Barbarossa made a pre-emptive strike, fight the Soviets in their territory before the Red Army tanks reach the German Autobahns and Romanian oil fields. In April 13, 1941, to finally reduce any chance for the Japanese Empire attacking the USSR from the East in spite of the Japanese Empire being quagmired in China triggered by Stalin himself, Stalin signed the Japanese–Soviet Non-aggression Pact, which he broke/ discontinued once Germany was defeated and the USSR invaded the Japanese Empire. The pre-emptive strike by the Western Axis nations, was just a few weeks before a very likely sudden Soviet invasion for all of Europe. Remember unlike Trotsky who preferred the Communist cell and revolution method of spreading Communism, Stalin preferred the Red Army way. In other words, a Sino Japanese War had to be started by Stalin so that he could go ahead and Bolshevise all of Europe. -
John Wear says:@Carolyn Yeager
You write: “John, thank you for confirming/proving to the readers here that you are indeed a moron whose ability to think through something even a little bit complex is nil — just as I said.”
My response: All you presented in your comment #348 was information from Hermann Giesler’s memoir, which is hardly dispositive of the issue.
I personally find what Rudolf Hess’s son, Wolf Rüdiger Hess, wrote to be more convincing.
However, as Wolf Rüdiger Hess said, no one can say for sure whether Rudolf Hess undertook his flight with the knowledge and blessing of Adolf Hitler. This is because both men are now dead.
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Corvinus says:@Ron Unz
“Hitler’s final demand, that 95% German Danzig be returned to Germany just as its inhabitants desired, was an absolutely reasonable one”
Certainly. But his actions afterward were other than reasonable. Rather than invade and annex Danzig, Germany decided to run roughshod over Poland. Why? To demonstrate to Great Britain of its military might, and its willingness to seize any non-German territory by force, which goaded the British to declare war.
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Odyssey says:
Lebensraum was a myth, too?
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Odyssey says:@Malla
Malla (‘little’), you must be joking or do you want to be the leading revisionist ww2 ? Operation Barbarossa showed how prepared the USSR was for war. Did the Germans preemptively kill 27 million Russians? Some ‘panzer’ Germans say that even the cowardly attack on Yugoslavia without a declaration of war, the bombardment of Belgrade with incendiary bombs, the targeted destruction of the library with ancient manuscripts, as well as the sponsoring of Croats to commit genocide against Serbs in thousands of killing fields and concentration camps was self-defense.
The Soviets were preparing for war? Were the Germans preparing for war and producing so much weapons to fight on two major fronts plus Normandia? Then why did they attack Western Europe?
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whew says:@HVMII
“Central Europe was turned into a region of ethnic minorities dominating over ethnic minorities. It made the artificial nations in the region unworkable.”
how did it differentiate it from the prior Central Europe where ethnic minorities were dominating other ethnic minorities? you hypocrite. only Germans are allowed to do it in your world view?
the Czechs offered to secede in the mid-19th century, without German majority-populated area that were historically Bohemia and Czech populated. the Germans refused. to call Czechoslovakia a creation of Wilson is extremely ignorant, pretending there were no desires for independence – it is typically jewrman: self-righteous and ignorant. since the Czechs had to fight for their freedom, it would’ve been inexcusable to surrender lands where Czechs lived and they had historical ties. since Germans didn’t believe in self-determination, it was hypocritical of them to use the argument for their benefit.
“Yugoslavia is another example. The only thing that held it together was Tito.”
and what held the artificial nation of Austria-Hungary together? the Habsburgs?
you should judge everyone by the same standard, including yourself.
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Sarita says:
Strange.
No one has answered the question.
(They are too busy looking for likes)
Here it goes again:
How many Jewish people did white people kill in Auschwitz I, Auschwitz II (Birkenau) and Auschwitz III (Monowitz).
Ok fine, it wasn’t 6 million, but how many?
No one was killed?.
And if so, how did those tiny, pale faced Jewish people convince all those governments to believe that so called lie?AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
MacOisdealbhtoo says:@Carolyn Yeager
Rong always counts his views on utube , most important part of his day.
An obvious cut out, Roger Waters can’t do the same show he has done for 40 years because of certain symbols, but Rong can praise certain dictators and not a word is said.
The Pravda issues on Cabaret Berlin period were very good too, but again how does Rong get to say what he says about his fellow tribesmen.
And I was right about war games release of Fauci flu in fall 2019, Rong was Wrong, again.
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HVMII says:@whew
Austria-Hungary was just as artificial as the nations created out of Versailles, but it had once been the leader of the Holy Roman Empire which gave it legitimacy. It was a major power until Napoleon defeated Austria at to the Battle of Austerlitz in 1805 which ended the Holy Roman Empire and led to the Confederation of the Rhine.
Austria lost relevance when it failed to answer the question of dualism in 1866 and allowed Prussia to create a lesser Germany by 1871. The 1866 Austro Prussia War was a question of Anschluss which never left the German consciousness from that point. Austria would later ask to unify with Germany during the Treaty of St. Germain negotiations, but that request was denied because unification would have made Austria-Germany too powerful.
To make it quite plain, WW I was a direct result of Austria-Hungary being a nation made up of minorities dominated by a German majority which had ruled over the entire region. It was a pluralistic country. Encouraged by Russia, Serbian nationalism was an existential threat to Austria Hungary, because it meant that if Serbian nationalists within Austria Hungary could demand their independence other ethnic nationalities could demand their independence and this meant the end of Austria Hungary.
The problem was quite clear at the end of WW I. Ethnic national rivalry was the very cause that started World War I (there were other causes but I am not going to explain them here). Yet, what do the allies do? They create new nations out the old without considering ethnic interests. Czechoslovakia was made up of Germans, Czechs, Slovaks and Ruthenians – none of which wanted to be ruled by the other. Yugoslavia was made up of Serbs, Croats, Bosnians, Macedonians, etc.
Many people in these countries did not want to be ruled by the other ethnic minority. I do not see the Czechs and Slovaks nor the Ruthenians (Ukranians) ever getting back together. Nor do I see Croatians and Serbians ever getting back together…
Czechoslovakia was artificial and so was Yugoslavia. They were created at Versailles without understanding the history or ethnic make up of Central Europe.
Ad hominem attacks do not make up for a lack of historical argument.
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MacOisdealbhtoo says:@Sarita
Not them but their reps threatened to expose all the civilian deaths of the Germans AFTER the war was over, committed by the allies, especially the British and Americans.
Over 10million German citizens starved shot raped and marched to death by freezing or hunger.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Liza says:
Pat Buchanan’s book may not be a direct line to God’s Holy & Complete Historical Truth, but it is certainly a toe in the door for people who might read it because they’ve read Pat’s other books.
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pachacuti says:@Sarita
what do you mean by white people and pale faced jews? please answer this.
if you care to read Mr Unz’s articles on the matter, you’ll find it is very likely that more than a million people of Jewish extraction died during the war, and perhaps 10 to 20 million Germans.
Now your other questions are very interesting, I’m sure you would love Unz’s articles even if you didn’t have the agenda of a troll
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whew says:@HVMII
“Austria-Hungary was just as artificial as the nations created out of Versailles, but it had once been the leader of the Holy Roman Empire which gave it legitimacy. ”
it had no legitimacy. at least you are able to admit it was artificial.
“Encouraged by Russia, Serbian nationalism was an existential threat to Austria Hungary, because it meant that if Serbian nationalists within Austria Hungary could demand their independence other ethnic nationalities could demand their independence and this meant the end of Austria Hungary.”
you are completely rewriting history for your benefit. Austria-Hungary was trying to conquer Serbia, and this enraged Serbians (rightfully so). Serbians had every Right to their nation, and to their independence, having just gained it from one empire didn’t mean they should surrender it to another.
“The problem was quite clear at the end of WW I. Ethnic national rivalry was the very cause that started World War I (there were other causes but I am not going to explain them here).”
firstly, it seems you need to do more listening than explaining. secondly, the cause was more empire rivalry than ethnic rivalry. the Czechs were busy fighting the Bolsheviks while the Germans were busy planning to send Lenin to Russia (so ironic that they, a few decades later, pretended to be the saviors). Austria-Hungary declared war on Serbia, a war that no one wanted to fight on its behalf (ie. why should Czechs go fight to oppress a people for the sake of the oppressor oppressing them?). Germans need to stop whining about being victims when they were as busy playing the sneaky Game of Empire as anyone else.
“WW I was a direct result of Austria-Hungary being a nation made up of minorities dominated by a German majority which had ruled over the entire region.”
and here, again, you lie. i pointed out your hypocrisy in my first reply, and you now try to rewrite the facts. Germans made up 23% of Austria-Hungary, and even not counting the Hungarian portion of the artificial state, were still not over 50%. they were a minority lording over minorities, less of a percentage of the population than Czechs in Bohemia.
“Many people in these countries did not want to be ruled by the other ethnic minority.”
this is true, but they banded together to not be ruled over by a completely foreign minority, and retained far more Rights for each other than was reserved for them prior to their coalitions. they did what they had to, and it worked far better than the alternative.
“I do not see the Czechs and Slovaks nor the Ruthenians (Ukranians) ever getting back together. Nor do I see Croatians and Serbians ever getting back together…”
the Czechs and Slovaks like each other, a lot. there are no ill feelings. the split was by politicians more than people. tho it wasn’t a perfect union, both nations are happy with one another. i have never heard of a Slovak with bad things to say about Czechs nor vice versa. any nonsense otherwise is always from some ignoramus from the USA or a German. as for Croats and Serbs, sure, that didn’t end well, still: nothing to excuse Austria-Hungary, that would be weak.
“Czechoslovakia was artificial and so was Yugoslavia. They were created at Versailles without understanding the history or ethnic make up of Central Europe.”
Czechoslovakia was made official at Versaille, but to say it was created there is extremely ignorant. the Czechs and Slovaks formed a union, a coalition of sorts (which, by the way, was led by Europe’s first National Socialist Party) for their mutual protection. it worked. claims that Czechs or Slovaks didn’t ever have a state or that they don’t have a Right to one are ignorant (claims they shouldn’t have unified for mutual protection are ridiculous). it’s like claiming the Scottish people don’t exist because they were a part of the UK.
“Ad hominem attacks do not make up for a lack of historical argument.”
i wouldn’t say referring to you, and people of your caliber, as jewrmans is ad hominem. it’s like calling a low IQ person “dumb” – it isn’t actually ad hominem, it’s true. your views are ignorant, arrogant, and self-righteous. you have no concept of the other sides’ views, and you don’t seem to care; you are willing to lie to “prove your point” – you are, in fact, a jewrman. this is simply how it is. better yourself, engage with honesty, and you won’t earn the moniker. so long as you earn it, it is true, not ad hominem.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Sarita
A cursory answer…not even close to six million. The estimates I have seen are 100-200 thousand.
The camps were labor and detention camps, not death camps. The gas was for delousing to contain typhus outbreaks, although many did die from typhus. And from starvation as the war drew to a close.Germans evacuated camps upon the approach of the Russians. If the intention was to kill them all, why wouldn’t they just kill them instead of evacuating? Anne Frank was in a “death” camp, yet she died in a hospital.
If you do some calculations, and they are available from multiple sources, it is impossible to gas, haul and incinerate humans in that number in the amount of time specified.
Contrary to popular belief, Hitler did not just start scooping up all the Jews when he came to power. It’s a complicated history. If you are truly interested, I recommend lectures of David Irving. That’s a good start.
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Ron Unz says:@Haxo Angmark
actual, effective post-revolution Politburo c. 1920…I dunno, Pat…..looks kinda Jewy to me.
Exactly.
Also, there are widespread if disputed claims that Stalin’s wife was Jewish.
And although I’d always fully accepted that Dzerzhinsky was a Polish Gentile, a few years ago I read a very interesting article somewhere that made a reasonably persuasive case that he came from a family of Jewish converts.
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Alden says:@HVMII
The Holy Roman Empire began in 800AD Rudolf Hapsburg was elected Emperor in 1282. The Hapsburgs and previous Emperors held Central Europe together for 1,1000 years. The Prussian/German kingdom held together for a mere 47 years, 1871 to 1918. Then chaos. Then Hitler’s regime lasted only 12 years. Then 45 years of occupation by Russia and America. And still occupied by America. Nothing to brag about.
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Ron Unz says:@Wizard of Oz
You know how unlikely it is that you will elicit an apology, thanks, or even an admission of the most obvious error but please do not give up on readers who value the product of your eide reading and judgment.
“Patrick McNally” is merely attempting to deceive people, but fortunately, you seem about the only commenter on this thread gullible enough to fall for his tricks.
The claim being disputed is whether a large or even overwhelming majority of the top Bolshevik leadership was Jewish, not whether the the hundreds of members of the Central Committee were mostly Jewish.
Here’s a more recent analogy. I assume you fully recognize that the Republican Party during the Bush Administration was very heavily dominated and controlled by Jewish Neocons. Yet I doubt whether even 5% of the Republicans in Congress were Jewish. Indeed, the Democrats were much more heavily Jewish. Does that disprove the claim that the Jewish Neocons dominated the Republican Party during that period?
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Truth Vigilante says:@Carolyn Yeager
In the early days, Hess was his #1 friend and stalwart ally. Another was Hermann Goering ….
Carolyn, you do realise that it’s spelt ‘Göring’ ? I’m well aware that many American historians spell it with the ‘e’ included because it kind of sounds that way when spoken.
Nevertheless, it is still the wrong spelling.Look at his actual signature below:
That fact that you can’t spell the surname of the # 2 man in the Third Reich (coupled to your smears and lack of respect for the greatest WWII historian that ever lived – ie: David Irving), lends credence to the [justifiable] belief that most of us have, that you’re not remotely in John Wear’s league as far as real WWII history is concerned.Your efforts to belittle John Wear are not working. Kindly desist and pay him the respect that he so richly deserves.
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Alden says:@Malla
Japan invaded, conquered the large and economically important Chinese province of Manchuria in 1931. Immediately sent more troops and established military bases. And used Manchuria as the base to invade the rest of China
By 1930, Japan has built a very impressive well trained well equipped and capable army navy and Air Force. After about 70 years of intensive industrialization and modernization Japan was ready and eager to establish an Empire to rival the English and French Empires.
Whatever diplomatic talks with Russia happened in 1939, Japan was already in the process of conquering China and other Asian countries.
The level of ignorance on this site never ceases to amaze.
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@John Wear
“I personally find what Rudolf Hess’s son, Wolf Rüdiger Hess, wrote to be more convincing.”
That’s because you’re a moron, John. If you were higher on the intellectual scale than a moron, you wouldn’t find it more convincing. As I’ve said many times now already, you just keep repeating the same sentences over and over in spite of the fact they’ve been rejected. You’re like a robot and this is the only output you have. Wolf Hess himself said it: “no one can say for sure” if his father had “the knowledge and blessing of Adolf Hitler.” Wolf didn’t know!! He admitted it. Oh, and don’t forget: BOTH MEN ARE NOW DEAD. But Wolf believed in his father, wanted to believe. And so does John Wear. Only problem, there’s that troublesome expectation of evidence.
As for me, I am employing Reason, a wonderful gift the Lord God has given us. Reason tells me that Wolf Rudiger Hess is not the authority on Adolf Hitler and his relationship to Rudolf Hess that you seem to think he is. The best authority is Hitler himself. Hitler said to his friend Giesler in confidence that he was very worried about RH and strongly implied he no longer had confidence in him. Hess did not have the confidence of the Fuehrer. And Hess’s botched flight to Scotland proved that he was on a fool’s errand. Hitler’s enraged response, which all those who knew him said was genuine, not faked, is also testimony from Hitler himself. You try to cherry pick what you can, like ‘Hitler didn’t punish Hess’s wife and family.’ Why would he have? What good would that do? But he didn’t try to cover for Hess at all. He removed all honors from Hess. That’s the way Hitler was. He didn’t tolerate disloyalty.
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Alden says:@Patrick McNally
You are wrong. Plus you quote the New York Times. Which hasn’t published a truthful word in the last 100 years. And certainly not a truthful word about Russia. The NYTimes was always a Jewish communist newspaper. In the last 30 years it has hired many Asian Hispanic black and gay writers. Who hate America and Americans as much as the Jews of the NYTimes do.
When Russia was a Czarist Empire the NYTimes constantly criticized denigrated and lied about the Czarist Empire. Claiming Russia was a poverty stricken primitive hell hole.
After 1918, the Jewish liberal commie NYTimes continually praised the Soviet empire as heaven on earth. The most progressive and wonderful country. This continued right up to 1990.
As soon as the Soviet Union fell; the liberal Jewish communist NYTimes turned against Russia. And since 1990, 33 years has lied and lied about Russia. Jews hate hate hate Russia. Except during the 73 communist years. Because jews installed communism in Russia.
The level of ignorance on this site never ceases to amaze.
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Franz says:@Patrick McNally
One would expect Hitler to simply suggest that they wait and see what the outcome is. He clearly did not do that.
Probably right.
Lots of us have likely read too much into the mystical relationship between Hess and Hitler, but more than likely it had fizzled by the time Hess made his flight. But Adolf never repudiated Hess and made sure his family was okay. Clearly some residual affection at work at least.
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@Truth Vigilante
You don’t know ANYTHING!! You have no idea about German spelling. You have no idea about David Irving. You have no idea about John Wear and “his league” OR about WWII history. You are an imbecile (that’s one level down from a moron). Kindly desist from addressing me and shoving your ignorant self onto my attention. Thank you.
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soll says:@Alden
Again, the level of ignorance of the Men of UNZ never ceases to amaze. In the late 19th early 20th century the Russians including the former serfs were among the most literate educated common people in the world.
Russia had a free press in the decade of 1855-1865, although the peasants were illiterate. Claiming former serfs were “the most literate education common people in the world” is a hasty generalization.
Your overly attached with Tsarism.
In 1900, Russia was one of the 4 biggest industrial countries in the world. America Britain Germany Russia.
Russia’s attempts at modernization was solely dependent upon investments received from the West, in exchange the peasants labor was being explotited to pay. In return resulted in the famines of early 1890s. Tsarism acquired the wealth from the exports which was spent back on industry, nothing was reinvested into the peasantry class from where such wealth had been acquired. Eventually this forced the people into the cities working upto 16-hour days. No wonder why Russia was consumed with mass worker strikes throughout 1900 until 1914 and 1917. You cannot blame this response solely on the revolutionaries.
Perhaps the most thorough English study, although incredibly dry to read is ‘Russia in the Age of Modernisation and Revolution, 1881-1917’ by Hans Rogger. Revolutionary Russia was influenced in minor part from the lack of educational rights, as the case for women like Vera Figner.
Stop reading and repeating Jewish historians about backward Czarist Russia.
If this was a Jewish conspiracy to discredit Tsarism, then how does this explain the plight of Revolutionary Russia? From the Narodniks and the People’s Will, into the SRs and later the Bolsheviks? The discontent was real.
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@Anonymous
The comment stream is effectively unanimous that Ron Unz’ thesis is correct. That would have been impossible in 2003 or so, but has happened in 2023.
Yes, I think this is true. However this may have more to do with Weimar-like domestic conditions in the United States and the fact that those with living memory of the conflict are dead.
Why inventions and science happen is difficult to explain. China and also the islamic world led these advances for many centuries. Now it appears the lights are dimming in the West, especially Europe, and I expect they will not come back on for some time. I do not think arguments grounded in the philosophy of science adequately explain these large movements in world history.
Ugh, the 40k Orks doing science is too reminiscent of the black/Hindu FDA, which is housed in what was originally a naval ordnance research facility.
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JWalters says:@Pierre de Craon
I agree the 1st Amendment is under assault, but it’s not dead yet. In my view it’s still worth fighting for.
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Rurik says:@Carolyn Yeager
now I feel bad
perhaps some dignity for those who fought
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Chebyshev says:@Odyssey
Lebensraum was a myth, too?
Yes, that was just an idea Hitler had written about over a decade earlier. It wasn’t the goal of German invasions of the east.
The Brits and the Yanks urged the Poles to be totally unreasonable in order to provoke a German invasion of Poland. The Germans then had to march all the way to Warsaw – they couldn’t just occupy a small part of western Poland and then let the Polish military, allied with Britain and France, launch attacks on them from the rest of the country.
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Odyssey says:@HVMII
It is obvious that you do not know the true history just as the NYT does not write the true history of this conflict in Ukraine. Some still write that Serbia wanted a war with the AH empire and Germany, i.e. that a rural country of 3 million that has just emerged from two exhausting Balkan wars attacked 100+ million highly industrialized AH+Germany. AH occupied Bosnia after the departure of the Ottomans, even though it had been Serbian land since the beginning of time and there was not a single Austrian in it.
Serbia was one of the winners of World War II, whose victory was decisive for the end of the war and was already halfway to conquering Berlin when the Allies stopped them. Serbia was offered to take the Serbian parts of the AH monarchy, but the Croats (and the Slovenes) begged for the creation of Yugoslavia because they would have been assimilated in new Germany/Austria already in the first generation. It was a big Serbian mistake to accept them into Yugoslavia, because the Croats already after 20 years committed a great genocide against the Serbs.
There was only one historical people in Yugoslavia – the Serbs, the Croats never had their own state. The communists continued to destroy the Serbian people (in alliance with the Vatican and Zionism), which was decided at the Cominterna Congress in Dresden in 1928. They created several artificial nations and took away the territories from the Serbs (Macedonians, Montenegrins, Bosnians, Albanians, etc.) and created artificial borders breaking the Serbs into 7 parts.
After Tito’s death, Yugoslavia did not fall apart along ethnic lines, but along communist lines, which meant breaking the Serbs into 7 parts, in 5 of which they were in the minority. The Serbs resisted this new genocide, and because of that, a civil war took place. With the help of the West, Serbs were ethnically cleansed from Croatia, Kosovo, and most of Bosnia (e.g. Sarajevo had 250 K Serbs, i.e. one half of its population, there is none today).
The struggle for the destruction of the Serbs has been going on since the collapse of the Western Roman Empire up to today. The young independent Serbian state was founded on its ruins and it had the oldest Christian diocese, independent from Constantinople and Rome. The Vatican left the Serbs without help during the Ottoman invasion of Europe where they bled to death protecting Europe from the inroads of Islam.
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Thelma Ringbaum says:
Well, the hunger year(s) in postwar Germany has to be best compared not to “Holodomor” of 1930s but to the famine the Soviets also had in 1946-47, when probably a couple of millions of russians had perished without any Allied occupation to blame.
Holodomor was a man made famine caused by oversealous establishing of collective farms by the Ukrainian Commies. Famines of late 1940s were due to devastations of the WW2, all over the Europe and England. England had food rations well into 1950s, as the memoir of Keith Richards illustrates.
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eah says:@Alexandros
It’s an English translation (interpretation, paraphrasing) of part of what’s known as the Schmundt-Protokoll, notes taken by Rudolf Schmundt, Hitler’s military adjutant, at a meeting between Hitler and military chiefs held on 23 May 1939 in Berlin — you can dispute the authenticity of the Schmundt-Protokoll, or perhaps the translation (which is not an exact science and cannot be done word-for-word), but to me it seems a fair and reasonable rendering in English of the notes Schmundt allegedly took (found in captured documents) of what Hitler said at the meeting.
23.5.1939 — Bericht über eine Besprechung (Schmundt-Mitschrift)
Der Lebensraum, der staatl. Größe angemessen, ist die Grundlage für jede Macht. Eine Zeit lang kann man Verzicht leisten, dann aber kommt die Lösung der Probleme so oder so. Es bleibt die Wahl zwischen Aufstieg oder Abstieg. In 15 oder 20 Jahren wird für uns die Lösung zwangsweise notwendig. Länger kann sich kein deutscher Staatsmann um die Frage herumdrücken. … Danzig ist nicht das Objekt, um das es geht. Es handelt sich für uns um die Erweiterung des Lebensraumes im Osten und Sicherstellung der Ernährung, sowie der Lösung des Baltikum-Problems. … Es entfällt also die Frage Polen zu schonen und bleibt der Entschluß, bei erster passender Gelegenheit Polen anzugreifen. An eine Wiederholung der Tschechei ist nicht zu glauben. Es wird zum Kampf kommen. Aufgabe ist es, Polen zu isolieren. Das Gelingen der Isolierung ist entscheidend.
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Druid55 says:@Fiendly Neighbourhood Terrorist
I think it only became an issue later when the jew theft of Palestinian land became an issue. It was used as a battering ram for jew interests, esp after the 1967 invasion of Israel against the arabs ( this is now proven)
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24th Alabama says:@Brosi
It isn’t clear to me how feminism and male ignorance became intertwined in a discussion about Alsace -Lorraine, but your reference to “estrogen laden second wave feminists” piqued my interest. The typical male suspicion is that feminists are a little light on estrogen and a bit heavy on testosterone, a presumption stemming from their perceived aggressive and competitive behavior.
Corrections are welcome, but my understanding is that both the testes and ovaries secrete testosterone and estrogen, but in different proportions, with male serum levels of testosterone being about seven times that of females. The adrenal glands also secrete both hormones in lesser amounts.
Feminism is generally characterized as a political belief with important social implications and corollary behavioral habits and attitudes. I was unable to find any serious research to support a broad thesis that hormones cause a woman to be a feminist but gender does play a role in the unequal distribution of some personality disorders and other mental illnesses that may have genetic factors in their origin, but are triggered by environmental stressors.
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Sarita says:@pachacuti
My friend,
I was expressing the thought of Jewish minds when I said “white people killed”, I was being sarcastic.
Actually, I always say that white anglo Saxon protestants (England) took part in the killing of many white anglo Saxon protestants (Germany). They were killing their own race, their own people, and so did the Americans. (Dresden).
My question remains, how did Jews manage to craftily convince ( establish it as a fact) more than 95% of the world that 6 million died at the camps?
It’s actually law in many countries where you’ll face prison time by denying it.
How did they do that?
It’s a big Injustice.
The biggest.
And it’s corruption.
That’s what I meant.
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Dube says:@Mefobills
Hitler and Pilsudski as pals? Don’t carry it too far. In 1933 Pilsudski proposed joint military action with the West to bring down the German military buildup. The French declined, and the rest is … history. That’s what led to the German-Polish nonaggression pact.
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Brosi says:@HVMII
Czechoslovakia was artificial and so was Yugoslavia. They were created at Versailles without understanding the history or ethnic make up of Central Europe.
I think that these “states” were the deliberate plausible deniability cover story for a far more nefarious plot that the Jewish lawyers and their overlords had concocted likely before they even got the war machines rolling in 1914.
I think most readers would agree the Prinzip’s assassination of Ferdinand was about something far larger than just Serbian nationalism, and that there was a hidden hand pushing an genocidal agenda against all of European civilization.
Likewise at Versailles these same forces had plans that were far larger than the Czechs or the Serbs finally achieving “freedom”, “democracy” and “independence”. The Freemason credo is “Ordo ab Chao” (Order out of Chaos), and the monstrosities of Yugoslavia and Czechoslovakia were created with this in mind, if not a part of a far larger plan going back decades or even centuries.
We also have to consider that the wave of Communist Putsch’s planned for after the collapse of the Axis powers in 1918 had failed everywhere except Hungary.
Also, Germany had escaped WWI physically unscathed.
My father, a Freemason, once told me that the best time to buy real estate was after the second foreclosure. I think this applied to Europe as well, and I think WWII was planned before WWI even started. Albert Pike confirmed this in his famous letter to Giuseppe Mazzini in 1871.
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soll says:@RoboMoralFascist 1st
Say kids!…. In 1938 Adolf Hitler was Time Magazine’s Man of the Year… in the United States.
You and Ron are equally as ridiculous.
The January. 2, 1939, cover of TIMEHitler appeared on the cover of TIME on multiple occasions—most famously perhaps on Jan. 2, 1939, when he was named Man of the Year. That choice abided by the dictum of TIME founder Henry Luce, who decreed that the Man of the Year—now Person of the Year—was not an honor but instead should be a distinction applied to the newsmaker who most influenced world events for better or worse. In case that second criterion was lost on readers, the issue that named Hitler dispensed with the portrait treatment that cover subjects typically got. Instead he was depicted as a tiny figure with his back to the viewer, playing a massive organ with his murdered victims spinning on a St. Catherine’s wheel. Underneath the stark, black-and-white illustration was the caption, “From the unholy organist, a hymn of hate.”
https://time.com/5573720/hitler-world-influence/
Excerpt, seen below. Such a glowing review?
“But the figure of Adolf Hitler strode over a cringing Europe with all the swagger of a conqueror. Not the mere fact that the Führer brought 10,500,000 more people (7,000,000 Austrians, 3,500,000 Sudetens) under his absolute rule made him the Man of 1938. Japan during the same time added tens of millions of Chinese to her empire. More significant was the fact Hitler became in 1938 the greatest threatening force that the democratic, freedom-loving world faces today.”
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Wielgus says:@Haxo Angmark
So he wrote a diary entry while cramped into a Sperry ball turret over the target?
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Wielgus says:@the Man Behind the Curtain
If you think Hitler was a nice guy and Auschwitz was a health resort where Jews could use a swimming pool, you come to this website.
Maybe there would have been more pushback in 2003 but there were indeed still people back then who remembered WW2.• Agree: the Man Behind the Curtain• Replies: @MefobillsAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Brosi says:@Malla
In a recent Napolitano interview of Colonel Douglas MacGregor in a discussion about D-Day, MacGregor claimed that Stalin had so much US oil being delivered during Lend Lease that he couldn’t use it all, and so he was selling it on to the Japanese Empire. Much of this “oil” was high-octane aviation fuel than only America could manufacture. I read somewhere that 80% of the aviation fuel used by the USSR came from the US. I would bet that many Japanese Zero’s were flying on that very same aviation fuel.
An important historical fact is that during the entire war Japan never intervened against the Lend Lease shipments to Vladivostok of all kinds of munitions and other supplies, even though the US was brutally firebombing Japanese cities and was actively trying to starve Japan.
It was the signing of the Soviet-Japanese non-aggression pact that freed up the Soviet elite winter forces used to repel the German capture of Moscow in December 1941. Even after Hitler declared war on the US, Japan never reciprocated in any fashion.
Then there is the refusal of Stalin to invade Manchuria, Korea and Japan until after the Atomic bomb was detonated over the a full, Catholic cathedral in Hiroshima.
It seems clear to me that there were all kinds of secret agreements and plans being made in synogogues, lodges and board rooms strewn across the planet.
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@Anonymous
You had another long response which I had intended to reply to about the end of the republic but I can’t find it now…
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Wielgus says:@soll
British and French industrial investment was especially heavy, and economic ties to them played a part in Tsarist Russia becoming allied to them as well, ultimately in military form in WW1. With disastrous results.
Early on in his political career, Lenin ridiculed liberals for setting up committees to promote literacy (Lenin’s own father had made a civil service career setting up schools, mainly in the Volga area). But if literacy was all that widespread, why were there illiteracy committees in the first place?
Stress on “revolutionaries were mostly Jews!” tends not to answer the question why non-Jews gave them a hearing. Social strains in Tsarist Russian society, stupid wars, that kind of thing?AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Truth Vigilante says:@Sarita
How many Jewish people did white people kill in Auschwitz …..
Ok fine, it wasn’t 6 million, but how many?
No one was killed?.And if so, how did those tiny, pale faced Jewish people convince all those governments to believe that so called lie?
The Zionist Usury Banking Cartel, the controllers of the entirety of the western financial system, with the ability to print/digitally conjure scores of trillions of dollars with a keystroke through their ownership/control of the U.S Federal Reserve and the other western central banks, coupled to their ownership of the MSM/major book publishing houses in the western world (not to mention the Hollywood movie industry), can EASILY buy off all the corrupt politicians that they need and control the narrative that’s fed to the ignorant masses.
That you’re not aware of this Sarita, is proof that you’re a brain-washed automaton yourself that’s swallowed everything you’ve been force fed by the Zio miscreants.
As for your comment about those ‘tiny, pale faced Jewish people’, we’re all familiar with the Rothschild family dynasty and how they are one of the core constituents of the ‘Old Money’ Jewish dynastic families that comprise the Zionist Usury Banking Cartel.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Carolyn Yeager
You don’t know ANYTHING!! You have no idea about German spelling.
I posted Göring’s actual signature in comment # 397.
So Carolyn, let me get this straight, you’re telling me that Hermann Göring doesn’t know how to spell his own name or anything about German spelling ?I have David Irving’s biography of Hermann Göring on my bookshelf and in it, Irving explains that the ‘Goering’ spelling is the Americanised/bastardised spelling.
Carolyn, all I can say is that you’ve become quite a ‘bossy boots’. A woman should know her station in life.
To that end, I have posted below a two minute video from the 1930’s/40’s (that Adolf Hitler would have approved of), which illustrates the correct etiquette the fairer sex should observe when in the company of men that are infinitely more knowledgeable than her:
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Brad Anbro says:@Agent76
I have provided a link to the “All Wars Are Bankers’ Wars” video many times. Also links to Aaron Russo’s “Freedom to Fascism,” and the “Corporate Fascism,” “Cultural Fascism,” “The Money Masters” and “JFK to 9/11: Everything Is A Rich Man’s Trick” videos
A BIG thanks to Truth Vigilante, who has been helping me to get more educated and who has been kind enough to show where I have been misled on various subjects. I used to “put Franklin Roosevelt “on a pedestal” but after reading a lot about him by REAL historians, I now realize that he was a phony, just like most of the other presidents that we have had.
Thank you.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Anonymous
Plenty of realistic material for discussion without obsessive focus on bad motives. Thanks. There was a lot of high mindedness in the rise of what is often excoriating today as neoliberalism. it would ne interesting to use AI for a massive search foe what economics was taught and believed since about 1960 and what it resulted in.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Ron Unz
“Patrick McNally” is merely attempting to deceive people, but fortunately, you seem about the only commenter on this thread gullible enough to fall for his tricks
With frequent doubts and reservations I have been grateful for your opening my eyes to some enhancers of my historical understanding like the early David Irving (whom you don’t seem to have accepted gives a very different account from the one(?s) you prefer for dealing with Hitler’s drive for war for Lebensraum and destruction of Communism in the UsSR… just a little more than BTW). I don’t share the passion you have for being right. I really have no emotion attached to the truth of the many contriversial/heretical versions of historical fact you espouse. I am delighted to be surprised.
Take Patrick McNally. You seem to rely on one issue which, perhaps because I am not Jewish, doesn’t agitate me as it does you – and Patrick McNally according to your version of him, which, despite repeated challenges you have neglected to back up.**
You have done a heroic job of overcoming the limitations of your early education but does honesty not compel you to concede that, if McNally is not a syndicate, his lifetime reading of history is much more extensive than yours. Hoe can I be expected to rely on the Ron Unz ipse dixit? You have neglected to make the critical negative case which would prevent your open minded honest but critical readers getting the correctly halanced benefit of what appears to be a learned commenter. And you certainly haven’t destroyed him.
**on the Jewish angle I must offer this pour amuser. I thought I had mismanaged a Podcast on my phone in a doctor ‘s waiting room today when I was listening to “Putin’s chef” loudly praising the Ukrainian military humiliation of Russian generals in Russian whole reading English captoons. Yes and no. An 83 year old man expressed his pleasure at hearing the Russian. He was a Jew who had immigrated in 1979. Punchline: he supported the Russians against Ukraine. “The Russians saved us, not the Americans or British”.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Ron Unz
It seems that any left of centre politicians in Russia 1917-20 were bound to be Jewish. Their views and lifestyles and backgrounds would probably have amazed you with what you didn’t have a clue about if you could visit them in a time capsule. Your obsession with Jews as the Bolshevik villains seems as misleading as your lumping the bad policies and actions of Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld together as the product of some kind of lumped neo-conism with little nuance.
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Mefobills says:@Dube
Hitler and Pilsudski as pals? Don’t carry it too far. In 1933 Pilsudski proposed joint military action with the West to bring down the German military buildup.
There was also a plan from the West to bomb the Soviet Union. Instead they became allies.
With regards to pals, I don’t think that ever happens at the top political level. There is “accommodation.”
Hitler lamented the loss of Pilsudski, because they could accommodate each other. Apparently, Smigly was one of those egoic and irrational types that, as today’s Russian say is, “Not agreement capable.”
Putting an egoic idiot in charge of your country never ends well.
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Mefobills says:@Brosi
It seems clear to me that there were all kinds of secret agreements and plans being made in synogogues, lodges and board rooms strewn across the planet.
I think this is pretty close to the truth. That is why Hitler so desperately trying to negotiate before WW2. But, there are always red-lines.
One of those red-lines was that the Germans were no longer allowing themselves to be “debt serfs” paying perpetual usury to the creditor class ensconced in the finance centers (Paris, London, Wall Street).
Finance centers are the “board rooms.” The Synagogues are related to board rooms, because Jews do operate the usury mechanism, and have for thousands of years.
With regards to Stalin, I consider him as having gone through several pivots. At first he was receiving finance largesse through the Bolshevik connections, i.e. wall street Jews. By end of war, he had pivoted and was calling the Rus/white Russians, as the “civilization forming people” and already had begun the show trials to eject the Jewish triumvirates.
By 1946, Stalin had invented national communism, a rebuke of Trotskyite comintern (and the western finance class). Perhaps Stalin always did intend on using war to push communism, and early on had decided that force was the mechanism required to push communist ideology.
“Who gets to rule Europe?”
It wasn’t Hitler that was forcing anybody, he mostly wanted to in-gather the German people for self protection. The German speaking people had been scattered.
Putin is protecting today’s Russian speakers in the Donbass, and Hitler was trying to protect the Germans from further attacks. The German form of economy did not require colonies or imperialism, nor was NSDAP national socialist ideology expansionary. The bad guys won in WW2.
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Mefobills says:@Wielgus
If you think Hitler was a nice guy and Auschwitz was a health resort where Jews could use a swimming pool, you come to this website.
Maybe there would have been more pushback in 2003 but there were indeed still people back then who remembered WW2.Are you saying that Auschwitz didn’t have a swimming pool?
The reason Auschwitz is so important is that it and holocaustianity has become a religion. A holocuastianity religious person will react when their icon is questioned.
If the sainted Auschwitz killing fields were not killing fields, but instead had swimming pools, then the 666 religion must be false.
Somebody is a liar. Auschwitz is central to exposing the liar.
(Hint: all of the camps before war, were an intermediate place between jail and civilian life. They were something like the camps used on the Uighurs in China. You eventually can graduate, or become discharged from the intermediate non-jail. After war began, the camps became a source of labor to make war material.)
The best way to shut the liars up, is ask them for a picture of the murder weapon – the holocaust killing machines. Where are the pictures of proper engineered gas chambers.
There aren’t any.
Holocaustianity is a blood libel against innocent Germans.
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@Truth Vigilante
Alright, I have to spell it out for you and your ignorant ‘friends’. The “e” after a vowel IS the umlaut – they are the same. Umlauts were originally written as ‘ae’, ‘oe’, and ‘ue’. It is not a bastardization. Look it up; I’m not going to do it for you.
When you wrote, originally,I’m well aware that many American historians spell it with the ‘e’ included because it kind of sounds that way when spoken.
that was the dumbest thing I’ve heard in a awhile. You really need to think twice and double-check before you accuse me of not knowing something about Germany. It’s a certainty I know more than you do.
My friend Wilhelm Kriessmann, born & raised in German Austria and served in the Luftwaffe throughout the entire war, always used the “e” when writing in English to English-speakers bc it was easier, faster than going through the process of creating an umlaut on an American typewriter or keyboard — which I used to do but rarely do now. So you’re wrong, your friends/supporters are wrong, and so is David Irving IF he really said or meant what you’re claiming he did.
And then you special group of imbeciles invariably add photos or video clips of American movies to make your point about your imagined superiority. LOL. A dumber group of dopes could not be found.
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Patrick McNally says:@Malla
The exchange with Mannerheim is from June 4, 1942, at a time when it was obvious that the USSR had not been the easily cracked nut which Hitler had expected. It’s no surprise that at this later time Hitler had suddenly changed his tune and was talking about how he had had no choice. But that is not the way that he talked about things either before or during the early stages of Barbarossa.
A more honest depiction of Hitler’s real thoughts at the time he launched the attack is given in his Table Talk of July 27, 1941:
—–
It should be possible for us to control this region to the east with two hundred and fifty thousand men plus a cadre of good administrators… This space in Russia must always be dominated by Germans.
—–These are not the words of a man who was particularly concerned about a Soviet attack. They reflect confidence that the USSR will easily collapse and Germany will have a simple time policing the whole vast region.
It’s rather funny the way that you jump all the way up from Hitler’s documented words about Poland on May 23, 1939, to a conversation with Mannerheim of June 4, 1942. That’s a leap of more than 3 years. That kind of methodology will never result in an honest analysis of Hitler’s motives.
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HdC says:@Corvinus
Nonsense!
Germany had already proved its military prowess in France and with the British flight of 300,000+ from Dunkirk.
The Polish campaign was a rescue mission for German expatriates in Poland, among other things.• Replies: @CorvinusAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
@Carolyn Yeager
American movies
Settle down he’s Oestralian.
You are correct about the umlauts.
Oesterreich
Schoen
MuellerJust some examples.
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@Mefobills
I agree with this:
It wasn’t Hitler that was forcing anybody, he mostly wanted to in-gather the German people for self protection. The German speaking people had been scattered.
Putin is protecting today’s Russian speakers in the Donbass, and Hitler was trying to protect the Germans from further attacks. The German form of economy did not require colonies or imperialism, nor was NSDAP national socialist ideology expansionary.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Brad Anbro
Very kind of you to say those things Brad.
It’s the least I could do to reciprocate for all those stories you shared with me, enlightening me about the likes of Walter Reuther and his suspicious demise. ie: individuals that I, as a non-American, would not have known about.
In light of that, let’s call it even.
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Wielgus says:@Mefobills
Oh sure. For the use of the staff, not the “guests”.
An intermediate place between jail and civilian life? Jail inmates in the Third Reich could have access to lawyers and some form of contact with the outside world was possible – not exactly due process but you didn’t disappear off the face of the earth. Friends and family members might know where you were and letters and parcels could be delivered. Concentration camp inmates were different. In fact jail inmates who had served their term after conviction in a Nazi court were often simply sent to a concentration camp, not released. This was because being sent to a camp was a decision based on an administrative whim, whereas being sent to jail tended to bear some sort of relationship to a court sentence, however unjust. Overall, concentration camps were worse than jails.• Replies: @MefobillsAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Mefobills says:@Carolyn Yeager
And then you special group of imbeciles invariably add photos or video clips of American movies to make your point about your imagined superiority. LOL. A dumber group of dopes could not be found.
It’s very difficult to argue with dumb people. My comment history is full of arguments with the Lolbertarian Truth Vigilante.
Lolbertarianism is a jewish derived and funded ideology designed to snare midwits.
Other midwits are attracted to simple platitudes, and cannot understand nuance. It’s probably best to not engage with them, because it is like trying to explain physics to a dog. Not everybody has the same mental capacity, all humans are not the same.
The reason I engage with the dummies, is so that innocents are not snared by yet another Jewish, “thesis, antithesis, synthesis” type of ideology. In other words, other readers can benefit by viewing the exchange. The midwits are of a “type” and they cannot be converted.
The only way to convert somebody of this type, is to use a concentration camp.
This is yet one more reason Hitler used the camps, as the German people had been abused with Weimar Liberalism, and the camps were a corrective – an interim place between jail and civilian life.
The intent was to heal, not punish. German midwits who had sucked up Jewish liberalism and communist precepts were disabused of their foreign implanted ideology. Dumb people cannot discern when a camp is like a jail, or when it is a place to heal.
The Lolbertarians will grandstand and self-aggrandize, but basically they are midwit dupes, who need to be shoved into modern “healing” camps for their own good. Of course, they will bleet about their free-dumb.
Nobody can argue that Xi’s camps for the Uighurs were unsuccessful. They were wonderfully successful at eradicating the toxic Wahabbi cult, and a side benefit was that the Uighurs gained skills and a work ethic. Xi has also moved industry into the region – work makes you free.
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Patrick McNally says:@John Wear
While the specific documents which I cited are noteworthy, it should be stressed that they fit with everything that Hitler was expressing throughout the years. Since people seem to like David Irving on this board, I would recommend trying for once to honestly read through his own texts on The War Path and Hitler’s War. While there are scattered points where I could quibble with Irving’s chosen style of presentation, everything which he describes in the run-up to the war and into the time before Barbarossa was launched fits the pattern of a leader who envisioned the great conquest of living space.
The Schmundt and Bormann documents don’t come from the kind of oddball sources which some of the confessions by German officers to Katyn extracted in Soviet captivity do. These are just part of a massive chain of documents which were captured in giant sweeps. If one was going to start claiming that a specific document was somehow manufactured, then one would either have to show that the entire collection was fabricated (a difficult task) or else demonstrate that a particular document was always somehow distinguished from the broader collection in the way that it appeared. There has certainly been nothing to suggest anything like that.
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Patrick McNally says:@Alexandros
It matches quite consistently with all of Hitler’s talk about living space and the drive to the east from as far back as the 1920s.
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whew says:@Brosi
the problem with people like you is you imagine everything to be zero-sum. you see the Jewish hand in the French Revolution, and think they fomented it without considering the role of the French elite; the Jews were merely taking advantage of something that would’ve happened anyway, they simply steered it. same with the Russian Revolution, Jews took advantage of anger amongst the people, they simply steered that anger. blaming Jews 100% is eliminating all responsibility for ourselves.
when you call Yugoslavia and Czechoslovakia monstrosities, you are ignoring the monstrosity that existed prior: Austria-Hungary. you pretend that it was alright, even good, simply because Germans were in charge. this is, in fact, an arrogant belief to the point of being idiotic. while i have no doubt there was a Jewish role in whispering to certain powers to allow these states to form, nor do i doubt a Freemasonic role, to pretend that these people did not want their own nations and that these states were not their own creation is ludicrous.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Wizard of Oz
Wizard of ZOG posed this question to Ron Unz:
does honesty not compel you to concede that, if McNally is not a syndicate, his lifetime reading of history is much more extensive than yours [?]
Now WoZ, none of us are disputing that the disinfo peddler that uses the ‘Patrick McNally’ handle (to deflect attention away from the fact that he’s one of the mishpucka/mishpocha), isn’t well read.
But what concerns us is that every book he’s read comes exclusively from the ADL/Jonathan Greenblatt recommended reading list for members of the tribe.
With that in mind, it’s not exactly likely to include any objective truths – much more likely to be subjective Zio propaganda.You also write:
You seem to rely on one issue which, perhaps because I am not Jewish, doesn’t agitate me …
You’re not called the Wizard of ZOG for nothing (assuming of course, that you’re not using one of your other aliases like Blizzard of Ooze, Lizard of Oz etc).
I mean, we’ve all noted your hypersensitivity to ANY comment that implicated Malevolent International Jewry in the 9/11 False Flag, the JFK coup d’etat, orchestration of the Ukraine proxy war etc.
You just can’t help yourself. Your knee-jerk reaction in immediately having to defend the small hats (like ‘McNally’), is OBVIOUS to all of us.
So pleeeeease quit with the ‘I’m not Jewish’ B.S.Who are you trying to kid ?
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Patrick McNally says:@Malla
Again, it’s a falsification to jump as far ahead as October 3, 1941. By that time, it was obvious that Hitler’s expectation that the USSR would collapse within 3 months had failed. All of his speeches from here on reflect the need to justify his earlier actions. But this is not the way that he was talking either before Barbarossa or even during the first month or so. By October it was obvious that the situation had changed.
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@Ron Unz
Unz’s Understanding of WW II
https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-understanding-world-war-ii/#the-true-origins-of-the-second-world-warFrom my perspective, the key to understanding WW II is understanding why in hell the UK entered this war, that is, the details of the decision-making process in the Briish ruling elite that led them to want a war with Germany and to declare war on Germany, when they had nothing to gain, and everything to to lose, which they lost. I don’t believe Unz’s article or anything else I’ve seen with the exception of this vid describing how the Jews bought Churchill contributes to this understanding …
Video Link
That is why Lewis’s book is a revelation. He didn’t know who was pulling the strings, but he saw them being pulled in 1936. Mainstream historians, even Quigley, have, AFAIK, ignored this question altogether.And, exactly the same thing is happening now in Ukraine. WW III is on the way and we don’t have a clue as to why. The US is obviously hell-bent of a war with Russian, we have nothing to gain, and everything to lose, and the decision-making process that led us to this precipice is entirely opaque. We have the outer face of the govt., We have Mearsheimer and many others who see the strings being pulled, but … who in hell is pulling them? This is the great mystery. We live in a ‘democracy’ but to all outward appearances, we’re governed by a military dictatorship bent on world conquest. Nothing is voted on. Congress does nothing. Instead the military and executive branch control the government and the govt. and media follows lockstep. How in hell can this be happening? And, who is responsible?
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anarchyst says:@Carolyn Yeager
Hey Carolyn,
Lay off the name-calling.
You are damaging your credibility by resorting to name-calling.
You are better than that.
John Wear does bring up some points to ponder…• Replies: @Carolyn YeagerAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Truth Vigilante says:@the Man Behind the Curtain
Oesterreich
Schoen
MuellerCurtain Man, you’ve proven my point.
ALL of these spellings that you’ve posted are DUMBED DOWN westernised equivalents, to make it easier for dummies like you to pronounce them.
Bottom Line: NO Germanic person spells them the dumbed down Carolyn Yeager way.
None of them would write Oesterreich. It would be Österreich.
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Mefobills says:@Wielgus
Oh sure. For the use of the staff, not the “guests”.
Pilpul!
That is you splitting hairs, and not being honest. So what if the swimming pool was for the use of the staff?
If you bothered to pull on the red string, which you haven’t, you would find many more anomalous characteristics of Auschwitz, that don’t fit the Jewish death camp narrative.
If something doesn’t fit, then somebody is lying.
Little things like having Doctors on staff, having camp prostitutes, camp money, and arrangements for entertainment, like concerts are to be just waved away as if they didn’t happen?
Holocaustianity is a religion, and expect the converts to have blind “faith.” It’s a false religion.
Did the Uighurs have a trial before being shoved into their camps? Nope. More pilpul on your part. Who cares? The administrative state decided, and that is what you are against.
Jews hear the thundering hooves of the Cossacks in their fever dreams.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Mefobills
UR readers, take note of what MoFo-Bill is doing here.
After being exposed as a Big Government Authoritarian Central Planning Statist, and humiliated by me and others in the UR commentariat for advocating Marxism, the MoFo has teamed up with Carolyn Yeager here in the hope of scraping up some support for his failed economic doctrines.
This should be interesting. They may even make a movie out of it.
It’ll be called ‘Dumb and Dumber III’.
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Verymuchalive says:@Wizard of Oz
As ever you misrepresent, misdirect and obfuscate. You say that Mr Unz has animus against “Patrick McNally” because of one issue: the level of Jewishness of early Bolsheviks. This is untrue.McNally promotes many opinions that fly completely in the face of the facts. Mr Unz mentioned an egregious example in an earlier response, which you totally omit.
That’s as ridiculous as your [ McNally’s ] other repeated claim that the gigantic famine caused by Mao’s Great Leap Forward never happened, and is merely a Western intelligence hoax. You’ve also claimed that the PRC government doctored all their own official population statistics to make it look like there had been a gigantic famine, presumably because they were in cahoots with the CIA.
Then you make this ridiculous claim of Ron Unz.
You have done a heroic job of overcoming the limitations of your early education but does honesty not compel you to concede that, if McNally is not a syndicate, his lifetime reading of history is much more extensive than yours.
I think it highly unlikely that a pseudonymous troll, whom you do not know, would have a more extensive reading of history than Ron Unz. As well as qualifications in Physics, he studied Ancient History. He has published at least one article in academic journals, which he republished here at UR. It was on the brothers of Alexander the Great. Mr Unz thinks he murdered them.
https://www.unz.com/runz/alexander-s-brothers/
Only a troll would sneer that Ron Unz had done a heroic job of overcoming the limitations of his early education. Some limited education !I have had differences over the years with Mr Unz, particularly over COVID, but would never deride his intelligence, breadth of knowledge and education. Like many others, I am grateful that he provides a platform for A Collection of Interesting, Important, and Controversial Perspectives Largely Excluded from the American Mainstream Media
You, Wizard of Oz, I once thought was a harmless quibbler. However, over the years your contributions have concentrated on misrepresenting and obfuscating explanations that challenge the official version. 9/11 – it was Muslim hijackers: JFK Assassination – No Israeli involvement. The list is long, tedious and predictable. Deep State troll – you certainly fit the bill.
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@Truth Vigilante
DUMBED DOWN westernised equivalents
That’s what happens when you lose two world wars, you have to put up with foreigners whose typewriters can’t handle umlauts. An even more extreme thing happened with the Eszett, which is now always printed “ss.”
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Malla says:@Patrick McNally
It’s no surprise that at this later time Hitler had suddenly changed his tune and was talking about how he had had no choice.
Nothing but your own senseless fartings. This was a private conversation with a major Finnish leader, the Finns themselves were part of operation Barbarossa. There was no need for Hitler to “explain anything” to the Finns!!! Of all the people.
is Table Talk of July 27, 1941
Highly suspicious source.
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Mefobills says:
After being exposed as a Big Government Authoritarian Central Planning Statist, and humiliated by me and others in the UR commentariat for advocating Marxism, the MoFo has teamed up with Carolyn Yeager here in the hope of scraping up some support for his failed economic doctrines.
There you go again with your narcissim and midwittery. That is why you were banned by Dr. Hudson, who happens to have very thick skin.
Lolbertarians are midwits and dupes, who have sucked up a Jewish ideology.
It is beyond your mental capacity to note that the NSDAP economy WAS CENTRALLY PLANNED.
The western liberal corporatocracy, with its hidden string pullers, attacked in WW2. They couldn’t stand the example of a successful economy where they didn’t get to take their unearned cut.
Lolbertarians protect the free movement of labor and capital, and also free-dumb of the corporatocracy to take usury on the world.
Dupe. Lol’s and Jews need to be re-educated, if that is possible. Head first into the camps with you.
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Patrick McNally says:@Haxo Angmark
Well, this is really silliness on steroids. Let’s take the most obvious bit of nitwittery:
—–
Politburo c. 1920:…
Sverdlov…………………………………………Jew
—–Sverdlov died on March 16, 1919. No, he was not part of any politburo in 1920. But let’s refer to the actual politburo of April 5, 1920:
http://holocaust.skeptik.net/misc/party.htm
—–
Politbyuro TsK: Members: Kamenev L. B. (Jewish), Krestinskij N. N. (Ukrainian), Lenin V. I. (Russian), Stalin I. V. (Georgian), Trotskij L. D. (Jewish)Candidates: Bukharin N. I. (Russian), Zinovjev G. E. (Jewish), Kalinin M. I. (Russian)
—–So, 5 members and 3 candidates. Out of the 3 candidates, there is 1 Jew (Zinoviev). Among the formal members one may either, as the composer of the webpage did, count Kamenev and Trotsky as Jews, or else one may count Trotsky as a proper Jew, Kamenev as a half-Jew from his father’s side, and Lenin as a quarter-Jew from his grandfather. Basically, we’re saying 2 out of 5 and 1 out of 3, or 3 out of 8 if you count altogether. But your list is bogus.
> Dzerzhinsky…………………………………….non-Jew, with Jew-controler: the wife
Where in heck do you get the notion that he was ever controlled by a wife? That’s your wishful thinking. As I said above, by some reasonable standards Kamenev was not really Jewish since it was only from his father’s side that he had a Jewish genealogy. I don’t mind identifying him as one born from a Jewish father, but it’s obviously a twisted presentation when you jump from claiming Kamenev as Jewish without qualification over to an invented story about Dzerzhinsky being controlled by a wife.
We note, incidentally, that any political sympathies which Dzerzhinsky displayed in relation to conflicts in the party were in favor of Bukharin, not Trotsky or Zinoviev (never mind Kamenev). What exactly are you basing this ludicrous notion of Dzerzhinsky being controlled by a Jewish wife on. It’s easy to argue that Donald Trump was controlled by a Jewish son-in-law because of the politics which he favored. Where is your sign of Dzerzhinsky ever having favored politics which would imply anything similar?
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soll says:@Truth Vigilante
Do you believe that Nathan Rothschild took over the Bank of England in 1815 following the Battle of Waterloo, thus the Rothschild’s came to control the world, would you accept this as being true?
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@Malla
Is India really this shitty?
India is such a subpar country. The Vande Bharat train is the national pride of India. Although it only runs at 90km/h. Indians just have low standards for everything. If it’s not complete horseshit then it’s national pride of India. But this train proved to be complete horseshit pic.twitter.com/Wr0K9JxFGy— Manju Baturu (@Xongkuro) June 14, 2023
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Patrick McNally says:@HVMII
> but not without provoking Germany first by initiating a program against ethnic Germans living in Polish Silesia and Pomerania.
While some pogroms did begin after the onset of the German invasion, they were not occurring before September 1, 1939. It was rather Hitler who provoked the pogroms by invading Poland. Not that one needs to defend all of the Polish actions. This is sort of like arguments made in 1999 over the bombing of Kosova. It’s a fact that Milosevic and other Serbian officials had held the aim of driving Albanians out of Kosova. The start of US bombing created a pretext for this. Antiwar critics of the Clinton administration charged that he was setting in motion the events which he claimed to want to prevent. Clinton-supporters maintained that he had had no choice but to start the bombing anyway as Milosevic was no good. That’s rather similar to the arguments around the anti-German pogroms which broke out in Poland after September 1, 1939.
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@Truth Vigilante
Oesterreich
Schoen
MuellerCurtain Man, you’ve proven my point.
Wait… wait…
𝖁𝖊𝖗𝖌𝖊𝖘𝖘𝖊𝖓 𝕾𝖎𝖊 𝕹𝖎𝖈𝖍𝖙!
𝕯𝖊𝖗 𝕰𝖜𝖎𝖌𝖊 𝕭𝖔𝖊𝖒𝖊𝖗
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Sarita says:@Truth Vigilante
THANKYOU for the feed.
This segment of your comment is what I’m trying to get to; Maybe my humor or my cinicism is misunderstood:…they can EASILY buy off all the corrupt politicians that they need and control the narrative that’s fed to the ignorant masses….
What I’ve been trying to say is that it is our (us goys) fault for not removing or supporting politicians who are against all this shit.
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soll says:@Mefobills
With regards to Stalin, I consider him as having gone through several pivots. At first he was receiving finance largesse through the Bolshevik connections, i.e. wall street Jews.
How was Stalin allegedly being funded by Wall Street “Jews;” do these people have names?
What is the Bolshevik connection.
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@the Man Behind the Curtain
I know he’s Australian. I’ve known that longer than you have. Don’t tell me to “settle down.” If I want to get mad, I’ll get mad. I am totally disgusted with the pathetic quality of the people here, including yourself.
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Patrick McNally says:@Alden
“Plus you quote the New York Times. Which hasn’t published a truthful word in the last 100 years. And certainly not a truthful word about Russia.”
I simply referred to the obituary in the NYT of Nicholas Riasanovsky as a way of further identifying the historian whom I was citing. You’re pretty deranged if you think that has any bearing on the accuracy of Riasanovsky’s analysis. But here’s another observation from a similar historian:
—–
The literacy figure for the whole empire for 1897 was 28 per cent; by 1914 it had risen to 43 per cent.
—–
— Warren B. Walsh, Russia and the Soviet Union, p. 345.That fits very well with Riasanovsky’s figure of 45 for 1917.
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John Wear says:@Patrick McNally
You write: “While there are scattered points where I could quibble with Irving’s chosen style of presentation, everything which he describes in the run-up to the war and into the time before Barbarossa was launched fits the pattern of a leader who envisioned the great conquest of living space.”
My response: I don’t agree with this statement. If you have an interest, you can read the following articles I wrote about the run-up to World War II:
1) https://inconvenienthistory.com/12/4/7463 Czechoslovakia: How Britain Turned the Failure of a State into a Cause for War
2) https://inconvenienthistory.com/14/3/8199 Neutral Sources Document Why Germany Invaded Poland
3) https://inconvenienthistory.com/11/1/6391 Why Germany Invaded Poland
4) https://inconvenienthistory.com/11/3/6807 The Soviet Union Conspired to Foment World War II and Infiltrate the U.S. Government
Or, better yet, you can read my book “Germany’s War”, which you can read for free on this website at https://www.unz.com/book/john_wear__germanys-war/.
You write: “The Schmundt and Bormann documents don’t come from the kind of oddball sources which some of the confessions by German officers to Katyn extracted in Soviet captivity do.”
My response: The Schmundt and Bormann documents you cite were allegedly written by two people who were dead or gone by the end of the war. They would have been extremely easy to forge.
The Allies attempted to find the Germans guilty for many crimes they did not commit. A good example is the Katyn Forest massacres. Three witnesses at Nuremberg testified that Germans were responsible for the mass execution of Polish officers at Katyn. Today everybody agrees that the Soviet Union and not Germany was responsible for the Katyn Forest massacres. (Sources: Conot, Robert E., Justice at Nuremberg, New York: Harper & Row, 1983, p. 454; de Zayas, Alfred-Maurice, The Wehrmacht War Crimes Bureau, Lincoln: 1990, pp. 230-235).
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@Carolyn Yeager
Well I see why no one reads your website
Don’t tell me to “settle down.”
You sound so old and crabby I lol’d over this.
totally disgusted with the pathetic quality of the people here
Your comments are shit-tier, definitely in the bottom 10% of Unz comments.
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Things are not what they seem for sure, and such will not go unpunished.
WEM
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John Wear says:@Patrick McNally
You write: “While some pogroms did begin after the onset of the German invasion, they were not occurring before September 1, 1939. It was rather Hitler who provoked the pogroms by invading Poland.”
My response: Poland was committing crimes and atrocities against it German minority prior to Hitler’s invasion of Poland.
On August 14, 1939, the Polish authorities in East Upper Silesia launched a campaign of mass arrests against the German minority. The Poles then proceeded to close and confiscate the remaining German businesses, clubs, and welfare installations. The arrested Germans were forced to march toward the interior of Poland in prisoner columns. The various German groups in Poland were frantic by this time, and they feared that the Poles would attempt the total extermination of the German minority in the event of war. Thousands of Germans were seeking to escape arrest by crossing the border into Germany. Some of the worst recent Polish atrocities included the mutilation of several Germans. The Poles were warned not to regard their German minority as helpless hostages who could be butchered with impunity. (Source: Hoggan, David L., The Forced War: When Peaceful Revision Failed, Costa Mesa, CA: Institute for Historical Review, 1989, pp. 452-453).
Rudolf Wiesner, who was the most prominent of the German minority leaders in Poland, spoke of a disaster “of inconceivable magnitude” since the early months of 1939. Wiesner claimed that the last Germans had been dismissed from their jobs without the benefit of unemployment relief, and that hunger and privation were stamped on the faces of the Germans in Poland. German welfare agencies, cooperatives, and trade associations had been closed by Polish authorities. Exceptional martial law conditions of the earlier frontier zone had been extended to include more than one-third of the territory of Poland. The mass arrests, deportations, mutilations, and beatings of the last few weeks in Poland surpassed anything which had happened before. Wiesner insisted that the German minority leaders merely desired the restoration of peace, the banishment of the specter of war, and the right to live and work in peace. Wiesner was arrested by the Poles on August 16, 1939, on suspicion of conducting espionage for Germany in Poland. (Source: Ibid., Ibid., p. 463).
The German press devoted increasing space to detailed accounts of atrocities against the Germans in Poland. The Völkischer Beobachter reported that more than 80,000 German refugees from Poland had succeeded in reaching German territory by August 20, 1939. The German Foreign Office had received a huge file of specific reports of excesses against national and ethnic Germans in Poland. More than 1,500 documented reports had been received since March 1939, and more than 10 detailed reports were arriving in the German Foreign Office each day. The reports presented a staggering picture of brutality and human misery. (Source: Ibid., p. 479).
W. L. White, an American journalist, later recalled that there was no doubt among well-informed people by this time that horrible atrocities were being inflicted every day on the Germans of Poland. (Source: Ibid., p. 554).
Donald Day, a Chicago Tribune correspondent, reported on the atrocious treatment the Poles had meted out to the ethnic Germans in Poland:
“…I traveled up to the Polish corridor where the German authorities permitted me to interview the German refugees from many Polish cities and towns. The story was the same. Mass arrests and long marches along roads toward the interior of Poland. The railroads were crowded with troop movements. Those who fell by the wayside were shot. The Polish authorities seemed to have gone mad. I have been questioning people all my life and I think I know how to make deductions from the exaggerated stories told by people who have passed through harrowing personal experiences. But even with generous allowance, the situation was plenty bad. To me the war seemed only a question of hours.” (Source: Day, Donald, Onward Christian Soldiers, Newport Beach, CA: The Noontide Press, 2002, p. 56).
British Ambassador Nevile Henderson in Berlin was concentrating on obtaining recognition from British Foreign Minister Lord Halifax of the cruel fate of the German minority in Poland. Henderson emphatically warned Halifax on August 24, 1939, that German complaints about the treatment of the German minority in Poland were fully supported by the facts. Henderson knew that the Germans were prepared to negotiate, and he stated to Halifax that war between Poland and Germany was inevitable unless negotiations were resumed between the two countries. Henderson pleaded with Halifax that it would be contrary to Polish interests to attempt a full military occupation of Danzig, and he added a scathingly effective denunciation of Polish policy. What Henderson failed to realize is that Halifax was pursuing war for its own sake as an instrument of policy. Halifax desired the complete destruction of Germany. (Source: Hoggan, David L., The Forced War: When Peaceful Revision Failed, Costa Mesa, CA: Institute for Historical Review, 1989, pp. 500-501, 550).
On August 25, 1939, Ambassador Henderson reported to Halifax the latest Polish atrocity at Bielitz, Upper Silesia. Henderson never relied on official German statements concerning these incidents, but instead based his reports on information he had received from neutral sources. The Poles continued to forcibly deport the Germans of that area, and compelled them to march into the interior of Poland. Eight Germans were murdered and many more were injured during one of these actions. Henderson, who strongly desired peace with Germany, deplored the failure of the British government to exercise restraint over the Polish authorities. (Source: Ibid., p. 509).
So, the Poles gave Hitler good reason for attacking Poland. The Poles were hardly innocent of any wrongdoing.
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Brosi says:@Mefobills
Hitler, like Putin, wanted to “go along to get along”, but ZOG wouldn’t have it. Putin, like Hitler, has decided to run the $IMFS gauntlet. I think we are both hoping that he succeeds.
Carrying the Russia/Ukraine analogy further, what I was trying to say is that all these clowns on the world stage today have absolutely nothing to do with the real agenda. Sure, Biden, Johnson, Leyen, Stoltenberg and even Lagarde and Yellen all get inside information about what is coming so that they can preposition themselves and profit from it, but none of them have any real say in what the bigger agenda is.
It was the same back then. Churchill, Deladier, Roosevelt, Hacha and even Smigly-Ridz had were not the ones who had decided on war then either.
So the question then as now is who is really setting the agenda. Going back through Churchill cabinet meetings 70 years ago will do no more to clarify this point now than going through Johnson cabinet meetings will in 70 years to come. The same would hold for Montegue Norman or Morgentau minutes from the Treasury.
The true agenda behind this insane push to the brink of nuclear war because “Putin cannot be allowed to win” is likely written nowhere. Ron Unz, the Idiot of Oz, Fran Taubman and Patrick McNally and even John Wear can argue about it until kingdom come, but the real reasons why millions of stupid European goyim have had to die has little to do about puppet politicians or even nationalism, and especially not because of “anti-semitism”.
Only the Rabbis in their synogogues and/or the 300 families in their lodges and board rooms will know for sure. The only thing the rest of us can do is recognize patterns and estimate odds.
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@the Man Behind the Curtain
You write too many comments, mostly saying nothing of any consequence at all. What is your point? To have a social life?
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Munga Bulga says:@whew
wtf, u “whew (resp. jew) boy”: Well, if you have no idea of absolutely nothing (as your confused scribblings “impressively” document), you should at least keep your cheeky loud mouth closed. Instead of even expecting that anyone would be even remotely interested in this made-up nonsense. Since when are sons named after their mothers, you airhead? Can you even put one and one together?
And who in the world would have ever asked someone like you to watch my videos (as if anyone would care about YOUR completely irrelevant “judgment” of all things)? But you should definitely go to Mr. Martinez, because your “personality” is not only “problematic”, but at least very”ulterior”. And whether you have any sympathy for Germans is equally irrelevant, you self-declared “peace-maker/friend” and wouldbe-psychologist
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Patrick McNally says:@Malla
> Highly suspicious source.
Things were copied down by people who weren’t checking it professionally with Hitler. In that sense the Table Talk is a somewhat informal source, as a possessed to a professional brief that is made after an event with the confirmation of the supervisor. But the Table Talk is certainly not some invention of the Allies. If it had been one would expect some casual comments about gassing Jews to be inserted. Instead, there is a comment about dumping Jews into the morass of Russia’s territories. But no reference to gassings. That is what one could expect had the Table Talk been somehow fabricated by the Allies. It wasn’t.
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Alden says:@Patrick McNally
Go ahead and quote communist Jewish pro communist propaganda. Doesn’t make the lies true.
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Patrick McNally says:@John Wear
> They would have been extremely easy to forge.
No, it actually is very difficult to forge either a long sequence of documents or a single document which is then to be planted amidst a wider collection of authentic documents. One can write an order to execute the Poles at Katyn and then sign it with Himmler’s name. But such a fake document will not be a part of any general flow. It will be the oddball document standing out. No historian from any point of view has ever found anything similar with the relevant documents which describe Hitler’s ambitions of conquering eastern Europe for living space.
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@the Man Behind the Curtain
Well I see why no one reads your website
You should read it, there’s a lot you need to learn.
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Mefobills says:@soll
The Bolsheviks were funded by finance capital, especially Jacob Schiff of Kuhn and Loeb.
In other words, international finance capital wanted the comintern (communist international), and for the same reasons finance capital was actively hostile to NSDAP (It was a nation state re-asserting itself and exiting the international system.)
https://www.henrymakow.com/jacob_schiff_ordered_murder_of.html
I wrote a pretty extensive series of comments on how Stalin received free Lend-Lease from FDR. Additionally, many of the Jewish maneuvers and plotters in Soviet Union (and America) are named, along with dates and events.
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Patrick McNally says:@John Wear
> The Poles were hardly innocent of any wrongdoing.
It’s not necessary to maintain any general innocence of Poles in order to grasp that there would have been no serious problem if Hitler had not first violated the Munich Agreement with the occupation of Czechia and then proceeded to press claims on Poland which exactly his pattern the previous year with Czechoslovakia. Things like the Bromberg massacre began on September 3, but when ever since Hitler had first occupied Czechia and then disclaimed his neutrality agreement with Poland in April the tensions had been building.
As I indicated above, the most generous interpretation one could reasonably give to Hitler’s actions would be like with the criticisms of Clinton in 1999. Many people argued that Milosevic was using the bombings of Serbia to enact an expulsion of Kosovar Albanians, but they maintained that the Clinton administration had made things worse by launching the bombings. However, Clinton never contemplated the aim of conquering the Balkans for living space the way that Hitler intended to conquer eastern Europe.
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Brosi says:@Alden
This painting is one of my all time favorites:
You are looking at a painting “Oral Counting. In the folk school of S.A. Rachinsky” by national artist N.P. Bogdanov-Belsky, painted in 1895.
Have you ever wondered what children are trying to count? In their mind.
(10²+11²+12²+13²+14²) / 365
But here is the rub for Alden: Where in this picture are all the second wave feminists squawking about “Men of Unz” demanding free abortions on demand?
I will also mention how critical it is that boys are instructed by rational and balanced men instead of mentally unbalanced feminist man-haters like they are today.
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Mefobills says:@Brosi
So the question then as now is who is really setting the agenda. Going back through Churchill cabinet meetings 70 years ago will do no more to clarify this point now than going through Johnson cabinet meetings will in 70 years to come. The same would hold for Montegue Norman or Morgentau minutes from the Treasury.
It is the same now as then, the bad guys won.
Who are the bad guys?
Hudson already answered that:
https://michael-hudson.com/2011/12/democracy-and-debt/
Matters changed with the Dutch democracy, seeking to win and secure its liberty from Habsburg Spain. The fact that their parliament was to contract permanent public debts on behalf of the state enabled the Low Countries to raise loans to employ mercenaries in an epoch when money and credit were the sinews of war. Access to credit “was accordingly their most powerful weapon in the struggle for their freedom,” notes Ehrenberg: “Anyone who gave credit to a prince knew that the repayment of the debt depended only on his debtor’s capacity and will to pay. The case was very different for the cities, which had power as overlords, but were also corporations, associations of individuals held in common bond. According to the generally accepted law each individual burgher was liable for the debts of the city both with his person and his property.”[2]
The financial achievement of parliamentary government was thus to establish debts that were not merely the personal obligations of princes, but were truly public and binding regardless of who occupied the throne. This is why the first two democratic nations, the Netherlands and Britain after its 1688 revolution, developed the most active capital markets and proceeded to become leading military powers. What is ironic is that it was the need for war financing that promoted democracy, forming a symbiotic trinity between war making, credit and parliamentary democracy in an epoch when money was still the sinews of war.
At this time “the legal position of the King qua borrower was obscure, and it was still doubtful whether his creditors had any remedy against him in case of default.”[3] The more despotic Spain, Austria and France became, the greater the difficulty they found in financing their military adventures. By the end of the eighteenth century Austria was left “without credit, and consequently without much debt” the least credit-worthy and worst armed country in Europe (as Steuart 1767:373 noted), fully dependent on British subsidies and loan guarantees by the time of the Napoleonic Wars.
Finance accommodates itself to democracy, but then pushes for oligarchy
Of course, Hudson cannot name the Jew. Upon expulsion from Spain in 1492, they set about changing the landscape of the lowlands to make it comfortable for their existence.
To do that required “free-dumb of religon” to then move about freely. Then it required creating debtor towns. These towns had the burgermeister tax the citizens to then pay for debts to the (((creditor))).
If you think closely, these debtor “corporation” towns were the first attack at Kingship and Sovereignty.
The Jewish/Dutch form of Democracy was a hidden hand of creditors tax farming the debtor population. In order to induce the debtors into the 80 years war against Spain (the Jews were still butt hurting about expulsion), required the towns debtors to vote.
Basically, Corporatocracy and finance capitalism was invented by Sephardic Jews after expulsion. The deep pools of capital, and the class of bond holders/creditors were the sinews of war and imperialism. Dupes and midwits think that creditor democracy has something to do with Greece, when there is no connection.
The form of hidden hand creditor democracies, now ruling the west, maneuvered for war against Germany. The London finance class also maneuvered for war against the Colonials, causing the revolutionary war.
Hitler was more American than FDR.
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Malla says:@Odyssey
This stupid myth spread by both Commies and Western propagandists that the Soviets “were not ready for WW2”. The USSR was the most ready nation for a major war among all the powers during this time period, multiple times more ready than Third Reich Germany and the Japanese Empire combined.
Again back to the Ushanka Show, by Comrade Sergei Sputnikov, who was a Soviet citizen in his youth.
The Great Patriotic War That Comrade Stalin Was Not Ready For—Ushanka Show
He speaks of the difference in the way history was taught in Western and Soviet schools. He finds the claims by traditional mainstream Western historians that the USSR was not ready for war against Germany in June of 1941, laugable. And he spits the facts in a sarcastical way. 2:40 minutes, he says ofcourse the Soviet Union was not ready at all if we see the numbers(sarcasim).
When the German Army of 3 million soldiers attacked Red Army of 5 million soldiers in the first eschelons ALONG THE BORDER. Germans had about 3,700 tanks against Soviet 12,700 tanks!! Germans had 4,950 airplanes versus Soviet 10,700 airplanes. So definitely Soviet Union was not ready for the war against Germany (his sarcasim). So Mr. Sergei Sputnikov asks the million dollar questions to those pro Soviet, pro Allied Western historians as well as Soviet historians. He asks, when would the Soviet Union would be READY for the war?
When instead of 5 million, the USSR would have 10 million soldiers? When instead of 12,000 tanks, the USSR would have 20,000 tanks against German 4000? Mr. Sputnikov asks, “What numbers were the Soviets supposed to have ON THE BORDER ready to go, to call them ready for the war?”At 6:40 minutes, Comrade Sergei asks”Half of Europe was Bolshevised by the Soviet Union, “not ready for war”. The question is what would happen to Europe, if Soviet Russia WAS READY for the war? If the war they “were not ready for” they ended up taking over half of Europe What would happen of they were READY and they would smash the Germans, right there on the border and rolled. I don’t think they would stop at the French border or at the Switzerland border or the Swedish border or for that matter the channel would stop them. If Soviets would be ready for that war against Germany (which they were, he is talking in a sarcastic tone), there would be a big European Union under the Red Flag”
At 7:25 minutes, ex Soviet citizen Comrade Sergei says “If you look at some events that were going on in the Soviet Union before the war, it kind looks like maybe Comarade Stalin had such a plan as one Europe under one red flag. I remember, I had a video about it, Soviets began this giant construction in Moscow, they blew up a very important church of Christ and in its place they began began huge basement for the tallest building in the World, Dvorjez Sovjetov (Дворец Советов), The Palace of Soviets, supposed to be the tallest building in the World, with a giant Lenin statue at the top of it. Moscow was getting ready to be capital of (Marxist) Socialist Europe, if not the World. When 1941 war broke out, the plans were shelved and later abandonned. Khruschev converted the basement into what is today’s World’s largest swimming pool.”There is one more very interesting point Comrade Sergei says at 8:35 minutes, “You would think Stalin would be very proud to win the war, he was not ready for, right? He was caught “off-gaurd”, wasn’t prepared, he managed to gather our strenght and win the war, you would think we would be super proud, super happy, but he never was!!! There was never a parade on May 9th!!, except Victory Parade, when they were burning German flags and tossing them by the Kremlin walls. After that, May 9th was never celebrated in Soviet Union, it was just a regular work day and there were no parades on the Red square in Moscow!! It began only, I believe under Leonid Brezhnev, he was big fan of big parades, of the great Fatherland war. They made May 9 as holiday and we had annual parades. It never happened during Stalin rule. Also during Stalin era, no one was allowed to write books about the war, no memoirs were published ever...It was only later generals and marshalls were allowed to write their stories, under Stalin rule, it was big no-no, for whatever reasons”
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Malla says:@Patrick McNally
That is what one could expect had the Table Talk been somehow fabricated by the Allies. It wasn’t.
It is still a very suspicious source. There is too much showing that Operation Barbarossa was a pre-emptive strike. Your weak arguments does not stand a chance.
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Malla says:@pachacuti
Braviiisima! very useful summation
Thank You!
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@Truth Vigilante
the MoFo has teamed up with Carolyn Yeager here
“Conspiracy Central,” that is all one gets from you. Everything is a conspiracy; everyone is a puppet with someone pulling the strings. Nothing in your world can be spontaneous, which most things actually are. That’s a dead end.
I’d like to point out, TV, that just two comments above this one (#450) you pasted into a quote box
“Bottom Line: NO Germanic person spells them the dumbed down Carolyn Yeager way”
Yet it’s not a quote from anyone, but something you just then (spontaneously) wrote. You’re not even quoting yourself! You practice this kind of minor deception all the time.
I can also tell you that plenty of “Germanic persons” and even German persons use the “e” instead of the umlaut. And it’s only going to grow, as with my friend W.L. Kriessmann. You are blowing smoke through your a__. You are a joke.And while I’m at it, you failed to reply to my post directed to you, #434:
@Truth Vigilante
Alright, I have to spell it out for you and your ignorant ‘friends’ [who agreed with you]. The “e” after a vowel IS the umlaut – they are the same. Umlauts were originally written as ‘ae’, ‘oe’, and ‘ue’. It is not a bastardization. Look it up; I’m not going to do it for you.Did you look it up? You’re going to stick with your incorrect belief? Are you unwilling to learn? You like to be wrong? Well, I like to be right, and that’s why I usually am.
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Patrick McNally says:@Alden
So Warren B. Walsh was providing “communist Jewish pro communist propaganda”? You really are mentally deranged. Anyway, here’s his lecture to the Naval War College of 1961:
https://digital-commons.usnwc.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=7313&context=nwc-review
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@Mefobills
I didn’t hit the Agree button bc I don’t have an informed opinion on the Uighurs and China’s Xi. I don’t really know anything about the Uighurs except the news of their ongoing persecution. You may be right.
Is there any place for me to learn more about you, other than your Unz comments page? If not, please direct me to a couple of your most characteristic comments. Thanks.
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Brosi says:@saggy
I had seen that video before, but had forgotten about it.
Churchill forging painting and selling them in Paris sounds just like Hunter Biden selling his paintings at $500K per shot.
Irving finishes off talking about how an “Austrian Financier” bought up all of Churchill’s debt right on the eve of WWII.
Irving didn’t mention this:
Sir Henry Strakosch GBE (9 May 1871 – 30 October 1943) was an Austrian-born British banker and businessman. As a Jewish financier, his close ties to Winston Churchill were exploited by Nazi propaganda during the 1930s and World War II, and by Holocaust deniers in later years.
Irving goes into detail about all the letters and diaries of these people involved. But this is just all clown show fluff. These Jews owned Churchill like they own the Bidens, and there was immense corruption (and tax evasion, then as now) going on. But what were the real motivations and agenda of this satanic Jewish cabal? Irving could spend the next 1000 years reading diaries and letters and he would never find this out.
Granted, now we have the benefit of the internet and 50 years of hindsight, but the reality is that even though Irving can expose Jewish lies and degeracy, he cannot find evidence or proof of why the Jews were so busy owning Churchill, or where they were ultimately going to take this drunken idiot that they so clearly owned.
It is also important to note that Churchill, like Stalin and Roosevelt, was a freemason. Irving doesn’t discuss this and to my knowledge he never does.
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Mefobills says:@Carolyn Yeager
“Conspiracy Central,” that is all one gets from you. Everything is a conspiracy; everyone is a puppet with someone pulling the strings. Nothing in your world can be spontaneous, which most things actually are. That’s a dead end.
That’s right. TV is a retard, and thinks I’m a Bolshevik, when I have loudly announced and demonstrated repeatedly, that I’m a proud Nazi.
I quote Hudson, therefore I am in league with him, and hence I am a Trotskyite. You actually have to bend reality to even accept that Hudson is a Trotskyite, when most of his writings actually expose the finance class for what they are.
In the fevered warped imagination of the TRUTH VIGILANTE, I am some sort of communist and must be vanquished!
There are a lot of defective types of people on the planet. Average people are not equipped to make civilizational decisions.
Hudson, Plato, Aristotle, and Hitler are all correct. It takes a Stoic, or a philosopher King to rule, others (like all Libertarian dupes) are the wrong type of human. It requires a power vertical to smash Oligarchs and work for the common good.
For example, Xi’s use of concentration camps thwarted the war that Atlantacists had in mind for China.
The “bad guys” string pulling in the West, recycling Petro-Dollars into Madrassas and into destabilization of the “weak underbelly” of both China and Russia. That weak underbelly, were restive Muslims, who needed some Wahhabism to then become Takfiris. Once they are radicalized, they can then become paid mercenaries with more recycled Petro-Dollars.
Philosopher Kings like Xi or Putin are able to see the western usury mechanism at play, and work to thwart it. Unfortunately Putin had to go to war in Chechnya to root out and kill Takfiris.
Xi’s concentration camps were a kindness, in the same way as were Hitler’s. Chucking TV head first into a concentration camp would be a kindness.
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Patrick McNally says:@Mefobills
> The Bolsheviks were funded by finance capital, especially Jacob Schiff of Kuhn and Loeb.
That’s a popular Right-wing lie. The reality is that Schiff attempted to sponsor the Whites, but the latter were too criminally incompetent to be saved. Priscilla Roberts gives a reasonable rundown on the historical facts in this paper (which can be downloaded for free):
—–
This article surveys the dealings of the leading New York investment house Kuhn Loeb and Company with Russia and the Soviet Union during the first four decades of the twentieth century. The firm was the leading German Jewish investment bank in the United States. The firm’s senior partner, Jacob H. Schiff, deeply resented the persecution of Jews in Russia by the Tsarist regime. During the 1905 Russo-Japanese War, he was instrumental in assisting Japan to raise vital war financing on the American market. During World I, until 1917 he refused to allow Kuhn Loeb to participate in Allied war financing, arguing that the presence of Russia among the Allies vitiated that cause. (Many, however, suspected that his German origins were at least partly responsible for Schiff’s stance.) Schiff welcomed the overthrow of the Tsarist government and subscribed to Russian war loans in 1917. He and his partners were less enthused when a radical Bolshevik government took power in Russia at the end of that year, and refused to provide any further financing. He supported Allied intervention in Russia, and was closely associated with anti-Bolshevik Russian elements in the United States. After 1924, however, Kuhn Loeb’s relations with the Soviet government improved, and a significant rapprochement occurred. Through the Joint Distribution Committee, which he headed, one partner, Felix Warburg, became particularly heavily involved in negotiating arrangements with the Soviet Union that allowed 125,000 displaced European Jews to resettle in the Crimea.
—–Although many of these hoaxes originate from Robert Wilton, it may actually be the case that this particular falsehood owes more to another shyster, Henry Wickham Steed. Steed was an anti-German and anti-Jewish ideologue who worked in the news industry. Many stupid Right-wingers since the time when Steed wrote his original BS have simply selected preferred portions of what they like and ignored the rest.
There are 3 silly references which Steed makes to Schiff in the 2nd volume of his memoirs. On pages 331-2 he tells the reader:
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… the Italian press was denouncing me as a ferocious enemy of Italy, an “international filibuster” and “a notorious agent of Jacob Schiff.”
—–This provides an interesting example of how easily false accusations could be made against Schiff. If you believe that a liar like Steed is being all honest, then someone else is obviously lying in the Italian press by accusing him of being an agent of Schiff. Steed doesn’t seem to be able to reflect on things like this.
On page 302 Steed describes talking to Colonel House and tells the reader:
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I insisted that, unknown to him, the prime movers were Jacob Schiff, Warburg, and other international financiers, who wished above all to bolster up the Jewish Bolshevists in order to secure a field for German and Jewish exploitation of Russia.
—–This passage illustrates how in Steed’s world view the anti-Jewish was inseparable from the anti-German. Until Hitler came to power, at which point Steed shifted clearly towards the anti-German aspect even to the point where the anti-Jewish perspective gradually faded. Many of the people who cite Steed’s nonsense will be romantically attached to Hitler and German imperialism in general. But they simply ignore this when referencing Steed.
The only other mention of Schiff in this 2nd volume of Steed’s memoirs is on page 301 where he claims:
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The well-known American Jewish banker, Mr. Jacob Schiff, was known to be anxious to secure recognition for the Bolshevists…
—–That is a false claim. See the piece by Priscilla Roberts cited above for details. At the same time, it’s worth noting that Steed gives an exaggerated significance to the whole matter of someone advocating diplomatic contacts. While Schiff never advocated for recognition of Lenin’s government, on pages 301-2 Steed starts goes on about William Bullitt suggesting relations with the Soviet government.
If one knows nothing about the real world, you might be led to imagine that somehow by advocating a diplomatic contact with the Soviet government that Bullitt was deciding the outcome of the Russian Civil War. That’s ridiculous. It’s common in international affairs that while a civil war is occurring in one country, the governments of other countries will attempt to establish contacts with both sides in order to retain options no matter which side wins. But it was the Whites who received actual material aid for warfare from the British and French. No one gave the Bolsheviks any resources to contribute to a victory in the Russian Civil War while it was happening. The most one could say is that some people like Raymond Robins believed that a Soviet victory was unavoidable. But Jacob Schiff was not even one of those people.
Those 3 citations exhaust the total content of Steed’s ramblings about Jacob Schiff, all of it totally lacking in substance.
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Patrick McNally says:@Malla
> There is too much showing that Operation Barbarossa was a pre-emptive strike.
No, what the evidence shows is that as Hitler turned 50 in 1939, he was acutely aware that he needed to achieve the conquest of living space within the next decade (at most) of his life. Stalin was wary of being drawn into a war by Churchill and hoped that Hitler was merely building up forces in Poland to keep them out of the reach of British bombers, as Hitler claimed. But an attack initiated by Stalin on Germany would have meant Japan going to war against the USSR in the east, there would have been no bombing of Pearl Harbor, and Churchill would simply have sat on the sidelines while Germany, Japan and the USSR fought it out, until Britain was ready to pick up the pieces. Stalin definitely did not want this.
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Mefobills says:@Carolyn Yeager
Uighurs and China’s Xi. I don’t really know anything about the Uighurs except the news of their ongoing persecution. You may be right.
China’s economy is a recapitulation of the American System of the founders. It includes a state bank system, with sovereign control. Their money is a public utility for the general welfare.
China is effectively national socialist using industrial capitalism and mixed economy. Whenever you point out China, then expect teeth grinding from the West, as they cannot accept it. (I’m an American Nazi in Texas.)
This form of structure, the American System of economy was invented by the Colonials, and was carried to the Kaiser by Frederick List after Lincoln resurrected it. Lincoln was killed for his troubles.
Hitler resurrected the “American System” of the Kaiser when he came to power in 1933.
The reason I keep harping on “Bills of Credit” is that is the exact form of money the Colonials used, and they are held up in the Articles of Confederation. I do mention it in my comment history. The bad guys fought back, and had Bills of Credit excised from reality, by making sure they were not included in the Constitution. This is the exact moment that the revolutionary war was overturned and Americas fait as a failed state was set into motion.
Imperial Japan ran on the American system, which was transmitted to them by Peshine Smith.
Today’s China copied the system post communism, as they watched the Tiger Economies and Japan closely (and Taiwan).
Japan secretly ran the system using credit guidance windows, until western Mammonites and Jews figured it out and thwarted them at the Plaza Accords.
Oh Wait! Reagan was a libertarian, and was against the Japanese former American system. Reagan was an anti-American, who had wrapped himself in the clothes of righteousness, just as libertarians and Jews do.
See what I mean. Libertarianism is a brain washing operation. Margaret Thatcher also did tremendous damage, as she sold off large chunks of English economy to parasites who then take perpetual rents.
I don’t have a website or a book, and lot of people keep asking me to do it, but I’m busy. Usually I drop by at UNZ during periods where I have a little spare time.
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orchardist says:@saggy
who is responsible?
The Secret Group created by Truman in 1947.
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Mefobills says:@Patrick McNally
No, what the evidence shows is that as Hitler turned 50 in 1939, he was acutely aware that he needed to achieve the conquest of living space within the next decade (at most) of his life.
You cling to this gibberish like a rat clinging to flotsam and jetsam.
The living space thing was in Mein Kampf. That was before Reinhard’s reforms, where German farms were debt released.
In the first years of national socialist economy, farms were debt released, and price controls were installed on farm goods, to then raise their prices. This then worked to make Germany food independent. Students were encouraged to work the farms during harvest season, thus sharing the burden of food for everybody.
Remember, that the Jewish international creditor was intent on buying up Germany using debt mechanics, in the same way he is doing it now in Ukraine, and his attempts on Russia in the 90’s.
By 1938, there was no need for “Living Space” as German farms had become productive, and Germany was no longer starving.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/agricultural-and-biological-sciences/nitrogen-fertilizer
Nitrogen Fertilizer from natural gas was only 1918, and hadn’t become widespread, ergo farms were not nearly as productive then as now.
Rats cling to simple shibboleths and cannot think in multiple dimensions. Things are usually not simple, and have multiple causations.
If I could go back in time, I would tell Hitler to apologize for his “Living Space” comments in Mein Kampf. Stalin even said, that Hitler’s writings motivated him, no doubt being a causative factor in Stalin’s military build out.
It’s basically a tragedy the two locked horns, when the real enemy is ensconced in their cat-bird seats in finance centers, then and now.
FDR said he chased the money changers away from the Temple, but he was spewing BS. It was actually Hitler who chased them away.
The money changers have fled from their high seats in the temple of our civilization. We may now restore that temple to the ancient truths. The measure of the restoration lies in the extent to which we apply social values more noble than mere monetary profit.
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Corvinus says:@HdC
“Germany had already proved its military prowess in France and with the British flight of 300,000+ from Dunkirk.”
That happened in 1940!!! The invasion of Poland was in 1939.
“The Polish campaign was a rescue mission for German expatriates in Poland, among other things.”
Invading a sovereign nation is not a rescue mission.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mefobills
Not that you need input from me, but I also concluded that Lincoln was killed for issuing greenbacks. Jackson was also a fierce critic of the central bankers, vipers, he called them. The assassination attempt against him failed.
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Dube says:@Mefobills
Apparently, Smigly was one of those egoic and irrational types that, as today’s Russian say is, “Not agreement capable.” Putting an egoic idiot in charge of your country never ends well.
If he was egoic, irrational, and an idiot, nothing more need be said.
I could grant that Adolf was a far better painter.
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whew says:@Munga Bulga
what a pathetic response. simply because you don’t like what the truth is you point out that “whew” rhymes with “jew” – even tho, it’s more akin to “fyoo.” my comment stands, you are unable to counter it hence your anger. i pointed out that he isn’t Czech, and if you’d judge him on his background why not by his father since he is a man (and his last name is Martinez)? no surprise i have to lay it for you in even simpler terms. your judgment is clouded by your irrational hatred.
by posting in a public forum, and including a link, it is certain you’d want people to follow it. for you to just backtrack like that, is so childish. grow up.
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@anarchyst
I am not name-calling. Why do you say using proper names to describe actual conditions and facts, name-calling? If you’re not going to be helpful, you should mind your own business, not mine.
John Wear does bring up some points to ponder…
Where? When? Point them out, please.
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QCIC says:@saggy
The US dropped out of the ABM treaty in 2002. I now recognize that was a very strong threat against Russia, though it took me decades to understand. We may need to go back at least that far to understand who is pulling the strings of the Ukraine conflict.
The easiest guess is that Chabad and fellow travelers want to reclaim the Pale of Settlement, though I don’t know if they will want it so much if it is covered in fresh radioactive fallout.
Speculatively, this notion may suggest how Trump plans to resolve the war in a day, simply by brokering a deal with Chabad. The core of the country becomes a “Ukrainian” homeland entirely controlled by Jewish interests (the new Pale). The far West will be given to Poland to sweeten the deal. The near West will become the actual Ukrainian homeland (landlocked and impotent) and the East will go to Russia. Crimea will be made neutral and left as a future project to be added to the Pale. In this scenario the next city to be crushed in the East will be the least Jewish. Once this city is destroyed, Trump the peacemaker will move in as a non-state negotiator to make the deal. The Ukrainian NeoNazis will all be stabbed in the back in short order, in sort of a partially inverted hybrid of The Night of the Long Knives and Kristallnact.
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paulo says:
It is true that Hitler wanted to reach an agreement with the Poles , if only to allow his troops to march against neighbouring Russia.
There is no question as to who was the real agressor on the eastern theater .
Claiming that Hitler went into a preemptive war before Stalin had time to unleash his tanks on Germany and western Europe is to ignore what was abundantly documented in Mein Kampf by Adolf himself as early as 1924, that is the conquest of living space in the east . It didn’t matter if Russia was still tsarist, democratic or communist , the slavs had to give way to the new masters.
This is a fact of history and the main goal of the nazi regime prior to 1941 .Hitler tried to achieve that geopolitical position of german industrial and scientific prowess coupled with russian natural resources , agricultural land, oil and minerals, and if he had achieved his goal in 1941, he would have dominated Eurasia and the western allies would have been no match for him . He knew that and that’s why he fought so hard in Russia . This was the nightmare of the anglo-saxon elite, exactly as it was until 2022 with the german partnership with Russia . And that’s why the anglos helped the USSR , not out of love for Stalin .
With that in mind, claiming as some do that Hitler was an economic wizard is ludicrous . He put the germans back to work by policies that were economically unfeasible , he knew it and Goering himself acknowledged it as soon as 1938, when the path to war was “rationnally” decided because war was the only way to sustain the regime short term , that and plunder the unfortunate countries that were in the way. Giving jobs to million of previously unemployed men and women in arms factories and building highways to move tanks and armies more easily is not exactly what I would call an economic recovery .
Hitler was obsessed with supplying enough food to the german people, as he attributed the lack of support of the german people to WW1 to the mild famine that hit Germany around 1917 due to the Allies’ blockade . He did not hesitate to starve the russian occupied territories with as a result millions of civilian deaths in order to supply the plentiful Berlin markets with all kind of goodies from the conquered lands . People ate better in german occupied Bohemia 1939-145 than in occupied France , I can testify to that from my family recounts .Hitler was a racist megalomaniac , and he himself destroyed anything reasonable in national socialism , and he ultimately destroyed Germany . Western dirty tricks and manipulations that happened in ww2 as documented in this article should not distract us from this simple fact .
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Wizard of Oz says:@Liza
and not another book in any language. Yes that would help many a UR reader….
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Brad Anbro says:@Truth Vigilante
No, we are NOT “even” – I am still learning from your posts & comments!
I have been following the arguing here about the proper names of cities & locales with the “special” alphabet characters. Three years ago, I spent 3 weeks in Sverige (Sweden) and stayed with a ham radio operator friend and his wife. I’d had contacts on the radio with this ham for the past 30+ years. He personally took me all over south central and southeast Sweden. We even took a drive to Öland Island, where we stayed at the house of an older Swedish ham friend, who lived in a beautiful house that was over 100 years old and had walls that were over 30 cm thick!
I flew up to Östersund, to visit a 2nd cousin of mine. I did not care for that city at all – too much like Rockford, Illinois (too big, too many people & apartment buildings. I stayed there a couple of days and went back to Åkers Styckebruk, where my ham friend lived, with whom I was staying. Much better locale – plenty of forests, small towns, etc.
I asked my ham friend with whom I was staying about all of the apartment buildings that I’d seen in his country, which they were constructing at a rapid pace. I asked him if these people “have to live” in these apartments, as opposed to private homes. He told me that most people who live in apartment buildings do so because they do not want to bother with the work & expense of maintaining a home. I was relieved to hear that!
I then asked him if prices were so high in Sweden that people could not afford to “live out in the country” like he did – among the forests, farm land etc. He told me that Sweden was large enough that anyone could live outside the cities and that the prices were not high. I have been “living out in the country” since 1983 and I dread the day when I have to move back into a city.
Hej då!
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Wizard of Oz says:@Truth Vigilante
I’ve wasted my time readingour tripe again for the first time in weeks. No more. To read stuff thT is stupid as well as wrong I’d too much.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Verymuchalive
I didn’t realise that Ron had dim young cousins to act as interns. Indeed Mao’s famines extent is the other non issue (for your and Ron’s purposes as placing him as a troll for a cause – what the ADL???).
You only need to read Ron on the limitations of his early education to negate the weight of your impressive little list of the early products of Ron’s once formidable mind.
He , not you, needs to back up the claim that McNally is an anonymous troll.
You are wrong BTW in accusing me of denying all Israeli involvement in 9/11. I’m much more careful than Ron who started waving his hands when he got to the point of fancying the idea of a rocket hitting the Pentagon and a flight full of passengers going missing off the stage of the earth. (And that was hardly the beginning of his nonsense on 9/11).
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@paulo
Hitler did not destroy Germany.
To whom are you comparing his racist views and megalomania? The destroyers of Amalek? The saviors of the WORLD? Tikkun Olam and all that business?
He may have spun out a bit towards the end, but at least he attempted to take a stand. He most likely would have accomplished his goal had it not been for the compromised idiots in America. I think he may have underestimated the degree of corruption and infiltration of America’s future greatest ally.
Or maybe he didn’t, but still he tried.
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John Wear says:@Patrick McNally
You write: “It’s not necessary to maintain any general innocence of Poles in order to grasp that there would have been no serious problem if Hitler had not first violated the Munich Agreement with the occupation of Czechia and then proceeded to press claims on Poland which exactly his pattern the previous year with Czechoslovakia.”
My response: Hitler did not violate the Munich Agreement.
A crisis developed in Czechoslovakia after the Munich Agreement. The German, Polish and Hungarian minorities had been successfully relieved of Czech rule (Poland and Hungary joined Germany in hiving off pieces of Czechoslovakia). However, Slovak and Ruthenians minorities were also eager to escape Czech rule, and they received encouragement from Poland and Hungary. For about four months after Munich, Hitler considered the possibility of protecting the remnants of the Czech state. Hitler gradually came to the conclusion that the Czech cause was lost in Slovakia, and that Czech cooperation with Germany could not be relied upon. Hitler eventually decided to transfer German support from the Czechs to the Slovaks. (Source: Hoggan, David L., The Forced War: When Peaceful Revision Failed, Costa Mesa, Cal.: Institute for Historical Review, 1989, p. 227).
Increasingly serious internal difficulties faced the Czech state, and in early 1939 the Czech problem with Slovakia deteriorated rapidly. The climax of the Slovak crisis occurred on March 9, 1939, when the Czech government dismissed the four principal Slovak ministers from the local government at Bratislava.
Josef Tiso, the Slovakian leader, arrived in Berlin on March 13, 1939, and met with Hitler in a hurried conference. Hitler admitted to Tiso that until recently he had been unaware of the strength of the independence movement in Slovakia. Hitler promised Tiso that he would support Slovakia if she continued to demonstrate her will to independence. The Slovakian government proceeded to vote a declaration of independence from Czechoslovakia on March 14, 1939. (Source: Ibid., pp. 245-247).
Ruthenia also quickly declared independence and became part of Hungary, dissolving what was left of the Czech state. (Source: Buchanan, Patrick J., Churchill, Hitler, and the Unnecessary War, New York: Crown Publishers, 2008, p. 246).
German historian Udo Walendy wrote concerning the dissolution of Czechoslovakia: “The disintegration of this multi-cultural creation, joined together in total disregard of historical and national principles, happened without any German help and would already have come about in 1918 had not Russia and Germany been utterly and totally destroyed.” (Source: Walendy, Udo, Truth for Germany: The Guilt Question of the Second World War, Washington, D.C.: The Barnes Review, 2013, p. 115).
Czech President Emil Hácha, with prior approval from his cabinet, on his own initiative traveled to Berlin to see Hitler in the hope of finding a solution for this hopeless crisis. President Hácha was correctly received at Berlin with the full military honors due a visiting head of state. Hitler met Hácha’s train and presented flowers and chocolates to Hácha’s daughter, who accompanied her father. After World War II, Hácha’s daughter denied to Allied investigators that her father had been subjected to any unusual pressure during his visit to Berlin. This information is important because Hácha, who had a history of heart trouble, had a mild heart attack during his visit with the German leaders. Hácha agreed to accept German medical assistance, and recovered quickly enough to negotiate the outline of an agreement with Germany and the Czech state. The details were arranged between the Czechs and the Germans at Prague on March 15th and 16th. (Sources: Hoggan, David L., The Forced War: When Peaceful Revision Failed, Costa Mesa, Cal.: Institute for Historical Review, 1989, p. 248. See also Walendy, Udo, Truth for Germany: The Guilt Question of the Second World War, Washington, D.C.: The Barnes Review, 2013, p. 127).
The occupation of Prague by German troops was legalized by the agreements signed with the Czech and Slovak leaders. The period of direct German military rule lasted a little over one month. The new regime formed by the Protectorate of Bohemia-Moravia on March 16, 1939 enjoyed considerable popularity among the Czechs. On July 31, 1939, Hitler agreed to permit the Czech government to have a military force of 7,000 soldiers, which included 280 officers. (Source: Ibid., pp. 250-251).
President Hácha had voluntarily placed the fortunes of the Czech state in the hands of Germany. Hácha and his new cabinet resumed control of the government on April 27, 1939. (Soure: Tedor, Richard, Hitler’s Revolution, Chicago: 2013, pp. 117, 119).
Hácha would serve Hitler faithfully throughout the war. British historian Donald Cameron Watt writes, “[Hitler] was remarkably kind…to the Czech Cabinet after the march into Prague, keeping its members in office for a time and paying their pensions.” (Source: Watt, David Cameron, How War Came: The Immediate Origins of the Second World War, 1938-1939, New York: Pantheon, 1989, p. 145).
The motives behind Hitler’s actions in the Czech crisis of March 1939 remain in dispute. British historian A. J. P. Taylor evaluated Hitler’s motives:
“All the world saw in this the culmination of a long-planned campaign. In fact, it was the unforeseen by-product of developments in Slovakia; and Hitler was acting against the Hungarians rather than against the Czechs. Nor was there anything sinister or premeditated in the protectorate over Bohemia. Hitler, the supposed revolutionary, was simply reverting in the most conservative way to the pattern of previous centuries. Bohemia had always been part of the Holy Roman Empire; it had been part of the German Confederation between 1815 and 1866; then it had been linked to German Austria until 1918. Independence, not subordination, was the novelty in Czech history. Of course, Hitler’s protectorate brought tyranny to Bohemia—secret police, the S.S., the concentration camps; but no more than in Germany itself…Hitler’s domestic behavior, not his foreign policy, was the real crime which ultimately brought him—and Germany—to the ground. It did not seem so at the time. Hitler took the decisive step in his career when he occupied Prague. He did it without design; it brought him slight advantage. He acted only when events had already destroyed the settlement of Munich. But everyone outside Germany, and especially the other makers of that settlement, believed that he had deliberately destroyed it himself.” (Source: Taylor, A.J.P., The Origins of the Second World War, New York: Simon & Schuster, 1961, pp. 202-203).
American historian David Hoggan wrote: “Hitler’s decision to support the Slovaks and to occupy Prague had been based on the obvious disinterest of the British leaders in the Czech situation. There had been ample opportunities for them to encourage the Czechs in some way, but they had repeatedly refused to do so. The truth was that the British leaders did not care about the Czechs. They used Hitler’s policy as a pretext to become indignant about the Germans.” (Source: Hoggan, David L., The Forced War: When Peaceful Revision Failed, Costa Mesa, Cal.: Institute for Historical Review, 1989, p. 228).
Germany’s protectorate of Czechoslovakia effectively precluded potential military actions against Czech territory by third countries. Udo Walendy wrote: “Dr. Hácha’s decision to agree to the transformation of his state into a German protectorate was significantly influenced—quite apart from the purely internal strife—by an advancing Hungarian army that was, on the eve of 14 March, taking over and pugnaciously claiming a border strip, but also the fact that a lightning attack by Poland was feared.” (Source: Walendy, Udo, Truth for Germany: The Guilt Question of the Second World War, Washington, D.C.: The Barnes Review, 2013, p. 129).
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eah says:@John Wear
Thanks for the book recommendation.
>Hitler’s attack against the Soviet Union was made for preemptive reasons.
I’ve never been quite sure exactly what that means.
Anyway, I don’t think the timeline fits all that well — Hitler mentioned the possibility of waging war against the Soviet Union in the summer of 1940 — he issued Weisung Nr. 21 for Fall Barbarossa on 18 December 1940, directing OKW to prepare plans for a Blitzkrieg-like invasion and quick defeat of Soviet Russia (‘einem schnellen Feldzug’) — this was about five weeks after Molotov’s visit to Berlin, which by all accounts created more tension (Hitler was already unhappy with Stalin’s treatment of Finland and the Baltic states) — Hitler refers to all of this in his Winterhilfswerk speech of 03 October 1941.
Obviously, it’s clear why Hitler would want to eliminate any threat from the Red Army, and after the great success of the Wehrmacht against France he was likely full of confidence in its capabilities — it’s also clear that Hitler would want to portray the invasion as necessary for defensive reasons, rather than have it seen as a reprehensible surprise attack on a nation covered by a non-aggression pact.
I seem to recall reading that von Ribbentrop, when speaking to either Mussolini or Ciano, early in 1941, said something like ‘While we have favorable diplomatic and commercial ties with Stalin, der Führer prefers to rely on powerful means at his disposal to clarify relations with Soviet Russia’.
I guess a key question is this: Was an attack by the Soviet Union against Germany imminent, causing Hitler to act when he did? — I don’t think there’s much convincing evidence of that — in addition, as pointed out above, Hitler gave the order to begin planning the invasion back in December 1940 — so it seems it was a decision taken more for strategic (and ideological) reasons, rather than for immediate defensive purposes — the time for Stalin to attack would have been in May or June 1940, when the German Army was fully engaged in the west.
By the way, why did you agree with comment #354? — do you think the Schmundt-Protokoll is genuine, or not?
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Malla says:@Alden
Japan invaded, conquered the large and economically important Chinese province of Manchuria in 1931. Immediately sent more troops and established military bases. And used Manchuria as the base to invade the rest of China
Manchuria/ Manchukuo was a bulwark against the USSR and the spread of Communism into East Asia. Japan industrialized the place, clocking one of the highest recorded economic growth rates. All those Industries created by the Japanese Empire were looted by the Soviets and given to the CPC. Manchuria remained one of the major Industrial regions of Communist China thanks to the work done by the Japanese Empire.
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Malla says:@Alden
There are hundreds of footnotes, sources and the author had access to the private papers of General Patrick J. Hurley, former American Ambassador to Nationalist China. At the Hoover War Memorial Library in Stanford University he was able to examine in detail the private diaries and correspondence of General Joseph Stilwell and learn the exact role played by “Vinegar Joe” in the China tragedy. Also, transcripts from the Harry Dexter White Papers at Princeton University library and many other sources.
In 1920, the Communist movement in Asia was organized after Lenin sent his secretary, Marin, to establish secretly a Chinese Communist Party as a branch of the Communist International. In 1922, the Soviet government sent Adolf Joffe, a Jew, to China on the delicate mission of establishing official diplomatic relations with the internationally recognized Chinese government in Peking, while at the same time arranging for Soviet support of the revolutionary movement of Kuomintang, which aimed at overthrowing the Peking government. Joffe did not meet with success in Peking but met with Sun Yat-sen at Shanghai in January 1923, he was able to arrange an entente between Soviet Russia and the Kuomintang. Joffe returned to Soviet Russia and was succeeded by Leo Karakhan, the foremost Soviet expert in Oriental diplomacy. In 1924 he obtained official recognition of the Soviet Union from the Peking government.
In Oct. 1927, a major speech before the Chamber of Commerce of the United States, George Bronson Rea outlined the picture of Bolshevism spreading over China. Friction developed between Russia and China over the administration of the Chinese Eastern Railway. The two parties had agreed in the Sino-Soviet agreement in 1924 that it would be a joint administration of the railway as a commercial enterprise. There was also an agreement forbidding the dissemination of propaganda inimical to the political and social institutions of either country. On April 6, 1927 the troops of Chang Tso-lin raided the Soviet Embassy in Peking and discovered documents that abundantly proved the Russians were spreading propaganda and planning to establish Communism in China.The Japanese saw this situation very clearly, they were seeing a Communist wall being formed in Eastern Eurasia and Japan to protect her own security, began to take measures to check the flow of the Red tide. The Japanese statesmen understood the Communist threat in the Far East far better than any other nation could have. It was clear to the Japanese that unless bastions of defense were built in Manchuria and Inner Mongolia, Communism would spread all of North China and seriously threaten the security of Japan.
The United States had its danger zone in the Caribbean, and since the era of Thomas Jefferson, every effort had been made to strengthen the American position and keep foreign nations from establishing naval and military bases that would threaten American security. So Japan regarded Manchuria. But this fact was not recognized by the American Government after the close of WWI. Why?
Secretary of State Henry L. Stimson directed a long verbal barrage against the Japanese. When Wall Street man FDR became President in 1933, he supported the “Stimson Doctrine” without reservation. It is significant that during the first Cabinet meeting of the Roosevelt Administration full with Soviet agents, March 7, 1933 the eventuality of war with Japan was carefully considered. On October 5,1937, FDR made a famous address at Chicago, in which he advocated a “quarantine” against aggressor nations. His words of sharp criticism were directed at Japan. He had inaugurated a new policy of pressure that helped drive Americans down the road to war.
On July 26,1939, notice was given to Japan that after six months the Commercial Treaty of February 21, 1911 would expire. This action was a blow to the national pride of the Japanese.
Roosevelt wanted to employ economic sanctions against Japan. Ambassador Joseph C. Grew was against this idea so FDR brought into his Cabinet on June 20, 1940, the Secretary of war, Henry L. Stimson who had convinced him of the efficacy of that policy back in January,1933.
With the arrival of Stimson in the Cabinet, FDR began to forge an economic chain around Japan that foreclosed any hope of understanding between the two countries.• Replies: @MallaAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Malla says:@Malla
Under these circumstances, Japan was compelled to adopt a new policy. She began to expand to the south in order to control those areas which would supply not only the necessities of life, but also the products essential to the Japanese war effort- notably oil, rubber, tin and adequate foodstuffs.
On July 25,1941, FDR issued an executive order, effective the next day, freezing all Japanese assets in the United States. In effect, it created an economic blockade of Japan. America’s highest military and naval authorities- among them Admiral Harold R. Stark, Chief of Naval Operations and General George C. Marshall, Army Chief of Staff- believed that the freezing order would cause Japan to take last-ditch measures.
Six days before the order was issued the War Plans Division warned that an embargo on Japan would possibly involve the United States in an early war in the Pacific. Dr. Stanley K. Hornbeck, Advisor on Political Relations to the State Department and Secretaries Morgenthau and Stimson strongly advocated the order.
When the Japanese Ambassador, Admiral Kichisabura Nomura, called at the Department of State to inquire as to the meaning of the executive order, he was coolly received. Tojo, then Minister of War, regarded the freezing order by the United States as driving Japan into a corner. Oil was vital to Japan, and from now on each fall of the level on oil brought the hour of decision closer. Historian Louis Morton, Chief of the Pacific Section, Department of Army, wrote that America by adopting a program of unrestricted economic warfare, left Japan the embarrassing choice of humiliating surrender or resistance by whatever means lay at hand. He termed the American order of July 26 “the Japanese Pearl Harbor,” suggesting a degree of provocation in excess of what many have been willing to concede.President Roosevelt and his advisors wilfully ignored the fact that Manchuria and Inner Mongolia were danger zones for Japan. Japanese statemen of every party had realized for years the significance of Soviet menace to Japanese security.
Churchill said, the first time he met Roosevelt, Roosevelt had told him that,“regardless of whether Japan attacked us or not the United States would go to war” At noon on November 25, Secretaries Stimson and Knox met at the White House together with General Marshall and Admiral Stark. The discussion dealt mainly with the Japanese situation concerning the intercepted message fixing the November 29 deadline. The President brought up the event that we were likely to be attacked perhaps as soon as next Monday. The main question was “how we should maneuver into the position of firing the first shot without allowing too much danger to ourselves.”
Harry Dexter White ( Soviet mole) put pressure on the Japanese by sending a letter signed “Henry Morgenthau Jr.” to the President Roosevelt on the 24th or 25th of November. In words told of the dire consequences that would come in the wake of any agreement with Japan. Pressure exerted by Communist sympathizers in the Institute of Pacific Relations must also be taken into account when analyzing the reasons for the many rejections of a truce with Japan. On November 25, Professor Owen Lattimore, (Soviet spy) the special advisor to Chiang Kai-shek dispatched an anxious cable to Presidential Assistant Lauchlin Currie ( Soviet Spy) arguing against any agreement between the United States and Japan on a modus vivendi.
When Congressman Martin Dies, Chairman of the House Committee on Un-American Activities, became insistent on digging Reds out of the Administration, he was summoned to the White House, where Roosevelt , in fury, told him, “several of my best friends I’ve got are Communist, You’re all wrong about this….” Roosevelt, indeed, acted as if some of them were. After Earl Browder the head of the Communist Party in the United States had been sent to the penitentiary for passport fraud in making a clandestine trip to Moscow, Roosevelt pardoned him as a contribution to “national unity,” now that Soviet Union was an American ally. Browder boasted, in his testimony before the Tydings Committee in 1950 that in 1942 and 1943 he reported to Roosevelt, and that the information he relayed to the White House had an important in reshaping American policy in China.
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Rurik says:@Truth Vigilante
‘I’m not Jewish’ B.S.
Who are you trying to kid ?
I think Mr. Unz would be doing himself a favor to just come out and call the lizard on his bullshit, once and for all.
Like I said, they go way back, and so Mr. Unz would know, (and I’m sure does know).
So by confirming (what we all know), it would mean that the lizard has been lying all along, and participating in bad faith, and showing him to be a duplicitous putz, (which we all know he is anyways ; )
And once it’s been confirmed, then perhaps Mr. Unz wouldn’t be as pestered so relentlessly.
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John Wear says:@eah
You ask: “I guess a key question is this: Was an attack by the Soviet Union against Germany imminent, causing Hitler to act when he did?”
My response: An attack by the Soviet Union was imminent. This is why Hitler attacked the Soviet Union on June 22, 1941. Viktor Suvorov documents this very well in his book “The Chief Culprit.”
You ask: “By the way, why did you agree with comment #354? — do you think the Schmundt-Protokoll is genuine, or not?”
My response: I think the Schmundt quote was forged by the Allies after the war and is not genuine.
When I looked up Lieutenant Colonel Schmundt in Wikipedia, I discovered that he died on October 1, 1944 as a result of injuries incurred from the July 20, 1944 assassination attempt of Hitler. So, Schmundt was not alive when the war ended. I question how anyone can know that Hitler actually made these comments. It would be very easy for the Allies to forge them after the war, especially since Schmundt was not alive to dispute them.
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Mefobills says:@Patrick McNally
> The Bolsheviks were funded by finance capital, especially Jacob Schiff of Kuhn and Loeb.
That’s a popular Right-wing lie
The PilPul just flows out of you naturally doesn’t it? No wonder you piss off truth seekers like Ron Unz.
Schiff and the Bolsheviks installed a Wall Street Bank, to then extract from the prostrate Russians. That is more well documented than your pilpul.
As an aside, I always wonder when it was that Stalin turned against the Jews. Usually you can track it to some event, where people get disgusted with Jewish self interested behavior. The taking of usury.
Hitler and Stalin were actually natural allies, it is a tragedy they fell into confrontation.
https://nationalvanguard.org/2014/10/jews-the-ussr-and-communism/
I did a long series on the Crimea, where the Jews were trying to take over in my comment section.
________________
As soon as the Germans invaded the Soviet Union Stalin could count on the moral backing of Jewry everywhere. More importantly, with their enormous power of the press and of the purse, they could insure him the material support of the United States government.
The behavior of the Jews in the USSR in the early days of the war caused him considerable worry, however. As the Germans advanced, tens of thousands of Russia’s Jews loaded their suitcases with currency and headed for the Far Eastern provinces, where they immediately went into business as black marketeers. This had a very bad effect on the morale of the Russian masses, who were being exhorted to sacrifice everything in the fight against the fascist invaders.
Stalin kept the problem in check by having a few hundred Jewish currency speculators and black market dealers publicly shot, but he could hardly afford to take any stronger measures against them, or the Jews in America and Britain might simply call off the war, and he would be left alone to deal with Hitler.World War II convinced Stalin of one thing: he could never again feel safe against external enemies with the Soviet bureaucracy in the grip of a people who had no fundamental loyalty to Russia, like the pharaoh who “knew not Joseph,” he asked himself whether it might not happen that “when there falleth out any war” — a war against a philo-Semitic power instead of an anti-Semitic one next time, perhaps — Russia’s Jews would “join also unto our enemies.” He began taking steps to remedy this dangerous situation as soon as the war was over.
Acting with great discretion at first, Stalin started weeding Jews out of the upper levels of the Soviet hierarchy. It was necessary to proceed slowly for two reasons.
First, Jewish communists in the United States, Canada, and Britain were still funneling very valuable atomic and military secrets to him. Like U.S. atom-spies Julius and Ethel Rosenberg, Jews everywhere still regarded the Soviet Union as a Jewish paradise.
Second, Soviet society was utterly dependent upon its Jewish managers and technocrats for its continued functioning. For three decades Jews had virtually monopolized the bureaucracy and the professions, and it was necessary to train a new generation of Russians to replace them.
After the Zionist seizure of Palestine in 1948 — which was immediately given an official blessing by the Soviet Union — Stalin greatly accelerated his weeding-out program. Zionism — loyalty to a foreign power — was equivalent to treason, and every Jew, whether he professed loyalty to Israel or not, was regarded as at least a potential Zionist.
The Zionist seizure of Palestine in 1948 was sanctioned by Stalin, because he did not want the Jews taking over Crimea, as FDR had been pressuring him for with Lend Lease money. By agreeing to Palestein, then the Soviet Union was not on the hook to pay debt service to Zion transplanting itself there.
Stalin did not want to transfer the land of Crimea, southern Russia, and Ukraine to the Jews over Soviet debts for the construction of Israel – so he welcomed the decision of the Jews at the 1948 conference in Basel on the creation of Israel in Palestine, and actively supported them in considering this issue at the UN.
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Haxo Angmark says:@Malla
both good comments. Just a caveat on the Japs’ role in China:
Japan actually played a double game: in 1936-37 Chiang’s Nationalists were very close to defeating the Reds and herding them into out of the country altogether. One of the main reasons for Chiang’s military success were the 60 or so Third Reich officers advising and leading his armies. The Japs, however, did not want the Nationalists – or anyone else – uniting China, because it would endanger their own imperial lodgement. So when Japan invaded northern China in ’37, they did so not to defeat the Reds….but to save them from ultimate defeat. AND they strong-armed the Germans into withdrawing all their military advisors. This was the first of 4 key junctures when the Japs and the Germans found themselves at strategic right angles, which in turn were a major factor in the so-called “Axis” losing WW2.
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Brás Cubas says:@Mefobills
Of course, Hudson cannot name the Jew.
It’s funny that you think that way, because in the piece called Origins of Debt: How Financial Oligarchies in Greece & Rome Shaped Our World, he names the Jews in several occasions. Here is a selection from that article (actually the transcription of an interview):
Well the kings agreed to do this, and they raised the money to pay the interest by essentially confiscating whatever money the Jews had. And after confiscating the money that Jewish merchants had, in England and France, they then expelled the Jews.
The problem that the Italians complained about again and again was that the Jews made loans at a lower interest rate than the Christians charged. And you can’t have their competition. The Jews were driven out of England and France, not for the reason that you usually read in the books, that they were usurers. It’s because they were not usurers. They had no more money to lend to anyone because it was all grabbed by the kings and the church.But I think you should read it from beginning to end, as there are many interesting bits therein:
https://www.unz.com/mhudson/origins-of-debt-how-financial-oligarchies-in-greece-rome-shaped-our-world/• Replies: @MefobillsAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
@Dr. Rock
The Youtube content creator Razorfist has got the goods.
Abraham Lincoln: American Dictator
Greetings from Amsterdam, Mishko_
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Mefobills says:@Tiptoethrutulips
Lincoln was killed for issuing greenbacks.
Matthew Ehret does a good job of exposing the London plot to assassinate Lincoln.
(Ehret becomes unreliable if you color outside the lines, say going beyond 1694).
https://risingtidefoundation.net/2023/03/20/the-hidden-story-behind-lincolns-assassination/
London and the Jews became attached at the hip after the nameless war, and installation of the BOE in 1694.
London was incensed about the Colonials having the temerity to issue Script (Bills of Credit), and they were equally worked up about Treasury Money, like Greenbacks.
_________________________
How many of those popular narratives infused into the western zeitgeist over the decades even acknowledge the simple fact that John Wilkes Booth was carrying a $500 bank draft signed by Ontario Bank of Montreal President Henry Starnes (later to become Montreal Mayor) when he was shot dead at Garrett Farm on April 26, 1865?
How many people have been exposed to the vast Southern Confederacy secret service operations active throughout the civil war in Montreal, Toronto and Halifax which was under the firm control of Confederate Secretary of State Judah Benjamin and his handlers in British intelligence?
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Haxo Angmark says:@Wielgus
Probably not. More likely he wrote he wrote his thoughts down after his B-17 landed in England.
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Mefobills says:@Brás Cubas
It’s funny that you think that way, because in the piece called Origins of Debt: How Financial Oligarchies in Greece & Rome Shaped Our World, he names the Jews in several occasions. Here is a selection from that article (actually the transcription of an interview):
Dr. Hudson told me personally, that he saw irrational hatred in the eyes of the Neo-Cons.
Mostly, Hudson is very smart, and avoids the Jew question. The taking of usury is a “human thing,” but only the Jews have weaponized it, and given it religious cover. His lane is to expose humanities flaws, and jews are only a subset of humanity.
Oh wait, Judeo Christianity is a covering religion too, but that was funded into existence by Manasseh’s Ben Israel.. Never mind.
Hudson did some good work on the Prozbul, a marker in time when Hillel and Pharisee (((creditor class))) became super predatory on other innocent rank and file jews.
So, yes I agree with you. He does name them, but is circumspect about it.
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Zane says:@saggy
The UK doesn’t ” enter ” wars, the UK starts those wars.
Why?
The only reason that would make sense is that the Jewish bankster cartel has a mortgage on the souls of the British Royal Family. Thus, when the ZOGsters say ” Jump “, the response from the United Kingdom is always ” Yes Master! How high? ”
The Crown Jewels are likely in hock to Schlomo Finkelstein’s Pawn Emporium, Calle Rothschild.
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anarchyst says:@Carolyn Yeager
Calling a person a “moron” is childish. You called Mr. Wear a “moron”. If that is not name-calling, I don’t know what is…
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Munga Bulga says:@Munga Bulga
P.S. If Hitler was such a “fanatical Slav hater”, as Brandon Martinez claims, then this letter would not only be implausible, but a pure forgery. Moreover, not only the writer, but also all the millions of German soldiers who got “involved” with Russian women would be accused of “racial defilement”. https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/washington-secrets/hitler-papers-foresaw-putins-kidnapping-of-ukrainian-children
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Munga Bulga says:@whew
Why should I then “refute” your obvious ignorance (to formulate it deliberately)? Only because you are trying to make yourself “more important” than you really are (and probably always will be) by loud screeching?
i pointed out that he isn’t Czech
How can you judge that, when you didn’t even know him until just now? Of course his mother is of Czech origin and his father of Spanish origin, he has emphasized that over and over again in his videos over the years. He has also said his parents immigrated to Canada only in the last century.
After he was accused several times by his infantile followers of crypto-Judaism, he presented especially “as proof” his genetic test in a video to prove his (according to his opinion at that time still) “Aryan purity” (with 2 to 5% Middle Eastern content, i.e. Jewish blood, which in his opinion was totally negligible).
If he has a Spanish father and a Czech mother, then it is clear that his name is not Svoboda, but Martinez, what is so difficult for you to grasp that? I didn’t talk about his mother’s name at all in my comment (and it doesn’t even matter), but about his Slavic genetic heritage.
I have said that his maternal, i.e. Slavic, part comes through more and more strongly, because this subject increasingly paralyzes him. Before, he presented himself mainly (partly in Spanish) as a quasi “full-blooded Spaniard”.
by posting in a public forum, and including a link, it is certain you’d want people to follow it.
When I post links, I assume that people know what I’m talking about (at least in this case I did). So you expose yourself as completely incompetent. Or maybe you even want me to “explain” the alphabet to you because you in your still complete “nitwittery” think I need to “refute” your ignorance?
https://www.altcensored.com/watch?v=qvWy23vCcEw
https://counter-currents.com/tag/brandon-martinez/
https://counter-currents.com/2023/05/martinez-contra-fascism/
http://www.renegadetribune.com/brandon-martinezs-shilling-exposed/
https://redice.tv/red-ice-radio/neocon-globalism-and-kalergis-plan-to-genocide-europeans• Replies: @whewAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Haxo Angmark says:@Patrick McNally
“Dzerzhinsky in favor of Bukharin”. Well of course: no doubt the their Jew wives schmoozed incessantly, and aimed their men in the same direction.
“…..controlled by a Jew wife”. Apparently Pat has never been married to a Jewess.
neither have I, but
several of my non-Jew college friends made The Mistake.
each Jewess took over their lives, sucked all the blood out,
and then walked away from the husk with a large $ettlement.
and there are many other all-controlling Jew wives of great 20th century political interest:
cf. Allison Giffen & June Hopkins, eds., Jewish First Wife, Divorced – The Correspondence of Ethel Gross and Harry Hopkins(Lanham, 2003); also
Martha Gellhorn, Ernest Hemingway’s Red Jew wife-controller; also the communist Jew wife of Abraham Lincoln Brigade c/o Robert Merriman; & etc.
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Rurik says:@Mefobills
but is circumspect about it.
From the Hudson quote
The Jews were driven out of England and France, not for the reason that you usually read in the books, that they were usurers. It’s because they were not usurers.
that’s being pretty circumspect, I agree
I don’t think even Fran ((or the lizard)) is ever quite that circumspect.
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Mycroft1325 says:
Though I did not know many of these details, I was already conceptually prepared for them, having known since 1992 that our Government was, essentially, Evil. I won’t get into why, as I just have one important thing to add concerning FDR’s foreknowledge of the attack on Pearl Harbor.
I wish I had copied the article. If I had I would have forwarded it to you, but I remember the substance of it.
This essay claimed that in 1995, President Clinton and the Congress Posthumously undid the Dishonorable Discharges that were levied against the command staff of Pearl Harbor. They did this because they admitted that FDR knew about the attacks & let them happen.
I was surprised to find that you did not include that bit of information. Were you aware of it?
Lastly, I find it Blackly Hysterical that most Americans know the phrase- ‘History is Written by the Victors.’ Then we proceed to believe those victors about what they have written.
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Michael Bollinger says:@Hang All Text Drivers
I totally agree, and years of reading books about WW 2 and the amount of pressure against me for studying and mining new facts, proves it to me.
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whew says:@Munga Bulga
you are an angry person, and are projecting your insecurity unto me – particularly the point about “importance” which came out of nowhere. very sad indeed.
nevertheless, you still completely miss my point, which was less about Martinez and more about you. unsurprisingly, you are adept not just at projection but also elusion.
since you refuse to actually deliberate upon the points presented, and choose to act childish, i deem you unworthy of my time and this is my final response to you.
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Michael Bollinger says:@Peter Akuleyev
Poland was essentially German citizens. They were placed within those borders to keep Germans dislocated. Germany attacked and after victory offered very generous terms. Mainly the return of land stolen by the French and British.
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turtle says:@Truth Vigilante
Based on my experience,. it is at least somewhat common for those typing on an American QWERTY keyboard, which does not have keys for the German vowels with umlauts, to substitute non umlauted vowels followed by e for the vowels with umlauts.
Please compare the German keyboard(s), T1 & T2, with the American.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_keyboard_layoutPart of the keyboard is adapted to include umlauted vowels (ä, ö, ü) and the sharp s (ß). The “T1″ layout lacks some important characters like the German-style quotation marks („“ and ‚‘). As a consequence, these are seldom used in internet communication and usually replaced by ” and ‘.
The “T2” layout newly defined in DIN 2137-1:2012-06 was designed to overcome such restrictions, but firstly to enable typing of other languages written in the Latin script. Therefore, it contains several additional diacritical marks and punctuation characters, including the full set of German, English, and French-style quotation marks.
I have received emails from educated, native born Germans who made these substitutions because they were residing in the U.S. and therefore using U.S. standard keyboards.
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Mefobills says:@Rurik
The Jews were driven out of England and France, not for the reason that you usually read in the books, that they were usurers. It’s because they were not usurers.
Hudson has a high accuracy rate. But, his notion that the West is a detour in history is due to his focusing on Rome. Rome’s creditor oligarchy did indebt the periphery to pay the center, and this was not Jews.
He is fairly inarticulate on NSDAP economy, and also King Edward, when the Jews were kicked out.
Take the good with the bad. Nobody is perfect.
The Jews absolutely were driven out of England by King Edward because they (Jews) were operating the usury mechanism.
The original Magna Carta even has quotes about how the English were not to pay debts to the Jews as they (Jews) escaped. When they escaped, said Jews were allowed to take their Gold and Silver with them.
This loss of circulating medium then caused the English economy to collapse. Edward then issued more of the King’s talley sticks for corvee labor (palace labor). In this way, the debt to the king became the money of the realm. The wood sticks could not be counterfeited.
The wood talley stick system were actually a better debt release mechanism that the jubilee that Hudson focuses on in the near east.
During the upper middle ages, the English balanced debts/credit (debt release) YEARLY, at the great fairs like Mayfair.
As there were few rake-offs to parasitical creditors, an average English workingman could easily afford a family and vacations. It is also how they could afford to build the generational cathedrals, as those were done with volunteer work.
Hitler released debts, and so did King Edward.
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Truth Vigilante says:@saggy
At around 17:40 of the David Irving video in your comment # 448, Churchill makes a request of his crony (Brendan Rendall Bracken, 1st Viscount Bracken), by pleading:
‘Can you ask your friends in the CITY what they can do to help me in this awful situation ?’
Got that UR readers ? He speaks of the ‘CITY’.
Of course that refers to the City of London, the epicentre of financial chicanery on the planet.
The same ‘CITY’ where the obscenely rich Jewish financiers congregate and decide upon the foreign policy of Britain and the U.S – the two heads of the satanic hydra.SUMMARY: There is no ‘grey area’ in this matter. FDR and Churchill were completely controlled sock puppets of the Zionist Usury Banking Cartel.
And as it was then, it continues to be the case with all western politicians today, who are likewise controlled by the same Talmudic terrorists.
Of course, the likes of Patrick ‘Shlomo’ McNally and Wizard of ZOG will never mention these things to you.
They have been instructed to keep barking out the ‘standard narrative’ – the same narrative scripted by their ZOG controllers.In a similar fashion, Carolyn Yeager will never give David Irving the credit for revealing these insights to the world – insights that are orders of magnitude more important in awakening the slumbering masses to Zionist treachery than the ENTIRE body of her revisionist work compiled throughout her lifetime.
Instead Carolyn never wastes an opportunity to smear David Irving.
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Zarathustra says:@Colleen
Germany was making trade with Baltic republics which were part of German Reich.
Polacs were harassing German convoy’s.Germans were taking back stolen territories after loss of WW1
French and England attacked. Germany defeated them.After desperation French and English went to Russia and convinced Russia to attack Latvia.
Latvia was a part of German Reich
So de facto and de jure Soviet Union did attack GermanyWW2 started.
Russia is now precisely in the situation as Germany was before WW2
It is called irony of the FATE. (The difference is that Russia has a lot of nukes. Lots of it. And it is totally naïve to think that Russia will not use them when they will run out of other option)
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Odyssey says:
In 1941, a few weeks before the attack on the Soviet Union, Hitler uttered his famous words: “The struggle for world hegemony in Europe will be won by the conquest of Russian space… Russian space is our India. As the British rule there through a handful of their people, so we will rule that colonial space of ours. We will bring scarves, glass beads and other things that colonial peoples like to the Ukrainians.”
Hitler expressed his idea of the future of the Russian people in another well-known formulation from the same year: “Our Mississippi should be the Volga, not the Niger.”
The Mississippi River was the border across which the third American president, Thomas Jefferson, intended to expel the Indians. Hitler was convinced that the Anglo-Saxons, who reduced a million redskins to a few hundred thousand and kept their poor remains in a cage under surveillance, gave the Germans an example of how to deal with the Russians. In his opinion, “in the East of Germany” (that is, in Russia) such a process should have become “a repetition of the conquest of America.”
It was not for nothing that Hitler called the Russians “redskins”. His war against the USSR was just another colonial war. All the atrocities of the Nazis (mass murders, resettlement) were tested at the beginning of the twentieth century, when the Germans carried out the genocide of the Herero and Nama peoples in South-West Africa. Similar crimes were committed by the French, the Dutch, the Belgians, the Americans, and the British.
The executioners of Indians and US Indians earnestly pretended that they had nothing in common with their student, attributing the phenomenon of Hitlerism to German national characteristics, a mysterious movement called National Socialism, shades of German history and the evil genius Adolf.
However, fascism existed before Hitler and did not disappear after 1945. For example, Dutch SS men were sent to fight against the national liberation movement in Indonesia, and the French sent captured German SS men to Indochina. The sad truth is that after May 9, 1945, Hitler’s executioners continued to kill people in third world countries in alliance with the French and the British.
Nazism was not to be declared an exclusively German phenomenon, as this allowed the plague to continue to spread throughout the Western world under other names.
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@Carolyn Yeager
Projection much, Carolyn?
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HVMII says:@Alden
What is your point?
Did you read what I wrote?
What happened to the Hohenstaufens, the Staufens, and the Luxembourgs? You seem to have skipped over their existence.
I am not denying the Habsburgs held the HRE together, but the HRE was ended by Napoleon.
The Austrians created the Dual Monarchy in 1867 after their loss to Prussia in 1866. It gave more autonomy to Hungary. And my point was that Austria Hungary was a pluralistic society which held together many different ethnic minorities. I also noted though that there was a significant German majority in Austria that ruled over the ethnic minorities within the empire. And you simply cannot deny that those minorities did not want their independence from the Austro-Hungarian Empire.
The Russo-Turkish War of 1877-1879 started Balkan nationalism.
And what started WW I? A Serbian nationalist (Princips) killed Franz Ferdinand in Sarajevo located in Bosnia which had been annexed by Austria in 1879.
Again, the problem for Austria was the emergence of Serbian nationalism which was encouraged by Russia who also promoted its further expansion during the Balkan Wars of 1912-1913 and 1913. The very reason Albania was created was to block Serbian access to the sea after the first Balkan War. Regardless, the point is Serbian nationalism was an existential threat to Austria Hungary. If the Serbs within the empire could assert their independence that meant the eventual dissolution of Austria Hungary as other ethnic minorities would also assert their independence.
To note, it was Austria that dragged Germany into World War I – not the other way around. The Kaiser may have erred when he initially gave the Austro-Hungarians a blank check. However, he expected the war to be fought quickly before other powers like Russia became involved. The problem was that the Austro Hungarians dragged their feet and placed their 10 demands on Serbia, which they accepted except for all but one. The Kaiser thought war was adverted. The problem was that by this point all of Europe’s armies had already mobilized.
The point is (and was) the question ethnic nationalism in Central Europe which was totally ignored at Versailles.
The reason for war in the Balkans was ethnic nationalism. The trigger for WWI was ethnic nationalism. The post Versailles era was an era of ethnic national interests emerging as a result of the re-drawing of the Central European map and the creation of states where ethnic minorities ruled over ethnic minorities. What was the issue of Czechoslovakia in 1938 and 1939 about? It was nothing less than the question of ethnic minorities being ruled by ethnic minorities German, Czech, Slovak, and Ruthenian.
What held Czechoslovakia and Yugoslavia together during the Cold War was the authoritarian grip of the Soviet Union and Marshal Tito. Once they were gone, the ethnic minorities broke up into their own countries and not without a little war in Yugoslavia.
It certainly is a lesson on ethnic nationalism and what makes up a country an idea the multicultural globalists would like to abolish…
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HVMII says:@John Wear
Thank you John Wear.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Mefobills
It is beyond your mental capacity to note that the NSDAP economy WAS CENTRALLY PLANNED.
All other things being equal, a Centrally Planned economy ALWAYS produces worse outcomes than an economy that relies on unfettered Free Market Capitalism – there are NO exceptions to this in all of recorded history.
But of course, in Hitler’s Germany all the preconditions were NOT equal.
Germany had a highly educated and productive workforce, that had a culture of prudent management of their own household finances (ie: not a profligate mindset like Americans, who had a tendency to live beyond their means), and a sound work ethic.Especially, in the case of Germany, whose citizenry suffered the greatest deprivations amongst all the western nations during the Great Depression.
Said citizenry were even more grateful to Hitler for extricating them from the abyss, and thus tolerated the heavy handed central planning. They were willing to work harder for less compensation, thus ensuring the phoenix like rise of the German economy.Said society, unshackled from the yoke of Zionist usury, was ALWAYS GOING TO BE MORE SUCCESSFUL AND PRODUCTIVE, irrespective of the political ideologies and authoritarian central planning imposed on them.
Simply put, had Germany applied Free Market principles in the immediate aftermath of Bismarck’s unification, it would have been far more prosperous still, enabling an industrial and technological base that may well have been sufficient to ensure a victory in WWI – or at least a far better negotiated truce/end of hostilities (thus ensuring that the preconditions that led to WWII never came to fruition).
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Mefobills says:@Odyssey
“The struggle for world hegemony in Europe will be won by the conquest of Russian space… Russian space is our India. As the British rule there through a handful of their people, so we will rule that colonial space of ours.
__________________________That’s right. The European space.. which is now being taken over by third world peoples.
It was a mistake to turn east, even though Stalin was threatening with an enormous army, and wanted to take Europe. When did Stalin sour on the Jews, and consolidate his power. Answer: It was part of the way THROUGH THE WAR.
Offense to defense ratio is about 3 to 1. If Stalin wanted to attack Germany (and he did), his supply lines would have been stretched and he would also need to get through German defensive positions dug in Poland.
In other words, the smart move by Hitler would have been to destroy all the pre-positioned Soviet Supplies on Germany’s borders, as they did in operation Barbarossa, then retreat to defensive dug-in positions and wait out the winter.
Not creating an European army as what was done too late with the Waffen SS, was the other large mistake done by Hitler. The Waffen SS consisted of volunteers from much of Europe, people who were alarmed by the spread of the Comintern. Hitler dithered too long and did not form an European army.
The German soldiers did not need Commissars to shoot them in the back in order to fight, they knew what was at stake, and they didn’t give up easily.
So if NSDAP was so evil, why did the Germans of the day love it so much, volunteer for it, and fight to the end. If Fascism was so evil, why did the Italians sing songs about Mussolini?
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Mefobills says:@Truth Vigilante
All other things being equal, a Centrally Planned economy ALWAYS produces worse outcomes than an economy that relies on unfettered Free Market Capitalism – there are NO exceptions to this in all of recorded history.
If the government doesn’t do central planning, then it is left up to the bankers.
Nature abhors a vacuum.
How’s that centrally planned Chinese economy working out for you?
Making statements like “no exceptions in recorded history” when there is an elephant in the room, like China, makes you look pretty stupid – which you are.
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Truth Vigilante says:@soll
Do you believe that Nathan Rothschild took over the Bank of England in 1815 ….. [and] thus the Rothschild’s came to control the world ?
The Bank of England was already controlled by a cartel of Zionist Bankers since its inception in 1694.
In the lead up to the Battle of Waterloo, Nathan Mayer Rothschild was already one of the richest handful of men in England, if not the richest.
Because of his insider knowledge on the outcome of the Battle of Waterloo, Rothschild’s net worth, depending on what source you read, INCREASED BY A FACTOR OF BETWEEN TEN and TWENTY TIMES.So, for Rothschild to be this much richer than the next richest man in England, it is certain that he would have assumed the dominant role within the Bank of England.
I wouldn’t go so far as to say he ‘took over’ the BoE, because the collective net worth of all the other Jewish financiers (with a few gentile financiers in the mix), may well have eclipsed his personal fortune, or at least been comparable.But there is no doubt that Rothschild was at the head of the table thereafter.
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HVMII says:@Odyssey
So the Balkan Wars never happened and Serbia had no expansionist interests in 1912, 1913?
What about the Bonsnian crisis of 1909? I believe Serbia was trying to coax Russia into war with Austria, but Russia backed down.
Also, I believe Montenegro existed as early as the Russo Turkish War. I believe Albania was created after the First Balkan War.
I do not deny Serbia has been treated unfairly in historical terms.
They did accept 9 of Austria-Hungary’s terms in 1914. The Kaiser wanted to avoid war but Austria was intent on crushing Serbia because they saw the Serbia’s expansion as a part of Russia’s attempt to dominate the Balkans, while at the same time they view Serbian ethnic nationalism as a threat to the Dual Monarchy’s continued existence. I am not sure how you can deny the Serbians were opposed to the idea of a Greater Serbia.
Also, to say that Tito was nice to Croats is pretty crazy. The Croats supported the Nazis(i.e. Ustashe). I recall stories of Tito herding Croats into caves in Istria and then blowing up the cave entombing all inside. Serbs on the other hand joined the Partisans.
I well understand the problem of Serbia after the Yugoslav break up. The big question was who was going to seize what remained of the Yugoslav military.
Certainly the US involvement in Kosovo was wrong and they did misreport what happened at Sebrenica prior to the Kosovo conflict. Of course they do not tell how the Serbs were massacred the day before. I think this is mostly due to the fact that the Serbs are Slavs and cousins with the Russians as NATO sought a reason to continue its existence much like the Ukraine is serving the same purpose. It was also a falsification that the Serbs had concentration camps as portrayed by Time Magazine. As I recall, the picture was of diseased Albanians looking into the camp.
I have been to both Croatia and Serbia. I do not ever see them getting back together and this is primarily due to differences along ethnic lines although time has allowed for some intermixing. Most Croats I know were quite happy when Tito died.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Odyssey
I find it highly unlikely that Hitler based his strategy on the example of Europeans conquering a Stone Age people. If the Russians were in any way similar to Indians, they would have been routed out quickly.
Speaking of docile and amiable people, you obviously know nothing about natives in the Americas. They were nearly all warrior cultures. Comanches terrorized, enslaved, tortured, raided, and looted all over the southwest. Then they got their asses kicked when a technologically and intellectually superior population came on over from across the big water.
The only reason Africans were not necklacing each other a hundred years ago was due to the absence of “wheels” in Africa. Or rubber.
Atrocities happened everywhere. We know about tragedies in Europe because they were recorded in a written language. And in art. And film. We don’t have much written history in Africa, but we can see what they are doing TODAY. I guess they forgot how peaceful they once were.
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Odyssey says:@HVMII
And what started WW I? A Serbian nationalist (Princips) killed Franz Ferdinand in Sarajevo located in Bosnia which had been annexed by Austria in 1879.
Even though we’ve had a litmus test for moronism for a long time, many here still fail it. Why did WW1 start? Because Serb Gabriel Princip killed the heir to the AH throne! We recently had a write-up by Ron on the causes of WW1 where there were many excellent comments and little-known data.
So, the nationalism of small nations (so-called ‘ethno-nationalism’) is not desirable, but the nationalism of large nations is. Even today, we have the US accusing all other small nations and considering their nationalisms to be the most dangerous thing in the world, but theirs is benign and desirable with as many flags as possible and theatrical singing of the anthem with a hand on the heart.
The Serbs rose up several times during the Ottoman occupation to finally restore their state in 1804 and continue the fight for the liberation of the remaining Serbian territories. So, it was quite normal for AH to occupy Serbian Bosnia. And peace in Europe would have been maintained, there would have been no WW1, if only the Serbs had stayed to live peacefully under the Ottoman and AH occupation?
And there is nothing wrong with smaller ethnic groups and peoples living under German domination within the AH? It is interesting that Karl Marx also publicly accused the Serbs of uprisings under the Ottomans and considered them to be one of the 4 nations that should be wiped off the face of the earth.
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@Mefobills
Uighurs and China’s Xi. I don’t really know anything about the Uighurs except the news of their ongoing persecution. You may be right.
China’s economy is a recapitulation of the American System of the founders. It includes a state bank system, with sovereign control. Their money is a public utility for the general welfare.
The Uighur situation is not at all analogous to the Jewish situation in Nazi Germany – this is simply a smear by the lying western press. Most Jews in Nazi Germany were sent to camps. Most Uighurs are not. China has a highly visible A-list actress named Dilireba who is Uighur. There was no comparable Jewish actress in Germany that I can think of. There are Uighurs living all over China who go about their daily lives without interference from the state. There was no “Uighur Kristallnacht” to speak of. The flurry of news articles is just typical anglophone overconfidence and war-mongering. Ethnic minorities are featured on currency notes and were also exempt from the one-child policy while that was active.
Those racial issues aside, however, I do think you are correct to characterize “Socialism with Chinese Characteristics” as “National Socialism” which is why the PRC is so often demonized in the western press.
Today’s China copied the system post communism, as they watched the Tiger Economies and Japan closely (and Taiwan).
Japan secretly ran the system using credit guidance windows, until western Mammonites and Jews figured it out and thwarted them at the Plaza Accords.
China’s economic system has elements that are unlike any other I know of; for example the government owns substantially all the land and leases it out to individuals. It is also more state-led than the tiger economies and because it has such large economies of scale is in a much better negotiating position than they were. For example, China is much more capable of “big-picture” innovation due to its vast internal market, and can influence external nations into an alternate economic system which the tiger economies were simply too small to do. China has operated under a system of strict capital controls which is also somewhat different from the tiger economies, which operate under a dollar standard.
I wonder if you could elaborate more on the credit guidance windows. I agree in broad terms the Plaza accords were designed to stop Japan’s economic rise and it appears this succeeded for a generation, though I am hazy on the financial aspects of this arrangement.
Interestingly, Japan’s stock market is now at multi-decade highs. Things may finally be turning around for Japan.
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Rurik says:@Mefobills
Thanks Mefobills,
I’m no expert, to say the least, so I generally like to read what others have to say about economics.
I know enough to know that our ((court)) economists, (like ‘debt is good’ Paul Krugman) and others, are full of shite. And I’ve learned a lot from guys like you and TruthV, (yes, he’s correct about a lot of things, IMHO), so I just keep reading and maybe I’ll eventually grasp a bit more.
As for Hudson, I do recall reading some of his articles, and came away thinking he was knowledgeable and even astute about economics, but I also remember reading something, (I don’t recall exactly what it was), that made me lose respect for him on a different plane. (Perhaps it was his ‘circumspection’, which would make sense to me).
I find that I consider our immediate fate as a nation and a people (the West) and indeed our very civilization, is under imminent threat of dissolution. There is an invasion under way that would make the Moors of the the Umayyad Caliphate, or the Mongols or Ottomans, jealous for it’s ease and success of it’s conquest, and more concerning, the finality of it, because it also comes with wokeness (spiritual death) and blending. And the added humiliation of those being invaded, being forced to fund the invasion and the invaders, (and welcome them in with ‘gibs’, with groveling apologies for not giving them your lands and children much earlier).
In a few generations hence, there will be no more. Just a blacked-out memory from the history books of a scourge of ‘terrible racists’ who once menaced Europe and beyond.
This, (if I’m right), is what concerns me, and what I think we all should be concerned about, especially if we have children or grandchildren.
Indeed, right now in Ukraine, hundreds of thousands are dying in droves, being led to the slaughter by this menace; ZOG. (the exact same ZOG that destroyed Germany, and at least sixty million European and Russian Christians in the last century in only one of its wars).
So when otherwise intelligent and educated people are a little (for me) too academic (or circumspect) to mention the devil in the living room, I guess I become dismissive. Especially, as in my (admittedly layman’s view), it is ZOG, (the Fed, ECB) that is behind it all.
It isn’t that I dismiss their smarts or erudition, but rather their priorities, I guess.
Not that there isn’t perhaps something to learn, but it I find with some people who’re a bit too (for me) circumspect, (Jared Taylor, John Derbyshire, et al), that I get impatient, because I don’t think it’s prudent to be too circumspect, when it’s the devil in the living room, and he’s looking straight at your children and licking his lips.
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pachacuti says:@Mefobills
I really like your comments
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Michael Bollinger says:@Chuck Orloski
We chose the murderous Muslims over our WW 2 allies. We supported the Croatians, who back stabbed their fellow countryment at the start of WW2 when the Generals were set to meet, the Croations brought the Nazis with them.
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@anarchyst
You and John (“Mr. Wear”) are two of a type. You are capable of copy-paste, copy-paste, and more copy-paste, and that’s it. You show no capacity for true thinking, either original or non-original. For example, here I asked you a question based on what you had written to me:
You: John Wear does bring up some points to ponder…
Me: Where? When? Point them out, please.
You can’t answer it so you ignore it. You expect me to simply accept your statement about Wear without any proof or evidence. You repeat your first comment to me, and you will continue to repeat it even though I’ve already answered it. You won’t accept my answer bc it’s not in the narrow repertoire of what is accepted or understood by you. John does the same thing. Again and again.
I’ve stated in the past why I think John functions on the level of a moron. Definition:
having a mental age of from 7 to 12 years and generally having communication and social skills enabling some degree of academic or vocational education.
Would you say that anything John writes is above the level of what a normal white European 6th grader can do? What about your own writing? So if I know what a moron is, I define the word and then apply it, that is not name-calling. It’s identifying.
Rather than hurting Revisionism, I’m helping it by working to clear out unnecessary baggage and endless, repetitious copy-paste ‘articles’ and comment-posts that bog it down and cause eyes to glaze over and minds to numb out. In that situation, John Wear is in his element.
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Michael Bollinger says:@Anonymous
Agreed
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Michael Bollinger says:@bert33
It looks like you are one who refuses to learn, How sad.
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pachacuti says:@the Man Behind the Curtain
Israel system is also roughly like China’s in that the Bank that preceded the State owns all the land and leases it to individuals. Israel, like China, has also been described as a National / Socialist mixed econony.
In China, is the state (backed by its control of the land) the main creditor?
In China, like in Argentina, Cuba, Belarus, there are two systems within the same country: one for the internal econony and another to deal with the world market. Two exchange rates for its currency, two prices for the same food. This Catamaran works a lot better the bigger the size of its donestic market.
I wonder if the rise of a competing world reserve currency (used for south-south trade i.e.) might represent the rise of a similar Catamaran on a World scale
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Odyssey says:@Tiptoethrutulips
It’s obvious to you that it’s normal for someone from the outside to come, kick the ass of the local residents, take their land and put them in reserves, destroy their buffaloes and spread infectious diseases to eradicate them. It was normal for the US government to conclude hundreds of contracts with the local population and not fulfill a single one.
That was normal in Australia and it would probably be the same in Africa if the terrain configuration was different. It was normal to cause famine in India and kill tens of millions of locals. Maybe 27 million Russians killed was not enough for your criteria.
It’s amazing how normal it is for many in the West to intervene in countries on the opposite side of the globe ‘to protect western interests’, steal their natural resources and install a puppet regime that will be their colony. Since when did it start? Probably since 4,800 years ago, when the ancestors of today’s Westerners, Yamnaya nomads from the Russian steppes, came to Europe and committed genocides against the local population. From then until today, their descendants have started almost all wars in the world and committed countless genocides.
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Wokechoke says:@Truth Vigilante
This story goes a little too quickly into take over.
The BOE founded in the 1680s was trouble for others, because it created a serviceable national debt that funded the Royal Navy. The Jews didn’t even get to vote in England until the 1840s. They could not technically sit in parliament unless they converted to Christianity. You would struggle to find Jews founding the central bank in England tbh. None before the era of George II. Germany was however overrun with Jewish bankers.
Rothschild actually lost his fortune because he had heard that Wellington had lost Waterloo and he bought up bonds expecting a longer war. What he got was a bunch of bonds that shrivvelled up as the wars with Napoleon ended.
The Rothschild did do one thing that relates to America, they hired mercenary German men to go fight for king George III in North America. These are the Hessians. The basis of Rothschild wealth.
However the main thing about the American Revolution 1776 is that it fully emancipated Jews as citizens. That had not occurred in the UK until the 1860s as far as the laws in the UK record. The Jews in the UK during the Victorian period had to fight to get civil rights and gain citizenship until around the time of the American Civil War.
Disraeli notwithstanding Jews had it easier in the US than they did in England.
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Mefobills says:@the Man Behind the Curtain
I posted this earlier comment 244:
I get it that this is a long thread, so it is hard to digest everything:
Even the claims of Jewish persecution in Germany were no longer valid. Though the dominant Jewish elite had in large measure been stripped of high positions in finance, press, government, law and academia, the truth was, the 330,000 Jews who remained in Hitler’s Germany were unmolested and actually quite prosperous. Indeed, after anti-Jewish riots broke out following the 1938 Paris murder of a German diplomat by a deranged Polish Jew, it was Hitler himself who, via Josef Goebbels, immediately issued an Emergency Order for the anti-Jewish violence (since exaggerated in scope) to cease.
So, no – not all Jews were sent to be re-educated. There were even Jews in the Waffen SS. It was more about finding out who the subversives were. Stalin had the same problems.
This is what Ron Unz means by most people having it back to front. If you haven’t bothered to lift a finger and read source material, then you have been brainwashed, especially if you live in the West. (I’m American I went through the indoctrination too.)
There is a great movie on youtube called the Princes of the Yen. It describes the credit guidance windows. The Manchurian railroad engineers used the American System of Economy in Manchuria, and then secretly used it while they were at MITI. MITI guided the private banks and did civilizational planning.
Werner is an excellent economist. He is a little too pro private banking to my taste, but I acknowledge his genius.
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John Wear says:@Carolyn Yeager
You write to anarchyst: “Would you say that anything John writes is above the level of what a normal white European 6th grader can do?”
My response: My book “Germany’s War” is above the level of what a normal white European 6th grader can do. I think Ron Unz and Paul Craig Roberts would both agree with me on this.
I also have had about 70 articles published by The Barnes Review. I think both Paul Angel and John Friend would agree that my writing is above the level of what a normal white European 6th grader can do.
I have also had 101 articles published by Inconvenient History. I think both Germar Rudolf and Jett Rucker would say that my writing is above the level of what a normal white European 6th grader can do.
You know most of these people. Why don’t you contact them and see if any of them agree with you? I doubt if any of them will agree with you.
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Mefobills says:@Rurik
when it’s the devil in the living room, and he’s looking straight at your children and licking his lips.
That’s right. The devil is looking straight at you and wants to enslave you, maybe even use your kids for pleasure. Ron Unz had some commentary on Plenonexia, the human condition that is of the devil.
You can see how I am dismissive of Lolbertarians, because their free-dumb means freedom for degeneracy and sordid gain taking. Lol’s have no language for debt polarization – it cannot exist in their worldview.
They think that there are natural limits and they will arise, if only we used gold as money – our god.
I go hard against the Jews, because ejecting them is a pre-condition for erasing debts and rebalancing civilization. It is the “creditor class” of which the Jews are the most vocal agents that are the problem, and the ones most affected in a debt jubilee. They don’t want to lose their cat bird seat.
The West is now debt polarizing, the same as Rome did before the dark ages.
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@QCIC
The US dropped out of the ABM treaty in 2002. I now recognize that was a very strong threat against Russia, though it took me decades to understand. We may need to go back at least that far to understand who is pulling the strings of the Ukraine conflict.
You can start here.
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Mefobills says:@Odyssey
Since when did it start? Probably since 4,800 years ago, when the ancestors of today’s Westerners, Yamnaya nomads from the Russian steppes, came to Europe and committed genocides against the local population.
That’s more blood libel against white people. What’s up with that? Are you a Jew?
The Aryan tribes liked the ladies, and “bred into” the populations.
The Yamnaya is only 4,800 years ago. The oldest Cro-Magnon skull is 40K years ago.
Whites have been around a long time, getting with the ladies. Modern Europeans are a hybrid race, including the Yamnaya.
Even Chinese are probably a blend of Cro Magnon and something else.
Given the physiognomy of Jews, they appear to have heavy Neanderthal introgression, a postulate first put forth by the anthropologist Bradley. This explains the race war and blood libel accusations of Jews against the more Cro-Magnon peoples of the world.
http://www.fourwinds10.com/siterun_data/history/zionism/news.php?q=1276360998
However, independent of Koestler (whose work he had never before known), a Canadian- based writer of Jewish origins, Michael Bradley, released his own 1978 work, The Iceman Inheritance, followed up by its sequel, Chosen People From the Caucusus, in which (combined together) he put forth his thesis that the modern day people known as the Jews were descendants from the Khazars and that, indeed, the Khazars could trace their origins back to the Neanderthals.
Bradley’s website at michaelbradley.info describes Bradley’s findings in part: In Chosen People from the Caucasus, Bradley focuses on the two separate groups of people who came from the Caucasus Mountains of the Middle East: the Biblical Hebrews who emerged from the southern Caucasus between 3000-2000 BC to invade Palestine, and the northern Caucasus “Khazars” who were converted to Judaism about 740A.D.
The Khazars were pushed into Central and Eastern Europe by Mongol invasions, and their descendants comprise the vast majority of modern Jewry [a point that some historians, both Jewish and non-Jewish have quibbled over, some suggesting that only a small number of both peoples, ironically, are considered to be “Jews”—although they have no direct historical or genetic connections with each other—except as they shared a Neanderthal origin in the Caucasus Mountains in the far distant and ancient pre-Judaic past.
Bradley contends that people and cultures emerging from the Caucasus Mountains (a known refuge of late lingering Neanderthal populations) in proto-historical and historical times would have remained highly intelligent, highly aggressive and psychosexually maladapted (promoting a high level of in-group cohesion). These traits, Bradley contends, explain the survival of Biblical Hebrews against all odds and also the inordinate social influence of modern Western Jews.Bradley contends that there is no mystique of “the chosen people.” “Monotheism”— a purely male and abstract Godhead— is merely a result of Neanderthal glacial physical and mental adaptations or “maladaptations.” Proven Neanderthal in-group cohesion and extreme aggression together resulted in a fiercely parochial “chosen people” perspective. The cultural fusion of the two separate streams of “Jews” has, since the 16th century, played an important role in the evolution of Western Civilization and thus in the molding of the entire world’s present cultural profile.
Bradley contends that a uniquely high level of lingering Neanderthal aggression, perpetuated by ethnic prohibitions against outside marriage, has been responsible for the major role played by those calling themselves Jews in the discovery and conquest of the Americas, the transatlantic trade in Black Africans as slaves and cultural colonization of non-Whites by the West. It has been a role too often distorted and disguised by loud lamentations of “anti-Semitism.”
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Truth Vigilante says:@Carolyn Yeager
You posed this question to MoFo-Bill:
Is there any place for me to learn more about you, other than your Unz comments page? If not, please direct me to a couple of your most characteristic comments.
Firstly, his name is Bill. And seeing as he’s a Mother F*cker, hence the ‘MoFo’ that precedes it.
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whew says:@John Wear
Bohemia had always been part of the Holy Roman Empire; it had been part of the German Confederation between 1815 and 1866; then it had been linked to German Austria until 1918. Independence, not subordination, was the novelty in Czech history.
this is completely ahistorical, and a rewrite of the facts to excuse certain actions. it displays such a misunderstanding of history that it is obvious whoever said it first was a liar, and whoever repeats it is ignorant of reality.
Bohemia, the Czech state, was a Kingdom and a MEMBER of the Holy Roman Empire. it was not a conquered territory, as the above quote would make believe. it was an elector of the emperor, and throughout its history it was known as one of the, if not the very, wealthiest part of the Empire. the Bohemian ruler was the only ruler allowed to refer to himself as a King. to claim the Czechs didn’t have independence is ridiculous.
unfortunately, the Germans did betray the Czechs eventually when in 1649 they slaughtered dozens of Czech leaders because they were protestants, which led to a stupid and unnecessary war: the Thirty Years War; after the extermination campaigns during this war (aimed at the Czech population of Bohemia, since they were protestant – 50-80% of certain regions were exterminated) the Germans were sent in to repopulate (they were there prior, in some numbers, but were not the majority). only then did the Czechs lose some autonomy in Bohemia overall, but to claim Czechs never had autonomy is pure drivel.
The disintegration of this multi-cultural creation, joined together in total disregard of historical and national principles, happened without any German help and would already have come about in 1918 had not Russia and Germany been utterly and totally destroyed.
and was Austria-Hungary not a multicultural creation, joined together in total disregard of historical and national principles? oh right, measure others by a different stick. the Czech were trying to fight the Bolsheviks while the Germans were busy sending Lenin to Russia. the Czechs wanted their independence back, but to a typical jewrman if you don’t want to be ruled by the jewrmans you must want to be ruled by the jews. pathetic.
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@John Wear
To understand Czechoslovakia in the 1930s one needs to be familiar with how it was created with the Treaty of Trianon in 1920. This video provides a good overview.
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soll says:@Mefobills
The Bolsheviks were funded by finance capital, especially Jacob Schiff of Kuhn and Loeb.
If the Bolsheviks were allegedly being funded by Wall Street what was their purpose, for the collapse of Tsarism?
When did they allegedly start receiving this money? The origins of Bolshevism came around 1894, was Wall Street funding the pre-Bolshevik revolutionaries such as the Narodniks and the People’s Will, or the SRs who were likewise also committed to the overthrow of Tsarism?
Why was Jacob Schiff opposed to Tsarist Russia?
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Truth Vigilante says:@Wizard of Oz
Thanks for your endorsement. Much appreciated.
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@Carlton Meyer
He also has an excellent video about the Treaty of Versailles that resulted in the conflict with Poland and World War II.
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Mefobills says:@Truth Vigilante
Seeing as MoFo-Bill is a groupie of the failed economist and Marxist/Trotskyist Michael Hudson, you can usually find him in the Michael Hudson threads – boosting up the comments count (because so few people bother to read and post comments in Hudson’s monotonous and long-winded articles).
I’m detecting psychosis. I have already detected narcissism in you.
Even your handle TRUTH VIGILANTE! is a tell.
When pushed you revert to your true self.
I disagree with Ron Unz’s “free for all” lightly moderated comments section. It is pretty easy to do some sort of analysis and weed out the sociopaths and psychopaths.
Hudson’s comment section is much more civilized now that it is not bombed with libertarian nonsense (mostly from you), or what Hudson calls crackpot economic theories.
Banning is a good thing, and your being banned is a net benefit to normal people.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Odyssey
What I think is normal is irrelevant. Conquest is a fact of human history. It’s the same in nature. And you are correct, it was wrong for the US to draw up contracts with the natives to cease combat, and then break the terms. I do believe the US is paying restitution through the courts. Western countries seem to be the only societies made to pay for historical sins. If the Turks, Mongols and Barbary coast is paying up, I am not aware.
Western people (whites) traveled farther to do their colonizing and pillaging because they had the means to do so. Land locked peoples did not because they could not. But not having a boat didn’t stop nearly every known society from terrorizing their neighbors. Are you familiar with the Aztecs and the Mayans? They were not exactly warm and fuzzy with their adversaries. Neither were the Comanches and Apaches. They never stopped brutalizing each other; not even after the whites showed up and eventually ended that longstanding feud.
I think a threshold has been reached for tolerating virtue signaling from non-whites (and whites) for universal human activities. Certain groups reach back years and years to blame whites for all their dysfunction. Black kids raid and loot stores in their neighborhoods; the stores close; black community organizers hold a press conference and claim racism and “no one supports us!” Rinse and repeat.
In the context of history, modern and ancient, we all behaved in the same manner, more or less. Whites are judged by current day standards; everyone else is not. At least, some of us are looking around and asking, what the heck have we been doing all this time and why?
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mefobills
I read about that somewhere. There were German jews stating their life was good and prosperous in Germany. They knew the inhabitants of Palestine would not just acquiesce, and a lifetime of conflict would ensue.
Didn’t some influential jews propose a Jewish retreat in Palestine?
I also read that orthodox rabbis were in full support of ghettos as a means of preventing assimilation with the gentiles.
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Mefobills says:@soll
Zionism got its funding at the first Zionist conference in 1897.
Rothschild got on board at that time, so the movement started gaining steam. If I remember right, it was Lionel Rothschild who started buying up property in Palestine shortly afterward.
Why was Jacob Schiff opposed to Tsarist Russia? He is a Jew! Jews have historical grievances and hatreds. It is very bizarre, but there it is. Its even better if you can extract wealth from hapless Russians while fomenting a revolution.
Slightly earlier in history the Rus/Russians were pretty pissed off at the Jews, because Napoleon weaponized them around 1812.
Marx, Das Kapital published in English 1887. Going back further in time:
The Khazar Kaghanate about 600. Judaism adopted by Khazars around 741, probably by King Bulan.
Going back to about year 1000 for the Kievan Rus.
The Rus, who basically were Vikings, moved into the area around where Kiev is now. They portaged their ships across the rivers by attaching wheels.
The butt-hurting of the Khazars is somewhat legitimate, because they were displaced from the area they previously invaded in 600AD. Also, consider there would have been a very obvious physiognomy difference between Viking Rus and Khazars, much more so than today.
https://prepareforchange.net/2016/08/18/russia-and-the-khazars/
Bolshevism/Zionism six of one half a dozen of the other. They are basically Jewish thought constructs designed to establish a pyramid system of control, with them at the head. They both emerged around the same time, at the turn of the century.
If I got that dates wrong, sorry in advance. It is a rough timeline.
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Rurik says:@Mefobills
Banning is a good thing, and your being banned is a net benefit to normal people.
I don’t agree.
But I respect your right to say so.
I consider the rift a shame. TruthV is a great boon to this site and from whom I have learned a great deal.
FWIW
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Brosi says:@Haxo Angmark
So when Japan invaded northern China in ’37, they did so not to defeat the Reds….but to save them from ultimate defeat. AND they strong-armed the Germans into withdrawing all their military advisors. This was the first of 4 key junctures when the Japs and the Germans found themselves at strategic right angles, which in turn were a major factor in the so-called “Axis” losing WW2.
Interesting statement. Do you have any more detail on this assertion.
Roosevelt and the ((US)) were also double dealing and withholding vital Lend Lease supplies to Chaing as well as forcing him to form an alliance with the Mao and only attack Japan.
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Zarathustra says:@Mefobills
Actually that is error. Khazars were pushed out of Kavkaz by Magyars to area of present Stalingrad.
They did rule over different nationalities. Eventually they got diluted and dispersed.
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Petermx says:@whew
As usual, that sounds like a very one-sided account of things, and as usual, it demonizes only the Germans. Were you there in 1649? I’ll bet the Germans didn’t brutally expel and steal the land, homes, and all the belongings of 3.5 million Czechs, as the Czechs did to Germans at the end of World War II.
And Bohemia had many Germans too. They were just as responsible for the prosperity of Bohemia as part of the Austrian Empire. In the video below, Thomas Sowell explains (from minutes 9 to 10) that when the university was founded in Prague in 1348, the faculty was predominantly German.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Mefobills
MoFo-Bill writes:
How’s that centrally planned Chinese economy working out for you?
The overwhelmingly Capitalistic Chinese economy is doing well.
The private sector, subject to a relatively light touch from government in China (Low income tax rates, Low Corporate tax rates, much smaller government as a % of GDP, FAR LESS regulatory impositions from parasitic government busy bodies), is the dynamo of growth in the Middle Kingdom.To the extent that some of the Chinese economy is centrally planned, ie: trillions squandered on:
1) Ghost cities that no one lives in
2) Thousands of kilometres of roads and high speed rail to nowhere
3) The hundreds of billions of subsidies to inefficient State Owned Enterprises [SOE’s] that are haemorrhaging red ink
4) The building of a dozen or more mega airports in excess of the capacity required … etc
this has certainly been a major drag on the economy and built up an ENORMOUS DEBT LOAD that will impact China’s future growth prospects and leave future generations shackled in indentured servitude trying to pay it off.
However, despite the enormous sums flushed down a rat hole by the Central Planners, China’s Capitalistic private sector is SOOOOO dynamic, so productive, that it more than compensates for the disastrous mistakes of the hard line communists still in the party that think like you and Michael Hudson.
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Verymuchalive says:@Wizard of Oz
Misrepresentation, misdirection, obfuscation.
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JR Foley says:@John Wear
Can Rebekah Koffler perhaps assist you two towards finding the Real Truth?
Rebekah is dedicating her post-public service career to fighting for freedom, individual rights, and holding government establishment apparatchiks to account.
Also protecting America from sliding toward dehumanizing socialism and its next phase, communism, while describing the threat posed to the United States by Russia, is now Rebekah’s current mission.
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eah says:@John Wear
I’m not so interested in this question of whether Barbarossa was a Präventionskrieg or not, i.e. prompted to counter an imminent attack — as I said, to me the Barbarossa timeline does not really support that — I also find evidence of an imminent attack by Stalin marginal (at best) — not to mention that it would have made no military sense to wait until the German Army had regrouped after the campaign in the west, and was massed in the east for Barbarossa — did Stalin not have intelligence sources that gave him some info about the readiness and disposition of German forces?
>I think the Schmundt quote was forged by the Allies after the war and is not genuine.
This means, basically, that you think the Schmundt-Protokoll is a forgery — what causes you to think so? — is it akin to a religious belief, a matter of faith (confirmation bias), or do you know of some evidence? — also, do you have general criteria that you use to decide which documents are forgeries and which are not?
>I question how anyone can know that Hitler actually made these comments.
That’s an odd statement — obviously, Schmundt ‘could know’ because in his role as Hitler’s military aide, he was present at the meeting and took notes — reportedly, these notes were later found among captured documents, as were copies of Weisung Nr. 21 (Fall Barbarossa) — do you think Weisung Nr. 21 is a forgery too?
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@the Man Behind the Curtain
OK, you’ve raised a fair point: why bother with history of ideas?
I’d like to combine the history I gave in https://www.unz.com/runz/why-everything-you-know-about-world-war-ii-is-wrong/#comment-6007492 your comments:
Now it appears the lights are dimming in the West, especially Europe, and I expect they will not come back on for some time. I do not think arguments grounded in the philosophy of science adequately explain these large movements in world history.
What if history of ideas shows that the generally accepted reasoning is false, as false (say) the generally accepted version of WW II, and for much the same reason?
Apparently Einstein was a compiler rather than a creator, who was given overwhelming press support. I remember back when it was common wisdom that, confronted with a moral argument, the response tended to be “everything is relative”, because that was the interpretation given to Einstein’s papers. And I remember that physics more or less stopped short after Einstein’s 1905 papers. Ah, that was over century ago.
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@Anonymous
But could it be Stalin was bluffing? Mounting an offensive position to force Germans into a defensive position?
If so, the bluff was far too realistic. See Suvorov, Icebeaker for details, but, briefly: The USSR’s army and air force at the time of Hitler’s USSR invasion was designed solely for rapid penetration of defenses and deep penetration of enemy territory. Further, it was forward deployed (aircraft moved right behind the USSR held lines) so that it could better attack logistics tail, but that also left the aircraft to be destroyed on the ground by a German first strike. In practice, the Germans could and did overrun the front line Russian troops, and were thereafter fighting mostly logistics service troops, which is why the immense German victories at first.
Had the USSR attacked three weeks earlier, the German Army would have been just as thoroughly defeated.
The bluff you propose, taking a standard army and forward deploying its combat troops and air support as a bluff, would have been just as much an invitation to Third Reich attack as what actually happened.
Really strange how military thinkers come up with such fragile deployments and strategic policies. The Ukraine fiasco is a current example.
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Tsar Nicholas says:
I found this extremely interesting. Too long for my eyes so I listened. Many thanks to Mr Unz for his hard work.
But how does Operation Barbarossa fit into this Anglo-Saxon scenario?
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Truth Vigilante says:@Wokechoke
Rothschild actually lost his fortune because he had heard that Wellington had lost Waterloo and he bought up bonds expecting a longer war.
What he got was a bunch of bonds that shrivvelled up as the wars with Napoleon ended.That’s news to me. Would you kindly post the sources that gave you this information ?
Now, I’m not saying that Nathan Rothschild did or didn’t have bonds that may have shrivelled up and became worthless. (No investor/speculator in history that’s traded extensively over a number of years can say they haven’t made some losing bets).
But I take issue with the ‘lost his fortune’ bit. I suspect that if Rothschild did have bonds that became worthless, they represented a tiny fraction of his overall investment portfolio.
You also write:
The Rothschild did do one thing that relates to America, they hired mercenary German men to go fight for king George III in North America.
Nathan Mayer Rothschild, the individual that built the foundation of the colossal family fortune, was born in 1777.
I suspect that, as an infant, he didn’t hire many mercenaries from any country as the Revolutionary War raged in the 1770’s and 1780’s.Of course, his father (Mayer Amschel Rothschild), the patriarch of the dynasty, the same Rothschild that sent his five sons to different financial centres throughout Europe to expand and consolidate the family business, whilst relatively wealthy within the context of the Frankfurt business community where he lived, was a long way from being someone with ‘Global Reach’ and political clout.
It is no exaggeration to say that Mayer Amschel Rothschild’s net worth at its peak, was not more than a rounding error in comparison to that of his son Nathan, whose net worth in the post Napoleonic era was truly stratospheric.
In other words, I doubt the old man (who died in 1812) would have had the capacity to fund very many Hessian mercenaries during the 1770’s/80’s, when he wasn’t all that wealthy – as opposed to the latter years of his life in the early 1800’s.
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Brad Anbro says:@soll
I would advise that you read the many books that were written by Antony Sutton, Ph.D. (now deceased). He spells all this out very clearly and uses the United States’ own government documents as one of his sources of information.
The U.S. Jew (and WASP accomplices) were hoping that Russia would be a gigantic market for the U.S. – both as a purchaser of U.S. made goods and also as a country that the U.S. banking interests could “tap.”
Over the years, the U.S. has GIVEN Russia a lot of technology. Russia didn’t have to “steal” any of it; the technology was given to them, in hopes of the Jew & WASP financial concerns making a financial “killing” there. This is also covered in detail by Mr. Sutton.
But it hasn’t quite worked out that way, long term. Mr. Putin is nobody’s fool and he can see right through the USA’s actions, events which we are witnessing today bearing this out.
Thank you.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Mefobills
MoFo-Bill writes:
They [the Libertarians] think that there are natural limits and they will arise, if only we used gold as money – our god.
Yes of course, what was I thinking ?
The present Fiat Monetary system, whereby the Zionist Usury Banking Cartel owns the Federal Reserve and either owns or controls the other major western central banks, is working wonderfully well.
I mean, we have negligible inflation, real wages in the western nations are growing at a healthy clip year after year, wealth is equitably distributed and we’re all prospering in societal harmony.Yes, yes I agree with you. Why the need to rock the boat ?
Let’s stick with the present system that you and Michael Hudson advocate for, where money is printed/digitally created ad infinitum to fund your pet MMT projects.
It’s a foolproof system according to the two of you, and under the wise stewardship of the omniscient Central Planners, can never go wrong*.
(*Your hero the Jewess Janet Yellen, former Fed Chairman and present Secretary of the Treasury, is on record as saying a few years ago, that there will never be another major recession in our lifetimes).
So clearly Central Planning (and that’s what control of monetary policy by a bunch of unelected career bureaucrats at the Federal Reserve is all about), must be working satisfactorily.
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Wizard of Oz says:@John Wear
Noted for possible future reference
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Wizard of Oz says:@Rurik
It is only the pleasure of boring it up some of UR’s crude, rude and raving lunatics that makes me suggest that Ron do indeed tell you that I am not Jewish. And if his interest in me or my ethnicity is so slight that he is not sure he can ask SS or JD and be sure.
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Wow, what an extraordinary vid. The guy’s style is offputting but what a story, and I’m only 10 minutes in, have to take a break.
I assume he’ll get to what I see as the crux of the matter …. Lincoln instituted the military draft. This single act made the Declaration of Independence – “all men are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness” and the concept of freedom a total joke. Even now no one seems to notice. In the US you are free to pursue life, liberty, etc., unless the govt. decides otherwise and sends you to some god-forsaken place on earth, or down south in the case of the civil war, to kill or be killed.
Since that time the notion of ‘democracy’ in the US has been nothing more than a cover for a military dictatorship. As I recently tweeted
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Truthhurts says:
WW II and Hitler happened because Woodrow Wilson, a stroke victim, got us into WW I due to his new wife’s admiration for patrician Europe and the Beaux Arts style of the era. Many other American industrialists adapted European traits of style and class. They built mansions using European artifacts and design.
Hitler was eager to use slave labor, though. The Civil War here happened because the North could not compete with a slave labor using South turning industrial, the Cotton Gin was just the beginning, they thought. Imagine other industries using slave labor and you’d have CCP China-like unfair scale of cheap labor on your border. Well, we never learned from history did we?• Replies: @MefobillsAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
@whew
John Wear is correct. Bohemia was always part of the Holy Roman Empire. The Holy Roman Emperor was also the King of Bohemia. The Emperor being the King of Bohemia meant Bohemia was more subservient than most parts of the Empire.
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John Wear says:@eah
You write: “I also find evidence of an imminent attack by Stalin marginal (at best)…did Stalin not have intelligence sources that gave him some info about the readiness and disposition of German forces?”
My response: I recommend you read Viktor Suvorov’s book “The Chief Culprit.” Or, if you don’t want to read this entire book, you can read Chapter One of my book “Germany’s War”, which is available for free on this website at https://www.unz.com/book/john_wear__germanys-war/.
These sources should answer all of your questions. The evidence is overwhelming that the Soviet Union was preparing to attack Germany and all of Europe.
You write: “This means, basically, that you think the Schmundt-Protokoll is a forgery — what causes you to think so?”
My response: The Allies forged numerous documents, tortured Germans such as Rudolf Höss into making false confessions, and paid professional witnesses to bear false witness at their many trials after the war. You can read my articles at https://www.inconvenienthistory.com/columnists/2873 for more information.
You write: “also, do you have general criteria that you use to decide which documents are forgeries and which are not?”
My response: The Schmundt document conforms to the Allied propaganda campaign implemented during and after the war. Schmundt was conveniently dead, so he was not around to dispute its contents. There is no reason for me to believe it is an original document.
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Mefobills says:@Tiptoethrutulips
I also read that orthodox rabbis were in full support of ghettos as a means of preventing assimilation with the gentiles.
It is called the Kahal.
The local governing body of a former European Jewish community administering religious, legal and communal affairs.
Kahal is a feature of Jewish Shtetls in Poland, and the Pale of Settlement in areas of what is now Ukraine. The Kahal both prevented assimilation, and used their authority to suppress their population of normie jews. The Kahal (big jews) operated their mechanism on little jews. One mechanism was to prevent little jews from bathing, so that they literally offended the host population by their smelly presence. The Kahal are evil in my estimation.
In my opinion: two necessary books to read regarding the Kahal: 200 years together by Solzhenitsyn, and waters flowing eastward.
https://www.solzhenitsyncenter.org/his-writings/large-works-and-novels/two-hundred-years-together
Waters flowing eastward can be found using a search engine.
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whew says:@Petermx
“as usual” would apply to the German view of things, hence why i countered it. your bias makes you unable to see how perfectly clear and fair my comment was, in the context of it being a reply.
were you there when the Germans were kicked out of Bohemia after WW2? do you see how stupid that would sound? that’s how stupid it sounds when you claim i can’t discuss 1649. it’s ridiculous. the ethnic genocides of the Thirty Years War, especially against Protestants, is well documented. their replacement by Catholics is well documented. while some claim it was purely religious, it was obviously far more than that, since the slaughtered were Slavs and the replacements were Germans (the replacements could’ve been Catholic Slavs). so yes, the Germans did brutally expel the Czechs from their land.
as for what happened after WW2, jewrmans are able to lie quite like jews, and the exaggerations of what happened in those expulsions is on the level of shrunken heads and zyklon b. the jewrmans claim 250,000 died, which is an abomination of a lie equivalent to the 6,000,000 lie. i’m half German myself, from both sides of the family, and i’ve heard the stories of both crimes by Germans during the war, and crimes by Czechs after the war. while both sides are guilty, neither side is guilty of the horrors of what post-war lies would claim. ie. my great grandmother (mother’s father’s mom, lived in Litvinov – German: Leutensdorf), Sudeten German, was expelled after the war, she spent 3 days in Germany and was angry at the Germans who were treating her poorly (saying things like “oh heims in reich right!?) and blaming her and the other Sudetens for starting the war – she decided to go back to Czechoslovakia, so she just crossed the border, went back to her house, and that was it. 250,000? total brutality? oh please, she just went right back and no one bothered her, and she did that with her pure German husband (my great grandfather). my father’s mom didn’t speak a word of Czech when the war ended, she was never even bothered (lived in Cheb – German: Eger).
yes , the Germans were Bohemians too, but they forgot that when they tried breaking Bohemia apart. it’s like if today the Turks in Germany tried forming their own country. madness. what the Germans did was project their own dominance unto the Czechs, and thought the Czechs would want to Czechify them like they tried to Germanize the Czechs (even trying to force German as their official language). the University was founded by Karl IV who spoke Czech and considered himself Czech. it attracted students and teachers from all over the HRE. naturally, it would be majority German. Thomas Sowell isn’t exactly an authority on the subject, and his knowledge is surface level and superficial.
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Mefobills says:@Truth Vigilante
The present Fiat Monetary system, whereby the Zionist Usury Banking Cartel owns the Federal Reserve and either owns or controls the other major western central banks, is working wonderfully well.
All money is fiat you retard, and always has been. This is why you are dangerous and should be banned. I’ve explained this to you many times, yet you keep coming back to the same talking points, like some sort of spastic special education kid.
Others disagree about banning, but that is fine. What happens with bad ideas is they get lodged into innocent brains and then it is hard to disabuse them. It then takes a concentration camp to disabuse people, or they have to die off. You basically are a propagandist, and libertarianism is a cult.
Hudson is not for the “present Zionist cartel” either. You just make stuff up that has no bearing on facts. Cultish people are like that, if something is different from what they think they know, they just wave their hands.
If you bothered to lift a finger, instead of being an ideologue, you would find out that Hudson is advising the Astana group, the Russian Academy of Sciences, the Stolypin Group, and also does videos for China’s leadership.
All of these groups are working together now to overturn the petrodollar/private banking cartel that is strangling the world, and which is also Zionist. The other most important person you probably know nothing about is Glazyev, who is resurrecting something akin to the trading gold standard (gold is in the trading basket, along with commodities).
I even talked earlier about wood Talley sticks, which operated England longer than the U.S. has been around. They worked fine, and they were the king’s fiat. The is no god in gold, it is shiny metal.
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@John Wear
So predictable, John, and such a perfect example of what I’m trying to get across to whoever here can hear it. You state, “My book is above the level of what a normal white European 6th grader can do” and you name two people who you believe will impress. This proves nothing about the writing/thinking level of the content. You either think it does, or you hope other people will think so. You have no clue as to what actual evidence for an argument is. It’s like if the teacher gives you a good grade, that is all the proof you need.
You do the same with your articles. You do the same with the Inconvenient History website. You did the same with the Hitler-Hess Scotland flight question we disagreed on elsewhere. It says nothing about the question at hand. Sixth grade writing-reading level actually means that more people can follow it, and might read it. It’s very easy to read and follow. However, it’s never stimulating. Nor is there anything original. Nor is it ever controversial (except in the larger sense that the entire subject is). It’s copy-paste or “he said- she said,” period.
I don’t go by consensus. I’ve learned to make my own decisions based on my own knowledge and experience. I don’t have anything to sell, nor do I represent an institution that I must consider in my public statements. That you cannot speak in your own behalf but only recommend these people as ‘references’ simply proves my point.
So I think it’s important to make clear: You did not change anything or even say anything in this reply. It’s how you operate and you’re true to form.
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Mefobills says:@Truth Vigilante
The overwhelmingly Capitalistic Chinese economy is doing well.
The private sector, subject to a relatively light touch from government in China (Low income tax rates, Low Corporate tax rates, much smaller government as a % of GDP, FAR LESS regulatory impositions from parasitic government busy bodies), is the dynamo of growth in the Middle Kingdom.China is national socialist, fascist, and has what is called industrial capitalism. That means their STATE BANKS (not private stock owned corporations) inject credit into industry.
The credit they direct into industry is done by STATE PLANNING. It is STATE CREDIT injected into INDUSTRY by STATE PLANNING.
Are you in denial or something? China must be molded and formed into a template that fits your warped libertarian world view.
So, instead of waving your hands and ignoring China, you make it fit in as libertarian? You are basically crazy.
Libertarianism has nothing at all to do with state planning and state credit, it militates against these things. You are not even a good libertarian, you just make things up as an ideologue.
Head first for you and your ilk, into the concentration camps you go. You are not benefiting anybody, and are a net negative.
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soll says:@Mefobills
>Zionism got its funding at the first Zionist conference in 1897.
Rothschild got on board at that time, so the movement started gaining steam.
Zionism or Reformed Judaism was not even a well supported movement in the early 1900s, it took for Hitler to solidify support for Israel.
>Why was Jacob Schiff opposed to Tsarist Russia? He is a Jew! Jews have historical grievances and hatreds. It is very bizarre, but there it is.
It’s only “bizarre” if you’ve never looked into their plight. So you don’t know why Jacob Schiff had opposed Tsarism since 1890?
Upon the February Revolution of 1917
Quote:
Jubilant New Yorkers staged mass meetings to celebrate the overthrow of the czar. Jews were especially elated; their arch persecutor had fallen, and since Russia’s significance as a major belligerent was rapidly waning, the plight of Jews in war-ravaged countries became less acute. “We are singing a paean of victory; we are rejoicing at the answer to our prayers,” Louis Marshall said. Schiff, whose congratulations to Russia and exchange of wires with Paul Miliukov were widely circulated in Russia and America, spoke of “a miracle” that ended Romanov rule. Passover in 1917, he predicted, would be celebrated with greater fervor, for like the ancient Hebrews in Egypt, the Jews had been delivered from oppression. Identifying himself to Miliukov as “a persistent foe of the tyrannical autocracy, the merciless persecutors of my co-religionists,” he added exuberantly, “Just as before I hated most intensely the Russian government, so now I love deeply the new Russia.”
Schiff supported the February Revolution, not the October Revolution. He celebrated the end of Tsarism, and the emancipation of the Jews via the Provisional Government and gifted them 1 million rubles for their ‘liberty loan’ fund as-to support their war effort.
Quote:
When Russian officials assured Schiff and his friends of Jewish emancipation and equality, the revolution more than ever became a Jewish victory. Ex-President Taft, Schiff’s adversary in the fight for abrogation, also singled out the special Jewish interest, praising the Jews “for having retained their racial identity in the face of centuries of persecution.” For Schiff and his associates the moment cried for support of the new government that would prevent the revival of autocracy and Jewish disabilities. Now urging financial aid to Russia, Schiff called for Jewish subscriptions to the Russian liberty loan, to which he personally subscribed 1 million rubles.
Jacob Schiff was anti-Bolshevik. The original fringe claim was that he somehow funded the Bolsheviks with 12 million; by the 1990s this conspiracy theory had increased to 20 million.
Its interesting reading Schiff’s biography by Naomi Cohen and how he was planning to fund a replica of the Statue of Liberty to be given to new Russia. Barely 9 months later the October Revolution occurred and collapse of the Provisional Government. Once again, Schiff ended all relations with Russia, and by 1918 he was giving speeches in the U.S. attacking the Bolsheviks while demanding they return his money which he had been giving the Provisional Government following the February Revolution.
see, ‘Jacob H. Schiff: A Study in American Jewish Leadership’ (1999) by Naomi Cohen
>Marx, Das Kapital published in English 1887. Going back further in time:
What does this even mean? Karl Marx was also allegedly being funded?
>Bolshevism/Zionism six of one half a dozen of the other. They are basically Jewish thought constructs designed to establish a pyramid system of control, with them at the head. They both emerged around the same time, at the turn of the century.
Bolshevism more-so was influenced by the People’s Will, than “the Jews;” you cannot conflated Marxism with Zionism. Marx advocated for a classless, stateless society. At odds with the State of Israel and religious-nationalism. Demands for change came out of the industrial revolutions than any nameless “Jews.”
Shadow chasing in the dark. The Who’s, not “the Jews.”
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Rurik says:@Wizard of Oz
that he is not sure he can ask SS or JD and be sure.
so you’re telling us that Mr. Unz, who has endured you nagging him relentlessly for years, over every issue that might be of concern to ‘the Jews’, (WWII, 9/11, Ukraine, ‘Holocaust’, wars, neocons, ad nauseam..), and has known you ‘even privately’ going ‘way back’, (if I’m correct about those things)..
does not know if you’re a Jew or not?
LOL!
Here’s a clue lizard, the only ones I know of who are proud of their guile and duplicity, are people like you. People who think they’re being clever and ‘smarter’ than others, when they lie so glibly and infamously, that yes, for a lot of people, it is too much, and they become confounded.
But we’ve come to know you better, lizard. We know you’re the kind of person who (unlike Mr. Unz) relishes lying, and being false. Indeed, you seem to embody everything that is vile and reprehensible about some people. Whereas Mr. Unz represents the opposite, and honors and seeks truth, mankind’s highest and most noble calling.
It’s no wonder there is a chasm between you two, when your world views and personalities are so starkly at odds. Opposites, in some ways. Mr. Unz represents everything that is admirable about Jews in particular, (and people in general). Intelligence, accomplishment, fair play, and an unquenchable thirst for the truth. Whereas you represent the opposite. The sordid and the conniving and the duplicitous.
So much so, that any honorable Jew, would be understandably conflicted over the idea of claiming you as one of their own.
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QCIC says:@Carlton Meyer
Your videos are an excellent introduction and overview of the crisis in Ukraine. I am familiar with much of this history, but your brief presentations tie the facts together nicely and fill in some gaps.
Keep up the great work!
For everyone else:
I think you people should quit worrying about WW2 and start working to prevent WW3.
World War 3 is LOOMING.
See Carlton’s videos for more detail.
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Wokechoke says:@Truth Vigilante
Rothschild bought up bonds on incorrect news that Wellington had lost. He was expected at least 2 more years of war with France. Thus he bought in effect war bonds.
https://ideas.repec.org/p/ant/wpaper/2020009.html
The British state and economy actually had immense trouble after victory over Napoleon.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1815_in_the_United_Kingdom
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1816_in_the_United_Kingdom
The Corn Laws are introduced to protect Tory Land Owners from US and Russian grain. Several bloody riots when the war economy halts and you see Luddite industrial sabotage.
What Rothschild did, and it’s certainly true, he funded the army Wellington commanded in Spain and Portugal. There’s a good case to be made that Rothschild organised the takedown of Napoleon. Peace with France wasn’t good for the military contracting business.
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Mefobills says:@Truthhurts
WW II and Hitler happened because Woodrow Wilson, a stroke victim, got us into WW I due to his new wife’s admiration for patrician Europe and the Beaux Arts style of the era. Many other American industrialists adapted European traits of style and class. They built mansions using European artifacts and design.
Hitler was eager to use slave labor, though. The Civil War here happened because the North could not compete with a slave labor using South turning industrial, the Cotton Gin was just the beginning, they thought. Imagine other industries using slave labor and you’d have CCP China-like unfair scale of cheap labor on your border. Well, we never learned from history did we?You are as bad as Truth Vigilante, just making stuff up. Truthhurts?
Woodrow Wilson was compromised, as the Zionist had the goods on him. Wilson was screwing another Princeton professors wife. Compromat has long been used by our (((friends))).
The election of 1912 was rigged by the “European Banking Entities,” basically the Zionists of the day, or you could call it private finance capitalism.
The previously had lost out with the Aldrich Amendment, and were in danger of losing their desired money trust, which they eventually got with the Federal Reserve – which is not Federal.
So, to get their Aldrich Amendment passed they split the ticket with the Bull Moose party; this to get rid of Taft. (Taft opposed the Aldrich Amendment).
They appealed to the Egoist Teddy Roosevelt, and pulled him out of retirement. Teddy then had a political party created for him… the Bull Moose Party. It takes funding to create a new political party does it not? It takes ownership of newspapers to then promote the party, does it not?
Basically, if you don’t follow the Jew, you don’t know up from down, and then have to make up narratives that don’t fit reality.
Once Woodrow, their compromised man was put into power, he was then used to bring on other Jews into the administration, especially his handler Colonel House.
They then worked to subvert the country with the 16’th and 17’th amendments, and then the Federal Reserve Act and IRS.
Once the money trust cartel was in place, it was easy enough to gin up the presses, and then brain wash the population with hysteria propaganda, much like what was done during Covid.
WW1 was funded into existence, and part of the “long range planning” done by the privateering bankers preceded WW1 by many years.
WW1 was mostly because finance capital and Jews felt threatened by the Kaiser, who had adopted the American System of Economy of the founders, otherwise known as industrial capitalism – basically the same system now run in China.
The Kaiser also was building a battleship, which had the British alarmed. Britannia must rule the waves! Part of international finance capitalism is to debt spread around the world, and then enforce the debt contracts with blue water navies.
Maybe since you have ‘TRUTH” in your handle, none of what I said will resonate in your brain, because you already know the truth, right?
Hitler had slave labor? What are you smoking? That’s some good crack. It was only after the war started (which they didn’t start) that concentration camp labor was put to work making war material.
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whew says:@Alden
no, John Wear (and you) are incorrect. read, and then reread, what i wrote. and then think about it <– that's the key issue, to think. if the Czechs had no autonomy because they were a part of the HRE, than the Germans didn’t have it either. do you understand? probably not, but at least i tried. Bohemia was not more subservient than any other part, at least if you said equally, but in fact it was less subservient owing to its special privileges (which a more subservient part would not receive). simple, easy logic. shouldn’t take so much explanation. just think.
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Mefobills says:@soll
More propaganda and gaslighting eh?
Anybody with half an ounce of integrity can look up Herzyl and find out when his book was published.
Then they can look and see when the first Zionist Conference was held.
Then they can note how ‘international’ Jewry responded by looking at newspaper clippings. Six million must die!
Then they can look into Havarra, and not how Hitler worked with the Zionists.
It was win win. Nazis got to get rid of troublesome Jews. Jews got their paradise in Palestine.
If you are really honest, you can look into the funding mechanism for Havarra, how German Jewish property was sold, and then the purchasing power placed in a special bank in Haifa.
If you are even more honest, you will read up on Zionism and take note how the leadership wanted to create conditions to get Jews out of Germany, as they were too comfortable. The first wave of Jews were to be Kulaks and the type to dig in the dirt, and grow food. German Jews were to come later, and they were to be the technocrats.
Top Jews in the finance centers of London, Wall Street, and Paris were to remain in their cat-bird seats, directing international credit and continuing to pass propaganda in their owned press organs.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Anonymous
Had the USSR attacked three weeks earlier, the German Army would have been just as thoroughly defeated.
You’re wrong there. Not even close.
Forward German formations would no doubt have taken heavy casualties in the first day or two of the Soviet offensive, but they would have been able to provide enough of a delaying defence that bought time for other rearguard German formations to regroup and set up a powerful defensive perimeter.
Not long thereafter, the Germans would be in position to launch their own counteroffensive that would soon turn the tide.
From then on, the Germans would run riot and it would be shades of the early stages of Operation Barbarossa all over again.You have to remember, the Germans were hardened combat veterans that had participated in the Polish and French campaigns.
They would be up against Soviet troops that were no better than the rabble that was thoroughly walloped by the Finns in the Winter War of late 1939/early 1940.To the extent that the Soviets made some early gains, these would be limited in scope in terms of depth and breadth of penetration.
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annamaria says:@meamjojo
“Let’s discuss contemporary subjects, like Ukraine.”
— Sure. The context is critically important.The Nuremberg Tribunal exhibited the worst sort of legal double-standards … horrific torture, threats, blackmail, and other entirely illegitimate means were regularly employed to obtain confessions or denunciations of others, a situation that strongly suggested a very considerable number of those condemned and hanged were entirely innocent.
Rings Purim, does not it, “meajew?”
…after the end of the war, the Americans had starved to death as many as a million German POWs, seemingly as a deliberate act of policy, a war crime that would surely rank among the greatest in history.
Where did we hear this before? –
Here.You must understand, the leading Bolsheviks who took over Russia were not Russians. They hated Russians. They hated Christians. Driven by ethnic hatred, they tortured and slaughtered millions of Russians without a shred of human remorse. It cannot be overstated. Bolshevism committed the greatest human slaughter of all time. The fact that most of the world is ignorant and uncaring about this enormous crime is proof that the global media is in the hands of the perpetrators.
Aleksandr SolzhenitsynWhat is going on in the Kaganat of Nuland (former Ukraine) right now? –
This:Mykhailo Podolyak (Zelensky administration): “We must have not 1000, but 2500, 3000 or even 5000 funerals for Russia per day. This is the only way this war can end. Only destruction, destruction and again destruction.”
Compare the above with the mental setups of the Purimized “fighters with Amalek:’
…as early as 1940, an American Jew named Theodore Kaufman became so enraged at what he regarded as Hitler’s mistreatment of German Jewry that he published a short book evocatively entitled Germany Must Perish!, in which he explicitly proposed the total extermination of the German people.
Another Jewish genocider, Ehrenburg, “agitated in the style of Nazi racist ideology” with statements such as: “The Germans are not humans.” Ilya Ehrenburg was also the author of the slanderous memes about “soap” and “sculps.” Ehrenburg and the rabidly hateful and slanderous Lipstadt are twins in amorality.
The US State Department and various stink tanks like “The Institute for the Study of War” (which should be called The Institute of Jewish Warmongering”) are infested with genocidal neo-tamudic criminals:
In the wake of the 9/11 Attacks, the Jewish Neocons stampeded America towards the disastrous Iraq War and the resulting destruction of the Middle East, with the talking heads on our television sets endlessly claiming that “Saddam Hussein is another Hitler.” Since then, we have regularly heard the same tag-line repeated in various modified versions, being told that “Muammar Gaddafi is another Hitler” or “Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is another Hitler” or “Vladimir Putin is another Hitler…”
Local Jewish oligarchs and their loyal servants Banderites sold Ukraine to Zionists and war profiteers. The US-assisted Nazification of Ukraine created cannon fodder for the war against Russia and assured the depopulation of Ukraine to turn it into a “big Israel.” https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/4/5/zelenskyy-says-wants-ukraine-to-become-a-big-israel
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John Wear says:@Carolyn Yeager
You write: “So I think it’s important to make clear: You did not change anything or even say anything in this reply. It’s how you operate and you’re true to form.”
My response: I have no need to reply to your comments. My work speaks for itself.
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Rurik says:@Mefobills
All money is fiat …
Not too sure about this.
(with the caveat that I’m a student of economics, and not an expert – by a million miles).
But I do recall back when I first started participating here at TUR, a dispute I had with ‘the Maven’, (name given to him by Brother Nathanial, for a “smart” Jew), and he was an enthusiastic proponent of the Fed, whereas I was a critic. (Sam Shama was his name, if I remember correctly).
Anyways, I was making the case for gold and silver, and he was saying they were not money, (or something like that). And then I pointed out that a silver shekel, (let’s say an ounce of silver, and Sam was Jewish, so I used shekel), could likely buy a nice lunch and a drink, two thousand years ago, perhaps with some change, just as an ounce of silver today, could buy you a nice lunch and a drink, (in a modestly priced establishment), whereas the value of the U.S. dollar, in just two hundred years, has gone from being able to buy (I’m guessing a bit, because I’m not an expert), but I’d bet that in 1823, a dollar could have bought an entire family of five, a lunch and drinks, with a bit to spare. Whereas we all know what it’s worth today.
So this is a caveman’s way of trying to grok economics and fiat currencies and Keynesian concepts that are too esoteric for humble Rurik.
Precious metals were of value thousands of years ago, and are of value today, whereas the dollar is headed to the Wiemar Deutsche Mark, because they can print all they want, and then spend it, and the temptation to spend all that lucre, is simply too great for our noble elites (AOC) to resist.
So.. this is what I was thinking, as a way of a compromise.
It depends on the regime who’s printing the money.
I recall reading about how Benjamin Franklin was hailing the blessings of Colonial Script, and I’m not sure if it was tied gold, or not. But because the government of the Colonies, had the best interests of the colonial people at heart, it didn’t have to be tied to gold, because it wasn’t (as far as I know) used so much for international trade, as it was for greasing the economy of the Colonies.
This, I wonder might be the crux of the matter. Are the people printing the money, doing so for the benefit of the nation and the people, like in Colonial America, (or China or Russia today), or, are they your enemies, who’ve co-opted your Treasury, and now print unlimited trillions, at interest, to spend on ways to destroy your nation and your people? Like today in the ZUS of A.
It would seem to me, that in the case where the Treasury might need restraints, (as when it’s been co-opted by enemies) that money should be tied to gold, (or something that they can’t just conjure out of thin air), even if that restricts its fecundity, or creative power.
Yes? No?
Or ‘cavemen should not stick their noses in discussions way above their cave-heads?
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Rurik says:@Mefobills
Anybody with half an ounce of integrity
couldn’t help notice the idiom, and wonder as to its origins
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Mefobills says:@Carolyn Yeager
So predictable, John, and such a perfect example of what I’m trying to get across to whoever here can hear it. You state, “My book is above the level of what a normal white European 6th grader can do” and you name two people who you believe will impress. This proves nothing about the writing/thinking level of the content.
Would you two cut it out, and bury the hatchet?
A proper NAZI woman is to be subordinate to strong men. I get it that women have had to step up since the men are weak.
The same conditions that faced Nazi Germany, are facing America today. Essentially the same finance capitalist forces that pointed their daggers at Germany, are now “consuming the host.” Expanding debt claims must be paid, and the international creditor must stay in his catbird seat, and his oligarchy must not be threatened.
Part of the scheme is to drive a wedge between men and women. Women are then made to be unnatural because men become weak.
It takes a team, everybody has their role. The bad guys want us infighting. They want weak feminized men, and masculine women, along with broken families. Broken people are easier to lead around by the nose with propaganda and debt mechanics.
Here’s Goebbels:
Goebbels gave this speech on 18 March 1933 at the opening of a women’s exhibition in Berlin, only six weeks after Hitler came to power.
German women, German men!
It is a happy accident that my first speech since taking charge of the Ministry of Public Enlightenment and Propaganda is to German women. Although I agree with Treitschke that men make history, I do not forget that women raise boys to manhood. You know that the National Socialist movement is the only party that keeps women out of daily politics. This arouses bitter criticism and hostility, all of it very unjustified. We have kept women out of the parliamentary-democratic intrigues of the past fourteen years in Germany not because we do not respect them, but because we respect them too much. We do not see the woman as inferior, but rather as having a different mission, a different value, than that of the man. Therefore we believed that the German woman, who more than any other in the world is a woman in the best sense of the word, should use her strength and abilities in other areas than the man.
The woman has always been not only the man’s sexual companion, but also his fellow worker. Long ago, she did heavy labor with the man in the field. She moved with him into the cities, entering the offices and factories, doing her share of the work for which she was best suited. She did this with all her abilities, her loyalty, her selfless devotion, her readiness to sacrifice.
The woman in public life today is no different than the women of the past. No one who understands the modern age would have the crazy idea of driving women from public life, from work, profession, and bread winning. But it must also be said that those things that belong to the man must remain his. That includes politics and the military. That is not to disparage women, only a recognition of how she can best use her talents and abilities.
Looking back over the past years of Germany’s decline, we come to the frightening, nearly terrifying, conclusion that the less German men were willing to act as men in public life, the more women succumbed to the temptation to fill the role of the man. The feminization of men always leads to the masculinization of women. An age in which all great idea of virtue, of steadfastness, of hardness, and determination have been forgotten should not be surprised that the man gradually loses his leading role in life and politics and government to the woman.
….more at link above.
______
Stop the infighting. The woman has to acquiesce first, as they are subordinate in the hierarchy.
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Patrick McNally says:@Mefobills
> The living space thing was in Mein Kampf.
The aim of acquiring living space was the central goal of Hitler’s entire political career from 1919 to 1945. Let’s take some notice of Hitler’s speech of February 3, 1933:
—–
There are two possible ways of overcoming our desperate situation: firstly, seizing by force new markets for our production; secondly, obtaining new Lebensraum for our population surplus.* A peace-loving public will not stomach objectives like these. It will have to be prepared for them. Germany must recapture complete freedom of decision. This will not be feasible unless we first win political power. This is why my aim is to restore our political strength first…* Another general present, Curt Liebmann, noted his words thus: ‘We might fight for new export markets; or we might – and this would be better – conquer new Lebensraum in the east, and Germanise it ruthlessly.’
… The public has got to learn to think as a nation. This will weld it together. This cannot be done by persuasion alone, but only by force. Those who won’t agree must get their arms twisted. Our supreme commandment is to maintain our unity…
We must make all our economic and military preparations in secret, and only come out into the open when they are 100 percent complete. Then we will have regained the freedom of decision. . . Then we must decide: foreign markets, or colonies? I’m for colonies. . . One day the time will come when we can raise a mighty army …
—–
— David Irving, The War Path, pp. 28-9, 2013 edition.That was in the first month after taking power. Had plans changed by 1940?
—–
On Sunday, May 25, the Reichsführer SS outlined to Hitler and the head of his chancellery, Hans Lammers, proposals for dealing with the various racial strains in Poland. Himmler handed the Führer his six-page plan for screening the population of these new dominions for adults and children of sufficiently pure blood to allow their assimilation into Germany. He proposed that all other children should be taught only the necessary rudiments: ‘Simple counting up to five hundred, how to write their names, and lessons on the divine commandment to obey the Germans and be honest, industrious, and well-behaved.’ Racially acceptable children could be evacuated to the Reich to receive a proper education…A month later, Himmler took the opportunity of a train journey with Hitler to show him an eight-page plan for settling these eastern provinces with strong German stock. Himmler proposed that young unmarried German soldiers be induced to settle and work the land in the eastern provinces for up to eight years before marrying and taking over a farmstead or estate. The foreign labourers were to be kept in serfdom; attempts at sexual relations with their German overlords would be punishable by death. He afterward noted on the document: ‘The Führer said that every point I made was right.’
—–
— David Irving, Hitler’s War, pp. 123-4, 1977.What is really funny about this board is the way that one can simultaneously encounter effusive praises of David Irving as if he was some kind of high priest, while also seeing clear evidence that people have never either never bothered to read his works or else simply don’t take them seriously.
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Zarathustra says:@John Wear
You are wrong.
Hitler had nothing to do with Hess Flight to Scotland.• Thanks: Carolyn Yeager• Replies: @Carolyn YeagerAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
@John Wear
Of course you have no reply. I knew that when I posted it. After reading it over, I believe it may be the best, in the sense of ‘most perfect,’ comment I’ve ever posted.
My work speaks for itself.
Yes indeed. That’s what I’ve been saying all along — did you miss that? You miss so much, John, so much. But definitely, your work reveals who, what you are. It does for all of us. For those with no “work,” their comments reveal it. Nowhere to hide. Except through screen names.
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whew says:@Alden
and a point i missed in my first reply: it is unbelievable the claim you made, that the Holy Roman Emperor was also King of Bohemia, which is like claiming that the Holy Roman Emperor would also take on the role of all other electors, dukes, etc. no, the point is Bohemia had special privileges and its leader was the only king in the empire. your claim is ignorant. i hope you think this through.
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Mefobills says:
It would seem to me, that in the case where the Treasury might need restraints, (as when it’s been co-opted by enemies) that money should be tied to gold, (or something that they can’t just conjure out of thin air), even if that restricts its fecundity, or creative power.
Yes? No?
Or ‘cavemen should not stick their noses in discussions way above their cave-heads?
I refuse to talk down to cavemen, especially if they are honestly searching for answers. And besides, the searching for answers is not caveman anyway. The people I do take on, usually have some sort of personality defect. They fly off into hysterics when I confront them.
Speaking of defect, there is only one personality type suitable for manning the levers of power. There is always hierarchy, and the gold-bugs want to dismiss this fact. Anything complex is hierarchical. Plato long ago told us who this personality type is.
Benjamin Franklin thought he could find the right personalities with his Juntos. His experience taught him that man could rule himself. But, he ignored that some of the Juntos elsewhere that went bad, e.g. the Essex Junto. Read Franklin’s biography if you can. It’s dangerous to ignore things.
Also, during the constitutional convention, Franklin had gout, and had to be carried around on a stretcher. He wasn’t alert enough with Bills of Credit were erased and not transmitted into the new Constitution.
Franklin used Bills of Credit in his state bank in the Philadelphia Colony. Hitler used Bills of Credit to resurrect Germany. This is state money, issued by treasury, and it can be channeled. That means it can be aimed to do projects in accordance with state planning. Later it circulates and people use it to sell their goods and wares, at low friction, and low cost, not taking a tithe for its existence.
So, Franklin made a mistake. Hitler was searching for the right personality types, and he intended on the SS to find the right people for leadership.
Who is it that both Plato and Hitler wanted? They are called Stoics. They do not have Pleonexia. They give less than two shits about self-aggrandization, don’t care what other people think about them, and are basically philosopher kings. They do have empathy for others.
The two main examples of this type on the world scene today, are Putin and Xi.
If you do a youtube search, you will find videos on “Sigma Males.” This personality type DOES NOT WANT TO BE IN POWER. They do it only if they have to. Most likely Putin was compelled to do it when he saw Russia being collapsed in the 90’s, especially by the Jewish Oligarchy that had arisen and was taking over.
Franklin wanted Treasury money, a State Bank, and an armed population aiming their guns at the Treasury. He also wanted an educated population, hence the postal roads, and free press.
Nothing wrong with that, only Benjamin failed on finding the Sigma Philosopher kings and putting them into power. They have to be drag-netted as they are unwilling. Benjamin probably could not have foreseen the press being bought out and taken over by money power interests.
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Rurik says:@Mefobills
Stop the infighting.
I agree!
even as I might add, good luck with that particular interlocutor
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Mefobills says:@Patrick McNally
One of the tricks of liars, is that they make a claim up front, and then quickly move on, as if their claim is fact.
Here is you:
> The living space thing was in Mein Kampf._____________
The aim of acquiring living space was the central goal of Hitler’s entire political career from 1919 to 1945. Let’s take some notice of Hitler’s speech of February 3, 1933:
___________________Ron Unz, who is a truth seeker, has already sniffed you out as a PilPul spreader. Notice that I am a NAZI, and I am not hostile to all Jews, just as Hitler was not hostile. Some Jews are honest and awesome. Some other Jews are real pieces of shite.
Hitler’s goal was to in-gather the German speaking people, who had been scattered. Acquiring living space is blown all out of proportion by propagandists. There is no there there. Your whole world view hinges on this untruth, as if Hitler was some sort of raving lunatic. Everything about him was trying to peacefully develop national socialism, much as the Chinese are today. You probably also think the Chinese want to take over the world.
Bismarck’s goal before Hitler was to have low internal friction money and high tariffs, using List’s methods. Bismarck in-gathered the German people, who were then subsequently scattered by the Western Finance Class, via attacks in WW1.
Basically, Hitler wanted to undo the ravages of Versaille treaty, and the status quo brought on by WW1, which had turned Germans into debt slaves.
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Patrick McNally says:@John Wear
> A. J. P. Taylor evaluated Hitler’s motives: “… Hitler was acting against the Hungarians rather than against the Czechs.”
This is an instance where definitively in error. I had already brought up before the way that in August 1938, Germany pressured Hungary into abandoning its truce with Czechoslovakia, because Hitler wanted the Hungarians to be a source of pressure on the Czechs.
—–
But when he tried to bribe the Hungarians into promising outright support of his invasion of Czechoslovakia, he was disappointed. Hungary had been severely dismembered and disarmed after the World War, losing slabs of territory to all her neighbours – Romania, Yugoslavia and Czechoslovakia. But a flamboyant week-long state visit by the Hungarians, coupled with window-rattling military parades and the launching of a battlecruiser named Prinz Eugen in their honour, failed to extract more than conditional undertakings from their Regent, Admiral Nikolaus von Horthy…That day, 22 August, passed without incident until evening when the Forschungsamt, routinely monitoring the Hungarians’ telephone conversations between Kiel and Budapest, reported that at a meeting of foreign ministers of the Little Entente in faraway Bled the Hungarian delegation had apparently formally renounced all use of force against Czechoslovakia; the wiretaps showed that Horthy, Kánya and his prime minister, Bela von Imrédy, had retrospectively sanctioned this. This cast a cloud over the entire state visit.
The secret meetings which began the next day, during a sea trip to Heligoland, were stormy. In the morning Hitler conferred privately with Horthy, while Ribbentrop and Weizsäcker took on Imrédy and Kánya. Ribbentrop accused Kánya of stabbing Germany in the back with the Bled agreement, and refused to accept Kánya’s explanations.
— David Irving, The War Path, pp. 125-6, 2013 edition.This was all part of Hitler’s strategy to manufacture a Czech-Hungarian conflict which would enable him to intervene at the right moment.
—–
Over the next four weeks, the Nazi pressure on the Slovaks to declare independence increased. Keppler sent his close associate Dr. Edmund Veesenmayer to Bratislava to tell them to hurry, as “otherwise Hungary will get our permission to occupy Slovakia at any time after 15 March.” And when Durcansky and his economics minister visited Göring on 28 February, the field marshal sinisterly greeted them with: “Now, what’s it to be? When are you going to declare independence, so we don’t have to turn you over to the Hungarians!” Ribbentrop also received them with a promise to guarantee Slovakia’s frontiers, provided she proclaimed her independence at a time that suited the Führer.
—–
— Ibid, p. 186.It certainly is likely that, if Hitler had not stirred things up, one might have seen a more organic dissolution of Czechoslovakia a few years later in, say, 1941. But what happened in March 1939 was a prearranged coup engineered by Hitler.
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Ron Unz says:@Wizard of Oz
It is only the pleasure of boring it up some of UR’s crude, rude and raving lunatics that makes me suggest that Ron do indeed tell you that I am not Jewish. And if his interest in me or my ethnicity is so slight that he is not sure he can ask SS or JD and be sure.
WoZ isn’t Jewish. However, he’s rather gullible and pompous and has spent his entire long life totally immersed in our mainstream media portrayal of reality, which obviously has been very heavily shaped by Jewish activists. So his beliefs might be reasonably considered as constituting an extended phenotype of global Jewry.
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soll says:@Wokechoke
These conspiracy theorists allege that Nathan Rothschild had caused a crash on the London Exchange (the UK stock market) and eventually acquired the mass shares or consols in the Bank of England, thus ever since 1815 the Rothschild’s have secretly been controlling the world, through practically every central bank and of manipulating world history.
The only problem for this story, is that there was never a crash on the London Exchange in 1815 for any of these alleged outcomes to have taken place. The conspiracy industry is largely dependent upon this story being true.
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Mefobills says:@Carolyn Yeager
For those with no “work,” their comments reveal it. Nowhere to hide. Except through screen names.
I recommend that John Wear start ignoring you.
A proper NAZI woman is demure and feminine.
Are you ignoring Goebbels instructions to you and other proper NAZI women?
People that use screen names don’t automatically give you moral superiority over them. That is you self-aggrandizing.
Women can contribute to the conversation, but don’t be a harpee. Young men are watching and they are confused about reality, and when they see this sort of behavior from a Nazi woman, they instinctively find it abhorrent.
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soll says:@annamaria
This alleged Solzhenitsyn quote was invented by “Dr.” David Duke, who created the online meme that his international bestseller (French/Russian) editions of ‘Two Hundred Years Together’ with over 2 million copies sold is according to Duke, a “banned” and “surpressed” book. Ironically in Chapter 14 of this book, Solzhenitsyn actually contradicts David Duke’s hoax quote by stating how neither the Russian Revolutions of 1905/1917 were led by “the Jews.” Solzhenitsyn himself is not creditable, the quote though is bunkem.
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John Wear says:@Mefobills
You write: “Would you two cut it out, and bury the hatchet?”
My response: Yes. I am ceasing all communications with Carolyn Yeager, both now and in the future.
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Patrick McNally says:@Mefobills
> Schiff and the Bolsheviks installed a Wall Street Bank, to then extract from the prostrate Russians.
That’s your deranged fantasy. Jacob Schiff died on September 25, 1920. In 1922 the company of Kuhn, Loeb accepted the reality of the Bolshevik victory and began looking for new relations.
—–
Kahn, the American Warburg brothers, their German siblings, and Dr. Karl Melchior, another partner in M. M. Warburg and Company, all tried to argue that if the Allies did not treat Germany leniently and extend financial aid to Europe, Bolshevism might well win control of all of Europe, particularly Germany. After the First World War, particularly during the 1920s, Paul Warburg, now chairman of the International Acceptance Bank, and his former partners in Kuhn, Loeb were among those American bankers most committed to American participation in efforts to revive Europe’s devastated economy and restore financial and political stability. They called for the reduction or cancellation of reparations and war debts, took part in the Dawes Loan and other loans intended to facilitate European economic recovery, and extended numerous credits for the purchase of American goods, particularly favoring German-based enterprises. In these endeavors they often worked closely with M. M. Warburg and Company as well as other European banks.Yet by the 1920s, when Kuhn, Loeb’s efforts to revive the European economy were at their height, the partners’ fears of the spread of communism had largely dissipated. By 1922 Kahn felt that Bolshevism no longer appreciably threatened Eastern and Central Europe.
—–
— Priscilla Roberts, “Jewish Bankers, Russia, and the Soviet Union, 1900-1840: The Case of Khn, Loeb and Company,” American Jewish Archives Journal, Volume 49, Numbers 1 & 2, p. 26.The myth of Jacob Schiff as an alleged “Bolshevik banker” has been one of the most retarded enduring Right-wing lies of the last century. It’s the kind of silly fantasy which survives in small crackpot quarters inhabited by clowns who never try to look anything up.
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Patrick McNally says:@Haxo Angmark
So, are you saying that the Jewish wives of Dzerzhinsky and Bukharin were plotting against Trotsky and Zinoviev, among others? That’s the only way that your bit of crackpottery could have any coherence.
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Rurik says:@Mefobills
cavemen, especially if they are honestly searching for answers.
thanks, I am
The people I do take on,
I like what you said about infighting, and how it’s counter productive. I like TruthV, and even appreciate his humor, and have learned from him. There are a lot of people here with a lot of perspectives and personalities. I’ve seen a lot of people I like and respect, have issues with others, whom I also respect. People like Andrew Anglin or Priss, can be off-putting to certain others, and I also am not always appreciative of their particular prose, but I find what I can of value, no matter the source. If there is disagreement, then I’d just prefer to see less rancor, from all the people who’re here in good faith.
Not that I’m any kind of paragon of aloof poise, that is for certain! I too have been driven to intemperance, (even if I’d say so by bad actors, but wouldn’t we all?).
So thank you for your erudite and thoughtful reply. I continue to learn from you, and from others, like TruthV, who is a Ron Paul fan, as am I.
Perhaps there is something amiss to that, and in a conversation dedicated to specifics, it could be beneficial, all around. If there’s a reason to repudiate some of Dr. Paul’s positions, then in every and all cases, I prefer to know the truth. Come what may.
But I have admired Paul’s integrity and principles for a very long time now, and even if he might be in error on some matter(s), I still would wince at attacks on his character.
I wonder if he too, isn’t along the lines of the stoics, you mention. He certainly doesn’t come across like a vain man, but (as it seems to me) a true patriot who loves the nation of his birth, loves the principles of liberty and accountability, and chaffs at seeing it all depraved and destroyed by the moneyed elites and their serial wars, always based on lies.
I think Dr. Paul and yourself, have more in common, than at odds, if push should came to shove.
No, he would not be down for fascism, at least yet, but my take on fascism is it doesn’t resonate, until there is a dire existential threat. Like when the Comanches are attacking the wagon train, then there isn’t a lot of room for debate on what to do. When the wagon master tosses you a gun, and says protect the flank, you don’t balk. This is the situation Germany faced vis-a-vis the Bolshevik menace, and so the imperative to support the Nazi cause, was self-evident.
I’m not sure we’re there yet, but the problem is, by the time most people are aware that we are, it will be too late.
Sorry to bloviate so, but it is my wont.
Thanks again for your patience with my cave-mind. It is primitive, but sincere.
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Wielgus says:@Wielgus
Sounds possible. I have read such diary entries. But I squeezed into a Lancaster once on the ground, at an air show. These boys had very little room, though of course the Lancaster was British. Descriptions of the Sperry turret suggest nobody was going to do any writing in it, especially right over the target.
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Truthor says:
Excellent article. Two authors which are de rigeur for those studying actual history instead of the fake history foisted upon us are Viktor Suvorov and David L. Hoggan.
Suvorov’s Icebreaker and The Real Culprit document Soviet Russia’s role. David Hoggan in his The Forced War: When Peaceful Revision Failed documents, from diplomatic correspondence, Britain’s, France’s and America’s role in setting up and kicking off World War II.
In this regard I might also note a small book by Bro. Michael of Christ entitled Blessed Adolf Hitler: Saviour of Europe – Confessor and Martyr which documents the religious aspects of the war.
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@Zarathustra
You are right, but I guess you don’t have the kind of evidence to put this issue to bed once and for all. (Not that probably any evidence, no matter how good, would do that for the die-hards.) I did bring some that was very good, but it was ignored.
I’ve just made a decision that since interest in this secret flight is still high and so divided, I will write an article at my own web site, carolynyeager.net, on this subject, and see what commenting it brings. Of course, comment writing and reading is not as easy there as here, but one can’t have everything. Also, comments are moderated, but only on genuineness, as in being from real people with a modicum of decency.
This also coincides with my wishing an alternative for myself because I enjoy the back and forth of commenting and debate. As I’ve always found, if I want something done to my liking, I have to do it myself.
I will announce it here when my article is posted. Be patient, it won’t happen overnight.
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John Wear says:@Patrick McNally
You write: “But what happened in March 1939 was a prearranged coup engineered by Hitler.”
My response: In my opinion, what happened in March 1939 was a prearranged plan on the part of Britain to start a war with Germany.
Neville Chamberlain originally explained in the House of Commons on March 15, 1939 that Germany had no obligation to consult Great Britain in dealing with the Czech-Slovak crisis. The British government had also never fulfilled its promise to guarantee the Czech state after the Munich Agreement. Chamberlain stated that the Slovak declaration of independence on March 14, 1939 put an end by internal disruption to the Czech state, and therefore the British guarantee to preserve the integrity of Czechoslovakia was no longer binding. (Source: Hoggan, David L., The Forced War: When Peaceful Revision Failed, Costa Mesa, Cal., Institute for Historical Review, 1989, p. 252).
Chamberlain declared in the House of Commons: “With that [the breaking up of Czechoslovakia from the inside], a situation has ceased to exist which His Majesty’s government has always regarded as temporary.” (Source: Walendy, Udo, Truth for Germany: The Guilt Question of the Second World War, Washington, D.C.: The Barnes Review, 2013, pp. 124-125).
Chamberlain concluded, “Let us remember that the desire of all the peoples of the world still remains concentrated on the hopes of peace.” (Source: Smith, Gene, The Dark Summer: An Intimate History of the Events That Led to World War II, New York: Macmillan, 1987, p. 132).
British Foreign Minister Lord Halifax now began to take control of British policy toward Germany. Halifax informed Chamberlain that his speech of March 15, 1939 was unacceptable. President Roosevelt was also highly critical of Chamberlain’s speech. Two days later, on March 17, 1939, Chamberlain revealed the first sign of a major shift in British policy toward Germany. In a speech in his home city of Birmingham, Chamberlain charged Hitler with “a flagrant breach of personal faith.” Chamberlain presented himself as the victim of German duplicity, and stated that he would never be able to believe Hitler again. Chamberlain asked rhetorically if this was a step by Hitler to attempt to dominate the world by force. (Source: Buchanan, Patrick J., Churchill, Hitler, and the Unnecessary War, New York: Crown Publishers, 2008, pp. 252-253).
Halifax expressed his hostile views concerning Germany’s occupation of Prague to German Ambassador Herbert von Dirksen on March 15, 1939. Halifax claimed that Hitler had unmasked himself as a dishonest person, and that German policy implied a rejection of good relations with Great Britain. Halifax insisted that Germany was “seeking to establish a position in which they could by force dominate Europe, and, if possible, the world.” Halifax stated that he could understand Hitler’s taste for bloodless victories, but he promised the German diplomat that Hitler would be forced to shed blood the next time. (Source: Hoggan, David L., The Forced War: When Peaceful Revision Failed, Costa Mesa, Cal.: Institute for Historical Review, 1989, pp. 252, 297).
The reports which German Ambassador Dirksen sent to Berlin during the next several days indicate that he was considerably shaken by the menacing British reaction to the latest Czech crisis. The entire German Embassy staff was dismayed by the events of March 1939. Ambassador Dirksen recognized the importance of an Anglo-German understanding, and he became almost incoherent with grief when confronted with the collapse of his diplomatic efforts. The British had allowed the impression that the future of Bohemia was a matter of complete indifference to them. Then the British hypocritically turned around and declared that the events in Bohemia had convinced them that Hitler was seeking to conquer the world. No wonder the German diplomats in London were in despair. (Source: Ibid., p. 297).
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Truthor says:@Carlton Meyer
William Bullitt told David Hoggan that there was a secret alliance concluded between the U.S. and USSR in 1933 when Roosevelt recognized the Soviet Regime. Roosevelt wanted to divide the world between a Red U.S. and the Soviet Union.
Churchill thought he was the main partner of Roosevelt, but found out after doing Roosevelt’s bidding that Stalin was Roosevelt’s main partner and one of Roosevelt’s main goals was to destroy the British Empire. So first England was used to start the World War, after the cat’s paw Poland kicked off the Germano-Polish war, and then British Imperialism sought to destroy France’s empire. Quite a multi-layered nest of treason with Germany ultimately blamed for it all.
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Mefobills says:@soll
These conspiracy theorists allege that Nathan Rothschild had caused a crash on the London Exchange (the UK stock market) and eventually acquired the mass shares or consols in the Bank of England, thus ever since 1815 the Rothschild’s have secretly been controlling the world, through practically every central bank and of manipulating world history.
This is called A-Priori logic. A-Priori people create a theory, then they go around looking for examples to verify their theory. It is basically a form of fraud, because they are not truth seeking, instead they are ideologues.
Libertarians are famous A-Priori people. A theory is made up, and any sort of contrary evidence is ignored, or waved away, or excused in some fashion. I find a fair number of Jews to be in this camp as well. It amounts to “who me?” I’m pure as the driven snow.
The above about Rothschild is basically saying that private capital is not running the Western World. That there is no such thing as a corporatocracy. Don’t believe your lying eyes.
Well I do believe what my eyes tell me, and there is something rotten.
Oxfam did a scientific analysis of all the linked corporations in the western world, and the top controlling corporations are all finance corporations. This is the definition of a corporatocracy.
So, it really doesn’t matter whether it is Rothschild or not, it is a hidden creditor class of stock owners, hiding out in the finance markets.
Hudson already did an important analysis on this, which Ron posted.
https://www.unz.com/mhudson/beyond-the-dollar/
The core of all international power structures of the ‘capitalist mode of foreign relations’ (Van der Pijl 2014) lies in the international monetary system – what James Steuart called ‘the money of the world’ in 1767, referring to the means by which countries settle their trade or financial imbalances among one another. The domination the US sought to exert was no different. At its heart lay the dollar-denominated international financial system that we call the Dollar Creditocracy. It has undergirded the dollar’s world role since the early 1970s and its unravelling leads the denouement of US power.
Before the dollar creditocracy, was the Sterling Creditocracy centered on London. And yes, Rothschild was involved.
FDR wrestled much of the finance capitalist “world creditor” position away from London after WW2, mostly by making London pay for Lend Lease.
Hudson has also explained how the “deep pools of capital” that first formed in the Low Lands, took over as the new Sovereign. This capital was the sinews of war, and it centered on the democracies. This capital jumped to London with BOE by 1694, and then to Wall Street by several intrigues.
Hobson took note too, long before Hudson was born; Hobson also noticed who the real rulers are:
https://oll.libertyfund.org/titles/hobson-imperialism-a-study
The key concepts are laid out in Part I of Chapter IV: “Economic Parasites of Imperialism”
“By far the most important economic factor in Imperialism is the influence relating to investments.”
….
“If, contemplating the enormous expenditure on armaments, the ruinous wars, the diplomatic audacity of knavery by which modern Governments seek to extend their territorial power, we put the plain, practical question, Cui bono? the first and most obvious answer is, The investor.”….
“Investors who have put their money in foreign lands, upon terms which take full account of risks connected with the political conditions of the country, desire to use the resources of their Government to minimize these risks, and so to enhance the capital value and the interest of their private investments.”….
“If the special interest of the investor is liable to clash with the public interest and to induce a wrecking policy, still more dangerous is the special interest of the financier, the general dealer in investments. In large measure the rank and file of the investors are, both for business and for politics, the cat’s-paws of the great financial houses, who use stocks and shares not so much as investments to yield them interest, but as material for speculation in the money market. In handling large masses of stocks and shares, in floating companies, in manipulating fluctuations of values, the magnates of the Bourse find their gain. These great businesses—banking, broking, bill discounting, loan floating, company promoting—form the central ganglion of international capitalism.
_____________Going back even further to Aristotle:
https://michael-hudson.com/2011/12/democracy-and-debt/
Book V of Aristotle’s Politics describes the eternal transition of oligarchies making themselves into hereditary aristocracies – which end up being overthrown by tyrants or develop internal rivalries as some families decide to “take the multitude into their camp” and usher in democracy, within which an oligarchy emerges once again, followed by aristocracy, democracy, and so on throughout history.
A good tyrant emerges, and takes the multitudes into his camp, especially by releasing debts. The tyrant becomes a new King, which is followed by democracy (due to idiot princes), and so on.
(Notice how the word Tyrant has been inverted from its original meaning? Tyrants are good.)
A king system can last for thousands of years if they learn how to release debts and not allow idiot sons to destroy things. They also have to be tyrants and smash wannabe oligarchs.
The important thing is for the King to be a Stoic, who loves his people, and the money of the realm be the King’s sovereign Talley, or King’s debt.
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Truthor says:@Anonymous
David Hoggan, author of The Forced War, goes into this in his other books such as The Blind Century.
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Rurik says:@Ron Unz
WoZ isn’t Jewish.
So his beliefs might be reasonably considered as constituting an extended phenotype of global Jewry.
it could be that that is even worse than if he were Jewish..
a David French, John McCain, Mitt Romney, Liz Cheney, George Will of sorts, only far less articulate.
But I will take your word for it, if you say he’s not Jewish.
Ok lizard, you’re off the hook on that one. It seems there was at least something you weren’t duplicitous about, (so I was apparently wrong about that, for the record). But it only makes the lizard look even worse, if that’s possible.
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Patrick McNally says:@Mefobills
> One of the tricks of liars, is that they make a claim up front, and then quickly move on,
That’s quite some lying by you. I didn’t “move on” to anything. I simply proceeded to cite passages where first Hitler and then Hitler and Himmler discussed the basic aim of colonizing territories to gain living space.
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soll says:@soll
Cont.
Solzhenitsyn contradicts Duke’s hoax quote in Chapters 9 and 14 of ‘Two Hundred Years’ #9 had been translated into English and included in Mahoney’s, and Ericson, Jr’s ‘The Solzhenitsyn Reader’ (2006). ‘Two Hundred Years’Together’ unlike Duke’s nonsense of being suppressed is expected for English release in 2024, which Solzhenitsyn himself had originally requested following the completion of his main work, ‘The Red Wheel’ a 6,000 page tome.
No conspiracy to censor was ever required. This online meme was created by David Duke in 2013 used before his own book, ‘The Secret Behind Communism’ (2013) was published–intentionally Duke invented this quote merely to help crowd fund his own books’ publication.
In Two Hundred Years Together, Solzhenitsyn emphatically denies (in Chapters 9 and 14) that the Russian revolutions of 1905 and 1917 were the result of a “Jewish conspiracy” (just as he had earlier forcefully criticized the extreme nationalists who were and are obsessed with Freemasons and Jews—see, e.g., Russia in Collapse, Chapter 25, “The Maladies of Russian Nationalism”).
https://www.solzhenitsyncenter.org/s/_200_-Introduction-Chaps-891516.pdf
https://www.solzhenitsyncenter.org/his-writings/large-works-and-novels/two-hundred-years-together
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Mefobills says:@Rurik
But I have admired Paul’s integrity and principles for a very long time now, and even if he might be in error on some matter(s), I still would wince at attacks on his character.
You nailed it. Libertarians are some of the most moral people around. There is no question that Ron Paul has integrity.
That is why the ideology was invented, to snare moral people and then put them into a cul-de-sac of bad thought. Ron Paul is not an economic historian, he just grabbed onto a theory that resonated with him.
The most important best type of people are then sidelined as their brains become locked with propaganda.
Gold isn’t money, and it isn’t a panacea. Libertarians also make up all kinds of definitions.
Hudson wrote a book, J is for Junk economics, because the definitions got out of hand. Changing word meanings is an excellent method for the creditor class to hide in plain site. The book had to be written, because people just talk past each other, as they don’t know what the definitions are. A good reason TV doesn’t understand me, is because he doesn’t even know certain concepts.
Libertarians, although they mean well, are dupes who have been sidelined. When they go about recruiting for more dupes, it is analogous to the enemy winning. We don’t need any more highly moral people to get snared and sidelined.
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Patrick McNally says:@John Wear
> In my opinion, what happened in March 1939 was a prearranged plan on the part of Britain to start a war with Germany.
> Neville Chamberlain originally explained in the House of Commons on March 15, 1939
A prearranged plan would have to be made long in advance of March 15, 1939. That was what Hitler did. He first pressed the Hungarians to drop their effort to reach an agreement with Prague in August 1938, since he wanted Hungarian pressure of Benes. Then in early 1939 he began calling in the Slovaks and threatening them that unless they declared prompt independence from Prague, he would back Hungary against them. While he had the Slovaks backed into a corner with this, he called in Hacha and started working on him. The whole thing was contrived. There probably would have occurred an eventual break-up of Czechoslovakia within a couple years anyway, but this was not some spontaneous event.
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@Mefobills
Well, knock me over with a feather once again. After coming on to me about treasury bills & bills of credit, and not getting the reception I suppose you expected, you now transform into a “Nazi” leader who is bringing order to his charges. LOL, as though John Wear is anything close to a “Nazi.” You are hilarious.
Let me tell you where you’re most mistaken. You’re appealing to me as a NAZI woman. I am not a “NAZI woman.” And you are not a NAZI man bc there is no such thing as a NAZI except in your dreams. I am a German woman, but you are not a German man. You can’t speak to me about Germans, such as Hitler, Goebbels, etc. since you are not German yourself, and I am.
And what’s more, the Goebbels’ article you quote from never once mentions ‘Nazis’ — either men or women. It speaks of and to GERMAN women. And of GERMAN men, only. That’s how the National Socialists spoke. That leaves you out. It leaves Wear out. So don’t ever come to preach or scold me about what a NAZI woman owes to a NAZI man bc you’re in dream world when you do.
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Mefobills says:@Patrick McNally
> One of the tricks of liars, is that they make a claim up front, and then quickly move on,
That’s quite some lying by you. I didn’t “move on” to anything. I simply proceeded to cite passages where first Hitler and then Hitler and Himmler discussed the basic aim of colonizing territories to gain living space.
And you so conveniently leave out that German’s had been historically living in that space.
Ron even mentions it in this very article! How tone deaf are you? Hitler’s fears came to pass.
the organized expulsions of ethnic Germans from Silesia, the Sudatenland, East Prussia, and various other parts of Central and Eastern Europe where they had peacefully lived for many centuries, with the total number of such expellees generally estimated at 13 to 15 million. Families were sometimes given as little as ten minutes to leave the homes in which they had resided for a century or more, then forced to march off on foot, sometimes for hundreds of miles, towards a distant land they had never seen, with their only possessions being what they could carry in their own hands. In some cases, any surviving menfolk were separated out and shipped off to slave-labor camps, thereby producing an exodus consisting solely of women, children, and the very elderly. All estimates were that at least a couple million perished along the way, from hunger, illness, or exposure.
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Mefobills says:@Carolyn Yeager
Being a harpee is not what Goebbels wanted for German women.
You have entered into the political arena, which Goebbels did not want for German women.
Goebbels did warn that it was unnatural for women to enter into the political arena.
Basically, men are turned off by masculine women, especially harpees. It is a deep seated instinctual revulsion. Are you listening? Deep seated revulsion.
Your approach should not be as a smart ass, “like knock me over with a feather, or trying to demean others, with all of the various tricks you have evidenced.”
These are all moral failings on your part. Just be demure and list facts, don’t go around being combative. The men can combat, not the women – it is not your role.
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Ron Unz says:@Patrick McNally
The myth of Jacob Schiff as an alleged “Bolshevik banker” has been one of the most retarded enduring Right-wing lies of the last century. It’s the kind of silly fantasy which survives in small crackpot quarters inhabited by clowns who never try to look anything up.
Well, in 1949, a leading NYC newspaper columnist reported that: “Today it is estimated by Jacob’s grandson, John Schiff, that the old man sank about 20,000,000 dollars for the final triumph of Bolshevism in Russia.”
So maybe the “rightwing crackpots” believe that Jacob Schiff funded the Bolsheviks because his own grandson said he did. Keep in mind that $20M back then would have been roughly the roughly the equivalent of $2 billion in today’s money.
Obviously, it’s very possible that the younger Schiff got some of his family story garbled. For example, it’s likely that the $20M includes not only Schiff’s own personal contribution but also the funds he raised from his wealthy Jewish friends as well. And it’s also very plausible that the total includes what he spent over a period of decades, prior to the 1905 Revolution as well as the 1917 Revolution, and not only on the Bolsheviks, but also on all sorts of other Russian revolutionary groups trying to overthrow the Czar, such as the money he gave to Trotsky before Trotsky became a Bolshevik.
But your willingness to simply ignore all this direct personal testimony simply proves once again that you’re just a dishonest shill.
https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-the-bolshevik-revolution-and-its-aftermath/
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JohnnyWalker123 says:@Malla
This is interesting.
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Truthor says:@Bankotsu
“There is some debate as to whether Poland planned a pre emptive strike against Germany in 1933 in order to overthrow the Nazi regime.”
Churchill characterized Poland as a hyena state. The Poles had massive egos and sought desparately to be a “Great Power” – as such they sought to aggrandize themselves against anyone weaker than they while the “getting was good”.
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John Wear says:@Patrick McNally
You write: “A prearranged plan would have to be made long in advance of March 15, 1939.”
My response: In my opinion, Britain had a prearranged plan before March 15, 1939, and continued this plan after March 15, 1939.
War propaganda against Germany began to intensify from Great Britain in late November 1938, when the British press reported rumors that Germany was massing troops in preparation for an invasion of Czechoslovakia. These false rumors originated from London. Anthony Eden, who had opposed the Munich Agreement, was sent to the United States by British Foreign Secretary Edward Frederick Lindley Wood (Lord Halifax) in December 1938 to spread rumors about malign German plans. U.S. President Franklin Roosevelt responded with a provocative and insulting warning to Germany in his message to Congress on January 4, 1939. (Source: Hoggan, David L., The Forced War: When Peaceful Revision Failed, Costa Mesa, Cal.: Institute for Historical Review, 1989, pp. 235, 241).
Lord Halifax secretly circulated rumors both at home and abroad which presented the foreign policy of Hitler in the worst possible light. On January 24, 1939, Halifax sent a message to President Roosevelt in which he claimed to have received “a large number of reports from various reliable sources which throw a most disquieting light on Hitler’s mood and intentions.” Halifax claimed that Hitler had recently planned to establish an independent (of the Soviet Union) Ukraine, and that Hitler intended to destroy the Western nations in a surprise attack before he moved against the East. Halifax further claimed that not only British intelligence, but also “highly placed Germans who are anxious to prevent this crime” had furnished evidence of this evil conspiracy. These claims were all lies. Hitler did not have the remotest intention at the time of attacking in the East or any Western country. (Source: Ibid., p. 240).
Halifax after March 15, 1939, sought a broader basis than the Czech crisis to justify Britain’s belligerence toward Germany. Virgil Tilea, the Romanian Minister to Great Britain, was recruited by Halifax to make false charges against Germany. Tilea was carefully coached for his role by Sir Robert Vansittart, Great Britain’s vehemently anti-German chief diplomatic advisor. On March 17, 1939, Tilea issued a carefully crafted public statement which charged that Germany was seeking to obtain control of the entire Romanian economy. Tilea further claimed that Germany had issued an ultimatum that terrified Romanian leaders. These false accusations were published by the major British newspapers. Millions of British-newspaper readers around the world were aghast at Hitler’s apparently unlimited appetite for conquest. Tilea’s false accusations produced anxiety and outspoken hostility toward Germany among the British public. (Source: Ibid., pp. 299-301).
The British minister to Romania, Reginald Hoare, contacted Halifax and proceeded to explain in detail the ridiculous nature of Tilea’s charges. Hoare stated that it was “so utterly improbable that the Minister of Foreign Affairs would not have informed me that an immediate threatening situation had developed here that I called on him as soon as your telegrams to Warsaw and Moscow had been deciphered. He told me that he was being inundated with enquiries regarding the report of a German ultimatum which had appeared in The Times and Daily Telegraph today. There was not a word of truth in it.” (Source: Ibid., p. 301).
Hoare naturally assumed that his detailed report would move Halifax to dismiss the false Tilea charges. Nothing of this sort occurred. Hoare was astonished when Halifax continued to express his faith in the authenticity of Tilea’s story after its falsehood had been exposed. The Tilea hoax was crucial to the development of Halifax’s policy of inciting hatred among the British public (and through it, the entire Anglosphere and much of world opinion) toward Germany. Halifax was not concerned with any adverse repercussions of the Tilea hoax in Romania. (Source: Ibid.)
Halifax had lied to the British public about German policy toward Czechoslovakia after the Munich Agreement, and he had lied to them about the alleged crisis in Romania. It was only by means of these palpable falsehoods that the British public had been stirred into a warlike mood. It was by these means that Halifax would be able to persuade the British public to support a foreign policy that was both dangerous and bereft of logic. (Source: Ibid., p. 341).
In conclusion, the “brutal violation of little, defenseless Czecho-Slovakia” by Germany was a falsehood which was ceaselessly pounded into the masses by the opinion-makers of the press. In reality, Dr. Emil Hácha traveled to Berlin of his own volition in order to prevent chaos from breaking out in Bohemia and Moravia, which was threatening to erupt unless the Reich government intervened. Germany’s protectorate of Czechoslovakia maintained peace in a region that was facing both internal disruption and potential conquest by neighboring countries. (Source: Walendy, Udo, Truth for Germany: The Guilt Question of the Second World War, Washington, D.C.: The Barnes Review, 2013, pp. 115, 127, 130).
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Truthor says:@Alden
You need to study your history a bit. The French stole Elsass and Lothringen (Alsace Lorraine) from Germany. Strasburg was a great German city prior to this theft by Louis XIV in 1681. The French greatly resented having to give up their ill-gotten gains.
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@saggy
I guess it wasn’t included because not 3 minutes it is already preaching falsities.
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Wokechoke says:@Mefobills
You’ve gotta get the theory right. And the facts. Rothschild wasn’t allowed to vote or sit in parliament. He was the guy who made sure gold coin got into the pocket of British soldiers during the peninsular war but he wasn’t that big a deal as speculator. He was a military contractor. His relative another Rothschild did provide George III with Hessian mercenaries in the 1770s as well. Like Prigozhin or Erik Prince. But this was against a country and General George Washington that was funded in large part by Haim Solomon and a networked bunch of Jews from the Pale.
Jews got immediate full citizenship first in the US states which the Episcopalian\Anglicans blocked in England until the 1860s, largely under the pressure of one of the Rothschilds.
Antisemites need to get the fucking facts straight for it to be possible to see how Jews do the subversions.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:
For what it’s worth, I think holocaust apologists seem unbelievably obtuse about the myriad lies and exaggerations, so obviously false and easily disproved, and yet they go on looking for the needle in the haystack that proves Hitler was the personification of pure evil.
Historians and scholars split hairs, thread needles, and nitpick about every detail. That’s what they do; it’s what they are supposed to do. And, it’s necessary.
But, how do you continue on in the face of so many lies? They reduce the deaths from 6 million every few years; they confess to replicating a gas chamber after claiming it was the original structure; they lie about apples thrown over the fence, then say it was true in their imagination, therefore they did not lie…how many lies get exposed before we get to say, odds are, they lie all the time about everything?
I watched Pollard say, on camera, America deserved to be betrayed because Americans did not do enough for Jews during the war. I also heard Spectre say Europe does not get to be Europe much longer. Ignatiev said whites need to be abolished. Amalek must be destroyed! America and Europe are Edom; destroy Edom! Their organized malice and treachery is everywhere.
And still, organized Jewry is defended. I appreciate what scholars do, but spending just a day or two listening to what Jews actually say tells you everything you need to know, more or less, about what Hitler was up to and why.
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Wokechoke says:@Mefobills
I think the shares/bonds in the national debt, or war debt, were called Omnium at the time of the battle of Waterloo.
Also I wouldn’t dispute that Rothschild family was a pernicious influence on the UK as he eventually managed to push parliament to enfranchise English Jewry by the late 1850s with full civil rights as fellow citizens. But this status had occurred elsewhere particularly in the new United States as early as 1776 anyway. The French Republic gave Jews full citizenship rights. The last hold out was probably Imperial Russia.
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Truth Warrior says:
Unz failed to mention anything regarding the bombing of Rotterdam, which precipitated the blitz.
And none of the 649 responders bothered to mention it either.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_bombing_of_Rotterdam
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Blitz
Sorry, I’m not going to bother to read or investigate anything else Unz has to say. This is complete poppycock…
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Wokechoke says:@Patrick McNally
Schiff was especially pernicious.
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@Mefobills
Well, first, Goebbels is not my master, is he? This is 2023 and I’m an American ethnic-German woman. Also, Goebbels was speaking of German women with German men. As I’ve already pointed out, you are not a German man, neither is John Wear or most of those who happen to be males, here. And you also made the point that a man has to BE a man first. National Socialist men were gentlemen… for the greatest part, anyway.
Do I want the males here to be “turned on” by me? No. As I said before, you’re living in your own dream world. You seem/sound like a refugee from Cesar Tort’s blog, West’s Darkest Hour. They’re in a real “Nazi” cult there. I’m sure you know.
John Wear has proved again and again that he lacks INTEGRITY, the very quality he believes he excels in. In fact, he excels in the “woman’s role” as you describe it: being demure, not being combative, and just listing facts. Sometimes the ‘roles’ are reversed like that, what can you do about it? You can do nothing. What is, is. I could tell you a lot of stories … but it’s best you just read my web sites and listen to my podcasts. I’m too intelligent to take a back seat to very average men.
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anarchyst says:@Tiptoethrutulips
It is laughable to observe the number of comments spouting the old propaganda canard: Germany=bad-Communist=good.
The “American History Channel” in the USA should be renamed the “American Hitler Channel” for all the falsehoods and propaganda that it portrays and disseminates about WW2, Germany and Adolf Hitler.
According to programs on the “American History Channel”, Hitler was a drug addict, impotent, riddled with syphilis and other STDs, yet possessed highly technical “superweapons”, possessed “alien technology”, advanced flight and anti-gravity technologies, and still could not “win” WW2.
Anyone with an open mind who watches the Hitler lies and fabrications on that channel can easily see that it is all BS, especially when the so-called “holocaust™” propaganda is inserted into just about all of these programming “gems”. The same old photos of emaciated typhus victim bodies due to the result of the camps infrastructure collapses, NOT “gas chambers” are constantly being paraded around to remind “us” how evil Hitler truly was. (Yeah, right).
Germany was much more advanced than even the USA of the time, hence “Operation Paperclip” commenced in which the USA snatched up Germany’s greatest scientific minds after the summation of WW2.
Looking at the big picture (which is usually ignored), the “German state” was attacked by the rest of the world, and held on to its principles for over 6 years, far longer than expected.
Hitler’s greatest “sin” was the monetization of labor (giving labor true “value”) and going against the Rothschild banks. Going against the jew-run banks made him “enemy #1”.
He also KNEW that there was a subset of Bolshevik jews who were fomenting communist revolution within Germany. Most people are unaware of the secret agreements that he had with the zionists to “encourage” jewish emigration to what was then known as Palestine. These agreements were celebrated by both the German government and the zionist leaders at the time. A commemorative coin was even issued to celebrate the agreement. THAT aspect of history is never mentioned on the “American Hitler Channel”.
When it comes to WW2, Germany, and even the Allies, the “American History Channel” is 99% propaganda and 1% truth.
If those of “the greatest generation” could see the jew-run world of today and what it has become, being jew-controlled, they would have thrown off their American uniforms and fought on the side of the Germans…• Thanks: TiptoethrutulipsAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Haxo Angmark says:@Patrick McNally
and in addition,
Hitler’s ghost
arranged the re-secession of Slovakia from the Bohemian Empire
when the Red Empire collapsed.
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Mefobills says:@Wokechoke
You’ve gotta get the theory right. And the facts. Rothschild wasn’t allowed to vote or sit in parliament.
SO WHAT!
Did it completely fly over you head, all of the posts that I made about “string pullers” being the investment class? Or what is called the Creditor Class? And yes, many of them are Jews, because Jews invented finance capitalism. Corporatocracy is rule from behind the scenes.
You completely did not read and comprehend. You have narrative built up in your brain, and are on a track, like a train running down the rails.
The PilPul is strong with these Jews (or spiritual jews – who can do no wrong!)
Head first into the concentration camp with you.
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Mefobills says:@Carolyn Yeager
Well, first, Goebbels is not my master, is he? This is 2023 and I’m an American ethnic-German woman.
Just as I expected the masculine woman does not want to take correction.
What part about “deep revulsion” don’t you get?
Men don’t like masculine women, it causes a deep revulsion. It is a genetic revulsion, something like involuntary vomit coming up into your mouth.
Do you really think you are going to get any male converts with your harpee ways? What actually will happen is that the men will be polite to you, but the vomit will come up into their mouth, and they will run in the opposite direction, away from you.
Goebbels was aiming for the Logos, or the natural order. The natural order for women is to at home baking cookies for her many grandchildren, and especially making sure her male heirs are fit to do battle in the world.
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Mefobills says:@Wokechoke
I think the shares/bonds in the national debt, or war debt, were called Omnium at the time of the battle of Waterloo.
I don’t care, but you do apparently.
The Bank of England was NOT brought into being by Rothschild.
The first debt spreading banks in Amsterdam, the Wissel banks also were not Rothschild.
The first debt spreading banks had to include the invention of double entry ledgers, and it needed Jewish gold and silver to partially back up the privatering credit emission.
The Jewish gold and silver was won at usury (a sin) on the Haibaru caravan routes over thousands of years, long before Rothschild.
The Aiparu/Haibaru merchant class, has been at this game for a very long time. It was this same Haibaru merchant class that was secretly funding the Pharisee class, and maneuvering to get rid of the Jubilee. It was this same class that funded the Talmud into being.
Jewish creditors broke the covenant, and have been anti-life for some time now. It was Hillel, and his Prozbul clause, which then allowed the predator creditors (top jews) put little jews into perpetual bondage. It was only a hop and a skip to do it to non jewish out-groups.
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Si1ver1ock says:
I guess one of the problems with “everything I think I know” being wrong is that it’s more tempting to just give up than to learn a whole new history.
Maybe history is simply unknowable or ineffable.
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Rurik says:@Mefobills
I used to be a Libertarian, or at least belong to the party, for a short period, until I found out the party was for open borders, and I quite, forthwith. I also don’t agree with them vis-a-vis tariffs, I like some tariffs.
Rand Paul is apparently a self-described “constitutional conservative” and a “libertarian conservative.”
These are his so-called positions, albeit though the sieve of ((Wiki))
I agree with most of them, but certainly not all.
Federal Reserve
For his presidential campaign, he stated that he wanted to audit the Federal Reserve.[8] Paul opposes the Federal Reserve Act of 1913 and the Federal Reserve’s control of the money supply and interest rates, has advocated allowing the free market to regulate interest rates, and supports Congress’ constitutional role in controlling the money supply. Paul endorses the Federal Reserve Transparency Act, a bill originally introduced by his father as HR 1207 and reintroduced in the 114th US Congress as S 264 (by Sen. Paul),[9] and as HR 24 (by Rep. Thomas Massie),[10] mandating an audit of the Federal Reserve.[11] Paul has also expressed support for abolition of the Federal Reserve.[12][13]
[my emphais]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_positions_of_Rand_Paul
Would you say Rand Paul’s thinking (brain) has been snared and sidelined, and his stated agendas a cul-de-sac?
Gold isn’t money,
Well, I know when I have a few spare bucks, I buy some. I buy it as a store of value. I don’t trust the stock market, and so if I’m not in a position to buy Real Estate, I buy gold or silver.
Once when I didn’t have enough cash to buy some Real Estate, I cashed in some silver, (bought at around $22 an ounce, and sold for about $30. Now it’s at about $24.)
It’s true I wasn’t able to use the silver as legal tender, as the transaction was in Florida, and Florida is not one of the six states that allow gold and silver as legal tender. Not yet, anyways.
But as a store of value, I was happy with silver’s performance. How has silver and gold performed against money, in the last two hundred, (or twenty years)?
At the end of the day, it’s real life that we yokels have to live in, and for my money, (as the expression goes) I prefer gold and silver, at least for a long term store of value.
he doesn’t even know certain concepts.
I couldn’t say. Your conversations become to contentious for me, but as far as ‘down to earth, real life, rubber hits the road’, I like gold and silver, even if they aren’t legal tender in my state yet, or considered to be money, based on esoteric criteria that are a bit too arcane for your typical working class lout, (moi)
The Unz Review attracts lots of very smart people, with lots of expertise in various disciplines. And that’s one of its charms, to be sure. But there are also a lot of lurkers and others who’re just looking for some good common sense, and advise, and viewpoint other than the lies and kosher horseshit we all get from the media and government outlets, like the universities and other dens of iniquity, (whorehouses, as I see them ; )
So hopefully, even from the great unwashed, even humble Rurik can offer something to the conversation.
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Mefobills says:@Rurik
I couldn’t say. Your conversations become to contentious for me, but as far as ‘down to earth, real life, rubber hits the road’, I like gold and silver, even if they aren’t legal tender in my state yet, or considered to be money, based on esoteric criteria that are a bit too arcane for your typical working class lout, (moi)
Go ahead and stack, I recommend it. Gold is an asset class, that can fetch money. If you make it the money of the realm, then very bad things can happen. This is the verdict of history, not me just making claims. I can back it up if you ask, but, my time is limited.
Monetary history is no longer taught in skoools, so economists know not of what they speak. Most of them are not able to give you decent advice, because they don’t know themselves.
It was actually Dennis Kucinich, who happens to be good friends with Ron Paul, that was much closer to the mark.
HR2990 would have been much better. This is what I mean libertarianism sidelining people. I’m hoping that Ron bothered to learn, but sometimes when you hold deep convictions it is just too hard to unlearn.
There was a study done by a group in England. They sent a questionnaire to Parliamentarians, and asked them, “where does money come from?” None of the parliamentarians got it right.
I’m contentious because I want to save young men from a lifetime of despair. If they have bad narratives in their heads, then it is very hard for them to navigate life. Our world, issues false narratives constantly, which is why it is called clown world.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Mefobills
After I wrote:
‘The present Fiat Monetary system, whereby the Zionist Usury Banking Cartel owns the Federal Reserve and either owns or controls the other major western central banks’,
MoFo-Bill responded with:All money is fiat you retard, and always has been. This is why you are dangerous and should be banned.
In the MODERN VERNACULAR, ‘Fiat Money’ means currency BACKED BY NOTHING.
Undoubtedly you’ll be able to dig up some stodgy old economics textbook that defines Fiat Money are ‘Money by Decree’, as in by the decree of the King, Emperor, parliament or some Politburo.
In other words, by the decree of the King, henceforth gold and silver shall be money or alternatively freshly conjured greenbacks shall be deemed to be money etc.Now MoFo, we’ve had this same conversation on NUMEROUS other occasions and the definition of ‘Fiat Money’ as it is used in the modern vernacular (not just by laymen, but by financial experts and reputable economists – that excludes the know-nothing Michael Hudson), has been comprehensively explained to you.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@anarchyst
“If those of “the greatest generation” could see the jew-run world of today and what it has become, being jew-controlled, they would have thrown off their American uniforms and fought on the side of the Germans…“
My grandfather was a WW2 veteran. He said exactly that.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Wokechoke
Choke, I clicked onto the first link you supplied and it just focuses on the profits that the economist David Ricardo made in the wake of the Battle of Waterloo.
Your article MAKES NO MENTION whatsoever of any losses alleged to have been sustained by Nathan Rothschild.
So, I ask you once again, can you forward the source that claims ‘Rothschild lost his fortune’ as you posted in comment # 554 ?Pretty much all the reputable sources state that Nathan Mayer Rothschild multiplied his wealth many fold due to machinations over the outcome of the Battle of Waterloo.
Even Zio controlled Wikipedia, known for minimising and downplaying Jewish financial malfesance, had this to say about Rothschild during the Battle of Waterloo:
Georges Marie Mathieu-Dairnvaell, authored a work entitled Histoire édifiante et curieuse de Rothschild Ier, Roi des Juifs (“Edifying and Curious History of Rothschild the First, King of the Jews”).
Within it he made claims about Nathan Mayer Rothschild’s early knowledge of the outcome of the Battle of Waterloo, whose couriers delivered information about the victory back to London before the British Cabinet itself knew, claiming that he used the knowledge to speculate on the London Stock Exchange and make a vast fortune by unfair advantage against the other British stock holders, essentially defrauding them.Then he [Nathan Rothschild] proceeded to the Stock Exchange. Another man in his position would have sunk his work into consols [bank annuities], already weak because of Quatre Bras*. But this was Nathan Rothschild. He leaned against “his” pillar.
He did not invest. He sold.
He dumped consols. … Consols dropped still more. “Rothschild knows,” the whisper rippled through the ‘Change. “Waterloo is lost.” Nathan kept on selling, … consols plummeted – until, a split second before it was too late, Nathan suddenly bought a giant parcel for a song. Moments afterwards the great news broke, to send consols soaring. We cannot guess the number of hopes and savings wiped out by this engineered panic.(*The Battle of Quatre Bras was fought on 16 June 1815, as a preliminary engagement to the decisive Battle of Waterloo that occurred two days later.
The English government had already been informed of the strategic defeat suffered by Wellington’s army at this battle so many were naturally pessimistic about the outcome of the Waterloo conflict).One thing we do know FOR SURE, is that Nathan Rothschild’s political clout increased enormously in the immediate aftermath of the Napoleonic Wars.
All manner of high profile individuals and future Prime Ministers of Great Britain were beholden to him and were grateful to him for having advanced their political careers.How could that be possible if, as you claim, he lost his fortune during that period ?
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Johnny F. Ive says:
“But Poland’s dictatorship instead spent months rejecting his attempts at negotiations and also began brutal mistreatment of its German minority, finally forcing Hitler into declaring war.” World War III was started the same way with Ukraine rejecting the Minsk agreements while violently attacking the Russian minority in Ukraine, forcing Putin to go to war.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Mefobills
You’ll notice MoFo-Bill, that I don’t criticise those comments of yours where you’re being sensible, and there are quite a few of them.
It’s only when you spoil things and start ranting on about Authoritarian Big Government and Central Planning, that I have to put you in your place.
Your fixation to the ‘Cult of Big Brother’ lording over the common man and micromanaging our lives, is a unfortunate.
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Von Rho says:
Notice that in the map of illegal denying of Shoah, in exclusively Luteran and Anglican nations it is not illegal. Protestants hate Jews. Right wingers should know it. But rednecks are morons
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Truth Vigilante says:@soll
Your graph shows that Nathan Rothschild bought ‘low’ and sold ‘high’ in his trade of consols, and so made a tidy profit.
Irrespective of the price machinations of consols, when rumours got around that the British had likely lost at Waterloo (as would have been the impression when other traders noticed Rothschild frantically selling), all manner of OTHER STOCKS and SECURITIES would have been dumped at bargain basement prices as people panicked, thinking that a British loss would entail a collapse in the British economy and hence ALL of their stock portfolio.
You see, when a panic sets in, investors have a marked tendency to throw the baby out with the bathwater, and sell off their blue chip stocks along with those stocks that would be more susceptible to a price decline resulting from a British military defeat.
To that end, Rothschild’s agents would have stepped in and purchased these stocks at heavily discounted prices.
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24th Alabama says:@Rurik
“Unwashed” perhaps, but the remarkable lack of humility around here is endemic. Chivalry compels me to once again come to the defense of ladies of the evening, leaving the laddies to you.
Comparing the “working girls” to the minions of the media, government and academia is defamation of the prostitutes, who sell their bodies and lose their pride. The other bunch has made that Faustian swap with the Devil and have lost their souls.
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Bankotsu says:@Carolyn Yeager
This is 2023 and I’m an American ethnic-German woman.
I understand you are a translator of German language books.
Care to translate this German book by one of Hitler’s personal friend Henriette von Schirach?
Frauen um Hitler: Nach Materialien
It seems like Henriette von Schirach might have interesting information on Hitler:
In the television programme Hitler’s Henchmen (Episode, “Corrupter of the Youth”, about her husband Baldur von Schirach) Dr. Henk van Capelle and Dr. Peter van de Bovenkamp recalled how Henriette von Schirach in 1943 was invited to the Netherlands by friends in the German occupation forces.
A transcript is played in the programme in which she explains “I heard screaming outside the hotel late at night so went out to investigate. I saw Jewish women and children being bundled into transportation to be deported. I then asked a German soldier what they were doing to which he replied, ‘What Hitler is doing in Holland is wrong, we are making enemies of the Dutch which is a big mistake, make sure you tell him this the next time you visit the Berghof’”. She went on to say that what she had witnessed in Amsterdam had troubled her deeply.[citation needed]
Henriette broke off her visit to the Netherlands, and telephoned the Berghof to make an appointment with Hitler. Years later, for a BBC interview, Henriette explained what had happened:
“So I told him what I had seen. Hitler’s reply was, ‘You are sentimental.’ He stood up, I stood up, [and] I said, ‘Herr Hitler, you ought not to be doing that.’ I thought I could allow myself to say so because I had known him [for] so long. I have hurt him deeply, what’s more in front of other men who were there. Then Hitler said: ‘Every day 10,000 of my best soldiers die on the battlefield, while the others carry on living in the camps. That means the biological balance in Europe is not right anymore.’”
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Brosi says:
On the subject of “everything you know about WWII is wrong”, I love this holofraud meme below the more.
What is even worse is that the family had been getting rich off of black markets, smuggling and war profiteering before they were sent to the labor camp…
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Brad Anbro says:@Bankotsu
With all due respect to you, I DO NOT trust Wikipedia to tell the TRUTH about anything that is the least bit controversial. I am quite sure that the CIA and the “Global Elite” approve EVERYTHING that is contained on their website.
Just my opinion…
Thank you.
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HeebHunter says:@Bankotsu
>Holohoax mythology
Instantly discarded. The subtle jump from “deportation” to the implicit giant electric chair and masturbation machine is masterfully executed. Jew/100.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Brosi says:@anarchyst
Hitler’s greatest “sin” was the monetization of labor (giving labor true “value”) and going against the Rothschild banks. Going against the jew-run banks made him “enemy #1”.
This recent VBL video from ZH is quite interesting. As a holder of some Newmont shares I inherited from my mother, I have been puzzled as to why NEM took such a beating and why the share price remains in the cellar. I knew there was a strike at a silver mine in Mexico, but I was unaware that it centered around the renegotiation of a 1 year old union contract that gave the union laborers 10% of the profits. Now, a mere year later, the union is demanding 20% of profits.
VBL explains that this is far more significant that just a labor dispute, and this is really about all of the smaller/weaker BRICS/SCO countries demanding a larger share of the “Value Chain”, instead of just a small slice of the “Supply Chain”.
VBL points out that China is the unseen protector of these countries who suddenly are resisting the JWO (Jew World Order) and are demanding that their labor be given “true value”. Of course Russia is also playing a major role, especially as the naked Nato emperor’s inability to force Russia to lose in the US/Nato proxy war, and the superiority of Russian weapons systems becomes obvious.
One interesting correlation here is that just as it was Judea declaring war on Germany and creating trade embargoes in 1933 that forced Germany to come up with an alternative money to the Jewish Banking Monopoly that brought about the miraculous recovery of the German economy before Jewish Money Power got WWII started, so is it the US/EU/UK sanctions that have forced Russia, and China to a lesser degree, to go outside of the $IMFS in order to grow their own economies.
Judging by what is happening in Mexico, Ghana, Kenya and even Saudi Arabia, there is BRICS steam roller gathering steam. The sweet smell of US Dollar Debt Jubilee is in the air.
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Orionazzo says:@Rentana
They did the same in Italy in 1944 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marocchinate
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Brosi says:@Ron Unz
WoZ isn’t Jewish. However, he’s rather gullible and pompous and has spent his entire long life totally immersed in our mainstream media portrayal of reality, which obviously has been very heavily shaped by Jewish activists.
Hmmm. So you are saying that WoZ has an intellect and moral fiber comparable to Nancy Pelosi or Joe Biden…
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@Truth Vigilante
You’ve fallen for the “hardened veterans” story. Doesn’t happen much in mechanized warfare. It Of course, the WW II French campaign didn’t inflict severe casualties on either side, so it might not have “hardened” the German units involved. The Normandy invasion and subsequent operations did inflict severe casualties on some units, which became combat ineffective after around three months. Usually what happened was that the infantry component was killed or wounded, and the replacements did not form a cohesive unit. Being surrounded by unreliable strangers (sometimes pretending that “none of this is happening” or “it’s all Army bullshit”) in a life and death situation is not pleasant. Artillery and logistics are usually not nearly as affected, so the Army puts in replacement infantry and sends the unit back into the line.
What I’m trying to say is that “hardened veterans” tend to be people who have learned that warfare is an effective way to get killed.But ignore all that. There’s a line I’ve seen recently that captures the situation of “hardened veterans” who aren’t part of an organized force with some kind of logistics:
“Running out of ammunition is dangerous because the enemy might see you’re out and attack. Therefore, when you run out of ammunition, continue firing.”Units behind the line are not assigned resupply points except the mess hall etc. at wherever base they are staying at. They are ordinarily not even organized to fight because they are at the base to rest and resupply. They are in no position to fight.
That’s what happened in France – the German forces got between the somewhat ponderous French combat forces and No Suggestions Available the French forces’ supply base (and between the French forces and the French civil population). Had the Russians attacked the Third Reich first, the Russians would have achieved an analogous situation. Germany, like France, simply didn’t have the sheer size of the USSR, and could actually be overrun by armored forces.
As an historical note, the USSR and the German Army during Weimar developed WW II armored offensive tactics comparatively. The German Army needed real terrain and secrecy to actually put small armored forces with real equipment and personnel through their paces on the ground to develop the logistics (fuel, ammunition, spare parts, combat damage repair) needed for their proposed tactics, and conducted their tests in the USSR in full cooperation with USSR forces. The German Army thought the USSR incapable of developing or supporting an armored force. They were almost right, but the USSR was capable of mass attrition warfare and the US capable of supplying much of the logistics consumption. The mean USSR tank life in combat was so short that T-10 didn’t last long enough burn its initial load of fuel, but there were a lot of T-10s (~10,000 on the eve of war), and Russian had the geography (and the mud) to reorganize before German forces took the entire country.
We differ on the Winter War, but let’s let that go.
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Yes, and because the ethnic Germans to the east were mistreated, and since Der Fuehrer loved peace so much, he decided to invade Italy, France, the Netherlands, Belgium, Denmark, Norway, and North Africa as well as Poland. Mind you, this was only undertaken to protect the Germans in E. Prussia, not because Der Fuehrer actually wanted to invade those places.
And those camps where ***SOME NUMBER OF PEOPLE*** died, whose existence and mission were documented as thoroughly as almost any event in history, were actually hobby camps where various groups of people went — only if they wanted of course — to improve their gardening, chess, card-playing, and musical skills. Oh, the lovely music! The gardens!
The Jews, being bright, industrious, creative people, flocked to these cultural havens and flourished there. Yes a few died, but it was from pure joy. The only poison gas in those camps was from Jewish flatulence!
And towards the end of the war when the outcome was certain Der Fuehrer, because he was such a humanitarian and still so concerned about the Volga Germans, instead of surrendering sacrificed 80,000 additional young German men in a last-ditch effort to delay the inevitable and to drive home, to the recently liberated Vogels and Willms trapped in Slavic hell for so long, that others suffered similarly.
Those photos you’ve seen of Der Fuehrer among a group of uniformed, untrained teenagers in early 1945? They were not being sent to the front as canon fodder as the Jewish propagandists say. NEIN! They were part of a Jr. ROTC group heading off to a school boat ride on the Danube. Those uniforms are NOT German-army issue, but a special design by Himmler for his beloved “Children’s Peace Chorus,” which performed across Europe for decades.
Many thanks to Ron Unz for another spectacular piece of research.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Ron Unz
totally immersed in our mainstream media portrayal of reality
Oh daer, not just a delusional pretence to knowing more about me than he possibly can after one personal meeting for lunch in California but the intriguing presumption of the word “our” which Ron only woke up to about 20 years ago but makes him think the American flow of media words dominates the whole world in every language.
p It is hard to know which, of several kinds of answer to begin with. Let’s just look at personal background.
From my early 20s I had escaped the naveté which Ron now so much resented when he began to look back on his early years. At about 20 I noted that, whenever I knew about the subject of a Time article I saw major error. After that I got my real education working for over two years for one of Australia’s greatest minds, honoured by Oxford, Harvard and Yale, wartime diplomat who worked with Acheson and Frankfurter and later Nehru whom he distrusted and his Pakistani counterpart. He knew and distrusted Rupert Murdoch’s media owner and executive father (though he liked his mother) and would no doubt have believed highly derogatory sources about Rupert s honesty with whom I was acquainted like Rupert’s main tutor at Oxford and his headmaster. I never gave too much credence to the earlier three media empires as I knew their latest family leaders personally, even on the football field at school, and was not unduly impressed (even when they were smart enough to snap up our first free to air TV licenses). The very bright brother of a very bright contemporary of Rupert who became very important to him, to the point of giving up the chance of becoming chief justice, observed that his brother’s main job really was keeping Rupert out of gaol. And of course people like Beaverbrook, Northcliffe, Rothermere et al were notorious. As were many American media tycoons.
So I couldn’t possibly have reached even 25 with the naiveté that Ron has been overcompensating for so long.
A short alternative view is that I took great pleasure in sharing on Steve Sailer’s H-bd website to which I had been invited about 1998 electronic company with someone as intelligent and high achieving for good causes as Ron Unz and continued to be enthused by what he did for and through The American Conservative. Gradually, since then I have moved to devising ways to inhibit his ways of branding himself a crank, not just an ordinary Ivy League oddball but a collector of a readership of 85 per cent+ ravers to indulge his taste for bizarre (and some at least faintly credible) stories on which he snipes arrogantly and thunders with ridiculous over certainty. I have had little success and, sadly, Ron doesn’t even know or care that I am trying.
So what Ron says and maybe believes about what I write on UR is radically wrong though perhaps not surprising in a man so bad at assessing people and their motives that he led off much of his recent anti American bloviating by backing Scott Ritter and Larry C. Johnson just to mention the ones for which his excuses would be impossibly lame.
And I wonder where Ron gets his “pmpous” description from. Does it say more about him than me. I don’t know for sure what the sister-in-law with whom I did half my 10000 steps this afternoon would have said if I had asked “do you think I’m pompous?” It could well have been “Well, you can be – at any rate if you are insisting g you are right” or maybe “on no, talking too much isn’t the same thing at all” and other irreverent variations. How can I be the judge? But it seems unlikely that my life’s course has been influenced by the kind of pomposity that people associate not with elaborate courtesy but labouring to cover up one’s intellectual limitations. If he can find any justification I think Ron has noticed my frequent resort to elaborate care – or at least a lot of maybe superfluous words – to try and get my point over,especially to him.
What a waste of time – unless I have been able to help resurrect the Ron Unz of English for the Children and The American Conservative.
PS I almost missed adding what might be called a telling example of Ron’s determined cussedness.
It can be looked at from two angles. Ron McNally – none of Ron’s scare quote marks – has made some very good points in reliance on David Irving which trump the commenter he is replying to and Ron alike, although it is Ron who has cased many of us to take Irving seriously. Yet Ron persistently fails toman up to justifying his always brief put downs of the apparently learned McNally, or even credit his reality as a scholar.
The other angle is that Ron, when it suits him, ignores the evidence provided by Irving in contradiction of Ron’s recent fantasies about the origins of Barbarossa and related matters. It is all very stimulating to find Ron getting excited as a kindergartner over what appears to be a novel discovery but sometimes one hopes for nonsense like the “smoking gun” report or a missile hitting the Pentagon being given up.• Replies: @RurikAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Wizard of Oz says:@Truth Warrior
I also like to point out that the Germans began it inNovember 1914 by shelling (drom memory) civilians in Hartlepool and Whitby on the Yorkshire Coast followed by Zepellin bombings of Lonfon later in the war.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Ron Unz
I concede that you deserve a reply to that from Mc Nally as much as the rest of us deserve more from your disagreement with him than brief dismissal as a dishonest shill.
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@Bankotsu
No, I am not. I’ve gotten those who are to translate material I want translated, then I publish it, and I’ve been very successful with that. I would not bother anyone with this material, but also my former translators are not available anymore.
I think your last paragraph, “Hitler’s reply …” is pretty accurate. I think it’s an excellent answer too.
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@Carolyn Yeager
So C. Yaeger says she’s interested in the survival of her kin (Germans), and Mefobills responds with a personal attack apparently intended to hurt her so badly that she quits posting.
How original.
That maneuver worked back when the Jewish coalition was riding high and had escalation dominance. They’ve lost escalation dominance. The Black Coalition is trying for escalation dominance, but can’t quite get it. For example, Biden’s “We got F-16 and you don’t so we’re going to sic the USMC on you if you so much as think about disobeying” speech was thought of as more of a bluff than a warning (did the insurgents in Afghanistan have F-16s before the US panic withdrawal?). For a second example, the lawfare against Trump merely points out that every US citizen commits about two felonies a day under the US code, so everybody without political topcover is subject to arrest and conviction. The 1/6 arrests have convinced everybody, both sides, that the existing Federal establishment arrests political opponents. And, just to ice the cake, the Feds are introducing a “digital dollar”, changing the money supply to something they can control almost absolutely.
All that is going to be as effective as kicking a dead whale down the beach.
The Black Coalition is providing arguably the worst leadership since Jubilation T. Cornpone (fictional character, search YouTube for an account of his leadership).
It doesn’t work anymore. Your group isn’t dominant, the Black Coalition hates it (with good cause, see the urban vote farms), and the Black Coalition itself is proving too inept to survive.
So Mefobills is trying to pull the old psychological assault maneuver, thinking that the sheer shock of the assault coupled with his invincible topcover will prevail. Good going, provides everybody with a look at how things used to be.
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@Brosi
What does posting something like this accomplish? Nothing good. What level of mentality does this appeal to? Second graders? Well, maybe slow 9th & 10th graders, too. And look, our esteemed holohoax revisionists Petermx & John Wear give it a big seal of approval. It’s hard to fathom what is going on in these peoples’ minds.
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Brosi says:@Carolyn Yeager
LOL. Some of us “Men of Unz” enjoy a good laugh, especially when trolls like yourself get into pissing matches with anyone stupid enough to try to engage you in any kind of discussion. People like yourself who seem devoid of a sense of humor would not understand how important memes are in breaking through the Judaic mind control matrix.
Below the more are a couple more Holofraud memes for people who aren’t as stuffy and snobby as yourself.
[MORE]• Thanks: John Wear• Replies: @Carolyn YeagerAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD
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Wokechoke says:@Anonymous
The “problem” with France (by extension Holland and Belgium and Norway plus Denmark) in 1940.
The Third Reich was a better alternative than rule by Leon Blum and his tribe. The architecture of civilised Paris, Amsterdam, Brussels, Rotterdam, Antwerp, Copenhagen Oslo etc were more precious than liberal democracy.Russia was happy to have its cities burned down to absorb the blows the Third Reich could deal out. Britain and the US were fortunate in this respect. The Russians could have folded and just surrendered then thrown in their lot with Germany like the Western Continentals did.
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Wokechoke says:@Wizard of Oz
The Zepellin did make the Germans view London as beatable. As far back as 1900. By 1910 the first flight Whitehall was in full panic.
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Wokechoke says:@anonymous
One of the annoying aspects of the gassing, entire generations of men in ww1 were really gassed, including Hitler. And the inventor of the chemical weapon was a Jewish chemist Fritz Haber.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fritz_Haber
“The disapproval that the knight had for the man with the firearm is repeated in the soldier who shoots with steel bullets towards the man who confronts him with chemical weapons. […] The gas weapons are not at all more cruel than the flying iron pieces; on the contrary, the fraction of fatal gas diseases is comparatively smaller, the mutilations are missing”. (((Fritz Haber)))
Btw the Germans did stockpile tens of thousands of tons of SARIN nerve gas during ww2. They never used it.
“Sarin was discovered in 1938 in Wuppertal-Elberfeld in Germany by scientists at IG Farben who were attempting to create stronger pesticides; it is the most toxic of the four G-Series nerve agents made by Germany. The compound, which followed the discovery of the nerve agent tabun, was named in honor of its discoverers: chemist Gerhard Schrader, chemist Otto Ambros, chemist Gerhard Ritter, and from Heereswaffenamt Hans-Jürgen von der Linde.”
No Jews involved.
I do not know why they passed up the chance to use it on the pests.
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There is no escape, you are all principally complicit in wooden doors, soap, shrunken heads and lampshades as members of Amalek! They will not rest until they have made the last of you disappear. Even if, in truth, it was all a foul pretext from the beginning.
Video PlayerMedia error: Format(s) not supported or source(s) not found
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Mefobills says:@Anonymous
So Mefobills is trying to pull the old psychological assault maneuver, thinking that the sheer shock of the assault coupled with his invincible topcover will prevail. Good going, provides everybody with a look at how things used to be.
What a giant load of steaming BS!
There are differences between men and women. If you go back and re-read Goebbels very carefully, he was giving instructions to the German women of the day.
They were to return to the home life, and get the hell out of politics. He even told them that there were many who would not like it. Goebbels and national socialism was resurrecting the logos, or the natural order.
There are a lot of unnatural people who don’t want to submit to the logos. They want to take sordid gain, or they don’t want to be feminine, or there are males who want to be females and the like. All of that is unnatural.
Fascism and national socialism is AUTHORITARIAN. Germany had been devastated by liberal clown world of the day, almost exactly in the same fashion as what is happening now to the west.
In fact, Germany had been polarized with debt mechanics, with much of the countries wealth having been exported. German people found themselves being ejected from the lands of their forefathers.
No doubt if it had continued, the Creditor Class would have proscribed a new people, new debt free immigrants to replace the Germans.
Instead, Goebbels told the German women, go home and have babies, be a woman – spend your life in the natural way.
NAZI Germany even made it easy for women to go home, as they provided loans, and then erased (gifted) the loan money after children were born.
In other words, Germany had gone into population collapse as women stopped reproducing, just as the Western World is now, and they found a solution. That solution was for women to get back in their lane, and be women.
Men were encouraged to be strong. In the Hitler schools, boys were taught fencing. If you were SS and you had a nick on your face, that is where an opponent got through your face shield an nicked you. In a way, the nick/scar was a badge of honor. The SS did not go around raping, and comported themselves well.
Just about everything was reset in German civilization, and most importantly, so were the women.
It’s a measure of how far we have fallen, when women are not allowed to pursue their natural trajectory in life, and even more so when they are masculinized . It is a tragedy that the bad guys won in WW2.
Get back in your lane German Women!
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@Brosi
anyone stupid enough to try to engage you in any kind of discussion.
Yes, you tried it once, only once and your little attempt was destroyed so thoroughly you never tried again.
People like yourself who seem devoid of a sense of humor would not understand how important memes are in breaking through the Judaic mind control matrix.
I already said what people these would be: 2nd grade or maybe slow 9-10 grade mentality. These are the people you’re trying to reach, when we really need intelligent, mature people to join the truth movement for it to become dominant. You’re making it clear they are beyond your ability to connect with.
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Mefobills says:@Truth Vigilante
It’s only when you spoil things and start ranting on about AuthoritaLirian Big Government and Central Planning, that I have to put you in your place.
There you go again with your free-dumb. Yes, Fascism and National Socialism is authoritarian. Good thing too!
It completely escapes you that the very free-dumb of Libertarianism, is a major factor in the creation of clown-world.
Clown world needs clowns, and libertarians have big red clown noses.
You even tried to make some sort of BS argument earlier that China was libertarian, when they are not – they are authoritarian. China is very similar to NSDAP Germany. There are only degrees of free-dumb, and beyond that there are hard stops. It takes authoritarianism to enforce the hard stops. For example, the masculinization of women, and making boys into fairies is a hard stop, but libertarians are libertine, and you know gay is good!
In other words, you are crazy, and so is the libertarian BS that pretends free-dumb is some sort of panacea. Clown world is a direct result of international capital (finance international) wanting to spread its debt instruments everywhere and take usury. Basically it is invade the world, invite the world, and then spread freedom propaganda.
Libertarian ideology is to attach blinkers around your eyes, so you cannot see. It is propaganda. The Jew even brags about it… attaching spectacles to people’s noses, so they see how the Jew wants them to see.
Libertarianism a Jewish ideology, invented to snare people and thrust new spectacles on their noses.
The German people wanted authoritarianism because they had been devastated, and wanted to right their civilization.
Head first into the concentration camps for all libertarians, they need to be re-educated and would be an obstacle to resurrecting the logos. You get to lose your freedom because you don’t understand that there are limits to all things.
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Rurik says:@Mefobills
I want to save young men from a lifetime of despair. If they have bad narratives in their heads, then it is very hard for them to navigate life. Our world, issues false narratives constantly,
I agree.
And I’m still unsure about things like Bitcoin, even tho I’ve made a few feeble attempts to understand it. But yet, I don’t buy it, because it seems vulnerable to the machinations of ((Big Tech/fed gov)).
As indeed the price of silver and gold are highly manipulated by the PTB, but even so, they can’t press a button and create ten tones of gold out of thin air. So there is at least some rationality to the price/value.
As to the big picture, I think you’re facing some challenges if you’re trying to resurrect the National Socialist solution to what ails us. The positive side of that it that we all see who are destroying our world and dooming our children to a hellish future. And it was the same back then, when Hitler rose to power. So there’s that. And even Kanye agrees. But there are also some significant obstacles. Hitler’s Germany was almost entirely German, and homogeneous. So when he spoke, it was as to a family. And they all knew that he cared, just as a father loves and cares for his family. So this was perhaps Hitler’s greatest strength, and not unironically, are we barraged with the Orwellian slogan that ‘diversity is our greatest strength’. Because they know, that it is indeed ((their)) greatest strength.
So while the mantra that ‘diversity is our greatest strength’, is an abomination; like saying poison is the healthiest food, it all in the sudden becomes true, when you write it as
‘Diversity is ((our)) greatest strength’.
Because it is, if their agenda is to destroy us, (and it is ; ), then yes, diversity (for the goyim) is the greatest strength of the Jew, because a diverse goyim will never mount an effective campaign to dislodge the Zio-vampire from the goyim throat. And they know that. Which is why they’ve been foisting tones and tones of diversity, as fast as they possibly can.
The question is, ‘is it now a fait accompli?
And I’d say, as far as the U.S. and Canada are concerned, yes. There is no way the general public of the U.S. is ever going to rally for a savoir from ‘the Jews’, because too many non-whites (and homos and radical feminists and shitlibs) are very eager to buy what the Jew is selling; the destruction and subjugation of ‘whitey’.
So the numbers are not there. Hitler had them, we no longer do. Orban’s Hungary seems secure for the immediate future, but here in the Good ol’ Z.U.S. of A, I (personally) see no hope for any kind of solution from a general public perspective. The only hope is secession, and even then, I just don’t see it happening. ZOG would crush it at all costs.
So where does that leave us?
Well, the way I see it, is Biden just might be the best answer. Give him all the rope he needs. Let him allow millions upon millions more illiterate and hostile immigrants to come flooding in, and kick in those printing presses, (keys on the Fed computer), and keep printing trillions upon trillions like they’re going out of style. Ten million in reparations for every non-white on the planet! Slavery and oppression wasn’t just done to the blacks of America, whitey has been enslaving and oppressing all non-white people the planet over, since the beginning of time! They all deserve millions in reparations, and I think they should get it. Make it ten million per non-white denizen of this planet. It would only begin to pay for all the evils that whitey has done to all POC.
And in a year or two, once those millions have been distributed, they won’t be worth the paper they’re printed on.
That is the only way I see for a solution. We can’t march on the Fed with pitchforks and torches. And our congress are far too corrupt and in the pockets of ZOG for them ever to transform into decent human beings. They’re too far gone, as you like to say.
So the only way I see out of this, is the complete and utter collapse of the ((dollar)).
This diverse nation will never follow a white man (or woman) into a resurgent National Socialist-type of rally. They’ve made sure of that, with their ‘diversity’. So now it’s just wait and see, as Biden prints and prints and prints. And the borders stay open, and the wars continue to cost endless hundreds of billions.
Give the progressive/liberals and Democrats and Zionists and radical homos and feminists and BLM and La Raza and CAIR and everybody else what they want. Give it to them until they’re stuffed with it. Like that guy in the Monty Python skit. Once they’ve gorged on the (increasingly worthless) lucre to their gullet’s content, eventually, they’ll wake up and the millions they have, won’t buy a loaf of bread.
Then, things can start working towards a solution, once the (nearly absolute) power of the ((Fed)) has run its course, and they can no longer call the shots, by bribing corrupt scumbag politicians, and buying all the media and everything in sight, if it might somehow bolster their nefarious power.
The dollar is their ‘Ring of Mordor’. We will never be free, as long as they can print as much money as they need, to keep us enslaved and doomed to genocide.
Go Biden go!
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Schweinepriester (nowadays, due to increasing ignorance of the German language, only rarely used in one’s own country) is a crude German swear word. Where does it actually come from?
https://de.zxc.wiki/wiki/Schweinepriester
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eah says:@Bankotsu
>Henriette von Schirach
Her maiden name was Hoffmann — she was the daughter of Hitler photographer Heinrich Hoffmann — she and Baldur von Schirach, who was imprisoned in Spandau at the time, divorced in 1950.
I have a copy (auf Deutsch) of her book Der Preis der Herrlichkeit — Erlebte Zeitgeschichte — translating a book is a significant undertaking, and I doubt anyone will put in the effort to translate her books — the anecdote you mention is well-known, and except for the part about ‘breaking off her visit to the Netherlands and telephoning the Berghof to make an appointment with Hitler’, appears to have happened about as described — it was mentioned by others who were either present, or heard about it later from someone who was present.
After his release, Baldur von Schirach, who spoke English well, was interviewed by David Frost — you can watch that interview here:
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Rurik says:@24th Alabama
leaving the laddies to you.
not sure what you mean here, (it’s incomprehensible you’re being an asshole, so I’ll just put that down to a wtf?)
Comparing the “working girls” to the minions of the media, government and academia is defamation of the prostitutes, who sell their bodies and lose their pride. The other bunch has made that Faustian swap with the Devil and have lost their souls.
I agree, but then I didn’t say whore, I said whorehouse, and I suspect the owners of a whorehouse are just (or, almost) as depraved as the minions you mention. Being the ones most avaricious in their exploitation of the pitiable women and girls.
One of the most poignant descriptions of the hard times a woman can fall on, was the account of Fantine, in Hugo’s Les Miserables. Abandoned by the well-to-do father of her child, she is forced to first sell her hair, and then her front teeth, in a desperate bid to provide for her child, before she then descends into selling herself, where she’s treated as less than an animal by ‘respectable’ society.
I wouldn’t denigrate the most hapless crack whore, by comparing them to a corrupt politician or academic or other scum. The crack whore is orders of magnitude more decent and honorable and deserving of respect.
There is nothing on this earth worse than a corrupt politician, who betrays the people he’s paid and trusted to represent, over to their enemies, for perks and pats on the head and a pocket full of shekels.
(oh, and perhaps some ‘laddies’ as well)
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When ordinary Germans hear “Pelikan,” they think of a fountain pen or ink eraser from company of the same name based in Hanover. Annika, born in 1990 (in Dauchau!), flew to Sarasota, to make sure that they are in fact birds of flesh and blood. There, a German named Sabine is the head of a pelican recovery center.
It is simply staggering how white women take care of these poor endangered animals! In any case, they do not consider themselves to be an endangered species in any way shape or form. I fear there will be no refuge for “the last of our kind” one day. https://de.zxc.wiki/wiki/Annika_Preil
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Anonymous2831 says:
One of the (more than justified) criticisms of Steven Spielberg’s movie about Lincoln and slavery was that the movie contained, as one writer put it: “too many negroes and too few Jews”.
I have the same criticism of this article and almost anything Ron Unz writes: “too many —— and too few Jews”.
Unz seems totally unaware that it was entirely Jews who wanted the war (s) against Germany, that Morgenthau was a Jew and his so-called “plan” to totally de-industrialise Germany and turn that country into Europe’s dairy farm and potato patch.
Unz appears knowledgeable, but there is unquestionably a hidden agenda in much of what he says and writes, and that agenda includes very studiously and very cleverly avoiding implicating the Jews in anything. He blithely refers to the “Bolshevik” Revolution without noting that the Bolsheviks were more than 95% Jews. All his references to WWII are the same. Too many of everyone else, and no Jews, when Jews bear all the responsibility for both world wars, and the Jewish-owned media bear all the responsibility for the hate campaigns that led to those wars.
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Malla says:@Alden
Check out the video “Politically Incorrect Truth About Japan in World War 2” by the Mad Monarchist.
He asks to check out the Japanese pattern of behaviour first, check out the pattern and ask yourself “Is this the country we have learnt about we have seen portrayed in popular perception around the World”. For this we need to go back to WW1,or towards the end of WW1, when all the allied nations, and Japan was one of the allies in WW1, were sending expeditionary forces to Russia to fight in the Russian Civil War. And several sent expeditionary forces to Russian Far East, to Siberia and the one country which sent the most troops to the Russian Far East was Japan. By far the largest number of troops in the Russian Far East were Japanese. And many people may not be aware, Japanese forces occupied huge parts of the Russian Far East at that time, in fact, Japanese forces got as far West as Lake Baikal. And they won several victories against the Bolsheviks, they defeated the Bolsheviks who were attacking them and they were supporting the anti-Communist, pro-Monarchist White Russian forces the whole time. And what did Japan do after they occupied all this huge territory, won all these victories, what did they do? They left. Packed up and went home. Once the war was over, everything was decided, it was clear that Bolsheviks were going to win. They still supported the White Russian forces in exile, but they did not annex any territory, they did not try to annex any part of this vast Russian Far East, which was thinly populated and very useful for Japan from a strategic defensive point of view as well as from the point of view of resource control. It was completely under their military control, they gave it all back to Russia. Even the northern half of Sakhalin island, which was in contention in between Japan and Russia for some time, Japan gave it back. Even though they were no way compelled to do so. Does not really fit the behaviour of an aggressive power out to grab any territory wherever possible, does it?
Malla: Unlike the British and others, the Japanese government was sincere in fighting the Bolsheviks. For example the British Army in Russia could have destroyed the Petrograd Soviet in no time and saved Russia from Bolshevism but their governments did not. Some say Lord Kirshcner who was going to Russia and who died in mysterious conditions, some blaimg Jewish power would have led the British Army to victory over the Bolshevik thugs and thus he had to be killed.
In Siberia, Japanese officers and White Russian Army officers talked to each other over vodka and sake and it is here that the Japanese come to know about the Jewish question as well as freemasonry. When these Japanese officers cmae back to Japan, they, many of them intelligence officers did their own research and soon books on the Jewish menance as well as freemasonry, in Japanese, starts apearing in Japanese bookstores.
Back to Mad Monarchist: There were absolutely no annexations and the German colony in China was taken by Japan during a long siege during WW1 (both were on opposite sides in WW1), Tsingtao, the Japanese did not keep it for long, they gave it back to China. They kept a few German colonies, which were not worth very much which were assigned to them in the peace treaty of Versailles. But they gave back Tsingtao back to China. This does not really fit the pattern of behaviour of an aggressive power out to grab any territory it possibly can.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Rurik says:@Wizard of Oz
Oh daer, not just a delusional pretence to knowing more about me than he possibly can after one personal meeting for lunch in California..
So you’re suggesting that Mr. Unz does not know, in fact, if you’re Jewish or not.
Which you seemed to suggest, he didn’t know, because you advised him to ask certain others for ‘confirmation’.
Perhaps then it is Mr. Unz’ intuition that guides him to discount your Jewishness, or lack of. In which case, it would be for the rest of us, as well, to use our intuition, no?
And I wonder where Ron gets his “pmpous” description from.
LOL
your whole post is an effluvium of over-the-top pomposity and blowhard buffoonery.
And then more of your kvetching over ‘David Irving’ or ‘Barbarossa’ or “missile hitting the Pentagon” – ((9/11) damage control shibboleths that you’ve become so tiresomely known for.
If you’re not Jewish, then you deserve an award for the most slavish shabby goyim that there has ever been. Even more so that Florida governor De Shabbos.
And he’s not Jewish, so I guess in theory is also possible that you aren’t either.
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Malla says:@Haxo Angmark
in 1936-37 Chiang’s Nationalists were very close to defeating the Reds and herding them into out of the country altogether.
Yes, but then the Xian/Sian incident happens where Chiang Kai Shek is kidnapped and taken to the Communists. Mao even wanted a show trial and getting Chiang executed. However Stalin saved Chiang, Chiang’s son was hostage in Moscow, where he had gone for his studies earlier. Stalin and the CPC “convinced” Chiang to fight the Japanese Empire instead. Stalin promised him loads of weapon from the USSR and in a few months after the Xian incident where Chiang Kai Shek is captured, we have the mysterious Marco Polo bridge incident in between Japanese and Chinese troops. Who started the incident remains a mystery but it was China which was escalating the situation. What is also not known by many is that China had a bigger army than Japan with more tanks in those days, it was not in the interest of the Japanese Empire to fight China. Japan’s main interest was to stop Soviet influence in China. Manchuria was a bulwark against the Soviet Union and Bolshevism. Remember that Mongolia was already a Soviet satellite state. That is why the Japanese were supporting the Basmachi revolution in Central Asia where Central Asian Muslims revolted against the Soviets, it took many decades by the Soviets to crush that revolution. Japan collaborated with Pan Turkic groups to support that revolution because if Central Asia would break free, the contact in between the USSR and China would become weaker.
The Japs, however, did not want the Nationalists – or anyone else – uniting China, because it would endanger their own imperial lodgement.
Not true, Japan did not have any territorial ambitions in China besides Manchuria but Manchuria was not China proper, Japan made the last Chinese Qing Emperor whose family was the Royal family of Manchuria even before they became the Imperial family of China, the Emperor of Manchukuo.
So when Japan invaded northern China in ’37, they did so not to defeat the Reds
The Communists used cunning to get the KMT China and Japanese Empire at war with each other. That is why most of Japanese troops ended up fighting the KMT. That was what Stalin, the CPC and probably even the Roosevelt administration (full of Soviet agents) wanted to happen.
when the Japs and the Germans found themselves at strategic right angles
True, earlier Japan and Germany were not always allies. Same in between Mussolini and Hitler earlier. Mussolini was not happy about the way German unification with Austria went. Where National Socialists were pitted against Fascists. That is why Hitler was the first to provide weapons to the Ethiopians in their war against Italy, Yes, you heard that right, Hitler the “Nazi” supported a black African country in their fight against a White European country.
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Malla says:@Patrick McNally
No, what the evidence shows
There is no evidence here but your imaginations. I have posted far more posts here which prove that Stalin was very likely on the verge of a major invasion and Hitler had no option but to launch a pre-emptive strike.
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HdC says:@Wokechoke
The British, at the command of Churchill, were the first to use poison gas on their enemy.
This was somewhere in the Middle East, possibly Iran or Irak.It was a long time ago that I read this.
The German stock of poison gas during WWII was built up in response to the British threat to drench Germany with anthrax or similar.
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Petermx says:@Wokechoke
They didn’t use it against the allies possibly because it’s against the Geneva Convention, even though the allies repeatedly violated the Geneva Convention. The allies used gas in WW I too.
The chemistry behind the chemical weapon was developed by two Germans, a Christian and a Jew. It’s called the Haber-Bosch process. The research was not done to create chemical weapons. It was used to develop chemical weapons after the war started. It also resulted in huge growth in the world’s population. It was used to develop fertilizers which resulted in much bigger crop yields worldwide.
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Mefobills says:@Munga Bulga
It is simply staggering how white women take care of these poor endangered animals! In any case, they do not consider themselves to be an endangered species in any way shape or form. I fear there will be no refuge for “the last of our kind” one day.
Pathological altruism of white women works great in a single homogenous culture, that way there are no out-groups for white women to turn into pets. Shaming is a good technique to use on white women, so they snap out of their false attachment to pets.
In a single ethnic culture white women pets will be the neighbor’s kids, or the white stranger. This works just fine in “individualistic” cultures that white people develop as part of their genetic inheritance.
Immigration of unlike types of people into white countries is a disaster on multiple dimensions. Mostly it lowers social trust, as was shown by Putnam in bowling alone. It’s not debatable, the social science is done and its now conclusive. Immigration of differential races, especially of black people into western white countries is bad.
Hungary might be the last refuge of white people. They have their own unique language, so they are not bombed with Western Propaganda (in English). They have a long history of defending their lands against Jewish and then Muslim invasions.
Hungary also had a constitutional kingdom (authoritarian!) that lasted nearly 1000 years. This long history gives their people a sense of pride and place.
Russia eventually will be Eurasian, probably with many Asian genes floating about. Northern whites and northern Asians get along well enough.
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Kali says:@John Wear
Dear John,
I’m pleased you’re ending all comcunication with Ms Yeager. This is the third long thread that I’ve witnessed in which she has harangued, badgered and harrassed you. Enough is surely enough.
I don’t know how you’ve managed it, but you have remained patient and respectful at all times (much more than she deserved) and can hold your head high.
You are a true gentleman, John, gracious and calm, whilst staying true to yourself and standing on your recorded body of work.
People like yourself make the world a better place, whilst providing an excelent role model for others.
THANKYOU.
Very best regards,
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Brosi says:@HdC
Churchill, the C-Jew freemason was horny to use poison gas on the Germans and Germany.
Operation Vegetarian was a British biowarfare military plan in 1942 to disseminate linseed cakes infected with anthrax spores onto the fields of Germany. These cakes would have been eaten by the cattle, which would then be consumed by the civilian population, causing the deaths of millions of German civilians.[1][2] Furthermore, it would have wiped out the majority of Germany’s cattle, creating a massive food shortage for the rest of the population that remained uninfected. Preparations were not complete until early 1944.
his lengthy ”personal minute” of July 6, 1944, to General Ismay is Winston Churchill at his most chilling.
”I want you to think very seriously over this question of poison gas,” he told Ismay It is absurd to consider morality on this topic when everybody used it in the last war without a word of complaint from the moralists or the Church. On the other hand, in the last war the bombing of open cities was regarded as forbidden. Now everybody does it as a matter of course. It is simply a question of fashion, changing as she does between long and short skirts for women.”
This Top-Secret World War II Incident Killed Hundreds—And Helped Invent Chemotherapy
On November 26, 1943 the SS John Harvey cruised into the harbor of Bari, Italy. The placid port city of 250,000, which had an old quarter dating back to the Middle Ages, had been seized by British paratroopers several months earlier without a fight. Located in southern Italy near the heel of the Italian boot, it was safely distant from the frontline to the north.
By the late afternoon 105 Ju-88A4 bombers of Kampfgeschwader 54 were flying southeast into the Adriatic Sea—then swerved west to attack Bari from the east. Their approach was preceded by a few aircraft dropping strips of metallic foil to cloud Allied radars.
The harbor remained brilliantly illuminated, as port officials had kept the lights on to expedite the unloading process. This made the rows of densely packed ships the perfect target as the twin-engine bombers swooped down at 7:30 PM and unleashed their 3,000-pound bomb loads and Italian-made Motobomba circling torpedos.
This was why the Harvey’s hold contained more than 2000 bullet-shaped M47A2 bombs pumped full of ‘Agent H’—mustard gas. A thin steel shell, less than a millimeter thick, contained the liquid sulfur mustard in the notoriously leaky bombs. Despite its low lethality rate, mustard gas was one the most dreaded chemical weapons of World War I. Mere skin contact with the carcinogenic gas would eventually cause large, agonizing blisters full of yellow pus to form on the skin and blinding conjunctivitis in the eyes. If inhaled, bleeding ulcers could form in the lungs. The gas was so corrosive, the air-dropped M47 bombs had to be coated with a special oil to protect from being eaten from the inside out.
The secrecy around the munitions meant that even the Harvey’s captain, Eliot Knowles, was not supposed to be in the know. The Harvey’s cargomaster did know about the bombs, but he wasn’t supposed to reveal that to Allied authorities in Bari.
Meanwhile, Hitler had 500,000 Tabun nerve gas artillery shells ready to use on V2’s and against the Allies at Normandy or the Russians in Eastern Europe. Yet he didn’t. Meanwhile, it would appear that Churchill and Roosevelt were preparing to use mustard gas as a false flag in order open start a chemical warfare campaign against Germany on top of the firebombing and the dreams of nukes over Berlin. This begs the question, who were the real war criminals and barbarians.
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@Mefobills
Thank you for sharing this precious beacon of hope:
If you bothered to lift a finger, instead of being an ideologue, you would find out that Hudson is advising the Astana group, the Russian Academy of Sciences, the Stolypin Group, and also does videos for China’s leadership.
You are the necessary rare combo of intellect, tenacity, toughness and diligence. Your background in your youth and your physicality as shared here has fortified you to be a force for the survival of Christianity in the face of the Jew effort to genocide the descendants of Christendom.
May Jesus God bless you now and forever.
Yes you are a TRUE SUPER, as is Michael Hudson!
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@Mefobills
Necessary Truth:
Basically, if you don’t follow the Jew, you don’t know up from down, and then have to make up narratives that don’t fit reality.
As the brilliant Dr. Patrick Slattery says “Discussing politics or economics without naming the Jew is like trying to do physics without considering the Law of Gravity.”
https://www.republicbroadcastingarchives.org/category/patrick-slattery/
Thank you for identifying the need for politicians to reverse these Jew evils:
They then worked to subvert the country with the 16’th and 17’th amendments, and then the Federal Reserve Act and IRS.
And the citizenry must UNPLUG the ELECTRIC JEW!
Once the money trust cartel was in place, it was easy enough to gin up the presses, and then brain wash the population with hysteria propaganda, much like what was done during Covid.
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anarchyst says:@Mefobills
You bring up a good point.
One of my relatives was dating a woman who traveled to Peru (yes, the country Peru) to pick up a “rescue(d) dog”. Actually, the dog was a “mutt” picked up off a Peruvian street and had no special talents or pedigree. She had to pay for a quarantine facility to house the dog until it was allowed in the country.
The dog was not only next to useless, it was downright mean and attempted to take off my relative’s face. Around others, it had to be muzzled.
She “rescued” other dogs from various countries; these animals being just as mean and useless.
I could never understand why white women go after useless animals and yes, even useless humans from time-to-time when there are those truly deserving of help in the country.
Externalized altruism is extremely toxic, especially when it comes to white women. women who think that the can “change” a man’s behavior have it all wrong. Women who go after a “bad boy” quite often pay for their “choices” and “decisions” with brutal violence and even their lives, especially if they “burn the coal”.
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24th Alabama says:@Rurik
The blessings of ambiguity are more than could be imagined, and being an “asshole” around here may be a badge of honor.
In the sphere of man-on-man humor it is not uncommon to prick a friend’s ego.
You might want to abstain from this in the non-English speaking world where
male sensibilities are more tender.I appreciate your reference to Hugo’s “Pantene” as the most touching portrait of a woman’s vulnerability to evil. Only de Sade or W.C. Fields “en stupeur” would find her amusing, but remember that girls sometimes exploit men: The sugar babe was asked by her sugar daddy if she would still love him if he lost all of his money.
“Yes, I will always love you, and even more, I shall miss you.”BTW, are you hinting that Lindsay’s lover is deaf ? Why does he need a microphone to begin foreplay? What’s with the finger gesture?
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@anarchyst
As a woman and a dog rescuer, I can explain. Women, in general, have greater difficulty tolerating suffering, especially an innocent animal or child. There is an intense mothering instinct, although modern women deny it and fight against it, at their peril, in my opinion.
The traveling to other countries for one dog, for me, seems a bit over the top. Maybe she wants an opportunity to travel. The expenses are usually covered by the rescue group.
I think Mefo said earlier that women should stay in their lane. I agree, to a point. There are realms for women and realms for men. Sometimes they overlap. Women do need to be educated and aware of what’s going on in the world. Men are natural authority figures, but in the intellectual world, I certainly think female scholars should debate whomever they choose.
However, pulling out the “typical man” card, and then flipping out when the guys get hostile is not a good strategy. Men DO tend to go a bit easier on women than they do on male counterparts; it seems to me most women don’t realize this, until the men don’t, and then the girls don’t like it and often take it personally. And developing a sense of humor and a thick skin goes a long way when you play with the boys.
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Ramstein says:@RockaBoatus
“When we destroyed Hitler and his nation, we destroyed ourselves.” – RockaBoatus
That is a profoundly enlightened statement, sir, with which I wholeheartedly agree; provided, however, that the word “we” refers to Europeans and whites of European descent living elsewhere who were thrust into that unjust, jew-fomented brother war. I don’t think it can reasonably be disputed that the destruction of Hitler and his nation paved the way for the jewish tyranny that “we” now live under.
Thank you for your erudite commentary on this subject.
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Dube says:@Johnny F. Ive
“But Poland’s dictatorship instead spent months rejecting his attempts at negotiations and also began brutal mistreatment of its German minority, finally forcing Hitler into declaring war.”
See, we’re brutally mistreating our German minority, in hopes of forcing Hitler to declare war.
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24th Alabama says:
So true,but why do people deny the complemental relationship of men and women when it is so obvious in biology and culture? Very few men have the talent to nurture babies and the sensitivity, patience and kindness to teach young children.
But, we can be sure that lack of opportunity is the only reason there have been so few female warriors, mathematicians, poets and classical composers.
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24th Alabama says:@Tiptoethrutulips
# 718 was intended for you.
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Mefobills says:@Farrakhan.DDuke.AliceWalker.AllAgree
The new currency they are developing is exactly what the world needs. I’ve been listening to Hudson closely, but this is not first hand (we haven’t talked in awhile). Hudson is using their language, and writing position papers, so the debates are finalizing.
You will hear the Stolypin group, or others say code words, like “Keynes Bancor System.”
It is not exactly a Bancor they are aiming for, but close enough. It will allow the multi-polar world trade. Glazyev is involved.
Think of it like a blood stream that is separated from the spinal fluid. Without the cross contamination the usury system of the international creditor is thwarted.
In other words, the Jewish international creditor is having the physical supports of his cat-bird seat being cut.
There are some good things happening, just not in the West – which has turned its back on the Logos.
As you know, Jesus was a monetary reformer. He started his mission on the Jubilee year. The good news was that the Jubilee was to be resurrected. Of course the top Jews, the Pharisee class, put Jesus on the cross – a political punishment for his temerity at challenging their rule. Christianity is not irrelevant.
When goods are in transit in between nation states, they will be priced in the third currency.
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@Mefobills
Necessary history for understanding why Divine Jesus came down here and announced as His purpose at the outset of His public ministry (Luke 4:16-30) extinguishment of JewU$ury initiated by Hillel and practiced by his priest class the Pharisees and return to compliance with Mosaic Law forbidding usury:
The Jewish gold and silver was won at usury (a sin) on the Haibaru caravan routes over thousands of years, long before Rothschild.
The Aiparu/Haibaru merchant class, has been at this game for a very long time. It was this same Haibaru merchant class that was secretly funding the Pharisee class, and maneuvering to get rid of the Jubilee. It was this same class that funded the Talmud into being.
Jewish creditors broke the covenant, and have been anti-life for some time now. It was Hillel, and his Prozbul clause, which then allowed the predator creditors (top jews) put little jews into perpetual bondage. It was only a hop and a skip to do it to non jewish out-groups.
Then the direct Jew finance capitalism attack on Christendom was launched as you describe here when usurer Jews fled to Holland when expelled in 1492 from Spain:
The first debt spreading banks in Amsterdam, the Wissel banks also were not Rothschild.
The first debt spreading banks had to include the invention of double entry ledgers, and it needed Jewish gold and silver to partially back up the privatering credit emission.
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@Mefobills
Obviously true to this day:
Top Jews in the finance centers of London, Wall Street, and Paris were to remain in their cat-bird seats, directing international credit and continuing to pass propaganda in their owned press organs.
Jew perfidy is relentless.
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Thrallman says:@Mefobills
Libertarianism a Jewish ideology
That gives Jews more credit than they deserve. Libertarianism was developed as doctrine by Herbert Spencer, who was drawing on the work of Gentiles like Locke and Paine. Jews like Murray Rothbard, Milton Friedman, and Ayn Rand were late-comers who were able to divert attention onto themselves.
This is an example of a larger pattern. Wokeness has been supported by Jews, but White Gentile Protestants were its inventors. This subject has been brought up before on the Unz Review:
https://www.unz.com/proems/the-1620-project/My personal theory is that a lot of of Anglos carry a gene that disposes them to fundamentalism. When the Calvinist God dies, the Puritans seize onto some other figment to devote their lives to. (compare to Eric Hoffer, The True Believer)
The upshot is that removing Jews will not solve the problem. Self-hatred is intrinsic in Calvinist Gentiles. Longfellow was an 1800’s New England Congregationalist, and was already Woke. Read Evangeline if you doubt this.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@24th Alabama
It’s ridiculous. No one will just be honest about it.
I think the Bell Curve is quite accurate. Men are farther out on the genius spectrum. My Dad and brothers all have the engineering/spatial/advanced math mind, without much instruction or practice. I’m no dummy, but I have to try hard in those areas, although math/algebra/calculus was fairly easy for me. Temperament is important too; women can be excellent pilots to get from A to B, but what happens when the engines fail? I think men are better under pressure. Women know this really, but won’t say it.
Second and third wave feminism is destructive, and young girls and boys are completely indoctrinated. Traditional female strengths are not really admired today, and no one advocates for young girls in that area. It’s all a mess. And since this thread is mostly about Jewish perfidy, who do you think were the most prominent second wave feminists? Of course, the media and publishing also are used to indoctrinate young people…who’s in charge of those industries? It’s almost embarrassing to admit what’s been done to our societies.
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Badger Down says:@meamjojo
In this year, 2023, all across America. Young children suffer Holocaust Education. They visit Holocaust Museums. Some of them have nightmares. They write about the Holocaust and draw pictures of it. They read about Poor Little Anne Frank. It is most definitely a contemporary subject, and it is child abuse.
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Brosi says:@24th Alabama
LOL. You go girls.
Lets face it, the most deranged and mentally ill men are now allowed to pretend to be female are are cleaning your clocks in pro sports. The old feminist credo, “anything a man can do a woman can do better” has now been exposed as just another menstrual female delusion.
Another way the feminist delusion has been exposed is the recent wave of Jew stooge feminists pretending to be military leaders. It is fascinating to watch how this war mongering whores really believe that they are “the most qualified” people to conduct an aggressive proxy war by wokeist Nato against Russia.
For some reason ZOG has decided that the next Nato minister will be one of these ridiculous “warrior women”. LOL.
Who will take the leadership of NATO after Stoltenberg? The 4 main candidates are women
White feminist women, like negroes, are extremely easy for Jews to mind control. Compared to men, women are also extremely cowardly. We can be certain that Hitler knew this and he never would have let any of these bimboes any where near the Wehrmacht headquarters.Stalin on the other hand was well aware of how easy women could be manipulated and brainwashed. Up thread there is a comment, by Malla IIRC, about Stalin massaging the female ego and telling them that they could save the fatherland by becoming tractor drivers. Stalin and Ilya Ehrenburg loved portray Soviet women as fighter pilots, snipers and soldiers fighting for the brave fatherland. Even today, western women eat up this same crass and absurd propaganda and fantasize about out men-ing men. This is likely one of the reasons why 80% of transexuals are FTM.
Biologically over thousands of years women have been tuned to mold themselves to their stronger man. This makes them extremely vulnerable to MKUltra style mind control. They simply cannot recognize it or escape it.
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Badger Down says:@soll
That’s funny, Solzhenitsyn died in 2008 and you say his ‘Two Hundred Years Together’ is expected for English release in 2024. It looks as if it is being suppressed, yet you say that is “nonsense”.
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Badger Down says:@Rurik
Sam the Sham! Wooly Bully! Awesome!
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Florian says:@saggy
Britain had to enter the war to take on debt as part of a restructuring of the British empire by corporations/private interests. Using financial technology the empire was monetized and effectively transformed into the american empire.
While this is not necessarily the motive it most certainly happened:
The concept is outlined in the first (and only) review of the book here: https://www.amazon.de/Komm-Heim-Michael-Birthelm/dp/B0068PIPHQ/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?crid=3HLEBX19B2Q4&keywords=birthelm&qid=1686985848&sprefix=bi%2Caps%2C1487&sr=8-1
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Brad Anbro says:@Tiptoethrutulips
May I give my two cents worth on the subject of “men vs. women?” Thank you.
I have just turned 72 years old. When I began driving in 1968, women (and girls) were much better drivers than men (and boys). The insurance companies also agreed with this.
Now here we are in the year 2023 and this is no longer the case, at least here in the USA, judging from what I experience on a daily basis. 90% of the time, if someone is tail-gating me, it is a female. If I see someone attempting to move faster than the flow of traffic, it is more often than not a female.
Get in the way of a female and her minivan or SUV and look out! You are in their way and they are going to let you know it. It is almost like females are “trying to make up for lost time” in that, in their minds, they have been “relegated to the back seat” and they are now asserting their equal(?) power.
Thank you.
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Brad Anbro says:@Mefobills
Quote:
“The new currency they are developing is exactly what the world needs.”
Exactly which currency are you talking about and who is this “they?”
If you are referring to the proposed central bank digital currency and the World Economic Forum (or some other fascist, one-world all-controlling government, then you can COUNT ME OUT.
I want nothing to do with any of them. No one in any of these fascist groups speaks for me and represents me. Likewise, there is NO politician and NO political party here in the USA who speaks for me.
Thank you!
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Wizard of Oz says:@Brosi
Noted for reference
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Kali says:@Tiptoethrutulips
Hello Tiptoe,
I’ve enjoyed reading your comments on this thread. Thank you.
Speaking for myself, my domain is running the household, caring for the animals and Hubby, and growing the food garden. I have no children, not by choice, but am excellent with long other peoples. – I didn’t realise until later in life, after I met my husband at age 42, that I excel and thrive through “domestic bliss”!
And whilst I run the household, hubby provides for it, including building and fixing the broken bits. He’s also an engineer, and works hard in helping folks around our (predominantly elderly) local community. That’s his domain.
Naturally there’s some cross-over (he takes the goats out while I make dinner, I help with hey-making, etc, when I’m free to), but with such a natural (who knew?!) balance our energies flow and compliment eachother beautifully. – Thank goodness he entirely out-stubborned me duning our first few years together! lol
I’m no dummy either (though I don’t come close to Carolyn Yeager’s special level of super-inteligent-inteligence) but when it comes to the workings of the internal-combustion engine, and etc… I really do t
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@Brad Anbro
Hi Brad,
Your information from 1968 comes from the insurance companies, iow based on actual statistics.Your information on 2023 is your personal experience, iow based on your prejudice. Have you tried to find out what the insurance companies’ statistics say? https://www.trafficsafetystore.com/blog/who-causes-accidents/
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Servenet says:@Ron Unz
Yes, similarly, upon reading Buchanan’s Book, CH&the UW, I was so captivated I read it a second time for the shear enjoyment. Up till then I was only aware of the orthodox hagiography. Since then, though, through the early openness of the internet, MANY NARRATIVES have been greatly, if not completely been revised in my own mind. I have for sometime now come to see Buchanan as a committed System man. One with basic decent instincts, but still something of a gate-keeper in the end. Your own audio presentation here is not merely an excellent recapitulation but something I’ve downloaded for myself as well as a powerful resource to share with others. Thank you very much.
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Kali says:@Tiptoethrutulips
Hello Tiptoe,
I’ve enjoyed reading your comments on this thread. Thank you.
Speaking for myself, my domain is running the household, caring for the animals and Hubby, and growing the food garden. I have no children, not by choice, but am excellent with long other peoples. – I didn’t realise until later in life, after I met my husband at age 42, that I excel and thrive through “domestic bliss”!
And whilst I run the household, hubby provides for it, including building and fixing the broken bits. He’s also an engineer, and works hard in helping folks around our (predominantly elderly) local community. That’s his domain.
Naturally there’s some cross-over (he takes the goats out while I make dinner, I help with hey-making, etc, when I’m free to), but with such a natural (who knew?!) balance our energies flow and compliment eachother beautifully. – Thank goodness he entirely out-stubborned me duning our first few years together! lol
I’m no dummy either (though I don’t come close to Carolyn Yeager’s special level of super-inteligent-inteligence) but when it comes to the workings of the internal-combustion engine, and etc… I really do throw like a girl.
My one major, continuing regret in life is that I was very poorly educated as a child. Luckily I escaped the system with some of my brain intact.
Education, regardless of sex, is a blessing a gift, and should be given freely to all, I think you’ll (and I hope Mefobills will) agree.
Sending love,
Kali.• Thanks: TiptoethrutulipsAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD
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@Tiptoethrutulips
Yes, “Men are farther out on the genius spectrum,” and also on the lowest spectrum of moron, imbecile and idiot, etc. However, that is a very small group. More representative between the sexes is that male-female are equally divided, which means there are many, many women who are more intelligent than many men, and there are more women overall. So what is one to do and/or say about those women and those men? Aren’t you ignoring that? If men prefer women who are less intelligent than themselves, then we are in trouble as a people. And we are, have you noticed?
Plus, spacial IQ is not the only important area of intelligence. Women are probably better overall in verbal/language intelligence.
“I think men are better under pressure.” An opinion, not a fact. And I actually am against women in some professions 100%, like front-line military, police, fire fighters, and as President of the U.S. Not that a few women could do all those jobs but keeping the rest out is the problem. So best to keep it off-limits. That was the thinking of the NSDAP in the Third Reich too; it was not a judgement that women were inferior to men & must be ruled by men. That is cave-man thinking.
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Kali says:
Hi all,
I have a question for the forum, particularly the historiographers here: Given her tendancy to discredit and belittle such bodies of work (John Wear’s and Ron Unz’s for just 2 examples) that only benefit our search for true knowledge, my question is: Which Inteligence agency do you suppose she works for?
And: How long have you been aware of her existance?
Thank you,
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Brad Anbro
I think the insurance rates for female drivers were lower due to less frequent accidents, not due to skills necessarily, but boys tend to take more chances, i.e. speeding, racing.
When my first two kids were young, about 4 and 6, they loved to jump on the trampoline in our back yard. They had been doing it for years with no problems. A friend brought her 6yo son over to play. Within 5 minutes, that kid climbed up a tree, hopped over unto the garage roof, and jumped from the roof to the trampoline.
My brothers were a bit nuts behind the wheel too. I hated driving with them, but I think they were always intentionally scaring me. Fortunately, we never crashed. They received a few speeding tickets, though.
I don’t know if crazy female drivers are just asserting power; they just seem more spun out in general these days.
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Truthor says:@Tiptoethrutulips
One must say that Trafficant never gave up his efforts. A real fighter for truth.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Brosi
How about all those female police captains?
The black lady in charge of Philadelphia PD looks like the Creature from the Black Lagoon. I know damn well she has no idea what she’s doing. I could run circles around her on day one.
If/when they hire me, I will bring in David Clarke (it is a chocolate city), and tell him to run the show, while I sit back and keep my mouth shut.
Just for good measure, I’ll bring homemade lasagna and cookies for all the officers on Fridays, just to watch all the feminists loose their minds and hold up their stupid signs. Maybe Cookie Monster Hillary will join them.
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@Hang All Text Drivers
RE: “holohoax”- Is it not already known that allied bombing cut off supply lines to these “camps”?
Is it not already known that due to this bombing starvation and typhus killed a large part of the “six million”?
Was the Red Cross ever prevented from access to the “camps”?
Never underestimate the fact that your “leaders”, controlled by the real unseen “owners”, think nothing of allowing the deaths of millions. Is this not obvious?
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Carolyn Yeager
Yes, more women cluster around the average intelligence curve, and I know very many highly successful, intelligent women. I don’t necessarily believe men prefer less intelligent women. Make no mistake, I will argue with anyone, male or female, when necessary. In jest, the women vs men thing can be entertaining, but I would never suggest I’m being challenged simply because I’m female.
Women do have more intuitive intelligence. We pick up on underlying communication/behavioral indicators through tone of voice, a look in the eye, gestures, etc. Spatial IQ is not necessary for excellence in other areas. Of course, during child bearing years, women just cannot laser focus on other matters. You have to bow out for a bit. So, perhaps we feel we fall behind in intellectual/career pursuits. This is clearly a cause for resentment, but what are men supposed to do about it? They can’t have the babies for us.
Regarding performing under pressure, my observations indicate men are better. Some women can excel under pressure too; I don’t flip out very easily. But, I think women have more anxiety around danger due to a much higher flight reaction. Let’s face it, in a dangerous situation, the best option for most women is to get away from it, especially if you are pregnant or have children in tow. I think it’s an evolutionary trait.
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Rurik says:@24th Alabama
kudos on ambiguity, you do it well.
touching portrait of a woman’s vulnerability to evil.
and her child’s, as well. With the Inn keepers, and so on.
and even more, I shall miss you.”
ah yes. It’s important for a man to discover the mysterious labyrinth of a woman’s soul, earlier, rather than later. At least, insofar as it’s possible, at all. One can wander in wonder, at the marvels and charms, finding life’s meaning, as he traverses the ‘mirth and melancholy’ of the human condition, and what would be a grey place indeed, without the opposite sex.
What’s with the finger gesture?
when I thought of a ‘scumbag politician’ who ‘betrays everything for shekels and perks’, Lindsey was the first one, (of many) that came to mind, then I simply did a search, and looked for a photo that was smaller, so it wouldn’t be too much of an assault on the readers here, (yes, I try to be thoughtful, in that way), and that photo was the smallest one I could find. The microphone and gesture didn’t have any meaning, just that it was Lindsey; war monger for Jesus, stooge of ZOG extraordinaire, and betrayer of America and every tenet of decency or honor known to man or the Gods.
I hope Satan has a place waiting for Lindsey right next to John McCain, so that for eternity, they can be together again, just as they were all those years in the Senate. I’d like to think that all the suffering that a man or woman, (Madeleine / Hillary) causes in this life, is felt by them in the afterlife. So that every mother who lost a son or daughter, to Lindsey’s wars, the agony and despair, every bit of it, Lindsey will know. The blown off limb of a young soldier, Lindsey will feel it all, every piece of shrapnel that rips though an abdomen, every bomb or mine that shreds flesh, will all be felt, over and over, by Lindsey and McCain, (and Bush and Bliar and Hillary and the rest, of course, when their time comes).
Satan is waiting, Lindsey…
Sorry to go gloomy, but I get gloomy when I contemplate Lindsey and his ilk.
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Rurik says:@Kali
Dear Kali,
particularly the historiographers here:
Can others chime in as well?
Which Inteligence agency ..
It makes sense, insofar as the efforts are 100% disruptive to the honest appraisal of what really happened. By sowing the seeds of discord, the effects are a net negative, and obviously, it makes revisionists look like some very unpleasant types. Not anything any sane or decent person would want to emulate.
But I gave it some thought, and I don’t think it’s paid for by anyone. Of course I could be wrong, but I put it down to a kind of ‘Frankenstein Syndrome’, whereby a person becomes so alienated by life and people and relationships, that they go ‘Frankenstein’, insofar as the creature bemoaned to its maker, that ‘if he could not inspire love, that he would instead inspire hate’.
There is a deep emptiness in some, where love and relationships are supposed to fill our lives with meaning and happiness, but then when it’s a void, it can become a caldron of bitter resentment and bile.
Without love and tenderness and fulfilling relationships, some people slip into the dark side.
I’m sure I saw it with Hillary. All the humiliations Bill heaped upon her, year after grueling year. All the lust for adulation, became a deep and abiding rancor in her blackening soul. When the Clinton’s burned those people alive in Waco, TX, I didn’t consider the act to be the work of Bill, I considered it sheer Hillary. And when a normal woman would feel some shred of tenderness for those children, (at least), I suspect that Hillary only felt glee at their suffering, so lost can a soul become. ‘If they will not love me, if they will not worship me, then they shall die, and by fire from my hand!’
Hillary’s ultimate id was on display at the cackling over the dead body of Gaddafi. The best leader on the African continent. Her uncontrolled ebullience over his and the Libyan people’s suffering, was a window into how black and devoid of any shred of human decency, a person can descend into.
Just some ruminations on the topic. At least it created a stir, and I suppose that too, was much of the point. When you’re swirling into obscurity, perhaps the last branches to cling to, are to shout invectives at the world, for its lack of appreciation of your personal greatness.
How dare the world respect and revere the works of John Wear or Ron Unz, when I have been here all along! And these men are morons compared to me! Blah, blah, blah..
Much love,
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anarchyst says:@Badger Down
You are correct.
Holocaustanity should be considered a religion to which constitutional proscriptions which ban the establishment of a “state religion” should be followed.
A good example of the establishment of a “state religion” is taking place in Florida as we speak.
While in israel, Florida’s governor DeSantis signed two bills into law which makes public criticism of “holocaustianity” a “hate crime” as well as mandating that school-age children attend services at “holocaustianity temples” (actually jewish freak shows) as a part of their “public education” (actually brainwashing).
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anarchyst says:@Anonymous
A little-discussed aspect of the claims that jews were “gassed” utilizing cyanide compounds never mentions the handling of the bodies after “the deed was done”.
Bodies so-gassed cannot be handled without decontamination, which is not an easy process.
According to claims by holocaust promoters, bodies were routinely removed from the purported “gas chambers” without taking any precautions to prevent the handlers from themselves being poisoned.
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Brad Anbro says:@Carolyn Yeager
Hi Carolyn,
No, I have not tried to find out the latest statistics. It would be interesting to find out. Yes, you are correct. My statements were based on my experiences, observations and prejudices. But I stand by them. Like the title of the EXCELLENT UFO movie – “I know what I saw!” Ha!
Take care…
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HdC says:@Dube
Yes, that’s it in a nutshell.
Mind you, the Poles were egged-on by Churchill and Roosevelt to be as intransigent as possible with the Germans.
Throw in the Polish chauvinistic government and newspaper headlines, plus border excursions…
The Germans were pretty patient with the Poles.John Wear’s book “Germany’s War” covers this well.
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Mefobills says:@Brad Anbro
If you are referring to the proposed central bank digital currency and the World Economic Forum (or some other fascist, one-world all-controlling government, then you can COUNT ME OUT.
The fascists were nationalists, and were reacting to the “one world all controlling government clown world of the day.” You have the narrative exactly backward. Mussolini nationalized the banks in 1926.
The “third currency” of the BRICs (or new world) is actually an accounting gimmick. Goods outside of nation states need some sort of pricing anchor. The anchor is a basket of gold, and scientifically derived analysis of the natural resources of contributing countries, and also a mixture of some nation states money. In other words, the accounting mechanism takes in data about the natural ability of the earth to produce, and does not rely on some sort of perverted human monkey business. The models have already been run for many years, especially by the Russians. They will ease into it. For example, the sun shines, and things grow, and there is a certain rhythm to the earth and human productivity.
The bancor like system prevents the central bank digital currency from gaining traction and prevents the acceleration of clown world.. If we rephrase it makes more sense: CBDC is private corporate money issued from a central headquarters – who is in charge of the corporation?
Libertarian gibberish thinks that hidden hand of privateering corporate rulers are a good thing. Their desire for profit above all else will burn the earth.
Remember fascism basically told the corporate world….. you are no longer in charge, you have to submit to the will of the people. The victors write the narratives, and the bad guys won. So, now we have clown world with clowns and big red noses, who are confused about the shape of reality.
I want nothing to do with any of them. No one in any of these fascist groups speaks for me and represents me. Likewise, there is NO politician and NO political party here in the USA who speaks for me.
The first corporatocracy was in the lowlands. The town mayor, or burgermeister would collect taxes from the now indebted citizens, to then pay the creditor class. This mechanism was first put into place in order to fund the 80 years war that the Jews wanted against Spain. The war began in 1568. 1492 expulsion to 1568 are very important years.
The hidden war of corporatocracy jumped in stages, and took over the U.S. by the late 1800, and certainly by 1912.
So, you are living at the end of the usury system, which is about to be overturned. The CBDC, where the privateering finance corporations all link up via their owned central banks to then control international trade, is a very bad idea. And of course the privateers want their free-dumb to take usury, so they can recycle said usury, to string pull their politicians.
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Mefobills says:@Thrallman
This is an example of a larger pattern. Wokeness has been supported by Jews, but White Gentile Protestants were its inventors. This subject has been brought up before on the Unz Review:
Almost all movements are funded. How do you think Protestantism came about?
I’ve spilled plenty of Ink on the funding mechanism that our (((friends))) used in Holland, to then print Bibles (IN ENGLISH!) to then pave the way for their jump to London. That Protestantism is Jewish funded is not part of the common understanding of people. The devil hides in plain site.
Amsterdam’s Jews also funded Cromwell. The cost of this was in 100s of millions of dollars in today’s money. By this time in history (before 1600) they had already introduced changes in the Dutch stock market. There were 700 unlicensed Sephardic Jews who swarmed the stock market after Spanish expulsion, and they invented all kinds of tricks to front run and take usury..
White Gentile Protestants. To rephrase it: Judeo-Christians. White Gentile Judeo Christians, who are brainwashed to love and worship Israel and the Jew – they are god’s people! There is no such thing as usury and sordid gain taking! Sin doesn’t really mean debt!.
When words and meanings are changed, then people’s thoughts are manipulated. They don’t have the words to characterize their thoughts. It is a form of mind control.
Libertarianism was funded by the usual suspects. This is why I tend to use the term “creditor class” which includes more than just Jews. It also includes egoists that think they are special and independent. Ahem…. Libertarians.
By golly, I did it and why can’t you!
Since I am much larger, and probably smarter than most people, it is easier for me to see right through to the paucity of the Lolbertarian argument. Most people are average, and they have to labor to make a living, and they are not smart enough to create. Most people are normies, and are followers. Lolbertarians tell them lies. YOU GO GIRL! Or, everybody is equal, it is the government that is the problem.
If you want to run a nation state, then Libertarianism is a disaster (hint: Reagan and Thatcher). The sharks have free-dumb to roam and eat the normie fish.
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Patrick McNally says:@Mefobills
That’s quite a reversal of the order of events. The expulsions of German populations which your quoted passage refers to came after World War II. It was a classic case of blowback. If Hitler had not set out his own aims for driving out Slavic populations, then the expulsion of Germans would never have occurred.
—–
In Hitler’s eyes the east was already a German empire. On July 9 [1942] he discussed with Himmler the final plans for settling the South Tyroleans from Italy in the Crimea once the war was over… On the twenty-third he instructed Bormann to issue to Reichsleiter Rosenberg broad guidelines for population control in the east: the native population was to be kept down by encouraging abortion and contraceptive techniques; German standards of sanitation and public health would not be enforced (i.e., the natives were not to be immunized or vaccinated) … Still uneasy at the prospect that in later generations even the rejected offspring might “improve” the Russian bloodstock, Hitler ordered the widest distribution of contraceptives to his troops in the east forthwith. As for education, Himmler told his police officials: “I can only repeat what the Fuehrer has asked. It is enough if, firstly, the children are taught the traffic signs at school so that they won’t run under our cars; secondly, they learn to count to twenty-five; and thirdly, they can write their names as well. No more is necessary.”
—–
— David Irving, Hitler’s War, pp. 403-4, 1977 edition.Such aims of conquering the land inhabited by the Slavs and reducing the latter to the status of lower class servants were not a response to the postwar expulsions. These were Hitler’s original primary goals in seeking living space by a drive to the east.
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Quartermaster says:
But Poland’s dictatorship instead spent months rejecting his attempts at negotiations and also began brutal mistreatment of its German minority, finally forcing Hitler into declaring war.
Poland was not a dictatorship. Such a statement is silly hyperbole.
The abuse and killings of the German population in Poland was well known. Conformist historians have worked hard to cover that up. Ironically, Putin has used the same play as an excuse for invading Ukraine, when nothing of the sort had happened in Ukraine.
We saw the same sort of lies told to start WW1. Barnes went into the actual causes.
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Quartermaster says:@Nick Kollerstrom
Barnes did not place the blame on the Brits, but on the French egging Russia on. The French wanted a rematch because of 1871, and getting Russia to mobilize and move against Austria was an excellent way of getting that done.
Germany, by contrast, was the last to mobilize.
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@Tiptoethrutulips
I think the insurance rates for female drivers were lower due to less frequent accidents, not due to skills necessarily, but boys tend to take more chances, i.e. speeding, racing.
I agree.
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Quartermaster says:@Fiendly Neighbourhood Terrorist
Germans asked “what is this holocaust?” in the early 70s.
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Patrick McNally says:@Ron Unz
> Well, in 1949, a leading NYC newspaper columnist reported that
That absolutely was not a “newspaper columnist” as you phrase it. It was what is called a “gossip columnist” published under the semi-comical pseudonym “Cholly Knickerbocker” with the actual writer being Igor Cassini. To simply say “newspaper columnist” implies that this was an investigative news report. It was nothing of the sort.
That was why Richard Spence restricted his comments about Cassini to simply:
—–
John Schiff is nowhere on record as saying this anywhere else. Knickerbocker was the pen name of Igor Cassini, a gossip columnist who made a career out of peddling rumors and making things up.
—–
— Spence, Wall Street and the Russian Revolution, p. 138.Cassini’s gossipy rumormongering reads like a debauched version of something which the real John Schiff said. The use of the word “sank” is telling here, since to “sink” money in some way usually implies a failed enterprise. If Jacob Schiff had actually supported Lenin’s Bolsheviks (he never did) then this wouldn’t be counted as a “sunk” investment. It would be a successful investment.
What Jacob Schiff did do was he sent money to Alexander Kerensky’s government, which in turn was overthrown by Lenin’s forces. Since Schiff had given money to the losing political actor Kerensky, he had “sunk” that money in a bid which did not pay off. Most likely, the real John Schiff did make a statement about his grandfather having “sunk” money in an effort to support Kerensky, and the Right-wing rumor-mill simply turned this into a fake claim about John Schiff saying that Jacob Schiff had supported Lenin. Schiff never supported Lenin at all.
For actual reporting about Jacob Schiff’s attitude towards Lenin, one should look up the piece by Priscilla Roberts in American Jewish Archives Journal, 1997, “Jewish Bankers, Russia, and the Soviet Union, 1900-1940.” Again, it should be emphasized that Igor Cassini would easily give Ahmed Chalabi a run for the money in any competition over shyster rumormongering.
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24th Alabama says:@Wizard of Oz
McNally was designated as, and proven to be a dishonest shill. He earned
a public shaming and you have not provided any reason for your defense
of him, excepting the usual Ozmotic drivel.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Ron Unz says:@Patrick McNally
That absolutely was not a “newspaper columnist” as you phrase it. It was what is called a “gossip columnist” published under the semi-comical pseudonym “Cholly Knickerbocker” with the actual writer being Igor Cassini.
You’re making yourself look even more totally ridiculous than usual.
Back then “Knickerbocker” columnist was a major presence at the New York Journal-American, then one of NYC’s leading newspapers.
He explicitly quoted John Schiff as saying his grand-father Jacob Schiff had provided $20 million in funding to the Bolsheviks.
John Schiff was a very wealthy and important figure in NYC society, and in fact his sister Dorothy was the publisher of the New York Post.
If the inflammatory Knickerbocker quote hadn’t been accurate, Schiff would certainly have publicly objected and very likely sued. So it’s 100% certain that he made that statement.
You can certainly dispute whether Schiff had gotten some of his family history a little garbled and I suggested that myself. But it’s absolutely undeniable that he made the statement quoted in the newspaper.
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Patrick McNally says:@John Wear
It was Hitler who was conspiring from the time the Munich Agreement was signed.
—–
After the Englishman [Chamberlain] had left, Ribbentrop came around to the Fuehrer Building. Hitler discussed the strange episode with him. Walking down the long flight of steps afterward, Ribbentrop mentioned that he was not sure Hitler had been wise to sign such a document. Spitzy overheard Hitler’s muttered response: “Ach, don’t take it all so seriously. That piece of paper is of no further significance whatever.”
—–
— David Irving, The War Path, p. 151, 2013 edition.No surprise, then, that Hitler ordered the preparations made for a “liquidation of the remainder of Czechoslovakia” as early as October 21, 1938:
—–
The object is the swift occupation of Bohemia and Moravia and the cutting off of Slovakia … The units stationed in the vicinity of Bohemia-Moravia and several motorized divisions are to be earmarked for a surprise type of attack… The quick advance of the German Army is to be assured by an early elimination of the Czech Air Force.
—–
— OKW L Ia No. 236/38, Nazi Conspiracy and Aggression, Volme 6, pp. 947-8.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
lavoisier says:@Mefobills
Agree with this assessment. Ultimately we need philosopher kings to run things, including state economic policy, as Plato wisely thought many years ago.
The future, if there will be one, will mandate higher office holders to be both extremely intelligent and moral. One without the other is useless and often dangerous.
There is no such thing as the wisdom of the masses.
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Malla says:@John Wear
John, have your ever checked out this video? By James Perloff who is partially Jewish BTW. He defends the German Third Reich as well as the Japanese Empire.
James Perloff – An Alternative History to World War 2
“Renowned author, James Perloff, was our guest on the LOC Podcast/Videocast. He spent 90 minutes with Clint sharing what a lifetime of research has shown him about the true events of World War 2 and proving that history is written by the victors. It is beyond important to understand our history or we truly are doomed to repeat it.”
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Patrick McNally says:@Haxo Angmark
Not quite, but it probably is true that the expulsion of Germans from the Sudetenland after World War II facilitated this. The union of Czechs and Slovaks had been partly in response to the existence of greater powers in the region. The presence of Germanic populations in the area meant especially that both Czechs and Slovaks were wary of the possibility of German claims on the territory. So having all of those Germans get driven from 1945 and onward certainly made it easier for Czechs and Slovaks to work things out.
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smt says:
well here we go again. if hitler danzig demands were reasonable and hitler never meant conquer the world, so how did that happened that he ended up occupying most of europe? and while mostly reasonable invasion of poland which authors of this article didn’t have time to study in detail had nothing to do with intent of conquering the europe and elimination of subhumans what was occupation of chechoslovakia and anschluss of austria than? yeah, as i was told by well red neonazis, hitler was a good guy, he just didn’t know there were bad things happening out there, i love that new history devoid of logic, who needs the logic
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Patrick McNally says:@Wokechoke
> I do not know why they passed up the chance to use it on the pests.
Fear of retaliation. Churchill had made preparations for biological warfare but had stated that it was only to be used as retaliation. However, if Hitler had begun throwing Sarin gas around, then there would probably have been demands for Churchill to do something.
https://www.julianlewis.net/essays-and-topics/2938:churchills-anthrax-bombs-a-debate-9
—–
[POSTSCRIPT: Since this article was published in 1987, almost all of the archives on biological warfare – closed for fifty years – have become accessible. They repeatedly confirm the deterrent motivation for the wartime B.W. programme, as the following typical extracts illustrate:
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Patrick McNally says:@Malla
Just in regard to what I had said right at the beginning of that message, yes, the evidence shows that when Hitler turned 50, he felt a strong of urgency that his chance for gaining living space for the German race would be lost if he did not start getting things done now. The description given by Irving in The War Path is good on something like this.
You rather tend to jump over the record where it is inconvenient. Your fascination with the Hitler-Mannerheim conversation shows this. That exchange begins with Hitler and Mannerheim going on for 2 pages or so of transcript simply stating that they had not anticipated that the USSR was so prepared. It is only in the 2nd half of the 3rd page that Hitler suddenly interjects:
—–
… it was absolutely certain that Molotov departed with the decision to begin a war, and I dismissed the decision to begin a war, and I dismissed him with the decision to – impossible, to forestall him.
—–However, nothing in the contemporaneous record of Hitler’s comments after Molotov’s trip to Berlin shows any significant difference from the way that Hitler had talked about invading the USSR as early as July 31, 1940.
—–
Hitler called together his leading military advisers and Ribbentrop for a council of war at the Berghof. It began on January 7 [1941] and ended on the ninth with a major secret speech in which he outlined the reasoning underlying his grand strategy … Russia must be Britain’s last hope. “They will only give up when we have smashed this last hope on the continent to smithereens.” The British were no fools, said Hitler; they must realize that if they lost this war, they would no longer have the moral authority to hold their empire together. “On the other hand, if they can pull through and raise forty or fifty divisions, and if the United States and Russia help them, then Germany will be in a precarious situation. That must not be allowed to happen.” He had always believed in destroying the enemy’s most powerful positions first. “That is why Russia must now be defeated.” If Britain did not give in even then, Germany need leave only some fifty divisions in the east; her army could be cut back to provide manpower for the Luftwaffe and naval construction programs, for the antiaircraft defenses, and for the dispersal of industry out of reach of the British bombers. Meanwhile Russia’s defeat would enable Japan to put pressure on the United States, and Roosevelt would have second thoughts about attacking Germany.Since Russia must be defeated, it must be defeated now. “True, the Russian forces are a clay colossus with no head, but who knows how they will develop in the future?” He believed the Russian arms industry was still hamstrung by development problems.
—–
— David Irving, Hitler’s War, pp. 195, 197-8, 1977 edition.That speech from January 9, 1941, can be compared with Halder’s notes from July 31, 1940:
—–
The British were completely down; now they have perked up again. Intercepted telephone conversations. Russia is painfully shaken by the swift development of the Western European situation.All that Russia has to do is to hint that she does not care to have a strong Germany, and the British will take hope, like one about to go under, that the situation will undergo a radical change within six or eight months.
With Russia smashed, Britain’s last hope would be shattered. Germany then will be master of Europe and the Balkans.
Decision: Russia’s destruction must therefore be made a part of this struggle. Spring 41.
—–
— The Halder War Diary, p. 244, Presidio Press, 1988.There’s no really obvious difference between what Hitler was saying on January 9, 1941, versus the earlier remarks of July 31, 1940. No evidence suggests that his decisions were altered by meeting Molotov in November 1940.
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Patrick McNally says:@Brosi
> Meanwhile, it would appear that Churchill and Roosevelt were preparing to use mustard gas as a false flag in order open start a chemical warfare campaign against Germany
No, it does not appear that way. Churchill’s document where he tells his staff to examine the possibility of using poison gas explicitly states that it is only to be used if either it is likely to shorten the war by a whole year, or else in retaliation. Retaliation never arose, and the war was over within less than a year. Hence, Churchill’s own officially stated criteria made it redundant.
• Troll: BrosiAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Thrallman says:@Mefobills
the funding mechanism that our (((friends))) used in Holland, to then print Bibles (IN ENGLISH!) to then pave the way for their jump to London. That Protestantism is Jewish funded is not part of the common understanding of people.
Amsterdam’s Jews also funded Cromwell. The cost of this was in 100s of millions of dollars in today’s money.
Thanks, I didn’t know this. A couple things I know:
At Congregationalist summer camp, we were subjected to lessons on “My Neighbor’s Faith and Mine” which was Judaism. The Lutheran church I went to celebrated Passover.
There is no such thing as usury and sordid gain taking! Sin doesn’t really mean debt!.
Christians hurt themselves by forbidding interest on loans. That gave Jews a monopoly on banking.
Communists are right to say (absurdly) property is the slavery of the living to the dead. Libertarians are right to say (absurdly) taxation is theft. That is, if you want to take things to their ultimate and absurd conclusion. What I really believe is that there needs to be a compromise between inherited wealth and current labor.
Most people are average, and they have to labor to make a living, and they are not smart enough to create. Most people are normies, and are followers. Lolbertarians tell them lies. YOU GO GIRL! Or, everybody is equal, it is the government that is the problem.
Yes for sure. The American dream is to go to college and enter the workforce as a manager. China does the real work. It’s not sustainable.
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Patrick McNally says:@Badger Down
The only cause which English publishers would have for perhaps not wanting it published would be because they don’t relish having to correct falsehoods. Solzhenitsyn has never been a serious researcher and too easily picks up on and rehashes rumors from dubious sources without checking things. Enough partial translations of excerpts from 200 Years Together have been done to make it clear that he’s fallen into that again.
—–
At the last congress of the Russian Social Democratic Party prior to 1917 (London, 1907) where, it is true, Mensheviks were included, out of the 302 (or 305) delegates more than half–160–were Jewish.
—–
— The Solzhenitsyn Reader, p. 499, edited by Ericson & Mahoney, 2006.I tried looking for any kind of footnoted source, but there’s no footnote until the next page and at that point he’s talking about 1917. Is this an accurate record of events in 1907?
Fortunately, we do have a more completely referenced discussion of this in Leonard Schapiro, The Communist Party of the Soviet Union, published by Vintage Books in 1960
—–
The bolsheviks had begun their agitation for a Fifth Congress shortly after the end of the Fourth… The Congress met in London on 13 May 1907… There was, however, a noticeable difference in racial composition: nearly a third of the menshevik delegates were Georgians, and many, about a fifth, were Jews–in contrast to the bolshevik delegates, of whom only one-tenth were Jews… This latter fact gave rise to an anti-Semitic joke, carefully recorded and republished by Stalin (who was present at the Congress as a non-voting delegate) forty years later.
—–
— Leonard Schapiro, The Communist Party of the Soviet Union, pp. 95-6.The sharp difference between Solzhenitsyn’s claimed numbers and the percentages which Schapiro gives necessitates checking to see if Schapiro provides any source reference. Looking at the bottom of the page we see “A. S. Bubnov, VKP(b), Moscow, Leningrad, 1931.” So, until someone looks through all of the possible sources and somehow comes up with a better source Solzhenitsyn’s claim over that of Schapiro, it seems that historians will have to say that Solzhenitsyn was just making another inflated claim. Most academics such as Sean McMeekin or Robert Service would rather not bother themselves with taking Solzhenitsyn’s writings apart. But that is what they will be obligated to do if and when an English edition is published.
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Patrick McNally says:@Ron Unz
> He explicitly quoted John Schiff
He did not quote John Schiff at all. He simply repeated a story from the Right-wing rumor mill. The usual place where most readers in the past typically found this bit of gossip was in Elizabeth Dilling’s self-published book:
“Today it is estimated by Jacob’s grandson, John Schiff, a prominent member of New York society, that the old man sank about 20,000,000 dollars for the final triumph of Bolshevism in Russia.”
— Quoted In Elizabeth Dilling, The Plot Against Christianity, p. 125.There is no actual quote from John Schiff, and in a gossip column of this sort there would be no demand that he should provide a definite quote. It’s just a repetition of an old bogus rumor which had been popular in White propaganda and which Igor Cassini (a fraudster who was himself the spawn of exiled Russian aristocrats) decided to recycle without need for sources. Your belief that this is an actual quote from some kind of interview is just an illustration of your gullibility. Either that, or you’re playing shyster with the rubes. But a gossip column is not based upon interviews and quotes.
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@Ron Unz
So his beliefs might be reasonably considered as constituting an extended phenotype of global Jewry.
Phenotype of Global Jewry = Short/Hairy/Fat/Balding/Bug-eyed/Ugly Paranoid Schizophrenics?
. . . asking for an endogamy practicing friend.
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24th Alabama says:@Rurik
Ah, yes…Lindsey and Juan McCain, together again. You can feel the warmth
Satan has kindly provided to them for their devotion to Zion, warmongering
and border-jumpers.The Fairie Queen of the Senate and the King of Cucks, together forever.
Do not R.I.P., you miserable bastards!• Agree: RurikAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
24th Alabama says:@Rurik
Ah, yes…Lindsey and Juan McCain, together again. You can feel the warmth
Satan has kindly provided to them for their devotion to Zion, warmongering
and border-jumpers.The Fairie Queen of the Senate and the King of Cucks, together forever.
Do not R.I.P., you miserable bastards!• Agree: RurikAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
HdC says:@Carolyn Yeager
Hmmm, statistics…
Methinks that in days of yore boys drove a lot more than girls.
I was one of those boys and sometimes drove 400 miles on Fridays after quitting time. That’s right, 400 miles!
Thus I’d like to see the accident rate statistics on the basis of miles, or Kilometers, driven between accidents.• Replies: @Carolyn YeagerAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Mark Bahner says:
Ron Utz wrote:
Any conclusions I have drawn are obviously preliminary ones, and the weight others should attach to these must absolutely reflect my strictly amateur status. However, as an outsider exploring this contentious topic I think it far more likely than not that the standard Holocaust narrative is at least substantially false, and quite possibly, almost entirely so.
I would characterize the “standard Holocaust narrative” as: The Nazis, as a direct result of their ideology, created death camps that resulted in the murder of millions of civilians.
I wonder what part of that “standard Holocaust narrative” Ron Utz thinks is “substantially false, and quite possibly, almost entirely so”: That the Nazis created death camps? That the death camps resulted in the murder of millions of civilians?
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NotAnonymousHere says:
Stop the triple parenthesis faggotry of people who think they’re getting away with (((something))) instead of just saying “Jews”. Don’t even get me started on “cucks”, the calling card of the loser, the man who cannot cope, has never seen the arena, much less the elephant.
#778 @HdC:
I was one of those boys and sometimes drove 400 miles on Fridays after quitting time. That’s right, 400 miles!
So you sat in a chair for 5 to 8 hours. Super accomplishment.
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Billy Bob says:@Patrick McNally
Patrick, you have debunked this silly trope so many times, it is difficult for me to understand how any otherwise intelligent and ostensibly honest truth seeker can still cling to it without any solid supporting evidence, whatsoever. But it does remind me of Twain’s observation that it is far easier to fool a man than to convince him he has been fooled.
I would however, like to take this opportunity to pick your brain and ask for a response to the following passage from the book “In Our Time: The Chamberlain Hitler Collusion”.
“Military intelligence soon revealed to Chamberlain that Hitler was, in fact, planning to attack Western nations as well. This led Chamberlain to follow a dangerous and ultimately unsuccessful double game. On the one hand, he tried to demonstrate to Hitler that Britain would not tolerate a violation of the “understanding” the two men had reached at Godesberg and Munich. The British guarantee to Poland was key to this strategy. It meant that Germany would face a two-front war if attacked in the West–and if as expected Poland would reciprocate its guarantee from the West. On the other hand, he made it clear to Hitler via secret emissaries that if Hitler stuck by his part of the unwritten agreement at Godesberg, so would Britain stick by theirs. he could have his free hand if he acted in ways that convinced Britain he had no designs on Western Europe. Ultimately, however, Hitler was too suspicious of the impermanence of democratic governments to be willing to regard an agreement with Chamberlain as unshakable. His nonagression pact with Stalin and the latter’s agreement to hand over the non-Ukrainian areas of Poland to Nazi Germany demonstrated his lack of faith in Chamberlain’s ability to make good on “Anglo-German cooperation”. Britain was forced by the logic of its guarantee to Poland to declare war on Germany.”
I know in a previous comment, you suggested that Chamberlain had opposed giving Hitler a “free hand” in the East and would have only tolerated conceding to Hitler those “just demands” associated with reversing the injustices of Versailles.
The truth seems to be though that Chamberlain and his supporters within the British aristocracy envisioned an anti-communist “Anglo German Alliance” where Germany did not encroach upon Western Europe or any of the British empire and was encouraged to expand Eastward even if this expansion violated basic principles of sovereignty, democracy, and human rights.
As always, thank you in advance for any commentary you would like to add.
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Brás Cubas says:@Patrick McNally
I don’t want to interfere in this fascinating exchange of ideas, but, only as a clarification on your observations, let me point out that Dilling, whose book was published in 1964, got that information from the Knickerbocker column. One can check it at this link to chapter 12 as transcribed online:
http://www.come-and-hear.com/dilling/p_chapt12.html
Note: the book’s reprints after Dilling’s death were retitled as The Jewish Religion: Its Influence Today. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elizabeth_Dilling).
For a complete 100% certain source for Dilling’s text, look at the (searchable but not downloadable by everyone) scan at:
https://archive.org/details/plotagainstchris00dill/page/n7/mode/2up?q=knickerbocker• Replies: @Patrick McNallyAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Zarathustra says:@Carolyn Yeager
Evidence.
There is no evidence that Hitler ever changed his mind. Also there is no evidence that Hitler did try something twice. So Hitler did try for friendship with England once. Never did try second time.• Thanks: Carolyn Yeager• Replies: @Carolyn YeagerAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Ron Unz says:@Patrick McNally
He did not quote John Schiff at all. He simply repeated a story from the Right-wing rumor mill. The usual place where most readers in the past typically found this bit of gossip was in Elizabeth Dilling’s self-published book
Your sophistical arguments are clearly aimed at stupid, gullible people.
Dilling’s book was published in 1964 and she was obviously citing the Knickerbocker columnist, who’d published that statement in 1949. So what in the world does Dilling have to do with the issue?
We have a leading NYC columnist writing in a leading NYC newspaper that John Schiff believes his grandfather Jacob Schiff spent $20 million for the triumph of the Bolshevik Revolution in Russia.
Such a shocking statement surely would have spread like wildfire and unless you can find some indication that the younger Schiff—a leading NYC investment banker—denied or disputed it at the time, we can be 100% sure that he actually said it.
You’re really the worst sort of dishonest shill and you seem to have no respect for the intelligence of the people who read your remarks.
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John Wear says:@Patrick McNally
You write: “However, nothing in the contemporaneous record of Hitler’s comments after Molotov’s trip to Berlin shows any significant difference from the way that Hitler had talked about invading the USSR as early as July 31, 1940…No evidence suggests that his decisions were altered by meeting Molotov in November 1940.”
My response: Hitler’s meeting with Molotov in November 1940 convincd Hitler that the Soviet Union was planning to invade Germany and all of Europe.
The Molotov-Ribbentrop pact began to unravel when Soviet Foreign Minister Molotov arrived in Berlin on November 12, 1940. Molotov presented to Hitler a long list of ridiculous territorial claims on behalf of the Soviet Union. Molotov demanded strongholds in Yugoslavia, in the Adriatic Sea, in Greece, in the Bosporus and Dardanelles, in the Persian Gulf; he demanded that countries south of the Baku-Batumi line, in the direction of the Persian Gulf, be given over to Soviet control, including eastern Turkey, northern Iran, and Iraq. (Source: Suvorov, Viktor, The Chief Culprit: Stalin’s Grand Design to Start World War II, Annapolis, MD: Naval Institute Press, 2008, p. 278).
These territorial claims were repeated on November 25, 1940, when the Soviet Union proposed a peace pact between Germany, Italy, Japan, and the Soviet Union. Molotov also demanded naval bases on the Danish side of the straits of Kattegat and Skagerrak, and from Japan the renunciation of its oil concessions in the province of Northern Sakhalin. The German ambassador to Moscow was told on November 25, 1940, that Germany had to withdraw its troops from Finnish territory immediately. Molotov repeatedly reminded Hitler that without Soviet raw materials German victories in Europe would have been impossible. Hitler and his officials were surprised by such extraordinary demands and did not respond.
Hitler stated to Molotov in their talks that the Soviet Union’s takeover of Northern Bukovina violated their pact about the division of spheres of influence. Molotov replied that the Soviet Union did indeed violate the previously reached agreement with Germany, but that it would not give up what it got from Romania. Moreover, Stalin wanted Southern Bukovina and Bulgaria. Hitler again reminded Molotov that they had agreed about the division of Europe back in August 1939. Molotov replied that it was now time for a new division of Europe that would give an advantage to the Soviet Union. Hitler brought up questions of safety from a Soviet invasion of Germany’s oil supply in Romania and other territory crucial to Germany. Molotov did not give a satisfactory reply, and further discussions were in the same tone. (Source: Ibid., pp. 181-183).
Hitler had been preparing for an invasion of Great Britain when Stalin demanded new territories in Europe–territories on which Germany’s economy and armed forces depended completely. After Molotov’s departure, Hitler gathered his most trusted subordinates and clearly let them understand that he planned to invade the Soviet Union. On June 21, 1941, Hitler wrote a letter to Mussolini: “Russia is trying to destroy the Romania oil fields…The task for our armies is eliminating this threat as soon as possible.” The Soviet threat to the Romanian oil fields is a major reason why Hitler invaded the Soviet Union. Hitler’s invasion of the Soviet Union was not at all a struggle for Lebensraum (living space). (Source: Ibid., pp. 159, 183).
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Ron, you wrote:
“if Germany had ever done anything even remotely similar [population transfers] during its years of European victories and conquests, the visually-gripping scenes of such an enormous flood of desperate, trudging refugees would surely have become a centerpiece of numerous World War II movies of the last seventy years. But since nothing like that ever happened, Hollywood screenwriters lost a tremendous opportunity.”
Hollywood doesn’t miss a trick. Check out the first two minutes of “Casablanca.”
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@HdC
I added a link in my previous comment: https://www.trafficsafetystore.com/blog/who-causes-accidents/ Men drive more miles than women — does this include truck drivers, taxi drivers, company-owned van & small truck drivers?
Why don’t you do a search on these questions rather than leaving it up in the air? John Wear does the same thing. Do you not want to resolve it? Look, I believe men are better drivers than women overall. I just don’t like to see women tarred and feathered constantly for the bad behavior of some. Because it’s the very same thing with men.
I think you know that some men here (and everywhere) have a big, fat grudge and even hatred of women. This is unhealthy but most men are afraid to condemn another man. Is that cowardice?
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Billy Bob says:@Ron Unz
From Kenneth Ackerman “Trotsky in New York, 1917: A Radical on the Eve of Revolution”
“Schiff’s gripe against Russia had been its anti-Semitism. At home Schiff had never shown any sympathy for socialism, not even the milder Morris Hillquit variety. Schiff had declared victory for his purposes in Russia after the tsar was toppled in March 1917 and Alexander Kerensky, representing the new Provisional Government, had declared Jews to be equal citizens. In addition to repeated public statements of support, he used both his personal wealth and the resources of Kuhn Loeb to float large loans to Kerensky’s regime. When Lenin and Trotsky seized power for themselves in November 1917, Schiff immediately rejected them, cut off further loans, started funding anti-Bolshevist groups, and even demanded that the Bolsheviks pay back some of the money he’d loaned Kerensky. Schiff also joined a British-backed effort to appeal to fellow Jews in Russia to continue the fight against Germany.”
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Dube says:@Brad Anbro
I’d have to ask, where are you driving? It may be that the driving cultures are different, even within the US. But that might not cast light on the M/F comparison.
I drove for many years in LA, then many years not. Then I got a ride from the airport from an even-tempered, mild-mannered friend, who showed me how you can’t hesitate to make assertions in tight spots. Not what youd call defensive driving.
But yes, your generalization might be correct.
Reminds me however that a military friend said female chopper pilots are preferable in action because they remain calmer.
Back to WW II.
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Brosi says:@John Wear
in the Bosporus and Dardanelles, in the Persian Gulf
Stalin’s designs on the conquest of the Balkans was already clear in June 1940 when he invaded Romania and gobbled up Bukovina and Bessarabia. Like the Tsar, Stalin was horny for control of the Bosphorus and even made overtures to Italy for an exchange of control of the Black Sea in exchange for the Italian conquest of other parts of Turkey.
It is also important to note that in August 1941 with Barbarossa in full play and all the countries that Stalin had bullied and invaded (Finland and Romania) marching towards Moscow, Stalin also invaded Iran.
Yet useful idiots like ((Patrick McNally)) insist that WWII was only about Hitler wanting “Lebensraum”.
Invasion of Northwestern Iran
British supply convoy with Soviet escorts in Iran, September 1941
The Soviet forces attacked on 25 August and Iranian airbases were destroyed by preliminary air attacks. The Soviets attacked using three armoured spearheads, totalling over 1,000 tanks and motorised infantry; the Iranians had no tanks in the area.Good old “Uncle Joe”, after pulling his own Barbarossas on Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania and Romania, pulled another one on Iran, in the middle of Barbarossa.
Stalin also did not abide be the agreement with England that carved up Iran and did not recall his Red Rapist Army until months after the war was over and England withdrawn her invasion forces.
Today we still have to listen to Russophiles and Jews blather on about “Muh 30 million Russians died defeating the Nazis”. No one ever bothers to mention the millions of innocent peoples murdered by Stalin in his insane and power mad rush to conquer all of Asia, or do they ever bother to count the number of Russians who lost their lives due to Judeo-Bolshevic expansionism.
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Petermx says:@Quartermaster
Exactly, but others probably asked too. My parents were German and we only heard of the so called “Holocaust” in the early 1970’s. Prior to that, the word’s meaning had nothing to do with the supposed atrocity in WW II. Professor Norman Finkelstein wrote that after Israel’s victory in the 1967 Arab-Israeli War, Jews became emboldened, and many that were not big supporters of Israel became so, because Israel became seen as a strong American ally against the Soviet Union in the middle east. At the same time, the avalanche of Holohoax propaganda movies and media reports began and continues until today. Prior to that, the suffering of Jews in WW II had no special significance to the general population. Over 60 million people died in the war.
As Ron Unz points out, Winston Churchill, Charles de Gaulle and General Dwight Eisenhower wrote their memoirs after WW II comprising thousands of pages, and nowhere in those memoirs is the accusation of mass gassing of Jews mentioned. Jews have no special significance in those memoirs. I believe it was historian Robert Faurisson who first pointed this out. It was only in the 1970’s that Jews changed the supposed reason why the allies fought WW II. It was only then, 25 years after the war ended, that they went about making WW II about “saving the Jews,” which many people now believe, after decades of propaganda. If the British, French or Americans had been told that in 1939 or 1940, there would have been no war. Soldiers would have refused to start a war for Jews. Russian soldiers would have shot Stalin and other Soviet leaders dead.
However, ironically, the war was about Jews. There would have been no WW II, had it not been for the Jews. Wealthy Jews paid Winston Churchill off to start a war against Germany, as David Irving mentions in his speech in the video in the article, and the powerful pro-war Jewish media pushed the US into WW II, giving FDR the support he needed to get the US involved, and in France Jews no doubt played a key role in getting France to attack Germany. Leon Blum was the President of France just prior to the beginning of the war. Not to mention the USSR, where Jews played a huge role in the founding of the new country and running it until after the war when their power decreased.
I think the evidence is strong Germany was not just fighting four world powers, the Soviet Union, Great Britain, France and the USA, but five, including World Jewry. I don’t think there would have been WW II, if not for World Jewry, and some historians now seem to be saying that.
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Dube says:@HdC
Mind you, the Poles were egged-on by Churchill and Roosevelt to be as intransigent as possible with the Germans.
Alas the Poles, couldn’t think for themselves, ensorceled by Churchill and Roosevelt! Intransigent, but not of their own accord, eh. They had to be hypnotized into intransigence.
It’s apparently not understood and considered that the Poles would fight for their recovered state, regardless of attempted machinations by external actors.
The Germans were pretty patient with the Poles.
With even more patience they wouldn’t have had so much armor scratched up and in need of repainting when it came time for Barbarossa. Check the losses.
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Bankotsu says:@Billy Bob
I would however, like to take this opportunity to pick your brain and ask for a response to the following passage from the book “In Our Time: The Chamberlain Hitler Collusion”.
In our time : the Chamberlain-Hitler collusion
https://archive.org/details/inourtimechamber0000leibThat book is not the best book on this topic. Its arguments are too complicated.
These two sources by Prof Carroll Quigley are the shortest, the clearest, most simple, most accurate and backed up by evidence in my view:
“…the British Conservative government had reached the fantastic idea that they could kill two birds with one stone by setting Germany and Russia against one another in Eastern Europe…
…In order to carry out this plan of allowing Germany to drive eastward against Russia, it was necessary to do three things: (1) to liquidate all the countries standing between Germany and Russia…While all this was going on, the remorseless wheels of appeasement were grinding out of existence one country after another.
The fatal loss was Czechoslovakia. This disaster was engineered by Chamberlain... The details do not concern us here, but it should be mentioned that the dispute arose over the position of the Sudeten Germans within the Czechoslovak state, and as late as 15 September 1938 was still being expressed in those terms. Up to that day, Hitler had made no demand to annex the Sudeten area, although on 12 September he had for the first time asked for “self-determination” for the Sudetens. Konrad Henlein, Hitler’s agent in Czechoslovakia and leader of the Sudeten Germans, expressed no desire “to go back to the Reich” until after 12 September. Who, then, first demanded frontier rectification in favor of Germany ? Chamberlain did so privately on 10 May 1938…”
http://www.yamaguchy.com/library/quigley/anglo_12b.html
http://www.carrollquigley.net/books.htmSee pages 284, 559, 576 and 604 of “Tragedy and Hope” for the entire story of the machinations of the British government under Neville Chamberlain to drive Germany eastwards to destroy Soviet Union.
http://www.carrollquigley.net/pdf/Tragedy_and_Hope.pdf
Some other similar works and sources are:
Stalin, appeasement, and the Second World War by Mark Jones
http://www.columbia.edu/%7Elnp3/mark_jones/appeasement.htm
https://acienciala.ku.edu/hist557/lect16.htmThe Munich Conspiracy by Andrew Rothstein
https://archive.org/details/munichconspiracy0000andr/mode/2upEurope on the Eve, the Crises of Diplomacy, 1933-1939 by Frederick L. Schuman
https://archive.org/details/europeoneve0000schuFalsifiers of History: An Historial Document on the Origins of World War II
https://libgen.is/book/index.php?md5=4AD21DF829DA634FAFED44BE71ED6C62Selected Works of Mao Zedong
Mao: We are prepared for it to come, but it will collapse if it comes. It has only a handful of troops, and you Europeans are so frightened of it! Some people in the West are always trying to direct this calamity toward China. Your senior, Chamberlain, and also Daladier of France were the ones who pushed Germany eastward.
Edward Heath: I opposed Mr. Chamberlain then.
http://www.china.org.cn/china/military/2007-07/30/content_1219034.htm
https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/mao/selected-works/volume-2/mswv2_17.htm
https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/mao/selected-works/volume-2/mswv2_19.htmBut the best narrative is still Carroll Quigley in my view and he is more authoritative as he is not leftwing or a Marxist. He also happens to be Bill Clinton’s history prof at George Town University. So Bill Clinton probably knows this history of WWII also.
This view of British role in origins of WWII is not something that any british person is willing to accept or debate. There are no academic articles on this topic. No academic debates or any discussion. There seems to be a kind of suppression policy going on and making up of totally fake history about Neville Chamberlain. I find this very sad and it kind of exposes history academy in UK as a kind of a fraud.
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J.M.. says:@Chebyshev
Very telling questions indeed. Particularly between the East and West German ‘scholarly’ accounts.
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Brosi says:@Kali
Which Inteligence agency do you suppose she works for?
Mossad. They are a “Nazi” organization that tolerates and caters to pushy and arrogant women.
How long have you been aware of her existance?
Looking at her profile, her first comment on UR was about 2019. I became aware of her at about the same time.
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Brosi says:@Bankotsu
I agree that the Anglo-Zionists were the ones who most directly caused WWII. Of course they also started WWI. But to claim that it was the “British” or the “English” misses the target.
Of course on the other side, it was the Judeo-Bolsheviks who were pushing the USSR to conquer all of Asia.
When Stalin marched into Poland he was following his orders too.
What really frames the entire set up is the fact that neither France nor England said a word or did anything about Stalin’s double cross of both of them and Poland. They were setting up Poland for its own destruction just like they set up Ukraine from 2014-2022.
Later, when Stalin marched into Romania, which England had also given security guarantees to, England also did nothing.
Of all the European countries who participated in WWII, Germany was the least guilty for its outbreak. Of course Germany was the least guilty for WWI as well.
One of the most fascinating aspects of current Jewish war between Russia and Ukraine is how the war guilt was already being established and set in concrete long before the war actually broke out. This totally mirrors the prior two “world wars”.
Putin’s numerous attempts to get the Jews and their ZOG provinces to accept some kind of peace agreement, and Judea’s hunger for war, also closely mirrors what happened from 1936-1941.
This recent release by Putin could have come straight from Hitler had there been a Twitter in 1938:
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DogZ says:
Ron,
Please incorporate a 10 and 30 second rewind option into the audio articles.
Thanks a bunch!
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Brosi says:
Here is a great film composed of excerpts from various sources. There are several interesting cameo’s be Pat Buchanon where he makes clear that the war was not necessary. The Allies and Stalin wanted the war to crush Germany once and for all.
With the knowledge that Germany did not start the war, that the USSR was poised to attack Germany, and the the USSR invaded practically every neighbor in the years before the war and during it, the question about whether the Wehrmacht and SS’s “brutality” was unwarranted or just a reaction to behavior of the Allies and the USSR becomes very relevant.
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Ron Unz says:@Mark Bahner
I wonder what part of that “standard Holocaust narrative” Ron Utz thinks is “substantially false, and quite possibly, almost entirely so”
Well, as just one example I think Nick Kollerstrom’s analysis is quite persuasive. So the Jewish death-toll at Auschwitz was probably 95% lower than the traditional figure, nearly all those deaths were due to disease, and Jewish lives were saved rather than taken by Zyklon-B.
Is that “substantially false” enough to answer your question?
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Wokechoke says:@Brosi
The part of Poland that the USSR annexed in 1939 was almost all populated by Belorussians and Ukies. It wasn’t really Poland. The Poles who would have surrendered to the reds would have been local Polish militiamen (colonial administrators and the like) and a smattering of regular soldiers who had not been committed against Germany yet.
Over lay the demographic ethnic maps with the official polices borders and you find there’s no justification for the Polish borders of the time.
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Salcio says:
Just one correction, in text (and in some comments) the author laments the fact that 95% German city of Dazing was part of Poland before WW2.
No, it was not.
Danzig was “open city” governed by League of Nations.
There are dozen factual errors and misunderstanding in this article but the one mentioned above
is repeated very often so I though it would help to bring it up.Regarding the purge of “non-mainstream” intellectuals, two more names worth mentioning
(though their works were removed from libraries for different reasons) are J. Dos Passos and
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Truth Vigilante says:@Mefobills
MoFo-Bill writes:
Libertarianism was funded by the usual suspects. This is why I tend to use the term “creditor class” which includes more than just Jews.
It also includes egoists that think they are special and independent. Ahem…. Libertarians.Yes, yes, we all saw how (((they))) went out of their way to ensure that the Libertarian Ron Paul had a smooth run and secured the GOP nomination in the 2012 Presidential race.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Wokechoke
What does that tell us about who were killed (class, race and occupation) in the Katyn Massacre?
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Rurik says:@Ron Unz
..Jewish death-toll at Auschwitz was probably 95% lower than the traditional figure, nearly all those deaths were due to disease, and Jewish lives were saved rather than taken by Zyklon-B.
if so, would you be inclined to characterize ‘the Holocaust’ as a hoax?
there seems to be an impasse, on what exactly is the Holocaust, and that if there were less Jews murdered than we’ve all been told, perhaps by half, or 95%, (or more) then it (the Holocaust) didn’t happen. And it was/is a lie and a hoax. Or so the mantra goes..
I think most revisionists agree that some Jews were killed.
This seems to me a fundamental issue if there is going to be any serious discussion about the Holocaust, if in the first place, it can’t really be defined, because when the six million becomes 5 million, it just gets fuzzy, and the calls for more stringent Holocaust denial laws are demanded.
We all know of the ‘six million’, and the ‘gas chambers’ and soap and so forth, but if it were one million, or half a million, or one hundred thousand, and they died mostly by disease, and only a few were shot, (saboteurs, etc..), then would it be correct to say, for the record, and for posterity, that the Holocaust was indeed a hoax, and that it never happened..
?
“I am not a Holocaust denier,” he said. “I have never been a Holocaust denier.”
here we see a backdoor to Holocaust denial laws in Florida, by calling Holocaust denial a form of antisemitism, which is now illegal/banned in Florida.
JERUSALEM — Gov. Ron DeSantis signed legislation Wednesday in Jerusalem banning anti-Semitism in Florida’s public schools.
…Holocaust denial is another example of anti-Semitism:
https://floridapolitics.com/archives/297275-desantis-signs-anti-semitism-bill/
So, it seems they want to keep it vague. By keeping it vague, they can decide each potential breach of acceptable opinions on a case by case basis, depending on the offender’s social media history and so forth. If they’re ‘correct-thinking people’, (kosher/woke) who were slightly astray, then no harm, no foul. But if they’re deplorable people, then make an example of them.
If the Simon Wiesenthal Center says that the numbers of Jews killed was likely less than six million, it will be tolerated, because they know those people have their perspectives in order.
But if some high school teacher gets caught on a student’s smart phone saying ‘the gas chambers (or soap or six million), may be a myth, even if all the rest of it is true’, and it gets posted to social media, then that teacher is done for, under DeSantis’ Jerusalem-signed legislation.
So, all of that basically just to repeat, would you, Mr. Unz, be inclined to say, that if the numbers were wildly exaggerated, and some of the lore about soap and gas chambers were fabrications, then was ‘the Holocaust’, indeed a hoax?
It, never happened?
Perhaps you’ve answered that with one or more of your articles, but I do remember reading at least one of your Holocaust articles, and I just don’t recall a definitive answer to that (I think critical) question.
If I missed it, would you re-post the article in question, and I’ll read it there.
Thank you
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Wizard of Oz says:@Ron Unz
No, because
1. Hitler and other leading Nazis were clearly in favour of radical racial cleansing and none too prim about it being genocidal
2. If NK were right about Zyclon B being used to save the lives of workers at Auschwicz that is an entirely neutral fact consistent with the economic value of prisoners capable of work
3. There is no innocent explanation of any persuasive value for the round ups and transport of Jews who were not potential workers from France, Belgium, Holland, Italy, Greece and Hungary . What danger were old people and children to the Nazis or collaborators if left behind? If you want workers whom you can only keep alive on near starvation rations why would you bring useless eaters as well?
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Wizard of Oz says:@Rurik
Ron can’t resist being a naughty boy and boring it up he ADL, AIPAC et al. but it is seriously worth doing if you are a Jew who regards much of the activity of organised Jewry as shameful. Of course it is shamefully demeaning of scholars and others who go along with the sacred 6 million. I would regard the Nazis’ crime as adequately proven to deserve a special label if it were 4 million. And that would be my betting man’s figure after allowing for a lot of duplications and survivors amongst Yad Vashem’s 4.5 million.
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@Brosi
#795
Brosi says:
June 18, 2023 at 9:52 am GMT • 4.8 hours ago •
@KaliK- Which Inteligence (sic) agency do you suppose she works for?
B- Mossad. They are a “Nazi” organization that tolerates and caters to pushy and arrogant women.
K- How long have you been aware of her existance (sic)?
B- Looking at her profile, her first comment on UR was about 2019. I became aware of her at about the same time.
Oh brother. Can it get more nut-cake than this? More low-brow? They don’t need evidence, do they? If you’re a “pushy and arrogant woman” in their eyes, that’s enough. And see how he calls Mossad “Nazi” (in quotes) as though he’s against the term, yet supports so many men here who use that term to describe the NSDAP members during Adolf Hitler’s rule. Brosi is one confused dude. He doesn’t know whether he’s coming or going. I would call his condition “Feminist (or just Female) Derangement Syndrome.”
Further, he “first became aware of” Yours Truly in 2019. His own comment page shows his first comment here not to be until Oct. 2022 re COVID.
Brosi says:
October 27, 2022 at 5:13 am GMT • 7.8 months ago •↑
@cohen
Hugo at Hugotalks accuses Dr. Campbell of malfeasance (starting at about 10min).So was Brosi lurking here for 3 years without having the courage to say anything, or was he commenting as anonymous during that time? Or is he just lying and making things up, keeping up with his buddies (including the mountain-dwelling, child-free goat-herder Kali).
And people wonder why the white race is going down? Does this explain why Ron Unz created this web space and why he keeps it going? Just a passing thought.
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@Rurik
I think most revisionists agree that some Jews were killed.
You keep saying this. Please do the necessary work to find out. You can, you know. But you won’t, bc you just want to keep talking and hoping people will pay attention to you. Especially Ron Unz, your hero.
On and on you go, writing paragraph after paragraph, but always unwilling to look it up yourself.
You are a complete waste of time.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Petermx
Wealthy Jews paid Winston Churchill off to start a war against Germany,
If you want to be taken seriously rather than as a bloviating timewaster don’t give us such crap. Until 1939 when he was reappointed to the ministry he held in 1914 Churchill was regarded as a drunken has been with absolutely no power to start a war.
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anarchyst says:@Wizard of Oz
A little-discussed aspect of the claims that jews were “gassed” utilizing cyanide compounds never mentions the handling of the bodies after “the deed was done”.
Bodies so-gassed cannot be handled without decontamination, which is not an easy process.
According to claims by holocaust promoters, bodies were routinely removed from the purported “gas chambers” immediately after “gassing” without taking any precautions to prevent the handlers from themselves being poisoned.
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anarchyst says:@Wizard of Oz
Both Donald Duck and Mickey Mouse have been entered into the Yad Vashem database…
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@Zarathustra
Hitler did try for friendship with England once. Never did try second time.
What, in your opinion, was the first, and only, time?
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Rurik says:@Wizard of Oz
Ron [Unz] … a Jew who regards much of the activity of organised Jewry as shameful.
well lizard, I’m starting to think that guys like Mr. Unz (and Jeffrey Sachs and Seymour Hersh and others..) don’t just consider the actions of organized Jewry as shameful, but insane.
In fact, so deranged in their blind hubris, to be leading the planet inexorably to a nuclear conflagration.
If world Jewry has achieved so much ascendancy, to the point of near conquest, then is it prudent to blow up the planet, because you can’t own *all* of it right now? Or, even worse, (another Holocaust!) you might have to back off a bit on your hegemony. And allow Russia and the BRICS to form their multi-polar world.
If you left it up to Victoria Nuland; ‘we either allow Russia and its neighbors some limited sovereignty over their destiny, or we go full scale NATO vs. Russia, that all of our computer scenarios show will result in nuclear war’, what would she say?
‘How much room is there in the Patagonian bunkers?’
I suspect that these esteemed gentlemen, are attempting to gently chide organized Jewry, by suggesting they take it down a notch. War with Russia and China is a bad idea, these sane and intelligent Jews seem to be saying to ZOG.
I would regard the Nazis’ crime as adequately proven to deserve a special label if it were 4 million.
Please don’t take offense lizard, but with all due respect, I was asking Mr. Unz, because he has some gravitas on such issues, whereas you, sadly, have less than none.
I thank you for chiming in, for what it’s worth, but if the lizard personally considers it a Holocaust at four million, but not three, won’t exactly settle things. I don’t want to sound rude, and again, I appreciate your reply, but I was really hoping that Ron Unz could chime in on this, because I consider it a salient and even fundamental question. And, as I’ve mentioned, Mr. Unz is a well-respected (and deservedly so) voice on such matters.
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Rurik says:@Carolyn Yeager
You are a complete waste of time.
I wasn’t talking to you, was I?
If I’m a waste of time, why must you continue to pester me? Just stop reading my comments.
Find something in the barnyard to play with.
As for your opinions, I consider them somewhat slightly less interesting or of value than the lizard’s.
Which I just calculated as less-than-none.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Ron Unz
You are not laying a finger on Patrick McNally who might counter
your country rube’s fantasies about the response of John Schiff with a chuckle about the investment banker he was chatting to in the Knicerbocker Club on 5th Avenue who said I knew Jack Schiff pretty well. He had a great sense of humour and never took himself too seriously. Indeed I can remember him chortling about a great Knickerbocker nade up quote that had him boasting of his grandfather’s financing the Bolshevick revolution. That had him in stitches. He said he’d really dined out on that especially with a couple of European ambassadors”.Sad and pathetic really. And you still just blast him with “dishonest shill” based on nothing but crude repetition of one or two alleged facts.
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Wizard of Oz says:@anarchyst
You advertise thoughtless partisanship. If you are right that someone .anaged to get the Disney characters on to the Yad Vashem lists do you seriously believe they would have survived there for more than a working day?
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Wizard of Oz says:@anarchyst
Did I say anything about gas chambers? Presumably anyone handling contaminated bodies in a dangerous way without protective gear would be prisoners whose health was not highly valued. Wouldn’t that make sense if you are right. But how do you know what the procedures were supposed to be?
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@anarchyst
This is testimony from Solomon Radasky:
“The Russians were pushing back the Germans at Stalingrad. Transports were coming from the Lodz ghetto. That is when we saw them grab the little children by the head and the leg and throw them into the crematoria alive.”
He also says they scooped up the ashes from the ovens and covered the ashes with sand. That’s just the tip of the iceberg for his first hand account.The removal of bodies after gassing was neatly explained by another eyewitness; they used a hook to drag them out of the chamber. The hook was the only precaution taken to avoid direct contact according to this witness. I can’t remember the name of hook man, but when you start digging around looking for the source of comments or testimonies that you remember from past cursory sleuthing, you come across all sorts of outlandish claims. Prior to a few years ago, I had no idea how outrageous the accounts were.
Born in a bucket of piss? Did someone really say that?
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Wokechoke says:@Wizard of Oz
“The Katyn” dead would have been whomever the Reds scooped in surrendering units up in the East around Brest, Vilnius etc. I don’t know who the officers were or their location of origin. But, the Polish army right there was as much an occupation force as the Brits were in Wexford or Dublin. Most of the murdered guys were POWs in Russia proper. Only a fraction were killed in “Poland”. Katyn isn’t in Poland and neither were the soldiers who the Soviets captured when they were captured.
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Mark Bahner says:@Ron Unz
Ron Utz replies:
Well, as just one example I think Nick Kollerstrom’s analysis is quite persuasive. So the Jewish death-toll at Auschwitz was probably 95% lower than the traditional figure, nearly all those deaths were due to disease, and Jewish lives were saved rather than taken by Zyklon-B.
Is that “substantially false” enough to answer your question?
Yes, that’s very helpful. I was not familiar with Nick Kollerstrom. Because the name is so unusual, I assume this is the same guy on a Youtube video, discussing the 9/11 attacks:
At 17 minutes 49 seconds, he describes the theory that the twin towers (or maybe just one of them?) were brought down by a nuclear bomb in the basement (as opposed to airliners hitting near the tops of the towers) as:
Quite a good theory, and well-respected.
That doesn’t speak very promisingly for his analysis skills, in my opinion. And unfortunately, I can’t seem to find his book on the Holocaust anywhere online, either to purchase a hard copy, or in electronic form.
So I’ll just start with…the Auschwitz.org website states:
Historians estimate that around 1.1 million people perished in Auschwitz during the less than 5 years of its existence. The majority, around 1 million people, were Jews. The second most numerous group, from 70 to 75 thousand, was the Poles, and the third most numerous, about 20 thousand, the Gypsies. About 15 thousand Soviet POWs and 10 to 15 thousand prisoners of other ethnic backgrounds (including Czechs, Byelorussians, Yugoslavians, French, Germans, and Austrians) also died there.
So I take it that Nick Kollerstrom’s analysis was that the true number of deaths at Auschwitz is more like 55,000, and most of them died of disease? (Again, I can’t find the book online. Or is there some paper he’s done somewhere showing his analysis? Perhaps in some peer-reviewed journal article?)
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Gerry says:
@ Ron Unz
Disappeared authors and educators? Have to ask and wonder if another name shouldn’t
be added to the list a hero of mine Dr. Willard Cantelon. The book I have in front of me is filled with some very interesting and shocking history which was put out by Logos International in 1973.[MORE] -
Chebyshev says:@Rurik
Perhaps you’ve answered that with one or more of your articles, but I do remember reading at least one of your Holocaust articles, and I just don’t recall a definitive answer to that (I think critical) question.
Refer to the relevant interview on Iranian TV.
He claims there were less than a million Jewish deaths, with the overwhelming majority being unintended. I guess one would be allowed to endorse his claim that the Holocaust is basically a hoax on a private school or college campus in Florida, but not on a public one.
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orchardist says:@Mark Bahner
On the basis of “what seems to answer the question with the most plausible solution”, some believe that the WTC Buildings #1 and #2 were probably taken down in controlled demolition events created by using shaped-charge, low yield, SADM (Special Atomic Demolition Munition) Nuclear Explosive Devices placed in the basements, aimed vertically up, as Ted Taylor had espoused numerous times in 1973 in the book The Curve of Binding Energy by John McPhee. No other method seems to answer as many questions as well.
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Rurik says:@Chebyshev
Thank you Chebyshev,
Much appreciated. Yes, Mr. Unz lays it out. It didn’t even exist, for years after the war, until H0llywood created it in the sixties and seventies, and then, we’re all expected to treat the post-wartime propaganda as if it were gospel. The Nazis at Nuremberg were tortured, (I think most of them had their testicles crushed, if what I’ve read is true), and we also know the shrunken heads and soap and so forth were all bs.
So Mr. Unz does a great job, (as usual) of laying out the preposterous idiocies that we’re all supposed to pay homage to, because of the power of the Jewish domination of our institutions. (If I’m not mischaracterizing his points).
But even as he does so, he speaks of ‘the Holocaust’. It is something, even, I suspect to Mr. Unz, even if most of it is pure bs. The Holocaust, therefor I suppose might be considered the entire catalogue of lies and half-truths and propaganda and media hysteria in general, combined with the laws on the books, forbidding anyone from doubting or questioning any part of it, and perhaps most of all, the solemn ritual of observance. The Pavlovian genuflecting. The shame and guilt and debt that is owed, and yet can never really be repaid. Only though eternal homage to its victims, and condemnation of its eternal perpetrators, can the Holocaust be remembered and treated with sufficient sacrament and penance.
One wonders, had that interview been conducted in Germany, (or so many other countries) would Mr. Unz have found himself arrested and convicted and sentenced to a long prison term, for simply speaking the truth, as he’s discovered it, in an obviously well-intended effort at nothing more nefarious than the simple, academic search for the truth. Something the Western world used to consider a noble, if not the most noble of pursuits.
Not any more. You’ll be crucified for it, in today’s Western world.
So then one wonders, if a student in a Florida high school were to play that interview in his high school history class, would the teacher be fired for antisemitism? Perhaps the principal and the superintendent going all the way up the ladder, until you have school board members being ousted from their seats, because DeSantis has banned all such discussion of it in Florida?
I’d say there is zero doubt that what Mr. Unz is saying, would be considered ‘Holocaust denial’ by the Florida functionaries whose job it will be to scour the goings on in Florida classrooms for any signs of heresy to the new edicts on Holocaust denial’.
So, at some point, these things are going to have to get defined. And I suppose the most likely place that will happen, is in a civil court room, when that superintendent or school board member has been relieved, because they tolerated the kind of conversation I just watched Mr. Unz having with the polite gentleman.
But even so, I think they always find a way to settle out of court, in order to avoid that.
Better just to let the offender slink off, with a pocket full of cash, and the knowledge that he crossed a line and got fired, that the rest of you had better not cross, or else.
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Mefobills says:
This is a poke at our Hasbara friends, who are intent on making Hitler the personification of evil, while their Bolshevik brethren are pure as the driven snow. I don’t know how much of it is true, I’m just poking using Henry Makow, who himself is Jewish.
https://www.henrymakow.com/2020/10/communist-terror-coming-for-you.html
Henry makes an important point below. The free exchange of ideas on the internet must be shut down, so that the real powers are not exposed. In other words, this narrative about the Bolsheviks cannot be known.
(The free-dumb to groom children should be shut down, but political free speech is to be allowed.)
Within a year of seizing power in Russia in 1917, the Bolsheviks, Lenin established the Cheka, the “political police” of the new communist government. The Cheka was in charge of administering The Red Terror–the unbelievably brutal policy of state-sanctioned murder–terror as a policy goal–by which tens of millions of innocent Russians lost their lives. Here are a baker’s dozen verifiable facts to give you an idea of what it was like in Russia while the Bolsheviks held power:
Source: Bolshevism: Kill or Be Killed
A dozen facts about the Bolsheviks everyone should know, but no one does
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Mefobills says:@Gerry
We shall have world government whether or not we like it. The only question is, whether world government will be achieved by conquest or consent.
It’s very simple. Money is a function of the law.
If you want to extend sovereign debt instruments and finance paper across your nations borders, then you are escaping the bounds of national sovereign law.
The investor class and finance capital wants to own the world, or rather find profit anywhere in the world, and then escape to their finance bolt-holes.
This means they want world government. They want private corporate world money, with them creating and controlling the debt instruments. Of course all of this is unnatural, so they have to lie constantly, especially via their owned press.
If they actually said, yes we are rapacious – and we want to operate a sophisticated usury system, to then make us little gods on earth, then no voting sovereign citizen would allow them free-reign.
Duping the citizenry is a pre-requisite for the international creditor.
The new “trading currency” being dreamed up by the BRICS, should go a long way to prevent the contamination desired by international finance capital.
Sailer’s law updated:
Invest in the world using private credit; Invite the world (immigration); war with the world – to protect overseas investments.
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Dube says:@Wokechoke
The part of Poland that the USSR annexed in 1939 was almost all populated by Belorussians and Ukies. It wasn’t really Poland.
Convince the Poles, who speak of Wilno as the cultural heart of an historic Poland. Those Poles speak of the three great cities of Krakow, Warsaw, and Wilno.
But then, others say that Wilno wasn’t really Wilno.
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Mark Bahner says:@orchardist
On the basis of “what seems to answer the question with the most plausible solution”…
So the fact that two airliners loaded with fuel and passengers and traveling at high speed crashed into each of the twin towers, causing massive fires that burned for a prolonged period, thus causing each tower to “pancake” down on itself, isn’t the most plausible solution to the question of what caused each of the WTC twin towers to collapse?
Or is there some question about whether jetliners crashed into each of the WTC twin towers on 9/11?
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “Again, I can’t find the book online.”
My response: Dr. Nicholas Kollerstrom’s book “Breaking the Spell” can be purchased at
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Brad Anbro says:@Dube
Dube, I am now currently in NE Tennessee, but spent my entire adult life in the Rockford, Illinois (90 miles west of Chicago) area. I learned how to drive in Belvidere, about 12 miles east of Rockford.
My observations are primarily of the Rockford area, but having lived here in Tennessee for more than 5 years, the drivers are the same here as they were back in Illinois.
As a side note, right after September 11, 2001 (when I was still living in Illinois), I immediately noticed a big difference in peoples’ driving – they were driving much more courteously, as they drove when I first learned to drive in 1968. Apparently, drivers figured that life was precious and that they should drive more courteously. But that “courteous driving” only lasted a couple of days. After that, they were back to their agressive, inconsiderate habits!
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Brad Anbro says:@Mark Bahner
Mr. Bahner,
You really should do some SERIOUS study of the events of September 11, 2001 – before that date, and since that date, NO steel-framed skyscraper has ever collapsed due to fire. Many, many high-rise fires have burned with much higher temperatures and for much longer times and the steel frameworks STILL STOOD. Check out this excellent video –
I am not trying to belittle you. When the event happened, I was working and “trying to get ahead” in life. I took everything that the government said and I swallowed it hook, line and sinker. I only became educated as to the apparent truth of 9/11 at a much later date. And it was quite by accident, as it turned out.
Good luck with your education. If you watch the above video in its entirety and with an OPEN MIND, I guarantee that you will abandon your current views of 9/11 very quickly.
Thank you.
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Mefobills says:@Truth Vigilante
UR readers, I ask you honestly, name me that individual that alerted you to the evils of the ZOG owned Federal Reserve ?
RON PAUL!
LoL.
What about Wright Pattman? How about Charles Lindburgh? Lindburgh had his child kidnapped for objecting to the FED, and then the subsequent moves to smash Germany.
Of course it was not one of the Socialist Central Planning authoritarians like Michael Hudson and his groupies like MoFo-Bill.
This very article is about how everything you know about WW2 is wrong. Hitler and National Socialism did central planning, and they were authoritarians. This is why the hidden “libertarian” finance capitalist creditors of the West attacked.
The Gold Standard (especially the Classical Gold Standard as existed in the late 18th and the entirety of the 19th century), worked spectacularly well.
The revolutionary war in the U.S. was largely because the colonials had to pay for imports in gold, and in addition had their colonial script demonetized. This drained their circulating medium and caused a depression.
In past comments I explained to you the rape of 1873, and also mentioned Germany at the turn of the century, which went to the gold standard. This demonetization of silver was a great Boon for the holders of gold, as they immediately got wealthy for doing nothing. This was pure usury.
The classical gold system did not work spectacularly well. Britain built special ships to interdict the Spaniards on the high seas, so they could pirate their gold. Indian tribes were worked to death in the mines, and stopped reproducing.
Lolbertarians cherry pick history, and make up false narratives, to then dupe the public and gain converts. It is something similar to a homo trying to groom young boys.
Oh wait! They want complete free-dumb, including unrestricted immigration, and you know – if there is some grooming, then why not! Everybody is FREE.
There are no limits to FREE-DUMB. You just need gold, our god, and then the universe will be in harmonic convergence!
Lolbertarians are clowns in clownworld. Big Red Nose Clown Vigilante
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Ron Unz says:@Mark Bahner
So I take it that Nick Kollerstrom’s analysis was that the true number of deaths at Auschwitz is more like 55,000, and most of them died of disease?
Actually, the official Auschwitz figure for decades had been 4 million, but a couple of decades ago, they suddenly lowered it to about 1 million. So I was talking about a 95% reduction from the former figure. You can read Kollerstrom’s book for yourself and decade. It was purged from Amazon a few years ago along with all the other Holocaust books, but you can buy it elsewhere and there used to be copies available on-line as well.
Kollerstrom’s also a fervent 9/11 Truther, though I’ve never read any of his work in that area. I’m personally extremely skeptical of the nuke theory you mention, but if you’re interested in my own views on 9/11, here’s the link:
https://www.unz.com/runz/seeking-9-11-truth-after-twenty-years/
And here’s a long review of one of his other 9/11-related books:
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Zarathustra says:@Carolyn Yeager
I could be wrong but I do think that Hitler went to England only once.
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Gerry says:@Mefobills
World government wasn’t dreamed up for this reason but rather as a means of preventing a third world war or rather Armageddon. No ‘bolt-hole’ was going to save these parasites from their greed and owning all of the money of the world made them the worlds true politicians and shakers and movers. They know what we do not which led Dr. Carroll Quigley to surmise that they are the hope of the world!!??
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Mefobills says:@Patrick McNally
Such aims of conquering the land inhabited by the Slavs and reducing the latter to the status of lower class servants were not a response to the postwar expulsions. These were Hitler’s original primary goals in seeking living space by a drive to the east.
PILPUL is quibbling and hair splitting. It derails the bigger picture.
Truth seekers bring in all data, and try to paint a coherent picture. PILPUL is something like picking on a nit, and is a diversionary tactic to draw focus to the nit, to then obscure the bigger picture.
This is why Ron gets exasperated with you, because you pick at nits.
The bigger picture is coming into focus. Hitler wasn’t some sort of raving lunatic intent on conquest, and gaining living space. Also, your nit picking leaves out of account that people can pivot and change their opinion, or even act in opposition to their own convictions. I point out how Stalin does about three pivots in the course of his political life.
In other words, Hitler could have actually wanted to march east and grab farmland, but there would be no practical way to do that with Stalin threatening Germany on the East, and the democracies threatening on the west (who were intent on dismembering Germany).
You do assume that the Unz readers are low IQ. I’ve run into your type before – it is common even, low IQ people who think they are more than they are. (Truth Vigilante is one).
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Mefobills says:@Gerry
I don’t disagree with you.
Their motivations boil down to greed, or Plenonexia as has been discussed here.
These sort of avaricious people create all kinds of excuses.
Controlling the world needs an international money. It can be gold, or it can be the whore of Babylon (the U.S. Dollar).
Hudson calls it the dollar creditocracy. Before that it was the Sterling Creditocracy, centered on London.
Before that it was the international gold system. Silver was even used as the international money during the Levantine period. This is how Greece got themselves into debts and then Greek Farmers were impressed into slavery, as the “creditor” grabbed the farmland. Solon’s reforms were a direct result.
The conspiracy is real, but their motivations are simple greed, and it requires an international money they control.
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Gerry says:
about WW2 i did read somewhere to that they never expected that war to turn so bloody, so violent and for so long. Not after the bloodshed of WW 1. If true well what does that say about the human race? And Hitler who saw that bloody mess being a corporal in the trenches makes one wonder about the man? Puzzling questions.
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anarchyst says:@Wizard of Oz
Look up the decontamination procedures for the gas chamber used at California’s San Quentin execution facility. The decontamination procedure is quite involved.
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orchardist says:@Mefobills
Gary Allen ; John Birch Society, 1961
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Mark Bahner says:
Actually, the official Auschwitz figure for decades had been 4 million, but a couple of decades ago, they suddenly lowered it to about 1 million. So I was talking about a 95% reduction from the former figure.
That’s part of why I wanted to know what the “95% reduction” was from.
1) So, based on Nick Kollerstrom’s analysis, which you describe as “quite persuasive,” approximately 200,000 Jews died at Auschwitz in its entire history, and “nearly all those deaths were due to disease, and Jewish lives were saved rather than taken by Zyklon-B”?
2) So you don’t think *any* Jews were killed in gas chambers with Zyklon-B at Auschwitz?
3) How many non-Jews do you think died at Auschwitz, and do you think any of them were killed in gas chambers with Zyklon-B?
P.S. I see that Nick Kollerstrom apparently wrote an *entire book* on how Paul McCartney was killed in a traffic accident in 1966, and replace by a double. Do you agree with me that this theory could charitably be described as ridiculous? And doesn’t the fact that he wrote a *whole book* on that ridiculous theory call into question his others theories?
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Wokechoke says:@Ron Unz
Making sure that the czar gets overthrown makes Schiff culpable.
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Ron Unz says:@Wizard of Oz
You are not laying a finger on Patrick McNally…
I’ve known you for well over twenty years and in all that time I honestly can’t think of a single intelligent thing you’ve ever said, so you’re certainly keeping that remarkable streak alive.
Given your more than 15,000 comments on this website, I’m sure I somehow missed a handful that did show some mental ability, and perhaps you could point me to a couple of them.
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Mark Bahner says:@Brad Anbro
Let’s see if we agree:
1) Do you agree that the hijackers were these men:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hijackers_in_the_September_11_attacks
2) Do you agree they weren’t working for any government? Or if they were working for any government, which government do you think it was?
If you agree those were the hijackers, and they weren’t working for any government:
1) Who do you think planted the explosives?
2) Where do you think the explosives were planted? Just in the basement, or throughout the building, including the basement?
3) When do you think the explosives were planted?
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Wokechoke says:@Mefobills
Schiff pretty much ended the Czardom with his financial machinations. He can’t escape blame for communism taking over.
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Ron Unz says:@Mark Bahner
2) So you don’t think *any* Jews were killed in gas chambers with Zyklon-B at Auschwitz?
Well, duh, there were no gas chambers for killing inmates at Auschwitz and never had been. It’s all just a propaganda-hoax. Read any of the voluminous literature, including the seminal Butz book available on this website:
https://www.unz.com/book/arthur_r_butz__the-hoax-of-the-twentieth-century/
P.S. I see that Nick Kollerstrom apparently wrote an *entire book* on how Paul McCartney was killed in a traffic accident in 1966, and replace by a double. Do you agree with me that this theory could charitably be described as ridiculous? And doesn’t the fact that he wrote a *whole book* on that ridiculous theory call into question his others theories?
Don’t know or care about that nonsense. It’s fairly common for individuals who discover the correctness of some “conspiracy theories” to then gradually take up many others that are far more unlikely to be true.
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HdC says:@NotAnonymousHere
As a teenager and in my early twenties, it was the pleasure of driving a car and being in motion.
Many, many moons later my wife and I still enjoy road trips and do so at every opportune moment.
Not 400 miles in one go after work, but still several hundred Kilometers on secondary highways.This has nothing to do with accomplishment, but seeing the countryside and meeting people.
Others sit in front of the TV for weekends on end. To each his own.
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HdC says:@smt
Kindly show one instance where German officialdom referred to other people or nations as “subhumans”.
In German please, not some translation.
The rest of your scribbles do not deserve a reply.
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FoSquare says:@Mefobills
The Bolshevik parallels with the events transpiring in the US today couldn’t be more transparent.
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Wokechoke says:@Patrick McNally
Sarin would have ended the battles around Moscow.
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Brad Anbro says:@Mark Bahner
Mr. Bahner,
Let me make myself PERFECTLY CLEAR…I DO NOT TRUST ANYTHING that Wikipedia has to say about ANYTHING that is the least bit controversial or things which will put the United States in a bad light.
I firmly believe that ALL CONTENT that you see in Wikipedia, as well as Snopes, Skeptic, etc, is run by the CIA and nothing gets put into those websites which do not meet their “criteria.”
The mainstream media is habitually making fun of people who put forth “conspiracy theories,” but the term “conspiracy theory” was first used in a pejorative manner by the CIA.
As far as your questions about who the perpetrators were, what was used as explosives, etc., are concerned, these are all legitimate questions. It is NOT for me to answer any of them. That is the job of a grand jury to be convened, which would have complete powers of subpoena, something that has NEVER been done.
There are a group of lawyers who probably have over 500 hours of court room experience between them, who have tried for over a year and a half to get “to the bottom” of 9/11. But so far, they have not been successful. A judge has told them that they have no “standing” – their case has no merit.
Why? Simply because judges DO NOT WANT TO DIE.You need to stop trusting the mainstream media and do some REAL research on your own. You would be very surprised at what you would find out. Good luck!
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Wokechoke says:@smt
The Germans didn’t occupy much of Europe. Italy, Spain, no. Romania Hungary Bulgaria Sweden Finland no. The Baltics NO. Ukraine, Croatia, Bosnia not really. Most of the rest sent troops to support Barbarossa, especially France.
Poland, Serbia and Russia yes, occupied.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
You may be interested in this info:
http://warprofiteerstory.blogspot.com
These essays are some of the best I’ve read; not too technical, but very informative. It’s very helpful for skeptics.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Brad Anbro
Mr. Anbro,
You may be interested in this collection of three essays on 911, USS Liberty, JFK connections. I suspect you know much about this subject, but this is worth a read (and a share):
https://warprofiteerstory.blogspot.com
Here’s a sample:
The vulnerability of such a plan is its dependence upon secrecy, a great deal of it coerced. These articles are intended as compact introductions for people unfamiliar with these mountains of evidence, which have been carefully kept out of the mainstream media. The articles focus on key facts, and the relations between those facts. Links to solid sources back up the information so you can assess this material for yourself. There is much more evidence supporting these conclusions than what is presented here.*****
You may use this material freely and without attribution.• Replies: @Brad AnbroAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Dube says:@Wokechoke
The Poles could vanish several times over and I’d be happy enough.
But in the meantime, what?
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Wizard of Oz says:@Wokechoke
Where do you get the misinformation you waste readers time with? Can’t you use a search engine when you are ignorant? I thought “what about Greece, Italy after its surrender and surely the Baltic States” but Googling quickly added Norway,Denmark, France, Belgium, Holland, Luxembourg….. What were you thinking?
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Brad Anbro says:@Tiptoethrutulips
Thanks for the reply. I am very familiar with the USS Liberty story.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Ron Unz
Sadder still.How does it help your insecurities to shout unspecific insults at me when the charge that is riling you is that your calling Patrick McNally a dishonest shill (rather than a better read scholar than you) is no more than unsorted unsupported bluster. My family is full of high IQ underachievers and it once excited me to have chance to be able to help a high IQ person with proven achievements to his credit to continue polishing his record. But no, I see now an ageing crank who is not even strictly scrupulous.
Test yourself on this. Hasn’t Patrick McNally just w
quoted David Irving with passages which show that your tendency to adopt the line that Hitler’s lust for Lebebsraum was insignificant compared with his need for a
preemptive response against Stalin is at odds with your upholding Irving as your model researcher?• Replies: @MefobillsAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Wizard of Oz says:@Ron Unz
Is that a bit of self knowledge creeping in at the end?
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Gerry says:@Mefobills
Yes, the Whore of Babylon, I believe that.
On another matter regarding the Soviet Union here is some rather startling history:
Again from Cantelon:
9 FILLING STATIONS CLOSE,
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soll says:@Badger Down
That’s funny, Solzhenitsyn died in 2008 and you say his ‘Two Hundred Years Together’ is expected for English release in 2024. It looks as if it is being suppressed, yet you say that is “nonsense”.
‘Two Hundred Years Together’ is being translated for it’s authorized English edition at this very moment. It is indeed expected for English released in 2024, now that his 6.000 page novel ‘The Red Wheel’ has been completed.
Where is the conspiracy to suppress? Other than the online meme used to sell his own book, ‘The Secret Behind Communism’ (2013) as intentionally started by “Dr.” David Duke.
Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn’s Two Hundred Years Together, a two-volume history of Russian-Jewish relations, initially grew out of The Red Wheel, his monumental opus on the Russian Revolution. In The Red Wheel Solzhenitsyn had shown the Revolution in full complexity; and indeed—to avoid boiling down that complexity or skewing it via the narrow prism of Russian-Jewish relations—he gave The Red Wheel priority of publication in every major language, ahead of Two Hundred Years Together. Now that the full Red Wheel is well on its way to being published in English, an authorized translation of Two Hundred Years Together is in progress and scheduled for publication in 2024. […]
With respect to an English edition—to recapitulate the above—an authorized translation of the full work is in progress and scheduled for publication in 2024.
Meanwhile, readers need to be forewarned that any and all English versions available on the Internet… are illegal, pirated, a gross violation of international copyright law, and/or entirely unauthorized; often poorly and loosely translated; and redact passages, and indeed whole chapters, that apparently do not support the prejudices of those behind these illegal editions
https://www.solzhenitsyncenter.org/his-writings/large-works-and-novels/two-hundred-years-together
Duke’s hoax quote (“You must understand…”) will be formally exposed next year. While Duke cannot speak Russian, and Solzhenitsyn couldn’t speak English; yet according to Duke they did research together. Lay off the conspiracies.
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Patrick McNally says:@Brás Cubas
Yes, she specifically refers to the “Cholly Knickerbocker” column as a “society news column,” which is rather a generous phasing. “Gossip column” is the more appropriate term. To speak of a “news column” suggests that stories are checked with sources before being published. A gossip columnist can simply repeat any story heard in a bar while drinking late at night.
Someone like Igor Cassini would certainly have had many chances to hear such a story, since he “was a grandson of a former Tsarist ambassador to the United States, Count Artur Cassini.” (Richard Spence, Wall Street and the Russian Revolution, p. 138, Trine Day LLC, 2017). But there’s nothing about the either the general record of the “Cholly Knickerbocker” gossip column or Igor Cassini himself that should make anyone presume that the brief comment published in the column of February 3, 1949, was ever based on an actual interview with John Schiff.
The story just seems to have mutated over the years through the 2nd-hand references. When I first heard of this thing 18 or so years ago, I was led to believe that the New York-Journal American had actually published an interview with John Schiff. Only after trying to track things down, did I finally realize that there was never any sign of an interview having been done, but just a short one-sentence claim made in a known gossip column. That was when I lost interest in trying to track down the original New York-Journal American of February 3, 1949.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Brad Anbro
You are in error if you think that a ruling that litigants lack standing is the same as a ruling that their case lacks merit. Your brief note suggests the lawyers who apparently sued but had their case dismissed because they lacked standing are incompetent. It should be easy to find clients who would have standing because they have suffered compensable damage from the wrongful acts of 9/11.
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Wizard of Oz says:@anarchyst
You don’t seem to dispute my view that Auschwicz and San Quentin decontamination is hardly comparable. Consider numbers killed and who would be contaminated.
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Patrick McNally says:@Billy Bob
How is this
—–
The British guarantee to Poland was key to this strategy.
—–compatible with this
—–
he could have his free hand if he acted in ways that convinced Britain he had no designs on Western Europe.
—–In Hitler’s frame of reference, a “free hand” meant precisely that he was entitled to run across Poland if he felt like it. Giving a “British guarantee to Poland” was equivalent to denying Hitler a free hand. There’s no two ways around that.
The most one could realistically maintain is that once the guarantee to Poland had been made, Hitler had still had the option of refraining from any attack on Poland while working to form an anti-Soviet alliance which could have included Poland, Hungary, Romania and some other states. I’m sure that Chamberlain could have accommodated that. But an invasion of Poland was a different matter altogether. Chamberlain never showed any willingness to endorse this.
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Patrick McNally says:@Ron Unz
> We have a leading NYC columnist
Absolute rubbish. This was a gossip column that was published for entertainment value and never was regarded as a serious news source by anyone at the time. In a column of this sort there would be nothing professionally wrong about publishing the sentence “Saddam Hussein has weapons of mass-destruction ready to go off on 45-minute notice.” The only reason that there was any scandal over Judith Miller promoting that story was because Miller was supposed to be a reporter, whereas Cassini was not.
It’s an interesting question to pose here: is all of this a sign of your brain degenerating into senility, or it really just a reflection of one big scam played on dimwitted Right-wingers? I can’t answer that since I’m not a mind-reader. But no one who is serious would ever honestly label a gossip columnist like Igor Cassini as “a leading NYC columnist.” That is absolute bollocks.
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@Ron Unz
It was purged from Amazon a few years ago along with all the other Holocaust books, but you can buy it elsewhere and there used to be copies available on-line as well.
Ron Unz seems unwilling to mention Germar Rudolf’s “Holocaust Handbooks” or “Castle Hill Publishers” or even CODOH books, where Kollerstrom’s very popular book “Breaking the Spell” is and always has been available for purchase. Why would Unz purposely not mention that?
Come to think of it, Ron Unz does not talk about, even mention Germar Rudolf in his “major” articles on Holocaust. Other than the ethnic German American Arthur Butz, he seems to veer away from German revisionists altogether, unless they are ‘German’ Jews. [Note: I have not done a deep dive on this.] The books he discusses as “waking him up” and having an impact are not those included in the Holocaust Handbooks as the recommended “Revisionist” authors. This strikes me as rather astounding. And also meaningful. Why does he focus so much on the copy-paste John Wear, and also David Irving? And while I’m at it, why does he publish the non-entity Robert Stark?
Does anyone else find this failure to mention the “Holocaust Handbooks” as a source for Nick Kollerstrom’s book strange? Or disagree with anything else I’ve said?
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@Zarathustra
To my knowledge, Hitler never set foot in England. What is your source?
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@Ron Unz
It’s fairly common for individuals who discover the correctness of some “conspiracy theories” to then gradually take up many others that are far more unlikely to be true.
Sorry Ron, wrong again. Nick Kollertrom was deeply involved in the 7/7 conspiracies in Britain BEFORE he ever saw the light re Holohoax. So reality was opposite to what you’re pulling out of your hat.
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Gabreal Jones says:@geokat62
Adolph Hitler (AH) admired the way the USA had solved the “American Indian problem” / AH toured around Germany in a high tech train / called “America”….*
@ Roy Unz To understand WW II ( and WWI for that matter) the vid of Eustace Mullins that I linked to yesterday in a comment but somehow did not make it thru your filter on the Nazi Zionist oconnection…
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Carolyn Yeager
Out of curiosity, and no confrontation intended, do you find David Irving’s scholarship unreliable?
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Truth Vigilante says:@Mark Bahner
Do you agree that the [9/11] hijackers were these men:
None of the four aircraft that were alleged to have crashed on 9/11 were hijacked by Muslims.
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Patrick McNally says:@John Wear
> After Molotov’s departure, Hitler gathered his most trusted subordinates and clearly let them understand that he planned to invade the Soviet Union.
As I pointed out with regards to the Halder diaries, Hitler had already given clear orders for an invasion of the USSR on July 31, 1940, without any hint of concern over Romanian oil. His immediate concern when he made that first announcement on July 31 was over British hopes that a Russo-German conflict would allow Britain to eventually win. That was the same perspective which he took in his January 9, 1941, speech which I was recounting above from Irving. You’re just selectively picking out phrases where they are convenient, using a hoaxer like Vladimir Rezun as a source.
Now it’s true that in those specific speeches which I had referenced (July 31, 1940, and January 9, 1941) the emphasis was not on living space. But anyone who goes at greater length through the statements recorded at the time will see that plans about living space were immediately laid out as the decision to launch Barbarossa was made. Such plans remained a priority right up to the eve of Stalingrad:
—–
Moreover, Hitler was still misled as to Stalin’s coming strength. (On October 21, Keitel said, “The Fuehrer is convinced the Russians are collapsing. He says that twenty million will have to starve.”)
—–
— David Irving, Hitler’s War, p. 438, 1977 edition, The Viking Press.• Replies: @John WearAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Patrick McNally says:@Brosi
> British supply convoy with Soviet escorts in Iran, September 1941
Iran was an important route for the delivery of Lend-Lease supplies from the Allies to the USSR. It’s not a mystery that both Britain and the USSR attached priority to making sure that a friendly government held power there. Afterwards, Soviet forces withdrew because Iran was claimed as part of the Allied domain of influence, whereas the Baltics were claimed as part of the Soviet sphere. But none of this would have become an issue if Hitler had not started World War II.
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Bankotsu says:@Patrick McNally
The most one could realistically maintain is that once the guarantee to Poland had been made, Hitler had still had the option of refraining from any attack on Poland while working to form an anti-Soviet alliance which could have included Poland, Hungary, Romania and some other states. I’m sure that Chamberlain could have accommodated that. But an invasion of Poland was a different matter altogether. Chamberlain never showed any willingness to endorse this.
Don’t know what you are trying to say in this paragraph but in August 1939, Neville Chamberlain was prepared to offer a “second Munich” deal with Hitler. He was willing to offer parts of Poland to Germany in order to block a German invasion of Poland.
“…The industrialist Lord Aberconway, longtime chairman of both John Brown, the Clydeside shipbuilding firm, and English China Clays, and also a master-gardener, has died aged 89. Three years ago, he belatedly unburdened himself of a 60-year-old guilty secret.
He told the Tory historian Andrew Roberts that, as a 26-year-old, he had been one of seven British businessmen dispatched secretly by Neville Chamberlain’s pro-appeasement government to try to stop an Anglo-German war over Poland.
Three weeks before the war the seven made their separate ways to the island of Sylt off the German coast, to meet Reichsmarschall Hermann Goering. Their purpose was to offer a “second Munich” – a four-power agreement involving Britain, Germany, France and Italy – to make further concessions to German demands for lebensraum, on condition that the Nazis did not invade Poland.
This offer, authorised by the leading appeaser, Chamberlain’s Foreign Secretary Lord Halifax, came as a shock to Halifax’s biographer Roberts, who had not found any reference to this last-minute offer in either Foreign Office documents or Halifax’s private papers. Aberconway backed his claims by showing Roberts 38 pages of documents…”
https://www.theguardian.com/news/2003/feb/06/guardianobituaries.obituaries
“…On the afternoon of March 31, Chamberlain read a statement in the House of Commons. He first said, at great length, that the British government believed every dispute could be negotiated. In the meanwhile, if Polish independence were threatened and Poland resisted with all her forces, Britain would do all in her power to help Poland, and France would do likewise.
However, this was not the end of appeasement. The British guarantee of Polish independence was meant to deter Hitler from further aggression and persuade him to obtain what he wanted from Poland by negotiation. On April 1, (All Fools’ Day),Geoffrey Dawson (1874-1944), the editor of the London Times, published an editorial saying the guarantee did not apply to Polish frontiers, but to Polish independence. In his diary, he noted that Halifax and Chamberlain agreed “this was about right.” …
https://acienciala.ku.edu/hist557/lect16.htm
Right up until September 3, 1939 Neville Chamberlain NEVER ended appeasement.
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mike smith says:
Even Hilberg’s 1961 book might have been denounced today as “holocaust denial” literature if it were written by a gentile because it explicitly states that there was no nazi masterplan to exterminate the Jews, just lots of local atrocities authorized by local decision makers.
“Another Hitler!” – EVERYONE who gets repeatedly compared to Hitler by the mainstream media is inevitably some national leader who at that time is being targeted by the US foreign policy establishment for replacement. This cannot be a coincidence. Coincidence theories are way less probable than conspiracy theories.
And I too gradually came to a realization over a period of years that most of our media sources, even though privately owned, are just as effectively controlled by the government as the old Soviet era Pravda was, and the education system is basically just another version of big media. They all read from the same script. We are immersed all our lives in half truths and outright lies.
And that reminds me that most of the East Europeans I have known who grew up under Communism and understand that all sources of information in that period were firmly controlled by liars and political hacks still default to the history lessons they were taught as school children under Communism. I can’t imagine that opening the eyes of Americans and other Westerners will be any easier.
The good news is that America is, so far, not quite the next USSR or even analogous to today’s Germany. Thanks to the First Amendment, “the truth is out there.” But the bad news is that the powers that be make it incredibly hard to find, enabling them to fool most of the people most of the time, which seems to be good enough for their purposes. At this point I will consider it a victory if we can just preserve certain much assailed historical and scientific documentation for future generations so that mankind will not be forever lost in a fog of lies about our past.
And the next big question: who controls the US government? Because it sure is not the elected officials most of whom are rather transparently errand boys (and girls). And Joe Biden! Can he even wipe his own butt? Anyone should be able to see that he is just a figurehead. His only real job is to occasionally read from the teleprompter, and sometimes he can’t even do that right. And they’re actually going to run that demented puppet for reelection! Clearly, their opinion of the American voter is even lower than mine.
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Wokechoke says:@Wizard of Oz
Many of these countries were chummy with the Germans. I’d say the Greeks were antiGerman though, but mostly just the poor sods in Crete. The Greeks are an interesting case as they fought the Italians to a standstill.
Holland and Belgium sent troops in large numbers to Barbarossa. So did Norway with a half hearted fight in 1940 followed by a quiet war. Denmark literally put up no fight and sent 5,000 into the USSR in the SS. These are not small numbers btw.
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John Wear says:@Patrick McNally
You write: “As I pointed out with regards to the Halder diaries, Hitler had already given clear orders for an invasion of the USSR on July 31, 1940, without any hint of concern over Romanian oil.”
My response: I have a copy of David Irving’s book “Hitler’s War” published by Avon Books in March 1990. It is a condensation of three of David Irving’s previously published books: The War Path: Hitler’s Germany 1933-1939; Hitler’s War 1939-1942; and Hitler’s War 1942-1945.
An interesting passage in this book is at the top of page 123.
David Irving writes: When General Franz Halder first reported to the Führer as the new chief of general staff on board the Grille on August 22, 1938, Hitler had teased him: “You will never learn my real intentions. Not even my closest colleagues, who are convinced that they know them, will ever find them out.”
So, assuming Hitler said this to Halder, I don’t think we can regard the Halder diaries as a definitive source of information.
David Irving writes on page 326 of this book that Hitler was stunned by the demands Molotov made in November 1940. Hitler said that Molotov had demanded that Germany give him military bases on Danish soil on the outlets to the North Sea. Hitler said that Molotov had also demanded Constantinople, Romania, Bulgaria and Finland.
David Irving writes at the bottom of page 326:
“While the public was deliberately fed the impression that the formal discussions had been harmonious and successful, within the Chancellery there was no doubt that the parting of the ways had come. Irrevocable and terrible in its finality, the decision Adolf Hitler now took was one he never regretted, even in the jaws of ultimate defeat.”
You write: “You’re just selectively picking out phrases where they are convenient, using a hoaxer like Vladimir Rezun as a source.”
My response: Vladimir Rezun is not a hoaxer. I suggest you read his book “The Chief Culprit” if you haven’t read it already.
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Patrick McNally says:@Ron Unz
> Actually, the official Auschwitz figure for decades had been 4 million
An “official Auschwitz figure” is not the same as what Western orthodox historians wrote, and should not be conflated with the latter. Gerald Reitlinger’s book from 1953 tells us:
—–
The world has grown distrustful of ‘rectified coefficients’ and the figure of four million has become ridiculous. Unfortunately Russian arithmetic has blurred the stark and inescapable facts that little less than a million human beings perished in Auschwitz, its gas chambers and its camps.
—–
— Reitlinger, The Final Solution, p. 460, Valentine, Mitchel & Co., Ltd., 1953.Raul Hilberg has always given the rounded number of 1 million. Of course, there’s no reason to take what these authors say for granted. It might be true that Carlo Mattogno is more accurate when says:
https://www.vho.org/GB/Books/dth/fndcrema.html
—–
From all this it follows that the ovens of Auschwitz I and Birkenau (Auschwitz II) altogether were able to cremate about (138,000 + 24,000 =) 162,000 bodies during the period of their existence. This figure agrees quite well with the number of known, deceased registered inmates.
—–If Kollerstrom has been claiming that only 55,000 died in Auschwitz, then that really does sound overbaked. Anyone who wants to get a fairly quick competent summary of basic revisionist arguments around Auschwitz may go through the above piece by Mattogno. But that “four million” is just a non-starter. Reitlinger was rejecting back in 1953.
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Patrick McNally says:@Mefobills
The general aim of gaining living space in the east of Europe for what he intended to be a vastly expanding Aryan population runs through Hitler’s entire record of statements up until Stalingrad. But as for
“there would be no practical way to do that with Stalin threatening Germany on the East,”
it’s the other way around. There was no practical way for Stalin to threaten Germany on the east, until Hitler had run across first Czechia and then Poland. If Hitler had merely observed the Munich Pact, then the Czechoslovak state would likely have peacefully dissolved on its own within 3 years or less, while Hitler could have raised the issue of Danzig as something which needed to be worked out. Chamberlain would then have encouraged the Poles to settle this, the same way he had pressed Benes to give in over Munich. In the worst-case scenario, there’s a small chance that the Poles might have been foolish to carry on a short, limited war over Danzig. But it’s just as likely that Chamberlain would have gotten the Poles to accept an agreement similar to Munich.
Either way, the outcome would have been a scenario in which Stalin would not be able to make any moves on Germany without going through an invasion of Poland and likely Romania as well. In such a case, Britain and France would have declared war on the USSR. But Stalin would not have been so stupid to do this anyway.
It was Hitler’s determination to acquire living space in the east which first drove him to shred the Munich Agreement less than 6 months after it was signed, while pressing demands on Poland that were very similar to what he had claimed about Czechoslovakia in 1938 and telling his staff that the real aim in confronting Poland was to acquire living space. Hitler did all of this with the avowed intent of eventually moving further east:
—–
As early as June 2, Hitler had mentioned to Rundstedt … “Now that Britain will presumably be willing to make peace, I will begin the final settlement of scores with bolshevism.” He obviously regarded the August 1939 pact with Stalin with increasing cynicism. It was a life insurance policy to which he had steadfastly contributed but which he now felt had served its purpose; his victory in France had given him a feeling of immortality.
—–
— David Irving, Hitler’s War, p 134, 1977 edition.This shows again that not only had Hitler reached the decision to move further to the east long before the meeting with Molotov in November, but that even when he thought Britain would likely sue for peace, he was already decided in favor of this. In the July 31 meeting which Halder describes in his diary, Hitler had invoked the British continuation of the war as a rationale for invading the USSR. But here with Rundstedt on June 2, he was anticipating that Britain would sue for peace. Yet the aim, a drive to the east was the same.
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Patrick McNally says:@Wokechoke
Schiff had nothing to do with the overthrow of the Czar. The February Revolution was a total surprise to Schiff. He welcomed it, but played no role in it.
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Mefobills says:@Wizard of Oz
Test yourself on this. Hasn’t Patrick McNally just w
quoted David Irving with passages which show that your tendency to adopt the line that Hitler’s lust for Lebebsraum was insignificant compared with his need for a
preemptive response against Stalin is at odds with your upholding Irving as your model researcher?So, this is the hill you want to die on? Hitler had lust for Lebensraum, and hence everything must be viewed through that prism? No amount of nuance, such a pivots in Hitler’s worldview, or realpolitik (such as large armies amassing) can disabuse you of your emotional stance? How about a politician that says one thing and does another? Nah. Hitler both meant what he said – as he was completely rational, and he was also crazy for invading in the east, with a Wehrmacht army built for fair weather.
That is quite the warped worldview, to use a Lebensraum distortion field as a filter. Or, perhaps you have a weak and prideful personality, and hubris cannot allow you to adjust your thinking? People become unmoored, if what they think they know, is wrong. Even if Hitler wanted Lebensraum, which I think he did, it wasn’t the reason for marching east. Hitler wanted Lebensraum in Mein Kampf because Germans were starved out by the hyperinflation, and farms had come to be owned by the (((creditor class))). By 1938, NSDAP farms had become productive with Reinhard’s debt jubilee, and other economic techniques to get the farmers back on their feet. Germany was no longer starving by 38.
As can be seen in my comments, I recommend NSDAP re-education style concentration camps. The modern version Xi used on the Uighurs also worked very well. The human brain, due to evolution, myelin sheaths neuronal pathways. Those pathways become especially strong if they are built under emotional stress. It takes much more repetition to unlearn than learn.
People that have been weaned on “Hitler evil” since birth, cannot easily let go of their programming. Egoic people especially cannot let go due to hubris.
It may actually be normal for a large section of the population to accept simple narratives and then cling to said narratives in order to function. Without the narratives, they no longer can navigate life.
Democracy is an impossibility as most of any population are normies, and hence easy to lead around by the nose with propaganda, and/or they cannot let go of their shibboleths.
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Brad Anbro says:@Wizard of Oz
Thank you for the reply. I am a retired industrial electrician, not an attorney. I do not know what the proper legal term is that I should have used. All I know is that the residing judge rfused to allow their case to move forward. This information is from the lawyers’ own website.
Thank you.
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Ron Unz says:@Carolyn Yeager
Sorry Ron, wrong again. Nick Kollertrom was deeply involved in the 7/7 conspiracies in Britain BEFORE he ever saw the light re Holohoax. So reality was opposite to what you’re pulling out of your hat.
I’m perfectly aware that Kollerstrom spent years involved in the 9/11 Truth Movement (and its 7/7 adjunct) long before he ever looked into Holocaust issues. If you’d read my comment carefully, you’d have seen I was referring to his Paul McCartney conspiracy work, which came later, in 2015.
Come to think of it, Ron Unz does not talk about, even mention Germar Rudolf in his “major” articles on Holocaust.
Either your reading comprehension or your memory is severely flawed. Here’s a paragraph from my very long 2018 Holocaust Denial article:
Dr. Germar Rudolf was a successful young German chemist working at the prestigious Max Planck Institute when he heard of the controversy regarding the Leuchter Report, which he found reasonably persuasive but containing some weaknesses. Therefore, he repeated the analysis on a more thorough basis, and published the results as the Chemistry of Auschwitz, which came to the same conclusions as Leuchter. And just like Leuchter before him, Rudolf suffered the destruction of his career and his marriage, and since Germany treats these matters in harsher fashion, he eventually served five years in prison for his scientific impudence.
Perhaps you now better understand why I regard you as a very quarrelsome individual with poor reading comprehension?
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Mefobills says:
The general aim of gaining living space in the east of Europe for what he intended to be a vastly expanding Aryan population runs through Hitler’s entire record of statements up until Stalingrad. But as for
“there would be no practical way to do that with Stalin threatening Germany on the East,”
it’s the other way around.
___________________________________________________________It’s the other way around, because Hitler attacked east with an Army built for fair weather. It’s the other way around because Germany had no long range bombers.
BUT, But, it was an offensive army built for world conquest!
Really, you “Hubris People” have quite the Ego problem. Ego makes you irrational. I can more sympathize with Hasbara rats, because they are paid.
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Patrick McNally says:
> When General Franz Halder first reported to the Führer as the new chief of general staff on board the Grille on August 22, 1938, Hitler had teased him: “You will never learn my real intentions. Not even my closest colleagues, who are convinced that they know them, will ever find them out.”
> So, assuming Hitler said this to Halder, I don’t think we can regard the Halder diaries as a definitive source of information.
First of all, the matter about Hitler telling his officers that they need to start preparing plans for an invasion of the USSR on July 31, 1940, is independent of stuff about “intentions.” The latter is more relevant when we consider Hitler’s aim of conquering living space. At the meeting of July 31, Hitler said nothing about living space but only talked about the hope in Britain that Stalin would pull Churchill’s chestnuts out of the fire. This was exactly what Stalin himself had sworn not to do. Stalin greatly suspected Churchill of wanting to draw him into the war.
But Hitler’s real intentions involved more than just a concern that Britain hoped to use Stalin as an ally. On June 2, he had spoken with Rundstedt and stated that he expected that Britain would now sue for peace, and that his objective now was to go after the USSR. So, he really was not being honest about his motives when on July 31 he justified an attack on the USSR by saying that Churchill wanted to use Stalin as an ally.
In fact, the record of Hitler’s statements going through the earliest days shows that expanded living space was his intention. All of the stuff about Churchill trying to use Stalin as an ally was secondary to that.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Brad Anbro
My apologies. It’s sometimes difficult to determine where others are in the whole “who’s destroying the world?” process.
I read a reply from you to Ms. Taubman on the Stop Blaming Jews thread; I then laughed out loud for having sent you information on the subject.
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Mark Bahner says:@Ron Unz
Well, duh, there were no gas chambers for killing inmates at Auschwitz and never had been. It’s all just a propaganda-hoax.
So you think that approximately 200,000 people died at Auschwitz, and *none* of them were gassed to death?
If so why did the Auschwitz camp commandant, Rudolph Hoess, contend in his trial by the Poles, right before his execution by them, that:
To the end, he contended that, at the most, a million and a half people had died at Auschwitz, not 5 or 6 million. At the end of the trial, he requested the court’s permission to send his wedding ring to his wife. The court announced its verdict, sentencing Hoess to death by hanging, on April 2, 1947.
https://www.auschwitz.org/en/museum/news/auschwitz-commandant-rudolf-hoess-on-the-gallows,461.html
Don’t you think he knows better than you do how many people died at Auschwitz? Or do you think this account is false, and he really said, “No more than 300,000” or something like that?
Also, why did this exchange occur at Nuremberg, in which Hoess agreed to something that was entered into evidence as his sworn affidavit:
“6. The ‘final solution’ of the Jewish question meant the complete extermination of all Jews in Europe. I was ordered to establish extermination facilities at Auschwitz in June 1941. At that time, there were already in the General Government three other extermination camps: Belzek, Treblinka, and Wolzek. These camps were under the Einsatzkommando of the Security Police and SD. I visited Treblinka to find out how they carried out their exterminations. The camp commandant at Treblinka told me that he had liquidated 80,000 in the course of one-half year. He was principally concerned with liquidating all the Jews from the Warsaw Ghetto. He used monoxide gas, and I did not think that his methods were very efficient. So when I set up the extermination building at Auschwitz, I used Cyklon B, which was a crystallized prussic acid which we dropped into the death chamber from a small opening. It took from 3 to 15 minutes to kill the people in the death chamber, depending upon climatic conditions. We knew when the people were dead because their screaming stopped. We usually waited about one-half hour before we opened the doors and removed the bodies. After the bodies were removed our special Kommandos took off the rings and extracted the gold from the teeth of the corpses.”
Is that all true and correct, Witness?HOESS: Yes.
Why wouldn’t he shout out, “I never said we gassed *anyone*, you damned liar!”?
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Patrick McNally says:@Mefobills
> an offensive army built for world conquest!
Who the heck said that? Granted, Hitler’s ambitions as outlined in his 2nd book do envision a long-range rise of Germany to world power status. But that’s over a very long-term. The intended objective of Barbarossa was that the USSR had been expected to collapse swiftly, thereby opening up a vast range of new living space for Aryans. Simultaneously, it was expected that this would cause the political downfall of Churchill and lead to a new British government which would accept Germany as the dominant continental power. Fair weather was expected to hold until September or so, at which point it was expected that the USSR would have already fallen apart.
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Mark Bahner says:@Ron Unz
I’m personally extremely skeptical of the nuke theory you mention, but if you’re interested in my own views on 9/11, here’s the link:
https://www.unz.com/runz/seeking-9-11-truth-after-twenty-years/
So in the link, you seem to be saying it must have been some sophisticated organization. Do you agree that these were the hijackers:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hijackers_in_the_September_11_attacks
?
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Mark Bahner says:@Truth Vigilante
There is no proof that any of the alleged 19 hijackers boarded ANY of those four aircraft.
No one died when those planes impacted with WTC 1 & 2 in NYC on the day of 9/11.
That’s because no one was on board either plane – they were remotely flown drones.Heh, heh, heh! Too funny! Good one!
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Ron Unz says:@Mark Bahner
If so why did the Auschwitz camp commandant, Rudolph Hoess, contend in his trial by the Poles, right before his execution by them, that:
Well, he was obviously tortured. From what I vaguely remember, much of his “confession” was logically impossible.
I’m busy with my other things and don’t have time to waste arguing about the Holocaust with you, especially since you’re just some random activist who just showed up here. So just read my long Holocaust Denial article, read the Butz book that’s available on this website, or read the Kollerstrom book, and decide for yourself:
https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-holocaust-denial/
Or maybe argue with some of the other commenters here, who love debating about the Holocaust.
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anastasia says:@Haxo Angmark
“….but I don’t care”. Says it all about so many of us for there is no true excuse
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@Ron Unz
Perhaps you now better understand why I regard you as a very quarrelsome individual with poor reading comprehension?
No, I do not and for very good reason. First, I do not fall for your tricky “selection” process in what you answer and what you don’t the way your glowy-eyed, unconditional fans here, who don’t know any better, do.
Second, your reply was not McCartney-specific, but generalized as to “conspiracy theories.” Third, by not replying to my two comments separately but adding the two together, you didn’t provide a link back to my original comment which you don’t want to answer in full or even see brought up. That is not exactly kosher, and I don’t believe accidental on your part. It is #871 Carolyn Yeager says: •
June 19, 2023 at 2:20 pm GMT • 5.2 hours ago •
@Ron UnzFourth, the small paragraph you produced re GR, if that is all you wrote and it seems to be, is not nearly in proportion to Rudolf’s giant contribution to “Holocaust Denial,” the subject of your article. [And btw, I did note that I had not done ‘a deep dive’ into your article. I was only going by your comment.] The reason for this is very possibly your own “glowy-eyed” admiration for David Irving, of whom Germar Rudolf is quoted as saying during his trial in Germany that Irving was not a Holocaust revisionist bc he was unfamiliar with the literature, and should “shut up about it.” GR either said or implied that DI did more harm than good.
Wonder if he would say the same about you? I truly do not know. Just wondering.
And fifth, you do not answer why you won’t recommend the Holocaust Handbook series, and you even say they are unavailable if not on Amazon!
If I spent more time, I could surely come up with some more reasons, but I’ll stop here and see if you will deal with these — at least #4 and 5.
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Wokechoke says:@Patrick McNally
Apart from engineering it.
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Patrick McNally says:@Wokechoke
Unleashing that would have brought likely retaliation. Churchill had prepared biological weapons in case Hitler used them first. Trying out chemical warfare in Moscow would have invited an escalation, whether from Churchill or Stalin. Hitler knew that there wasn’t any safe way to use it.
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Brad Anbro says:@Mark Bahner
Mr. Bahner:
No, Truth Vigilante’s comments are not “too funny” – they are FACTS. We (meaning the general public) do not know what struck the Twin Towers or the Pentagon. There has NEVER been a definitive PHOTOGRAPH released of ANY AIRCRAFT striking the Pentagon. Only an image of “something” striking the Pentagon and the resulting “ball of fire.” There were many CCTV cameras located in the near vicinity of the Pentagon and shortly after the event, the media from those cameras was confiscated by government personnel. Many serious researchers believe that one of our (the USA’s) own cruise missiles struck the Pentagon.
As for the Twin Towers, again, we DO NOT KNOW what struck the structures. For all we know, it could have been EMPTY Boeing aircraft, powered by remote control. The U.S. government had the technology to do just that BEFORE September 11, 2001. Regardless of what struck or didn’t strike the Twin Towers, NO AIRCRAFT struck Building 7, which was 47 stories high, occupied an entire city block, had only a few small fires burning, which NYFD was in the process of putting out, before they were ordered to evacuate. After which the building “collapsed” in under 11 seconds, straight down, defying all laws of physics and exhibiting all the characteristics of controlled demolition.
As I said to you before, it is not (our) place to “figure out” what happened, who did it and what method of demolition was used. That is the job of a FEDERAL GRAND JURY, equipped with COMPLETE SUBPOENA POWERS. There has NEVER been a grand jury convened for this purpose and I doubt very much that I will see one convened in my lifetime (I am 72 years old). Why? Simply because judges DO NOT WANT TO DIE.
A little “advice” to you – before you do any more commenting on the events of September 11, 2001, you would do well to educate yourself on the subject. You are woefully ignorant in the matter. As a starter, I suggest the following video –
Also, READ some of the many excellent books that were written by David Ray Griffin, Ph.D. (now deceased).
Thank you.
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Patrick McNally says:@Wokechoke
No one engineered the February Revolution. It broke out because the city of Petrograd was suffering from food shortages which were the result of the war disrupting distribution and transportation. The Cossacks refused to attack the crowd, something which no outsider could have forecast, and the revolution grew from there. The notion that Jacob Schiff somehow engineered these events is the epitome of Old Right stupidity.
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@Carolyn Yeager
Sorry Ron, wrong again. Nick Koller[s]trom was deeply involved in the 7/7 conspiracies in Britain BEFORE he ever saw the light re Holohoax.
I believe, Kollerstrom was involved in (private) revisionist Holocaust research before his 7/7 conspiracy theorizing, he just didn’t go public with until after 7/7: School Trips to Auschwitz “Is it a crime, to believe the data? The primary evidence for the number of Jews who died in German concentration camps lies in the archives of Bad Arolsen, in Northern Germany.” https://codoh.com/library/document/school-trips-to-auschwitz/en/ or https://archive.is/kIE8Y
I think Kollerstrom didn’t go public until early 2008, since that was when the Bad Arolsen archives opened “An archive storing files on those persecuted and killed by the Nazis officially opened in the German town of Bad Arolsen on Wednesday, April 30.” – https://www.dw.com/en/archive-of-nazi-documents-finally-opens-its-doors-to-the-public/a-3303484 or https://archive.is/OAaxmFollowing is an astrology article of his from July 2005, in which he mentions the word “holocaust” just in a different context, which likely indicates that that topic was already on his mind prior to 7/7/2005:
Britain’s Foot-and-Mouth Epidemic
[…]
It was a holocaust, with nearly four million farm animals slaughtered. Computer boffins in London (at Imperial College and the Royal Society) advised the government, overruling the advice of the recognised experts on foot-and-mouth who were advocating a very different course.– © Nick Kollerst[r]om, 2005. Published in Astro-Logos, July 2005. https://archive.is/jy7Si#selection-713.8-713.284 or https://www.skyscript.co.uk/algol.html
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kb_2 says:
Ron, have you read a recent debate between Thomas Dalton and history PhD student Matt Cockerill?
You can acceess it via CODOH website (see pdf file) https://codoh.com/news/3495/
or via Matt’s blog https://historyspeaks.substack.com/p/history-speaks-debates-thomas-daltonMy impressions is that dr. Dalton lost the debate.
The most important question that the revisionists cannot answer is where did the people moved via “transit” camps disappeared? This is the question that made revisionist Eric Hunt (documentary maker) orthodox.
As Matt wrote:
Let us suppose the 1.4 million were deposited into 24 settlements with an average population of 57,000; that would be equivalent to twenty four Greenlands. But whether we are talking about one Estonia (“Jewlantis”), twenty four Greenlands, or for that matter thirty five Leichensteins, common sense still requires us to assume there would be physical evidence (infrastructure, homes, human remains, etc), as well as testimonial, infrastructural, economic, and communicative traces of these nations, not to mention train records of the actual deportations from the Reinhardt camps to the East. But you have literally nothing. There is no evidence for “resettlements.”
Dalton answered:
Of the 1.4 million shuttled through the Reinhardt transit camps, as I said, the vast majority were shipped on to the east into captured (former-Soviet) territory, and then either interned in labor camps or released. This would have occurred between roughly mid-1942 and mid-1943. The total captured area was huge; if we combine the Reichskommissariat Ukraine, the Reichskommissariat Ostland, and occupied Soviet territory, the area is roughly twice the size of France, amounting to some 400,000 square miles (about 1 million square kilometers). That’s an average of about 3 Jews per square mile; no surprise that we can’t find them. As the Soviets recaptured all that land over the subsequent two years, they would have swallowed up all 1.4 million Jews, who were then quickly ‘locked up’ behind the Iron Curtain, for decades. There, with new lives, new names, new families, they were ‘lost’ to the West—and thus “disappeared.”
“3 Jews per square mile; no surprise that we can’t find them”! – as if during the resettlement they would be distributed evenly.
As far as I know, the revisionists seem to have found evidence of the fate of one such jew – but it crumbles before our eyes (https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2017/03/the-rothstein-canard.html).
——-
I recently skimmed through the beginning of this book (stumbled upon it before, but read a little): https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2011/12/belzec-sobibor-treblinka-holocaust.html
Very interesting, indeed.I decided to compare an Armia Krajowa wartime report (from “Wartime Reports” section from the 1st chapter) with rebuttal by Mattogno et al. (pp. 90-92) https://archive.org/details/carlo-mattogno-thomas-kues-jurgen-graf-castle-hill-publishers-2015-the-extermina/ – revisionists [I think correctly] point to the wrong reference, but in essence the whole “refutation” is a mockery (or at least that’s how it seems to me)
I am not competent enough to talk about stories about how the bodies were destroyed and where they went … But one and a half million people who disappeared without a trace on Soviet territory are hardly less fantastic than death (from any causes) under the regime who hated Jews. If there was something like that, Russian historians (including those of Jewish origin) would surely have noticed something.
P.S I have read an interesting observation made by anti-revisionist Sergey Romanov:
none of the Holocaust scholars has gone a denier, to my knowledge. It’s always a one-way track.
(https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2017/02/eric-hunt-is-no-longer-holocaust-denier.html)
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Brad Anbro says:@Patrick McNally
I do not know about the cause(s) of the “February Revolution” – but I am very familiar with the cause of the Bolshevik Revolution. Antony Sutton, Ph.D. (now deceased) wrote a book, titled “Wall Street and the Bolshevik Revolution” and this book goes into great detail about that event. Numerous other highly educated authors have confirmed his writings.
Thank you.
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soll says:@Tiptoethrutulips
Out of curiosity, and no confrontation intended, do you find David Irving’s scholarship unreliable?
Irving became a conspiracy theorist in the late 80s and threw away his career.
Watch his London Forum lecture (I recall from 2012) he alleges the Holocaust was caused solely from the 1-day boycott following the sensational Daily Express headline of March 24, 1933, titled “Judea Declares War on Germany.”
This is a 2-page article that no one who cites it has ever bothered to read, including David Irving. Had he done-so and be familiar with the context he would know this was made in response to attacks on Jewish businesses caused by the SA starting in early January, leading into February and March, hence this public response on March 24, 1933. Yeager also promotes such nonsense.
Listen to Richard Evans discussing some of Irving’s folly in the following interview on his then book, Telling Lies about Hitler.
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Patrick McNally says:@Brad Anbro
Sutton’s book is confused nonsense. He vents about Trotsky having been in New York and then being released by the Canadians after they temporarily held him for a month. But he shows no awareness that Trosky did not join the Bolsheviks until July, had been a bitter opponent of Lenin’s for the previous 14 years, and was released by the Canadians because the Russian foreign minister Paul Milyukov had demanded that Trotsky be released.
Sutton shows that he has no knowledge at all of the Russian Civil War and no understanding of how it is that the Bolsheviks won. The fact is that no one gave the Bolsheviks anything which would have contributed to their war effort while the civil war was ongoing. The Whites were given a goodly amount of aid, but routinely wasted it through straight corruption.
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John Wear says:@kb_2
You write: “The most important question that the revisionists cannot answer is where did the people moved via “transit” camps disappeared? This is the question that made revisionist Eric Hunt (documentary maker) orthodox.”
My response: I wrote an article on this subject, which you can read at https://inconvenienthistory.com/15/1/8206.
I also wrote a related article at https://inconvenienthistory.com/12/2/7291. We know that the Jews were not killed at the Aktion Reinhardt camps, as this article makes clear.
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BlackFlag says:@Malla
Chiang Kai-shek realised the risks Communism posed to China had said that Japanese are eczema, CCP is cancer.
In hindsight, seeing the pragmatic turn the CCP was able to once it consolidated power, apparently both the Japanese and the CCP were merely diseases of the skin.
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Wokechoke says:@Patrick McNally
You are such a bullshitter.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Takahashi_Korekiyo
Russo-Japanese War of 1904–1905, Takahashi raised foreign loans that were critical to Japan’s war effort. He met personally with American financier Jacob Schiff, who floated half of Japan’s loans in the U.S. He also raised loans from the Rothschild family in Britain.
For this success, he was appointed to the House of Peers of the Diet of Japan in 1905.
Takahashi was named president of the Yokohama Specie Bank in 1906. He was made a baron (danshaku) under the kazoku peerage system in 1907.
Takahashi was Governor of the Bank of Japan from 1 June 1911, through 20 February 1913.A Jew and a Jap meet in London… Revolution in Russian Empire follows.
The United States, Tsarist Russia, and the issue of Russia’s Jewish pogroms
Throughout its history, the United States of America had considered itself one of Tsarist Russia’s most loyal allies. Tsarist Russia had provided aid in opposing England, France, and the Confederate States during the American Civil War, and the U.S. reciprocated this support. The U.S. maintained generally friendly relations with Tsarist Russia for more than half a century afterwards, even helping it, under the leadership of President Theodore Roosevelt, in ending the devastating Russo-Japanese War of 1904-05.However, the United States was not wholeheartedly supportive of all of its ally’s policies. Namely, from the 1880s until 1917, the U.S. expressed dissatisfaction over Tsarist Russia’s policies regarding its Jewish citizens. Beginning in 1881 with the renewal of Russian pogroms against Jews, John W. Foster, the U.S. minister to Russia, reported on the “violence and chaos in […] more than 100 [Jewish] communities” in which “mobs assaulted and killed inhabitants, looted their homes and shops, and destroyed an enormous amount of their property.” What was more disconcerting to the U.S. government, however, was the fact that “Russian Jews suffered not only from hostile mobs but from a hostile government.” In 1882, “severe new laws” on the part of the Tsarist government “prohibited [Russian Jews] from settling in the countryside, restricting nearly all of them – five million by 1897 – to cities, towns, or hamlets in the Pale of Settlement, some 162,000 square miles in western Russia.”7 Collectively, the Russian laws on Jewish matters “consisted of a vast number of restrictive edicts on all aspects of life, which could, when enforced, cause Jews incalculable hardship.”
It was all about Jews.
Before the Japs Schiff had funded the Turks. In response to the American government’s indifferent treatment of the Russian Jew issue, American Jewish leaders led by Jacob H. Schiff intervened. Schiff had repeatedly refused to raise loans for Tsarist Russia, whose rulers had “oppressed” his people for centuries, and he encouraged other American bankers to do the same. Beginning with the Russo-Turkish War of 1877-78, as “treasurer of the American committee which raised funds for the relief of Jews,” Schiff took to financing and organizing the sponsorship of the enemies of the Russian tsar in an attempt to weaken and eventually terminate the tsarist régime.
Schiff later boasted he’d funded the the 1917 revolution ffs. He had a track record.
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Ron Unz says:@Carolyn Yeager
Fourth, the small paragraph you produced re GR, if that is all you wrote and it seems to be, is not nearly in proportion to Rudolf’s giant contribution to “Holocaust Denial,” the subject of your article. [And btw, I did note that I had not done ‘a deep dive’ into your article. I was only going by your comment.]
Like I said, you’re a very stubborn and quarrelsome person…
You denounced me for never mentioning Germar Rudolf in any of my Holocaust articles, so I quoted you a paragraph in which I’d discussed him. You then defended yourself by saying you’d never actually bothered reading my articles that you were attacking, and also argued that a single paragraph wasn’t enough coverage.
That reminds me of a year or two ago when you’d claimed that Arthur Butz had never used the word “Nazi” in his Holocaust book, and I pointed out that he’d actually used “Nazi” something like 179 times, including in the titles of some of his chapters. But you’d refused to admit you were wrong.
A very, very stubborn and quarrelsome person…
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Wokechoke says:@soll
The Jews had declared war on Germany much earlier. It’s not widely known today but the chief commissioner of the Berlin Police was a Jew called Bernard Weiss. Jews were not a persecuted minority at all. They controlled much of the state security apparatus of Weimar Germany much to the annoyance of Germans. Weiss and Goebbels fought street battles and legal court cases for libel for years before Goebbels defeated him and chased him out of Germany. The guy filed 40 suits for libel on Goebbels.
#/media/File:Bundesarchiv_Bild_102-10213,_Bernhard_Wei%C3%9F.jpg)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernhard_Weiß_(police_executive)
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Wokechoke says:@Brad Anbro
Schiff was financing two wars on Russia before the devotion. He definitely sent money overthrow the Tsar in 1917. The Revolution did liberate the Jews. Sadly. The Tsarists had kept the vampires at bay for centuries but they ran out of luck.
The 60,000 or so white officers who lost in the civil war were massacred by Belu Kun and this Jewish cunt the Governor of Crimea for a time Rose Zalkind.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Béla_Kun
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosalia_Zemlyachka
She loaded the surrendered men on barges and sank the ships out in the Black Sea
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
Thanks.
I couldn’t seem to use Zelle. Don’t want to use my credit card. Checks are a pain. Maybe I’ll just wait for the movie. ;-
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soll says:@Brad Anbro
I do not know about the cause(s) of the “February Revolution”
The February Revolution was caused by the populace. It was started on International Women’s Day, while caused from the affects resulting largely from the war and food shortages in the city of St. Petersburg. Food existed in the outer regions, although being unable to supply the city everyone basically joined together in their own uprisings. Tsarism was in high disdain long before 1917, you can start with the serfs emancipation of 1861 and follow through Revolutionary Russia and the whole revolutionary movements, including the birth of modern Terrorism.
In the late 1800s for example on average up to 300 government officials were killed each month. There was no free press (this was opened for the decade of 1855-1865) then ended until the people forcing minor reforms following the 1905 Russian Revolution. While Russia began modernization in the 1890s+ the peasants produced the exports to the West, in return for investments used to build the industry in Russia. This caused famines in the early 1890s repeated for Stalin 40 years later.
The peasants then was forced into the cities working up to 16-18 hour days, during the early 1900s to 1905, 1914 and to February 1917 there was thousands of worker strikes. You have to remember the majority of the revolutionaries had been stuck in exile (so the Russian colonies of London, Paris and Geneva) etc. for 30+ years before the February Revolution. Lenin had been out of Russia since 1900, he returned in 1905 and left until his return following the February uprisings.
No one has interest in studying Revolutionary Russia (40 odd years) so people like Ron, John Wear etc. start strictly from October 1917. ROFL; The whole social context of Imperial Russia is ignored, both turn the Russian Revolution(s) into a cartoon episode of fables and rumours.
If it’s not featured in America’s leading gossip column published 32 years later it is not true. If the rumors are not from White propaganda of the Civil War, 1918-1921 likewise it’s not true etc. John Wear has never read a book on the Russian Revolutions, neither as Ron Unz (claims he’s read Richard Pipes a decade or-so ago, yet in 2017 he was writing articles where the February Revolution never occurred).
Antony Sutton, Ph.D. (now deceased) wrote a book, titled “Wall Street and the Bolshevik Revolution” and this book goes into great detail about that event. Numerous other highly educated authors have confirmed his writings.
Sutton’s work is outdated, it’s why Richard Spence wrote his book ‘Wall Street and the Revolution Revolution, 1905-1925’ (2017)
see, https://archive.org/details/richard-spence-wall-street-and-the-russian-revolution-audio
At least Sutton dismissed Schiff as supporting the Bolsheviks, yet he turns the conspiracy as instead led by Rockefeller and Morgan. it’s just as bizarre. To quote Delphine Slotten’s essay summary on Sutton, of such reports, and theories.
British historian Antony C. Sutton (1925-2002) extensively reviewed the primary sources of the “Jewish conspiracy” era, and his research largely indicated that both the American and British governments and politicians were misinformed in terms of the knowledge they presented. Sutton specifically evaluated Winston Churchill’s “Zionism Versus Bolshevism” February 1920 news article. According to Sutton, Churchill had, “contrary to fact,” asserted that with the exception of Lenin, “the majority of the leading figures of the revolution were Jewish,” and that, also contrary to fact, “Jewish interests and Jewish places of worship were exempted by the Bolsheviks from their policies of seizure.”
The inaccuracy of the assertions made by Churchill (a significant British politician), as made evident by Sutton, indicates the extent to which both the American and the British governments believed (even if falsely) in the “Jewish conspiracy”: both camps were prepared either to uncritically believe false information or to intentionally fabricate and disseminate it through such public forums as the newspaper.
In his assessment of the position taken by American and British government officials in the 1920s regarding the conspiracy, Anthony Sutton revealed the existence of U.S. State Department files that “confirm that the investment banker Jacob Schiff, often cited as a source of funds for the Bolshevik Revolution, was in fact against support of the Bolshevik régime.” Specifically, cables and letters between Schiff and American government officials reveal his willingness to assist the Russian Jewish banker Kamenka in gaining Allied support against the Bolsheviks “because [the] Bolshevik government does not represent [the] Russian people.*”
*Jacob H. Schiff, letter to State Department (Mr. Polk), November 25, 1918.
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Ron Unz says:@Patrick McNally
It’s an interesting question to pose here: is all of this a sign of your brain degenerating into senility
Look, you’re just a dishonest propagandist, very possibly paid to spend endless hours on this website spouting your obfuscating nonsense.
This entire exchange began when you disputed the obvious fact that the top Bolshevik leadership was overwhelmingly Jewish, and I eventually added the additional detail that in 1949 a leading NYC newspaper had credibly reported that according to his grandson, Jacob Schiff had bankrolled the entire Bolshevik Revolution. Your approach is to challenge each individual piece of evidence and source, but never provide any contrary evidence on the other side.
For example, here’s one of my paragraphs from a previous article, with all the links available in the original:
Meanwhile, all historians know perfectly well that the Bolshevik leaders were overwhelmingly Jewish, with three of the five revolutionaries Lenin named as his plausible successors coming from that background. Although only around 4% of Russia’s population was Jewish, a few years ago Vladimir Putin stated that Jews constituted perhaps 80-85% of the early Soviet government, an estimate fully consistent with the contemporaneous claims of Winston Churchill, Times of London correspondent Robert Wilton, and the officers of American Military Intelligence. Recent books by Alexander Solzhenitsyn, Yuri Slezkine, and others have all painted a very similar picture. And prior to World War II, Jews remained enormously over-represented in the Communist leadership, especially dominating the Gulag administration and the top ranks of the dreaded NKVD.
https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-holocaust-denial/
So you can just add those eight or nine other top-quality sources to John Schiff’s reported 1949 statement about his grand-father.
Since you’re so focused on this subject, can you locate a single, high-quality contemporaneous source that states the early Bolshevik leadership was NOT overwhelmingly Jewish?
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Patrick McNally says:@Wokechoke
> Schiff later boasted he’d funded the the 1917 revolution
He boasted nothing of the sort. He celebrated the February Revolution and never made any boasts about allegedly funding it (which would be pretty stupid since it was essentially a spontaneous event).
In any event, in classical shyster fashion you’ve suddenly swerved the topic over from the February Revolution of 1917 to the Russo-Japanese War of 1904-5. Pure dishonesty on your part.
As far as the Russo-Japanese War goes, yes, Schiff certainly did provide Japan with funds. But France and Germany provided Russia with funds. A liar makes it seem like Japan was getting massive support while Russia did not. That was not the case. Both powers were given various loans from the outside. But the Russian defeat was a consequence of poor decisions by the Russian staff, not any special funding by outside powers for Japan.
Again, this has no bearing on the February Revolution which was sparked by the breakdown of food deliveries in Petrograd and had nothing to do with outside funding from anyone.
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Mark Bahner says:@Tiptoethrutulips
These essays are some of the best I’ve read; not too technical, but very informative. It’s very helpful for skeptics.
I don’t have time to read anything other than the WTC stuff. They seem to be saying the Israelis did a controlled demolition of WTC-7. Is that correct?
If that’s what they’re saying, then are they also saying that the Israelis caused the 19 hijackers (overwhelmingly Saudis) to fly the two planes into the WTC twin towers? Really?
And if they’re saying that the Israelis were working separate from the 19 hijackers, isn’t it extremely unlikely that the Israelis just happened to set up a controlled demolition for WTC-7 on the same day the 19 hijackers flew into the twin towers? (And who even really cares about WTC-7 anyway? No one was hurt in that collapse, and it’s not like a bridge collapse where no one can move around until the bridge is replaced…)
Isn’t the most likely reason for the WTC-7 tower collapse exactly what NIST says? That uncontrolled fires that had neither sprinklers nor firefighting crews (who decided just not to try to put out the fires) caused thermal expansion of a critical area, leading to failure of inner column 79, followed by other nearby columns, followed by failure of the whole mess?
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@soll
I watched the video. It seems to be more “spin.”
It begins with the images of corpses of Jews. We see these images everywhere. We don’t see images of the Bolshevik carnage in Russia (most Americans know nothing of it whatsoever); no images of ethnic Germans killed in Danzig. These events must have contributed to Hitler’s animus towards organized Jewry. (I know Danzig was further along in the process of actual war)
The movie says there was ‘no Judea” in existence, therefore no war could be declared by Jews against Germany. Well, I have no doubt that Israel existed in the hearts and mind of Jews, regardless of who was actually living in their holy land. And, they were trickling back in, weren’t they, after the Balfour declaration? Besides, no one really mistook that declaration to be an actual “hot” war. There are countless examples of Jews actually saying Germany Must Perish! Or Edom and Amalek must be destroyed, but those statements are always dismissed out of hand. Except, I guess, by Hitler.
Everyone knows Hitler believed the Jewish influence in Germany was destructive and he wanted them out. Most of us once believed he began his burning and boiling immediately upon coming to power because that’s how mainstream media/history presents it. I am astonished at the outrageous falsehoods and exaggerations made by the mainstream establishment. I have listened to his many speeches, not all of course, and I spent months translating his German language to the English subtitles, so I could be reasonably sure it was accurate. I believe he wanted the influential Jews out of power, he wanted previous German territories returned, and he wanted to accomplish it peacefully, if possible.
I admit I have a soft spot for Irving. I think his intentions were honest and he stumbled upon his revisionism after researching Dresden. But, I will listen to the interview you cited. Thank you.
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Patrick McNally says:@Ron Unz
> I eventually added the additional detail that in 1949 a leading NYC newspaper had credibly reported that according to his grandson, Jacob Schiff had bankrolled the entire Bolshevik Revolution.
And I pointed out that such was not the case at all. What you call “a leading NYC newspaper” is a misdirection since the claim was simply stated in a gossip column which is not regarded as part of the news section and does not operate according to the standards which a news reporter is supposed to be responsible for.
> So you can just add those eight or nine other top-quality sources
Nonsense. Most of what those sources claimed in that time would be dismissed by you because it was heavily anti-German propaganda. For example, Robert Wilton was fanatically anti-German. Wilton’s rubbish is only treated seriously by you on very select topics where it is convenient.
As for a good beginning source on the party membership, I’ve references this page before:
http://holocaust.skeptik.net/misc/party.htm
It’s a good place to start.
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soll says:@Ron Unz
Recent books by Alexander Solzhenitsyn, Yuri Slezkine, and others have all painted a very similar picture.
Only if selectively misrepresenting their works. As engagingly done by the likes of one “Dr.” David Duke, who both you and John enjoy using as your base of knowledge.
Meanwhile, all historians know perfectly well that the Bolshevik leaders were overwhelmingly Jewish, with three of the five revolutionaries Lenin named as his plausible successors coming from that background.
While only Stalin, the Georgian non-Jew was raised as 2nd in line? Why do you keep including Trotsky in your list, not knowing of their hatred past between each other?
Although only around 4% of Russia’s population was Jewish, a few years ago Vladimir Putin stated that Jews constituted perhaps 80-85% of the early Soviet government, an estimate fully consistent with the contemporaneous claims of Winston Churchill,
Simply check the individuals yourself, and count the Jews in the First Government. Putin was called out at the time for his falsehoods.
Or let J. Arch Getty, one of America’s foremost scholars on the Soviet Communist Party, the Great Terror and secret police. give you a walk through.
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soll says:@Wokechoke
Russo-Japanese War of 1904–1905, Takahashi raised foreign loans that were critical to Japan’s war effort. He met personally with American financier Jacob Schiff, who floated half of Japan’s loans in the U.S. He also raised loans from the Rothschild family in Britain.
Schiff secured Takahashi’s 10 million loan request through Rockefeller at National City Bank, and Warburg of M. M. Warburg & Co. of Germany. Rothschilds of London opposed to support so not to caused additional pogroms in Russia (being the Kishinev massacre of 1903 which had infused Schiff’s passing disdain of Tsarism since 1890 to becoming now actively involved) the Rothschilds branch of Paris was supportive.
What’s omitted is that the U.S. government had secured more to Japan.
A Jew and a Jap meet in London… Revolution in Russian Empire follows.
Yet Revolutionary Russia existed actively 30+ years prior to the 1905 Revolution. The fall of Tsarism did not start in 1904-1905.
Schiff later boasted he’d funded the the 1917 revolution ffs. He had a track record.
No, Schiff boasted the February Revolution as featured in newspapers in the West dated in March of 1917. Search them online.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
There is no way someone can take flying lessons on prop planes, or whatever they were training on, which I am sure were NOT passenger jets, and then have the ability to commandeer state of the art passenger jets and maneuver them in that manner. I think the Saudi stooges had only a few lessons, if I remember correctly. That has to be impossible.
Building 7 imploded in essentially the same manner as the other two, sans the projectiles. There was some government information storage in building 7, much like the obliterated information storage sector of the pentagon. What a happy coincidence.
You can also find an audio recording of Lucky Larry Silverstein saying he ASKED THE FIRE DEPARTMENT TO “JUST PULL IT”…..just pull building 7 as there has been so much loss of life. Then he hammers on about how his wife insisted he skip his morning breakfast at the tower for a doctors appointment, that he was apparently unaware of until that very morning. His children also somehow managed to be elsewhere that morning too, as they both worked in one of those towers.
If you really want to better understand the issues regarding 911, I would read those essays for a start. They are not very long. Lucky Larry’s “pull it” audio is still on the internet; I would look for it before it’s gone forever.
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Truth Vigilante says:@soll
Soll (I assume your handle is short for ‘Solomon’ ?), writes:
Irving became a conspiracy theorist in the late 80s and threw away his career.
Irving’s earlier historical output (ie: before the late 80’s), made no mention of the authenticity or otherwise of the Holohoax.
Needless to say, Irving was the darling of the Jewish literary community up until that point and received widespread acclaim from those entities.Then, starting with his book ‘Hitler’s War’ released in the late 80’s, where Irving mentions that he could find no documents to support the contention that the Fuhrer ordered the ‘Final Solution’, immediately thereafter the small hats hounded and demonised him from pillar to post.
What a coincidence.
SUMMARY: David Irving is the greatest WWII historian that ever lived – by a country mile.
As more information becomes available and classified docs are released, Irving’s already stellar reputation is only further enhanced.Soll/Solomon, your attempts (and those of paid propagandists like Richard Evans) to sully Irving’s reputation are not working.
Go back to your Talmudic controllers and tell them that the UR readership are aware that you have an axe to grind in peddling derogatory nonsense about David Irving.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
@Ron Unz
No, no, no, you are going by selective reading, which you know but do it anyway as subterfuge to avoid the real questions I’m asking.
You denounced me for never mentioning Germar Rudolf in any of my Holocaust articles,
I did not. I said:
“the small paragraph you produced re GR, if that is all you wrote and it seems to be, is not nearly in proportion to Rudolf’s giant contribution to ‘Holocaust Denial,’ the subject of your article.”
I was clearly speaking of that article only. And I had read it, but I only did not go back and check it out again, as I indicated with “I didn’t do a deep dive.” You also said
You then defended yourself by saying you’d never actually bothered reading my articles that you were attacking,
False. Please quote me writing that. I did not, and not even anything like it!
You end up being the one who is not reading carefully or has “poor reading comprehension”. You are reduced to bringing up an old dispute re Butz which you did not win, you just stopped. I didn’t “claim,” or say anything that was “wrong,” so naturally I wasn’t going to “admit it.” The whole Butz argument about the “common” use of “Nazi” remains open. I would be happy to continue it bc there are a lot of good side issues that it also opens up.
Unfortunately, most participants here are like John Wear with his very active “agree” button – major cowards who can’t take the heat in the kitchen where the ‘cooking’ is going on. He bows out of the fray but then wants to punch from behind the ‘big guy’ – you, Ron.
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Ron Unz says:@Patrick McNally
Nonsense.
Just out of curiosity I checked, and since the beginning of this year you’ve already published over 100,000 words of comments on this website, while you’d published 100,000 words last year and nearly 200,000 the year before. That’s really quite a lot, the equivalent of several good size books.
There are probably a few other commenters here with higher totals, but they’re mostly individuals with extremely unorthodox views on hot-button topics important to them, views banned on almost every other website. So it’s natural they’d take advantage of the relative freedom of speech here.
You, on the other hand, seem to have ultra-conventional views on Jews, the Bolshevik Revolution, and World War II. That raises all sorts of questions about why you would spend so much of your time on this website, writing such detailed comments totaling hundreds of thousands of words defending the conventional narrative and disputing the obvious reality that the top early Bolshevik leadership was overwhelmingly Jewish. Why put in so much time and effort on this fringe-website? Don’t you have a job at which you need to be earning a living?
Perhaps you’re just a very publicly-spirited citizen, and commenting on this website is your primary leisure activity. But I think it’s far more likely that commenting on this website is your job and how your earn your living. Presumably you’re being paid by the ADL or some similar sort of organization to obfuscate those facts they wish to see obfuscated.
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Mark Bahner says:
Hi,
You write:There is no way someone can take flying lessons on prop planes, or whatever they were training on, which I am sure were NOT passenger jets, and then have the ability to commandeer state of the art passenger jets and maneuver them in that manner. I think the Saudi stooges had only a few lessons, if I remember correctly. That has to be impossible.
Apparently, the had both flight lessons and used flight simulator games:
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Pierre de Craon says:
Ron Unz writes,
In 2000, journalist Robert M. Stinnett published a wealth of additional supporting evidence, based upon his eight years of archival research, [that FDR knew that a Japanese fleet was steaming toward Pearl Harbor].
A specimen of the virulence of the Establishment’s response to Stinnett’s Day of Deceit can be seen in this transcript of a 2003 debate, conducted under the auspices of the Independent Institute, between Stinnett and the (almost certainly Jewish) historian-cum-NSA-stooge Stephen Budiansky. In its essence, Budiansky’s response to Stinnett amounts to little more than “respectable people wouldn’t touch you and your conspiracy theories with a barge pole.”
A critical part of the Pearl Harbor conspiracy was the need to fix blame for the calamity on someone, anyone, so long as he was far, far away from Washington and FDR. According to former naval Captain Edward L. Beach (d. 2002), author of Scapegoats: A Defense of Kimmel and Short at Pearl Harbor, the evidence that FDR and his principal military and naval advisers, both civilian and uniformed, deliberately withheld absolutely critical information from the two Pearl Harbor commanders is overwhelming and has also been willfully suppressed, both at the time and for decades thereafter.
On December 7, 1999, at Pearl Harbor, Captain Beach was part of a panel discussion, under US Navy auspices, whose topic was whether Admiral Kimmel had been treated justly or otherwise by the US government. Captain Beach’s main presentation can be seen and heard during the last twenty-one minutes of the video in the C-SPAN archives. Anyone who watches the ninety minutes that precede Beach’s presentation, however, will not fail to note how assiduously the Establishment historians on the stage resist any and all attempts to tarnish FDR’s halo.
For whatever reason—Establishment self-protection springs unbidden to mind—C-SPAN does not archive the remaining two hours or so of the panel discussion. I know this to be so because I saw the discussion in its entirety on the occasion of its first broadcast, either on or shortly after the discussion’s occurrence. At least for me, the most eye-opening bit of information was contained in a telling remark that Beach made either in response to an audience member’s question or in rebuttal of another panelist’s remarks—I can’t recall which. (In other words, this occurred during the unarchived portion of the discussion.)
The telling remark was this: Beach noted in passing that only the aircraft carriers and the submarines in the US Pacific Fleet were essential to the conduct of the war that senior American strategists and the naval high command all saw on the horizon.* These, of course, were the very vessels that were dispatched from Pearl Harbor, on direct, unexplained orders from the Chief of Naval Operations in DC, on maneuvers to the east of the Hawaiian Islands a few days before the Japanese attack. In other words, the battleships and other vessels that sustained such severe damage on December 7, 1941, were considered the weapons of yesteryear’s wars. Hence, to the FDR administration, they were expendable. The same could justly be said of the roughly 2,400 men who died and the thousand or so more who were injured in the attack.
_________
*The fact that this comment by Beach did not occasion the slightest stir from anyone on stage or in the auditorium told me straight away that naval professionals and historians of the attack consider this assessment uncontroversial.• Thanks: John WearAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER -
Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
I am familiar with Occam’s Razor. Occam’s Butterknife is what’s applicable with 911. In my opinion.
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Mark Bahner says:@Tiptoethrutulips
Lucky Larry’s “pull it” audio is still on the internet; I would look for it before it’s gone forever.
Nothing is ever gone forever from the Internet. Here’s a “Quora” question/answer regarding “pull it”:
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Kb_2 says:@John Wear
I know both articles and my opinion that it doesn’t answer the question satisfactorily.
P.S You may be pleased to know (if you don’t know) that many of your articles were translated into Russian – I read many of it some time ago on website “Велесова слобода”
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Wizard of Oz says:@Brad Anbro
Can you please provide the link to their website.
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John Wear says:@Kb_2
You write: “I know both articles and my opinion that it doesn’t answer the question satisfactorily.”
My response: Another Jew who survived Treblinka was Sol Rosenberg, who ended up living in Monroe, Louisiana. Sol Rosenberg said he was in Treblinka but escaped within two days. His account can be read in the book “Sol’s Story”, available on Amazon at https://www.amazon.com/Sols-Story-story-survived-thrived/dp/1728689503.
I don’t recommend this book, and do not count him as a Treblinka survivor because Sol Rosenberg said he escaped from Treblinka and was never transited out of the camp.
You write: “P.S You may be pleased to know (if you don’t know) that many of your articles were translated into Russian – I read many of it some time ago on website “Велесова слобода”
My response: I did not know this. I am glad someone has taken the time to translate some of my articles into Russian.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Tiptoethrutulips
modern, steel framed buildings that imploded, nearly into dust, due to a few office fires.
What’s that got to do with 9/11 when steel beams were thrown over 100.metres from where the buildings stood?
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Gabreal Jones says:@Gabreal Jones
@ Roy Unz / Thanks for posting….
I read that you see no connection between the est. of the FED in 1913 & WWI….but imv there is one just after Wilsons commitment to them December 1913 WWI started in 1914
And the the bolshewiks like Trotzky – who spent some time in NYC as you will know- & Lenin were directly financed by them…
1913 is also the launch of the ADL / I know about the Leo Frank rape story but then again same year…
1913 is also the year of the usurers Income Tax…
They are kabbalists & therefore also numerologists / they may not always know the exact outcome of their using these methodologies.
CIA O
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Mark Bahner says:@Tiptoethrutulips
[This really isn’t a 9/11 thread and such off-topic comments may not be published. Instead take this discussion to one of the many 9/11 threads.]
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@Tiptoethrutulips
Go to my website by clicking on that word next to my name, type “David Irving” into the search box and read the results that come up. You’ll find the answer to your question. See how easy?
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Truth Vigilante says:@Mark Bahner
Bahner, I’d normally take the time to respond to individuals that, after having done quite a bit of research of their own utilising reputable sources, who then wanted to have some other pieces of the 9/11 puzzle connected.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner[MORE]AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Wizard of Oz[MORE]• Replies: @Wizard of OzAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Carolyn Yeager
Yes, Ma’am. Thanks.
I actually have toggled to your site after reading through these threads. I didn’t notice it before, but I’ll check again.
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Mark Bahner says:@Ron Unz
I’m busy with my other things and don’t have time to waste arguing about the Holocaust with you,…
I can understand why you don’t want to argue with me about the Holocaust. The more we talk about the Holocaust the clearer it is how far you are divorced from reality. Here are your positions on Auschwitz, a part of the Holocaust (or correct me if I’m wrong):
1) Only 200,000 people died at Auschwitz,
2) Most of the 200,000 people died of disease, and
3) *Not one person* was gassed to death at Auschwitz.
4) Zyklon-B was used to save Jewish lives, not to take them.In contrast, here are my positions:
1) More than 1,o00,000 people died at Auschwitz,
2) They were murdered by various means, including gassing, starvation, overwork…you name it.
3) *Of course* people were gassed to death at Auschwitz.
4) *Of course* Zyklon-B was used to gas people to death at Auschwitz. Not a single credible historical or scientific organization doubts this. There are numerous eyewitness accounts, including by the *Commandant* of the camp, Rudolph Hoess. For example:(See A “MASS MURDERER REPENTS: The Case of Rudolf Hoess, Commandant of Auschwitz,” by
John Jay Hughes, Archbishop Gerety Lecture at Seton Hall University, March 25, 1998.)From that Adobe Acrobat file, in the words of Rudolph Hoess:
I had to appear cold and heartless during these events which tear the heart apart in anyone who had any kind of human feelings. … Coldly I had to stand and watch as the mothers went into the gas chambers with their laughing or crying children. … I was never happy at Auschwitz once the mass annihilation began.
And:
“Did you never have qualms of conscience?” the Polish prosecutor asked Hoess at his trial.
Yes, later [he replied] when the mass transports arrived – especially when we had to exterminate women daily. Everyone involved had the same unspoken question: was this necessary? They came to me a number of times and spoke about this. All I could do was tell them that we had to carry out orders without permitting ourselves any human feelings.37
So again, of course you don’t want to argue about the Holocaust with me. It simply shows how inexcusably ignorant you are (in this age of the Internet), and how divorced you are from reality.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “Of course people were gassed to death at Auschwitz.”
My response: There were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau. If you have an interest, you can read my articles on this subject at https://www.inconvenienthistory.com/9/4/5160 and
https://www.inconvenienthistory.com/12/1/7200.You write: “There are numerous eyewitness accounts, including by the *Commandant* of the camp, Rudolph Hoess.”
My response: Rudolf Höss was tortured into making his famous confessions. For more detailed information, I recommend you read my article at http://www.wearswar.com/2022/05/30/rudolf-hoss-tortured-into-making-his-confessions/.
You write: “So again, of course you don’t want to argue about the Holocaust with me. It simply shows how inexcusably ignorant you are (in this age of the Internet), and how divorced you are from reality.”
My response: Ron Unz is busy writing articles and managing his website. By contrast, I am retired and have plenty of free time on my hands. Feel free to discuss the so-called Holocaust with me all you want. I will be happy to answer all of your questions.
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soll says:@Ron Unz
Welcome guest articles that challenge and debates such topics allowing for the arguments and contradictory sources to be presented in whole.
Often Ron you appear to choose name-calling and invoking conspiracy theories alleging those who regularly critique like Patrick are ‘being paid for and working for some agency.’ As even done in your response. Some of us used too entertain such ideas being promoted, only later to have come to dismiss them.
Create a debating history category, if what is believed to be true can withstand critique then it reflects the most likely, and probable of being true. Have Patrick write an article on the myth of etc. and allow the arguments to stand or fall by themselves. It could form a series, follow up article by some who disagree etc.. only rule is sources are to be cited in full.
The long form comment section produces enough pro-cons to create the follow-up topics to debate.
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Truth Vigilante says:@soll
Soll/Solomon writes:
Have Patrick write an article on the myth of etc. and allow the arguments to stand or fall by themselves. It could form a series, follow up article by some who disagree etc.
The fellow that uses the handle ‘Patrick McNally’ (to divert attention away from his Talmudic background), is a KNOWN disinformer.
Assuming we could get anyone to read his B.S, we already know what the outcome is going to be.
ie: ALL objective UR readers would vehemently disagree with his output.So Solomon, what’s the point ?
Why would Ron Unz lower the standard of his excellent webzine by featuring a fool like Shlomo McNally ?
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Kali says:@Carolyn Yeager
Well hello there Carolyn Yeager!
Correct me if I’m wrong (I’m sure you’ll try even if I’m not), but are you not supposed to be working on an article of your own right now, rather than badgering Mr Unz? – You did say you would write something for your website regarding Hess’ trip to Scotland that would take you some time to complete.
Yet here you are, dishonestly (we can all read) quibbling with Ron over trivial comments, thus taking up his valuable time, whilst attempting to discredit his important work for no discernable reason, just as you have done time and again with the very gracious John Wear.
Given your track record on this website I believe that Ron may be mistaken, that you are not simply a stubborn, argumentative old woman. I think you may well be an agent, one of several, here to disrupt, obfuscate and discredit the work of others.
If I am wrong about that I do not care, because, agent or not, the effect is the same.
Ron has already told you he is busy with othere things, so lay off him with your ridiculous nit-picking. If you’re bored come after me instead.
Or go and write that article you promised us!
Bye now,
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Tisch says:@Bukowski
“As evidenced by the total betrayal of Poland by the British in 1945”.
No. That is not so. In late 1944 and early 1945, W. Churchill tried very hard to get the exiled Polish government in London to get the “London Poles” to make some sort of accomodation with the USSR- given that Poland at that time was largely occupied by the advancing Red Army and Poland was anyway on the other side of Europe and far away. He offered to use his – not insignificant – influence with Stalin to help make the most out of a bad situation. He might well have obtained some real concessions for Poland from the USSR. After all, on 9th October 1944, he had persuaded Stalin to agree to the Percentages Agreement, a deal to which Stalin adhered and which broadly settled the political map of Eastern Europe for the next 45 years.
Churchill met the London Polish government in exile about six times during those months but got nowhere. He was quite polite about them in his memoirs, though bearing in mind his reputation for the use of choice language in private, one suspects he found them frustrating. He describes the London Poles as rather unworldly people of an agricultural background, living in a dreamworld of the past and utterly unable to get to grips with reality of 1944/45.
Churchill was actually Poland’s one chance of retrieving something, however small, from a dismal and rapidly evolving state of affairs and despite his energetic efforts to get them to see reality and use his good offices they walked away into their dreams. After the British general election of 5th July 1945 he was no longer PM and it was too late.
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
“John Wear”:
Before we get into the weeds of Rudolf Hoess or the gas chambers at Auschwitz, let’s see if we can agree on some preliminary assertions.
Ron Unz asserts:
1) Only 200,000 people died at Auschwitz,
2) Most of the 200,000 people died of disease, and
3) *Not one person* was gassed to death at Auschwitz.
4) Zyklon-B was used to save Jewish lives, not to take them.I assert:
1) More than 1,o00,000 people died at Auschwitz,
2) They were murdered by various means, including gassing, starvation, overwork…you name it.
3) *Of course* people were gassed to death at Auschwitz.
4) *Of course* Zyklon-B was used to gas people to death at Auschwitz. Not a single credible historical or scientific organization doubts this.I’ll add a 5th assertion for myself (I forgot to check with Ron Unz about this):
5) Approximately 1.3 million people arrived at Auschwitz.
Do any of your assertions differ from those of Ron Unz, and what is your assertion with regard to item #5?
P.S. You write:
My response: Ron Unz is busy writing articles and managing his website.
Yes, as a person who has been thrown off, or had his comments censored from, multiple websites representing the left and the right, I appreciate that to this point, every single comment of mine on this site has been posted intact.
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HdC says:@Mark Bahner
Never has more ignorance been voiced with more conviction!
But that is what one gets when all your information is from the mass media and schools.
If you are interested sir, I can recommend more that a dozen books that take the more or less opposite view of yours.
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HdC says:@Mark Bahner
If you were threatened with having your testicles crushed your be willing to swear that your mother was a child molester.
Hoess was severely tortured to force his “confession”. This was written in English ISTR, a language Hoess did not read or write.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You ask: “Do any of your assertions differ from those of Ron Unz, and what is your assertion with regard to item #5?”
My response: I agree with your assertion #5 that approximately 1.3 million people arrived at Auschwitz-Birkenau. This figure could be off slightly, but is a reasonable ballpark estimate.
The only assertion Ron Unz made that I somewhat disagree with is his assertion #1, where he states that only 200,000 people died at Auschwitz-Birkenau. I think the death figure is probably slightly less than this, in about the 140,000 to 150,000 range.
I totally agree with his assertions #2, #3, and #4. Most people who died at Auschwitz-Birkenau died of diseases such as typhus and typhoid, there were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau, and Zyklon-B was used to save Jewish lives by killing lice and other insects in delousing chambers.
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HdC says:@Tisch
You are letting Churchill, and his co-conspirator Roosevelt, off much too easy!
One must understand that Roosevelt and Churchill wanted war, war at any cost. These two war mongers had been conspiring to have a war engulfing Germany since at least the mid 1930, before Churchill was even prime minister.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Kali
Oh, boy. Should I grab some popcorn?
You should have signed your memo “Goat Herder” so she can readily identify you. (That was such bad form, btw)
I have actually been on “Inconvenient History” site many times over the last few years. It is a treasure trove of good information.
I never heard of Ms. Yeager until viewing this thread, actually. Perhaps that’s why she’s so prickly.
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Mark Bahner says:@HdC
If you are interested sir, I can recommend more that a dozen books that take the more or less opposite view of yours.
I can’t promise I’ll do much more than to glance at/through them, but sure, I’m interested in a list. Thanks.
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soll says:@Truth Vigilante
The fellow that uses the handle ‘Patrick McNally’ (to divert attention away from his Talmudic background), is a KNOWN disinformer.
You need to learn some logical fallacies.
If you or Ron believe that you have acquired the truth (or as closest that can be asserted based on the availability of sources) you should both welcome debates. Instead you avoid debate–its easier resorting to name-calling while inventing conspiracy theories adds nothing to the subjects.
Complete evasion.
Assuming we could get anyone to read his B.S, we already know what the outcome is going to be. ie: ALL objective UR readers would vehemently disagree with his output.
What is allegedly B.S? If something can be contradicted do so, and enter in a debate.
So Solomon, what’s the point ?
To test the credibility of your assumed beliefs of whatever is being alleged as true. Or are you protecting an ideology you have become so overly invested in by becoming an ideologue to the echo chamber you surround yourself in? Welcome debate and drop the dogma.
Why would Ron Unz lower the standard of his excellent webzine by featuring a fool like Shlomo McNally ?
Ron’s articles always revolves around the same few authors, even by him seeing the validity of information published 32 years later to an alleged event as featured in a gossip column, shows the standards are severely lacking.
The casual debates found in the long comments need to be fleshed out in articles.
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so let me get this right: All Ron did is read a few books and all of a sudden his long life long BS(Believe System) was changed! Just by a few books! WoOW! And how long before he did read those books did he believe his previous BS? 30 years? 40? 50? Incredible, I say that just a few books changed his whole outlook! Aren’t Americans incredible? ALl it take is a few books, man!
People have known these things for decades, Ronny boy. I have known them for decades too, just b y thinking about WWII. No need to read a few specific books. Just takes a bran and the ability to think.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER -
Rurik says:@soll
you should both welcome debates.
debate is one thing, provided it is conducted in good faith
the problem is, there are a lot of people who know their ideas will not prevail in an honest and fair crucible of veracity, and so they resort to tactics that are not intended to advance knowledge or truth, but rather to obfuscate, equivocate, dissemble, set up endless strawmen, while distracting from the point, because their agenda is not what they claim it is, (bad faith, iow) and so if you’re participating in good faith, while your interlocutor is not, then it not only becomes a waste of your time, but the whole exercise becomes a net negative for everyone involved, except for the person whose agenda always was to feign and disrupt.
This is why Mr. Unz’ ‘Troll’ button is so useful, so that when we know there is a solid commenter, (TruthV for instance), who has smoked out a troll, it can save everybody a lot of time and energy, when a troll is hence flagged as such.
I’ve know this “Patrick” guy was a troll for a while now, but I was forced to waste some time on it, before I then simply ignored his comments.
FWIW
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
I agree with your assertion #5 that approximately 1.3 million people arrived at Auschwitz-Birkenau. I think the death figure is…about the 140,000 to 150,000 range.
1) Does that figure of 140,000 to 150,000 deaths at Auschwitz-Birkenau include deaths from every possible cause, including starvation, hypothermia, deaths from overwork or accidents at work, drowning in the pool, scalding to death in the hot showers, dying of laughter in the theater…everything?
2) OK…my next assertion is that this is the *approximate* distribution of arrivals to Auschwitz-Birkenau by year:
1941 = 30,000
1942 = 230,000
1943 = 310,000
1944 = 690,000
1945 = 45,000Does this *approximate* distribution of arrival times look reasonable to you? If not, please fill in your own numbers.
Thanks.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You ask: “Does that figure of 140,000 to 150,000 deaths at Auschwitz-Birkenau include deaths from every possible cause, including starvation, hypothermia, deaths from overwork or accidents at work, drowning in the pool, scalding to death in the hot showers, dying of laughter in the theater…everything?”
My response: Yes.
You ask: OK…my next assertion is that this is the *approximate* distribution of arrivals to Auschwitz-Birkenau by year:
1941 = 30,000
1942 = 230,000
1943 = 310,000
1944 = 690,000
1945 = 45,000Does this *approximate* distribution of arrival times look reasonable to you? If not, please fill in your own numbers.
My response: I don’t know exactly how many people arrived in Auschwitz-Birkenau each year. The 45,000 figure in 1945 might be high, because Auschwitz-Birkenau was taken over by the Soviets on January 27, 1945. I doubt that the Germans would transfer 45,000 people to the camp when they knew the Soviets were so close to the camp.
However, without doing any research on this question, I will accept your numbers as a reasonable possibility.
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Billy Bob says:@Patrick McNally
Well, I’m a little more than halfway through the book. Here’s what the ruling faction in France and Britain were hoping for and would have been happy to abide by. The following was written by Coulondre, the French ambassador to Germany (Dec. 15, 1938):
To secure mastery over Central Europe by reducing Czechoslovakia and Hungary to a state of vassagage and then to create a Greater Ukraine under German control–this is what essentially appears to be the leading idea now accepted by the Nazi leaders and doubtless by Herr Hitler himself…
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Billy Bob says:
Damn, the above comment posted inadvertently before I was finished typing it out. The passage continues:
“Among those who approach Him [Hitler], a political operation is thought of which would repeat, on a larger scale, that of the Sudetens: propaganda in Poland, in Romania and in Soviet Russia in favor of Ukrainian independence; support eventually given by diplomatic pressure and by the action of armed bands; Ruthenia would be the focus of the movement. Thus by a curious turn of Fate, Czechoslovakia, which had been established as a bulwark to stem the German drive, now serves the Reich as a battering-ram to demolish the gates of the East…”
The authors maintain that this was Hitler’s plan which centered on Ruthenia as being the bridgehead for a future Soviet offensive that they were all too happy to facilitate.
But I agree. A “free hand” is perhaps a imprecise description. A “free hand within certain limits” is more accurate.
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Truth Vigilante says:@soll
In relation to the comments of the individual that uses the handle Patrick McNally (real name Mordechai Moshe Baruch Shlongstein), you wrote:
What is allegedly B.S? If something can be contradicted do so, and enter in a debate.
Solomon, I notice that you’re new on the scene (you have around 100 comments posted in UR in aggregate), and therefore have no appreciation for Shlomo McNally’s history of disinfo peddling.
I have had numerous exchanges with this fellow over a long period, and caught him out posting OBVIOUS UNTRUTHS on numerous occasions.
Others in the UR commentariat have caught him out countless times more.The fact is, there have been endless debates between ‘McNally’ and others over the years and invariably, McNally is exposed as a fraud and obvious minion of ZOG.
It’s not just on matters pertaining to WWII, he’s shilling on behalf of the Judeo Khazarian regime in the Ukrainian proxy war, he tries to defend the preposterous official narrative propagated by the neocons who perpetrated the 9/11 False Flag etc.You name it and McNally is acting in the capacity of ZOG’s spokesman.
You need only click onto his name next time he posts a comment, and go through his entire comment history and peruse* it for yourself.
(*I notice that he’s toned it down a little over recent months and has not been quite as brazen with his bald faced lies as in the past. With that in mind, when you scroll through his commenting history, go back further than say 6 months and you’ll see some absolute whoppers that he’s posted).
You’ll see that this despicable individual is not to be trusted.
Note also that a fellow that uses the pseudonym ‘Wizard of ZOG’ (or some minor variation of that), is constantly praising him.
That should be all the confirmation you need to ascertain that McNally is a shady character.
That’s because Wizard of ZOG (WoZ) is known to be one of the lead minions of the ZOG establishment and a reliable ‘contrarian indicator’.
In other words, when WoZ says something, you can be pretty certain that the truth is the opposite.
WoZ is very consistent in that sense.Solomon, let me encapsulate it in one sentence :
Patrick ‘Shlomo’ McNally, LIES LIKE HE BREATHES.
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Bankotsu says:@Billy Bob
But I agree. A “free hand” is perhaps a imprecise description. A “free hand within certain limits” is more accurate.
This was what Neville Chamberlain had in mind with regards to Nazi Germany and eastern europe:
“…As a result, Halifax had a long conversation with Hitler on 19 November 1937 in which, whatever may have been Halifax’s intention, Hitler’s government became convinced of three things:
(a) that Britain regarded Germany as the chief bulwark against communism in Europe;
(b) that Britain was prepared to join a Four Power agreement of France, Germany, Italy, and herself; and (c) that Britain was prepared to allow Germany to liquidate Austria, Czechoslovakia, and Poland if this could be done without provoking a war into which the British Government, however unwillingly, would be dragged in opposition to Germany.The German Foreign Ministry memorandum on this conversation makes it perfectly clear that the Germans did not misunderstand Halifax except, possibly, on the last point. There they failed to see that if Germany made war, the British Government would be forced into the war against Germany by public opinion in England. The German diplomatic agents in London, especially the Ambassador, Dirksen, saw this clearly, but the Government in Berlin listened only to the blind and conceited ignorance of Ribbentrop.
As dictators themselves, unfamiliar with the British social or constitutional systems, the German rulers assumed that the willingness of the British Government to accept the liquidation of Austria, Czechoslovakia, and Poland implied that the British Government would never go to war to prevent this liquidation. They did not see that the British Government might have to declare war to stay in office if public opinion in Britain were sufficiently aroused. The British Government saw this difficulty and as a last resort were prepared to declare war but not to wage war on Germany. This distinction was not clear to the Germans and was not accepted by the inner core of the Milner Group. It was, however, accepted by the other elements in the government, like Chamberlain himself, and by much of the second circle of the Milner Group, including Simon, Hoare, and probably Halifax. It was this which resulted in the “phony war” from September 1939 to April 1940….
…This was nothing but the appeasement program of Chamberlain and Halifax—that concessions should be made to Germany to strengthen her on the Continent and in Eastern Europe, while Britain should remain strong enough on the sea and in the air to prevent Hitler from using war to obtain these concessions. The fear of Hitler’s using war was based not so much on a dislike of force (neither Lothian nor Halifax was a pacifist in that sense) but on the realization that if Hitler made war against Austria, Czechoslovakia, or Poland, public opinion in France and England might force their governments to declare war in spite of their desire to yield these areas to Germany. This, of course, is what finally happened…”
http://www.yamaguchy.com/library/quigley/anglo_12b.html
http://www.carrollquigley.net/books.htmThe entire transcript of the 1937 Nov Halifax-Hitler talk can be found here:
Documents and materials relating to the eve of the Second World War. Volume I. November 1937-1938
• Thanks: Wizard of OzAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Kali says:@Tiptoethrutulips
Hi Tiptoe,
Thanks for your comment.
Don’t grab the popcorn just yet. I think the Yeager woman is scared of me. – I’ve been slaying trolls for much longer than I’ve kept goats.
(Oh dear; I’m now reminded of the “three billy goats gruff” and the troll under the bridge! lol)Let’s see if she bites…
Best wishes,
Kali.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
littlereddot says:@soll
You will know a person is not worth replying to, when his first resort is juvenile name calling.
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soll says:@Truth Vigilante
In relation to the comments of the individual that uses the handle Patrick McNally (real name Mordechai Moshe Baruch Shlongstein)
ad hominem: criticism or attacks directed against a person, rather than against what they say. (Definition of ad hominem from the Cambridge Advanced Learner’s Dictionary & Thesaurus © Cambridge University Press)
Solomon, I notice that you’re new on the scene (you have around 100 comments posted in UR in aggregate), and therefore have no appreciation for Shlomo McNally’s history of disinfo peddling.
I personally lost interest in such conspiracy led narratives over a decade ago, casually visiting this site to see the same talking points and fables being retold is a passing interest, doesn’t mean that I am “new on the scene.”
I have had numerous exchanges with this fellow over a long period, and caught him out posting OBVIOUS UNTRUTHS on numerous occasions. Others in the UR commentariat have caught him out countless times more.
Yet rarely in disagreement does anyone contradict by citing sources (gossip and unsubstantiated rumors are not fit to print). So void of challenges you few are inventing theories of people being a paid agent.
Evasion to debate.
The fact is, there have been endless debates between ‘McNally’ and others over the years and invariably, McNally is exposed as a fraud and obvious minion of ZOG.
Calling people names does not equal any contradiction of what is being debated. So overly invested in conspiracy theories, that even a minor critique is considered an attack on your identity.
It’s not just on matters pertaining to WWII, he’s shilling on behalf of the Judeo Khazarian regime in the Ukrainian proxy war, he tries to defend the preposterous official narrative propagated by the neocons who perpetrated the 9/11 False Flag etc
Everything soon becomes a conspiracy.
[…]
You’ll see that this despicable individual is not to be trusted.
Note also that a fellow that uses the pseudonym ‘Wizard of ZOG’ (or some minor variation of that), is constantly praising him.
That should be all the confirmation you need to ascertain that McNally is a shady character.
That’s because Wizard of ZOG (WoZ) is known to be one of the lead minions of the ZOG establishment and a reliable ‘contrarian indicator’.If what you believe is considered “true” you should welcome all challenges. Yet, some of you are sensitive to any critiques.
To revert the online meme used against the so-called “establishment” ‘truth does not fear investigation’ yet when turned around to challenge the conspiracy theorists everyone is a paid agent from the ZOG. Try not to be stuck in an echo chamber. Attempt to challenge and debunk your own beliefs.
>Solomon, let me encapsulate it in one sentence :
Patrick ‘Shlomo’ McNally, LIES LIKE HE BREATHES.
Declarations do not substantiate fact. Argue from evidence, not opinion.
• Replies: @Truth VigilanteAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Wizard of Oz says:@Tiptoethrutulips
You are trying to wriggle out of your false or misleading description of the collapses (Ron too has repeated the nonsense Bout filing into its own footprint). In reality the steel beams were thrown all over the place e by the pressures and tensions building up in the steelwork by weight originating a I’
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Wizard of Oz says:@Ron Unz
Even without Patrick McNally’s criticism of the source of your John
Schiff quote you are failing to justify your view that Schiff would have been outraged if it was true which is essential to your argument. You often seem to have little feeling for or only narrow experience of human reality and I think you should take seriously my competing guess that Schiff would have enjoyed the nonsense as a huge joke.And you still haven’t got close to discrediting McNally as shill,or paid or dishonest, and I don’t see how you can go on trying to bang on a single simple Jewish Bolshevik drum without realising that you are damaging g your credibility.
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Alexandros says:@Zarathustra
Adolf Hitler never left Germany. The exceptions are military campaigns, but obviously not England.
This seems to be a bald faced lie in order to present him as some type of “english agent”.
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Truth Vigilante says:@soll
Declarations do not substantiate fact. Argue from evidence, not opinion.
Agreed – and that’s precisely what I do (all my arguments are evidence based).
That’s why I asked you to check McNally’s commentary archives and see for yourself that it’s bursting to overflowing with B.S.So don’t be lazy young Solomon. Get off your arse and do some investigatory work.
You’ll see that the issues have been debated to death, the evidence is all there and that McNally is as claimed.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Patrick McNally says:@Ron Unz
> You, on the other hand, seem to have ultra-conventional views
You obviously have a very poor grasp of what “ultra-conventional views” are in the world at large.
> the top early Bolshevik leadership was overwhelmingly Jewish.
This is obviously a false statement. The most which anyone had ever been able to rationally support is that Jews were overrepresented among the top layers of leadership in all of the popular Left-wing parties which existed in Russia at this time, with the Bolsheviks actually having the lowest such proportion of Jews in comparison with the other popular parties (Mensheviks and Social Revolutionaries). Let’s just, for example, take the membership of the Central Committee on August 16, 1917:
http://holocaust.skeptik.net/misc/party.htm
—–
16 August 1917 (VI Congress of RSDRP(b))TsK: Members: Artem F. A., Berzin Ja. A., Bubnov A. S. (Russian), Buharin N. I. (Russian), Dzerzhinskij F. E. (Pole), Zinovjev G. E. (Jewish), Kamenev L. B. (Jewish), Kollontaj A. M., Krestinskij N. N. (Ukrainian), Lenin V. I. (Russian), Milyutin V. P. (Russian), Muranov M. K. (Ukrainian), Nogin V. P. (Russian), Rykov A. I. (Russian), Sverdlov Ja. M. (Jewish), Smilga I. T., Sokol’nikov G. Ja. (Jewish), Stalin I. V. (Georgian), Trotskij L. D. (Jewish), Uritskij M. S. (Jewish), Shaumyan S. G.
Candidates: Dzhaparidze P. A., Ioffe A. A. (Jewish), Kiselev A. S., Lomov-Oppokov G. I. (Russian), Osinskij V. V., Preobrazhenskij E. A. (Russian), Skrypnik N. A., Stasova E. D. (Russian), Teodorovich I. A. (Pole), Jakovleva V. N.
—–So, about 21 members and 10 candidates, with the first group having around 4 Jews and the second containing another one. That hardly fits the description of “overwhelmingly Jewish.” You could go around looking at different committees and such and some would most definitely have some more Jews, while other would have less. But no serious historical investigation has ever been able to argue more than simply that the proportions of Jews in the Soviet government was notably higher than Jews as a percentage of the population, and that this would have been equally true in any other government which was capable of maintaining authority.
Again, we should always recall that the only possible alternative government to Lenin’s Bolsheviks was not Admiral Kolchak as the Supreme Ruler, never mind Ataman Semyonov. This kind of lunacy never had any support from a significant body of Russians. The potential alternative to Lenin would have been a government predominated by Social Revolutionaries and Mensheviks such as Abram Gots and Raphael Abramovitch. Because these were the kinds of parties which actually supported. Fools like Kolchak and Denikin had an opportunity at the beginning to make an alliance with the SRs and Mensheviks, but they chose not to. Hence their defeat.
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Sparkon says:@Rurik
FWIW
Not much, but it does make you look like a hypocrite.
…resort to tactics…
Tactics like lying and making false accusations against me? That’s what your cohort vigil auntie has done here at UR on numerous occasions, as if you didn’t know.
By the way, I’ve been meaning to ask why you chose the handle Rurik?
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Patrick McNally says:@Gabreal Jones
> bolshewiks like Trotzky – who spent some time in NYC
Trotsky did not join the Bolsheviks until July 1917. During the 10 weeks that he spent in NYC he was an independent activist with no party connections whose energy was devoted to telling US audiences that they should stay out of the First World War. While it’s plausible that Jacob Schiff may have wanted to give some support to such antiwar activism, there was nothing about Bolshevism involved.
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Sparkon says:@Anonymous
That’s what happened in France – the German forces got between the somewhat ponderous French combat forces and No Suggestions Available the French forces’ supply base (and between the French forces and the French civil population).
[my bold]
I had been searching for the term “logistics” in Ron’s two recent articles, when I came across this peculiar, clumsy and rather revealing inclusion of an AI’s output, which was being used to compose the comment.
I say this comment was composed by somebody sitting at a keyboard somewhere using AI to make apparently knowledgeable comments, who was too lazy to even read what the AI had output, and instead just copied and pasted the whole shebang, giving us a nice snapshot, so to say, of the hired hack with his fingers in the cookie jar and on the keyboard.
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Patrick McNally says:@Tisch
> Churchill was actually Poland’s one chance of retrieving something,
Churchill went so far as to order his staff in early 1945 to prepare plans for Operation Unthinkable, which was meant to be a war launched by Britain against the USSR in July 1945, His officers made up the plans, but told him that the whole idea was crazy and Britain was too exhausted. Churchill continued urging the Truman administration to start an atomic attack on the USSR right up until the time when the Soviet atomic bomb was exploded in 1949.
For more details see:
Jonathan Walker, Operation Unthinkable, The Third World War: British Plans to Attack the Soviet Empire, 1945
David Carlton, Churchill and the Soviet Union
Thomas Maier, When Lions Roar: The Churchills and the Kennedys
The fact that even Churchill realized how divorced from reality the old Polish leadership was says a lot about them.
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Patrick McNally says:@Billy Bob
It seems like some select snippets from The French Yellow Book are being used. As an online resource, here is the document Number 33 which appears on pp. 41-5 of The French Yellow Book:
https://avalon.law.yale.edu/wwii/ylbk033.asp
—–
I have not personally received very definite confidential information on this subject; but it appears that little by little one can see the outlines of a great German enterprise emerge from what is still nebulous. To secure mastery over Central Europe by reducing Czechoslovakia and Hungary to a state of vassalage and then to create a Greater Ukraine under German control-this is what essentially appears to be the leading idea now accepted by the Nazi leaders, and doubtless by Herr Hitler himself.Unfortunately the vassalage of Czechoslovakia is almost complete by this time. “My country is now nothing more than a province,” my Czech colleague said only yesterday. The German Secret Service is said to be already only working there with Poland in mind and certain German circles are reported to have gone so far as to declare that from now on the Czech army will be called on to play the same part as the Bavarian army under the Second Reich. The construction of the motor road between Breslau and Vienna and of the canal between the Oder and the Danube will be entrusted exclusively to Czech labour. From two equally trustworthy sources I have learnt that in the near future a German-Czech currency agreement will be concluded and will soon be followed by an economic and monetary union.
In Hungary, where resistance will evidently be more determined, they will first endeavour to establish a sort of economic vassalage, and to ensure for the German Army the right of transit, which has become indispensable for action in the east, since Hungarian territory cuts across the Slovak railway.
—–Is this author you refer trying to imply that Coulondre was somehow approving of the idea that Hitler should gain vassalage over regions in the east? I don’t read that from the document at all. He says “Unfortunately the vassalage of Czechoslovakia is almost complete by this time.” That doesn’t sound like someone who wants Hitler to gain vassalage over Czechoslovakia. He’s just describing the events.
Perhaps some clarity can be shed on what Coulondre wished for by looking at a later document Number 57 on pages 68-70 of the same volume:
—–
If Your Excellency considers it suitable, I could, in view of the rapid development of events, try to see the State Secretary as soon as possible. I could point out to him that the French Government would very well understand that the Reich should help in bringing about some fair settlement between Prague and Bratislava; but I would stress that any violent solution, by destroying the foundations of the agreement of September 29, would seriously endanger the policy of mutual confidence and cooperation in the spirit of Munich, which was also manifested in the declaration of December 6.
—–So, Coulondre wants to communicate to Hitler that “destroying the foundations of the agreement of September 29, would seriously endanger the policy of mutual confidence and cooperation in the spirit of Munich…” This is consistent with what I have always noted. It was not the intent of either Britain or France to give Hitler a blank check to march across eastern Europe.
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
However, without doing any research on this question, I will accept your numbers as a reasonable possibility.
OK, let’s say no one (zero) came in in January 1945, since the camp was liberated at the end of the month. So that lowers the total number of arrivals to 1,260,000. Let’s further estimate that your total deaths of 150,000 is distributed over the years in direct proportion to the arrivals. Therefore we can make a table of:
Year: Arrivals – deaths = increase in camp population that year
1941: 30,000 – 4,000 = 26,000
1942: 230,000 – 27,000 = 203,000
1943: 310,000 – 37,000 = 273,000
1944: 690,000 – 82,000 = 608,000All years: 1,260,000 – 150,000 = 1,110,000
The problem here, obviously, is that the total population increase for all years is 1,110,000 people…but the total population of Auschwitz I, Auschwitz II (Birkenau) and all 40 subcamps never exceeded about 150,000 people.
So, in your scenario (others would probably call “fantasy”) in which only 150,000 people died of mostly disease, where did the approximately 1 million missing people go?
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Formicably says:@meamjojo
Do you really think it’s worth pointing out that Karl Marx’ popularity rose, after his texts inspired a revolution in Eurasia’s biggest empire, as if that weren’t blatantly obvious to anyone with half a brain. What are you, retarded?
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Rurik says:@Sparkon
I would have simply pushed the ‘troll’ button, because you’re clearly just trying to troll me, when nothing I wrote had anything to do with you.
But then it seems you’re actually attacking TruthV by proxy. I’m not TruthV. I just enjoy his truth-telling, and his humor. If you have a problem with TruthV, then tell it to TruthV. He can certainly handle all comers.
By the way, I’ve been meaning to ask why you chose the handle Rurik?
I’ve explained this many times over the years, and I don’t mind doing so again.
I specifically chose that name because I was concerned at the time, that ZOG was attempting to foment a war between Russia and Ukraine. And since I abhor ZOG’s wars, and I didn’t want to see those tragic people, (on both sides), intrigued into yet another zio-slaughter-fest.
Wasn’t the (((Red reign of terror, and the Holodomor and gulags and WWII))) enough?No, it’s never enough for ZOG, is it?
So I picked the name Rurik because he was an historical figure that I considered to be poised at the center of these two people’s worlds. With zero ties to any modern ill will.
He was a central figure in the histories of both the people of Russia and the people of Ukraine, and I wanted to be a voice of moderation between these current victim’s of ZOG’s ongoing treachery.
(Also, perhaps because I too have some ancestral ties to those people, if you go back far enough).
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Sparkon says:@Rurik
I would have simply pushed the ‘troll’ button, because you’re clearly just trying to troll me, when nothing I wrote had anything to do with you.
But then it seems you’re actually attacking TruthV by proxy. I’m not TruthV. I just enjoy his truth-telling, and his humor. If you have a problem with TruthV, then tell it to TruthV. He can certainly handle all comers.
‘Been there, done that.
You are supporting and shilling for a known liar, that’s why I call you a hypocrite.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You ask: “So, in your scenario (others would probably call “fantasy”) in which only 150,000 people died of mostly disease, where did the approximately 1 million missing people go?”
My response: I will now do some actual research to answer your question.
I have volume two of the book “Auschwitz: The Case for Sanity” by Carlo Mattogno. Mattogno estimates on page 535 of this book that the deaths by year at Auschwitz-Birkenau are:
1940-1941 — 19,500
1942 — 48,500
1943 — 37,000
1944 — 30,000
1945 — 500
Total — 135,500On page 534 of this book, Mattogno estimates that the number of deportees to Auschwitz-Birkenau were 1,109,400, of whom 914,600 were Jews and 194,800 were non-Jews. So, using Mattogno’s estimates, we have 1,109,400 deportees to Auschwitz-Birkenau less 135,500 deaths equals a total of 973,900 Auschwitz-Birkenau inmates who eventually went some where else.
So, where did these Auschwitz-Birkenau inmates go? First, even mainstream Jewish historians acknowledge that Auschwitz-Birkenau served as a transit camp throughout the war. For example, Edwin Black writes that Auschwitz was a labor camp, a transit camp, as well as an extermination camp where Jews were immediately exterminated in gas chambers upon arrival. (Source: Black, Edwin, IBM and the Holocaust: The Strategic Alliance between Nazi Germany and America’s Most Powerful Corporation, New York: Crown Publishers, 2001, p. 351).
The literature is replete with Jews who were transited through Auschwitz-Birkenau. For example, Viktor Frankl’s book “Man’s Search for Meaning” has been ranked by the Library of Congress as one of the 20th century’s 10 most influential books in the United States. Frankl described his experiences at Auschwitz in this book as if he had spent many months there. In reality, Frankl was in Auschwitz only for a few days in October 1944 while in transit from Theresienstadt to a sub-camp of Dachau. Frankl has admitted this to the American evangelist Robert Schuller: “I was in Auschwitz only three or four days…I was sent to a barrack and we were all transported to a camp in Bavaria.” (Source: Frankl, Viktor, “Dr. Robert Schuller Interviews Viktor Frankl: How to Find Meaning In Life,” Possibilities: The Magazine of Hope, March/April 1991, p. 10).
There are numerous other examples I could cite. Violette Fintz, a Jewish woman who had been deported from the island of Rhodes to Auschwitz in mid-1944, and then to Dachau and then to Belsen in early 1945, said that from her experience Belsen was worse than Auschwitz. Fintz is another Jew who survived Auschwitz and lived to describe her experiences at the camp. (Source: Weber, Mark, “‘Extermination’ Camp Propaganda Myths” in Gauss, Ernst (ed.), Dissecting the Holocaust: The Growing Critique of Truth and Memory, Capshaw, AL: Thesis and Dissertations Press, 2000, p. 303).
Also, toward the end of the war, large numbers of inmates were transported out of Auschwitz-Birkenau. For example, in the face of the advancing Soviet Army, Anne Frank was evacuated to Bergen-Belsen, where she died of typhus in March 1945. While Anne Frank’s fate was tragic, her story is not consistent with a German plan of extermination against the Jews. Along with thousands of others at Bergen-Belsen, Anne died from a typhus epidemic and not from a German plan to commit genocide against European Jewry.
The Allies were no more effective in stopping deaths in the camps than the Germans had been. For example, there were some 55,000 to 60,000 inmates in Bergen-Belsen when the British took control of the camp. Despite the best efforts of the British, almost 14,000 inmates died at Bergen-Belsen in the months following the British takeover. (Source: “Holocaust,” Encyclopedia Judaica, New York and Jerusalem: Macmillan and Keter, 1971, Vol. 8, p. 859. See also Shephard, Ben, After Daybreak: The Liberation of Bergen-Belsen, 1945, New York: Schocken Books, 2005, pp. 4, 202).
Such transfers out of Auschwitz-Birkenau caused extreme overcrowding in the German camps. When U.S. and British troops entered German concentration camps at the end of World War II, they discovered huge piles of dead bodies and emaciated and diseased surviving inmates. The horrific scenes were filmed and photographed for posterity by the U.S. Army Signal Corps. Prominent newsmen and politicians were flown in to Germany to see the harrowing evidence at the camps for themselves. Films of the horrific scenes at the camps were made mandatory viewing for the vanquished populace of Germany, so that their national pride would be destroyed and replaced with feelings of collective guilt. What the general public was not told is that most of the inmates in these camps died of natural causes.
Thousands of Jew were also left behind at Auschwitz-Birkenau. Primo Levi was a Jewish Communist who one would think would have been executed at Auschwitz-Birkenau. However, along with about 7,000 to 8,000 additional disabled Jews, Levi was left behind in Auschwitz. Although the Germans could have executed Levi and the other Jews in a few days, the Germans let them survive to tell their story about Auschwitz-Birkenau. (Source: Faurison, Robert, “Witnesses to the Gas Chambers of Auschwitz,” in Gauss, Ernst (ed.), Dissecting the Holocaust: The Growing Critique of Truth and Memory, Capshaw, AL: Thesis and Dissertations Press, 2000, p. 142).
If Auschwitz-Birkenau had been a place of mass exterminations, why would the German authorities leave behind thousands of disabled Jews such as Otto Frank and Primo Levi to testify to their genocide? The SS would have easily been able to gas and cremate these Jewish inmates in crematorium V at Birkenau during the first week of January 1945. (Source: Mattogno, Carlo, Auschwitz: The Case for Sanity, Volume Two, Washington, D.C.: The Barnes Review, 2010, p. 558).
I hope this helps. Please let me know if you have any questions or comments.
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Brad Anbro says:@Wizard of Oz
Here it is:
https://www.lawyerscommitteefor9-11inquiry.org/
And for readers, especially Mr. Bahner, who would like to further their education as to what REALLY HAPPENED on September 11, 2001 –
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Brad Anbro says:@Wizard of Oz
You must evidently be a MSM / CIA apologist as Mr. Bahner appears to be.
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Gabreal Jones says:@Patrick McNally
Anthony Sutton / “Trotsky Leaves New York to Complete the Revolution…”
“The term “racism”is an active noun first put to literary use by Leon Trotsky (aka as Lev Bronstein )
in his 1930 book the history of The Russian Revolution ”More on Trotsky from page 134 / 150 Trotsky Abroad….(Trotsky was into it from day one / meaning jewry / masonry etc.that were later / 1917/ labeled bolshewism in Russia ) ….
“He landed in New York on January 13, 1917″ with many of his j. collabarators…. gave lectures / wrote articles….
” Despite the fact that the newspaper could pay no normal royalties, Trotsky and his family lived in a luxurious house in the Bronx 150″
page 151 ” Trotsky officially went to the United States to prepare the organisation of the “workers’ revolution” in Russia. (Robert Payne, “The Life andDeath of Trotsky”, London, 1978.)…
” In the spring of 1917, Jacob Schiff began to finance Leon Trotsky to implement “the second phase of the revolution”, according to Dr Antony C. Sutton.”…..
“In New York, on the 27th of March 1917, the 37-year-old Trotsky, with his family and 275 international terrorists and adventurers embarked on the ship Kristianiajjord bound for Europe to complete the “revolution” in Russia….
“Various criminals, Jewish-American communists and brokers from Wall Street also accompanied them” /writes Juri lina…..
Juri Lina dug most of his stuff up from the archives that were opened after “the fall of the USSR” / I posted for ca a year or so at fitzinfo.net by Timothy Fitzpatick under my second pename julien romanovsky ( have onle 2 ) / not anymore since he as an Irish catholic can´t stomach my emphasis on black JC & his Hebrew crew….
Nevertheless his take on Vlad P. – see his “Putin Dossier” – is more than correct imv / the Perestroika Deception / P. is a crypto j. / after the not completely immaculately conceived Gorbatsjov (j.) Wodka Yeltsin (j) who installed P. / the onle non j. is Andropov (former KGB chief)
Remember mossads motto / through deception we wage war…..
CIA O
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Wizard of Oz
I think you are suggesting that hot air, aka backdraft, can be explosive. Yes, it can. Pressure can cause explosions. Hot air expands…we learn this in jr. high school.
That’s one heck of a backdraft to take out an entire building. But, I guess that happens all the time; you see it everywhere after all. Buildings on fire dropping like flies.
Don’t you think NYC fire chief and staff knew how to manage that in an unoccupied building? If they didn’t, I’m sure Lucky Larry Silvertongue had appropriate advice in that regard.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Gabreal Jones
That’s a valid point; the manner in which language is manipulated for use as a weapon.
I’ve seen city ballot referendums so complex, you have no idea what you’re voting for or against.
Take “Holocaust Denial”. It means no Jewish person was removed from Germany or anywhere else; there were no camps; there were no Jewish hairs on Jewish heads that were harmed; Hitler loved the Jews; it was sunshine and roses for Jews in Europe. So, if you are a “Holocaust Denier” that’s essentially what you believe.
It’s the same for “revisionist”; the implication being someone is trying to alter a history that was previously established as true.
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Rurik says:@Sparkon
You are supporting and shilling for a known liar, that’s why I call you a hypocrite.
someone may say they don’t approve of my support for Russia vis-a-vis the current war, they may say Russia is wrong, and so I too am wrong, and a shill and a hypocrite.
But for me to be these things, then I would have to agree with this person, and I don’t. Which means I’m not a shill or a liar.
Is it really necessary to point out 3rd grade elementary school logic to you?
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Patrick McNally says:@Gabreal Jones
As I pointed out, Trotsky did not join the Bolsheviks until July 1917. Antony Sutton was a confused author who did not know very much about the history of the revolutionary movements.
> The term “racism”is an active noun first put to literary use by Leon Trotsky
Nonsense.
—–
While the Oxford English Dictionary currently dates racism in English to 1903 and racist to 1919, the terms were still rarely used in the early decades of the 20th century… That all changed thanks to a perceptive observation by one member of the editorial staff named Rose Frances Egan…
—–Trotsky tended to emphasize very Marxist-sounding jargon about “proletarian,” “bourgeoisie” and the like. The idea that he played some special role in promoting the use of a word like “racism” is just another Right-wing myth.
> ” In the spring of 1917, Jacob Schiff began to finance Leon Trotsky to implement “the second phase of the revolution”, according to Dr Antony C. Sutton.”…..
You’ve obviously never opened up a copy of Sutton’s book. He very explicitly rejects the charge that Jacob Schiff ever wanted Kerensky’s government to be overthrown. Where Sutton is confused, it is because he does not grasp that Trotsky being in New York had nothing to do with Bolshevism. Trotsky was an independent maverick at that time and his activities while in New York were about denouncing the war and telling people that US workers should not want to join it. It is possible that Jacob Schiff may have supported such activities, but no more than that.
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OrangeSmoke says:@Truth Vigilante
Irritability can be caused by normal aging in senior citizens. Not sure if there is a cure but I suspect deep breaths and long walk help.
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big mouth says:@Nick Kollerstrom
thanks i just bought your book.
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Billy Bob says:@Bankotsu
Thank you very much. You post rings absolutely true and is in line with the book I am currently reading by Leibovitz and Finkel. These authors suggest as you do, that even after Germany invaded Poland, Chamberlain continued the policy of appeasement and worked for some kind of arrangement that did not necessitate actual war between the Western powers.
Ultimately, Hitler did not trust the “democracy” of Britain and he did not have confidence that any agreement he made with Chamberlain would not be torn up by Chamberlain’s successor.
I’m simply curious though if Patrick McNally shares our certainty on this issue or if he has an alternative view. If he has an alternative view, I’d like to know what it is. His takes are always thoughtful and solid.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Sparkon
You are supporting and shilling for a known liar
Thanks for your kind words Sparkie. You hold a special place in my heart also.
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Billy Bob says:@Patrick McNally
So I very much appreciate your patience and for humoring my attempts to really grasp your position in order to identify any differences we may have.
No, the authors aren’t suggesting Coulondre was supportive of Hitler’s ambitions, but they make the point that Chamberlain was and that he was dragging the French along behind him. The authors make the case that Chamberlain understood that Ruthenia was central to Hitler’s plan to destabilize and invade the Soviet Union which he desperately wanted them to do… so long as it was done in a way that was tactful and did not necessitate war with Britain. I suspect in the later pages of the book, I will have a better understanding about how it all played out. The turning point was when Hitler dealt with Ruthenia in a way which precluded it’s use as a bridgehead against the Soviet Union. Once this happened, Chamberlain’s hopes were truly dashed.
But, let me not waste any more of your time until I can better formulate and articulate my own position and then, if you disagree, you can let me know where you think it goes wrong.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Patrick McNally
And why wouldn’t John Schiff have thought it a great joke to done out on when a gossip columnist produced a made up quote that “grandpa financed the Bolshies”. Indeed wouldn’t an honest sophisticated libel lawyer have told him that telling the story frequently and laughing about it was the way to go?
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Wizard of Oz says:@Wokechoke
You are making a different point from the one I addressed a d you are still wrong. To sayBelgium, Holland, Norway and Denmark sent troops to Barbarossa suggests they were sent by national governments which you must know to be wrong.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Patrick McNally
Memory tells me Bertrand Russell, as late S 1948, said the atom bomb should be used to curb the USSR.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Ron Unz
Why would torture be relevant to his willingness to take one of his last chances to shout out his defiant defence ofthe truth?
Is there any documentation of his torture. E.g. in archival material available after the Soviet Union collapsed? Any diary or letter?
What’s wrong with his having been reduced by one of the more sophisticated appare tly friendly interrogators to bring a penitent.
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John Wear says:@Wizard of Oz
You ask: “Is there any documentation of his [Rudolf Höss’s] torture. E.g. in archival material available after the Soviet Union collapsed? Any diary or letter?
My response: Yes, there is documentation that Rudolf Höss was tortured into making his confessions.
In 1983, the anti-National Socialist book “Legions of Death” by Rupert Butler documented that Sgt. Bernard Clarke and other British officers tortured Rudolf Höss into making his confession. The torture of Höss was exceptionally brutal. Neither Bernard Clarke nor Rupert Butler finds anything wrong or immoral in the torture of Höss. Neither of them seems to understand the importance of their revelations. Bernard Clarke and Rupert Butler prove that Höss’s confession was obtained by torture. (Source: Faurisson, Robert, “How the British Obtained the Confessions of Rudolf Höss,” The Journal of Historical Review, Vol. 7, No. 4, Winter 1986-87, pp. 392-399).
Moritz von Schirmeister, a former associate of Joseph Goebbels, confirmed that Höss’s confession was obtained by torture. At Nuremberg, von Schirmeister sat in the backseat of a car together with Höss, with whom he could speak freely during transit. He remembered Höss’s following statement:
“On the things he is accused of, he told me: ‘Certainly, I signed a statement that I killed two and a half million Jews. But I could just as well have said that it was five million Jews. There are certain methods by which any confession can be obtained, whether it is true or not.’” (Source: Mattogno, Carlo, Commandant of Auschwitz: Rudolf Höss, His Torture and His Forced Confessions, Uckfield, UK: Castle Hill Publishers, 2017, p. 16).
British Pvt. Ken Jones confirmed that the British used sleep deprivation to break Höss. Jones stated:
“We sat in the cell with him, night and day, armed with axe handles. Our job was to prod him every time he fell asleep to help break down his resistance. When Höss was taken out for exercise, he was made to wear only jeans and a thin cotton shirt in the bitter cold. After three days and nights without sleep, Höss finally broke down and made a full confession to the authorities.” (Source: Ibid., pp. 16-17).
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Patrick McNally says:@Wizard of Oz
First, on a technical point, it doesn’t appear that the gossip column of Igor Cassini ever actually offered a real quote attributed to John Schiff. The usual words attributed to Cassini are:
“Today it is estimated by Jacob’s grandson, John Schiff, a prominent member of New York society, that the old man sank about 20,000,000 dollars for the final triumph of Bolshevism in Russia.”
No actual quote is allegedly from John Schiff here. It’s like the difference between
—–
Wizard of Oz said, “Don’t look behind that curtain!”
—–versus
—–
Wizard of Oz told us not to look behind the curtain.
—–One version gives a quote, the other does not. Cassini did not properly claim any quote.
As far as whether or not John Schiff would have bothered to notice this at all, and if so whether he would have responded, it was a different environment back then in 1949. The state of Israel had just been formed a year earlier in 1948. Although there was a small influential Zionist network which helped to persuade Truman to recognize the new state at a time when his advisors thought this a dubious idea, it wasn’t anything like today.
If today a major New York newspaper were to publish a gossip column with a sentence like Cassini included, it would be a national scandal. Jonathan Greenblatt would be on FOX News talking about the surge of anti-Semitism which this column represents. The Israeli lobby of today is so constantly on the lookout for any sign of such that it may be tempting to project all of this back to 1949. But it was a very different atmosphere back then.
If John Schiff ever bothered to notice this bit of gossip by Cassini, he most likely would have shrugged it off. In those days of the 1940s it was still not unusual for an occasional newspaper to make some statement which would today be regarded as “anti-Semitic” and for the whole thing to just be downplayed by wealthy Jews. The 1967 war did a lot to change that environment, and as the Israel lobby has steadily grown since then it has also developed an institutional tendency to ever be on the lookout for more incidents of “anti-Semitism.” But John Schiff was born in 1904 and these later developments were not really part of his time.
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Patrick McNally says:@Wizard of Oz
Russell did make a speech where he brought that up.
https://globalgovernanceforum.org/visionary/bertrand-russell/
—–
In a 1948 speech, when only the U.S. possessed the atomic bomb, Russell argued that if the USSR’s aggression continued, it would be morally worse to go to war after that country possessed an atomic bomb than before it possessed one, insisting that if the USSR had no bomb, the West’s victory would come more swiftly and with fewer casualties than if there were atomic weapons on both sides.
—–Churchill was a bit more determined on this issue.
—–
But it’s Maier’s ability to substantiate various bold claims with original Cold War-era research that is most impressive. His most startling revelation has to do with Churchill’s clamor to drop atomic weapons on the Soviet Union in the early Truman years. Sen. Styles Bridges of New Hampshire, a conservative Republican, told the FBI that Churchill approached him about leading a charge on Capitol Hill for the Anglo-Americans to obliterate Moscow. Churchill “pointed out that if an atomic bomb could be dropped on the Kremlin wiping it out,” Bridges told the FBI, “it would be a very easy problem to handle the balance of Russia, which would be without direction.”
—–This also has importance for assessing the likely outcome if Stalin had been so stupid as to do what Rezun claims he intended to attempt. If one imagines Europe being overrun by Soviet forces in the summer and fall of 1941 as a result of an invasion launched by Stalin in early July, then it is safe to assume that Churchill would have been clamoring by the late fall for a war against the USSR. That clamoring for war by Churchill would have been addressed to American audiences as much as British. Roosevelt would then have come under intense pressure to intervene in Europe, not against Hitler (who presumably would have committed suicide within his bunker when Soviet troops captured Berlin) but against Stalin. It’s exactly the kind of mindless stupidity which Hitler was famous for, but which Stalin would have been very wary of.
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Wizard of Oz says:@John Wear
Thanks. I would have expected a detailed follow up to explain with credible evidence why he couldn’t or wouldn’t rationally take the opportunity of saying his confession was a fabrication.
Did Hoess have a lawyer? If so, what did he say at or about the trial? Did he say that Hoess wouldn’t allow him to mention the torture, and, if so, why?
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Wizard of Oz says:@Bankotsu
A second glance has made me realise how likely it was that Halifax might have thought the most effective advocacy to confront Hitler with would have been to persuade him that the strength of British public feeling might have been overwhelming. And just maybe that was the exactly wrong thing to say to Gitler who would believe he was lying because it was incredible to him.
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Malla says:@Patrick McNally
then it is safe to assume that Churchill would have been clamoring by the late fall for a war against the USSR
False, attitudes towards the USSR before 1945 and after 1945 is not the same. Churchill could have intervened during Stalin’s invasion of Finland, Churchill could have intervened during Stalin’s invasion of the Baltics, Churchill could have declared war on both Germany and the USSR when they both invaded Poland. If Poland was the reason, Churchill declared war on Germany, why did Churchill sit with Stalin in Yalta, the other invader of Poland? Churchill sent some of the best British tanks to Stalin when British troops needed it the most during WW2 through convoys through dangerous waters. The British also sent back Soviet POWs, more than what Stalin even asked for, the Anglo-Americans wanted to appease Stalin. The situation changed after 1945.
The political situation changed after WW2, but this was not the same before 1945.Roosevelt would then have come under intense pressure to intervene in Europe
False, Roosevelt was hostile towards Germany when it was not needed to be hostile towards Germany,, his directing the U.S. Navy to attack German naval vessels, even before declaring war. No such hostility was shown towards the USSR like what Roosevelt showed towards Japan and Germany. over than the Roosevelt administration was full of Soviet spies like Alger Hiss and others.
It is safe to assume that if Stalin had invaded Europe as he intended to do, the reaction he would face from the Anglo Americans would have been minor, Stalin would he hailed as the “liberator of Europe”.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
@Truth Vigilante
Once again, this comment is beyond ignorant of the German language. And everyone who Agrees with it or says Thanks for it, is equally ignorant. This is way too common on this site, but it reflects society as a whole. And those who include “Truth” in their fantasy screen names are the worst of all. Ignorance rules in this world!
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littlereddot says:@Carolyn Yeager
That’s because you are using the English alphabet and not the German one. Next he will insist that you use Chinese characters when referring to Xi Jinping.
This guy is so pedantic my eyes just roll. His “arguments” mostly consist of obfuscation, deflections and fallacy.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Malla
Oh dear! Another commenter whom I often read puts his foot in it big time.
Churchill could have intervened during Stalin’s invasion of Finland, Churchill could have intervened during Stalin’s invasion of the Baltics, Churchill could have declared war on both Germany and the USSR when they both invaded Poland.
No he couldn’t. He wasn’t Prime Miniister till months later.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Ron Unz
As you haven’t chosen to justify your denigration of Patrick McNally as a dishonest shill (and possibly pseudonymous) I have searched for the identification that I thought I remembered. Instead I found there were hundreds of Patrick McNallys known to search engines but, well behind sportsmen in fame but I think he is probably a respectable historian associated with the University College of Worcester in the UK. Would you now clear this up?
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John Wear says:@Wizard of Oz
You ask: “Did Hoess have a lawyer? If so, what did he say at or about the trial? Did he say that Hoess wouldn’t allow him to mention the torture, and, if so, why?”
My response: Rudolf Höss was called to the witness stand at the IMT by Ernst Kaltenbrunner’s defense attorney. The sequence of events is as follows.
On April 1, 1946, Höss was taken to a small office to be interviewed by American prosecutor Whitney Harris. The three weeks in British captivity had taken their toll on Höss. Höss’s eyes were bloodshot, his cheeks were unshaven and gaunt, and his frame appeared to be fragile. Expecting to meet a larger man, someone who exuded power and brutality, Harris instead observed that Höss was a shrunken man. (Source: Harding, Thomas, Hanns and Rudolf: The True Story of the German Jew Who Tracked Down and Caught the Kommandant of Auschwitz, New York: Simon & Schuster, 2013, p. 252).
While Höss waited in his cell to be called as a witness, he was visited by psychologist Dr. Gustave Gilbert, a New Yorker born to Jewish-Austrian immigrants. Gilbert wrote about Höss:
“In all of the discussions Höss is quite matter-of-fact and apathetic, shows some belated interest in the enormity of his crime, but gives the impression that it never would have occurred to him if somebody hadn’t asked him. There is too much apathy to leave any suggestion of remorse and even the prospect of hanging does not unduly distress him. One gets the general impression of a man who is intellectually normal but with the schizoid apathy, insensitivity and lack of empathy that could hardly be more extreme in a frank psychotic.” (Source: Gilbert, Gustave M., Nuremberg Diary, New York: Farrar, Straus and Company, 1947, p. 260).
Dr. Gilbert later wrote after Höss’s testimony at the IMT: “He gave his testimony in the same matter-of-fact, apathetic manner as he had related it to me in his cell.” (Source: Ibid., p. 264).
Maj. Leon Goldensohn, a U.S. Army psychiatrist, also remarked that “Höss looked blank and apathetic.” (Source: Mattogno, Carlo, Commandant of Auschwitz: Rudolf Höss, His Torture and His Forced Confessions, Uckfield, UK: Castle Hill Publishers, 2017, pp. 119, 329).
It is my opinion that Höss’s “schizoid apathy” and “apathetic manner” were caused by his brutal torture by British soldiers. Höss was not usually described as apathetic before he was tortured.
On April 15, 1946, Höss appeared in court at the IMT. Ernst Kaltenbrunner’s defense lawyer, Dr. Kurt Kauffmann, asked Höss a series of questions designed to prove that Kaltenbrunner had never visited Auschwitz. Höss affirmed that Kaltenbrunner had never visited Auschwitz, and that Kaltenbrunner didn’t ordered the execution of Jews at this camp. (Source: Harding, Thomas, Hanns and Rudolf: The True Story of the German Jew Who Tracked Down and Caught the Kommandant of Auschwitz, New York: Simon & Schuster, 2013, p. 257).
U.S. prosecutor Col. John Amen next started reading from an affidavit Höss had signed in front of Whitney Harris on April 5, 1946. Höss’s testimony at the IMT was probably the most important and striking evidence presented there of a German extermination program. Höss in his testimony said that more than two and a half million people were exterminated in the Auschwitz gas chambers, and that another 500,000 inmates had died there of other causes. (Source: Taylor, Telford, The Anatomy of the Nuremberg Trials: A Personal Memoir, New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 1992, p. 363).
No defender of the Holocaust story today accepts these inflated figures, and other key portions of Höss’s testimony at the IMT are widely acknowledged to be untrue.
Höss’s testimony, however, was reported around the world. A New York Times article described it as the “crushing climax to the case.” The Times in Britain said of Höss’s signed testimony: “Its dreadful implications must surpass any document ever penned.” (Source: Harding, Thomas, Hanns and Rudolf: The True Story of the German Jew Who Tracked Down and Caught the Kommandant of Auschwitz, New York: Simon & Schuster, 2013, pp. 259-260).
Höss was regarded as the star prosecution witness at the IMT, and his testimony has become the framework for the official Holocaust story.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Carolyn Yeager
Carolyn, you’re looking stupider by the minute.
I stated the obvious. ie: that the correct spelling for the Third Reich’s second in charge was Göring (not Goering).
Similarly, the Auschwitz Commandant was Höss, instead of the bastardised ‘Hoess’.You then gave me a lecture about the application of the umlaut.
Well guess what ? I am the only one actually using the EFF’N umlaut.It is you, silly Carolyn (and a few other ignorant contributors here in UR), who is using the lazy American spelling.
Carolyn, it didn’t escape my attention that a dumb Chinaman from Singapore wrote this message to you:
That’s because you are using the English alphabet and not the German one.
This Chinaman is one especially dumb c*nt, because he’s not aware that the German and English alphabets are exactly identical.
SUMMARY: I get it that most English character QWERTY keyboards don’t have the provision for the umlaut.
No problem then. You can spell the Auschwitz Commandant’s name as HOSS and Hitler’s number two as GORING – and we’ll make allowance for the fact that no umlauts were accessible on your keyboard.But FFS, no more of the HOESS or GOERING B.S.
The inclusion of the ‘E’ is unwarranted.
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@littlereddot
No, the German alphabet includes the oe, ue, ae and they are called “umlaut” along with ö ; that is why he is so COMPLETELY wrong. I’m not sure if he’s just being stubborn or really cannot grasp it. If the latter, he is truly dumb as sh-t and no one should pay any attention to him.
Not surprising, T.Vigilante is the one that poor Rurik praises most profusely as his mentor. Lol.
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Patrick McNally says:@Malla
> False, attitudes towards the USSR before 1945 and after 1945 is not the same.
While that statement has truth to it, you miss the point that a hypothetical invasion and conquest of Europe by Stalin would have brought a much more drastic change a lot quicker. If we really are envisioning a scenario where the Soviet army overruns Berlin within a few months and Hitler is suddenly ancient history, then from that moment on Churchill would be clamoring for Stalin to get out of eastern Europe and calling for the West to unite against him. Roosevelt would still be looking for a good war to stimulate the US economy with, and Japan would have promptly gone to war against the USSR as soon as Stalin struck at Germany.
The only real point ay issue is whether or not a hypothetical Soviet offensive against Germany would have been a swift success (the view which Rezun takes) or whether it would have bogged down. In the latter case, it’s easy to imagine Churchill offering alliance to Stalin and then sitting back for several years while Hitler, Hirohito and Stalin all exhaust each other. In the former case, Hitler would be a dead memory in a few months and people like Chaim Weizmann would have begun rallying in support of Churchill for a war against Stalin. It would be stupid either way from Stalin’s perspective.
>If Poland was the reason, Churchill declared war on Germany
It was Chamberlain who declared war on Germany. This was don because after Hitler had torn up the Munich Agreement and marched across Czechia, Chamberlain knew his credibility required taking a firm stand on Poland. But Allied plans had existed for, first, an intervention into the Winter War in Finland (which Hitler’s occupation of Norway stopped) and then for an attack on the Baku oilfields which was supposed to be done in the spring/summer of 1940. Hitler’s victory in France put an end to all of this and from then until summer 1941 Churchill’s hope was simply to draw Stalin into the war against Hitler.
> why did Churchill sit with Stalin in Yalta, the other invader of Poland?
Churchill’s position in 1945 was a rather sensitive one. He had ordered his staff to prepare the plans for Operation Unthinkable, which they did. But they emphasized to him that it was unrealistic for Britain to try launching another war so soon after this one. If Churchill had been surrounded by staff members like MacArthur and Patton, then history might have taken a different turn. But Churchill could not fought against this opposition from his officers. Instead, he began urging the Truman administration to start its own war against the USSR. But Churchill could not have easily come out against his own officers and Truman as well, when the latter rejected the idea of launching an atomic attack.
All of the latter consideration would have been completely different in the scenario where Stalin invades and conquers all of Europe during the second half of 1941. In such a case, Churchill would have had enormous support from his officers, Truman and the majority of Western civilization. It would have been a totally move by Stalin.
> Roosevelt was hostile towards Germany when it was not needed to be hostile towards Germany
Roosevelt found that the New Deal was blocked by domestic opposition from conservatives like Robert Taft. The only way around this was if a war broke out. Every public statement which Hitler made since the early 1920s suggested that he was the most likely person to actually start a war. Soviet leaders had traditionally been very cautious, though they hoped that imperialist rivalries would create a war amongst the capitalist powers that would facilitate a new wave of revolution. But the man most likely to make the first move in starting a war was Hitler, not Stalin. Roosevelt understood this.
However, if Stalin had so arrogantly moronic as to attempt a blatant conquest of Europe, then all of this would have changed. Churchill would definitely have been demanding a campaign by the whole West against Stalin. Meanwhile, many of the people who were ‘isolationist’ in the USA would now be ready to join with Churchill. It’s not likely that Charles Lindbergh would have remained ‘isolationist’ in such a case. More plausible is that Churchill and Lindbergh would join together with people like Rabbi Stephen Wise in demanding a US intervention in Europe. Roosevelt would be under serious pressure.
The small number of authentic Soviet agents who held positions in the Roosevelt administration would have lost their positions very quickly if they had tried to argue in defense of such a Soviet conquest of Europe. They lost their positions quickly after World War II in peacetime conditions. By 1948 most of the really authenticated cases had been exposed. They would have been exposed a lot quicker if they had been forced to try to defend an outright occupation of Europe.
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Patrick McNally says:@Wizard of Oz
I don’t know if that was addressed to me, but I certainly don’t live in the UK. I live in Florida know, have lived in Massachusetts in the past. When teaching some years ago, I was teaching math. The interest in history was always a personal fascination of mine. My father may have been noted by some people because he attended a meeting in Iran in 2006 where he acted as a translator for some other attendees.
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@Truth Vigilante
You, TV, may be the most dishonest man commenting regularly on this board. And that’s saying a lot. Because your “student-follower” Rurik is a strong competitor.
You use the Blockquote feature dishonestly to portray YOUR regular text, in the same post you use it for someone else’s words, whom you don’t indicate clearly. In this way, you can lie without actually lying, in your own eyes anyway. So in the first box you quote “red dot” and in the next ‘box’ you write your own words which are not even a quote! Why would you put what you’re saying to me for the first time in a blockquote??? It should be a regular part of your comment.
It’s possible you can’t follow this … OR … ?? I can’t even fathom such idiocy. If it’s meant to be deceitful, it’s idiotic deceitfulness on your part.
Bottom line: There is no such thing as “the bastardised ‘Hoess’” or “lazy American spelling.” I understand you’re Australian — is that the problem?
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HdC says:@Truth Vigilante
Pure and unadulterated rubbish.
In the German language the Umlaute ae, oe, ue, are identical to a, o, and u, with the two dots on top.
That was at the time when I learned German in Germany. They ought to know, right???
To repeat, these could be used interchangeably, especially when typing or typesetting and the Umlaut with the dots on top were unavailable.
When writing by hand it is quicker to simply write a, o, u, and add two dots when the word has been completed, as opposed to writing ae, etc.
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Gabreal Jones says:@Patrick McNally
Anthony Sutton is right on the money imv / but what he writes is not easy listening music to the ears of most…
” You’ve obviously never opened up a copy of Sutton’s book.” Did u open up the book of Juri Lina ?
Do you even know it ?Trotsky is a tribe member of te talmud j.´s / born in Ukrain he most probably will have been spoonfed with the “tanya” / the “holy” book of the chabad lubavitch sect.
Forget about Trotsky he left the stage in Mexico in 1940 thru an ice pick attack of a Stalin agent.
The chabad tanya is actualy very concretely present till this very day in the National Education Day of the USA since 1978 , when Christian potus Jimmy Carter / no peanuts /dedicated this yearly event to chabad rebbe Schneerson / every WH resident after him followed suit / the noahide laws cq guilotines….
http://www.whale.to/c/lina.pdf / Freemasonry Masters of Deception
page 366 “Hitler meetings with his financial backers” …. AH asked initially 200 million marks :
” In the opinion of the New York ( j. / gj) bankers, these amounts were far too large, / however a week later, they sent Hitler a mere 15 million dollars * demanding aggressive initiatives on the neighbouring countries…*
” The money was transferred to three banks: Mendelsohn & Co. in Amsterdam, Rotterdamsche Bank in Rotterdam and Banca Italiana in Rome. Each bank received 5 million dollars”
* The centre of Rotterdam was bombed out of existence May 1940 / people I know in the Rotterdam art scene got amply financed by the city for a project called the “brandgrens” / since 2010 marking the boarder of the 12 kilometer fire line of this bombardment….
http://aanirfan.blogspot.com/2020/02/jane-haining-soros-eichmann-kasztner.html 4 February 2020 at 12:36 Julien romanovsky
Asking them / did you ever wonder “who financed AH´s bombardment” ? / does not make you very popular in those circles.
CIA O
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
I will now do some actual research to answer your question.
1) Your “actual research” raised many more questions. See below. This will be one of my many responses, in order to avoid the longest single set of comments in the history of this website.
2) You say you’re retired? Did you do historical research professionally before your retirement? Did you do some other type of research, professionally? (The reason I ask is that I’m retired, and did environmental/energy research for nearly the entirety of my 30-year career. So I don’t particularly appreciate a statement that begins with, “I will now do some actual research…”)
I have volume two of the book “Auschwitz: The Case for Sanity” by Carlo Mattogno.
3) Do you consider Carlo Mattogno one of the premier researchers regarding what happened at Auschwitz-Birkenau (hereafter abbreviated as A-B)? If you do, *why* do you consider him one of the premier researchers regarding what happened at A-B? If I did a poll of 5 people who seem to represent the top researchers regarding what happened at A-B, and asked them each to name the top five besides themselves, what percentage of the total people named would you expect would include Carlo Mattogno?
4)
Mattogno estimates on page 535 of this book that the deaths by year at Auschwitz-Birkenau are:
1940-1941 — 19,500
1942 — 48,500
1943 — 37,000
1944 — 30,000
1945 — 500
Total — 135,500When you were doing your “actual research” did it ever occur to you to *evaluate* Mattogno’s estimates in light of known/suspected facts? Here were my estimates of arrivals by year (ratioed downward from my estimate of 1,260,000 total arrivals to Mattogno’s estimate of 1,109,400), with Carlos Mattogno’s (CM’s) estimates of deaths, presented in table form:
Year: Arrivals – Deaths = Difference
1941: 26,414 – 19,500 = 6,914
1942: 202,510 – 48,500 = 154,010
1943: 272,948 – 37,000 = 235,948
1944: 607,548 – 30,000 = 577,529
1945: 0 – 500 = -500All years: 1,109,400 – 135,500 = 973,900
Don’t you see the *insanity* of CM’s and your analysis of what happened at Auschwitz? Take 1944 *alone*, for example. In 1944, if over 600,000 people came into A-B, and only 30,000 people died at A-B, just where the hell do you and CM think the other 570,000+ went? To what other places did those 570,000+ (in 1944 alone!) go?
So, using Mattogno’s estimates, we have 1,109,400 deportees to Auschwitz-Birkenau less 135,500 deaths equals a total of 973,900 Auschwitz-Birkenau inmates who eventually went some where else.
Yes, exactly. Where did those 973,900 A-B inmates who “eventually went somewhere else” go?
I’ll help you out. You say 7,000 – 8,000 were left at Auschwitz. Using the 7,500 midpoint, that means 966,400 “eventually went somewhere else”.
You don’t mention it, but I’ll help you out with this one: the miserable Nazi monsters led approximately 60,000 on a death march on foot mere weeks before Auschwitz was liberated. So that means we’re down to (966,400 – 60,000) = 906,400 who “eventually went somewhere else”. Where did those 906,400 people go?
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Alexandros says:@Bankotsu
This is Jewish and British propaganda to portray England as the good guy and Hitler as bumbling any hopes for peace.
The notion that Hitler was planning to use Ruthenia for a move against the Ukraine is patently ridiculous. He was offered Ruthenia by the Ruthenians themselves when he occupied Czechoslovakia. He had no interest in them and instead offered them up as a gift to the Hungarians who promptly occupied the territory. If anything he was showing the world this was not his intention.
In the Halifax talks nothing of the sort is promised. And there is no indication Hitler is being taken in by Halifax. On the contrary he is constantly reminding Halifax of England’s real attitude whenever the latter pretends otherwise. Halifax ultimately stymied the German-Polish negotiations about Danzig, opening the door for war, and Hitler knew it. Ribbentropp too, who advised Hitler of the fact. To present Ribbentropp as ignorant of English intentions has been one of the masterstrokes of English propaganda. It was hardly a secret they were preparing for war in the late 30s.
The decision to risk war was taken by Hitler when von Brachtisch informed him that Germany had the strengt to win a war against Poland, France and England. Not because he was under the false impression the English was going to let him off the hook. Again, on the contrary he was ordering an immediate attack on France in the winter of 1939 trying to knock the English out of the continent as quickly as possible. He knew the game was on.
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Rurik says:@Carolyn Yeager
Rurik praises most profusely as his mentor. Lol.
more lies
TruthV is an intelligent and honorable person who participates here, whom I’ve never described as my mentor. Only that I have learned from him, as I have hundreds of others here at TUR.
He also participates in good faith,
unlike some others..
dishonest man commenting regularly on this board. And that’s saying a lot. Because your “student-follower” Rurik is a strong competitor.
you know, some people didn’t like that I called you a sow and a pig,
but I was actually too kind.
You’re actually a lying pig, aren’t you?
Or, you can kindly point out where I’ve been dishonest…
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Mefobills says:@Patrick McNally
The intended objective of Barbarossa was that the USSR had been expected to collapse swiftly, thereby opening up a vast range of new living space for Aryans
This is you seizing on one thing, and clinging to it.
Malla gave you a transcript, which presumably you read.
These comments are taped, and the tapes still exist, and are in Hitler’s voice. The transcript is of the Mannerheim tapes:
Our whole armament – you know, was – is a pure good weather armament. It is very capable, very good, but it is unfortunately just a good-weather armament. We have seen this in the war. Our weapons naturally were made for the West, and we all thought, and this was true’till that time, uh, it was the opinion from the earliest times; you cannot wage war in winter.
and this comment from Hitler is also in direct contradiction to your main thesis:
Therefore I aspired to, bridge the period of negotiations’till we would be strong enough to, counter those extortive demands [from Moscow] because – those demands were simply naked extortion’s. They were extortion’s. The Russians knew we were tied up in the west.
They could really extort everything from us.You seem to have an agenda rather than being a truth seeker.
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Patrick McNally says:@Gabreal Jones
> Juri Lina
Repeats a fabricated story alleging that Trotsky became a Mason in January 1917. Total rubbish.
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Patrick McNally says:@Mefobills
> Malla gave you a transcript, which presumably you read.
Of course, I read it about a decade ago when it was published by Veronica Clark in the booklet Hitler’s Most Significant Speech. You’re just showing off your gullibility here. The record of Hitler’s statements makes it clear that not only was living space for an expanding Aryan race a principal objective of Barbarossa, but that in the early weeks he was expecting the main operation to wrap within a few months. From September 1941 onward there is a visible shift In Hitler’s tone. That is true whether one refers to the Table Talk or collections of speeches and memos as assembled Max Domarus, Norman Baynes, and other editors.
By the time Hitler met with Mannerheim it would have sounded stupid to tell him “I was expecting the whole thing would be over by September!” Instead, the conversation leads off with both Hitler and Mannerheim expressing their shock at how strong the Soviet forces really were. Then, more than two-thirds of the way through the transcript, Hitler suddenly brings up Molotov and tells Mannerheim “it was absolutely certain that Molotov departed with decision to begin a war.” This is quite obviously different from statements which Hitler had made earlier, such as in February 1941:
—–
Keitel’s economics expert General Thomas noted after meeting Göring on February 26: “He shares the Führer’s opinion that when German troops march into Russia the entire Bolshevik state will collapse, and that for this reason we need not fear the destruction of the stores and railway system on a large scale, as I do. The main thing is to get rid of the Bolshevik leaders rapidly first of all.” Göring’s anxiety was the weakness of the German supply lines… Hitler was already thinking beyond the end of ‘Barbarossa.’ On the seventeenth, Jodl instructed his staff that the Führer wished them to study the problems of assembling troops in Afghanistan for an assault on India.
—–
— David Irving, Hitler’s War, p. 206.This was obviously a very different frame of mind from when Hitler met with Mannerheim in June 1942.
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Rurik says:@Carolyn Yeager
This entire comment #1020 is dishonest, through and through.
no, you’re lying again.
You’re actually at a loss when it comes to honesty vs dishonesty.
is this true, or not?
“Rurik praises most profusely as his mentor.”
It isn’t rocket science. Either that statement is true, or it’s not. And if it’s not, is it an honest mistake, or a mean spirited lie intended to disparage Rurik, (myself)?
I’m not really asking you, because I don’t think you’re capable of acting in good faith. So it would be pointless to query you on anything, when you’ll just dissemble and lie about it afterwards. So my words are for the others, who are not liars but who recognize one when they see one.
Then you claim I’m dishonest, in an ironic twist. But I’ve been participating here for many years, and millions of words, and in all that time I’ve never lied or been dishonest about anything. I’ve been mistaken from time to time, but I’ve never lied. And you claim I’m a competitor for being the most dishonest commenter on this board, with exactly ZERO evidence for that outrages and malicious and defamatory calumny. Which has become your calling card.
Do you think that by lying more, that people will believe you, if you just tell more lies?
We know that’s how the media works, but it isn’t so easy to do on a website forum like this, where all your lies are cataloged and part of the permanent record.
But that shouldn’t stop you from tying. Clearly, you have no shame and no principles and no honor or integrity, so why not tell more lies, huh?
It’s obviously something you’re quite comfortable doing. Almost as glib at lying as Franny.
Like I said, you two are peas in a pod.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “You say you’re retired? Did you do historical research professionally before your retirement? Did you do some other type of research, professionally?”
My response: I am an amateur historian. My work career was primarily as a tax accountant. I did do research as a tax accountant.
You write: “So I don’t particularly appreciate a statement that begins with, “I will now do some actual research…”)”
My response: My first two responses were off the top of my head. My last response used research primarily from Carlo Mattogno and other sources. This is why I said “I will now do some actual research.”
You write: “Do you consider Carlo Mattogno one of the premier researchers regarding what happened at Auschwitz-Birkenau (hereafter abbreviated as A-B)?”
My response: Yes.
You write: “If you do, *why* do you consider him one of the premier researchers regarding what happened at A-B?”
My response: Because I have read many of his books. Mattogno’s books are extremely well researched.
You ask: “If I did a poll of 5 people who seem to represent the top researchers regarding what happened at A-B, and asked them each to name the top five besides themselves, what percentage of the total people named would you expect would include Carlo Mattogno?”
My response: It depends on who you asked. If you asked people such as Germar Rudolf, Dr. Arthur Robert Butz, Jürgen Graff, Thomas Dalton, and other Holocaust revisionists, they would all agree that Carlo Mattogno is one of the top researchers of Auschwitz-Birkenau. If you asked people who attempt to uphold the official Holocaust narrative, probably none of them would.
You ask: “When you were doing your “actual research” did it ever occur to you to *evaluate* Mattogno’s estimates in light of known/suspected facts?”
My response: Yes.
You ask: “Don’t you see the *insanity* of CM’s and your analysis of what happened at Auschwitz?”
My response: No.
You ask: “Take 1944 *alone*, for example. In 1944, if over 600,000 people came into A-B, and only 30,000 people died at A-B, just where the hell do you and CM think the other 570,000+ went? To what other places did those 570,000+ (in 1944 alone!) go?”
My response: Mattogno in his book discusses in detail the number of victims at Auschwitz-Birkenau on pages 514-540 of his book. You can read these pages for a more detailed discussion of this issue.
You ask: “Yes, exactly. Where did those 973,900 A-B inmates who “eventually went somewhere else” go?”
My response: Mostly to other camps such as Bergen-Belsen, Buchenwald, Dachau, Mauthausen and their sub-camps. In my comment #983, I gave you Viktor Frankl, Anne Frank and Violette Fintz as three examples of people who were transferred out of Auschwitz-Birkenau. There were obviously many more examples. As Edwin Black has stated, Auschwitz-Birkenau served as a transit camp.
The Bergen-Belsen Camp, for example, was designed to hold only 3,000 inmates. By the end of 1944 in was holding about 60,000 inmates, a large number of whom had transferred out of Auschwitz-Birkenau. The overcrowding at Bergen-Belsen was enormous, and the ensuing typhus epidemic killed a large number of inmates in the camp.
You write: “You don’t mention it, but I’ll help you out with this one: the miserable Nazi monsters led approximately 60,000 on a death march on foot mere weeks before Auschwitz was liberated. So that means we’re down to (966,400 – 60,000) = 906,400 who “eventually went somewhere else”. Where did those 906,400 people go?”
My response: There were probably about 60,000 inmates who were marched out of Auschwitz-Birkenau on foot, and certainly some of them died. However, I would not describe it as a “death march.” Many German civilians who were traveling west to escape the Red Army also perished from the cold and lack of food. The winter of 1944-1945 was unusually cold, and it was hard on everyone.
Other places where the inmates evacuated from Auschwitz-Birkenau went include, but are certainly not limited to, Sachsenhausen, Ravensbrück, Flossenbürg, Neuengamme, and Dora. There were also numerous smaller work camps where Auschwitz-Birkenau inmates were transferred to.
Please feel free to send me more of your questions and comments. I will be glad to answer them.
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Mark Bahner says:
I’m curious, Carolyn, have you ever lived in Germany? If so, for how long?
P.S. For you to write, “You have no idea…about WWII history” is surely the pinnacle of irony, given you’ve also written this drivel:
https://carolynyeager.net/auschwitz-underground-guided-tour
…as opposed to simply directing people who visit your website to an organization that actually knows what Auschwitz-Birkenau was like::
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@Rurik
Childish beyond belief. Get help.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Carolyn Yeager
No, the German alphabet includes the oe, ue, ae and they are called “umlaut”
This all started with the spelling of Hermann Göring’s name, and I PROVED (by furnishing his actual signature in comment # 397) that he never spelled it with an ‘e’, as in Goering.
FFS, who should we trust in the spelling of Hermann’s last name ? Is it Carolyn Yeager or Göring himself ??
I challenge you Carolyn, show me one case, just ONE EFF’N CASE, where the Reichsmarschall spelt his name with an ‘e’.
Hmmm … I didn’t think so.Similarly, the German city of Munich is spelt as München by the Germans themselves. Once again, show me a single case where the Germans have spelt it as Muenchen ?
Now, I don’t doubt that there exist American made maps, reference books etc, that use the bogus Muenchen spelling, but NEVER a Germanic one.
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Truth Vigilante says:@HdC
In the German language the Umlaute ae, oe, ue, are identical to a, o, and u, with the two dots on top.
That was at the time when I learned German in Germany. They ought to know, right???
Whilst what you write is technically true, in PRACTICE the Germans themselves always opt for the two dots on top.
That was my point.
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
My first two responses were off the top of my head. My last response used research primarily from Carlo Mattogno and other sources. This is why I said “I will now do some actual research.”
I see. I apologize for the inappropriate offense taken.
My response: Mattogno in his book discusses in detail the number of victims at Auschwitz-Birkenau on pages 514-540 of his book. You can read these pages for a more detailed discussion of this issue.
That wasn’t the question I asked. I asked where the 570,000+ people who “went somewhere else” *in 1944 alone* actually went? Were they transferred to other concentration or death camps? Did they escape? Did they fall through trap door into an alternate universe?
If Carlos Mattogno and you can’t explain where at least the vast majority of those estimated 570,000+ unaccounted for people *in 1944 alone* went, I don’t see how either of you have any credibility in your estimates of the number of deaths at A-B in 1944 and the cause of those deaths.
However, I would not describe it as a “death march.”
1) You wouldn’t?! Seriously?
2) Would you call the event known as the “Bataan death march” a “death march”?
3) If you would call the “Bataan death march” a “death march,” why would you not consider the forced evacuation at gunpoint of the approximately 60,000 malnourished, overworked, and ill-clothed civilian survivors of the Auschwitz-Birkenau camp in January 1945 not a “death march”?
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Odyssey says:@Truth Vigilante
She said that her (((hero))) was Alexander Löhr (not Loer). Löhr served in the Luftwaffe during World War II, rising to commander of Army Group E and then to commander-in-chief in Southeastern Europe (OB Südost). He bombed Belgrade with incendiary bombs and for that crime he got the promotion to Generaloberst.
Löhr was captured by Yugoslav Partisans at the end of the war in Europe. He was tried and convicted of war crimes by the Yugoslav government for anti-partisan reprisals committed under his command, and the bombing of Belgrade in 1941. He was executed by firing squad on 26 February 1947 In Belgrade, Yugoslavia.
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niceland says:
I don’t have a horse in this race. To be sure, the revisionist view has changed my totally main-stream ideas about these events quite a bit but this story has so many angles it’s difficult to be sure about great many things without spending a lot of time investigating. Something I haven’t done. I like to share what opened my mind to the possibility the ‘official’ version of these events may be skewed or basically wrong.
Some years ago I came across a video from some young jewish fellow (Cole?) who visited Auschwitz and walked around with a camera and was wondering about many things, he interviewed Auschwitz ‘museum’ chief historian who stated on camera the current gas chambers were ‘rebuilt’ after the war, based on stories or some ‘evidence’ regarding how they were when they were used to exterminate huge numbers of people few years prior.
Said video sent me on a short quest to learn a bit about Auschwitz. I didn’t know there was a huge industrial park close by where several prominent German corporations had operations, no doubt relying on Auschwitz for workforce. Areal photos show buildings dedicated to de-lousing clothes, supposedly using Zyclon B.
One can find drawings and photos of the alleged gas chambers (used for extermination) and the crematorium on the web. For a ‘normal’ and more or less main-stream bloke like me it’s one thing to read long articles about these events. Even if well reasoned and sourced it seems there is always someone who can poke holes in them citing different sources or coming up with different interpretations. But for me, with some background in construction and engineering – looking at the these photos and plans and considering the logistics was quite powerful and revealing.
I am sure the main question that popped up in my head has been asked many times – why on earth did the Germans use so inefficient, cumbersome and far- fetched methods to exterminate, and dispose of, hundreds of thousands (or even millions?) of people? I can’t figure it out, from my experience this just doesn’t make any sense and this casts very serious doubt about the official version of the Auschwitz story.
The Third Reich was the pinnacle of efficiency in the world during it’s time, they excelled in engineering and pretty much everything else – and we are led to believe they used such stone-age methods to exterminate people huge scale? It’s even worse than that because what they allegedly did seems impossible. Even for them.
My simple take is: this gas chamber massacre in Auschwitz is extremely unlikely to have happened. Kind of proverbial straw that broke the camels back and made me view revisionist history with open mind. After all, what else are they lying about?
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You ask: “That wasn’t the question I asked. I asked where the 570,000+ people who “went somewhere else” *in 1944 alone* actually went? Were they transferred to other concentration or death camps?
My response: As I stated in my comment #1026, most Auschwitz-Birkenau inmates were transferred to other German concentration camps or their sub-camps as well as some work camps. I mention a total of nine of these German camps in my comment #1026.
Let’s look at a tenth camp, Stutthof, which I have not mentioned yet.
“Germar Rudolf writes on page 304 in the 4th edition of his book “Lectures on the Holocaust”:
“Since late June 1944, large transports of Jews arrived at Stutthof. They came mainly either from the Baltic countries or from the Auschwitz Camp. The first set was the result of the Red Army advancing into these countries, leading to the evacuation of all sorts of camps in that area, while the second set consisted of Jews from Hungary and the Lodz Ghetto, for whom Auschwitz had only been a transit camp.”
Rudolf continues:
“If we follow the orthodox narrative, the vast majority of the Hungarian Jews deported to Auschwitz since May 1944, as well as the Jews deported to Auschwitz from the Lodz Ghetto in August 1944, are said to have been murdered on arrival without having been registered. The data about the Stutthof Camp prove, however, that at least some of these unregistered Jews (23,566, to be precise) were not murdered on arrival but were transferred to other camps as forced laborers.”
Rudolf continues on pp. 304-305:
“One should not surmise that all Jews from the Baltic countries, Hungary and Lodz who were transited through Auschwitz in the summer of 1944 ended up in Stutthof, because that was only a small camp and merely one among many others. Further research about admissions to other camps, to the extent that the records still exist, may reveal that many more Jews were alive and kicking of whom orthodox historians had assumed that they had been murdered. Based on data available to him in 2001, Mattogno was able to prove that at least 79,200 of the Hungarian Jews who were deported to Auschwitz but remained unregistered, had been transported to other camps– without having been murdered. Stutthof demonstrates therefore that the orthodox conjecture about the mass murder of inmates who were not registered on arrival at Auschwitz is untenable.”
You write: “If Carlos Mattogno and you can’t explain where at least the vast majority of those estimated 570,000+ unaccounted for people *in 1944 alone* went, I don’t see how either of you have any credibility in your estimates of the number of deaths at A-B in 1944 and the cause of those deaths.”
My response: The vast majority of the Auschwitz-Birkenau inmates were transferred to other German camps and sub-camps. This is how the population of Bergen-Belsen ballooned to approximately 60,000 inmates by the end of 1944, when the population in this camp was only about 3,000 early in 1944.
You write: “If you would call the “Bataan death march” a “death march,” why would you not consider the forced evacuation at gunpoint of the approximately 60,000 malnourished, overworked, and ill-clothed civilian survivors of the Auschwitz-Birkenau camp in January 1945 not a “death march”?”
My response: I do not describe the forced evacuation of 60,000 Auschwitz-Birkenau inmates on foot as a death march because it was not the intent of the Germans to kill these inmates. I do not believe that very many of these inmates had been overworked. Many of the inmates were probably ill-clothed, but that is primarily because the winter of 1944-1945 was extremely cold. It was also extremely cold for the Germans traveling west to escape capture and possibly death from the Soviet Army.
Most of the 60,000 Auschwitz-Birkenau inmates were probably malnourished, but I don’t think there was a German intent to kill these inmates. I have yet to see evidence that the Germans intentionally starved the inmates in their camps.
For example, Dr. Russell Barton, an English physician who later became an American psychiatrist, testified at the 1985 Ernst Zündel trial that he entered Bergen-Belsen with British forces as a young medical student on May 2, 1945. Dr. Barton’s first impression of the camp was one of horror; some inmates were dead and piled up outside the huts, others were in various stages of dying, disease, and dehydration. Barton examined the camp’s well-equipped kitchens and found record books listing the food that had been cooked and distributed going back to 1942. Dr. Barton determined from his examination of the camp records that there had not been a deliberate policy of starvation at Bergen-Belsen.
Dr. Barton made inquiries with inmates, including Jewish doctors, who told him that Bergen-Belsen had not been too bad until the autumn of 1944. Then, as the Russian armies were advancing, the inmates said they had been given the choice of remaining in the camps about to be overrun by the Soviets or being repatriated back to Germany. Many chose to return to Germany. As a result, from the autumn of 1944 to early 1945, some 53,000 people were moved into Bergen-Belsen, which had room for only 3,000 inmates. The overcrowding was extreme and the staff at the camp resented it. Josef Kramer, the commandant of Bergen-Belsen, and Dr. Fritz Klein, the medical doctor at the camp, didn’t know what to do with the huge influx of inmates. Dr. Barton testified that the horrific conditions at Bergen-Belsen were attributable to overcrowding and the collapse of the German economy at the end of the war rather than to an intentional program of extermination. (Source: Rudolf, Germar (ed.), The First Zündel Trial: The Court Transcript of the Canadian “False News” Trial of Ernst Zündel, 1985, Uckfield, UK: Castle Hill Publishers, 2020, pp. 483-495).
Likewise, I do not accuse the British of murdering almost 14,000 Bergen-Belsen inmates after they took control of Bergen-Belsen, because it was not the intent of the British to kill these inmates. These Bergen-Belsen inmates who died under British control died mostly from typhus and other natural causes.
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Odyssey says:@Ron Unz
Coincidentally met and spoke to one of the guys who pushes unorthodox hot buttons. He told me that if anyone found one falsehood in his button-pressing that he would immediately stop posting comments. And over time, many people’s minds will open, since it is a very difficult process, especially for those arrogant and full of themselves from the West.
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Mark Bahner says:@Wizard of Oz
Is there any documentation of his torture. E.g. in archival material available after the Soviet Union collapsed? Any diary or letter?
Hoess said he’d been tortured by the British. But that is not really relevant. I have a book on the memoir of Höss on order. But apparently, in his memoir he reduced the number of deaths from 2.5 million to 1.1 million.
See this website titled, “How reliable are the Höss memoirs?”
https://phdn.org/archives/holocaust-history.org/auschwitz/hoess-memoirs/
From that website:
Höss’s most important demographic observation concerns the total number of victims who were murdered at Auschwitz. He gave the total (39) of 1,130,000. Until recently, many disputed estimates of this size. Most studies of Auschwitz gave a number at least twice as high or higher. Even the cover jacket for the edition of the memoirs used for this study places the number murdered at 2 million. However, in 1991 Polish historian and Auschwitz authority, Dr. Franciszek Piper, did the most comprehensive demographic study of the number of deportees to the camp ever undertaken. He began the study in 1980. He found that 1.3 million had been deported to Auschwitz during its 4 1/2 year existence but that only 400,000 had received a registration number. Of those 400,000 only 200,000 had not been killed. All of the unregistered deportees, who cannot be accounted for, were killed. This means that 1.1 million were killed. 49 The United States Holocaust Memorial Museum in Washington D.C. has now accepted this number. 50
Also from that website:
The most significant aspect to Höss’s placing the number at 1.1 million is that this constitutes the definitive proof that Höss could not have been forced to lie in his memoirs. At the time Höss wrote his memoirs the standard figure on the number murdered was 4 million. The Soviets, who had liberated Auschwitz in January 1945, issued a report dated May 6, 1945 where the 4 million number was given. This report was subsequently filed with the International Tribunal at Nuremberg as document USSR-008. Many former prisoners stated that 4 million were killed at Auschwitz. This number was also accepted by the Polish authorities that tried Höss. 51 Yet at the same time these reports were listing four million murdered, Höss repudiated former testimony he had given at the International Military Tribunal, before he was handed over to the Poles, that 2.5 million were killed. He wrote (39): “I regard a total of 2.5 million as far too high. Even Auschwitz had limits to its destructive capacity. Figures given by former prisoners are figments of their imagination and have no basis in fact.”
Since Höss himself reduced his estimate from 2.5 million to 1.13 million in a situation in which he was clearly not being tortured, his later estimate of 1.13 million deaths in Auschwitz-Birkenau represents his best estimate of the actual number of deaths.
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
I do not describe the forced evacuation of 60,000 Auschwitz-Birkenau inmates on foot as a death march because it was not the intent of the Germans to kill these inmates.
Do you call the Bataan Death March a “death march”?
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Wizard of Oz says:@Mark Bahner
Of course SS guards who knew the Red Army was coming and they were on the losing side wanted to keep the inmates alive.
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Malla says:@Wizard of Oz
Thanks for the correction, Patrick McNally is flailing all around to somehow discredit the fact that Operation Barbarossa was a pre-Emptive Strike, for ideological and emotional reasons. He comes up with all kinds of ‘what ifs’ and this ‘what if’ about Churchill is ridiculous when one sees Churchill’s behaviour even before he was in 10 Downing Street.
Months before Churchill entered No. 10, Chamberlain’s government nearly went to war with the USSR over Stalin’s brutal invasion of Finland during the winter of 1939. Churchill, in contrast, went out of his way to cultivate the Soviets: he privately assured Stalin’s ambassador in London, Ivan Maisky, that in order to weaken Nazi Germany, Britain did not view Soviet expansion into the Baltic region unfavourably. However Churchill did suggest sending a British Army officer, Brigadier Christopher Ling, to Helsinki for moral support to the Finns. In the war cabinet in November 1939, Churchill urged Chamberlain not to make the ‘mistake’ of ‘trying to stiffen the Finns against making concessions to the USSR’. For this reason Churchill’s premiership was warmly welcomed by Maisky and Soviet-aligned groups in Britain, such as the Daily Worker and the Russia Today Society. The Russia Today Society latter expressed hope that Churchill would reverse ‘the previous government’s policy of hostility towards the USSR’.
Churchill threw all of his support behind Stalin’s armies after Operation Barbarossa despite Stalin’s alliance with Hitler during the first 21 months of the war — the USSR having invaded the same number of countries as NS Germany (seven), having supplied the German Wehrmacht as it fought France and the Low Countries, and having literally fuelled the Luftwaffe as it bombed London in 1940. And mind you, most of Germany’s invasions could be explained on some grounds unlike the Soviet invasions, even then, Churchill ignored/forgave Soviet aggression when he made friendship with the USSR. Churchill responded to news of Axis pre-emptive strike of the Soviet Union by sending Stalin 200 brand-new Hurricane Hawker pursuit planes which had been pledged to be sent to Singapore. Churchill then ‘re–gifted’ Stalin 200 Tomahawk fighters and 300 Douglas A-20 Havoc bombers from Britain’s own Lend-Lease consignments, and shipped Stalin 2,000 tonnes of processed aluminium for Soviet warplane factories, despite it being desperately needed at home. Churchill’s also shipped to Stalin nearly 600 tanks, some of the most advanced British tanks, through dangerous and expensive naval convoys, which helped the Soviets tip the balance in the Battle of Moscow in December 1941. Churchill even agreed to strip Cairo command of hundreds more tanks in 1942, routing them to Stalin’s USSR via Iran to bail out the Red Army at Stalingrad, which left the British Army in Egypt vulnerable to Erwin Rommel’s Afrika Korps.
Churchill doubled down on his pro–Soviet policies even in areas where Britain had her own clients, such as Yugoslavia. Despite hosting the Yugoslav exile government in London, by September 1943, Churchill abandoned that government’s commander on the ground and threw his full support behind Stalin’s man, Josip Broz (‘Tito’). In support of Stalin, Churchill backstabbed and cut off Colonel Draža Mihailovic’s Chetniks, who had fought the Axis armies, mind you and shipped the Communist Tito more than 100 times more war material over the next nine months than Mihailovic had received in the previous two years.
At Tehran and Yalta, Churchill showed some resistance to Stalin’s plans to impose a puppet communist government on Poland, despite getting no help at all from US president Franklin Roosevelt. Nonetheless, Churchill allowed Stalin to sideline the Polish exile government he was hosting in London. He even pressured Polish leaders to move the country’s borders westward so as to satisfy Stalin’s designs, including a forcible population exchange. Churchill and Stalin came to a deal where there would be 90% Soviet influence in Poland and 10% British influence in exchange for Greece where it would be reverse (90% British influence and 10% Soviet), due to which the Soviets withdrew support to some Greek Communists. So Churchill starts a devastating and destructive war in Europe for Poland and then just dumped the same Poland??
Churchill, a man who believed in Britain as a force for good carried out policies in WW2 which sacrificed a relatively liberal and racially tolerant empire. He did so to defeat Hitler’s Third Reich, Mussolini’s Italy as well as the Japanese Empire — while enabling and furthering the expansion of Stalin’s totalitarian, brutal communist empire from Berlin to Beijing.
The painful truth about Whether or not the payoff was worth the price is a question well worth debating, but it is hardly fair for people today to blame Churchill for selfish devotion to the beloved empire he sacrificed.
Churchill eventually summoned up some of his old fire at the end of the war by trying to get U.S. President Harry Truman, to resist further Soviet encroachment in eastern Europe. (Churchill first used his ‘Iron Curtain’ phrase in May 1945.) By then, however, it was too late to contain the damage done by his earlier embrace of Stalin’s regime and its interests. Millions of Eastern Europeans were forced into Bolshevist totalitarianism and millions went to Gulags. Maybe it was only later that Chruchill realised that he was a fool, he made a serious mistake, supported the wrong side, who knows? In his lifetime, he saw the dissolution of his beloved British Empire, an event which led to many new serious problems (India-Pakistan for one) on the global stage, of Britain turning into a second rate power under the shadow of America.
And now leftists hate him, and want to destroy his statues, falsely blame him for the Bengal Famine, in India we have a word for this, “karmon ka faal”.
So, no McNally’s ‘what if’ does not hold water. Churchill had many opportunities to oppose the USSR, he did not, he embraced it.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Wizard of Oz says:@Patrick McNally
Perhaps you have converted the thoroughness required of a .
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Patrick McNally says:@Bankotsu
> The British guarantee of Polish independence was meant to deter Hitler from further aggression and persuade him to obtain what he wanted from Poland by negotiation.
So, what’s your point? Your own reference says that the intent was “deter Hitler from further aggression and persuade him to obtain what he wanted from Poland by negotiation.” That doesn’t conflict with anything that I’ve ever said. At most, you seem to simply be expressing over the idea that Chamberlain might recognize that there could be something which needed to be negotiated over. In fact, many British intellectuals had already argued since 1919 that the status of Danzig deserved a closer review. Sure, Hitler was a lying hypocrite when he pretended in public to be concerned about Danig while pursuing very different aims in reality. But there is nothing shocking about Chamberlain suggesting that there might be something worth negotiating over about Danzig.
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Wizard of Oz says:@niceland
Your generalisation about German efficiency is at best totally irrelevant. What’s wrong with an equally speculative view that Himmler was indeed concerned about reported PTSD (as we might call it today) in young German soldiers who had to shoot civilians. How would he have responded to being told that one bright young need had pointed out that carbon monoxide in the back of trucks had done a pretty good job and gas might be the way to go? The idea that Zyclon B could have more than.one use might have been another sales point.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Mark Bahner
Since Höss himself reduced his estimate from 2.5 million to 1.13 million in a situation in which he was clearly not being tortured, his later estimate of 1.13 million deaths in Auschwitz-Birkenau represents his best estimate of the actual number of deaths.
Your attempt at logic here ranks as one of the most asinine I’ve ever seen.
Höss had a wife and five children. ANY statement extracted from him was done through THREATS and INTIMIDATION.
ie: specifically threats and intimidation directed at his family in the event that he didn’t ‘confess’ to pre-prepared statements written by rabid Jews with an axe to grind.So picture this Bahner: Some depraved Jew is talking to Höss in an interrogation room and says:
‘My, my you do have a lovely family (as he’s looking at photos of Höss’ children in front of him).
Little Annegret (Höss’ 3 year old daughter) is an absolute delight.
We certainly wouldn’t want any harm to come to her, would we now ?’.SUMMARY: ANYTHING that Höss is alleged to have confessed to, whether it be the original draft confession (or a toned down version – after the Jews had worked out that the 2.5 million figure was not remotely feasible), is completely worthless as evidence.
Only a dyed-in-the-wool mendacious Jew would accept these statements at face value.
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kb_2 says:@John Wear
John, while I think that the disappearance of a million people is extremely serious evidence against the revisionist point of view, I recently found one interesting remark regarding hypothetical survivors:
Also, note that many of these survivors would not know they had come from (or through) “Belzec”, “Sobibor” or “Treblinka”, all the more suggesting the diminished sense of relevance of their experiences, hence little motive to document their travels, even once the names of these camps gained popular attention decades after the war.
(from here: https://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=15007)
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Truth Vigilante says:
Also, something that UR readers my find interesting:
About Klaus Höss – Son of SS Obersturmbanführer (Lieutenant Colonel) Rudolf Höss.
In the mid-1960s, Klaus Höss, the eldest of Rudolf and Hedwig Höss’ five children, emigrated with his German wife Lisolet (Lilo) to Australia.
Klaus and Lilo Höss settled in Sydney where they brought up their only daughter, Christine Höss, Anita’s mother. They later divorced.
In the mid-1980s Klaus died in Sydney from liver cirrhosis as a result of chronic alcohol abuse. He is survived by his ex-wife Lilo, daughter Christine, and numerous nephews and nieces.Klaus was 56 years old at the time of his death.
Below is a photo of Inge-Brigitt Höss (born 1933) Rudolf Höss’ second daughter, circa early 1950’s:
Brigitt worked briefly as a model for the Balenciaga fashion house in Madrid in the 1950’s, and thereafter lived and worked in Washington D.C for 40 years.
Her father would have been proud of her – a gorgeous girl she certainly was (contrast that with the hideous inbreds that killed her father).Below are the eldest four of the Höss children (Inge-Brigitt top left, Heidetraud standing next to her, Klaus seated on the right, and Hans-Jürgen (the youngest son) seated beside him:
The youngest child (Annegret -born November 1943), had likely not been born when this photo was taken.
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littlereddot says:@Carolyn Yeager
Exactly. Also don’t forget what English speakers recognise as the “beta” letter that the Germans use to denote a double “S”. Such as in “strasse”.
Despite all his pretensions to the contrary, and the COPIOUS volume of his comments, he strikes me as rather insular and limited in perceptive ability….only able to perceive issues from his point of view, and never from the other person’s vantage point.
I have given up on reading his posts, much less communicating with him. It is like casting pearls before swine.
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Bankotsu says:@Patrick McNally
So, what’s your point?
My point is this:
“…It is a complete error to say, as most students of the period have said, that before 15 March the government was solidly appeasement and afterwards solidly resistant. The Chamberlain group, after 17 March 1939, was just as partial to appeasement as before, perhaps more so, but it had to adopt a pretense of resistance to satisfy public opinion and keep a way open to wage the November election on either side of the issue…
The efforts of the Chamberlain group to continue the policy of appeasement by making economic and other concessions to Germany and their efforts to get Hitler to agree to a four-power pact form one of the most shameful episodes in the history of recent British diplomacy. These negotiations were chiefly conducted through Sir Horace Wilson and consisted chiefly of offers of colonial bribes and other concessions to Germany. These offers were either rejected or ignored by the Nazis…
If, by means of another Munich, he could have obtained a German-Polish settlement that would satisfy Germany and avoid war, he would have taken it. It was the hope of such an agreement that prevented him from making any real agreement with Russia, for it was, apparently, the expectation of the British government that if the Germans could get the Polish Corridor by negotiation, they could then drive into Russia across the Baltic States. For this reason, in the negotiations with Russia, Halifax refused any multilateral pact against aggression, any guarantee of the Baltic States, or any tripartite guarantee of Poland…”
http://www.yamaguchy.com/library/quigley/anglo_12b.html
http://www.carrollquigley.net/books.htmMy point is that until 3 September 1939, when UK declared war, Neville Chamberlain NEVER ENDED appeasement of Hitler. The UK policy of letting Germany annex more territory in eastern europe never ended. All the public talk of resistance was only a facade and PR BS. Anyone that argues otherwise is talking total garbage and repeating British drivel propaganda.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You ask: “Do you call the Bataan Death March a “death march”?”
My response: I have not researched the Bataan Death March enough to make an informed opinion. For now I will pass on making a comment.
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Brosi says:@Malla
Churchill, a man who believed in Britain as a force for good
Churchill was an amoral Freemason and a pathological liar. The only thing Churchill believed in was Churchill, and possibly lucifer.
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@niceland
Very intelligent and mature comment. Your experience is my experience, except that I don’t have a ” background in construction and engineering.” But I did have the ability to reason, to think. That’s really what it takes. For many, their politics and social considerations stop the free range of thinking; create walls called ‘taboos.’ An example of this kind of person is Wiz of Oz, who replied to your comment with a blindly stupid objection. He is here to do just that and has been doing it for years. That’s why it’s pointless to respond to him.
To pursue the “Holocaust” questioning further, one must have sufficient interest to do so. Only a relative few have that interest. That’s what the pushers of this lie depend on. Thanks again for your input.
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Brad Anbro says:@Mark Bahner
Mr. Bahner,
I see that as of 23 June you have not answered my reply to your post regarding the “events” of September 11, 2001. I was just curious as to how your effort is going to educate yourself as to the REAL events of that day are concerned? Or have you not bothered and are going to continue acting as a cheerleader for the 9/11 Commission?
Thank you.
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Gabreal Jones says:@Patrick McNally
“Repeats a fabricated story alleging that Trotsky became a Mason in January 1917” In fact immaterial imv if Trotsky became mason or not / Trotsky born Lev Bronstein was raised with the talmud & tanya….Masonry is an entirely j. business….
What is important in the framework of this Unz Review article is who financed AH?
“Banking with Hitler” is a good doc about the truth on this important matter / but is hard to upload from Spain where I my phusical mental apparatus currently is doing its thing…..Many masons here & its hot…..
Read the silview article & view the vids / I would say…..
CIA O
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@Truth Vigilante
This all started with the spelling of Hermann Göring’s name
Yes, and your real reason for questioning me was bc of my criticism of David Irving (who you call the greatest WWII historian who ever lived) and John Wear. You erroneously thought this was a way to put yourself in a superior position. When it backfired, you dug in your heels and added that the umlaut can only be spelled as ö, not as oe; that oe was “bastardized American lazy spelling.” That is WRONG. Do you understand what wrong is? It means you can’t twist it around and make it appear RIGHT. You repeated in another post:
Carolyn, you do realise that it’s spelt ‘Göring’ ? I’m well aware that many American historians spell it with the ‘e’ included because it kind of sounds that way when spoken.
Nevertheless, it is still the wrong spelling.NO, it is not the wrong spelling. The ‘e’ is not added “bc it kind of sounds that way.” Oe IS the sound. Being ignorant of the German language, you invent things in your mind (make it up) and then believe it. It happens all the time. This comment forum is full of such inventions! That’s why there’s so many comments, mostly useless trash.
Why don’t you talk to a real, educated German person or read an article on it by such a person? Is your answer that you like being an ignorant Aussie with a superiority complex, and intend to stay that way? After all, you’ve got Unz Review and all the space & readers you need to express your ideas, no matter how asinine they are.
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Brad Anbro says:@Truth Vigilante
T-V,
In ham radio, we exchange “post cards” (QSL cards) that serve as written proof that communication has taken place between two stations. The Swedes, land of my ancestors, sometimes use “oe” and not the ö on thir cards. Just thought you’d like to know. I am not sure about the ä and the å characters. I would have to look at my Swedish cards to see.
Brad
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@Truth Vigilante
That was my point.
That was not your point. You tried to say it was “technically true,” not in practice only, for Germans. As though someone like you would know. Now you’re slithering around to save your butt. You’re unable to say, like a man, I was mistaken, I was wrong — learn a lesson and move on from there.
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Mark Bahner says:@Wizard of Oz
This is a joke (sarcasm) right?
In any case, I really am interested in whether “John Wear” will answer my question:
Do you call the Bataan Death March a “death march”?
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John Wear says:@kb_2
Thanks for sending me this article.
I think the main reason we don’t have train records of the transfers from Belzec, Sobibor and Treblinka is summarized in this article as “Records maintained in the East kept secret, destroyed, or lost due to Soviet practices.” The Soviets could easily have destroyed all documentation of the transfers out of the Aktion Reinhardt camps.
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Mark Bahner says:@Carolyn Yeager
When it backfired, you dug in your heels and added that the umlaut can only be spelled as ö, not as oe; that oe was “bastardized American lazy spelling.” That is WRONG.
Carolyn, have you ever lived in Germany?
Do you think any German would write Göring’s name as “Goering”?
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HdC says:@Mark Bahner
If handwritten, no.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Carolyn Yeager
I don’t think your complimenting him will do much to affect niceland’s self regard. Your deficiencies of intellect which even Holocaust denier Ron can’t restrain himself from noticing are so obvious in what you say about me that I can hardly be bothered to reply to you and possibly provoke agreement with you from UR’s halfwitted troglodytes. But I can’t resist putting you to the test of justifying your words
Wiz of Oz, who replied to your comment with a blindly stupid objection. He is here to do just that
My “objection” as you call it was to ask him why his purely speculative guesswork aboutgas chambers was more plausible than the speculation that one of the known stories about the reasons gor adopting gas to kill prisoners was true. How do you justify “stipid” and how do you refute the speculation?
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Wizard of Oz says:@Mark Bahner
No joke or even sarcasm but I don’t think John Wear has a leg to stand on. Live prisoners who had been helped to survive were probably the best protection for their SS guards at that stage who knew the war was lost.
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Truth Vigilante says:@littlereddot
Little Red Bot writes (referencing me):
I have given up on reading his posts
C’mon man, who are you kidding ? We know that you go through my comments with a fine tooth comb, looking for something to nitpick.
You’re still seething with rage after the multiple humiliations I inflicted on you in other UR threads (eg: exposed Singapore for the sham two-tier society composed of automatons that it is – and the rest), and you now feel the compulsion to even the score.
Well, good luck with that – you’ll need it.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Malla
You say
Patrick McNally is flailing all around to somehow discredit the fact that Operation Barbarossa was a pre-Emptive Strike
To support your contrary view you need to show that Hitler’s Barbarossa would not have been launched when it was if Hitler had not feared an attack by the Red Army on German forces by the end if August at latest. Where’s your evidence? And how does it fit with all the evidence in Irvjng’s work inter alia that preparations for the supposed pre-Emptive Strike were ordered in 1940 and were also entirely consistent with Hitler’s long time dream of Lebensraum for an expanding population of Aryans?
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
My response: I have not researched the Bataan Death March enough to make an informed opinion. For now I will pass on making a comment.
I thought you were retired, and an “amateur historian”?
You can’t find, for example, the Wikipedia article on the Bataan Death March? Well, here it is:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bataan_Death_March
Now, what do you think? Was the Bataan Death March a death march, or was it not?
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Mark Bahner says:@Wizard of Oz
Live prisoners who had been helped to survive were probably the best protection for their SS guards at that stage who knew the war was lost.
Live prisoners who were walking too slowly were not helping the SS guards. That’s why the SS guards shot the live prisoners who were walking too slowly.
And the SS guards were actually trying to get the slave laborers from Auschwitz-Birkenau to other slave labor camps inside Germany, like Bergen Belsen, to keep the war effort going.
The SS guards had absolutely no care for whether the slaves survived, unless the slaves were strong enough to work in Germany to support the German war effort:
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@Wizard of Oz
why his purely speculative guesswork aboutgas chambers was more plausible than the speculation that one of the known stories about the reasons gor (sic) adopting gas to kill prisoners was true.
Easy. Niceland’s skepticism about gas chambers was not “speculative guesswork” but based on the words of the A-B camp head historian and on reason.
In contrast, your speculation about “one of the known stories about the reasons gor adopting gas to kill prisoners” is pure speculation.How do you justify “stipid” and how do you refute the speculation?
Easy. You can’t spell “stupid” and I don’t bother to refute speculation. I’d be at it 24/7 and I have my Rudolf Hess article to finish.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You ask: “You can’t find, for example, the Wikipedia article on the Bataan Death March? Well, here it is: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bataan_Death_March. Now, what do you think? Was the Bataan Death March a death march, or was it not?”
My response: Like many people on this discussion thread, I do not regard Wikipedia as an authoritative source of information. I would have to go to the SMU library here in Dallas and read some books on the subject before I could answer your question.
After all, if I trusted Wikipedia, I would believe that the Germans used homicidal gas chambers as part of a program of genocide against Jews which resulted in the deaths of between 5 to 6 million Jews during World War II.
I know this isn’t true. So, if I know Wikipedia has made major errors in regard to the so-called Holocaust, I do not trust them on other issues such as the Bataan Death March.
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Mark Bahner says:@HdC
If handwritten, no. If typed or typeset, and the Umlaut o with dots on top was not available, then oe was perfectly acceptable.
Yes, I agree with that. No one would handwrite anything but “Göring,” and no one would type anything but “Göring,” unless a typewriter with the Umlaut o was not available.
That’s why this document by Göring has the Umlaut o:
P.S. Just like I would never type my last name as “Bonner,” unless both the “a” and the “h” key on my keyboard were broken.
https://www.geni.com/people/Johann-Nicholas-Bahner/6000000031567440691
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Alexandros says:@Mark Bahner
What’s your point? Using USHMM as a source I’m fairly certain it’s a Jewish point. More complaining and demonization.
The Germans evacuated the camps on Hitlers orders for a variety of reasons. Preserve labor, protect the civilian population and potential hostages.
The strain was of course hard, like so many other things in the war. It is nevertheless notable that far less casualties happened on the German watch compared to when the allies did the same with millions of Germans in 1945. Estimates differ, but between 2 and 6 million Germans perished in these marches. And where the Jews often went with the Germans willingly, to escape the marauding Soviets, the Germans were generally forced from their ancestral homes.
So why exactly should anyone care about these particular Jews who had to walk a little bit? There is nothing special about it, and in many respects it was far more comfortable to sit out the war in a camp than it was to fight in it or have bombs dropped on you every day.
Especially rich coming from Jews who shy away from no evil if they can benefit from it.
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Alexandros says:@Patrick McNally
By the time Hitler met with Mannerheim it would have sounded stupid to tell him “I was expecting the whole thing would be over by September!” Instead, the conversation leads off with both Hitler and Mannerheim expressing their shock at how strong the Soviet forces really were.
That they are shocked implies they both thought it would be over by now, so in effect “I thought it would be over by September!” is more or less what Hitler is saying.
People love to use the partial “collapse like a house of cards” quote. In fact “the USSR is a house of cards” is what other people are saying, Hitler’s retort goes a little more like this:
“Yes, but we don’t know what the USSR will be in the future. We shouldn’t underestimate them.”
So in contrast to myth, Hitler is the one who is trying to dampen the hubris and warning people not to underestimate them.
The reason the Germans are not taking all the necessary precautions for a long war is that they can’t. They don’t have the resources. It’s Barbarossa or bust. The concerns are of course valid, but there is nothing they can do about it.
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Gabreal Jones says:
“Repeats a fabricated story alleging that Trotsky became a Mason in January 1917. Total rubbish.”
How do u know that it is fabricated ? Show me your sources…..and whether or not T. became a mason in 1917 or whatever year is irrelevant / masonry is a j. business* / Trotsky born Lev Bronstein in a rich j. family in Ukrain / got infected at his 16th with Marx / Karl M. – born Mordechai Levi – stems from a family of rabbis & wrote Das Kapital in the British Museum library / he was on the payroll of a 3rd cousin of him a RotSchild ( common info)
In the framework of this Unz Review article on WW II it is nice to know who financed Adolf
This silviewmedia article of a year ago throws more light on this / with a good documentary
https://topdocumentaryfilms.com/banking-with-hitler/ which gets blocked from the place where I am presently internetworking.If you prefer to live in the darkness – the rubbish of the talmud rabbis – on this important topic / ok / thats your business but don´t expect me to digest any of your vomit.
* and yes / read Linas Master of Deception http://www.whale.to/c/lina.pdf ( start with page 188 The United States Masonic Executive Base )
just 40.49…..
Kike Albert Pike 33rd degree mason / “previewer” of WW I + II & WW III & is the father of the KKK / the BLM dumbos (said to be) on the payroll of goulash Ashke/nazi Soros are not that emptyheaded after all when they took down Pike´s statue in Washington DC .
CIA O
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
I think it would be reasonable to say that a march to escape danger is an “escape” march. If many marchers expire due to extreme conditions, poor health, etc., the survivors could describe the exodus as a “death” march. And, historians and scholars, in hindsight, may categorize it that way as well.
The Trail of Tears was not an effort the kill Cherokees; it was an effort to remove them from one place and settle them elsewhere. Many died, nonetheless. The Cherokees most likely say it was their death march. The US government says it was a relocation effort.
Yes, the US had the means to transport them otherwise. Did the Germans also have the means to do so at that time?
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Mark Bahner says:@Tiptoethrutulips
I think it would be reasonable to say that a march to escape danger is an “escape” march.
Your logic is, to put it mildly, deeply flawed.
The march wasn’t to “escape danger” for the *slave laborers being marched*. The slave laborers were being marched to their deaths, and being killed all along the way. That’s exactly why it’s called a “death march” by any reasonable, rational, and unbiased person…which obviously doesn’t include many people here.
The Cherokees most likely say it was their death march. The US government says it was a relocation effort.
Any reasonable, rational, and unbiased person today would call the “Trail of Tears” a death march. Just like any reasonable, rational, and unbiased person today should call the Auschwitz-Birkenau relocation a death march.
It really boggles my mind how so many people here, seemingly deliberately, avoid reality, and equivocate in calling unquestionably evil acts for what they are…evil!
Let’s look at the Auschwitz Death March:
1) There were 60,000 people who had survived almost unimaginable suffering and brutality. I’ve read that the *average* life expectancy in Auschwitz-Birkenau (A-B) among registered prisoners was three months. And that’s *registered* prisoners…not the hundreds of thousands that were executed in gas chambers within hours of arriving at A-B.
2) These were for the most part civilians, who had committed absolutely no crime other than the “crime” of being Jewish.
3) They were forced out of A-B in the middle of January, a brutally cold time of the year in Auschwitz. At least in A-B they had the shelter of buildings…even if those buildings were ridiculously overcrowded.
4) The had *no* appropriate clothing for being outdoors in the middle of January.
5) As far as I can tell from my research, the makeup of the slaves on the Auschwitz death march were:
a) 60% *from Poland*, 20% from the *USSR*, and 20% from other countries in Europe
b) 70% were JewishThat means that basically, the worst place in the world for them to be forced to go was to Nazi Germany. Particularly to concentration camps in Nazi Germany such as Bergen-Belsen, where in fact many of the survivors ended up (only to die in Bergen-Belsen).
6) As has been pointed out already, anybody but a brain-dead Nazi maniac could have seen, at the end of January 1945, that Nazi Germany was going to lose the war.
7) They slave laborers were marched *at gunpoint* for days, with little food or water (it seems likely little provision was made for those things) and the slave laborers were shot if they fell behind or tried to escape. Then they went on trains (that obviously were not heated).
8) From the U.S. Holocaust Museum:
https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/death-marches-1
January 18, 1945
Death marches from the Auschwitz camp system begin
The SS begins evacuating Auschwitz and its satellite camps. Nearly 60,000 prisoners are forced on death marches from the Auschwitz camp system. Thousands are killed in the days before the death march. Tens of thousands of prisoners, mostly Jews, are forced to march to the city of Wodzislaw in the western part of Upper Silesia. SS guards shoot anyone who falls behind or cannot continue. More than 15,000 die during the death marches from Auschwitz. In Wodzislaw, the prisoners are put on unheated freight trains and deported to concentration camps in Germany, particularly to Flossenbürg, Sachsenhausen, Gross-Rosen, Buchenwald, Dachau, and Mauthausen. On January 27, 1945, the Soviet army enters Auschwitz and liberates the few remaining prisoners.
9) So if the Nazi guards/monsters had simply ran like the cowards they were, and left the prisoners for the Soviets to find, literally tens of thousands of prisoners’ lives might have been saved.
It just boggles my mind. How can *anyone* read that material and not say, “That was an evil thing done to those poor people. That was unquestionably a death march.”
???
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Absolutely no one suggests that no tragedies, atrocities or malice can be deduced from an analysis of WW2 and Hitler’s attempt to thwart jewish influence in Germany.
What you are doing is dissecting a general statement and over analyzing it to the nth degree with the objective of implying it means something it doesn’t.
I have never encountered a reasonable explanation for the myriad of obvious lies and exaggerations submitted by Jewry, such as the magical number 6,000,000. Ergo:
“Heddesheimer cogently documents the slew of previous attempts by Jews to disseminate deceitful and untrue atrocity propaganda before, during and after World War I. The First Holocaust features an amazing collection of press clippings and propaganda articles dating back to the late 19th century that make claims of the suffering and imminent extermination of European Jewry. Among such articles we find that Jews have, dozens of times before WWII, invoked the cabalisitc “6,000,000″ number as the amount of Jews on the verge of death and destruction during various periods of turmoil and conflict in Europe and Russia.”
How about eyewitness testimony of Jews, who claim that as soon as they believed the victims in a gas chamber were dead, they hauled them out with hooks, and no other protective gear was used or needed. Do you know the protocol for entering a garage or room that may be filled with carbon monoxide? Or noxious chemicals? You can’t just go mucking about amongst the toxins.
The claims of millions slaughtered, whether by gas, ripping to pieces (this is what Germans did to Jewish infants and toddlers), fire pits that burn in swampland (have you ever built a small fire?), orchestras and theaters in DEATH camps, hospitals in DEATH/EXTERMINATION camps, incinerators that defy the laws of combustion and zap people to dust in a few minutes (how else could you roast millions in a short time frame?)….the list is endless.
These proven falsehoods don’t seem to deter Holocaust proponents in any measurable fashion from insisting everything indeed happened just as they say it did. At least not that I have seen.
I will also mention the testimony of one Herman Rosenblat, who claimed his future wife threw apples over the fence to him in a camp. When the story turned out to be false, he said it happened in his imagination, therefore HE DID NOT TELL A LIE.
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Mefobills says:@Patrick McNally
You are doing it again.
The composition of a military is a purposeful thing, and describes intent much more than mere words.
A state has intent by what kind of military it fields.
Here is Hitler again, which you hand wave away:
Our weapons naturally were made for the West, and we all thought, and this was true’till that time, uh, it was the opinion from the earliest times; you cannot wage war in winter.
It’s much more likely that Stalin figured Hitler would strike West, as that is how the Whermacht was configured. At the moment of weakness, then Stalin’s offensive army would then invade Germany. (As Germany was occupied fighting the Western democracies.) The Germany army was not configured for sea power, and hence Britain was never a target.
So, you have concocted this Lebensraum argument, when it is ridiculous to invade with an army not configured for cold weather, has no long range bombers, and no prepositioned supplies.
Also, Hitler was very concerned about Stalin over-running oil supplies sourced from Romania, as Germany was oil insecure.
So, your basic view was that Hitler was crazy, wanted Lebensraum, and invaded to the East to achieve his fever dreams. Then when he failed, he lied to cover up his insecurities.
Never could it occur to you that he might have been highly intelligent, was not some sort of maniac intent on world conquest, and only wanted to protect the German people, much as Putin is doing now for Russian speakers.
If I were Hitler, I also would have created a buffer in the East.
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Patrick McNally says:@Malla
> Chamberlain’s government nearly went to war with the USSR over Stalin’s brutal invasion of Finland during the winter of 1939.
Churchill was fully on board with that policy of Chamberlain. From January 20, 1940:
—–
Only Finland-superb, nay, sublime-in the jaws of peril-Finland shows what free men can do. The service rendered by Finland to mankind is magnificent. They have exposed, for all the world to see, the military incapacity of the Red Army and of the Red Air Force. Many illusions about Soviet Russia have been dispelled in these few fierce weeks of fighting in the Arctic Circle. Everyone can see how Communism rots the soul of a nation; how it makes it abject and hungry in peace, and proves it base and abominable in war. We cannot tell what the fate of Finland may be, but no more mournful spectacle could be presented to what is left to civilized mankind than that this splendid Northern race should be at last worn down and reduced to servitude worse than death by the dull brutish force of overwhelming numbers. If the light of freedom which still burns so brightly in the frozen North should be finally quenched, it might well herald a return to the Dark Ages, when every vestige of human progress during two thousand years would be engulfed.
—–For further background, see David Carlton, Churchill and the Soviet Union.
Of course, it’s true that both Churchill and Chamberlain after September 3, 1939, gave emphasis to the task of defeating Germany. Most people did not expect the USSR to be a stable long-term superpower and mainly Germany as the rising power on the continent. All of the talk about either aiding the Finns or attacking the oilfields in Baku was filtered this framework. But Churchill was easily won over to both of these policies. Again, see Carlton for more details.
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Patrick McNally says:@Bankotsu
> solidly resistant
This is just going to evolve into an argument over what those last 2 words mean. If we are going to define them to mean that Chamberlain refused to acknowledge that Germany might have any legitimate gripe over the status of Danzig after the Versailles Treaty, then in that sense he was not “solidly resistant.” But if we mean that he never contemplated allowing Hitler’s military conquest of Poland to stand unchallenged, well, by those standards, he was solidly resistant. Many voices in Britain, including John Maynard Keynes, had complained about the terms of the Versailles Treaty long before Hitler came to power. It’s not shocking that Chamberlain could allow that renegotiations could be made over Danzig. But a military conquest of Poland was allowed for by Chamberlain. In practice, this policy determined the war from September 3, 1939 onward.
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Patrick McNally says:@Gabreal Jones
> Trotsky born Lev Bronstein was raised with the talmud
There’s no evidence of that either. On the contrary, it’s impossible for any objective analyst to avoid the sense that Trotsky would have fared much better in his eventual rivalry with Stalin if he had been better trained in the Talmud. Trotsky easily fell into bitter conflicts with people like Zinoviev who, in theory, if we accept a Talmudic interpretation of events, should have been his natural political allies against Stalin. Trotsky was able to form an alliance with the Russian Ivan Smirnov which lasted from 1923-9 when Smirnov recanted to Stalin. But Zinoviev defaulted much more quickly on the short 1926-7 alliance which he had made with Trotsky against Stalin. There is certainly no evidence of Trotsky ever having stable alliances with other Jewish members of the party.
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Pierre de Craon says:@Patrick McNally
The predominant role of Jews in the Bolshevik coup d’état and the murderous regime formed in its wake—a role grossly out of proportion to their numbers in Russia but fully consonant with their numbers in anti-Christian and antinationalist movements throughout the West for the past fifteen hundred years—is documented in this 1994 CODOH article by Mark Weber.
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Patrick McNally says:@Alexandros
> That they are shocked implies they both thought it would be over by now,
I will refer again to David Irving’s point that, in February 1941:
—–
Keitel’s economics expert General Thomas noted after meeting Göring on February 26: “He shares the Führer’s opinion that when German troops march into Russia the entire Bolshevik state will collapse, and that for this reason we need not fear the destruction of the stores and railway system on a large scale, as I do. The main thing is to get rid of the Bolshevik leaders rapidly first of all.” Göring’s anxiety was the weakness of the German supply lines… Hitler was already thinking beyond the end of ‘Barbarossa.’ On the seventeenth, Jodl instructed his staff that the Führer wished them to study the problems of assembling troops in Afghanistan for an assault on India.
—–
— David Irving, Hitler’s War, p. 206.Hitler’s expectation that Germany in February 1941 could go ahead and start making plans for invading Afghanistan and India is simply one of many pieces of evidence showing that he expected Barbarossa to be over within a few months. It was General Thomas who was more wary of the possibility that scorched earth warfare (“the destruction of the stores and railway system on a large scale”) might pose a serious problem.
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Patrick McNally says:@Gabreal Jones
For example, Trotsky’s demands that Freemasons should be expelled from the Comintern, and especially from the French Communist Party, are well known:
https://www.marxists.org/archive/trotsky/1922/12/freemasonry.htm
—–
Freemasonry on the whole represents one of the forms of political servility of the petit bourgeoisie before the big bourgeoisie. The masonic affiliation of “communists” is nothing but the spiritual servility of individual pseudo-revolutionaries before the petty bourgeoisie, and consequently before the big bourgeoisie.
—–https://www.neliti.com/publications/332115/approaches-to-leon-trotskys-anti-masonry
—–
This paper analyzes his role and position with respect to the resolution of the Fourth Congress of the Communist International that decided to prohibit French communist leaders from belonging to the obedience of Freemasonry… León Trotsky’s position is integrated into the anti-freemasonry of the workers that was built since the beginning of the rise of socialist, anarchist and union organizations in the 19th century in countries such as England, Germany and France that were also territories of strong masonic activity for more than a century. This anti-freemasonry was less studied by academics than the religious-style anti-freemasonry that monopolized the research. Therefore, they should not be confused. This paper presents some notes that contextualize the differences between both anti-freemasonry through the 1922 Moscow resolution on the incompatibility between being a communist leader and a freemason.
—–It was Kerensky who joined a Freemasonic group in 1912. This was compatible with the idea of two-stage revolution which maintained that Russia should first go through a bourgeois revolution (which Freemasons in general can be expected to support) and only at a much later stage of history will a revolution against the bourgeoisie occur. For Trotsky, the goal was to swiftly carry things from one stage of revolution in Russia to the next. Freemasons were not compatible with this.
What generates a lot of confusion among anyone who samples the old White propaganda is that the Whites drew an unbroken line from any type of liberalism to all variants of Leftism which existed in Russia. From the White perspective, a Freemason and Social Revolutionary like Kerensky was indistinguishable from Lenin or Trotsky. Hence, stories about Trotsky as a Freemason easily proliferated in White circles even when it was clear that he was insisting that Freemasons be expelled from the French Communist Party and related organizations.
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Patrick McNally says:@Mefobills
“Our weapons naturally were made for the West, and we all thought, and this was true ’til that time, uh, it was the opinion from the earliest times: you cannot wage war in winter.”
Totally compatible with what I’ve said: Hitler expected Barbarossa to largely succeed before October. The only caveat which should made here is that it makes more sense to look at Hitler’s words before and during the early stages of Barbarossa. This conversation with Mannerheim was occurring at a time when it would obviously have sounded foolish to say that one expected a brief campaign with Barbarossa. So, Hitler is kind of muddling things as he goes along. But his earliest statements are much clearer about expecting a rapid victory over the USSR. This statement which you’ve quoted does not contradict that.
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soll says:@Mefobills
So, you have concocted this Lebensraum argument, when it is ridiculous to invade with an army not configured for cold weather, has no long range bombers, and no prepositioned supplies.
Your whole argument presupposes that Hitler expected the war to be long-lasting. Hence, no Winter wares. Your reading history backwards. Its a logical fallacy.
So, your basic view was that Hitler was crazy, wanted Lebensraum, and invaded to the East to achieve his fever dreams. Then when he failed, he lied to cover up his insecurities.
Never could it occur to you that he might have been highly intelligent, was not some sort of maniac intent on world conquest, and only wanted to protect the German people…
Works by Adam Tooze and Gotz Aly answers to such appeals. How do you allegedly “protect the German people”? You have this void by not being familiar with the backwards economy of the Third Reich. As stuck only on pro-Hitler sites.
https://archive.org/details/adam-tooze-the-wages-of-destruction-audio
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Patrick McNally says:@Pierre de Craon
Weber shows that he has not evaluated sources with any seriousness in that piece. Just a few things to note.
—–
To direct the takeover, a seven-man “Political Bureau” was chosen. It consisted of two Russians (Lenin and Bubnov), one Georgian (Stalin), and four Jews (Trotsky, Sokolnikov, Zinoviev, and Kamenev).
—–In actuality what occurred was that the politburo was formed, and Zinoviev and Kamenev led the opposition against Lenin and Trotsky. The former pair argued that it would be a wrong move for the Bolsheviks to attempt to overthrow the Provisional Government. The latter maintained that the time to seize power was now. The other 4 members of this would-be politburo were cool to the idea, though not as vociferously opposed as Zinoviev and Kamenev. As a result, Lenin and Trotsky simply bypassed and ignored this politburo, while Zinoviev and Kamenev were kicked out of the Central Committee. The politburo in question never met after its first meeting, played no role in events, and never held any power.
> Meanwhile, the Petersburg (Petrograd) Soviet – whose chairman was Trotsky – established an 18-member “Military Revolutionary Committee” to actually carry out the seizure of power. It included eight (or nine) Russians, one Ukrainian, one Pole, one Caucasian, and six Jews.
Well, as the first most obvious error, the Military Revolutionary Committee had 24 members, not 18. For an online photo of its membership see:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petrograd_Military_Revolutionary_Committee
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Mark Bahner says:@Patrick McNally
Only Finland-superb, nay, sublime-in the jaws of peril-Finland shows what free men can do. The service rendered by Finland to mankind is magnificent. They have exposed, for all the world to see, the military incapacity of the Red Army and of the Red Air Force. Many illusions about Soviet Russia have been dispelled in these few fierce weeks of fighting in the Arctic Circle. Everyone can see how Communism rots the soul of a nation; how it makes it abject and hungry in peace, and proves it base and abominable in war. …
My compliments to his speech writer.
P.S. Of course, I’m sure Churchill wrote them on the backs of envelopes, like Honest Abe. ;_)
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John Wear says:@soll
You write to Mefobills: “Works by Adam Tooze and Gotz Aly answers to such appeals. How do you allegedly “protect the German people”? You have this void by not being familiar with the backwards economy of the Third Reich. As stuck only on pro-Hitler sites.”
My response: We revisionists are familiar with the work of Adam Tooze and his book “Wages of Destruction”. For example, Ezra McVie writes about this book:
“This work is magisterial. The author, a British national born in 1967, was raised both in England and in Heidelberg. While his degrees in economics and history come from British institutions, he also studied for two years at the Free University of Berlin, and is obviously fully bilingual. His book is sold both in its original English and in German translation in Germany. While the German version was written by a professional translator, it contains in its front matter the legend (in German), “This translation has been thoroughly reviewed by the author,” a valuable reassurance to have for a work of such technical nuance where the author speaks the target language. The sources cited in the footnotes appear to be about evenly divided between English-language ones and German-language.” (Source: https://www.inconvenienthistory.com/3/3/3156).
I cite “Wages of Destruction” in an article I wrote about the German atomic bomb program at https://inconvenienthistory.com/11/3/6861. I wrote in this article:
British historian and economist Adam Tooze states in regard to the German atomic-bomb program:
“After months of organizational argument, in the summer of 1942 the physicists made a major presentation to an audience including Albert Speer. All present were impressed with the extraordinary potential of the scheme, but, when pressed, Werner Heisenberg and his colleagues confirmed [Gen.] Fromm’s view that an atomic bomb was a long-term proposition. The project would come to fruition in two or three years’ time at the earliest and would require a huge investment. Given Germany’s situation in 1941 that made it an irrelevance. What the leadership of the Third Reich was looking for was a decisive success on the Eastern Front in the coming summer.” (Source: Tooze, Adam, The Wages of Destruction: The Making and Breaking of the Nazi Economy, New York: Penguin Books, 2006, p. 510).
Your video in comment #1084 emphasizes Hitler’s drive to rebuild the German military.
Hitler wanted to rebuild the German military because the Versailles Treaty had forced Germany to disarm almost completely. The treaty abolished the general draft, prohibited all artillery and tanks, allowed a volunteer army of only 100,000 troops and officers, and abolished the air force. The navy was reduced to six capital ships, six light cruisers, 12 destroyers, 12 torpedo-boats, 15,000 men and 500 officers. After the delivery of its remaining navy, Germany had to hand over its merchant ships to the Allies with only a few exceptions. All German rivers had to be internationalized and overseas cables ceded to the victors. An international military committee oversaw the process of disarmament until 1927. (Source: Franz-Willing, “The Origins of the Second World War,” The Journal of Historical Review, Vol. 7, No. 1, Spring 1986, p. 103).
In my opinion, Hitler’ determination to rebuild the German military was entirely justified. No national leader such as Hitler would want to have his nation be so militarily weakened forever.
What you and your video do not mention is the extreme military buildup of the Soviet Union. For a thorough documentation of this Soviet military buildup, I recommend that you read the book “The Chief Culprit” by Viktor Suvorov. It is a very convincing book.
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
I would have to go to the SMU library here in Dallas and read some books on the subject before I could answer your question.
Geez, “John”! You really are a fossil. Libraries are so last century for research! (No offense. I’m a bit of a fossil myself…but I do like to try to keep up with this new fad the kids are calling, “World…Wide…Web.”)
Here is more information than you probably could get in an hour at a university library. (In fact, the first link is actually from the Ohio State University Library.) And I got it in about 5 minutes…probably less time than it would take you even to get to the library.
https://origins.osu.edu/milestones/april-2017-bataan-death-march?language_content_entity=en
https://www.britannica.com/event/Bataan-Death-March
https://www.britannica.com/summary/Bataan-Death-March
After all, if I trusted Wikipedia, I would believe that the Germans used homicidal gas chambers as part of a program of genocide against Jews which resulted in the deaths of between 5 to 6 million Jews during World War II.
So you wouldn’t be so shockingly ignorant and unmoored from reality as you are now. I think that’s good, not bad!
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Truth Vigilante says:@Carolyn Yeager
You’re unable to say, like a man, I was mistaken, I was wrong — learn a lesson and move on from there.
Indeed, I’m not half the man you are Carolyn.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
WHAT is wrong with you?
People pop off around here all the time, but it’s usually a mutual endeavor, and often deserved. I haven’t read everything that Mr. Wear asserts on these threads, but I don’t see snarky and outlandish arguments meant primarily to stir things up. You insult his intelligence and scholarship, and now you mock a propensity to conduct research before wading off into a fray.
For the sake of brevity, I previously did not mention the other tactic you use to push the official Holocaust narrative. I observe repeated obfuscations, muddying of waters and appeals to emotion.
You throw around specific numbers, percentages and calculations that just can’t be precisely determined, which is fine in some settings, but often you are doing it to avoid coming to conclusions.Then, of course, you cry “How can you deny the suffering of all these people? How can you defend a single position that does not portray Hitler as The Evil Incarnate? Did you see the mile high pile of baby shoes? The shoes of the babies thrown into raging infernos in bogs…”
Since you are so adept at determining the quickest and most efficient way of doing things, just how long does it take to gas, haul and incinerate a million corpses? How long did it take to use those hooks and fling bodies up into the Jewish bakery?
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “So you wouldn’t be so shockingly ignorant and unmoored from reality as you are now. I think that’s good, not bad!”
My response: You wrote to Ron Unz in comment #944, “So again, of course you don’t want to argue about the Holocaust with me. It simply shows how inexcusably ignorant you are (in this age of the Internet), and how divorced you are from reality.”
In comment #945, we began discussing the so-called Holocaust. I wanted to show you that Ron Unz was not “inexcusably ignorant” and divorced from reality.
I wrote in comment #945: “There were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau. If you have an interest, you can read my articles on this subject at https://www.inconvenienthistory.com/9/4/5160 and https://www.inconvenienthistory.com/12/1/7200.”
Have you taken the time yet to read these two articles? They explain why I think there were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau. Without homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau, the official Holocaust story falls apart.
So, after reading my two articles, do you still think there were homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau? If you think there were homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau, where do you think I made mistakes in my two articles?
I have studied the “Holocaust” off and on for over 30 years. This is the topic we are supposed to be discussing. I have read numerous books written by Holocaust revisionists.
I have also read more than 70 books supporting the official Holocaust story. These include every book ever written by Raul Hilberg, four of Deborah Lipstadt’s books, and books written by Gerald Fleming, Lucy Dawidowicz, Gerald Reitlinger, Robert Jay Lifton, Leny Yahil, Arno Mayer, Pierre Vidal-Naquet, Martin Gilbert, Yehuda Bauer, Elie Weisel, Primo Levi, Michael Berenbaum, Michael Shermer, Jean-Claude Pressac, Robert Jan van Pelt, Dr. Franciszek Piper (whose book I bought when I was at the Auschwitz main camp in October 1996), Daniel Jonah Goldhagen, Tom Bower, Hannah Arendt, Michael Marrus, Tom Segev, Yoram Sheftel, Simon Wiesenthal, Sol Rosenberg, Peter Longerich, Nikolaus Wachsmann, Thomas Buergenthal, David Cesarani, Yitzak Arad, and Christopher Browning.
Thus, I have read many traditional and revisionist books about the so-called Holocaust over a long period of time. Why do you think I am “shockingly ignorant and unmoored from reality” on this subject?
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Kali says:@Wizard of Oz
Dear Wiz,
You say to the Yeager woman:
“Your deficiencies of intellect which even Holocaust denier Ron can’t restrain himself from noticing are so obvious…”Dude, even I can admit that that is utter BS! She may be an insufferable troll, but her interlectual abilities are beyond doubt.
I know it’s hard for you, but at least try to give credit where it’s due.
Plus, unlike yours, her trolling is entertaining, and often educational.
Regards,
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littlereddot says:@Mark Bahner
UR is an English language website. The vast majority of people who use this website do not have their keyboards configured for German letter inputs nor any letter not present in the standard English keyboards.
Anybody using UR will naturally modify non-English languages to suit the audience here. Why would any expect someone writing about a Danish person to use the O with the / through it? Or writing a Russian name in Cyrillic? Or writing a Chinese name in Chinese characters?
Everybody understands what he means, and that is what counts.
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@Kali
She may be an insufferable troll, but her interlectual (sic) abilities are beyond doubt.
Do you know what the slang word “troll” means?
From Wikipedia: In slang, a troll is a person who posts or makes inflammatory, insincere, digressive,[1] extraneous, or off-topic messages online (such as in social media, a newsgroup, a forum, a chat room, an online video game) or in real life, with the intent of provoking others into displaying emotional responses,[2] or manipulating others’ perception, thus acting as a bully or a provocateur. The behavior is typically for the troll’s amusement, or to achieve a specific result such as disrupting a rival’s online activities or purposefully causing confusion or harm to other people. (my italics)
From How-to Geek.com: An internet troll is someone who makes intentionally inflammatory, rude, or upsetting statements online to elicit strong emotional responses in people or to steer the conversation off-topic. https://www.howtogeek.com
From Urban Dictionary: An Internet troll, or simply troll in Internet slang, is someone who posts controversial, inflammatory, irrelevant or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum or chat room, with the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response or to generally disrupt normal on-topic discussion.
From Merriam Webster: 2a: to antagonize (others) online by deliberately posting inflammatory, irrelevant, or offensive comments or other disruptive content.
I think you would be hard-pressed to find any specific examples of trolling from “that Yeager woman.” Why don’t you try? You’re confusing replies you don’t like, usually bc it is a superior argument/facts to your own, or it contains truth unflattering to you and/or your “pets” who you imagine you are protecting, with purposeful obstruction. I do not obstruct and I do not inflame. As someone famously said (Harry Truman?) of his political opponents (paraphrased): “I didn’t give them hell. I just told the truth, and it felt like hell.”
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Wizard of Oz says:@Mark Bahner
I had forgotten a out the shooting of those who couldn’t keep going but I doubt that it occurred to any guard that he was more likely to suffer retribution if he did kill someone in those circumstances. The fact that Anne Frank and her mother were left behind rather than killed seems consistent with the view that SS guards no longer saw merit in murder although willing to force fit prisoners to go elsewhere to work.
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Truth Vigilante says:
Little Red Bot writes:
Or writing a Russian name in Cyrillic? Or writing a Chinese name in Chinese characters?
Red Bot uses a poor analogy here – another case of false conflation, as Red Bot is known to employ.
No one is implying that Chinese, Russian or any other names/words that use symbols FOREIGN to English language speakers, should be employed.
But if someone is unable to write Göring with the keyboard they possess, why not write Goring instead? (Other than for the two dots, it’s absolutely the correct spelling).
By way of example, whilst English speakers call Rome the capital of Italy, for the sake of accuracy we should henceforth call it Roma, just like the Italians do.
We should do that because WE’RE STILL USING ENGLISH/LATIN CHARACTERS – just as we are in the case of writing GORING, instead of sticking an ‘e’ in there and thus using a spelling that the Reichsmarschall (or ANY other German), would never have used.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
@Truth Vigilante
Well, that little comeback is a diversionary tactic used in place of admitting that your completely ignorant comments about the German language can no longer stand. And it reflects even worse on John Wear that he continued to agree with you, and now pushes his little “LOL” button after he claimed he would no longer “engage in discussion” with me . What sneaky cowards!
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Wizard of Oz says:@Carolyn Yeager
You remind me of a bright, combative but eneducated and fundamentally undisciplined.
What possessed you to make the utterly trivial and actually quite stupid remark “you can’t [sic] spell stupid”? Do you think anyone on UR threads doesn’t know that it is not spelled “stipid”? (I have apologised for my typos in the past though they are a result of my slight degree of macular degeneration.)
Then, with equal clumsiness, you say that you “don’t bother to refute speculation”. But of course you do, unless you abjure all attempts to refute unproven theories, many if which can be described very accurately as speculative.
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littlereddot says:@Truth Vigilante
No one is implying that Chinese, Russian or any other names/words that use symbols FOREIGN to English language speakers, should be employed.
But if someone is unable to write Göring with the keyboard they possess, why not write Goring instead? (Other than for the two dots, it’s absolutely the correct spelling).
Why should someone writing in English in and English website use the German alphabet?
Unless of course you think that English alphabet = German alphabet?
Does the English alphabet contain the Umlaut?
Does the German alphabet contain the Umlaut?
Is the English alphabet = German alphabet?Why are you so confused?
WE’RE STILL USING ENGLISH/LATIN CHARACTERS
You obviously think that the English alphabet = Latin Alphabet
There is a difference between the English and Latin alphabet. If you are in doubt of this, look for J and W in the Latin alphabet.
Why are you so confused?
Your copious utterances flow from your mouth without being moderated by your brain.
Mark Twain said that “it is better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt”.
There is no person more in need of Twain’s wisdom than you.we should henceforth call it Roma, just like the Italians do.
That is downright pedantic.Besides, I am still waiting for your admission that Socialism has brought economic benefits, are you man enough to admit it now?:
History:
Untruthful Vigilante challenged:
#176
…name a single country that adopted Socialism and increased its prosperity thereafter.I replied:
#184
China 1949 GDP Per Capita $200 (in 1990 USD) When China became Socialist
China 1978 GDP Per Capita $700 (in 1990 USD) This was just before Deng’s reformsUntruthful Vigilante refuses to acknowledge this proof, instead deflects:
#196
…..is anything to crow about.Untrutful Vigilante continues to refuse to acknowledge the proof, and obfuscates:
#206
Let me answer it that question with another analogy….Untrutful Vigilante become disingenuous instead:
#213
And you are yet demonstrate a single country that had improved prosperity after adopting Socialism.
Why are you obfuscating ?and now deny that GDP is an indicator of prosperity…..wtf?
#214
let me enlighten you a little about GDP and whether or not its actually related to prosperity.while earlier Untrutful Vigilante himself used GDP as an indicator of prosperity
#176
Since embarking on the Socialist experiment around the 1960’s, it has slid well down the list in terms of per capita GDP and, recognising the failure of Socialism, successive Swedish governments have unwound many of the policies in recent decades that have been bleeding the country dry.Despite my pleas for him to be truthful, Untrutful Vigilante refuses to answer honestly, and deflects by:
#223
Oh dear, it’s come down to moral fibre now.Untrutful Vigilante then slinks away, fuming and plotting his revenge.
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Mark Bahner says:
Have you taken the time yet to read these two articles? They explain why I think there were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau. Without homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau, the official Holocaust story falls apart.
Hi John,
I apologize for the snarky character of many of my comments to you. I should have realized earlier that you seem to be a genuinely sincere, honest, and decent fellow. Part of what drove me to it is my anger that the untruths you are telling–I don’t say lies, because I’m now fairly convinced that you actually believe them–are just such an abomination. You’re denying the cold-blooded murders and suffering of millions of people. To deny those murders, to me, is just like Alex Jones denying the murders of those poor children at Sandy Hook Elementary school. In fact, it’s probably even worse than that, because “only” 20 children were murdered at Sandy Hook Elementary, and the number of children murdered at Auschwitz (with Zyklon-B) is almost certainly more than 1000 times more. (I’m still looking at the likely number of children gassed to death at Auschwitz-Birkenau.)
Before I address your two articles, a bit about myself. I’m a retired environmental engineer. I have a Bachelor’s degree in Mechanical Engineering, and a Master’s Degree in Environmental Engineering, both from Virginia Tech (go Hokies! ;)). I spent approximately 30 years doing environmental research, mostly related to air pollution. My father’s side of the family is German (hence my last name). In fact, my first relative from Germany fought with George Washington in the Revolutionary War, right after Washington famously crossed the Delaware. And by fought “with” George Washington, I mean it in the sense of “Those boys are always fighting with each other!” My first relative in the U.S. was a Hessian soldier, fighting with the British. (He was captured as a POW in the Battle of Trenton, and eventually deserted and went to live in Pennsylvania.) Also, I *lived* in Germany, growing up…in Frankfurt, Augsburg, and Wiesbaden. (My father was a principal of military dependent schools.) So I have more than a little interest in Germany.
Finally, I’m a Libertarian. (Not a Republican or Democrat.) I think that human liberty is tremendously important, and government is best limited to preventing people from committing violence against each other (e.g. murder, rape, robbery, etc.) and fraud (e.g., fraudulently taking money, forging checks and signatures, etc.). In that regard, I consider both National Socialism and Communism to be unquestionably evil. Therefore, lies that promote either one–and I think it’s only lies that could be used to promote either one–are unquestionably evil.
Well, I’ve used a lot of space with my background, so I don’t have much time with your articles. I’ll try to be diplomatic, but:
1) Fred Leuchter is a liar and a fraud. Considering his age, he will probably never learn how to do a decent scientific analysis if he spent the rest of his life trying to learn.
2) He passed himself off as an “engineer.”
https://codoh.com/library/document/the-leuchter-report-the-how-and-the-why/en/
That is a f*cking lie. He never even spent a single day studying engineering, let alone obtaining a degree, or even spending any time doing anything that could qualify as engineering. As a person with multiple engineering degrees and an entire career spent as a practicing engineer, it is particularly infuriating to me when people pass themselves off as engineers who obviously know nothing about engineering.
3) He claimed to be an execution expert, but all he apparently ever did was *witness* gas chamber executions. Any expertise he had was apparently more related to *electrocutions*. (Correct me if I’m wrong…that’s what I think I read.)
4) He knows absolutely nothing about environmental sampling, and he lied to the laboratory who did the analysis of his samples, so their laboratory techniques rendered all his results meaningless.
5) I’ll try to dig up a detailed rebuttal of Fred Leuchter’s so-called analysis…but if I don’t find it, I’ll return to a detailed rebuttal of that so-called analysis.
There is simply no doubt in my mind that mass executions with Zyklon-B were performed at Auschwitz-Birkenau, resulting in many hundreds of thousands of deaths…including several tens of thousands of children (possibly even 100,000 or more).
But I hope you can agree with me that if even one child was murdered at Auschwitz-Birkenau by poison gas, bullet, or any other means, it would unquestionably be wrong.
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littlereddot says:@Truth Vigilante
No one is implying that Chinese, Russian or any other names/words that use symbols FOREIGN to English language speakers, should be employed.
But if someone is unable to write Göring with the keyboard they possess, why not write Goring instead? (Other than for the two dots, it’s absolutely the correct spelling).
Because by the fact that many other people already do, and so it is already accepted. It is a matter of communication of an idea, which is the essential purpose of language.
Conversely, what is the point of writing an exact spelling of a word when nobody else recognises it?
If you refer to the Austrian capital as Wien, how many of your audience will understand it? And those who do, will not consider you clever or knowledgeable. They will consider you pedantic, and over eager to show off your knowledge of minutiae. Rather than impressing your audience, you will achieve the unintended opposite effect of turning off your audience.
WE’RE STILL USING ENGLISH/LATIN CHARACTERS
No we are not. We are using the English alphabet. It is not the same as Latin. If in doubt, look for the J and W in the Latin alphabet.
Alphabets are particular to the languages being used.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Wizard of Oz
“aunt” was meant to end the first sentence.
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Rurik says:@littlereddot
blah, blah, blah..
Your copious utterances flow…
blah, blah, blah..
They will consider you pedantic,
irony alert
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Wizard of Oz says:@Mark Bahner
Thank you for all of that but particularly for that rare courtesy on UR of not using the word lie and its cognates lightly.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “There is simply no doubt in my mind that mass executions with Zyklon-B were performed at Auschwitz-Birkenau, resulting in many hundreds of thousands of deaths…including several tens of thousands of children (possibly even 100,000 or more).”
My response: There were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau. In addition to my two articles at https://inconvenienthistory.com/9/4/5160 and https://inconvenienthistory.com/12/1/7200, I recommend that you read Germar Rudolf’s books “The Chemistry of Auschwitz” and “The Leuchter Reports: Critical Edition.”
You certainly have the technical expertise to study this subject. If you don’t like Fred Leuchter, I recommend that you read Germar Rudolf instead.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
An article at http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v12/v12p421_Weber.html explains Fred Leuchter’s background and his qualifications to write The Leuchter Report.
It should be noted that other scientists have agreed with Fred Leuchter’s conclusion that there were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau and other German camps. Leuchter was merely the first person to publish a report on this subject.
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@Carolyn Yeager
As promised, I posted the article denying Hitler’s knowledge of the Hess flight to Scotland on May 10, 1941 today. It is here:
https://carolynyeager.net/hess-peace-mission-scotland-debate-f%C3%BChrer-did-not-know
So, from June 15th to June 24th, that is 9 days. Not a long wait. Not like David Irving makes you wait — more like 9 years!! Lol.
I do urge anyone who wants to discuss this in a knowledgeable fashion to at least read it. Commenting will take place at cy.net. Thanks all.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Wizard of Oz
I understand what you are saying, and yes, it’s usually easy to distinguish blatant lies from misconceptions or misunderstandings, especially among people actually seeking the truth.
The Holocaust is complex and difficult to comprehend, especially for those far removed from it. Despite the tragedies, people who question the official narrative are not doing so because they have no empathy or care for those who perished. Every student or casual reader of history understands that the greater group often suffers for the machinations of their leaders. Sometimes their leaders had good intentions, sometimes not.
However, the story of Mr. Herman Rosenblat is quite significant, in that his wife, who did not share in his imaginings, confessed that she went along with his false story because he had suffered enough. And therein lies the explanation for the numerous falsehoods and exaggerations, and the extreme vilification of Hitler and Germany. In my humble opinion.
I also find it a bit ironic that the two major Jewish holidays, Purim and Passover, are essentially celebrations of the slaughter of their adversaries, some of whom were innocent children, as well.
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Pierre de Craon says:@Patrick McNally
Weber shows that he has not evaluated sources with any seriousness in that piece.
In other words, he is less inclined than you are to claim that the Jews are perpetually guiltless.
As for the “error” regarding the Military Revolutionary Committee, since when is (((Wikipedia))) a reliable source for things other than World Series and Super Bowl scores?
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
My response: There were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
Of course there were, John. The evidence that many hundreds of thousands of people were gassed to death at Auschwitz-Birkenau (A-B) is so overwhelming, it would take a book just to list the evidence, let alone describe it.
Here are the results of my preliminary research on the homicidal gas chambers at A-B:
1) Crematorium I: First gas chamber built. Located in the main camp. Operated March 1942 – June 1942. A few thousand people murdered.
2) Bunker 1: Provisional gas chamber outside main camp. Operated March to June 1942. A few thousand people murdered.
3) Bunker 2: Another provisional gas chamber outside main camp. Operated June to December 1942. A few thousand people murdered.
4) Crematorium II, III, IV, V: At Birkenau. I think II and III were closest to the railroad tracks. *Approximately* a million people were murdered in all four gas chambers, combined. Operated March 1943 and blown up by the Nazis in November 1944, to hide the evidence of the crimes against humanity committed inside them.
Here’s a picture of A-B. The four “Gaskammern” (gas chambers) are Crematorium II, III, IV, and V, and are in Auschwitz II (Birkenau) near the railroad tracks, at the top right of the layout.
Here’s more information on the homicidal gas chambers:https://www.auschwitz.org/en/history/auschwitz-and-shoah/gas-chambers/
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Gabreal Jones says:@Patrick McNally
OK / you show me some sources, nevertheless I wrote in reaction to you : “whether or not T. became a mason in 1917 or whatever year is irrelevant / masonry is a j. business*
You write in “1079” There is certainly no evidence of Trotsky ever having stable alliances with other Jewish members of the party…” I did not know that one yet / interesting
https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/arts-letters/articles/trotsky-the-jew ´There is no question that genetically speaking, Trotsky was a Jew. But personally and culturally, he emphatically denied any connection with the Jewish people.´
In a vid this popped out : insisted to be called an “internationalist” in an atricle of the NYT /
Stalin was after him https://www.marxists.org/archive/trotsky/1940/05/assatt.html
´Trotsky Letter Exposes Stalin Role in Recent Assassination Attempt´ End of story a Stalin agent finished the job with the ice pick in Mexico ( I will get you j. / a thoughtcloud above Joseph S. head)The ice pick started the Cold War after 45 ? The academics – academic deformed ?- are still heavily divided on this one….
The toppling of the statue of Pike in Washington DC / I actually never saw on vid /I don´t watch tv or go to movie theaters for over 2 decades / started reading some “quality” news papers …they all program their in-takers with lies that created the European Soviet Union etc. / do you know the tune “Back in USSR / how lucky you are boy….?”
In December 2013 a new episode started in my personal story/ I call it the esp xyz files of my ora @ labora fact tory….too weird for words… but if necessary I put this “seeing things” afterwards mercilessly on the cutting board of my intellect aka common sense…
In short in 2015 (2016) this process intensified / a abnormal tsunami of abnormak paranormal encounters startinh with Jacob R. who had putan agent on me …..Putin and quite a lor of other types like him showed up as well / it is not a vision only it is also interction 7 encountering them
The statue of Pike I “saw it falling / made it falling” / that Lina writes about Pike & his birthing of the KKK was not new to me / but the details ….
All these covid global massmurder perps etc. are j. tribe members with their goyim personnel they should be “toppled” with the no-way-to-hide guillotines…
Who wants to have a just conversation with people who vanish per year 8 million children to get their adrenochrome aperatif……
We should forget about Trotsky & the like & deal with his same frame of mind massmurderers….
CIA O
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “Here are the results of my preliminary research on the homicidal gas chambers at A-B:
1) Crematorium I: First gas chamber built. Located in the main camp. Operated March 1942 – June 1942. A few thousand people murdered.”
My response: I recommend that you watch David Cole’s video of his tour of Auschwitz.
David Cole, a Jewish American, produced a very revealing video based on his visit to Auschwitz in September 1992. Wearing a yarmulke and pretending to be a righteous Jew wanting to answer those who question the Holocaust story, Cole paid extra for his personal English language tour guide. The video shows numerous weaknesses of the alleged homicidal gas chamber at Auschwitz: 1) Obvious marks on the walls and floors where apparently walls have been knocked down; 2) Equally obvious holes in the floor where bathroom facilities had been; 3) A flimsy wooden door with a big glass pane in it; 4) A doorway with no door and no fittings for a door leading to the crematorium ovens; 5) A big manhole right in the middle of the gas chamber; and 6) No Zyklon B staining in the walls. Any reasonable person can tell that the alleged gas chamber shown in the video could not possibly function as a homicidal gas chamber.
In response to David Cole’s questions, Cole’s tour guide repeatedly states that the gas chamber at Auschwitz was in its original state. Unable to answer all of Cole’s questions, Cole’s tour guide went to get a woman who was introduced as the Supervisor of Tour Guides for the Auschwitz State Museum. In response to Cole’s question, the Auschwitz tour supervisor states that the holes in the ceiling of the alleged gas chamber at Auschwitz were rebuilt after the war. Thus, contrary to statements made by Cole’s tour guide, the Auschwitz tour supervisor acknowledges that the alleged gas chamber at Auschwitz is not in its original state.
David Cole next interviewed Dr. Franciszek Piper, the Head of Archives and the Senior Curator of the Auschwitz State Museum. Dr. Piper explained in the interview that the gas chamber shown to tourists at Auschwitz is similar to the one that existed in 1941-1942, but not all details are the same so that, for example, there are no gas-tight doors. In other words, the gas chamber is not in its original state but is rather a postwar reconstruction. Cole’s video documents that the museum officials deceive tourists by representing that the gas chamber at Auschwitz is in its original state even though the museum officials know better. The postwar reconstruction they show tourists at Auschwitz is worthless as proof of anything. Also, there is not a single wartime document or photograph to confirm what the alleged homicidal gas chamber at Auschwitz looked like. (Source: David Cole Interviews Dr. Franciszek Piper, Director, Auschwitz State Museum. Newport Beach, CA: Institute for Historical Review, 1992).
This video can be viewed at https://holocausthandbooks.com/index.php?page_id=1004&play=93#watch.
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Gabreal Jones says:@Gabreal Jones
@ Mark Bahner
Funny: The videos of David Cole in Auschwitz of September 1992 are deleted by youtube and bitchute why would they do that / you think ? Show me your tatoos Elie Wiesel…
And yes Oprah Winfrey has become one of them for quite some time now / it is good for her bank account / but she lost her soul…
CIA O
• Agree: John WearAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Patrick McNally says:@Pierre de Craon
I was simply referencing the photo, but as far as an actual listing of the members of the Military Revolutionary Committee by name, here it is:
F. E. Dzerzhinsky
V. A. Antonov-Ovseyenko
A. D. Sadovsky
M. S. Uritsky
N. I. Podvoisky
A. A. Ioffe
K. A. Mekhonoshin
V. I. Nevsky
L. D. Trotsky
Ia. M. Sverdlov
I. S. Unshlikht
S. I. Gusev
S. S. Petkovsky
Iu. M. Kotsiubinsky
N. A. Skrypnik
M. M. Lashevich
G. I. Chudnovsky
K. S. Eremeev
P. E Dybenko
V. M. Molotov
G. I. Boky
F. F. Raskolnikov
B. A. Breslav
N. V. Krylenko
— Alexander Rabinowitch, The Bolsheviks Come to Power, p. 238, W. W. Norton & Company, 1978.The absence of Zinoviev and Kamenev from this list is a consequence of their opposition to the overthrow of the Provisional Government. Looking the list over without doing any major investigations, the 5 Jewish names which spring out to my eyes are Gusev, Ioffe, Sverdlov, Trotsky and Uritsky. There probably is at least one more in there, consistent with Weber’s claim of 6. But that is the actual listing.
Although I had picked this point out since it actually does relate to what is sometimes honest confusion over historical details, it should be mentioned that Weber casually recycles an old lie with his repetition of the hoax around the American Hebrew & Jewish Messenger of September 10, 1920, in that silly article written by Svetozar Tonjoroff. Weber claims that:
—–
“The Bolshevik Revolution,” declared a leading American Jewish community paper in 1920, “was largely the product of Jewish thinking, Jewish discontent, Jewish effort to reconstruct.”
—–That is a false quote. The actual quote was talking about the February Revolution. Here it is:
“The workings of this unrest are to be seen in the events that have accomplished, since the fateful year 1914, a task that looms far larger than the French Revolution–the annihilation of the most firmly entrenched, the most selfish and most reckless autocratic system in the world, the Russian Czarism. That achievement, destined to figure in history as the overshadowing result of the world war, was largely the result of Jewish thinking, of Jewish discontent, of Jewish effort to reconstruct.”
Tonjoroff goes on in a bland way claiming that Jews had invented the Golden Rule and that this was what caused the overthrow of the Czar. He has little to say about the Bolshevik Revolution, and where he does he portrays it rather as a kind of hiccup which is being rejected:
“the passing of the destructive phase of the Lenine-Trotzky revolution, which may also mean the passing of Lenine and Trotzky themselves.”
If you actually read Tonjoroff’s (pretty silly) article (which can be found on the web by simply Googling for the quotes which I’ve given) it is apparent that he draws the connection not between “Jewish discontent” and Bolshevism but rather with the creation of the Provisional Government which was overthrown by the Bolsheviks. Where he comments on Bolshevism, he simply treats it as an instance of falling off of the track from what his desired “Jewish thinking” had wanted. Hence, he looks forward to “the passing of Lenine and Trotzky themselves.” It’s a rather naive news article, but it does not claim what Weber attributes to it.
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Patrick McNally says:@Gabreal Jones
I certainly have no doubt that Trotsky was Jewish in his ethnic background. He was the sort of character who gravitated towards maverick roles and didn’t easily fit into ethnic alliances or anything similar. In certain contexts, that worked to his political benefit. In others, it was a political loss.
One of the more interesting forays which he got himself into was when he found out that the Ukrainian Cheka had an absurd overrepresentation of Jews in its ranks:
“At a politburo meeting held on 18 April 1919, Trotsky commented:
“‘that Latvians and Jews constituted a vast percentage of those employed in Cheka frontal units, executive committees in frontal zones and the rear, and in Soviet establishments at the center; that the percentage of them at the front was a comparatively small one; that strong chauvinist agitation on this subject was being carried out among Red Army men and finding a certain response there; and that in Comrade Trotsky’s opinion, a reallocation of Party personnel was essential to achieve a more even distribution of all nationalities between the front and the rear.’
“A striking imbalance manifested itself particularly in the Ukraine, where in early 1919 the Chekas contained an extraordinarily high proportion of Jews. 75 per cent of the personnel of the Kiev Cheka, and seven out of its ten collegium members, were Jews…
“On 1 May 1919, i.e. shortly after Trotsky’s Politburo protest, the Kiev Cheka (and doubtless other Chekas) received an order prohibiting (or, more probably, limiting) the appointment of Jews to top Cheka posts and requiring, for propaganda reasons, the token execution of Jews–previously only one Jew had been executed by the Kiev Cheka…”
— George Leggett, The Cheka, pp. 262, 413.It’s not really clear whether Leggett’s point about only 1 Jew having been executed by the Kiev Cheka represents loyalty by Kiev Jews to the Bolshevik government or favoritism by Jewish Cheka agents towards people who otherwise might have been charged and executed by the Cheka. In any event, Trotsky certainly was not interested in promoting Jews as such within either the Cheka or anywhere else. Hence his acting to curb the most extreme over-representation. The subsequent trials of Ukrainian Zionists were the result of this intervention by Trotsky.
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Kali says:@Carolyn Yeager
I think you would be hard-pressed to find any specific examples of trolling from “that Yeager woman.” Why don’t you try? You’re confusing replies you don’t like, usually bc it is a superior argument/facts to your own, or it contains truth unflattering to you and/or your “pets”
Well, there’s that. lol
For the rest all anyone has to do is click on your name. It’s all there in almost every comment.
You’re welcome.
Kali.
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Caruthers says:@Carolyn Yeager
Yeager is clearly not a troll. She appears quite sincere in everything she writes.
• Agree: Mark BahnerAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
littlereddot says:@Rurik
It appears a child has chosen to impress us with his intellect.
Go on, write more so that I may peer into your mind.
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Wizard of Oz says:@John Wear
So what? It has long been known that what tourists see today (and presumably Leuchter and Germar Rudolf purported to give scientific evidence about) were approximate reconstructions.
Furthermore you neglect to acknowledge that David Cole rejects all claims that he is a Holocaust denier.
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
Hi John,
Oy vey!
That was brutal. David Cole may have thought he “went to see a place he had studied so long” (see 11:33 in the video), but that was obviously *pre-Internet* research!For the *entire fricking video* he talks about “the” gas chamber. As I pointed out to you already, there were ***seven*** gas chambers at various times at Auschwitz:
1) Crematorium I: First gas chamber built. Located in the main camp. Operated March 1942 – June 1942. A few thousand people murdered.
2) Bunker 1: Provisional gas chamber outside main camp. Operated March to June 1942. A few thousand people murdered.
3) Bunker 2: Another provisional gas chamber outside main camp. Operated June to December 1942. A few thousand people murdered.
4) Crematorium II, III, IV, V: At Birkenau. I think II and III were closest to the railroad tracks. *Approximately* a million people were murdered in all four gas chambers, combined. Operated March 1943 and blown up by the Nazis in November 1944, to hide the evidence of the crimes against humanity committed inside them.
Further, as I pointed out, *virtually everyone* murdered by Zyklon-B at Auschwitz was murdered in one of the *four* gas chambers at *Birkenau*! He didn’t even bother or ask to even *look* at Birkenau!
Finally, ever single thing said by everyone representing the museum in that video was perfectly reasonable and absolutely in no way indicative of any sort of coverup:
1) The first tour guide said the holes in the ceiling were original, and all the walls were original. But she’s like 16 years old
and probably there just for the summer. So she gets her supervisor.2) Her supervisor *correctly* says that the holes were added after the war, but doesn’t know exactly what the situation with the walls was, so she says to contact Dr. Piper.
Dr. Piper ***nails everything***. He explains *exactly* why things happened the way they did in that gas chamber. (WHICH IS A TRIVIAL FRICKING GAS CHAMBER! APPROXIMATELY *99 PERCENT OF THE EXECUTIONS OCCURRED IN THE FOUR GAS CHAMBERS AT BIRKENAU!!!!!!!!)
Sorry for the capitalizations, but it’s so frustrating to me when people can’t keep their eyes on the ball…largely because, in this case, Dave Cole didn’t even KNOW about the four Birkenau chambers.
Dr. Piper said:
1) This was Crematorium I (i.e. the first gas chamber) and it ONLY OPERATED FROM FALL 1941 to DECEMBER 1942.
2) Then, when the Soviets started bombing, they converted it into an air raid shelter. So they *plugged the holes* (which is a perfectly reasonable thing to do in an air-raid shelter) and they apparently also added walls maybe to have a toilet (which is also a perfectly reasonable thing to have in an air-raid shelter).
3) Then, after the war, the Soviets wanted to make it look like it looked when it was used as a gas chamber (because the Nazis blew up the gas chambers in Birkenau, so putting *those* back together wouldn’t fit into the budget.) So the added the holes back to the roof and took out the walls.
Dave Cole made this into some sort of big coverup, and you’re apparently swallowing the hook. But again, this was ONE gas chamber, that was important ONLY because it was the first. The FINAL FOUR GAS CHAMBERS IN AUSCHWITZ-2/BIRKENAU (Crematorium II, III, IV, and V) were where approximately *99 PERCENT* of all executions at Auschwitz-Birkenau occurred.
Best wishes,
MarkP.S. As has already been pointed out, Dave Cole has *completely changed his mind about the Holocaust*. I’m pretty sure he even *wrote* the words in the movie documentary “Auschwitz: Silent Witness”. I’ll provide a link or two later.
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Petermx says:@Wizard of Oz
They weren’t “reconstructions.” They were post-war constructions, and they lied about that until they finally admitted it to Cole in the early 1990s, around the same time they admitted that they lied and invented the number of four million people supposedly murdered at Auschwitz, later reducing their claim to 1.1 million, still without any evidence. The authorities at Auschwitz presented the constructions there as being found that way in 1945 and then admitted they lied and built those constructions after the war was over.
If David Cole now retracts some things he said previously, that could be because other Jews (the Jewish Defense League) threatened to kill him for his outspokenness regarding the holohoax. That was why he went into hiding to begin with.
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Brosi says:@Patrick McNally
Here are just a few of the more poignant comments by Ron Unz concerting the troll known as “Patrick McNally” who constantly spams UR threads:
https://www.unz.com/runz/more-falsehoods-of-world-war-ii
I wonder whether you’ve actually ever read any Suvorov’s books or merely rely upon what you can glean from Internet reviews and such.
https://www.unz.com/runz/why-everything-you-know-about-world-war-ii-is-wrong
I wouldn’t pay any attention to “Patrick McNally.” He’s a notorious fraud who hangs around this website, regularly making absurd claims such as that few of the early Bolshevik leaders were Jewish.
I sometimes wonder whether you’re related to Bernie Madoff or perhaps trained under him. He was an extraordinarily bold fraudster, and you seem much the same.
Look, you’re just a dishonest propagandist, very possibly paid to spend endless hours on this website spouting your obfuscating nonsense.
Your sophistical arguments are clearly aimed at stupid, gullible people.
But your willingness to simply ignore all this direct personal testimony simply proves once again that you’re just a dishonest shill.
You, on the other hand, seem to have ultra-conventional views on Jews, the Bolshevik Revolution, and World War II. That raises all sorts of questions about why you would spend so much of your time on this website, writing such detailed comments totaling hundreds of thousands of words defending the conventional narrative and disputing the obvious reality that the top early Bolshevik leadership was overwhelmingly Jewish. Why put in so much time and effort on this fringe-website? Don’t you have a job at which you need to be earning a living?
Perhaps you’re just a very publicly-spirited citizen, and commenting on this website is your primary leisure activity. But I think it’s far more likely that commenting on this website is your job and how your earn your living. Presumably you’re being paid by the ADL or some similar sort of organization to obfuscate those facts they wish to see obfuscated.
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Mark Bahner says:@Mark Bahner
I’m virtually certain I’m correct.
David Cole made the video “David Cole Interviews Dr. Franciszek Piper” in 1992, but he *also* wrote “Auschwitz: Silent Witness” *seven years later* under the name David Abravenal Stein. And unless I’m mistaken, “Auschwitz: Silent Witness” is from the “conventional” view of Auschwitz as an extermination camp.
https://en.kinorium.com/name/1188422/
P.S. Again, there is essentially no doubt that *approximately* a million people were executed by Zyklon-B gas in the gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau. And *99 percent* of those executions were in Crematorium II, III, IV, and V at the *Birkenau* (Auschwitz II) part of the death camp.
See the four buildings labeled “Gaskammern” at the top right of the plot diagram I provided earlier, in the “Auschwitz II” portion of the camp…particularly the two Gaskammern near the railroad tracks.
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Brosi says:@Wizard of Oz
Here are just a few of the more damning comments by Ron Unz concerting the troll known as “Wizard of Oz” who constantly spams UR threads:
But your willingness to simply ignore all this direct personal testimony simply proves once again that you’re just a dishonest shill.
I’m busy with my other things and don’t have time to waste arguing about the Holocaust with you, especially since you’re just some random activist who just showed up here.
WoZ isn’t Jewish. However, he’s rather gullible and pompous and has spent his entire long life totally immersed in our mainstream media portrayal of reality, which obviously has been very heavily shaped by Jewish activists. So his beliefs might be reasonably considered as constituting an extended phenotype of global Jewry.
I’ve known you for well over twenty years and in all that time I honestly can’t think of a single intelligent thing you’ve ever said, so you’re certainly keeping that remarkable streak alive.
Given your more than 15,000 comments on this website, I’m sure I somehow missed a handful that did show some mental ability, and perhaps you could point me to a couple of them.
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Petermx says:@Mark Bahner
LOL. If everything they presented was “perfectly reasonable,” they would not have been exposed as bald-faced liars and admitted they lied and invented the number of four million people being “murdered” at Auschwitz, reducing their new claim to 1.1 million after about 40 years, still without a shred of evidence. That was when they came up with their latest lie, now claiming the holohoax was done with bullets. They are the gang that can’t get their story straight.
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Brosi says:@Mark Bahner
Here are the results of my preliminary research on the homicidal gas chambers at A-B
That graphic you linked to is unreadable and proves nothing. You are a stupid Jewish troll, and a typically arrogant one to boot.
You can come up with unreadable fake diagrams and doctored photographs until kingdom come, they will prove nothing. The problem is that your claims of 6 million are not only physically impossible, they are merely one small link in a massive tapestry of Jewish lies and sophistry. Here is one very famous montage that proves that 6 million is a lie:
These are from the New York Times alone. How many times throughout history do Jews like you get to claim 6 million victims of holocausts and expect to get away with it? Chutzpah doesn’t even start to describe it.
I happen to love this one because it is proof that there could not have been more than 999,999 gassed and cremated Jews over all the “death camps”, LOL.
You are a lying Jew who worships the prince of lies and whose holy book the talmud is nothing but twisted and warped lies.
You are a liar sent here to UR to troll the comments section.
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Petermx says:@Mark Bahner
What crap you write. The people promoting the hoax can’t even agree among themselves where the supposed murders were committed. The Auschwitz story has been exposed as nothing but lies, as they admitted when they tore down the memorial claiming four million people were murdered there.
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John Wear says:@Wizard of Oz
You write: “Furthermore you neglect to acknowledge that David Cole rejects all claims that he is a Holocaust denier.”
My response: David Cole, whose parents are both Jewish, was very effective in the 1990s in promulgating revisionist viewpoints. He was so effective that the Jewish Defense League threatened him into recanting his views. In January 1998, Cole changed his name to David Stein to protect himself, and he became publicly known as a right-wing Hollywood Republican. In May 2013, David Cole was exposed by a former friend and is now using his original name again.
So, when enough pressure is applied, many people buckle under the pressure. I think David Cole is one of these people.
• Disagree: Wizard of Oz• Thanks: Pierre de CraonAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “He didn’t even bother or ask to even *look* at Birkenau!”
My response: David Cole toured Birkenau on his visit. He didn’t show his visit to Birkenau in this video.
You write: “The first tour guide said the holes in the ceiling were original, and all the walls were original. But she’s like 16 years old
and probably there just for the summer. So she gets her supervisor.”My response: The first tour guide was there over four years later when I toured Auschwitz-Birkenau in October 1996. She was not there just for the summer.
You write: “Her supervisor *correctly* says that the holes were added after the war, but doesn’t know exactly what the situation with the walls was, so she says to contact Dr. Piper.”
My response: Everything about this alleged homicidal gas chamber is fake. It never could have functioned as a genuine homicidal gas chamber.
You write: “Dr. Piper ***nails everything***. He explains *exactly* why things happened the way they did in that gas chamber. (WHICH IS A TRIVIAL FRICKING GAS CHAMBER! APPROXIMATELY *99 PERCENT OF THE EXECUTIONS OCCURRED IN THE FOUR GAS CHAMBERS AT BIRKENAU!!!!!!!!).”
My response: Cole in this video says that camp officials allege that exterminations were moved to Birkenau because the gas chamber at the main camp was too close to the inmates and therefore the inmates could know what was going on. Cole questions the accuracy of this statement.
Cole states: “Let’s refer back to our map of the main camp. Now here’s the gas chamber right there, and there’s the row of inmates barracks. As you can see, the gas chamber is well outside the prison compound. It’s hidden from view by the three SS buildings which effectively hide it from the inmates’ sight.
Plus, we’re told, the arrivals who are going to be gassed would be taken in through here, thus avoiding any and all contact with the other inmates. This was a gas chamber that could have functioned completely isolated from anybody’s notice.
Now this is Auschwitz-Birkenau in an Allied aerial photo from September 1944. These are the two crematoriums and “gas chambers,” with the crematoriums above ground and L-shaped below ground rooms that were either gas chambers or mortuaries. And here you have the rows and rows of inmates barracks.
Now the thing that becomes immediately clear is there is nothing but a barbed wire fence hiding the inmates’ barracks from the gas chambers.
And this over here was the Birkenau sports field, right next door to the “gas chambers.” And another thing to notice is not only could you see the “gas chamber,” parallel with the barracks, but you could see diagonally to the one across the way from you. Nothing was hidden from the inmates.
Another interesting thing was the train that would come up, carrying the doomed inmates. You would have thousands of inmates being marched off the train into one of these two gas chambers in full view of the entire camp. This was a spectacle that nobody in the camp could miss; they would see thousands of people marching into those buildings and nobody coming out.
These were ‘gas chambers’ that were not isolated from anyone and indeed, when these aerial photographs were released in the late 1970s, they contradicted many supposed eyewitness claims about how the Nazis had tried to camouflage the gas chambers at Birkenau.
I spent several days here at Birkenau, and the footage I have, which is available on a separate tape, dramatically shows everything I have just been saying. Frankly, I don’t think [Dr. Fraciszek] Piper’s claim holds any water.”
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Truth Vigilante says:@littlereddot
Oh dear, you’re still crying over that I see, after I embarrassed you in that previous thread and swatted away your asinine notion that Socialism has worked anywhere to improve prosperity.
Meanwhile, you wrote:
You obviously think that the English alphabet = Latin Alphabet
The English alphabet, and indeed that of all western European nations, is Latin derived.
Colloquially, we just say they’re all from the Latin alphabet.Of course, in the case of the English and German alphabets, they are EXACTLY the same 26 letters used in both.
You also write:
Does the English alphabet contain the Umlaut?
The umlaut is NOT a letter of the alphabet. It’s role is solely for the purpose of accentuation – nothing more.
Mr Little Red Bot, it seems that you just can’t take a trick.
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Malla says:@Patrick McNally
Churchill was fully on board with that policy of Chamberlain
Churchill, in contrast, went out of his way to cultivate the Soviets: he privately assured Stalin’s ambassador in London, Ivan Maisky, that in order to weaken Nazi Germany, Britain did not view Soviet expansion into the Baltic region unfavourably. However Churchill did suggest sending a British Army officer, Brigadier Christopher Ling, to Helsinki for moral support to the Finns. In the war cabinet in November 1939, Churchill urged Chamberlain not to make the ‘mistake’ of ‘trying to stiffen the Finns against making concessions to the USSR’. For this reason Churchill’s premiership was warmly welcomed by Maisky and Soviet-aligned groups in Britain, such as the Daily Worker and the Russia Today Society. The Russia Today Society latter expressed hope that Churchill would reverse ‘the previous government’s policy of hostility towards the USSR’.
Sorry
Also Churchill was of the view that sending troops to Finland via Sweden would be impractical and yet Churchill was ready to attack Sweden to deny Germany iron. Right!!! Sorry, your argument does not sell.Most people did not expect the USSR to be a stable long-term superpower and mainly Germany as the rising power on the continent.
More bullshit.
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Brosi says:@Kali
Reasons why Carolyn Yeager is a paid CIA/MI6/Mossad/SPLC/ADL troll, or a combination thereof. Pick any three.
1) Her website never suffers the kind of DOS/DNS attacks like any other “Nazi” site does. Just compare to Daily Stormer.
2) She rarely wastes her “Nazi” energy debating/debunking Holofraud deniers the way John Wear does.
3) Instead she constantly beats on revisionists like Ron Unz, John Wear, Rurik, Truth Vigilante.
4) Every thread she spams on she instantly side tracks into narcissistic discussions about herself.
5) She rarely, if ever adds any original revisionist views, even though she claims she has a mountain of original content.
6) She insists that Adolf smiles at her from heaven, yet she behaves like the worst kind of man-hating feminist that we know Hitler would have despised.
Here are a few comments by Ron Unz concerning her behavior here at UR:
But on the other hand, you’re an exceptionally stubborn individual, who sometimes seems almost delusional.
Look, you’re just a stubborn elderly crank, so extremely stubborn as to nearly be delusional.
I’m just giving up on you
The problem is that you mostly just make assertions without ever providing any evidence to support them.
• Disagree: Mark Bahner• Replies: @Mark BahnerAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Mark Bahner says:@Brosi
Reasons why Carolyn Yeager is a paid CIA/MI6/Mossad/SPLC/ADL troll, or a combination thereof. Pick any three.
You forgot: Just an elderly woman with a weird personality (antisemitic) and weird ideas…e.g., that Auschwitz-Birkenau was some kind of almost resort, simply because she took a tour *only of Auschwitz 1* and didn’t see anything that seemed like it represented an extermination camp.
I’m not really speculating here…unless the CIA/MI6/Mossad/SPLC/ADL are much better at inventing, and more interested in inventing, a woman who simply comments on a website filled with weird/irrational/antisemitic ideas.
NOTE: Auschwitz-Birkenau was most certainly a Nazi extermination camp. One million+ people (give or take) were killed there. The majority of those one million+ people (give or take) were gassed with Zyklon-B within hours of arrival. The majority of the people murdered there consisted of combined group of: children under the age of ~13 , very often with their mothers (unless their mothers gave them to elderly people before selection), elderly women, and elderly men.
• Troll: BrosiAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
littlereddot says:@Truth Vigilante
Oh dear, you’re still crying over that I see, after I embarrassed you in that previous thread and swatted away your asinine notion that Socialism has worked anywhere to improve prosperity.
Obfuscating and deflecting is not swatting away. The only one you showed up is yourself. As Yeager urged you, man up and admit your mistake and move on.
Unless of course you want to renew the debate, which I am game for.
The English alphabet, and indeed that of all western European nations, is Latin derived.
Colloquially, we just say they’re all from the Latin alphabet.Derived is correct.
But you stated (in block letters I might add), and I quoteWE’RE STILL USING ENGLISH/LATIN CHARACTERS
Clearly you equate the two.
The umlaut is NOT a letter of the alphabet. It’s role is solely for the purpose of accentuation – nothing more.
What is wrong with you? A few keystrokes on google and you would save yourself the embarrassment.
It seems that the more you write, the more you expose yourself as a fool that talks incessantly.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Petermx
I assumed that it went without saying that reconstructions can never be an exact copy of the original and may be far from it.
Do you believe your speculation about David Cole’s motives to be true? If so, why? On what evidence? Have you ever attempted to question him? For my part I have read enough of Cole’s wtitings in which he has repeatedly and consistently argued that the Holicaust was not a myth to regard it as ridiculous in 2023 that he would be rejecting denialism out of fear of fanatics.
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HdC says:@Truth Vigilante
Well, you are wrong with the oe Umlaut!
If you do not have the O with the dots on top, why not type the perfectly acceptable oe?AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD
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Wizard of Oz says:@John Wear
Thanks to your punctuation you do not make it clear who is saying what. To the extent that you are relying on David Cole being surprised 30 years ago that it didn’t appear that any effective effort to conceal the gassing from the rest of the camps had been made my answer is “so what?’”. Maybe the Germans didn’t care and naybe the rest were all at work elsewhere when women, children and elderly were separated from the workers. Moreover if each lot of arrivals was treated in the same way why would the Germans bother to hide what they were doing from existing inmates?
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Wizard of Oz says:@Petermx
Who tore down the memorial? Who is the “they” that somehow thereby made an admission that they had not previously been truthful? Try showing some intellectual self respect and UR readers may benefit from reading your comments.
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Malla says:@Brosi
Churchill really did believe in the good of Empire but because of his weird hatred for Germany and Hitler, destroyed his Empire. But funny part is that the left now wants to screw him and destroy his statues. 1.4 billion Indians consider him a mass murderer, the most populated nation on Earth, the largest democracy in Earth . They don’t hate Hitler, they hate Churchill. It is funny.
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Malla says:@Patrick McNally
Just in regard to what I had said right at the beginning of that message, yes, the evidence shows that when Hitler turned 50, he felt a strong of urgency that his chance for gaining living space for the German race would be lost if he did not start getting things done now.
Pure bulcrap.
You rather tend to jump over the record where it is inconvenient.
I have shown so much evidence and you ignore them where it is inconvenient.
Your fascination with the Hitler-Mannerheim conversation shows this.
It is Hitler having frank talk with his ally.
However, nothing in the contemporaneous record of Hitler’s comments after Molotov’s trip to Berlin shows any significant difference from the way that Hitler had talked about invading the USSR as early as July 31, 1940.
Molotov himself said that Hitler was agitated when the question of German guarantees about Romania was raised. Adolf Hitler issued Führer Directive 21 on 18 December 1940 , an order for the invasion of the Soviet Union, exactly the month after his talks with Molotov (Molotov’s 4 demands), which was in November 1940, when Hitler realized that Stalin was planning an invasion of all Europe and the Axis had no option but of a pre-emptive strike. Again consistent with Hitler’s talk with Mannerheim and his speech.
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John Wear says:@Wizard of Oz
You ask: “To the extent that you are relying on David Cole being surprised 30 years ago that it didn’t appear that any effective effort to conceal the gassing from the rest of the camps had been made my answer is “so what?’”.”
My response: My comment #1130 where I made this statement was in response to Mark Bahner’s comment #1121 where he says “Dr. Piper ***nails everything***.”
David Cole explains in his video that the alleged homicidal gas chamber at Auschwitz I was hidden from the camp inmates, while the alleged Birkenau gas chambers were not hidden.
Cole states about Birkenau: “Now the thing that becomes immediately clear is there is nothing but a barbed wire fence hiding the inmates’ barracks from the gas chambers.
And this over here was the Birkenau sports field, right next door to the “gas chambers.” And another thing to notice is not only could you see the “gas chamber,” parallel with the barracks, but you could see diagonally to the one across the way from you. Nothing was hidden from the inmates.
Another interesting thing was the train that would come up, carrying the doomed inmates. You would have thousands of inmates being marched off the train into one of these two gas chambers in full view of the entire camp. This was a spectacle that nobody in the camp could miss; they would see thousands of people marching into those buildings and nobody coming out.”
The “so what?” is David Cole’s next statement: “These were ‘gas chambers’ that were not isolated from anyone and indeed, when these aerial photographs were released in the late 1970s, they contradicted many supposed eyewitness claims about how the Nazis had tried to camouflage the gas chambers at Birkenau.”
The “so what?” is that the numerous eyewitnesses who claimed that the Nazis were attempting to camouflage the gas chambers at Birkenau are all wrong. Also, Dr. Piper’s explanation of why gas chambers were moved to Birkenau is also wrong. Contrary to Mark Bahner’s statement, Dr. Piper did not nail everything.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Brosi
Who do you think that discredits? I assume you don’t see how it reflects on yourself but it is embarrasing for one who admired much of Ron Unz’s early work to discover just how far he has sunk into the repetition of mere abuse.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Brosi
What a clever little boy you are. Perhaps you should be the only 5 year old ac erated to Grade 2.
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Malla says:@Patrick McNally
Hitler was already thinking beyond the end of ‘Barbarossa.’ On the seventeenth, Jodl instructed his staff that the Führer wished them to study the problems of assembling troops in Afghanistan for an assault on India.
That would be in support of Indian Nationalist leader, Subhash Chandra Bose, to liberate India from British rule. Both Iran and Afghanistan were pro-German. Subhash Chandra Bose is the most popular person in India of 1.4 billion and always will be, till the end of time.
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Wizard of Oz says:@John Wear
Interesting but entirely inconclusive. Did Hoess ever give direct oral evidence of the greatly inflated figure for deaths or was that just on a document he signed and which was put in evidence? And what about my question about his lawyer or lawyers?
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
Hi John,
You simply don’t understand the background of David Cole’s video. You write as though David Cole did that video a couple years ago instead of 1989.(!!!!)
He didn’t even have an Internet connection back then! (Nobody did.) He was an ignorant, smart-alecky young man. He had reasonable instincts, but again, he was *IGNORANT*.
He still writes in a smart-alecky too-clever-by-half manner, but he’s learned A LOT since 1989. To my knowledge, virtually everything he questions in that video he no longer questions. (I’m trying to connect with him through his Substack account to make sure I’m accurately portraying his views, but I’m pretty sure I am.)
One thing that I can state for certain is that he absolutely does not question anymore that the Nazis began a mass extermination campaign in 1941, called “Operation Reinhard.” That involved the mass extermination of Polish Jews using carbon monoxide at Belzec, Sobibor, and Treblinka:
https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/operation-reinhard-einsatz-reinhard
I know this for certain because he wrote that very thing just a few months ago. I’ll provide the link, and some cut/pasted material from that link in a short while.
Bottom line: David Cole made that video in 1989. Now it’s 2023. He’s learned he was wrong in 1989. (Good for him! Hopefully, you’ll be joining him soon…because there’s absolutely no doubt that Auschwitz was an extermination camp in which approximately 1 million people were murdered, and most with Zyklon-B gas.)
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Mark Bahner says:@Carolyn Yeager
Very intelligent and mature comment. Your experience is my experience, except that I don’t have a ” background in construction and engineering.” But I did have the ability to reason, to think. That’s really what it takes.
To pursue the “Holocaust” questioning further, one must have sufficient interest to do so. Only a relative few have that interest. That’s what the pushers of this lie depend on. Thanks again for your input.
You need to do more learning, thinking and reasoning, Carolyn. You’re absolutely wrong. Auschwitz-Birkenau was an extermination camp in which approximately 1 million people were murdered, and a majority of them were murdered in gas chambers with Zyklon-B.
I can see you have a birthday coming up, and that you’ve probably got, what, 10 years left to learn the truth? So it’s best to get started now. I’m available to help.
Best wishes,
Mark Bahner (German-American…but mostly American ;-))P.S. I should honor Mom’s side of the family, too…”German-English-American”…but still mostly American.
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Kali says:@Carolyn Yeager
Ahhh, it’s the Yeager woman, TROLLING again.
She does this because she is a TROLL
Luckily for those of us here in good faith, our host, Ron, has provided archives of all of our comments. A feature which makes it much easier to respond when threads become long and laggy. (Thanks Ron!)
So, here I am, swamping around in the filth of the Yeager womans archive. Not that I accept “asignments” from trolls, or anyone else , of course, but as a service to the good people of Unz.
Helpfully the Yeager woman provided us with several definitions of the word “troll”. Let’s put them to good use shall we:
a troll is a person who posts or makes inflammatory, insincere, digressive,[1] extraneous, or off-topic messages online (such as in social media, a newsgroup, a forum, a chat room, an online video game) or in real life, with the intent of provoking others into displaying emotional responses,[2] or manipulating others’ perception, thus acting as a bully or a provocateur. The behavior is typically for the troll’s amusement, or to achieve a specific result such as disrupting a rival’s online activities
So, is the Yeager woman a bully or a provocateur?
Does she write these things for her own ammusement or to disrupt others?
Could her comments be characterised as “inflammatory, insincere, digressive,[1] extraneous, or off-topic”?Let the reader be the judge:
Here she is to author of Germany’s War, the very gracious gentleman, John Wear:
The fact of the matter is that you are a moron. A moron is defined as a person whose intellectual limit is the equivalent of 12 years of age/6th grade level. This fits you to a tee. You function just fine, and can do a lot as a grown man, but you have your limits. Among your limits is that you can’t do complexity. That’s why you have so many fans who appreciate your very simple approach, simple writing style, simple ideas, and lots of virtue signalling.
And again:
And it reflects even worse on John Wear that he continued to agree with you, and now pushes his little “LOL” button
And again:
Unfortunately, most participants here are like John Wear with his very active “agree” button – major cowards who can’t take the heat in the kitchen where the ‘cooking’ is going on. He bows out of the fray but then wants to punch from behind the ‘big guy’ – you, Ron.
And again:
John Wear has proved again and again that he lacks INTEGRITY, the very quality he believes he excels in. In fact, he excels in the “woman’s role”
And again:
John, thank you for confirming/proving to the readers here that you are indeed a moron whose ability to think through something even a little bit complex is nil
And again:
I can out-reason 80% of the commenters here and keep up with the other 20%. Hey, you are the one who put a gold border around John Wear’s reply to me that I easily struck down. What does that say about you?
That’s just a selection of the Yeager woman TROLLING John, and just from this month alone.
Of course he is not the only victim of her TROLLING, but the material provides a clear picture of what a BULLY looks like once she’s selected a victim.
So, it’s over to the readers to judge for themselves. Is the Yeager woman, or is she not a low-life, bitter, jelous, bullying TROLL? I think you’ll agree with me that she is.
Now I need a shower! yuk
Kali.
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Gabreal Jones says:@Wizard of Oz
“Furthermore you neglect to acknowledge that David Cole rejects all claims that he is a Holocaust denier”
David / Cole – Stein – Cole is indeed a wigglebut. After he came out in 2013 that he was not Stein – the Rep. party animal – but was David – Ausch mit die Witz – Cole he made another vid about the gasvan hoax……
Video Link Deleted by Da Bitch chute – I saw it – David Cole exposes fake footage of gas vans at Holocaust …19 jun 2020 — David Cole exposes fake footage of gas vans at Holocaust Museum…@ Patrick McNally I wrote “The statue of Pike I “saw it falling / made it falling” that was in 2016…..
We live now in 2023 don´t we / I guess tptsb the powers that should not be have a great laugh at us that we chit chat about Bronstein aka Trotsky this “grandfather of the gulag” – Stalin implemented his ideas – where many many millions of Russian Orthodox Christians were horrendously murdered
via starvation or direct excution…The talmud j. bankers & their personnel are now behind the massmurder worldwide via the j. jabs most horriific aspect to it is : the she0ople in the abattoir don´t even (want to) know…
CIA O
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Truth Vigilante says:@Malla
1.4 billion Indians consider him [Churchill] a mass murderer …. They don’t hate Hitler, they hate Churchill. It is funny.
What’s funny is that all 8 billion of the Earth’s inhabitants don’t hate this despicable wretch of a man, otherwise known as Winston ‘Spendthrift’ Churchill.
After all, we know FOR CERTAIN that he was owned by the moneyed Jewish financiers, that he sold out his countrymen and those in the British Commonwealth, so that he could pursue the Talmudic agenda.Winston Churchill was a TRAITOR and amongst the greatest War Criminals of the 20th century.
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Mark Bahner says:@Brosi
You are a lying Jew who worships the prince of lies and whose holy book the talmud is nothing but twisted and warped lies.
I’m an extremely honest person, who obviously sometimes makes mistakes. So sometimes the things I say in honesty are in fact incorrect. But throughout my life, an extremely important goal of mine has been to be correct. That is, I’m an absolute bloodhound sniffing out truth. I will spend a ridiculous amount of time and effort both to find out what correct answers are, and to make sure I clearly and precisely state what the correct answers are.
As far as my religion, I *think* I was baptized Episcopalian. In any case, I’m almost certain it was some flavor of Protestantism. (My parents both passed away last year, so I can’t ask them. And I’m too lazy to see if there’s a photograph from those days.) In any case, now I’m pretty firmly agnostic.
And actually, one component of my agnosticism is that I just can’t understand why, if there is a God, she/he/they would *allow* ~1 million people to die at Auschwitz-Birkenau from 1941 to 1945, most of them from being gassed by Zyklon-B.
You’re comments are about *6 million* people, which shows you don’t read very carefully, because not a single comment I’ve made has mentioned the figure of 6 million people.
I want to stick to Auschwitz-Birkenau. Once we all can agree what happened there from 1941-1945, we can discuss what happened elsewhere in Europe.
What do you think happened at Auschwitz-Birkenau from 1941-1945? Do you think anyone was murdered? If so, approximately how many people were murdered, and by what methods?
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John Wear says:@Wizard of Oz
You ask about Rudolf Höss: “Did Hoess ever give direct oral evidence of the greatly inflated figure for deaths or was that just on a document he signed and which was put in evidence? And what about my question about his lawyer or lawyers?”
My response: Höss was never tried at the International Military Tribunal (IMT). He testified there as a defense witness for Ernst Kaltenbrunner. Höss affirmed that Kaltenbrunner had never visited Auschwitz, and that Kaltenbrunner didn’t ordered the execution of Jews at this camp.
As previously stated, U.S. prosecutor Col. John Amen next started reading from an affidavit Höss had signed in front of Whitney Harris on April 5, 1946. Höss’s testimony at the IMT was probably the most important and striking evidence presented there of a German extermination program. Höss in his testimony said that more than two and a half million people were exterminated in the Auschwitz gas chambers, and that another 500,000 inmates had died there of other causes. (Source: Taylor, Telford, The Anatomy of the Nuremberg Trials: A Personal Memoir, New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 1992, p. 363).
No defender of the Holocaust story today accepts these inflated figures, and other key portions of Höss’s testimony at the IMT are widely acknowledged to be untrue.
While Höss was appearing as a witness at Nuremberg, the Polish government sent word that they intended to try Höss for crimes committed in their country. Höss was eventually transported to a tiny basement cell in a prison on the outskirts of Krakow. Dr. Jan Sehn, the leading investigator in the Polish war crimes trials, asked Höss to write about Auschwitz’s operations and many other war-related matters. Sehn eventually persuaded Höss to write his memoirs. (Source: Harding, Thomas, Hanns and Rudolf: The True Story of the German Jew Who Tracked Down and Caught the Kommandant of Auschwitz, New York: Simon & Schuster, 2013, pp. 262-267).
Höss was also interrogated 13 times and fully answered all questions. (Source: Primomo, John W., Architect of Death at Auschwitz: A Biography of Rudolf Höss, Jefferson, NC: McFarland & Company, Inc., 2020, p. 163).
Höss’s trial began March 11, 1947, before the Supreme National Tribunal of Poland in Warsaw. Dr. Tadeusz Cyprian, the lead prosecutor, presented statements from a large number of camp inmates to prove Höss’s guilt. By contrast, neither Höss nor his attorneys introduced any witnesses, relying entirely on the witnesses put forward by the prosecution. As he had done at Nuremberg, Höss remained stoic, answering all questions in a brief, precise manner, without emotions. Similar to Dr. Gustave Gilbert and Dr. Leon Goldensohn at Nuremberg, both Dr. Shen and Dr. Cyprian described Höss as being apathetic. (Source: Ibid., pp. 166-167, 187).
Höss’s trial ended on March 29, 1947. As expected, on April 2, 1947, Höss was found guilty and sentenced to death by hanging. Höss was hanged on April 16, 1947, in front of the old crematorium at the Auschwitz main camp. (Source: Ibid., pp. 167, 196).
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Gabreal Jones says:@Mark Bahner
“and most with Zyklon-B gas”…..
https://www.vho.org/GB/c/DC/gc46-ORIGI.html
“The Zyklon B Issue
(6) To sum up the Zyklon B issue, we can take an overview of the Nazi gas chambers and their respective states RE Zyklon B traces:
Krema 1 (Auschwitz Main Camp): Minute traces, no blue staining
Krema 2 (Auschwitz-Birkenau): Minute traces, no blue staining
Krema 3 (Auschwitz-Birkenau): Minute traces, no blue staining.
Majdanek gas chambers 1, 3 and 4: Heavy traces, heavy blue staining (on inside and outside walls).
Dachau gas chamber: No traces, no blue staining.
Mauthausen gas chamber: No traces, no blue staining.
The revisionist explanation for the above is:
Kremas 1, 2 and 3 were not used as gas chambers; — the only Zyklon B they saw was from the routine camp fumigations.
Majdanek rooms 1, 3 and 4 were delousing rooms, like the ones at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
The Dachau gas chamber was a shower.
The Mauthausen gas chamber was a shower
What theory can be offered which explains the wildly divergent states of the gas chambers re Zyklon B traces, while still supporting the concept of mass homicidal gassings at these camps?”
David Cole was threaened after he was a 2 nationwide tv shows / if he withdrew the above / which I don´t think he did – he must have been cornered again by the known j. elements such as ADL etc.
( And he is a heavy drinker )
CIA O
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “You simply don’t understand the background of David Cole’s video. You write as though David Cole did that video a couple years ago instead of 1989.(!!!!)”
My response: David Cole visited Auschwitz in September 1992.
You write: “He didn’t even have an Internet connection back then! (Nobody did.) He was an ignorant, smart-alecky young man. He had reasonable instincts, but again, he was *IGNORANT*.”
My response: David Cole has read a number of books on the so-called Holocaust. He was not ignorant when he made his video.
You write: “One thing that I can state for certain is that he absolutely does not question anymore that the Nazis began a mass extermination campaign in 1941, called “Operation Reinhard.” That involved the mass extermination of Polish Jews using carbon monoxide at Belzec, Sobibor, and Treblinka.”
My response: This is correct. However, this does not necessarily mean that he believes that Belzec, Sobibor and Treblinka were extermination camps. He could easily being bowing to pressure from Jewish groups.
If you have an interest, I recommend you read my articles at https://inconvenienthistory.com/12/2/7291 and https://inconvenienthistory.com/15/1/8206 for information on the Aktion Reinhardt camps.
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soll says:@Brosi
Here is one very famous montage that proves that 6 million is a lie:
These are from the New York Times alone. How many times throughout history do Jews like you get to claim 6 million victims of holocausts and expect to get away with it? Chutzpah doesn’t even start to describe it.
Written during the Russian Civil War, 1918-1921 and it’s aftermath following widespread pogroms in Ukraine and Poland in which Jews were falsely blamed for causing the downfall of the Russian Empire. It’s modern estimates are that 1.5 million Jews were murdered by the local townsmen and peasants including the White Army. The Red Army protected the Jews in the local villages into the next towns which acquired the early support of the Jews to the Bolsheviks. If your subscribing to a conspiracy theory as this alleging a ‘hoax’ at least know the context of which your peddling.
For anyone interested (excluding Brosi) see, ‘In the Midst of Civilized Europe: The 1918-1921 Pogroms in Ukraine and the Onset of the Holocaust’ (2021) by Jeffrey Veidlinger
Some audio recordings are available below.
https://archive.org/details/jeffrey-veidlinger-in-the-midst-of-civilized-europe-audio
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Wizard of Oz says:@Ron Unz
Its hard to imagine being in favour of anything the ADL gets up to but if it is paying Patrick McNally you ought to be pleased that it has found someone possibly capable, if anyone is, of causing you to step back from your almost childish sallies towards unscholarly over-certain verdicts on historical pseudo issues (and the odd plausible one). For a win,win you should just try answering McNally properly.
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Brosi says:@Mark Bahner
I’m an extremely honest person
LOL. If the “Holocaust” were true, then there would not be laws all across the planet making its “denial” a crime. Too many good people like Faurisson, Zundel and Irving have suffered far too much at the hands of evil lying Jews for merely questioning its existence.
If you truly, truly believe that only 1 million Jews died at Auschwitz, then the Unz Review is definitely the wrong place to question this bogus Jewish shibboleth.
Instead you come here and spam honest people like John Wear with your garbage.
If you really believe that only 1 million died at Auschwitz as strongly as you claim you do then schedule a public appearance at Auschwitz and tell the world that there was no Holocaust because the 6 million figure is a lie and the Jews are liars. Everyone reading this thread will be delighted and will follow your ordeal right until the point that your entire existence and your family are cancelled.
But we know you won’t because we know you are just another Jewish troll sent here to sow discord.
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Wizard of Oz says:@John Wear
Thanks and I note too Soll’s comment below
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Wizard of Oz says:@Brosi
You have trouble even being too clever by half. If you do some searching you will find that only those not killed were tattooed and not all of them.
The possible legendary origin of the clearly unsubstantiated 6 million figure has been illustrated in TUR many times.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Mark Bahner
I’m an absolute bloodhound sniffing out truth. I will spend a ridiculous amount of time and effort both to find out what correct answers are ….
Well it appears you’ve been sniffing too close to your arse – because you are obviously clueless on the Holohoax.
As for the ‘ridiculous amount of time and effort’ you’ve squandered, the problem is that it was spent entirely on books sourced from the Jonathan Greenblatt/ADL approved list of Holohoax disinformation and bald faced lies.
STEP 1: I suggest you immediately read Chapter 8 of John Wear’s brilliant book – click on the link below:
https://www.unz.com/book/john_wear__germanys-war/
That chapter single handedly shreds the Zio concocted Holohoax fable.
Meanwhile, I suggest you buy this book from Nick Kollerstrom (formerly a Professor at University College London whose academic career was destroyed by the small hats because he dared to tell the truth about the phony gas chambers):
If that’s still not enough, John Wear will direct you to some other objective sources.
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Mark Bahner says:
My response: This is correct. However, this does not necessarily mean that he believes that Belzec, Sobibor and Treblinka were extermination camps. He could easily being bowing to pressure from Jewish groups.
I don’t want to discuss any place but Auschwitz-Birkenau, until I can convince you that you are ridiculously wrong about Auschwitz-Birkenau…that in fact hundreds of thousands of people were murdered there using Zyklon-B from 1942 to the end of 1944…when the gas chambers were blown up by the Nazis to hide evidence of their crimes.
Speaking of which, why do you think the Nazis installed the four large gas chambers and crematoria at Birkenau in 1943?:
The construction of the four large gas chambers and crematoria used at Birkenau began in 1942. These buildings, called ‘crematorium’ by the Nazis, included an area for the victims to undress, gas chambers, and incinerators for burning the bodies. The first chamber – Crematorium IV – became operational on 22 March 1943, with the other three chambers following in March, April and June 1943. The gas chambers at crematoria II and III, as well as the undressing rooms, were located underground, but crematoria IV and V were above ground.
And why do you think they destroyed the four large gas chambers and crematoria in November 1944?
November 25, 1944
Himmler Orders Demolition of Auschwitz Gas Chambers and Crematoria
As Soviet forces continue to approach, SS chief Heinrich Himmler orders the destruction of the Auschwitz-Birkenau gas chambers and crematoria.
Also, if the gas chambers at crematoria II, III, IV, and V in Birkenau (Auschwitz II) were for delousing clothes then why the hell did the Nazis put four crematoriums right next to the four gas chambers?
Were they planning to de-louse the clothes, and then burn the clothes?
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MarylinM says:@Munga Bulga
Slicing the bullshit into sub-atomic trivia with pedantic obsession proves only that myopia is a self-imposed affliction of those blinded by the trees to notice the forest. Evil is not Good, no matter how craftily gilded to conceal the true, the never publically admitted motives.
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Mark Bahner says:@Brosi
If you really believe that only 1 million died at Auschwitz as strongly as you claim you do then schedule a public appearance at Auschwitz and tell the world that there was no Holocaust because the 6 million figure is a lie and the Jews are liars.
You seem to be seriously confused. The figure of 6 million Jews dying in the entire Holocaust represents *all over Europe*…in the six death camps, in the other concentration camps, people shot in their own towns, people starved to death in ghettos, etc. etc.
I only want to discuss Auschwitz-Birkenau. That is one camp in Auschwitz, Poland. Nobody has ever claimed that 6 million people died there.
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Patrick McNally says:@Brosi
The first point there is perhaps the only one that warrants some notice. I’ll just list the data about the publication:
Icebreaker, translated by Thomas Beattie, published Hamish Hamilton, London, 1990.
Feel free to ask for any further details from specific pages of that book, if you are so curious about my possessing and having read it.
It’s true that I haven’t bothered to get any of Rezun’s later follow-up volumes. This style of this volume was enough to convince me that Rezun was simply playing games and that reading later volumes would simply involve more of an effort to disentangle the hoaxes of a dishonest author. Perhaps I will eventually find it useful to get some of the more recent volumes, simply because I have found that sometimes it is necessary to methodically dig through the scripts published by popular liars. But that first volume of Icebreaker was enough to show me that Rezun was playing games and no more.
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@littlereddot
Thanks, reddot, for sticking to your guns and in the process humiliating TV. I don’t know that I’ve ever encountered on the Internet someone as stupid as he is. I would never have known it if he hadn’t come up with this umlaut business … and he still hasn’t thrown in the towel!
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Brás Cubas says:@Pierre de Craon
Ref. [16] in Weber’s article is an indirect quote. The American Hebrew article itself — entitled ‘Jews in World Reconstruction’ — is available online. It was printed on pages 434 and 507 of that periodical and the links to those respective pages are provided below:
https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=osu.32435057876310&view=1up&seq=108
https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=osu.32435057876310&view=1up&seq=181
One further remark is that the author of that piece, one Svetozar Tonjoroff, is not Jewish, at least according to the following book (see page 10 of the book at page 9 of the file):
‘Father Coughlin: His “facts” and arguments’
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Brosi says:@soll
It’s modern estimates are that 1.5 million Jews were murdered by the local townsmen and peasants including the White Army. The Red Army protected the Jews in the local villages into the next towns which acquired the early support of the Jews to the Bolsheviks.
LOL. So you are claiming that 6 million Jews were gassed and creamed along with 5 million non Jews, and that 1.5 million Jews were murdered by “white Nazis” before the war started.
Yet there were 15 million Jews after the war, the same number that there was before the war.
There is only one logical explanation here: Jews are like Zombies. They like eating brains of Goyim, and they especially like eating their children. That is why Jews never die, even if you kill 7.5 million of them
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Patrick McNally says:@Malla
You’re just selecting statements from one convenient point in time, while ignoring others. That seems to be your whole modus operandi. I’ll refer again to David Carlton’s Churchill and the Soviet Union as a good study of the whole record. Yes, when the war began in September, Churchill harbored hopes that the entry of Soviet troops into Poland would soon lead to a German-Soviet conflict:
—–
By 1 October Churchill even proved willing to make a public broadcast which virtually welcomed the Soviet act of aggression against Great Britain’s hapless ally:“Russia has pursued a policy of cold self-interest. We could have wished that the Russian armies should be standing on their present line as the friends and allies of Poland, instead of as invaders. But that the Russian armies should stand on this line was clearly necessary for the safety of Russia against the Nazi menace. At any rate the line is there, and an Eastern Front has been created which Nazi Germany dare not assail.”
In taking this line, Churchill may have been genuinely convinced that Great Britain and the Soviet Union would soon be allies.
—–
— Carlton, ibid, p. 71.At a time when Churchill thought a German-Soviet war likely to break out very soon, he was willing to preach tolerance for the Soviet thrust into Poland. When it became obvious later on that the German-Soviet pact was not going to crumble very soon, Churchill’s stance shifted. All of these maneuvers are detailed by Carlton.
However, it’s particularly absurd for anyone to use this to suggest that Churchill would have tolerated a Soviet conquest of Europe of the sort which Rezun claims was imminent in 1941. A full uninhibited reading of all of Churchill’s statements (such as outlined by Carlton or other authors such as Jon Walker in Operation Unthinkable) shows that if Hitler had been swiftly defeated by Stalin with an attack in the summer of 1941, then Churchill would have promptly begun demanding a Soviet withdrawal from Europe. You just have an eternal tendency to pick the things which sound good to you and ignore what’s left.
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Brosi says:@Mark Bahner
Poland initially claimed 4 million dead at Auschwitz. Then they reduced the number to 1.5 million. Now you, the holocaust expert extraordinaire, claim 1 million. Where did the other 5 million dead happened. Please provide proof for the existence of their bodies.
Either break down how you come up with “6 million Jews dying in the entire Holocaust represents *all over Europe*” or stop your idiotic quibbling and admit that you are a holocaust denier.
https://codoh.com/library/document/the-four-million-figure-of-auschwitz/en/
1. The Origin of the Propaganda Figure of Four Million
The propaganda story of the alleged four million Auschwitz victims appeared first in the Pravda of May 7, 1945, as is generally known, and it received its official blessing at the Nuremberg trial during the court session on February 19, 1946, thanks to the Soviet prosecutor Smirnow.[4] But far less known is the origin of this story.
4. The Consequences of Giving Up the Propaganda Figure of Four Million
Whoever thinks that the propaganda figure of four million can be dropped without punishment deceives himself completely. This figure is closely connected with the thesis of mass extermination in Auschwitz and cannot be thrown overboard without bringing the whole artificial building into sway. Regardless of the futile efforts of Jean-Claude Pressac to prove this thesis of mass extermination by documents, it is up to this day based exclusively on statements of alleged eye witnesses, and Pressac himself had to make use of those when he tried to describe the first alleged homicidal gassing in crematorium II of Birkenau.[37]As already said, the witness testimonies and the four million figure were intimately woven together right from the start, in a way that the refutation of the witness testimonies would have been equivalent to a refutation of this figure and vice versa; at the same time, the entire thesis of mass extermination in Auschwitz would become untenable.
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Brosi says:@Patrick McNally
More useless word salad from ((McNally)).
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Mark Bahner says:@Truth Vigilante
STEP 1: I suggest you immediately read Chapter 8 of John Wear’s brilliant book – click on the link below:
OK, I’ve read it. It’s not very good at all.
John Wear starts with:
Despite the extensive attention given to the event, revisionist historians have called into question many aspects of the Holocaust story. In particular, it has been shown that: 1) there were no homicidal gas chambers in any of the German concentration camps;
That is utter nonsense, refuted by mountains of evidence. There is irrefutable evidence that there were seven homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau, and irrefutable evidence that the four gas chambers at Birkenau, associated with Crematoriums II, III, IV, and V were used to murder hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians…particularly children, old women, and old men.
John Wear continues:
In every murder trial the prosecution has the burden of proof to show the cause of death. Scientific evidence is usually the most convincing evidence to show the cause of death because scientific evidence can be verified in an objective manner.
I’m not a lawyer, but John Wear is completely neglecting one of the most powerful types of evidence in trials. In fact, it’s probably considered the most important evidence in a trial: a confession, or testimony provided “against interest.” That is precisely why the U.S. has the 5th Amendment of the Constitution, to allow people not to be forced to confess to an alleged crime.
In the case of the homicidal gas chambers of Auschwitz-Birkenau, we have the affidavits and testimony of Rudolf Hoess that over a million people were murdered at Auschwitz-Birkenau using Zyklon-B gas. His affidavits and testimony are supported by the construction and demolition of the four gas chambers and crematoriums (II, III, IV, and V) at Auschwitz-Birkenau. Those four gas chambers operated from the spring of 1943 until they were *destroyed by the Nazis* in November 1944.
John Wear mentions *none* of this in his chapter that asserts there were “no homicidal gas chambers in any of the German concentration camps.” He doesn’t mention the affidavits and testimony of Hoess. (Or Hoess’s memoir, which it appears that John Wear may never even have read.) It doesn’t mention the four gas chambers (though actually there were seven…the four gas chambers at Crematoriums II, III, IV, and IV just did most of the homicides).
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Patrick McNally says:@Malla
The order of December 18 was simply a finalization of earlier orders which went back as far as July 31, as described in Halder’s war diary. Hitler was certainly irked by Molotov, but one has to ignore all of the evidence to suggest that he suddenly got the idea to attack the USSR after the November meetings.
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Patrick McNally says:@Malla
> That would be in support of Indian Nationalist leader, Subhash Chandra Bose, to liberate India from British rule.
No doubt. What’s important here, however, is that Hitler instructed that these plans be made because he was confident that the USSR would fall apart swiftly. He did not expect to take longer than 3 months.
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Petermx says:@Wizard of Oz
This is conclusive, but you obviously know nothing about it. Auschwitz commandant Höss was beaten and tortured for days, like the other prisoners. Jews were prominent among the torturers. If these facts are hidden and lied about, nothing makes sense because the authorities at Auschwitz lowered their figure of the number of deaths at Auschwitz from 2.5 million people to 1.5 million people in the early 1990s. For years, the victors publicized Höss’s confession that he murdered 2.5 million people at Auschwitz, but in the early 1990s, the Auschwitz authorities said only 1.5 million people died at Auschwitz. Actually, they lowered that figure even further later on. But Höss’s figure was problematic for other people, who knew it was outlandish long before the liars lowered their original figure. When Eichmann was writing his memoirs in the late 1950s, he was confused at how Höss could claim to have murdered so many people when he knew better. Well, in the mid-1980s, it came out when the British Jew in charge of torturing Höss and having him sign the confessions they wrote out for him boasted about what he did to an author who was happy to write about it in his book, a book that apparently you and Mark Bahner have never heard of.
The testimony of the key witness at Nuremberg, whose testimony of murdering millions of people in a camp shaped the story of World War II, is now known to be false and exposes the Nuremberg Trials as show trials with defendants tortured and then forced to sign outlandish confessions, but you apparently know nothing about this, and hardly anyone else knows either. Publicizing these facts would expose the Nuremberg Trials as one of the biggest lies ever told, so you have to read about it here in my comment. Read what I posted below from the now deceased historian Robert Faurisson’s website.
Robert Faurisson writes:
The revisionists proved long ago that the various confessions of Rudolf Höss presented so many gross errors, nonsensical elements and impossibilities of all kinds that it was no longer possible to lend them the credence that the judges at Nuremberg and Cracow – as well as some casual historians – had, without prior analysis of their content or the circumstances in which they had been obtained, lent them.
In all likelihood Höss had been tortured by the British of the 92nd Field Security Section. But a confirmation of that hypothesis was needed. Confirmation was to come with the publication of a book containing the name of the main torturer (a British sergeant of Jewish origin) and describing the circumstances both of Höss’s arrest and of his third-degree interrogation.
The book is by Rupert Butler. It was published in 1983 (Hamlyn Paperbacks, Feltham, England). Butler is the author of three other works: The Black Angels, Hand of Steel and Gestapo, all from the same publisher. What interests us here is his Legions of Death. Its inspiration is anti-Nazi. Butler says he did his research for it at the Imperial War Museum, the Institute of Contemporary History (Wiener Library) and other equally prestigious institutions. At the start of this book he expresses gratitude to these institutions and, moreover, to two persons, one of whom is a “Jew” called Bernard Clarke, “who captured Auschwitz Commandant Rudolf Höss”, and of whom he quotes some fragments of writings or recorded speech.
Bernard Clarke feels no remorse but, on the contrary, rather a certain pride in having tortured a “Nazi”. Nor does Rupert Butler, for his part, see anything wrong in that. Neither of the two gauges the import of their revelation. They say that Höss was arrested on March 11, 1946 and that three days of torture were needed to obtain “a coherent statement”. They seem not to realise that this alleged “coherent statement” is nothing but a truly mad confession, signed by the gasping torture victim on the 14th or 15th of March 1946 at 2.30 in the morning, a statement which was to seal his fate definitively and mark forever the history of the myth of Auschwitz, the alleged grand centre for the extermination of the Jews especially by means of alleged homicidal gas chambers.
On March 11, 1946 Clarke and five other intelligence agents in British uniform, for the most part tall and threatening-looking, entered the home of Mrs Höss and her children. The six men, we are told, were all “practised in the more sophisticated techniques of sustained and merciless investigation”. Clarke started shouting:
If you don’t tell us [where your husband is] we’ll turn you over to the Russians and they’ll put you before a firing-squad. Your son will go to Siberia [5].
Mrs Höss broke down and disclosed, says Clarke, the location of the farm where her husband was hiding, as well as his assumed name: Franz Lang. Clarke adds:
Suitable intimidation of the son and daughter produced precisely identical information.
The Jewish sergeant and the five other specialists in third degree interrogation then departed in search of Höss, whom they surprised at the farm in the middle of the night, lying in a corner of the room used as an abattoir.
Höss screamed in terror at the mere sight of British uniforms.
Clarke yelled “What is your name?”
With each answer of “Franz Lang”, Clarke’s hand crashed into the face of his prisoner.
The fourth time that happened, Höss broke and admitted who he was.
The admission suddenly unleashed the loathing of the Jewish sergeants in the arresting party whose parents had died in Auschwitz following an order signed by Höss.
The prisoner was torn from the top bunk, the pyjamas ripped from his body. He was then dragged naked to one of the slaughter tables, where it seemed to Clarke the blows and screams were endless.
Eventually, the Medical Officer urged the Captain: “Call them off, unless you want to take back a corpse.”
A blanket was thrown over Höss and he was dragged to Clarke’s car, where the sergeant poured a substantial slug of whisky down his throat. Then Höss tried to sleep.
Clarke thrust his service stick under the man’s eyelids and ordered in German: “Keep your pig eyes open, you swine.”
For the first time Höss trotted out his oft-repeated justification: “I took my orders from Himmler. I am a soldier in the same way as you are a soldier and we had to obey orders.”
The party arrived back at Heide around three in the morning. The snow was swirling still, but the blanket was torn from Höss and he was made to walk completely nude through the prison yard to his cell.
https://robert-faurisson.com/history/confessions-of-rudolf-hoss/
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Patrick McNally says:@Brosi
To give an example of useless word-salad that has been on this board lately, you keep bringing up the “4 million” number. Authors such as Gerald Reitlinger and Raul Hilberg had thrown that number out as early as 1953. They always claimed the number of “1 million” for Auschwitz. Now I personally think that that number is probably greatly inflated. But it means nothing to go on about the “4 million” figure which was maintained within the Warsaw Pact until the late 1980s. If you wish to debunk the orthodox Holocaust historiography as it has existed in the West for the last 7 decades or so, then you need to focus on what authors in the West have actually said. Nothing produced in the Soviet bloc prior to 1989 is really all that relevant.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Brosi
Brosi,
6 million Jews have been purged from 6 million land masses all over the planet, every year, for the last 6 million years.
If I have told you once, I have told you 6 million times.
Snap out of it already!
I think the Babylonian Talmud says exactly that as well. Maybe. I haven’t read all 6 million pages.
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Petermx says:@Wizard of Oz
So, then you claim to think the prosecutors and judges at Nuremberg didn’t know Hoess and other prisoners were tortured and beaten. What do you think they thought when they saw the “confession” was extracted at 2:30 am. Maybe the soldiers were just working overtime?
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Well, in point of fact, eyewitness testimony is often considered the least reliable with regard to legal testimony.
People lie. Their memories fail. They “look” after hearing a crash or explosion. They advocate for a specific side. They are bribed. It goes on and on. But, sometimes they are accurate, but not necessarily about everything.
Scientific evidence is usually more reliable. If one million were killed, and their skeletons were not found, where are their remains? If we assert they were cremated after death, where is the voluminous pile of ashes? If the ashes were thrown to the wind, or dumped in the sea, then we have to determine the validity of incinerating a million corpses. How long would it take to transport and burn one million corpses to ash? I think those calculations have been done, and it’s not possible to do so in the amount of time suggested. I’m sure someone here knows the estimates off the top of their head; I don’t, and would need to dig around and find the reports. If I am not mistaken, the calculations were made by a modern crematory expert, who had no dog in the Holocaust hunt.
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Petermx says:@Wizard of Oz
Do you know anything at all about the subject? You certainly have a big mouth. In the early 1990s the authorities at Auschwitz tore down the memorial sign that had stood there for about 40 years that claimed four million people were murdered at the camp and replaced it with a new sign claiming 1.5 million people were murdered. When they replaced the figure of 4 million with 1.5 million, they admitted they lied, but they’re still lying, because they have no evidence to support 1.5 million either. In fact, the Auschwitz books that the USSR captured and turned over to the Poles in the early 1990s have a figure below 100,000 deaths, and those deaths are not by murder.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “I don’t want to discuss any place but Auschwitz-Birkenau, until I can convince you that you are ridiculously wrong about Auschwitz-Birkenau.”
My response: If you want to learn more about Auschwitz-Birkenau from a world-class expert on the subject, I recommend that you read Germar Rudolf. The following is an email I received this morning about Rudolf’s current predicament. https://castlehill.shop/2023/06/25/have-you-ever-wondered-what-the-world-would-be-like-without-us/
A book Germar Rudolf recently updated is his 2023 4th edition of “Lectures on the Holocaust.” You might want to start with this book if you have an interest. Pages 176 through 256 of this book deal exclusively with Auschwitz-Birkenau.
You ask: “Speaking of which, why do you think the Nazis installed the four large gas chambers and crematoria at Birkenau in 1943?”
My response: There were no homicidal gas chambers at Birkenau. The short answer as to why they built the crematoria is that there was a typhus epidemic at Auschwitz-Birkenau. The typhus epidemic at Auschwitz-Birkenau has been acknowledged by virtually all historians.
You ask: “And why do you think they destroyed the four large gas chambers and crematoria in November 1944?”
My response: As previously stated, there were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau. There were morgues instead of homicidal gas chambers that were destroyed by the Germans.
It should be noted that when the Red Army captured the Auschwitz Camp on January 27, 1945, the entire files of the Central Construction Office fell into their hands. These documents were not destroyed by the Germans, and were carted off to Moscow and stored in archives which were only opened to the public after the collapse of the Soviet Union. (Source: Rudolf, Germar, Lectures on the Holocaust, Bargoed, UK: Castle Hill Publishers, 2023, pp. 236-237).
As to why the Germans destroyed the morgues and crematoria at Birkenau, Germar Rudolf writes:
“Majdanek was the first concentration camp which was occupied by the Red Army in summer 1944. The press frenzy was accordingly huge, because in Majdanek they found cremation furnaces, delousing chambers, cans of Zyklon B, as well as the huge pile of shoes about which I spoke at the beginning of this book. Although all of these objects had life-saving functions–except for the shoes, of course–Soviet propaganda turned them into their opposite. A particularly horrible picture of the Majdanek cremation furnaces did the rounds.” (Source: Ibid., p. 295).
Rudolf concludes:
“The destruction of the crematories at Auschwitz by the Germans before their retreat, by the way, may have been done as a result of this picture and similar Soviet propaganda photos, because no one in Germany wanted to see more of such photos appearing.” (Source: Ibid.).
You ask: “Also, if the gas chambers at crematoria II, III, IV, and V in Birkenau (Auschwitz II) were for delousing clothes then why the hell did the Nazis put four crematoriums right next to the four gas chambers?”
My response: The delousing chambers were located in separate buildings a considerable distance from the crematoria. To the best of my knowledge, the delousing chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau were not blown up.
You ask: “Were they planning to de-louse the clothes, and then burn the clothes?”
My response: No.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “John Wear mentions *none* of this in his chapter that asserts there were “no homicidal gas chambers in any of the German concentration camps.” He doesn’t mention the affidavits and testimony of Hoess.”
My response: Actually, I do mention Rudolf Höss in Chapter 8 on pages 362-363 of my book “Germany’s War.” I write:
“Allied prosecutors also used torture to help convict the defendants at Nuremberg and other postwar trials. A leading example of the use of torture to obtain evidence at the Nuremberg trials is the confession of Rudolf Höss, who was a former commandant at Auschwitz. Höss’s testimony at the Nuremberg trial was probably the most important and striking evidence presented there of a German extermination program. Höss said that more than two and a half million people were exterminated in the Auschwitz gas chambers, and that another 500,000 inmates had died there of other causes. (Source: Taylor, Telford, The Anatomy of the Nuremberg Trials: A Personal Memoir, New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 1992, p. 363). No defender of the Holocaust story today accepts these inflated figures, and other key portions of Höss’s testimony at Nuremberg are widely acknowledged to be untrue.
In 1983 the anti-Nazi book Legions of Death by Rupert Butler showed that Sgt. Bernard Clarke and other British officers tortured Rudolf Höss into making his confession. The torture of Höss was exceptionally brutal. Neither Bernard Clarke nor Rupert Butler finds anything wrong or immoral in the torture of Höss. Neither of them seems to understand the importance of their revelations. Bernard Clarke and Rupert Butler prove that Höss’s testimony at Nuremberg was obtained by torture, and is therefore not credible evidence in proving a program of German genocide against European Jewry.” (Source: Faurisson, Robert, “How the British Obtained the Confessions of Rudolf Höss,” The Journal of Historical Review, Vol. 7, No. 4, Winter 1986-87, pp. 392-399).
I have since written an article documenting in more detail the life of Rudolf Höss. You can read this article at http://www.wearswar.com/2022/05/30/rudolf-hoss-tortured-into-making-his-confessions/.
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soll says:@Brosi
LOL. So you are claiming that 6 million Jews were gassed and creamed along with 5 million non Jews, and that 1.5 million Jews were murdered by “white Nazis” before the war started.
Your not reading what you’re responding too, your arguing against your own phantoms.
My response was on pogroms against the Jews from the late 1880s into the early 1900s and through their peak during the Russian Civil War, 1918-1921 and your mindlessly stuck chasing shadows wholly lost in the 1930s.
So triggered by even reference of the White Army has you believing that I am referring to the supposed, “White Nazis” who wasn’t around, neither was your favourite house painter.
There is only one logical explanation here: Jews are like Zombies. They like eating brains of Goyim, and they especially like eating their children. That is why Jews never die, even if you kill 7.5 million of them
If you were using logic you’ll not be invoking the Jews as supposed Zombies. Ironically how you dehumanize the Jews as subhuman, while ranting how they are overly-oppressing you. For anyone interest in such ‘thinking’ see, ‘Making Monsters: The Uncanny Power of Dehumanization’ by David Livingstone Smith (Harvard, 2021)
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anarchyst says:@Mark Bahner
You claim to be an engineer. I don’t believe you.
Your claim is laughable and is false on its face. If you ARE an “environmental engineer” how many trees or bunnies have you hugged?
I have been engineering electrical and mechanical systems and subsystems all of my life WITHOUT state “permission” as the types of systems I design need no state permission. I don’t have an engineering “degree” but have been quite successful in my work life.
There were much better execution agents than Zyklon B.
Fred Leuchter designed and engineered execution equipment for both federal and state government penal facilities.
One does not have to have a state engineering “license” to engineer machinery.
You should know that.
State mandated “professional engineer” licenses are strictly for architectural, civil and other stationary building systems (electrical, mechanical, etc.), not for machinery.
Fred Leuchter lost his livelihood as all of his federal and state contracts were terminated after he went to Auschwitz and PROVED the “gas chamber fraud”.
Fred Leuchter was prosecuted by the state of Massachusetts for “practicing engineering without a license” although no license is required for engineering machinery. This was selective and vindictive prosecution because he dared to go against the jews and expose the TRUTH about the holocaust.
All holocaust claims can easily be disproven by utilizing basic scientific and logistical principles. If jews were being gassed and cremated, the operations would have been still going on in the 1950s. It is statistically impossible to gas and cremate people in the time frame of the so-called “holocaust”.
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Brad Anbro says:@Mark Bahner
Quote:
“I’m an absolute bloodhound sniffing out truth. I will spend a ridiculous amount of time and effort both to find out what correct answers are, and to make sure I clearly and precisely state what the correct answers are.”
If that is actually the case with you, I suggest that you spend some time investigating THE TRUTH of the events of September 11, 2001.
Just an idea…
Thank you.
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Mark Bahner says:@Tiptoethrutulips
Well, in point of fact, eyewitness testimony is often considered the least reliable with regard to legal testimony.
Well, in point of fact, this is not “eyewitness testimony.” This was a perpetrator describing his own actions.
Scientific evidence is usually more reliable. If one million were killed, and their skeletons were not found, where are their remains?
You don’t seem to be aware of the situation. John Wear is claiming that not a single person was murdered with Zyklon-B at Auschwitz-Birkenau. He has in fact been making this claim for more than a decade. In constrast, the book “Commandant of Auschwitz,” published nearly 40 years ago in 1985, contains pages 29 to 181 that were hand-written *by* Rudolph Hoess himself, and translated into English.
Just a few quotes from Rudolf Hoess show John Wear has been wrong all these years:
By the will of the Reichsfuhrer SS, Auschwitz became the greatest human extermination centre of all time.
When in the summer of 1941 he himself gave me the order to prepare installations at Auschwitz where mass exterminations would take place, and personally to carry out these exterminations, I did not have the slightest idea of their scale or consequences. It was certainly an extraordinary and monstrous order. Nevertheless, the reasons behind the extermination programme seemed to me right. I did not reflect on it at the time: I had been given an order, and I had to carry it out. Whether the extermination of the Jews was necessary or not was something on which I could not allow myself to form an opinion, for I lacked the necessary breadth of view. (page 144)
When I was away on duty, my deputy, Fritzsch, the commander of the protective custody camp, first tried gas for these killings. It was a preparation of prussic acid, called Zyklon B, which was used in the camp as an insecticide and of which there was always a stock on hand. On my return, Fritzsch reported this to me, and the gas was again used for the next transport.
The gassing was carried out in the detention cells of Block 11. Protected by a gas mask, I watched the killing myself. In the crowded cells death came instantaneously the moment the Zyklon B was thrown in. A short, almost smothered cry, and it was all over. During the first gassing of people, I did not fully realize what was happening, perhaps because I was too impressed by the whole procedure. I have a clearer recollection of the gassing of 900 Russians which took place shortly afterwards in the old crematorium, since the use of Block 11 for this purpose caused too much trouble. While the transport was detraining, holes were pierced in the earth and concrete ceiling of the mortuary. The Russians were told to undress in the anteroom, they then quietly entered the mortuary, for they had been told they were to be deloused. The whole transport exactly filled the mortuary to capacity. The doors were then sealed and the gas shaken down through the holes in the roof. I do not know how long this killing took. For a while a humming sound could be heard. When the powder was thrown in, there were cries of “Gas!”, then a great bellowing, then the prisoners hurled themselves against the doors. But the doors held. They were opened several hours later, so that the place might be aired. It was then that I saw, for the first time, gassed bodies in the mass. (pages 146 and 147)
In the spring of 1942 the first transports of Jews, all earmarked for mass extermination, arrived from Upper Silesia. (page 148)
I noticed that women who either guessed or knew what awaited them had the courage to joke with the children to encourage them, despite the mortal terror visible in their own eyes. (page 149).
From time to time women would suddenly give the most terrible shrieks while undressing, or tear their hair, or scream like maniacs. These were immediately led away behind the building and shot with a small-calibre weapon.
It sometime happened that, as the men of the Special Detachment left the gas chamber, the women would suddenly realise what was happening, and would call down every imaginable curse upon our heads.
I remember, too, a woman who tried to throw her children out of the gas chamber, just as the door was closing. Weeping she called out, “At least let my precious children live.” (p 150)
I had to see everything. I had to watch hour after hour, by day and by night, the removal and burning of bodies, the extraction of the teeth, the cutting of the hair, the whole grisly, interminable business. I had to stand for hours in the ghastly stench, while mass graves were being opened and the bodies dragged out and burned.
I had to look through the people-hole of the gas chambers and watch the process of death itself, because the doctors wanted me to see it. (page 154)
I could probably fill several more *feet* of column space from the written memoirs of Rudolf Hoess. These writing make it absolutely clear that massive numbers of prisoners were murdered with Zyklon B at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
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Mefobills says:
I could probably fill several more *feet* of column space from the written memoirs of Rudolf Hoess. These writing make it absolutely clear that massive numbers of prisoners were murdered with Zyklon B at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
How many feet deep did they bury the ashes from the homicidal gas chambers?
How many feet of shoring lumber was used to dig the trenches for the ashes from the homicidal gas chambers?
How many milions of cubic feet of coke was transported by rail, to then homicidally kill the 6 million bodies?
How many millions of cubic feet of gas and soot was detected by allied photography, as they overflew the homicidal death camp?
How many of the millions of cubic feet of bodies have the tell-tale red color of being homicidally zyclon gassed in the homicidal gas chambers?
How many linear feet of photographs are there of functioning homicidal gas chambers, so equipped to homicide 6 million jews?
How many linear feet of diary entries, of random parties, are there about the construction and operation of the homicidal gas chambers?
I’m sure you could fill many balloons full of cubic feet, of hot air.
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Fred762 says:
Read yr column in recent lewrockwell.com. Add this truism to yer content: my late dadinlaw. told me this in 1976 wen I got out of USN : he was a colonel in air corps in WW2: a flight surgeon w bomber group in pacific from may 1942-45 . Mid May ’42 he said his pilots came to him crying w rage bks DC had just put off limits to US bombing all 3 mjr refineries, captured INTACT by JAPS since 12/7/1941,…..BP and Shell in Singapore and Std Oil up in…Hanoi!! He ssid the pilots told him they cud end Pacific war in 6 weeks (by July 1942)if they cud bomb those refineries and shut off Nip fuel!!!! He said they never hit permission to bomb. Btw the ESSO refinery at Hanoi was still off limits til summer 1972…reason why WE cud not bomb Hanoi??? True tale. He died in 1983 without ever talking another word re WW2
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “John Wear is claiming that not a single person was murdered with Zyklon-B at Auschwitz-Birkenau. He has in fact been making this claim for more than a decade. In contrast, the book “Commandant of Auschwitz,” published nearly 40 years ago in 1985, contains pages 29 to 181 that were hand-written *by* Rudolph Hoess himself, and translated into English.”
My response: Rudolf Höss had been brutally tortured and was a totally broken man when he wrote his memoirs. Memoirs and confessions written by people who have been brutally tortured lose credibility.
Moritz von Schirmeister, a former associate of Joseph Goebbels, confirmed that Höss’s confession was obtained by torture. At Nuremberg, von Schirmeister sat in the backseat of a car together with Höss, with whom he could speak freely during transit. He remembered Höss’s following statement:
“On the things he is accused of, he told me: ‘Certainly, I signed a statement that I killed two and a half million Jews. But I could just as well have said that it was five million Jews. There are certain methods by which any confession can be obtained, whether it is true or not.’” (Source: Mattogno, Carlo, Commandant of Auschwitz: Rudolf Höss, His Torture and His Forced Confessions, Uckfield, UK: Castle Hill Publishers, 2017, p. 16).
British Pvt. Ken Jones confirmed that the British used sleep deprivation to break Höss. Jones stated:
“We sat in the cell with him, night and day, armed with axe handles. Our job was to prod him every time he fell asleep to help break down his resistance. When Höss was taken out for exercise, he was made to wear only jeans and a thin cotton shirt in the bitter cold. After three days and nights without sleep, Höss finally broke down and made a full confession to the authorities.” (Source: Ibid., pp. 16-17).
Even British officers have confirmed that Höss had been brutally tortured.
In 1983, the anti-National Socialist book “Legions of Death” by Rupert Butler documented that Sgt. Bernard Clarke and other British officers tortured Rudolf Höss into making his confession. The torture of Höss was exceptionally brutal. Neither Bernard Clarke nor Rupert Butler finds anything wrong or immoral in the torture of Höss. Neither of them seems to understand the importance of their revelations. Bernard Clarke and Rupert Butler prove that Höss’s confession was obtained by torture. (Source: Faurisson, Robert, “How the British Obtained the Confessions of Rudolf Höss,” The Journal of Historical Review, Vol. 7, No. 4, Winter 1986-87, pp. 392-399).
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Brosi says:@Mefobills
Yup, this Bahner is a real piece of work. He demands to be judge and jury and if someone at UR doesn’t disprove his idiotic talmudic assertions then Germany will just have to pay reparations for another gorrillion years.
This Codoh document by Carlo Mattogno shows how only a complete moronlike Bahner could believe the Hoess “confession”, let alone assert that it wasn’t coerced:
https://codoh.com/library/document/commandant-of-auschwitz/en/#
This one proves that the “gas chambers” were no such thing and were for storing dead bodies before cremation:
https://codoh.com/library/document/crematoriums-ii-and-iii-of-birkenau/en/
This document shows how the US was using Zyklon-B in Mexico
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Brosi says:@Patrick McNally
By all means show us your brilliant arithmetic that uses a judaically cast in concrete 1 million dead Jews at Auschwitz and adds up to the holy holocaust number of 6 million dead Jews between January 1942 and May 1945. I’ll even give you a 5% fudge factor. It must be > 5,700,000 and < 6,300,000.
Bonus points will be awarded for any proof of your figures.
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Petermx says:@Petermx
I wrote in comment 1175 “the authorities at Auschwitz lowered their figure of the number of deaths at Auschwitz from 2.5 million people to 1.5 million people in the early 1990s.” That is wrong. I worded the sentence incorrectly. It should say “the authorities at Auschwitz lowered their figure of the number of deaths at Auschwitz by 2.5 million people, from 4 million to 1.5 million people in the early 1990s.”
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Wizard of Oz says:@Mefobills
oAre you implicitly claiming scientific knowledge? Evidently yes. So please help with the ingredients. Assume those alleged to be gassed weighed on average 80 pounds. What would be the weight of ash left after incineration? And how much space would o
it occupy?And how much coal fuel would be required in average to burn as well as the dozens of human bodies to generate the heat to reduce the bodies to ashes?]
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Truth Vigilante says:@Carolyn Yeager
I don’t know that I’ve ever encountered on the Internet someone as stupid as he is.
Did you read that UR readers ?
As much as the Yeager woman has heaped vitriol on the rest of you, she has singled me out as the most stupid of all – on the entire internet.Well Carolyn, I thank you for bestowing that honour on lil’ ol’ me. That’s very thoughtful of you.
As for this remark of yours:
… and he still hasn’t thrown in the towel
I intend throwing the towel shortly – on to your head.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Petermx
Unfortunately yet another UR commenter proves is uneducated obsessional status bulit without even the intelligence (or moral upbrinhing) to grasp the distinction between being wrong and lying.
Moreover
In fact, the Auschwitz books that the USSR captured and turned over to the Poles in the early 1990s have a figure below 100,000 deaths, and those deaths are not by murder.
just won’t wash as bland assertion of something so important – indeed critical to tour case – without your identifying sources so they can be checked and spelled out in detail. Not eve from an Ivy League Em Prof of fame and standing. So don’t expect us to accept your ipse dixit.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Mark Bahner
In relation to my suggestion you read Chapter 8 of John Wear’s book ‘Germany’s War’, you said:
‘OK, I’ve read it. It’s not very good at all’.I suspect you didn’t read it in its entirety and just skipped through it, and/or ignored the salient bits. ie: stuff like this:
The ICRC (International Committee of the Red Cross) visited and inspected all of the major concentration [work] camps right up to the end of the war.
In response to a U.S State Dept request, the ICRC replied in a formal letter to the State Dept dated Nov. 22, 1944, that the ICRC found NO EVIDENCE OF MASS MURDER of concentration camp inmates.Got that Bahner ?
The ICRC consisted of impartial observers that were not beholden to one side or the other. And they saw NOTHING to suggest mass murder of any description, let alone of gas chambers – and FOR SURE they would have interviewed and spoken to the actual inmates of Auschwitz-Birkenau (out of ear shot of the Germans) and asked them if they were being ill treated.
And bear in mind that this verdict was not based on a single trip to each of the camps.
The ICRC made MULTIPLE INSPECTION VISITS to each of the camps.What the ICRC saw were inmates playing in the orchestra, swimming in the camp pool – hardly an environment where mass murder was taking place.
Somehow the ICRC couldn’t find a SINGLE one of those alleged ‘seven homicidal gas chambers’ you claim existed.
And it’s obvious why they couldn’t detect a single one – because THEY NEVER EFF’N EXISTED.
I’ve posted the following short video in UR before, but people like you Bahner are in desperate need of being enlightened as to what really went on at those camps (start watching at around the 3:00 min mark of this video from BitChute titled ‘Holocaust Hoax for Kids!’):
SUMMARY: It is you and your small hat ilk Bahner, that are claiming these gas chambers existed.
Therefore the onus is on YOU to prove it.
WHERE are the photos of them ?
WHERE are the blueprints for their construction ?Surely, from your ‘mountains of evidence’, you would be able to dig out said proof if it actually existed.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Petermx
So Hoess was tortured. Significantly, nothing you say gives the slightest reason to believe that Hoess’s final version was not approximately accurate though it does justify close examination of the evidence and keeping an eye out for more.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
It MATTERS NOT the nature of the witness testimony. A witness can/will lie for a myriad of reasons. People confess to things they did not do all the time. There have been multiple law suits or controversies, of various nature, with witnesses alleging their “confessions” were coerced. Every lawyer who has ever taken fifteen to twenty minutes, at least, to review protocol for process, knows the Nuremberg trials were a farce. Are you seriously suggesting EVERYONE tells the truth? I’m waiting for your thoughts on “apple man.”
There you go again…OH! The Humanity! I know what Mr.Wear asserts. I know what you assert. And, I know what Jews have been saying about the fate of 6 million since long before WW2.
So, Hoess used a gas mask, to observe, but the Jews, assigned with the removal task, were made to enter the chamber with their hooks in hand, but no masks, yet they were unharmed. Do you have any thoughts on those high speed conveyer belts used to whisk the bodies off to the ovens (were there 4?), or was my flinging hypothesis correct? I hear the flux capacitors for those belts were always malfunctioning.
But, it does make sense that Hoess wore a mask as the chambers were NOT sealed. I wonder why his memory failed regarding the length of time needed to finish fumigation. Perhaps a few of his marbles had been flung to the floor, and rolled out the door…when he sneezed.
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Brad Anbro says:@Truth Vigilante
T-V,
From what you have probably seen on the news, it looks as though our free speech rights here in the USA might be coming to an end. I will not use an “alias” though, because the government has the ability to monitor every computer & cell phone and also knows the IP address of each device. You have probably heard of the “fusion centers” that have been installed around the country. “They” say that the purpose of these is to track “terrorists” but the real reason is so that they can SPY on Americans who disagree with anything that our government says or does.
In addition to the fusion centers, they have installed cameras on all of the interstate highways, at least the ones that I have driven on, for real-time tracking of every vehicle. There is absolutely NO “privacy” left in the USA and if anyone thinks otherwise, they are sadly mistaken.
I imagine that every keystroke on my computer is monitored, as well as every phone call I make and every text message that I send.
RE: Brother Nathanael, I have watched him for quite some time and have donated money to his efforts. There are only two other religious leaders here in the USA, that I know of, who dare to speak the truth about things. The first is Chuck Baldwin, of Kalispell, Montana. He has a non-denominational, Bible- and Constitutional-believing church and has NO 501(c)(3) IRS tax exemption. The other one is Louis Farrakhan, of Chicago, Illinois, of the Black Muslims. Farrakhan does not hesitate to tell the truth about the U.S. government and the various “groups” which are seeking to undermine our constitutional form of government here in the USA.
As far as “terrorism” is concerned, I firmly believe that 99% of the “terrorism” that occurs in the USA is “manufactured terrorism” by the various government agencies. I was very surprised that my name was not on the government’s “no-fly list” and that I was allowed to travel to Sweden in the fall of 2019. But I do imagine that my name is on quite a few “lists” and that I am grouped with “the troublemakers.”
Hej då!
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Oh, I’m sorry, Mark, I failed to mention, I watched Sophie’s Choice, too. So, I know exactly what happened at Auschwitz.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Brad Anbro
On that note, Mr. Anbro, I rescued a large, aged German Shepherd, in early 2010. I posted on an open Facebook pet rescue forum, but provided NO personal info whatsoever. The next morning, at 8am, the police were at my door; the dog was a retired drug sniffing border patrol police dog. So, they knew my name and address from an anonymous post.
With satellites and smart/electronic devices, we are always under supervision. The fuzz busting industry is going to have to step up their game.
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
My response: Rudolf Höss had been brutally tortured and was a totally broken man when he wrote his memoirs. Memoirs and confessions written by people who have been brutally tortured lose credibility.
My response: Simply go to the website, “How reliable are the Höss memoirs?”:
https://phdn.org/archives/holocaust-history.org/auschwitz/hoess-memoirs/
From that website:
Höss’s most important demographic observation concerns the total number of victims who were murdered at Auschwitz. He gave the total (39) of 1,130,000. Until recently, many disputed estimates of this size. Most studies of Auschwitz gave a number at least twice as high or higher. Even the cover jacket for the edition of the memoirs used for this study places the number murdered at 2 million. However, in 1991 Polish historian and Auschwitz authority, Dr. Franciszek Piper, did the most comprehensive demographic study of the number of deportees to the camp ever undertaken. He began the study in 1980. He found that 1.3 million had been deported to Auschwitz during its 4 1/2 year existence but that only 400,000 had received a registration number. Of those 400,000 only 200,000 had not been killed. All of the unregistered deportees, who cannot be accounted for, were killed. This means that 1.1 million were killed. 49 The United States Holocaust Memorial Museum in Washington D.C. has now accepted this number. 50
Also from that website:
The most significant aspect to Höss’s placing the number at 1.1 million is that this constitutes the definitive proof that Höss could not have been forced to lie in his memoirs. At the time Höss wrote his memoirs the standard figure on the number murdered was 4 million. The Soviets, who had liberated Auschwitz in January 1945, issued a report dated May 6, 1945 where the 4 million number was given. This report was subsequently filed with the International Tribunal at Nuremberg as document USSR-008. Many former prisoners stated that 4 million were killed at Auschwitz. This number was also accepted by the Polish authorities that tried Höss. 51 Yet at the same time these reports were listing four million murdered, Höss repudiated former testimony he had given at the International Military Tribunal, before he was handed over to the Poles, that 2.5 million were killed. He wrote (39): “I regard a total of 2.5 million as far too high. Even Auschwitz had limits to its destructive capacity. Figures given by former prisoners are figments of their imagination and have no basis in fact.”
Conclusion: Höss repudiated his 2.5 million estimate, and lowered his estimate to 1.13 million people.
Repeating from the above:
…in 1991 Polish historian and Auschwitz authority, Dr. Franciszek Piper, did the most comprehensive demographic study of the number of deportees to the camp ever undertaken. He began the study in 1980. He found that 1.3 million had been deported to Auschwitz during its 4 1/2 year existence but that only 400,000 had received a registration number. Of those 400,000 only 200,000 had not been killed. All of the unregistered deportees, who cannot be accounted for, were killed. This means that 1.1 million were killed.
So Rudolph Höss said 1.13 million were killed at Auschwitz. And Dr. Franciszek Piper thinks 1.1 million were killed at Auschwitz. You and Carlo Mattogno and Ron Unz think 150,000 or less died and *no one* was killed by gassing with Zyklon B?
Who do you think is more likely to be correct:
1) Rudolph Höss and Dr. Franciszek Piper, or
2) You, Carlo Mattogno, and Ron Unz?
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Gabreal Jones says:
2 Cole -Stein-Cole vids
Jim Rizoli holohoax exposer shows 25 June 2023 old footage of David Cole on – big guy – Irv Rubin the ADL agent who was set on Cole to beat him up….( or worse ?)
1.00.16 I have a video …of David Cole….
1.o9.15 Now we are going to the interview someone had with Irv Rubin eating in restaurant…before he went to prison & before he was killed ( in prison btw)
The last part of the vid is interesting – especially for me / Cole apparently wrote a book and Jim Rizoli comments 1.19.56 ¨ One thing I must admit about him he is a good writer but he hates us / he kicked us of his tiktok….but David you believe non-sense that Hitler killed millions of people in Treblinka & Sobibor….
Anyway / did not now this part of Cole- Stein- Cole story / but actually I do / “consulting my esp xyz files in 2015 / 2016 ”
(I will leave out describing that part / too weird for words too hard …. but these “Old Freaks” confirm what my encounter with David Steincole contains)
@ Mark Bahner If you so desire I will convey what exactly happened / but this vid in itself proves that this whole synagogue of satan stuff is based on lies / stein cole nidre…../ I suppose you know what Kol Nidre is ?
Bottom line : imv his September 1992 visit to Auschwitz is true after that he became a Cole Stein Cole wigglebutt optima forma / for whatever reasons / steenkool ( pronounce : staincoal) in Dutch means “coal”
CIA O
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Mark Bahner says:@Tiptoethrutulips
You claim to be an engineer. I don’t believe you.
My Master’s thesis in Environmental Engineering (Air Pollution Option) :
https://vtechworks.lib.vt.edu/handle/10919/41469
Assessment of Styrene Emission Controls for the FRP and Boat Building Industries
Evaluation of Pollution Prevention measures to reduce styrene emissions (as opposed to end-of-pipe controls evaluated above)
One of a host of memos reporting research on emissions and control measures for cement kilns:
Nitrogen Oxides (NOx) Emissions Generated from Reheating Flue Gas, if Reheat
Used for Selective Catalytic Reduction (SCR)In my 30+ years as an environmental engineer, mostly working on air pollution issues, I evaluated air pollution emissions and emission reduction measures from industries including: coal- and gas-fired power plants, cement kilns, fiber-reinforced plastics and boat building, secondary and primary aluminum production facilities, primary copper smelters, and others. This included research and analysis performed in offices, laboratory testing, full field testing, and detailed evaluations of production operations in the industries listed above and others.
In summary, I am a retired engineer…and Fred Leuchter is a liar who claims he’s an engineer.
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Mark Bahner says:
You claim to be an engineer. I don’t believe you. Your claim is laughable and is false on its face.
My Master’s thesis for a degree in Environmental Engineering (Air Pollution Option) from Virginia Tech:
https://vtechworks.lib.vt.edu/handle/10919/41469
A reduced-turbulence, reduced-entrainment electrostatic precipitator
This thesis describes testing of an electrostatic precipitator that has a portion of the main precipitator flow drawn through a porous (fabric) collecting surface. Tests investigated effects of flow through the collecting surface (side flow) on precipitator turbulence and particulate removal efficiency. Particulate removal tests were conducted at both ambient temperature and boiler slipstream conditions. Side flow was shown to reduce turbulence in the boundary layers of the collecting plates, but to have no significant effect on turbulence in the main gas stream (beyond the boundary layer). Side flow was shown to create a more uniform horizontal velocity profile within the precipitator. Side flow was shown to have little effect on the reentrainment of single particles, but appears to reduce reentrainment of an established dust layer. Reentrainment was shown to be an important concern primarily for particles greater than three micrometers in diameter. This research strongly indicated the advisability of using two stage electrostatic precipitation for the collection of particles less than three micrometers in size.
A report evaluating use of air pollution controls (rather than pollution prevention measures) to reduce styrene emissions
To provide technical and cost information to companies that might choose emission
controls to reduce styrene emissions, several conventional and novel emission control
technologies that have been used to treat styrene emissions in the United States and abroad and a
few emerging technologies were examined. Control costs for these conventional and novel
technologies were developed and compared for three hypothetical plant sizes.
The results of this cost analysis indicate that increasing styrene concentration (i.e.,
lowering flow rate) of the exhaust streams can significantly reduce cost per ton of styrene
removed for all technologies examined, because capital and operating costs increase with
increasing flow rate. Therefore, a company should evaluate methods to increase concentrations
(i.e., lower flow rates) of the exhaust stream before considering any add-on control devices.
This report also presents air flow management practices and enclosure concepts that could be
used to create a concentrated exhaust stream while maintaining a safe working environment.If you ARE an “environmental engineer” how many trees or bunnies have you hugged?
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
“All of the unregistered deportees, who cannot be accounted for, were killed”
Do you not see the error in just this statement alone? To Wit:
They were not killed; they boarded the Great Flying Yarmulke and were dropped down in the Land of Bilk & Money.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
You have mistaken me for another commenter. I never questioned your credentials. Your sanity, perhaps….
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You ask: “Who do you think is more likely to be correct:
1) Rudolph Höss and Dr. Franciszek Piper, or
2) You, Carlo Mattogno, and Ron Unz?”
My response: Number 2 above.
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Gabreal Jones says:
When the coal is wet the heater will not warm a cold room…
Compact resume of the 2016 esp encounter with David Cole / around that time I still championed Cole´s visit to Auschwitz September 1992…..
Acc. to Eustace Mullins the Holocaust museum in Washington DC is in the direct vicinity of the Fed building where the US money is printed & minted….
The whole process is accompanied by certain kabbalah j. rituals to reinforce the truth (which is in Reality a Lie) of “Holocaustianity….”
I forgot about Cole since mid 2016 / part of this vid about a book he apparently wrote after 2016 confirms what I esp perceived….
( raw esp vision – so not a dream – sketch / Cole had come to Holland for a tv appearance / he stayed in a Marriot Hotel in Rotterdam – the city bombarded by Adolf H. in May 1940 . The tv appearance would have been a giant breakthru in AnneFrankenStein Holland ( the Netherlands) but was cancelled….instead David C. got in satanic mode attempting to hunt me while I was in a bus or train / I had to ward him off of course )
concluZion: his September 1992 Auschwitz expose is 100% true – later he fled back to the s.o.s. nest / thus making himself a piece of zionide shit / his 1992 Auschwitz trip however remains a diamond imv) .
D. I AM . O. N. D. Divinity I AM Opening New Dimensions…..
You ignored the call of your Soul / David C. & thats for sure / u did not take the j. jab….
CIA O
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Mefobills says:@Brosi
There is only one way to shut up the Hasbara-rat trolls.
Ask them repeatedly to show pictures of the homicidal gas chambers.
There aren’t any.
They will scurry around like rats trying to find them, but they don’t exist.
Where are the pictures?
They cannot do pil-pul when you reduce it to something that cannot be hair split any further.
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Mefobills says:@Wizard of Oz
oAre you implicitly claiming scientific knowledge? Evidently yes. So please help with the ingredients. Assume those alleged to be gassed weighed on average 80 pounds. What would be the weight of ash left after incineration? And how much space would o
it occupy?They didn’t weigh 80 pounds until after the American bombing campaign. The skeleton figures are consistent with about 3 months of starvation, as food was no longer available due to general chaos and civilizational break-down.
In war time, labor is a precious commodity, which is why the camp inmates were used to make war material.
Hasbara rat trolls have the assumption that the German people suddenly went crazy. They were scientifically advanced, had high civilization, and were simultaneously crazy. LoL.
Do you own calculations. It takes quite a bit of energy to incinerate a body, especially six million bodies. Six million times any number is still a large number.
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Mark Bahner says:@Tiptoethrutulips
You have mistaken me for another commenter. I never questioned your credentials.
Oops. I have literally 50+ tabs open at a typical time, including multiple tabs related to “Everything you know about WWII is wrong”.
I was responding to “anarchyst” in comment #1184, who wrote to me:
You claim to be an engineer. I don’t believe you.
Your claim is laughable and is false on its face. If you ARE an “environmental engineer” how many trees or bunnies have you hugged?Sorry about the mistake.
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Brosi says:@Mefobills
They are getting paid shekels for each word, so they will just keep lying and deflecting until kingdom come.
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Mark Bahner says:@Mefobills
Ask them repeatedly to show pictures of the homicidal gas chambers.
Gas chambers of Majdanek:
Gas chamber (originally called Krematorium 1) at the original Auschwitz I camp.
https://www.auschwitz.org/en/visiting/permanent-exhibition/gas-chamber-i/
Blown up Krematorium II gas chamber at Auschwitz-Birkenau:
Krematorium III gas chamber at Auschwitz-Birkenau in June 1943:
https://www.facebook.com/auschwitzmemorial/photos/a.10150892453251097/10158299187246097/?type=3
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Patrick McNally says:@Brosi
I have no reason to seek to uphold the fabled 6 million. As far as I can see the number of excess Jewish deaths during World War II was somewhere between 2 and 3 million, probably closer (but greater than) 2. Maybe 2.25 million or so.
Whatever the truth there may be, that is obviously irrelevant to claims that Hitler was averting an impending invasion of Europe by Stalin. Or to assertions that the Whites were defeated in the Russian Civil War by the Bolsheviks because of some global Jewish conspiracy. Or a host of other ridiculous claims that get bounced around here.
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
Correct me if you disagree with this statement:
In May and June of 1944, more than 400,000 Hungarian Jews were deported to Auschwitz-Birkenau.
???
If you agree with that statement, how many does Carlo Mattogno think died in gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau?
And if you agree with that statement, how many do *you* think died in gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau?
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Mark Bahner says:@Tiptoethrutulips
They were not killed; they boarded the Great Flying Yarmulke and were dropped down in the Land of Bilk & Money.
• LOL: Brosi
Y’all think murdering thousands of people in gas chambers is funny?
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Wizard of Oz says:@Mefobills
You have just proved that your expressions of opinion are a waste of time to read Indeed your only potentially relevant response this time is a ridiculous diversion and distraction about 80 pounds. Have you forgotten that children and wizened old people were the ones daud to be gassed?
Another obfuscatory diversion is to quote the sacred 6 million figure. Who is saying anything about 6 million?
Right up there for intellectual delinquency and contempt for your readers is your “assumption that the German people [sic] suddenly went crazy” when the problem of actual positive decisions lay with parts of the Nazi Party like the SS.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “Correct me if you disagree with this statement: In May and June of 1944, more than 400,000 Hungarian Jews were deported to Auschwitz-Birkenau.”
My response: That is a reasonable ballpark estimate.
You ask: “If you agree with that statement, how many does Carlo Mattogno think died in gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau?”
My response: None.
You ask: “And if you agree with that statement, how many do *you* think died in gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau?”
My response: None.
FYI, I wrote an article on this subject, which you can read at https://inconvenienthistory.com/15/2/8214.
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Mefobills says:@Wizard of Oz
The German people didn’t suddenly go crazy. The camps were professionally run.
Hasbara rats are narrative curators. You cannot curate logical thinkers.
Normies can be influenced and they are about 70 percent of the population.
The way to get through to normies is to use memes. Their narrative conditioning cannot come up fast enough to overcome the meme imagery.
Hasbara trolls will ultimately lose, there are not enough recycled usury dollars available for their army.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Mr. Bahner,
No one, that I know or read, feels or believes the death of any people, particularly those killed in war, is funny, regardless of what we believe about the objectives of our/their rulers. I do not and would not mock or trivialize the death of civilians or soldiers.
You are virtue signaling again. Does anyone really believe Mel Brooks is an evil man who cares not for his Jewish brethren? I’m sure he was criticized for Springtime for Hitler, but he gets a pass. I’m not comparing myself to Mr. Brooks, but there is certainly a double standard for Gentiles. Jews hammer on, in public, about abolishing whiteness, destroying Edom; they can say whatever they want.
However, I/we do mock the lies, the liars, and the process, by which ANYONE who dares to question the official narrative is thrown to the wolves. Legislation should not be necessary to protect the truth. People lose their livelihood and freedom over this issue, but you are offended by sarcasm?
The irony is, I was once firmly in your camp, despite anecdotal evidence from my grandfather, who was a cargo pilot during the war, who said the US made a mistake. He left for the war anti-Germany; returned pro-I think we were deceived. I believed our “errors” were honest mistakes or the US was tricked somehow. Of course, anecdotal evidence from Gentiles is dismissed; anecdotal evidence from Jews is absolute. And incidentally, how many average Americans know the number of American soldiers killed in WW2? No one really seems to care. Jew extraordinaire, Pollard, said America deserved to be destroyed because she didn’t do enough to help the Jews.
You have yet to give your opinion on the story about the apples. It may seem inconsequential, but there is a definite pattern to be observed.
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Mefobills says:@Mark Bahner
I want to see pictures of proper German engineered Homicidal Gas Chambers. That includes doors that seal and latch, heated zyklon generators, spark arresting lamp fixtures, and a scram system for evacuation of the gasses.
I would also like to see some sort of historical provenance, such that any pictures can have high confidence they were taken during the time period in question (during the supposed holocaust).
Some sort of diary entries that also have provenance would be nice, as the people of that era kept their private thoughts in diaries, unlike today.
As I expected, your attempts at procuring an industrial scale homicidal gas chamber picture doesn’t even rise to the sophomoric level.
They don’t exist! Quick get that Jew AI booted up to rewrite history! The Hasbara ministry of truth needs to generate some of those pictures asap.
Get crackin Jew Boy, time is burning.
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Mark Bahner says:
No one, that I know or read, feels or believes the death of any people, particularly those killed in war, is funny, regardless of what we believe about the objectives of our/their rulers. I do not and would not mock or trivialize the death of civilians or soldiers.
But in fact you did mock and trivialize the extermination of many tens of thousands of Jewish children and old people who were led directly from the trains arriving from Hungary to gas chambers in Birkenau. (Oh, they were of course forced to strip naked first. So there’s probably a another joke in there somewhere for you.)
Here’s a website showing some of them:
https://www.yadvashem.org/articles/general/photograph-context-auschwitz-album.html
*All* of those children and elderly women will be murdered in hours at most.
You have yet to give your opinion on the story about the apples.
I didn’t even see a “story about the apples.” Now that I see it…one man appears to have been so traumatized by the horrors he saw, that his memory imagines good things. I guess that means the murder of tens or hundreds of thousands of Hungarian Jews by Zyklon B didn’t really occur.
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littlereddot says:
I want to see pictures of proper German engineered Homicidal Gas Chambers. That includes doors that seal and latch, heated zyklon generators, spark arresting lamp fixtures, and a scram system for evacuation of the gasses.
You have a good point there. I think it would make a good place to test if the alleged gas chambers were really so….and by extrapolation the whole Holocaust story.
I must research more. Thanks.
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Mark Bahner says:@Mefobills
I want to see pictures of proper German engineered Homicidal Gas Chambers.
Get crackin Jew Boy, time is burning.
I don’t give a damn what you want. You’re an ignoramus, and too much of a gutless coward to even en post under your real name.
I’ve already provided links to photos of gas chambers used at Majdanek and Auschwitz-Birkenau.
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Mark Bahner says:@littlereddot
You have a good point there. I think it would make a good place to test if the alleged gas chambers were really so….and by extrapolation the whole Holocaust story.
I must research more. Thanks.
There is no need to “test if the alleged chambers were really so”. Literally hundreds of people who were around them during their operation have confirmed that they killed people.
Here’s Rudolf Hoess, commenting on Crematorium 1, in Auschwitz I, which was the first and *least* sophisticated gas chamber in Auschwitz-Birkenau. The four gas chambers associated with Crematoriums II, III, IV, and V were all much more sophisticated gas chambers, built specifically to murder large numbers of people with Zyklon B. Here is Rudolf Hoess, the Commandant of Auschwitz, comment on that first, unsophisticated gas chamber.
I have a clearer recollection of the gassing of 900 Russians which took place shortly afterwards in the old crematorium, since the use of Block 11 for this purpose caused too much trouble. While the transport was detraining, holes were pierced in the earth and concrete ceiling of the mortuary. The Russians were told to undress in the anteroom, they then quietly entered the mortuary, for they had been told they were to be deloused. The whole transport exactly filled the mortuary to capacity. The doors were then sealed and the gas shaken down through the holes in the roof. I do not know how long this killing took. For a while a humming sound could be heard. When the powder was thrown in, there were cries of “Gas!”, then a great bellowing, then the prisoners hurled themselves against the doors. But the doors held. They were opened several hours later, so that the place might be aired. It was then that I saw, for the first time, gassed bodies in the mass. (pages 146 and 147)
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
You ask: “And if you agree with that statement, how many do *you* think died in gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau?”
My response: None.
So you think every single one of the 400,000+ Jews coming to Auschwitz from Hungary were fit for work?
If not, suppose 200,000 were fit for work, and the others were not fit for work (say, children under 12, women and men over 65, etc.
In that hypothetical with half of the incoming Jews from Poland being unfit for work, what would happen to those not fit for work? Do you think they got sent back to Hungary?
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littlereddot says:@Mark Bahner
I am beginning to look into this subject to satisfy myself on its veracity.
As an engineer, I am sure you would appreciate that if the facilities were used as gas chambers, there will be tell tale signs such as gas/air purging facilities, decontamination rooms and equipment, airlocks etc.
I myself have experience with bunkers/civil defense shelters where there are careful consideration and provision of facilities to ensure that poisonous substances do not mix with the population, or in this case administered to those within the chamber, but must be stopped from escaping and poisoning the guards and staff.
Further, there must be an ability to purge (extraction fans, plenums, chimney etc) or neutralise (filter rooms, plenum chambers, extraction fans, recirculation fans etc) the poisons within the chambers before staff or other personnel can enter the chambers to dispose of the bodies or remains.
While I myself look to find such evidence, if you be able to point me in the way of say plans/blueprints or detailed photographs that would show the gas chambers/crematoria in more detail. It would be much appreciated. Unfortunately a general photo of the interior of the main chamber, or ruins will not be able to give an accurate picture.
Thanks.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:
In fact, I do mock the liars and the lies. I will admit I often feel a pang of guilt, because I do have care and regret for those who suffered, ALL of the victims, but I make no apologies for directing ire or scorn on the ones who perpetuate lies against my own people. I am an American of German descent, as you said you are.
I suppose you are blissfully unaware of doctored photos, verified to be false, when the originals surfaced? There is too much evidence pointing to gross exaggerations and outright lies, to believe official reporting. There are some of us who know people who actually lived through the war…but what they say does not matter, unless it’s in line with official doctrine.
Yes, in and of itself, the story about the apples can be understood with allowance for his coping strategy. But, that gentleman toured the world, collected money/support for a false story. His wife, who did not share his experience, went right along, benefiting as well. He was defiant about his fib, and claimed he told no lies because it was real in his imagination. I suspect he is not the only one.
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Mefobills says:@Mark Bahner
I don’t give a damn what you want. You’re an ignoramus, and too much of a gutless coward to even en post under your real name.
The name I post under, is the type of money that NSDAP used to work their way out of Jew Debts.
They didn’t borrow money from the (((international creditor))) which is the primary reason they were attacked by finance capital emanating from London, Wall Street, and Paris.
Jews are claiming blood libel against the German people. To do murder, you need a body, a murder weapon, and motive.
The bodies are the supposed piles at the concentration camps, which were really killed by American bombing, and subsequent starvation.
The motive, is some sort of irrational hatred of jews, you know – just because.
And finally, the one that the Jews cannot surmount is the murder weapon.
NO PICTURES.
And what is fobbed off as evidence is childish buffoonery.
This is why I say that Jew Boys better get crackin on that Jew AI, that way they can re-write visual history ASAP.
Got to keep the mountains of lies in place, otherwise people might start thinking for themselves.
If you are going to cast blood libels, it is ON YOU to prove the murder weapon.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
See #1229
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BlackFlag says:@Carlton Meyer
How do you think the incident that Fleming relates of the schooner in the Philippines that was commissioned as a navy vessel and outfitted with a few guns? A US Navy officer was to captain it alongside a crew of Filipino US Navy sailors. It was given a receiver but no transmitter. The plan was to sail into waters near Vietnam which was under Japanese control. Only a few hours before leaving the Philippines, its mission was called off on news of the Pearl Harbor attack.
Fleming thinks this undermines the theory that the FDR administration had foreknowledge of the attack. The captain of the boat confirms he now believes it was a one-way mission, i.e. he was sent to get shot at by the Japanese to provide a casus belli. It makes no sense that the mission would have been planned if an attack on Pearl Harbor was expected.
A couple of elements are suspicious.
1) The timing is too close. You could argue that once negotiations broke down in late November, the US wanted to get the war going ASAP, especially since they believed Japan would attack somewhere. So it’s expected this pretext would be arranged within say 2 weeks. Still, the timing is to the day.2) In addition to other incidents, Germany had already sunk a US ship that lead to the drowning of about 115 soldiers and yet Americans still were strongly against going to war. How would 1 dead American sailor plus some Filipino auxiliaries be enough to turn the public in favor of the war? You could argue that the American public was less opposed to going to war against Japan.
If the FDR admin had foreknowledge, there are 2 explanations for the schooner false flag plan.
1) Alibi. FDR knew he would be suspected of having expected the Pearl Harbor attack. He could point to this false flag plan as an alibi. It might look kind of bad, but not nearly as bad as having allowed Pearl Harbor to get hit. A bit too intricate maybe.
2) More junior officers were given general plans to create pretexts and the details were left up to them. They were unaware of PH and just happened to plan this around the same time.
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Mark Bahner says:@littlereddot
I am beginning to look into this subject to satisfy myself on its veracity.
As an engineer, I am sure you would appreciate that if the facilities were used as gas chambers, there will be tell tale signs such as gas/air purging facilities, decontamination rooms and equipment, airlocks etc.
1) What is your background?
2) Yes, I appreciate that there would be “tell tale signs”, but this is not a close call. People on this site seem to have absolutely no clue of something called “Occam’s Razor.” People like John Wear seem to think, “Oh, this particular thing doesn’t seem to be right, therefore there must not have been any homicidal chambers at all.” But that’s simply not the right way to analyze this question. Here’s instead what you should do:
a) Investigate how many people *arrived* at Auschwitz.
b) Of those people, figure out how many were capable of working (say people age 14-55).
c) For the people who arrived, but were not capable of work, where did they go?A particularly good analysis subset of all the people who arrived at Auschwitz are the Hungarian Jews who arrived in May and June of 1944. The total number was approximately 420,000. That’s 420,000 in eight weeks. The problem is that Auschwitz was already had a “full house”. So where did those 420,000 people go? And in particular, where did the people who were *unfit for work* go? Auschwitz was *not* a “family friendly” workplace. There were quarters for men plus older boys, and quarters for women plus older girls. There were no quarters for families with children under 12…or retired people living their golden age in a nice extermination camp with a great view of four crematoriums.
Also, the *capacity* of Auschwitz was *maybe* 140,000 people, and it was likely very near that capacity already in May and June of 1944. So let’s make the frankly insane assumption that half of the 420,000 simply got off the train, stretched their legs, and got back to go to some other destination. That’s still 210,000 *additional* people in a place that maybe can fit 140,000 people.
The Occam’s Razor conclusion is that they built the 4 extra crematoria (Crematorium II, III, IV, and V) because they needed to get rid of tremendously more bodies than they’d needed to get rid of in early 1942, before the mass exterminations started ramping up.
P.S. But since you asked, here’s a wonder Twitter shipping manifest for equipment for the gas chambers (or the crematoriums, if you want to be charitable):
https://www.holocaust.cz/en/history/events/the-terezin-family-camp-in-auschwitz-birkenau/
From that:
“Be-und Entluftungsanlage” –> “Loading and ventilation system”
There’s a very good virtually reality video about the gas chambers and the crematoria…but I’ll want to explain why the guy doesn’t know what he’s talking about before I show it to you.
Best wishes,
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Brosi says:@Mark Bahner
Y’all think murdering thousands of people in gas chambers is funny?
LOL. The tranny yenta, aka Karen Bergsteinowitz, has her panties in a bunch because UR commenters don’t believe her/them fantasies: gas chambers, men with uteruses, women with penises, and of course masturbation death machines…
Every time she/them see people playing a simple game of bingo she starts kvetching and squealing and flinging spittle.
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Brosi says:@Wizard of Oz
You’ll have to keep your fairy tail straight if you want anyone to believe you. All of the tiny hats of Israel, New York, Florida and London are so certain that there were exactly 6 million that they are in demanding that we be sent to the gas chamber if we disagree.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You ask: “So you think every single one of the 400,000+ Jews coming to Auschwitz from Hungary were fit for work?”
My response: No.
You ask: In that hypothetical with half of the incoming Jews from Poland being unfit for work, what would happen to those not fit for work? Do you think they got sent back to Hungary?”
My response: No, they were not sent back to Hungary.
Many were transited to other camps, as has been acknowledged by many traditional Holocaust historians. Edwin Black, for example, writes that Auschwitz was a labor camp, a transit camp, as well as an extermination camp where Jews were immediately exterminated in gas chambers upon arrival. (Source: Black, Edwin, IBM and the Holocaust: The Strategic Alliance between Nazi Germany and America’s Most Powerful Corporation, New York: Crown Publishers, 2001, p. 351).
Numerous sick and disabled Jews were transported to and survived Auschwitz-Birkenau.
For example, Primo Levi was a Jewish Communist who one would think would have been executed at Auschwitz-Birkenau. However, along with about 7,000 to 8,000 additional disabled Jews, Levi was left behind in Auschwitz. Although the Germans could have executed Levi and the other Jews in a few days, the Germans let them survive to tell their story about Auschwitz-Birkenau. (Source: Faurisson, Robert, “Witnesses to the Gas Chambers of Auschwitz,” in Gauss, Ernst (ed.), Dissecting the Holocaust: The Growing Critique of Truth and Memory, Capshaw, AL: Thesis and Dissertations Press, 2000, p. 142).
The Hungarian Jews were not subject to a program of mass extermination at Auschwitz-Birkenau. No homicidal gas chambers existed at Auschwitz-Birkenau to carry out such a massive extermination process. The crematoria capacity at Auschwitz-Birkenau was also not sufficient to cremate the alleged dead Hungarian Jews in the time period claimed by most Holocaust historians. Finally, Allied aerial photographs taken at the height of the alleged extermination of the Hungarian Jews at Birkenau show an uneventful camp devoid of any evidence of a mass extermination program.
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littlereddot says:@Mark Bahner
1) What is your background?
I was an architect specialising in infrastructure projects. In my line of work I coordinated very extensively with different kinds of engineers. Most of these projects are mostly engineering determined, so designing things had to have engineering requirements often times take priority over human considerations.
As for projects that are similar to “gas chambers”, I designed and supervised mass transit (subway) stations that could be turned into civil defense shelters. These are not small little bunkers, these hold 5000 to 20,000 people. They had to protect the occupants not only from physical blast effect of bombs, but also chemical and biological attack. As can be expected, the engineering involved is very extensive.
The civil defense shelters were designed to Swiss standards, so of course these bunkers had to have all the bells and whistles like blast doors, airlocks, blast valves, filtration rooms, generator rooms, assorted plenums and shafts, decontamination rooms etc….alongside the usual mass transit facilities like traction power substations, signalling rooms, extraction fan rooms etc etc.
Because of this, I know that poisoning hundreds or thousands of people at the time is not as simple as throwing in a bottle of Zyklon-B into the gas chamber. There is a whole lot of considerations that must be taken into account…. And especially if the deed is undertaken by Germans.
I don’t know if you have worked with Germans before…..but they don’t like anything to be simple. They just love complexity….and the stereotype about them over-engineering everything……it really is true.
With these things in mind, I would say that if I could get my hands on a set of plans/blueprints of the gas chambers in question, I can come to pretty good idea of what was going on there.
“Occam’s Razor.”
I hope you will forgive me if I tell you I do not trust anything I read in the mass media. Lies upon lies have been told for so many decades, that it is difficult to trust any data coming from anywhere…..especially from Western sources.
This post is getting too long, so I will end it here before I bore you.
If you are interested to know why I do not trust especially Western media, please ask, and I will be happy to elaborate.
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Mefobills says:@Brosi
Y’all think murdering thousands of people in gas chambers is funny?
You are handling the Jew rats perfectly.
They cannot show pictures of the murder weapon, or show any proof that has provenance. PIctures don’t exist, because there was no homiciding in gas chambers.
Nothing they show can hold up to critical investigation. Basically, they make claims, and later it turns out the eye witnesses are liars.
They are casting blood libels against innocent Germans. It is really disgusting.
Memes are the best way to counter the hasbara rat troll army. The other is to demand they show proof of the supposed murder weapon. If you get down in the weeds with them, like asking to show pink bodies from Zyklon they will wave their hands and tie you up with PiLPul.
The rats need to sh#t or get off of the pot. Where are the homicide gas chamber pictures? Real pictures, not some sort of crayon re-creation after the fact.
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Patrick McNally says:@John Wear
> For example, Primo Levi was a Jewish Communist
What is that based on? I haven’t been able to find anything which remotely suggests that Levi ever was part of a Communist Party, whether in Italy or anywhere else.
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Mark Bahner says:
I was an architect specialising in infrastructure projects. In my line of work I coordinated very extensively with different kinds of engineers.
OK, cool. With that background, you should be able to easily see the correct answer here…which is that there is simply no doubt that hundreds of thousands of people were gassed with Zyklon-B at Auschwitz from the middle of 1942 to the end of 1944 (when the big gas chambers and crematoria were blown up by the Nazis before they evacuated Auschwitz).
The civil defense shelters were designed to Swiss standards, so of course these bunkers had to have all the bells and whistles like blast doors, airlocks, blast valves, filtration rooms, generator rooms, assorted plenums and shafts, decontamination rooms etc….alongside the usual mass transit facilities like traction power substations, signalling rooms, extraction fan rooms etc etc.
Because of this, I know that poisoning hundreds or thousands of people at the time is not as simple as throwing in a bottle of Zyklon-B into the gas chamber. There is a whole lot of considerations that must be taken into account…. And especially if the deed is undertaken by Germans.
No, your background is leading you astray. You’re thinking, “How things were done must conform to my experience.” But Occam’s Razor outlook should be: “This is how people said things were done. If it doesn’t conform to my experience, is it because people were lying or didn’t know how things were done…or is it because this was a different situation, and my experience doesn’t really apply?”
All the stuff you’re talking about is design by and for people who give a damn about human life. That was simply not the case with Nazis and Jews in WW2.
Let’s take the case of Hungarian Jews that arrived in May and June 1944. We know beyond a doubt that approximately 400,000 Jews were put on trains in Hungary that ended up in Auschwitz. Here’s how people *at the time* reported the process:
1) People get off the trains. They’ve been traveling for many hours or even days without adequate food, water, or toilet facilities.
2) People get selected as fit for work, or unfit for work. The unfit for work are virtually always: children under, say, 12 years old; old men and women, say, over 65 years old.
3) The unfit for work are walked to a large building containing an undressing room, a gas chamber, and a crematorium.
4) The children and old women and men are forced to strip in a common room. They’re then moved right next door to the gas chamber, which can hold up to 2000 people (although that makes it jam-packed). They’re told they’ll be showered to be de-loused. When the door shuts and locks, the Zyklon-B is dropped down from holes in the ceiling. Screaming is heard for several minutes.
5) After a period of time that is less than a few hours, the door is opened, and Jewish prisoners began moving the bodies out of the gas chamber, up an elevator to the crematorium room, where bodies are burned with coke (a special type of coal).Now, you may say, “It couldn’t work that way, because the people wouldn’t go into the stripping room, or wouldn’t go into the gas chamber.” But these are little children and old people (oh…and sometimes the mothers of the little children). So what the hell are they going to do, after they just got off a terrible train ride, and left all their belongings next to the train?
Or, you may say, “No, the Jewish prisoners become sick from handling the bodies with cyanide still in their hair or on their skin.” Well, the Nazis simply didn’t care about the Jewish prisoners taking the bodies out.
With that said, here is that video I hinted at:
https://holocausthandbooks.com/index.php?page_id=1005
After you watch it, let’s discuss what he gets right…and what he gets wrong.
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John Wear says:@Patrick McNally
You ask: “What is that based on? I haven’t been able to find anything which remotely suggests that Levi ever was part of a Communist Party, whether in Italy or anywhere else.”
My response: When I go to ihr.org, I see the following statement from Dr. William B. Lindsey:
“An inquiring mind will at this point, I believe wonder why, if the Germans intended to kill all Jews, Primo Levi was spared? He had, after all, been caught red-handed as a communist partisan. He was a Jewish intellectual.” (Source: http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v06/v06p252_Lindsey.html).
There is probably more evidence, but I don’t want to spend too much time researching this issue.
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
My response: No, they were not sent back to Hungary.
Many were transited to other camps, as has been acknowledged by many traditional Holocaust historians. Edwin Black, for example, writes that Auschwitz was a labor camp, a transit camp, as well as an extermination camp where Jews were immediately exterminated in gas chambers upon arrival.
So we agree that the “unfit for work” Hungarian Jews of May-June 1944, consisting mostly of children under the age of twelve, and old women and men were not sent back to Hungary.
You then bring up the idea of “transited to other camps”…but we’re talking here about the “unfit for work” Hungarian Jews of May and June 1944. These are mostly young children under 12, old women, and old men. Are you saying they were “transited to other camps”?
In other words, are you saying that in May-June 1944, the Hungarian Jewish children under 12 and the old Hungarian Jewish men and women were put back on the trains, and sent to other camps?
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Mark Bahner says:@Mark Bahner
Oops!
This is the link I meant to supply:
https://holocausthandbooks.com/index.php?page_id=1005&play=96#watch
Mark
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Mefobills says:@Mark Bahner
big gas chambers and crematoria were blown up by the Nazis before they evacuated Auschwitz).
Those eeeviil Nazi’s blew up the evidence, so there isn’t any? What is this narrative for dummies?
Where are the pictures? How about engineering plans? How about diary entries?
You are not getting off the hook, jew rat.
You cannot make blood libel allegations and take usury on innocent people forever. The game is up.
Where are the pictures? You do see why normal humanity is tired of your Jew evil? Oh right, narcissists can do no wrong, as they are mentally ill, and hence anything they do is pure as the driven snow.
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Patrick McNally says:@John Wear
> He had, after all, been caught red-handed as a communist partisan.
Careless misuse of verbiage by Lindsey. Levi had joined the Giustizia e Libertà, a group which since the 1930s had sought to distance themselves from the Communist Party. They joined with anarchists in Spain during the Spanish Civil War. Giustizia e Libertà were never part of either Communist Party, whether in Italy or Spain. Levi himself was not really an anarchist for that matter. He joined Giustizia e Libertà at a time when in 1943 he simply wanted to find some type of resistance group which would allow him to join guerilla activities and avoid deportation. He was drawn to Giustizia e Libertà as a more liberal type of group.
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Gabreal Jones says:@Gabreal Jones
“julien romanovsky comment” (gj = jr) 2 yrs ago at :
Cole / Stein did not realy retract his statements / the time that I posted a comment as gabreal jones some time ago at vidrebel he happened to be outed by a girlfriend as David Cole.
After he was heavily attacked by adl types he went into hiding as David Stein remained a doc maker on the holo subject / but from the other angle / side & Rep. organiser. Never saw any of his stuff from that period.
He changed a lot esp. his eyes who were black like coal / but the same guy / surtout his voice / I saw later on a short report he made about the alleged gas busses / cars in a holo museum in the US / he debunked that too. Cheers / Proost Cole / Stein / Cole still a funny guy though…..*
http://aanirfan.blogspot.com/2018/03/hitlers-jewish-nazis-part-1.html
And a link to Angirfan where -julien romanovsky 24 february 2020- with the following link to the Barier Miner, Austrian newspaper : “Vienna, July 12 ( 1933 /gj. Is Herr Hitler, the German Nazi dictator and alleged persecutor of Jews, of Jewish extraction?”
And some other unknown interesting links on AH / tool of the RotSchild j.bankers crime cartel to establish via WW II the slc sweet little country on the eastern shore of the Mediterranean…
* That Stein Cole is again back in the s.o.s. camp is no-fun / for himself in the first place….
CIA O
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You ask: “You then bring up the idea of “transited to other camps”…but we’re talking here about the “unfit for work” Hungarian Jews of May and June 1944. These are mostly young children under 12, old women, and old men. Are you saying they were “transited to other camps”?”
My response: Some would have been transited to other camps, and some would have stayed in Auschwitz-Birkenau.
The Holocaust story claims that virtually all Jews who were too sick to work were immediately killed. The documentary evidence, however, indicates that a high percentage of the inmates at Birkenau were disabled. Oswald Pohl, in a secret report to Heinrich Himmler dated April 5, 1944, stated that there were 67,000 inmates in the entire Auschwitz-Birkenau camp complex, of which 18,000 were unable to work. In Birkenau there were a total of 36,000 inmates, of whom “approximately 15,000 are unable to work.” (Source: Nuremberg document NO-021, NMT (The “green series”), Vol. 5, pp. 384-385).
Such high percentages of disabled inmates at Auschwitz-Birkenau are not consistent with a program of mass extermination.
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Mark Bahner says:@Mefobills
The name I post under, is the type of money that NSDAP used to work their way out of Jew Debts.
You post under a fake name, because you’re a coward. Why don’t you stop being a pussy, and post under your real name, like a real man?
Jews are claiming blood libel against the German people.
I’m not Jewish, as I’ve already written. (Simply click the button that says, “This commenter” and you can look through my comments to see that.) As I wrote, I was probably baptized Episcopalian, but almost certainly some flavor of Protestant. I’m now agnostic. I don’t what God or Gods may exist or not exist.
And as I’ve also written, my great-great-great-great-great-great-great (I’m not sure how many more to add) grandpappy was a Hessian soldier. He fought against Washington’s troops at Trenton, right after Washington stepped out of that painting of him crossing the Delaware River. I lived in West Germany (Frankfurt, Augsburg, and Wiesbaden) when I was growing up.
I say that Nazis killed hundreds of thousands of Jews in gas chambers using Zyklon B at Auschwitz between 1942 and 1944 because I’m virtually certain that’s what happened. The evidence it happened is overwhelming. The “evidence” that it didn’t happen is essentially ridiculous nonsense.
You seem to be unfamiliar with what “blood libel” even is. You need to look up the meaning of “libel”. (And if you don’t understand what you read, have some adult explain it to you.)
“Libel” is saying things that are not true, that one *knows* are not true. It can’t possibly be “blood libel” for me to say that Nazi Germans murdered hundreds of thousands of Jews at Auschwitz-Birkenau because I’m virtually certain that’s exactly what happened. I know the times; I know the equipment/buildings used; I know in general, and in a few cases specifically, the people who were murdered.
Are you German? Or are you some other nationality–for example, a U.S. citizen, like me–with a German heritage?
If you are either of those things, the last thing in the world you should be doing is defending the murder of untold thousands of children–or perhaps even worse, claiming it didn’t happen at all– which is exactly what the Nazis did at Auschwitz from 1942-1944.
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
My response: Some would have been transited to other camps, and some would have stayed in Auschwitz-Birkenau.
So let’s say, among the 400+ Hungarian Jews who arrived at Auschwitz-Birkenau from in the months of May and June of 1944, 100,000 of them were children or old people “unfit for work”.
If they were “transited to other camps,” would they have gotten right back on the train? Or would they have stayed in Auschwitz-Birkenau for a few days, weeks, or months, and then got on a train to some new destination?
Where would the have stayed while in Auschwitz-Birkenau? How many barracks were there at Auschwitz-Birkenau for old people and young children? And how would they fit in Auschwitz-Birkenau, if the camp was already full when they arrived in May and June of 1944?
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Gabreal Jones says:
Hitlers Doubles by Peter Fotis Kapnistos
https://books.google.es/books?id=OBFNCAAAQBAJ&printsec=copyright&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q&f=false
“The more Heineken / the WC / the double you see …” ( Frans Vogel of The Rotterdam School a good poet camerado of mine whose father was a soldier in Hitler´s army ) / ¿ U C ?
CIA O
( @ Roy Unz Webmaster of The Unz Review / I know its over the daily allowed quotum / but if not today maybe Morgen )
CIA O
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john speke says:
it’s a long long road to these red pills. It takes, #1, an inquisitive mind and someone who has lots of time on their hands to read old books, and obscure articles on obscure platforms. Even then, it takes decades. Meanwhile, the other side is able to get it’s ideas into American heads 24/7. We have nothing like that. We are too small in number. Absent some messiah coming who has the oratorical skills of Cicero or Hitler, the confidence of Trump, the brains of Aristotle, and the financial means to get his message out without being cancelled or silenced, I dont think there is much hope. Even if such a person came around, he would be killed.
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Mark Bahner says:@john speke
It takes, #1, an inquisitive mind and someone who has lots of time on their hands to read old books, and obscure articles on obscure platforms. Even then, it takes decades.
So far, we have two theories for what happened at Auschwitz-Birkenau from 1941 to January 1945:
Theory 1:
1) Only 130,000 to 200,000 people died at Auschwitz,
2) Most of the 130,000 to 200,000 people died of disease, and
3) *Not one person* was gassed to death at Auschwitz.
4) Zyklon-B was used to save Jewish lives, not to take them.Theory 2:
1) More than 1,o00,000 people died at Auschwitz,
2) They were murdered by various means, including gassing, starvation, overwork…you name it.
3) *Of course* people were gassed to death at Auschwitz.
4) *Of course* Zyklon-B was used to gas people to death at Auschwitz.I gather you subscribe to some flavor of the first theory? Do you think not one single person was gassed to death with Zyklon B at Auschwitz?
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Pierre de Craon says:@Wizard of Oz
So what? It has long been known that what tourists see today (and presumably Leuchter and Germar Rudolf purported to give scientific evidence about) were approximate reconstructions.
Whether it was your intention to have it do so or not, this sentence of yours encapsulates the essence of what it is to be a Jew or an apologist for the Jews. First, you lie through your teeth; then, when called on your lies, you say “so what?” and continue lying as if truth simply doesn’t matter.
This analysis is not, Lord knows, original with me: cf. John 8:43–44.
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Pierre de Craon says:@Mark Bahner
I’m virtually certain I’m correct.
Were it not that this remark of yours embodied the knee-jerk, prototypical Jewish attitude toward almost literally everything, it might be funny in the present context.
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Brad Anbro says:@Mark Bahner
Quote:
“Libel” is saying things that are not true
False!
“Libel” is the PRINTING of something that is not true…a PUBLISHED false statement that is damaging to a person’s reputation.
For being an “engineer,” your education appears to be sorely lacking. Especially about September 11, 2001 and what actually went on that day – NOT what we were told went on…
I am just a lowly retired industrial electrician, but I have known for many years the difference between SLANDER and LIBEL.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You ask numerous questions in your comment #1249.
Let’s begin by examining what happened to one of the world’s most famous Jewish transferee’s out of Auschwitz-Birkenau.
Viktor Frankl’s book “Man’s Search for Meaning” has been ranked by the Library of Congress as one of the 20th century’s 10 most influential books in the United States. Frankl described his experiences at Auschwitz in this book as if he had spent many months there. In reality, Frankl was in Auschwitz only for a few days in October 1944 while in transit from Theresienstadt to a sub-camp of Dachau. Frankl has admitted this to the American evangelist Robert Schuller: “I was in Auschwitz only three or four days…I was sent to a barrack and we were all transported to a camp in Bavaria. (Source: Frankl, Viktor, “Dr. Robert Schuller Interviews Viktor Frankl: How to Find Meaning In Life,” Possibilities: The Magazine of Hope, March/April 1991, p. 10.)
Frankl’s short time in Auschwitz is substantiated by the prisoner log from the sub-camp of Dachau, Kaufering III, which listed Frankl’s arrival on October 25, 1944, six days after his departure from Theresienstadt. (Source: Pytell, Timothy, “Extreme Experience, Psychological Insight, and Holocaust Perception; Reflections of Bettelheim and Frankl,” Psychoanalytic Psychology, Vol. 24, No. 4, Oct. 2007, p. 646).
Thus, Frankl’s descriptions of his long stay at Auschwitz in “Man’s Search For Meaning” are false and inaccurate. Similar to Viktor Frankl, I think most of the Hungarian Jews transited out of Auschwitz-Birkenau would have been there only for a very short period of time.
Germar Rudolf examines Jews transferred to the Stutthof Camp on page 304 of the 4th edition of his book “Lectures on the Holocaust”:
“Since late June 1944, large transports of Jews arrived at Stutthof. They came mainly either from the Baltic countries or from the Auschwitz Camp. The first set was the result of the Red Army advancing into these countries, leading to the evacuation of all sorts of camps in that area, while the second set consisted of Jews from Hungary and the Lodz Ghetto, for whom Auschwitz had only been a transit camp.”
Rudolf continues:
“If we follow the orthodox narrative, the vast majority of the Hungarian Jews deported to Auschwitz since May 1944, as well as the Jews deported to Auschwitz from the Lodz Ghetto in August 1944, are said to have been murdered on arrival without having been registered. The data about the Stutthof Camp prove, however, that at least some of these unregistered Jews (23,566, to be precise) were not murdered on arrival but were transferred to other camps as forced laborers.”
Rudolf continues on pp. 304-305:
“One should not surmise that all Jews from the Baltic countries, Hungary, and Lodz who were transited through Auschwitz in the summer of 1944 ended up in Stutthof, because that was only a small camp and merely one among many others. Further research about admissions to other camps, to the extent that the records still exist, may reveal that many more Jews were alive and kicking of whom orthodox historians had assumed that they had been murdered. Based on data available to him in 2001, Mattogno was able to prove that at least 79,200 of the Hungarian Jews who were deported to Auschwitz but remained unregistered, had been transported to other camps– without having been murdered. Stutthof demonstrates therefore that the orthodox conjecture about the mass murder of inmates who were not registered on arrival at Auschwitz is untenable.”
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Pierre de Craon says:@littlereddot
You obviously think that the English alphabet = Latin Alphabet.
Anyone who thinks that the alphabet used to write English-language words is called the Latin (or Roman) alphabet is correct.
I learned in grammar school that Western languages were written in either (1) the Latin alphabet or (2) the Greek alphabet—in the latter case, in either the original form or one of its derived forms. By the sixth grade at the latest I had learned that the use of the one alphabet rather than the other by a given people stemmed primarily from the origin and native language of the particular early Christian missionaries who sought to convert that people.* Subsequently, migrations and conquests also played very significant roles in whose alphabet got used.**
In short, the alphabets used by English, French, German, Spanish, Polish, Czech, Slovak, and Portuguese speakers—this list is not meant to be read as comprehensive—are one and the same: the Latin alphabet. The presence or absence of diacritics in one language or another and the existence in German of the Eszett, or “sharp s,” are no more than instances of window dressing—i.e., trivialities.
People who are unfamiliar with these facts are typically under the age of fifty, as it was in the late seventies and early eighties that elementary education, at least in big-city public schools, was radically “reformed” to cope with the fact that the virtual disappearance of all but the poorest and least intelligent whites left the schools with student bodies made up almost entirely of blacks and other ineducable minorities. So instead of math and literature and history, they were taught self-glamorization. As almost every frequenter of this website knows, it wasn’t long till minorities’ self-worship and lack of interest in education began being shoved down white children’s throat.
_________
*Notably, Saints Cyril and Methodius, often called the Apostles to the Slavs, were Thessalonian Greeks. Most of those they converted had no written language of their own. Significantly, the Poles and some other northern Slavs were converted about a century later than most western and southern Slavs, and the impetus for their conversion came from western Europe, not Byzantium.**That’s why redskins bitch about the white man in Roman letters.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Mark,
john speke clearly just explained the need to seriously take into consideration all evidence for a complicated and highly controversial historical subject. He then suggests, rightly so, that anyone who pipes up and says, “How can this be accurate?” is swatted away, like the gadflies we apparently are, to Those Who Know What Really Happened.
You are hysterical again, and you just did the exact thing he surmised was happening, thereby confirming his suspicions, i.e. don’t bother lifting up carpets, or peering into pots, everything’s already been resolved….did I mention the raging infernos, raging in soggy bottoms? Would you like to spend some time in the dungeon for asking a few questions? Have you seen that pretty little wife of yours lately?
Maybe that’s not exactly what you said, but we know what you mean.
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Pierre de Craon says:@Kali
Your carrying on about Carolyn Yeager’s being a troll, in ever more abusive terms, brings no credit upon you. In a fraternal spirit, I urge you to see that one need not agree with her about everything—indeed, about much of anything!—to recognize that she is no friend or ally of Jewish lies or of the broader (((Establishment narrative))).
Please recall, too, that lack of rudimentary civility,* especially toward women, is a typically Jewish trait. Surely no person of principle wants to conduct himself in a manner associated with the inveterate enemies of white people and the Cross.
____
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Mefobills says:@Mark Bahner
You post under a fake name, because you’re a coward. Why don’t you stop being a pussy, and post under your real name, like a real man?
This form of logic is an ad-hominem. It puts you in the higher moral position, because you know, you are superior because you post your name. By your being superior, ipso facto, your interlocutor is inferior.
I’m not Jewish, as I’ve already written. (Simply click the button that says, “This commenter” and you can look through my comments to see that.) As I wrote, I was probably baptized Episcopalian, but almost certainly some flavor of Protestant. I’m now agnostic. I don’t what God or Gods may exist or not exist.
A spiritual Jew then. A sayanim. If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck… I have made plenty of commentary about how Manasseh Ben Israel funded Protestantism during the reformation. Protestantism is Judeo-Christianity.
I’m an American, a Texan even. I am man enough to admit that we bombed the shit out of the Germans, and did war crimes and murder. I even have relatives, whom I have interviewed, who were in the war (they are old now, and one is still alive), and they are eye witnesses to the camps. I believe them (especially one great uncle) not your BS. We killed the Jews not the Germans. Suck it up. Be a man.
And as I’ve also written, my great-great-great-great-great-great-great (I’m not sure how many more to add) grandpappy was a Hessian soldierSo what? This is you self-aggrandizing. I have relatives that go all the way back the beginning too. Eat shit.
If you are either of those things, the last thing in the world you should be doing is defending the murder of untold thousands of children–or perhaps even worse, claiming it didn’t happen at all– which is exactly what the Nazis did at Auschwitz from 1942-1944.
It didn’t happen. The camps were a place in-between jail and civilian life. They were modeled on the British Boer camps, minus the horrors that the English visited on the Boers. Hitler especially wanted to re-habilitate German people as they had been busted out by the hyperinflation, and had their lands bought out from under their feet. Up to 1/3 of Germany had been bought up by the (((International))). The same gambit run against Russia in the 90’s was run against Germany in the 20’s. This sort of predatory super liberalism, creates an oligarchy, concurrent with civilizational slide into the gutter. The modern term for it is debt-polarization.
Hitler released debts, and was resurrecting the ship of state, and that included re-education for a large number of people.
After the war began, the camps were a place to make war material. The final solution was to be a place for Jews in the far east. This ended up happening as Stalin built out the Jewish Oblast.
In the meantime, the usual sneaky debt tricks were used by Zion, to acquire Crimea, in what was called the Crimea California Project. Stalin thwarted that too.
Basically, it is a tragedy that Stalin and Hitler locked horns. The real enemy has always been finance capital and its hidden string pullers. This same “class” includes many Jews, who also own the propaganda organs. You are a dupe as in “having been duped” since birth, and are unwilling to let go of shibboleths. This also indicates to me that you have weak character. MAN UP!
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
You ask numerous questions in your comment #1249.
No, John, I asked only two questions in my comment #1249. And your response in #1256 answers neither of those two questions. Once again, my questions were:
So let’s say, among the 400+ Hungarian Jews who arrived at Auschwitz-Birkenau from in the months of May and June of 1944, 100,000 of them were children or old people “unfit for work”.
If they were “transited to other camps,” would they have gotten right back on the train? Or would they have stayed in Auschwitz-Birkenau for a few days, weeks, or months, and then got on a train to some new destination?
Where would the have stayed while in Auschwitz-Birkenau? How many barracks were there at Auschwitz-Birkenau for old people and young children? And how would they fit in Auschwitz-Birkenau, if the camp was already full when they arrived in May and June of 1944?
Your response dealt with Viktor Frankl who you yourself wrote came to Auschwitz from Theresienstadt, which was in Czechoslovakia.
https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/theresienstadt
Then you cite Rudolf:
“If we follow the orthodox narrative, the vast majority of the Hungarian Jews deported to Auschwitz since May 1944, as well as the Jews deported to Auschwitz from the Lodz Ghetto in August 1944, are said to have been murdered on arrival without having been registered. The data about the Stutthof Camp prove, however, that at least some of these unregistered Jews (23,566, to be precise) were not murdered on arrival but were transferred to other camps as forced laborers.”
So obviously none of those 23,566 people were very young children or very old people who were “unfit for work”…if they were “transferred to other camps as forced laborers.”
Once again, I asked about young children and old people (e.g. over 60-65) who were “unfit for work.”
The closest you come to actually answer either of my two questions is that you quote Rudolph:
Based on data available to him in 2001, Mattogno was able to prove that at least 79,200 of the Hungarian Jews who were deported to Auschwitz but remained unregistered, had been transported to other camps– without having been murdered.
But you provide absolutely zero indication that those 79,200 Hungarian Jews were composed of young children and old people who were “unfit for work.”
I previously provided a link to a website with multiple pictures of Hungarian Jews transported to Auschwitz-Birkenau in May-June 1944, and I think I asked you what you thought happened to them. Here is that website again:
https://www.yadvashem.org/articles/general/photograph-context-auschwitz-album.html
What do you think happened to those people in those pictures? Especially, what happened to the people in the captions labeled as being “in a grove near gas chamber number four prior to their extermination”?
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Pierre de Craon says:@John Wear
Viktor Frankl’s book “Man’s Search for Meaning” has been ranked by the Library of Congress as one of the 20th century’s 10 most influential books in the United States.
Sad to say, the Library of Congress is almost certainly correct in its assessment of the book’s influence.
A search for the meaning of life that is grounded in self-pitying fictions and slanderous distortions is doomed from its first step. Its hypocrisy and internal contradictions merit contempt, not praise—and emulation even less so! What passion, if any, that Frankl has for truth is (((sectarian))) in its understanding. Moreover, as is customary with Jews, it stops well short of locating small-t truths in Truth Itself.
Perhaps the thing readers should be most cognizant of is the year of the book’s publication: 1946. The acclaim with which it was greeted should lead anyone who thinks that Jewish primacy within American society dates only from the 1980s or 1990s to think again.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:
From the link/site you posted:
“The Auschwitz Album is the only surviving visual evidence of the process of mass murder at Auschwitz-Birkenau. It is a unique document.”
Are you sure this true? The only image?
This is a description of a photo on said site:
“Auschwitz-Birkenau, Poland, Jewish women and children deemed “unfit for work” being unknowingly led to Gas Chamber #3.”
I viewed the photograph. There are 4 young children/toddlers. No one else in the photo appears infirm or elderly. In fact, they all appear quite healthy. Not one appears gaunt or malnourished. Not a single one. Look for yourself. Not to suggest these people were not suffering, but the image does not align with the description.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
See # 1263
And, the only images not the only picture
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Mefobills says:@Mark Bahner
Where are the pictures jew-boy? We need pictures of the homicide gas chambers. I notice how you just moved on, probably while waving your hands.
A person trained in logic, and who has integrity, does not allow large gaps in their knowledge base to exist.
They say it is a function of high intelligence to operate with conflicting narratives in your brain.
I say, it is a chicken shit personality type that doesn’t grapple with the gaps. High intelligence allows you to fill in the gaps until more info is known.
How many people sucked up 911 narratives the day it was promulgated? How many people sucked up Covid narratives? Even today they cannot let go minus some sort of emotional shock to their system.
Once narratives are sucked up, they become myelin sheathed in weak normie brains, and cannot be easily dislodged.
It takes about six times the effort to dislodge “first information” with subsequent new updated info. This is why weaklings hang onto their shibboleths so tenaciously. If they become unmoored, then they have no anchor to life. They become adrift. If what they knew was wrong, then what else is wrong?
Concentration camps are a terrific idea, especially due to the myelin sheathing issue of the human brain, which in turn is a function of evolution. This evolution was fine in the stone age, but not today.
The Uighur camps were a smashing success at un-doing Wahabbi Takfiri programming. The Atlantacist, Jew-led west, was trying to undermine both China and Russia using recycled petrodollars into Madrassas. The Madrassas were programming new Takfirs.
Unfortunately Russia had to go to war in Chechenia, but China’s concentration camps were a kinder and softer way to re-educate people.
We actually need soft and gentle concentration camps like Hitler had. There were prostitutes, camp money, and you could go on furlough for weddings and the like.
Work makes you free, and sometimes normies can become so traumatized (as in Germany in the 20’s) that camps are required.
Thanks Jews for all that you do! Not.
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Pierre de Craon says:@Patrick McNally
Maybe 2.25 million or so.
Nothing new here with this typically deceitful Jewish fallback figure, now many decades old. Yehuda Bauer took a good deal of flak from the Israeli and Diaspora thought police when he began pushing this number in the eighties. When he was anointed director of the International Center for Holocaust Studies at Yad Vashem, his views—or at least their expression—quietly became more “orthodox.”
Whatever else may be said for or against Bauer, he is one of the most formidable public debaters I have ever seen. Thirty years ago, I saw him, ably seconded by Christopher Browning, rhetorically dismember Daniel Goldhagen. Among other devices, throughout the debate Bauer referred to Goldhagen only as “little Danny.” Although Goldhagen and his evil thesis deserved every syllable of vilification they got, I couldn’t help feeling grateful not to be on the receiving end of such articulate abuse.
• Thanks: Wizard of Oz• Replies: @Patrick McNallyAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Rurik says:@Pierre de Craon
Pierre, it is with respect for you (and Kali) that I must respond to this.
It isn’t about whether we agree with Ms. Yeager about everything, or anything.
It is her character, (or lack of) that is the issue. I’ve engaged with lots and lots of people I didn’t agree with, but we were generally able to keep it civil.
Surely no person of principle wants to conduct himself in a manner associated with the inveterate enemies of white people and the Cross.
There has never been a Jewish supremacist or Zionist who’s ever demonstrated towards me more vicious effrontery or over-the-top rudeness than I experienced from Ms. Yeager.
If that is the type of person who represents revisionists, then may they all rot.
If David Duke walked into a person’s home, who was kind and invited him in, in good faith, only to have Mr. Duke insult the person and his family, and demand more obeisance from others in the home, then if I were in the house, I’d like to think I’d give such a person some help out of the house, in not too gentle a way.
What transpired on this thread, (where you at least saw some of it) was I engaged in some discussion, whereupon Ms. Yeager told me I was too stupid to participate, and why don’t I go away. At which point I agreed to do so, and tried to leave graciously while being very chivalrous about it, as is my wont.
At which point Ms. Yeager suggested I was too afraid of her intellect, to learn from her, or some such idiocy.
So I agreed to reply to her solicitations that I do so, with a thoughtful and reasonable and well-considered comment.
To this Ms. Yeager decided that instead of considering the reply, she would instead heap further insults upon me, acting (stupidly) like she was too intelligent and aloof and superior to give my reply any consideration.
And what makes matters worse, is that the reason she replied with insults, rather than attempting to respond, is because she knew she was too stupid to reply to my comment, without betraying the idiocy of her stance. So rather than admit I made some points, she decided on being over-the-top obnoxious, instead.
Then, she congratulated herself on her rudeness and crass disrespect of a commenter who had done nothing but show her courtesy. She was so proud that she had tricked me into responding, so that she could spring her trap.
Since then, she has gone on to tell bold-faced lies about me, and conduct herself in such a way to make Fran look like the epitome of feminine grace.
We might agree with her on some issues, and give her some credit for defending those who’ve been maligned, and to that extent, sure.
But at some point, character becomes relevant. I wouldn’t want the most articulate scholar in my camp, if I thought he’d stab me in the back the second he considered it advantageous to do so.
And Ms. Yeager is not even close to being what I would call Scholarly, as in Mr. Unz or John Wear.
So all there is is a puffed up ego, with a petty and mean-spirited hag attached to the other end.
(there are some -I think two in all the years I’ve been here- who I’ve refereed to as hags, Hillary and Madeleine Albright. I don’t make a habit of it).
Is it fair to call such a thing ‘a troll’?
I’d say so. Because I wouldn’t want anyone who participates in good faith, to ever encounter such an unbelievably rude bitch, without having at least been warned.
fwiw (and so other can be warned).
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John Wear says:
You write: “No, John, I asked only two questions in my comment #1249. And your response in #1256 answers neither of those two questions. Once again, my questions were:”
My response: Actually, you asked five questions in your comment #1249. I will answer them one at a time as follows:
1) If they were “transited to other camps,” would they have gotten right back on the train?
My response: Possibly some Hungarian Jews would have, but many would not get right on the train.
2) Or would they have stayed in Auschwitz-Birkenau for a few days, weeks, or months, and then got on a train to some new destination?
My response: Most would not have stayed in Auschwitz-Birkenau for very long. Typically not more than a few days. Viktor Frankl who I cite in my comment is probably the norm.
3) Where would the have stayed while in Auschwitz-Birkenau?
My response: In barracks.
4) You ask: “How many barracks were there at Auschwitz-Birkenau for old people and young children?”
My response: I don’t know.
5) You ask: “And how would they fit in Auschwitz-Birkenau, if the camp was already full when they arrived in May and June of 1944?”
My response: I don’t know that Auschwitz-Birkenau was already full when the Hungarian Jews arrived. With people transiting in and out of the camp, there could have been room for incoming Jews.
You write: “The closest you come to actually answer either of my two questions is that you quote Rudolph…But you provide absolutely zero indication that those 79,200 Hungarian Jews were composed of young children and old people who were “unfit for work.”
My response: I don’t know of any way to obtain such data. How could I know how many of the 79,200 Hungarian Jews were composed of young children and old people who were “unfit for work”?
You ask: “What do you think happened to those people in those pictures? Especially, what happened to the people in the captions labeled as being “in a grove near gas chamber number four prior to their extermination”?
My response: These people were not sent to homicidal gas chambers. I know this because there were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
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Mefobills says:@Rurik
I’d say so. Because I wouldn’t want anyone who participates in good faith, to ever encounter such an unbelievably rude bitch, without having at least been warned.
Agree totally Rurick.
I tested her with Goebbels. Six days into NSDAP coming into power, Goebbels went on a tour to educate German women and their new status. They were not to engage in politics. It was priority one to return women to their traditional roles. Germany had been economically busted out and was in civilizational collapse. They also were in population collapse, just as in the West today.
At link 635 above is her response. She is a proud masculine woman who does not want to submit to authority.
The role for women is to evolve their souls as women, and that especially means nurturing their children and next generation of men, not attacking men. She does not have a feminine spirit, which Goebbels wanted for German women.
In other words, she is a terrible example of a proper national socialist woman, yet wraps herself in the minutia of national socialism.
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Patrick McNally says:@Pierre de Craon
> fallback figure
It’s not fallback. There obviously many Jewish deaths caused by Einsatzgruppen, starvation in ghettos and much else of the same kind. Whatever the correct number of excess Jewish deaths may have been, it certainly was something notable. There’s just no reason to be attached to the six million number. Do you know of any specific publication or newspaper interview where Bauer said what you attribute to him? I’m not saying he did or didn’t say it, but I’d have to be able to look it up myself.
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littlereddot says:@Mark Bahner
But Occam’s Razor
Occam’s Razor depends on reliable data on which to make a judgement. In this case, what I have been seeing is data filtered by people with their own biases. Until I examine the data on my own, and ensure that they have not been cherry picked to suit one pre-determined set of biases or another, I will have to remain agnostic about it.
Here is a very important point that I have come to realise:
The same set of facts can look totally different, perhaps even diametrically opposite, depending on who is spinning the story.
Let me say it simply for clarity, I am not yet decided whether your view is right or wrong….I have just not yet satisfied myself which is correct, because I do not trust what anybody tells me.
All the stuff you’re talking about is design by and for people who give a damn about human life. That was simply not the case with Nazis and Jews in WW2.
The people who built the gas chambers surely wouldn’t want:
1. Themselves and the guards and staff to be killed by poisons while they were standing outside the chambers?
2. The personnel going into the chambers to clear out the bodies and bring them to the crematoria to be poisoned on the spot?
3. The new batch of jewish victims to be spooked by dead bodies lying all over the gas chamber and panic and thus become less manageable?All of these points show that they would have taken care to design the gas chambers properly to achieve their aims.
Let’s take the case of Hungarian Jews that arrived in May and June 1944. We know beyond a doubt that approximately 400,000 Jews were put on trains in Hungary that ended up in Auschwitz. Here’s how people *at the time* reported the process:
1) People get off the trains. They’ve been traveling for many hours or even days without adequate food, water, or toilet facilities.
2) People get selected as fit for work, or unfit for work. The unfit for work are virtually always: children under, say, 12 years old; old men and women, say, over 65 years old.
3) The unfit for work are walked to a large building containing an undressing room, a gas chamber, and a crematorium.
4) The children and old women and men are forced to strip in a common room. They’re then moved right next door to the gas chamber, which can hold up to 2000 people (although that makes it jam-packed). They’re told they’ll be showered to be de-loused. When the door shuts and locks, the Zyklon-B is dropped down from holes in the ceiling. Screaming is heard for several minutes.
5) After a period of time that is less than a few hours, the door is opened, and Jewish prisoners began moving the bodies out of the gas chamber, up an elevator to the crematorium room, where bodies are burned with coke (a special type of coal).Let me tell why I am so careful about taking data on board, especially from the telling and retelling.
I live in Singapore, a former British colony. It is perceived to be in the Western camp against China. We, afterall host US Naval facilities. Western media is ubiquitous here, and the BBC is highly regarded as reliable and accurate. This is the background.
We are in the same time zone as Hong Kong. And as you know in 2019 there were HK “Pro Democracy Protests”. By the power of social media, we could see events unfold in near real time. Unlike in the West, where the Brits see things 8 hours later, and you in the US see it nominally 12 hours later.
In one particular incident, there was a policeman who was attacked by “protestors”. He was lying on the ground, and the kids were kicking him. The policeman’s colleague ran up to protect him. He waved them off with both open hands. The “protestors” retreated momentarily, but soon returned, this time one of them wielding a metal pole.
When this “protestor” advanced with the pole, this was the time that the policeman drew his service revolver and fired.
This scene was broadcast minutes after it happened and millions in Asia saw how it unfolded.
Then some hours later, Western media started broadcasting it. However, what was shown was simply the policeman drawing his pistol and shooting the “poor innocent protestor”. The entire context of the incident had been DELIBERATELY EDITED OUT.
This shows without a doubt, that Western media is actively participating in shaping opinions. It was not limited to one news channel. BBC, CNN, DW, France24 were all showing the same thing.
I know, because I deliberately checked on them. To me it was a litmus test to see if Western media was just being negligent or innocently over enthusiastic about telling the story…..NO! They were deliberately TWISTING the facts to tell a bold faced lie.
I had already been smelling a rat about official accounts from the time of the 2003 Iraqi Invasion. And my friends used to laugh at me at being a conspiracy theorist. But after this HK incident, most of them have come to the same distrust of Western media.
Now for some of them, any mention of the US or anything Western will elicit an angry
curse “F*CK the USA”. Others refuse to buy any US goods or services. In time this sentiment will only grow…not only in Singapore, but the rest of SE Asia, and by extension the rest of the world.Sorry to be so long winded, but I just wanted to explain my position.
Now that I have done it. I will explain that the litmus test that I used to decide on the reliability of Western MSM, ….. I am now applying to the veracity of the Holocaust story.
You will please forgive me for trying to sift out fact from fiction.
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littlereddot says:@littlereddot
Folks, are there anyone familiar with chemistry reading this? I would like to know how long the toxicity of Zyklon B lasts.
Thanks in advance for any input.
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Mefobills says:
Ron Unz is not a spiritual Jew. There have many others like himself, for example Spinoza.
Spinoza went against the dominant narratives of the Jewish Kahal leadership of the day. He especially did not like the underhanded tactics the Jewish leadership was using to print Bibles (in English) in order to dupe the English people.
There were many other subversive screeds published by Manessah Ben Israel and the Jewish community in Amsterdam. They were printed in various languages, especially in English.
Spinoza was ex-communicated from the Jewish community. In today’s world if you have a moral consciousness then it can go very bad for you.
PCR broached this subject here:
https://www.unz.com/mwhitney/rescue-from-the-matrix/
“Germany did not Start World War 2”. Here’s a brief excerpt from the article:
“The aims of the National Socialist German Workers Party… (was) to correct the unemployment caused by unjust reparations forced on Germany… following World War 1 and to put Germany… back together.…
World War 2 began when the Churchill government and the French… declared war on Germany.……
The German leader, Adolf Hitler, had reacquired German territories given to Denmark, France and Czechoslovakia by the humiliating Versailles Treaty and had united with German Austria without war…. The British guarantee emboldened the Polish military dictatorship to refuse to negotiate the return of German territory…. All Hitler contributed was to force countries given German territory by the Versailles Treaty to release the lands and the Germans, who were heavily persecuted in Czechoslovakia and Poland. Hitler’s restoration of Germany’s national boundaries was misrepresented in the British and US press as ‘German aggression.’….This fake news story of German aggression was used to to build the case that Germany, which was merely recovering its national territory, and rescuing German people from persecution in Czechoslovakia and Poland, was an aggressor with world conquest as its goal…
Hitler stated many times that he did not want, or intend, war with Britain and France and only intended to recover the lost German populations stolen from Germany by the unjust Versailles Treaty.” Empire Of Lies, Paul Craig Roberts, Korsgaard Publishing, page 280, 2023
Occasionally, there are men who are born into this world, who have a pair of testicles between their legs; and PCR is one of those men. Ron Unz is also a truth teller, and has giant testicles.
I count sayanim goy as lower than the many honorable jews.
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Rurik says:@Mefobills
Thanks Mefobills,
But I don’t have a problem with strong women per se, and certainly not proud women. I like proud, intelligent women.
I get your points, but I’m personally not such a purest when it comes to National Socialism. I say whatever works.
My problem isn’t with proud women, but rudeness, male or female.
People who participate in bad faith.
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Pierre de Craon says:@Rurik
I regret to say that I see no exaggeration in your account of the abuse you have taken from Carolyn. Indeed, when you write that I saw some of the remarks though perhaps not all, you are more correct than you know. That is to say, I found the character of the exchange so distressing that I moved on as quickly as I could.
Again, it is plain to me that you are the one who has been wronged. You are thus especially to be commended for stepping away rather than further escalating the animosity level of a heated exchange where you were not the source of most of the heat.* It is indeed precisely for that reason that I continue to think that Kali should have taken a similar initiative. It certainly wasn’t as if his/her point hadn’t already been amply made. Besides, with what must approach a hundred comments from McNally and Bahner, any accusation of trolling has an almost impossibly high standard of comparison to meet.
Kevin MacDonald frequently and justly complains of pointless intramural squabbling among cultural traditionalists and advocates of white interests. Being conscious, as I am, of the fact that I have more than once been guilty as charged,** I am trying to do better. I should like to think that suggesting to others that they too do better is a pardonable aspect of being, if not a true peacemaker, then perhaps a peacemaker en apprenti.
____________
*I recall with genuine regret a score of occasions in the past five years where I wish I had done the same. Thus, your good example is doubly inspiring.
**Indeed, this is the very reason I used the words “fraternal spirit”: to acknowledge my brotherhood in failure to meet appropriate standards of conduct now and then.• Replies: @RurikAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Rurik says:@Pierre de Craon
Besides, with what must approach a hundred comments from McNally and Bahner, any accusation of trolling has an almost impossibly high standard of comparison to meet.
Lol
perhaps a peacemaker en apprenti.
as usual, your eloquence transcends
to acknowledge my brotherhood in failure to meet appropriate standards of conduct now and then.
mea culpa Pierre, mea culpa
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Mark Bahner says:
“Libel” is the PRINTING of something that is not true…
Yes, “libel” is printing and “slander” is speaking.
What do think is happening here, printing or speaking? Do you hear my voice coming out of your computer?
For being an “engineer,” your education appears to be sorely lacking. Especially about September 11, 2001 and what actually went on that day – NOT what we were told went on…
Ron Unz wrote correctly and appropriately pointed out a long time ago that 9/11 comments should be moved to here:
https://www.unz.com/runz/seeking-9-11-truth-after-twenty-years/
But speaking of which, this about says it all:
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Pierre de Craon says:@Patrick McNally
This 1989 article from the Times just scratches the surface, but it certainly establishes Bauer’s “controversial” status. Even so, the article’s last paragraph, written by Peter Steinfels and quoting Bauer, is hilarious. It effectively declares that numbers (i.e., truth) should not be allowed to obscure Jewish suffering (i.e., something other than truth).
Several Bauer articles from learned journals are available (more or less) via JSTOR. Fifteen years ago, when I still worked full-time in academic-reference publishing, I had a company-provided access link to all JSTOR-archived materials. (I first got a link via Macmillan Reference, where I worked for almost ten years starting in the late eighties. To my knowledge, every other US publisher has a similar link.) I still have the link from my last employer and use it to read JSTOR stuff. Virtually everything even remotely involving analysis or criticism of Jews, however, including several Bauer articles, is now locked out to all save those who have university-provided links.
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Pierre de Craon says:@Rurik
This terrific photo of Catherine Austin Fitts, esteem for whom we share, makes me think of the photo taken for the mid-nineties’ renewal of my driver’s license. At the time, I regarded the photo as a gross misrepresentation of, shall we say, my largely inoffensive appearance. The very same photo adorns my current driver’s license, and I now see it as chronicling the Christian Bale or Robert Redford phase of my adulthood.
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Pierre de Craon says:@Rurik
mea culpa, Pierre, mea culpa
Alas, there is plenty of culpa to go around, my friend. My own shelf is well stocked.
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Mark Bahner says:@Mark Bahner
Sorry, your answers have only raised many more questions.
1) If they were “transited to other camps,” would they have gotten right back on the train?
My response: Possibly some Hungarian Jews would have, but many would not get right on the train.
Keep in mind, I was asking about people deemed “unfit for work“…children and the elderly. If these children and elderly got “right back on the train”, where would they go to? Why would they go to some other camp where they knew almost no one and would have no support? Take, for example, young children separated from their parents and given to grandparents or even elderly strangers. How does that make sense to drop them off at Auschwitz, then have them get right back on the train to somewhere else? Wouldn’t it make more sense to just come into their home in Hungary and take *only the parents* or *only one parent* to Auschwitz? After all, even if the Nazis took both parents to Auschwitz from Hungary, and left the little kids in their houses, there would still be neighbors, and the children would still have a house to live in, right?
2) Or would they have stayed in Auschwitz-Birkenau for a few days, weeks, or months, and then got on a train to some new destination?
My response: Most would not have stayed in Auschwitz-Birkenau for very long. Typically not more than a few days. Viktor Frankl who I cite in my comment is probably the norm.
Again, Viktor Frankl was was “fit for work.” I’m asking about children and the elderly. If they stayed in Auschwitz-Birkenau for just a few days, and then went somewhere else, where would they go? What camp would want children–many of them separated from one or more parent–and old people not fit for work?
How does that make any sense to you? Germany takes them from Hungary, where they’re living together just fine with their families, and then ships them to Auschwitz-Birkenau for a few days, and then ships them to *another camp*? How do the children get along in that other camp, separated from one or even both parents? Why would Germany–which was busy *losing a war*– take people from their homes, and put them in camps where they had *no food* to feed themselves and no doctors they could call on if they were sick? What idiotic government would do such a thing?
You ask: “What do you think happened to those people in those pictures? Especially, what happened to the people in the captions labeled as being “in a grove near gas chamber number four prior to their extermination”?
My response: These people were not sent to homicidal gas chambers. I know this because there were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
So Rudolph Hoess is lying? Because he was tortured *so much* that he didn’t simply get wrong the number of people killed in gas chambers in Auschwitz, he even *invented* that there were any gas chambers in Auschwitz?
And I’m reading a book right now by a man named Shlomo Venezia entitled, “Inside the Gas Chambers: Eight Months in the Sonderkommando of Auschwitz. He was a Greek Jew who arrived at Auschwitz on April 11, 1944…7 months before the Nazis blew up the things four things that merely *looked* like gas chambers. (And have you ever explained why they blew up the four things that looked like gas chambers?)
The forward to the book is by Simone Veil, who says she arrived in Auschwitz from Drancy, four days later.
Schlomo Venezia says that immediately after arriving to Auschwitz, his 44-year-old mother, and sisters aged 14 and 11, were sent to a gas chamber. He says that out of the entire train he was only, only 326 people were selected as “fit for work,” and the rest were sent to a gas chamber with his mother and two younger sisters.
The book is in the form of short questions and lengthy answers. On page 69:
Did the SS man wear a gas mask?
No, I never saw a German wearing one, neither when pouring the gas in nor when opening the door. I know many people have claimed they did wear them. That might have been the case in other crematoria, but not in mine. There was no point, since the operation was very rapid. The cover was just opened, the gas thrown in, it lasted about ten to twelve minutes, then you couldn’t hear anymore, not a living soul. A German came to check that everyone was really dead by looking through a peephole placed in a thick door (it had iron bars on the inside to prevent the victims from trying to smash the glass). When he was sure everyone was well and truly dead, he opened the door and came out right away after starting the ventilation system. For twenty minutes, you could hear a loud throbbing noise, like a machine breathing in air. Then, finally, we could go in and start to bring corpses out of the gas chamber. A terrible, acrid smell filled the room. We couldn’t distinguish between what came from the specific smell of gas and what came from the smell of the people and the human excrement.
All lies? Lies about his two younger sister and his mother? Lies about the small percentage of people selected as “fit for work”? Lies about the gas chamber’s existence? He wrote a whole book filled with lies like that?
Do you think he and his mother and two younger sisters were even *at* Auschwitz-Birkenau, or do you think he’s even lying about that?
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Mark Bahner says:@littlereddot
Occam’s Razor depends on reliable data on which to make a judgement. In this case, what I have been seeing is data filtered by people with their own biases.
What data are you looking for?
The people who built the gas chambers surely wouldn’t want:
1. Themselves and the guards and staff to be killed by poisons while they were standing outside the chambers? –>No, but unless there were needlessly high concentrations inside, there should be any problem there.
2. The personnel going into the chambers to clear out the bodies and bring them to the crematoria to be poisoned on the spot? –> See the account above, from Shlomo Venezia, the Greek Jew who wrote a book titled, “Inside the Gas Chambers: Eight Months in the Soderkommando of Auschwitz”
3. The new batch of jewish victims to be spooked by dead bodies lying all over the gas chamber and panic and thus become less manageable? –> Per accounts by people who claim to have taken out the dead bodies from the gas chamber, all the bodies were removed.
You will please forgive me for trying to sift out fact from fiction.
There’s never any need to ask forgiveness from me for that!
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Thank you, Mark.
When I read the reference to Shlomo Venezia, a Greek Jew, a memory was triggered.
“Dario Gabbai recalls his experiences as a Sonderkommando in Auschwitz II-Birkenau. He was forced to usher people into gas chambers, and then haul out the bodies, take them to the crematorium, and clean up the room for the next group of victims.”
Dario said, on camera the following:
Upon his arrival to Auschwitz, the roadway was covered with human bones. They were made to pulverize the bones, and deposit the bone powder in the Vistula river.
2500 to 3000 people were sent to the gas chamber most days. He claims that mostly Hungarian Jews were dropped directly from the tram to the stairwell leading down to the chamber.
Zy-b was dropped from the opening in the ceiling.
It took 4 or 5 minutes for the victims to die.
He entered the chamber about 15 to 20 minutes after their death. The deceased were black and blue from the gas.
What equipment did you use to remove the bodies, Mr. Gabbai? He said “canes”; we used the hook end of the cane. We put the bodies in an elevator and sent them upstairs. Sometimes he screamed because of the gas.
How were you able to do all this so quickly? It’s was very hard.
The bodies were incinerated to ash in 30 to 40 minutes. They put “about 4” bodies in each oven. Any remaining bones were pulverized.
…………………………………………………………………..Mr. Gabbai’s cousin, Venezia, said on camera in 1999: I have never said this story before; one day three babies arrived without their mothers. I was made to hold all three while the SS soldier attempted to shoot all three in the head. But, only two died. I asked why don’t you kill the third baby? SS monster did not want to waste a bullet.
……………………………………………………………………My thought is this occurred in their imaginations.
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Fran Taubman says:@Mark Bahner
Not going to get into this thread. But I just wanted to butt in and say to Mark you are asking the wrong question, because you are talking to dishonest people. So you will get a lot of BS back.
The correct question which will stop these nut job deniers flat in their tracks. Is why in 1944 with all the fronts closing in on the Germans, and quite obvious the Germans were going to lose the war, did Eichmann create a staff and divert precious resources like fuel for trains used to resupply the front lines, divert these last resources to ship 475,000 Hungarian Jews (who were already rounded up in ghettos posing no threat to the Germans.) to Auschwitz? Why? Butz claimed that only employable Jews were shipped to Auschwitz, but the photos from the Auschwitz Album which was found in 1988 and was shot by an SS officer and verified by all the top deniers, ship old women, disabled men, and young women with babies, all looking like they were ready for the famous German T4 euthanize program of just unfit to live Germans. The T4 gassing program was before the war.
It is a question that has bugged the best deniers. Himmler told Eichmann to stop. The world told Eichmann to stop. The Swedish government set up an embassy to hide Jews with diplomatic immunity. All of the neutral countries begged Eichmann to stop the transports. It was only when the Allies threaten Horthly with war crimes that the transports stoped. And yes the unfit for work Jews died the day they entered Auschwitz because there was no room for them. There was no room for anyone anywhere, as the entire camp system was breaking down, people starving and sick.
So why transport all those Jews? Eichmann was an idealist and felt it was his obligation to rid Germany of the Jews, because he viewed them as the enemies of Germany, especially eager to murder women and children to stop a future generation of Jews. Now most people on this thread hate Jews and the irony is that they say it did not happen but at the same time wish it did. LOL Eichmann gladly would have spent his last days of the war eradicating the Jews. That is what he did
There is no other reason to transport those Jews to Auschwitz in 1944. None. And do not let John Wear swindle you with a story here and a story there. The extermination of the Hungarian Jews is one of the most well documented part of the war. Every train, fuel etc. and Jew was recorded. Jews were told to report to places and waited in the open air for days to board trains. Mass hysteria in Budapest. Non Jews say the German occupation of Hungary was like watching a horror movie everyday. Eichmann was obsessed and personally would run around from train to train making sure every Jew was on board. Not only was there no toilet there was no toilet paper, people got off the train smelling like feces, you think they were transported onto other trains? I think not. They were barely alive, when they arrived.
Game, set, match for H denial. Everyone on the planet including Eichmann new they were transporting the Jews in 1944 to murder them, every last one to the very last day. They say if Eichmann had been more concerned with the war than with transporting and murdering Jews, the war might have ended differently.
Eichmann in preparation for the mass murder ordered extra ramp space for larger trains, and a big beautiful eight muffle oven from Topf and Sons, for high speed incineration, multiple burning bodies at once.
So just ask the one simple question to these psycho Jew haters. Why in the summer 1944 did Eichmann order the transportation to Auschwitz 475,000 Jews mostly women, the disabled the old, the sick and babies? For what reason? Not one denier or revisionist can answer that question, and were shocked to see all those feeble Jews in the album.
These people right here; Below the big boys from the same SS phot album.
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Brosi says:@Mark Bahner
This Codoh article is not a book review, but a complete debunking of the typical Jewish lies in the book that ((Mark Bahner)) wants to flaunt as the gospel truth. Here is what Mattogno says:
17) Conclusion
The book Sonderkommando Auschwitz is presented as “The Truth about the Gas Chambers” and “A Unique Testimony”. These reports are completely unfounded, even from the point of view of the historiography of the Holocaust.The book supplies in fact no “truth” which was previously unknown and only repeats in a confused and vague manner some “truths” which were already known. It provides no major contribution, or even anything new, to our knowledge of Auschwitz, on the contrary, it systematically evades all historically relevant questions.
The chronology is practically non-existent. After the date of arrival at Auschwitz, on 11 April 1944[260], the next date to appear in the book is the beginning of October 1944[261],
…
The process of extermination, in Venezia’s book, also remains lost in a fog.bhere is no description of “Bunker 2”; or of the supposed “cremation pits”, of which Venezia does not even indicate the number.
As regards Crematorium III, the description of the undressing room is almost non-existent, that of the gas chamber, non-existent. Historical problems essential to confuting “negationism”, such as those of the Zyklon B introduction devices, vanish in an embarrassing silence; from the book, one learns neither the dimensions of the gas chamber, nor how it was designed[262], or equipped or how the apertures of the induction and exhaust system were arranged, nor how one accessed the gas chamber from the undressing room. No description of the reinforced concrete lid on the Leichenkeller1 in the north courtyard of the crematorium, whether it was on ground level or above ground, no description of the “chimney”, and possibly how many there were or how they were arranged.
The same fog wafts over the narration of the cremation: here as well, everything escapes us and remains indistinct. Venezia tells us nothing about the crematory ovens: their construction system, their functioning, their coke consumption, not even how many there were. On their cremation capacity, by contrast, he provides very precise, but technically absurd details which contradict each other.
LOL. ((Bahner)) the “environmental engineer” seems awfully gullible and a complete moron when it comes to critical environmental engineering issues of mass gas chambers and cremation of bodies in open pits.
In conclusion, getting back to the analysis of V. Pisanty, it may be said that Venezia’s testimony is the fruit of a confabulation in Venezia’s mind between that which he actually saw, that which he heard about during his internment, and that which later came to be added, in his memory, to events he actually experienced, after reading other works on the subject, with the result that “the immediacy of memory has disappeared, in favor of a more consistent and complete vision of the supposed extermination process”, which is transformed into a historical romance.
But precisely for this reason, the historians who present him as “The Truth about the Gas Chambers” and “A Unique Testimony” can have no excuse and no justification – not even their atavistic ineptitude.
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Brosi says:@Rurik
Fitts is not only a limited hangout (she never names the Jew for one thing) and she often throws out all kinds of unbelievable distractions that discredit her and her followers. Things like incredible black budgets and UFO’s.
She also represents a mild form of feminism that bypasses much women’s natural role.
She comes from an elite family and was appointed to HUD likely due to connections and vagina.
I listen to her podcasts because she does offer some interesting viewpoints and does reveal some of the inside shenanigans of the masonic deep state, of which she is affiliated.
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Brosi says:@Patrick McNally
As far as I can see the number of excess Jewish deaths during World War II was somewhere between 2 and 3 million, probably closer (but greater than) 2. Maybe 2.25 million or so.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_denial
Holocaust denial is an antisemitic conspiracy theory[1][2] that asserts that the Nazi genocide of Jews, known as the Holocaust, is a myth, fabrication, or exaggeration.[3][4][5] Holocaust denial involves making one or more of the following false statements:[6][7][8]
– Nazi Germany’s “Final Solution” was aimed only at deporting Jews from the territory of the Third Reich and did not include their extermination.
– Nazi authorities did not use extermination camps and gas chambers for the mass murder of Jews.
– The actual number of Jews murdered is significantly lower than the accepted figure of approximately 6 million.
-The Holocaust is a hoax perpetrated by the Allies, Jews, and/or the Soviet Union.Your “between 2 and 3 million” IS “significantly lower than the accepted figure of approximately 6 million.“.
That makes you a holocaust denier and an antisemite. It also means that you are a hypocrite and a troll because on this webzine you actively and consistently spam other commenters with lies by these very same people who you tacitly admit are liars.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Wait, there’s more. Per Dario Gabbai:
What Jewish traditions did you celebrate at home in childhood? Oh, all of them. My mother did it.
Which ones? All of them, you know.
Did you go to synagogue? Very seldom I went to the synagogue.
Which holidays were your favorite? Rosh Hashanah. Yom Kippur. They were the high ones, you know.
What traditional foods did you have at home? Oh, what the Sephardic Jews always have.
Like what? Oh you know, the chicken. And rice. And beans. Fruits and vegetables.
Did you have a bar mitzvah? I think I had a bar mitzvah. I don’t remember exactly.
So you don’t remember it? No (he glances off camera).
Did you attend any type of Hebrew school? No.
He claims he doesn’t remember the synagogue he seldom attended so he can’t describe it.
He clears his throat and glances off camera constantly during the interview.
………………………………………………..He is clearly not Jewish. He’s Italian. Since you are a truth seeker, his interview is here:
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Truth Vigilante says:@Mark Bahner
In other words, are you saying that in May-June 1944, the Hungarian Jewish children under 12 and the old Hungarian Jewish men and women were put back on the trains, and sent to other camps?
You’re not very bright, are you Bahner ?
Let me ask you, WHY were ‘unfit for work’ Jews (eg: children, the elderly, disabled etc) sent to any of the work camps in the first place ?
Of course, if extermination of Jews was the Third Reich’s motive, said Jews could have been killed in their originating countries and just dumped in ditches in the forest and covered over by bulldozers, rather than been transported thousands of kilometres to far flung locations (utilising precious rail capacity that was much needed for another purpose).So Bahner, let me explain it to you, because you’re too dumb to work it out on your own.
For example, take the case of a typical 30-50 year old Jewish man who was a tradesman/artisan or professional that had skills that could be used in the German armaments industry, or even an unskilled fit and healthy Jew that could be trained to do some simple task on a production line.
Yes, the Germans could forcibly take just him to Auschwitz-Birkenau, and leave his two kids/pregnant wife and elderly in-laws behind in the ghetto in Krakow Poland.
Bear in mind, this is the 1940’s, there is no Zoom conference call/Skype technology around like there is today, so that this fit and able worker can check on his family each evening to see that they’re doing fine.Of course, it is OBVIOUS that such individuals would REFUSE to go to these work camps, and assuming they were forced to go, it was equally obvious that their productively would be very low to non existent, seeing as they’d be fretting over the welfare of their families.
SUMMARY: By letting the ‘unfit-for-work’ children and elderly relatives also travel with their fit-for-work men, the Germans achieved a ‘TWO-FOR’.
ie: a two for the price of one.Done this way, the Germans not only got the necessary workers for their factories that greatly contributed to the German war effort, but they SIMULTANEOUSLY cleared out the Jews from cities and towns that were going to be reincorporated into the greater Reich or were destined to be Jew free zones.
Seeing as the workers returned to their families in their comfortable barracks accommodation each night after their daily work shift, and all the while the Germans ensured that all individuals were well fed/housed/received good healthcare, this resulted in MAXIMUM PRODUCTIVITY from the workers.
To enhance morale in the camps the Germans ensured that plays were staged, an orchestra was formed, swimming pools were at most camps and football games were a regular occurrence.
All of these things are not indicative of an extermination camp.And it’s not as though the wives and elderly relatives were useless in the camps.
For certain they contributed in the babysitting/schooling of the children during the day, thus FREEING UP many mothers and young women to engage in tasks in the factories that contributed to the outputs of German armaments needs etc.
Many women and elderly no doubt worked in the production line kitchens/laundries etc, that played their part in contributing to the functioning of the work camp.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You ask: “So Rudolph Hoess is lying? Because he was tortured *so much* that he didn’t simply get wrong the number of people killed in gas chambers in Auschwitz, he even *invented* that there were any gas chambers in Auschwitz?”
My response: Yes. Rudolf Höss had been tortured so severely that he would say anything his captors wanted him to say. Höss was a totally broken man. His testimony would not carry weight in any legitimate court of law.
Höss was not the only commandant of Auschwitz. Richard Baer, the last commandant of Auschwitz, did not live to see the beginning of his trial in Frankfurt, Germany. He was arrested in December of 1960 in the vicinity of Hamburg. Baer during his pretrial questioning adamantly refused to confirm the existence of homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz during World War II.
Baer died in June 1963 under mysterious circumstances while being held in pretrial custody. An autopsy performed on Baer at the Frankfurt-am-Main University School of Medicine stated that the ingestion of an odorless, non-corrosive poison could not be ruled out as the cause of his death. There was no further probe into the cause of Baer’s death, and Chief Public Prosecutor Fritz Bauer ordered his body cremated. Conveniently, the Auschwitz trial in Frankfurt, Germany began almost immediately after Baer’s death. The statements Baer made during his pretrial interrogations were not read into the trial record. With Baer’s death the prosecutors at the Auschwitz trial were able to attain their primary objective—to reinforce the gas chamber myth and establish it as an unassailable historical fact.
It has been widely known ever since the illegal abduction of Adolf Eichmann in Argentina that the Israeli Mossad has immense capabilities. Given the fact that Chief Public Prosecutor Bauer was a Zionist Jew, which should have precluded him from heading the pretrial investigation, it is quite possible that the forces of international Jewry were able to murder Baer while he was in jail. If anyone knew the truth about the gas chamber allegation, it was Baer, the last commandant of Auschwitz. Baer’s untimely death prevented him from giving testimony that would have contradicted the official Holocaust narrative. Baer’s death was certainly a relief for the promoters of the Auschwitz trial. (Source: Stäglich, Wilhelm, Auschwitz: A Judge Looks at the Evidence, Institute for Historical Review, 1990, pp. 238-239).
You write: “What camp would want children–many of them separated from one or more parent–and old people not fit for work?”
My response: Large numbers of young Jewish children survived the so-called Holocaust. The survival of young children at Auschwitz-Birkenau is not surprising since Auschwitz-Birkenau served as a transit camp for detainees unfit for work. This is proven by a note dated July 21, 1942, concerning a telephone conversation that took place the day before. SS Hauptsturmführer Theodor Dannecker wrote:
“The question of the evacuation of children was discussed with SS-Obersturmbannführer Eichmann. He decided that transports of children are to take place as soon as transports into the General Government are again possible. SS-Obersturmbannführer Nowak promised to provide about six transports to the General Government at the end of August/beginning of September, which may contain Jews of all kinds (also those unfit for work and old Jews).” (Source: Mattogno, Carlo, Auschwitz: The Case for Sanity, Volume Two, Washington, D.C: The Barnes Review, 2010, p. 654).
The question I have for you is: If the so-called Holocaust happened, why did so many young children survive the “Holocaust”?
You ask about Schlomo Venezia: “All lies? Lies about his two younger sister and his mother? Lies about the small percentage of people selected as “fit for work”? Lies about the gas chamber’s existence? He wrote a whole book filled with lies like that?”
My response: I write about Schlomo Venezia toward the end of my article at https://inconvenienthistory.com/12/4/7562. I do not regard Venezia’s book and testimony as being credible.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Mark Bahner
Adding further to my last comment, and to answer the question you posed of:
‘were these Hungarian Jewish children and elderly people put back on trains and sent to other camps’,
the answer is, in many cases, an emphatic YES !!That’s because, if a particular worker was needed at (for example) Peenemünde, where the world’s first functional large-scale liquid-propellant rocket, the V-2, was developed, said worker and HIS WHOLE EXTENDED FAMILY would be put on the train and shipped out to that location.
Bear in mind also that in late 1944/early 1945, the Soviet army was fast advancing on Auschwitz-Birkenau, and the camp would soon be overrun.
Therefore, FOR CERTAIN the valuable workers and their extended families among these Hungarians that arrived in 1944, would have been transferred to other work camps within the Reich.Those that could not be transferred due to limited railway carriages available, would have been given the choice of either remaining in the camps to await the Soviets, or taking the option of walking westwards back to Germany – just like Anne Frank’s family were given that option.
Most, in view of how well the German’s had treated them, would likely have taken the walk to Germany option, but many would have perished in the unusually cold winter of December 1944/Jan 1945 (just as countless tens of thousands of German nationals also perished as they made similar journeys after abandoning their homes), or been killed by Allied bombardment as they made the trek.
Got it now Bahner ? That’s where your Hungarian Jews went. ie: the vast bulk of them survived the war and ended up scattered to the four corners of the globe.
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Zane says:@Truthor
Hiroshima Revisited.
https://archive.org/details/Hiroshima_revisited
A good podcast with Michael Palmer on the topic:-
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littlereddot says:@Mark Bahner
What data are you looking for?
Physical evidence either in the form of blue prints or detailed photographs. For example:
1. Themselves and the guards and staff to be killed by poisons while they were standing outside the chambers? –>No, but unless there were needlessly high concentrations inside, there should be any problem there.
a. Airtight seals on the doors or windows etc.
b. Negative pressure inside the gas chambers so that if there are any air leaks, air would flow into the chamber rather than poisonous gases flowing outwards
c. Extraction fan rooms or some sort of way to create the negative pressure within the gas chamber.2. The personnel going into the chambers to clear out the bodies and bring them to the crematoria to be poisoned on the spot? –> See the account above, from Shlomo Venezia, the Greek Jew who wrote a book titled, “Inside the Gas Chambers: Eight Months in the Soderkommando of Auschwitz”
Once the poison has done its deed, the chamber has to be rendered safe for guards and staff to enter. Therefore:
a. Filter room containing filter canister/medium with extraction fans etc to remove the toxic agents through a filter or
b. A means to introduce a neutralising agent to render the poison safe. This would require spray heads distributed around the chamber to spread the agent should it be liquid, or circulation fans if the agent was gaseous.
c. Possible airtight airlocks for access into the chamber for staff to test if the chamber is safe before the main doors are opened.
d. Decontamination facilities to decontaminate the staff who enter into the chamber but when they still have poison residue on them.3. The new batch of jewish victims to be spooked by dead bodies lying all over the gas chamber and panic and thus become less manageable? –> Per accounts by people who claim to have taken out the dead bodies from the gas chamber, all the bodies were removed.
This relates back to item 2 above, where the bodies must all be safely removed by staff so that the new batch victims would not suspect anything nefarious.
I am sorry, but I am not looking for verbal or written accounts. I stress that I am not saying that those accounts are fake. Only that for me, to function as solid evidence, they do not hold the same weight as physical evidence like I have described above.
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Mark Bahner says:@Truth Vigilante
Got it now Bahner ? That’s where your Hungarian Jews went. ie: the vast bulk of them survived the war and ended up scattered to the four corners of the globe.
So the account below is a complete lie?_______________
https://mjhnyc.org/blog/those-who-were-there-esther-schwartzman/
Yet, the Hungarian government did not allow the Germans to deport Hungarian Jews to the death camps. Esther and her family continued to live in Mukachevo, scraping together a living and celebrating Jewish holidays, even while most of Europe’s Jews were murdered just across the border in Poland. This was until March 1944, when Hitler installed a new, radical rightwing government in Hungary. Within days, Adolf Eichmann and special teams of SS arrived to plan the deportation of Hungarian Jewry. Between May 15 and July 7, almost 450,000 Hungarian Jews were sent to Auschwitz. About two-thirds were immediately sent to the gas chambers.
When Esther and her family arrived at Auschwitz, her mother, younger sister, and younger brother were immediately sent to the gas chambers. However, she was selected for work, along with her father and two older sisters. Esther and her sisters left Auschwitz on a transport that went first to Stutthof and then to a labor camp at Braunau, where they were forced to build munitions for the increasingly desperate German war effort.
Two-thirds of the Hungarian Jews shipped to Auschwitz between May 15 and July 7 were not “immediately sent to the gas chambers”?_________________
Instead, none of the 400,000+ Hungarian Jews was sent to a gas chamber at Auschwitz-Birkenau?_______________
And Esther’s mother, younger sister, and younger brother were *not* “immediately sent to the gas chambers”?____________________
In fact, not a single one of the three of them was sent to a gas chamber at Auschwitz-Birkenau?_____________________
Also, if the “vast bulk of them survived the war” why would they not go back to Hungary to try to reclaim their homes and possessions?_________________
Therefore, FOR CERTAIN the valuable workers and their extended families among these Hungarians that arrived in 1944, would have been transferred to other work camps within the Reich.
I know in your alternate universe of your mind “FOR CERTAIN the valuable workers *and their extended families* among these Hungarians that arrived in 1944, would have been transferred to other work camps within the Reich”.
But on this planet earth in this universe, Hungarian Jews that arrived in 1944 and were not “fit for work”–people like Esther’s mother, little sister, and little brother–were immediately murdered in gas chambers.
P.S. John Wear, all my questions to the hilariously ironically self-named “Truth Seeker” apply to you. Would you please answer the questions that I placed underlines after?
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John Wear says:
Mark Bahner,
You ask: “P.S. John Wear, all my questions to the hilariously ironically self-named “Truth Seeker” apply to you. Would you please answer the questions that I placed underlines after?”
My response: There were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau. This is explained in my article about the Hungarian Jews at https://inconvenienthistory.com/15/2/8214.
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Mark Bahner says:@littlereddot
Hi littlereddot,
Physical evidence either in the form of blue prints or detailed photographs. For example:
You didn’t complete the sentence, “For example:….” so I don’t know what examples you’re looking for.
If you’re looking for photos of hundreds of dead bodies inside a gas chamber, with a Nazi guard giving a revolting “thumbs up”, ala the disgusting photos from Abu Ghraib…the Nazis weren’t *that* stupid.
https://www.rferl.org/a/iraq-war-lynndie-ghraib/24930947.html
In fact, the Nazis actually did a pretty good job, such as blowing up the gas chambers at Crematorium II, III, IV, and V in Birkenau, and burning most records. However, here is a diagram of Crematorium II at Auschwitz-Birkenau:
Here’s the website from which that blueprint comes:
https://www.yadvashem.org/yv/en/exhibitions/through-the-lens/auschwitz-blueprints.asp
From the text on that website:
Shortly after construction had begun at Birkenau, the decision was made to change its designation, and turn it into an extermination camp. The first experiments with gas were carried out in the main camp in the fall of 1941, and in the light of their success, the SS decided to build four permanent installations in Birkenau, for the specific purpose of gassing people to death. The construction began in 1942, directed by the Topf and Sons company, supervised by the SS. As a stopgap measure until the installations were completed, the Germans converted existing buildings to erect two makeshift gas chambers next to the camp.
The four extermination installations started operating in 1943. They each included an undressing room and a gas chamber, both underground, and a crematorium for incinerating the bodies of the murdered. These facilities made the murder of the Jews a far more efficient process.
SS man Perry Broad describes one instance of murder by gas that he witnessed:
“A number of victims noticed that the covers had been removed from the six holes in the ceiling (of the gas chamber). They screamed in terror when a head, covered in a gas-mask, appeared at one of the holes. The “disinfectors” went to work…. Using a hammer and chisel, they opened some innocuous-looking tins which bore the inscription “Zyklon, to be used against vermin. Attention, poison! To be opened by trained personnel only.” As soon as the tins were opened, their contents were thrown through the holes, and the covers were replaced immediately… about two minutes later, the screams died down, and only muffled groans could be heard. Most of the victims had already lost consciousness. Two more minutes passed, and Grabner (one of the SS men) stopped looking at his watch. Absolute silence prevailed.”
The extermination reached its peak in the spring and summer of 1944, with the deportation of some 430,000 Hungarian Jews to the camp, and the subsequent murder of the majority of the deportees.
During this period, the pressure on the extermination machinery was so great that the Germans also reactivated the makeshift gas chambers that had been operating in 1942.
In tandem with its transformation into a killing center, the economic significance of the Auschwitz camp complex also grew. The massive I. G. Farben factory was never completed, but thousands of prisoners were involved in its construction over the years. In addition, other factories were set up at Auschwitz for different products. Additional factories and workshops were built near the camps and prisoners were sent to work in them. Auschwitz also served as the center for collection and distribution of forced laborers to all areas of German industry. The largest allocation of Auschwitz prisoners was made in the spring of 1944, when some 100,000 prisoners from the Auschwitz complex were transferred to the German aircraft industry.
A sketch of the main camp, including one of the surrounding watchtowers, from the Vrba-Wetzler Report Concrete information about Auschwitz including relatively accurate drawings of its main camps and the extermination facilities only reached the West in the summer of 1944, in the form of the Vrba-Wetzler report.
Rudolph Vrba and Alfred Wetzler were Slovak Jewish prisoners who escaped from Auschwitz in April 1944. They prepared a comprehensive report on what was happening at Auschwitz, and sent it to the West via underground channels. The drawings included in the report are surprisingly accurate.
The construction work at the Auschwitz complex continued until November 1944. At this point, Himmler gave the order to halt the extermination of the Jews there, and the Germans began to dismantle the extermination facilities in order to conceal all traces of their crime. Later, the Germans dismantled further sections of Birkenau, but when the Red Army arrived on January 27th, 1945, most of the Birkenau camp was still intact.
The Germans incinerated the camp archives shortly before the Soviets arrived, but missed the construction archive, which was kept in a different building. As a result, the Soviets found a considerable amount of the technical paperwork – including many of the construction blueprints. These documents became accessible to researchers and the general public after the Cold War ended. From no other extermination camp did so much paperwork survive, including detailed documents about the extermination facilities. The Auschwitz construction blueprints thus constitute extraordinary documentation of the manner in which a major building operation served as a central tool of Nazi extermination policy. They will be preserved for perpetuity in the Yad Vashem Archives.
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littlereddot says:@Mark Bahner
Thanks, I have seen that plan. But it is a little small. But even on this blueprint/plan we can see that there is no airlock between the stairwell and the gas chamber. There is a possibility that this was an earlier plan before the retrofitting that Hoess was talking about. This is why I have not yet drawn conclusions and am keeping an open mind for more evidence.
If there is an airlock, it would look something like this:
In this case, the airlock would probably be much larger than shown above, as it would probably have also contained decontamination facilities. These would look like a washing bay where staff could be hosed down with neutralising chemicals.But in all cases, the airlocks would be a sealed chamber with 2 separate doors.
I would expect to see this kind of stuff in the facility if poison gases are involved….but in a larger industrial scale.
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Mark Bahner says:@Tiptoethrutulips
Tiptoethrutulips
You are hysterical again, and you just did the exact thing he surmised was happening, thereby confirming his suspicions, i.e. don’t bother lifting up carpets, or peering into pots, everything’s already been resolved….did I mention the raging infernos, raging in soggy bottoms? Would you like to spend some time in the dungeon for asking a few questions? Have you seen that pretty little wife of yours lately?
Maybe that’s not exactly what you said, but we know what you mean.
No, that’s the exact opposite of what I both said and meant. I asked *questions*. I did not make statements. Here were the questions I asked:
I gather you subscribe to some flavor of the first theory? Do you think not one single person was gassed to death with Zyklon B at Auschwitz?
John Speke was free to answer those questions anyway he wanted. He could have said, “No, I think there might have been a gas chamber at Auschwitz, but I just don’t think many people were killed that way.”
Or whatever. I just presented two positions, and asked if he “subscribed” to one position or the other. (It seemed like, from what he wrote, he “subscribed” the first position, so I sort of emphasized that position in my *questions*.)
https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/subscribe
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
John,
So if Esther Schwartzman says her mother, little brother, and little sister went to the gas chamber, she is either lying or mistaken?
If she’s lying or mistaken, where do you think her mother, little brother, and little sister went?___________
And if the article says “about two-thirds” of the 400,000+ Hungarian Jews in May and June of 1944 went to the gas chambers, do you think they’re lying?______________
Or do you think they’re simply mistaken?_________________
“About two-thirds” of 450,000 people is approximately 300,000 people. If you think that *none* of those approximately 300,000 people went immediately to the gas chambers at Auschwitz, where do you think they went?_________________
The approximately 300,000 people that the article says went directly to the gas chambers came to Auschwitz in May and June of 1944. Victory in Europe was May 8, 1945…about one year later. How many of those 300,000 people do you think survived to May 8, 1945?_____________
And where were they on May 8, 1945?______________________
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Rurik says:@Pierre de Craon
father time is an unforgiving old man, and he spares none of us..
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Mark Bahner says:@littlereddot
Once the poison has done its deed, the chamber has to be rendered safe for guards and staff to enter. Therefore:
a. Filter room containing filter canister/medium with extraction fans etc to remove the toxic agents through a filter or
b. A means to introduce a neutralising agent to render the poison safe. This would require spray heads distributed around the chamber to spread the agent should it be liquid, or circulation fans if the agent was gaseous.
By “a”, you mean something like this?
https://emilms.fema.gov/is_0156/groups/294.html
And if you did not find either of those two things, what conclusion(s), if any, would you make?
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littlereddot says:@Mark Bahner
Further to my last comment#1298, I will give you an update:
So far, the best blueprint / plan I can find is this one. It is a little small but I can get the gist of what is going on here. (blueprint is a colloquial term, and I am more used to using the correct architectural term “plan”, so I shall use it from now on. Plan simply is how the design looks when you look straight down. It is normally notionally cut at 1 metre from the ground level….so doors and windows will be shown. If it is cut higher than 2 metres, these will not usually appear)
I note that these may have outdated plans, and there may have been later alterations/modifications to the design of the Gas Chamber / Crematoria that are not shown here. If you, or anyone else does find them, please let me know.
From the looks of these plans, it appears that the facility was really used as a crematorium and would have functioned efficiently as such. If it were to be retrofitted as a gas chamber cum crematorium, some tell tale modifications would have to have been made.
If the facility were designed from scratch to be gas chamber cum crematorium, the design would have been quite different to maximize efficiency.
I doubt if you or anyone else is interested why I have drawn these observations, unless they enjoy peering into the details. If anyone does, let me know.
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRBaQVhU7nwF9y5DFIcT4CXHNYsPO3LAVOSUw&usqp=CAU
The website where it is from:
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Rurik says:@Brosi
Fitts is not only a limited hangout (she never names the Jew for one thing)
I think the reason I was thinking of her was I had recently watched this video
Video Link
at 20 to 30 seconds in they mention the astounding fact that the United States Treasury Secretary is a Israeli dual citizen. And, former Chair of the Federal ReserveFrom 11:10 to 11:57, a younger Ron Paul comes right out and calls it evil.
this juxtaposition of the U.S. Treasury, the Fed, and the power of total secrecy, is our, (and the rest of the world’s) misfortune.
Since Americans can’t or won’t fix it, (and certainly not our craven and venal congress), the rest of the world has made it their mission to do so, because they know if these power-crazed maniacs aren’t stopped, we’ll all be Palestinians.
Were it not for Wilson and the Fed, there would not have been a WWII, or any Holocaust, however one describes that event. It would not have happened, were it not for the Fed. Neither would have 70 million people have been butchered or burned alive or starved or froze to death.
and while I’m at it, I’d say that if you asked every single Jewish supremacist- (whining about the so-called ‘Holocaust’), in their heart of black hearts, if you put it to them, that they had the power to prevent WWII from ever transpiring, and whereupon those Jews who died during that time, would not have died, but neither would have seventy million white Gentiles…
.. I’d say in every case, Jews like Yellen would grimly say, no, it must be so, losing a few Jews to the Holocaust, in order that the flower of Europe might be slaughtered off, and with it, any prospect that those white Christians, (Amalek) would have families, and pass on their genes to the next generations..
..is worth it.
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littlereddot says:@Mark Bahner
Yes, perhaps. But the pic you have attached is a sophisticated modern version. I would expect that during WW2 it might have been simpler in design.
This is why I appealed for someone familiar with chemistry to chime in. We don’t even know if the neutralising agent was liquid or gas, or a filter (charcoal or zeolite) was used. Or even how long the toxicity of Zyklon B was.
At this stage, there are many variables that I am unsure of to draw a firm conclusion.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
I apologize for my error. However, it wasn’t exactly an error.
You ask the exact same questions over and over again, regardless of the answers you are given. Sometimes you change a few words around, but you say/ask the same question.
How many times must someone say there were no HOMICIDAL gas chambers, therefore the answer to the question about how many were put to death in said chamber is NONE?
No one says there was no zy-b used; no one says there were no deaths in the camps. No one says the war/camps were not tragic for all concerned. No one says, I just don’t care about what happened to those women and children. Are you aware of the photographic images of healthy women and children in the death camps?
You are essentially baiting everyone and trying to evoke emotions by bringing up oh! The Horror! How can you look upon these faces and not have a care? How dare you question their suffering? That’s what you do; that’s what you are doing.
Please view the first ten or fifteen minutes of the video I sent you and tell me if you honestly believe that man grew up in a Jewish family in a Jewish community. He knows NOTHING about Jewish society. His eyes dart around constantly. He is looking at someone else in the room for signals about his answers. I guess he breathed in too much “deadly” gas; a few of his marbles must have rolled out the door. I could have given a much more convincing performance just for having watched Springtime for Hitler.
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Rurik says:@John Wear
My response: Yes. Rudolf Höss had been tortured so severely that he would say anything his captors wanted him to say. Höss was a totally broken man.
this guy?
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Mark Bahner says:@littlereddot
Hi,
The website where it is from:
http://www.deathcamps.org/gas_chambers/gas_chambers_auschwitz.htmlHere is text from that website:
Construction works on Crematory II began in August 1942. Although prisoners and civilian workers laboured at maximum speed, the construction works could not be finished as planned in mid-February 1943 but one month later.
The first mass murder in Crematory II took place on 13 March 1943. On this day about 1.500 Jews from Ghetto B in Krakow were killed with Zyklon B gas.
The gas chamber was 30 m long, 7 m wide, and 2.41 m high, giving a floor space of 210 m2. The ceiling consisted of about 22 cm reinforced concrete covered with 45 cm of earth. In late 1943 a wall was constructed in the gas chamber to create two separate gas chambers. If smaller transports had to be gassed, now only one of these smaller rooms (the rear one) was used to save gas and to accelerate the killing.
False showers were installed to deceive the victims and to keep up the infamous lie of bathing and disinfection. Because it took a while until all victims had undressed and entered the gas chamber, the first ones had time to inspect the room (the SS had installed lamps in the gas chambers to avoid panic). Therefore it happened that people became suspicious; panic broke out which was brutally put down by the armed SS men.
The gas chamber, not the undressing cellar, could be aerated and ventilated by a sophisticated ventilation system. The gas-tight entrance door was 192 cm high, 100 cm wide, and contained a spy hole which was secured from inside with an iron grille. The door was usually closed by use of a latch but could also be fastened with screws since the victims pressed against the door when they realized their fate.
The ceiling was propped up by seven concrete pillars. The insertion openings for the poison gas were located beside pillars nos. 1, 3, 5, and 7. They consisted of a quadrangular, 70 x 70 cm wire net column which reached from the floor to the ceiling. These special pillars had two outer layers made of wire nets with different mesh sizes. In the centre they had a movable nucleus also made from wire nets. This nucleus served as container for the carrier material for the Zyklon B gas.
When a gassing took place, the gas-tight caps at the upper ends of the “wire net gassing pillars”, on top of the ceiling above ground were opened by an “SS disinfector” who then poured the gas into the container. Then it was quickly let down by a cord to the floor of the gas chamber, and the cap put on the opening. After the gassing procedure the containers were pulled up and emptied. The basic idea of these installations was to spread the gas as quickly as possible and to therefore speed up the killing process.Do you think any of that text is clearly incorrect or probably incorrect?
Also, here is an aerial photo identifying sections of the building as “gas chamber” and “undressing room.” Do you think those designations are not correct?
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
My response: There were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau. This is explained in my article about the Hungarian Jews
John, how many of your so-called experts were actually in Auschwitz when the Hungarian Jews arrived?___________________
Also, do you think that every single person in mentioned in this article is lying/mistaken about the Hungarian Jews dying in gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau…even the SS guard?_____________
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/auschwitz-guards-account-of-gas-chamber-scene-differs-from-survivors/
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Patrick McNally says:@Pierre de Craon
To be fair to Bauer, at least within the NYT piece which you linked he was talking the Sovit claims of “4 million” at Auschwitz, rather than the general 6 million. It’s possible that he may have made other statements elsewhere which call into question the fabled 6 million. I would be curious if there was something about that.
Authors such as Gerald Reitlinger and Raul Hilberg had always dismissed the “4 million” claim made about Auschwitz by Soviet propaganda. Hilberg gave as a general estimate of Jewish population loss around 5 million. Even though this is obviously well short of 6 million, the 5 million could also be a gross overestimate. However, one should try to have a realistic sense of what is plausible even for revisionism.
The estimates for world Jewish population on the eve of World War II range between 15.7 and 16.7 million. It was Arthur Ruppin who produced the higher estimate of 16.7 in 1938 (before the war). At the time, Ruppin’s estimate was seen as a bit controversial by people who chose the 15.7 figure. After World War II, Ruppin’s estimate of 16.7 became set in stone and the older 15.7 figure was allowed to fade.
To the extent that there is a basis for Ruppin claiming that the 15.7 million estimate was too low, it relates to the Soviet Jewish population. Anywhere outside of the USSR, it is highly unlikely that anyone would have underestimated the European Jewish population. If anything, the sharp criterion which the Third Reich promoted (and which would have in the 1930s influenced such countries as Poland, Hungary, Romania, Yugoslavia among others) would have led to higher estimates of Jewish populations (since many non-practicing secular Jews were identified as racial Jews). But in the USSR, it’s plausible that many people who could be considered as ethnically Jewish may have chosen to register as non-Jews. So, Ruppin may have been correct that the true world Jewish population in 1938 was more like 16.7 million rather than 15.7 million.
The question becomes, what was the world Jewish population in the summer of 1945? For the first year after the war, it was not possible to make an estimate. But after a couple years the new global estimate for the immediate aftermath of the war was given as 11 million. Any serious revisionist argument must amount to alleging that that 11 million is a significant underestimate of the real world Jewish population in summer 1945.
This at least is a plausible hypothesis. If it was possible in 1938 for a controversy to happen over whether or not the world Jewish population was 15.7 or 16.7 million, then it is at least hypothetically plausible to imagine that the 11 million assigned to 1945 may actually be a serious underestimate. Of course, one shouldn’t just blandly assume that it is. One has to offer more than that, if this is to be a serious argument. Even allowing that the 11 million may be a significant underestimate, it would be absurd to claim that no serious loss of Jewish population happened, and that the world Jewish population of 1945 was still in a range of 15.7-16.7 million. If it were that high in 1945, then much better evidence would have emerged in support of revisionist arguments by now.
Without being in any way attached to the 11 million figure for 1945, I would say that the most extreme outer bounds which one might guess at for a higher number would be less than 14.5 million. The latter type of guess makes the assumption that there 3.5 million Jews who were wandering Europe and migrating out to different regions of the world and who escaped being counted in the 11 million tally.
Let’s grant that there was a lot of chaos across the whole world, and especially in Europe, after World War II that something like this is in the range of plausibility. Even that would still lead us to something like the 2.25 million (16.7 – 14.45) figure which I had suggested above. But of course, one would have to do more to really establish any such higher estimate for a post-1945 world Jewish population.
Part of what draws a haze over a lot of this is the fact that most Jews around played things rather low key for the first quarter-century after World War II. Despite the overall triumphalism after the war, there wasn’t really much said about Jews. By the 1970s, things had started to change, and many Jews became more vocal about specifically Jewish issues. But it was also apparent at that time that inter-breeding trends were growing on a massive scale. It’s been pointed out by others that Ultra-Orthodox Jews have become more prominent precisely as secular Jews have bred themselves into the Gentile population.
This makes it even more difficult to draw an easy extrapolation of the 1945 world Jewish population from current counts. One thing which helps is that birth-rates seem to be usually low among Jews who outbreed with non-Jews. Hence, you’re not likely to find an Orthodox Jew marrying a Roman Catholic and producing 10 children. Ivanka Trump is perhaps the exception which proves the rule. The last time I checked she was having 3 children. Most inter-marrying Jews have had 2 or less. Still, this kind of inter-breeding does complicate any honest attempt to extrapolate to the world Jewish population of 1945 in a manner that could challenge that 11 million number.
It should also be emphasized that, whatever the accuracy or inaccuracy of that 11 million number for 1945, it makes no sense to attribute to any kind of centralized conspiracy. Some people will charge that the American Jewish Congress wanted to come up with a lower figure in order to support atrocity claims against the Third Reich. That may have been partly true, but they also had an interest in locating as many Jews as they could in order to make capital of them, whether in Israel or anywhere else. Similarly, Soviet authorities may have had some desire to present inflated atrocity claims against the Reich, but they too had an interest at stake in spreading stories about how the USSR had saved Jews. More important is that these disparate actors such as the AJC, USSR and other parties were not closely coordinating anything together. That doesn’t preclude the possibility that the 11 million may still be an underestimate. But one should be cautious of any brazen conspiracy theories which attribute possible underestimations to any gigantic plot.
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Patrick McNally says:@Brosi
> That makes you a holocaust denier and an antisemite.
So what?
> It also means that you are a hypocrite and a troll because on this webzine you actively and consistently spam other commenters with lies by these very same people who you tacitly admit are liars.
I have never done anything of the sort. I have simply found myself forced to point out lies which are more popular on this board. For example, the lie that Jacob Schiff ever had anything to do with supporting Lenin. Or the lie made up by Robert Wilton which Trotsky traveled back from New York with 100 New York Jews who set up the Soviet government. Those types of lies are classical Right-wing lies which have a popularity on a board like this. But anyone who recycles such is just going to chewing on a Dachau gas chamber for the rest of their stupid life.
If any revisionist view ever does eventually come to replace the modern-day version of The Holocaust, it won’t come from recycling old Right-wing garbage from a century ago. It will require a careful look at historical records. Most people on this board have no grasp of what that even means.
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Rurik says:@Patrick McNally
for what it’s worth, taking a look at the length of your post, I just wanted to pass on to those others, (who are here in good faith), that I have a perfect and foolproof solution to your comments.
I don’t read them.
And again, just looking at how excruciatingly tiresome they are, I just wanted to pass on my simple and feel-good way to respond to them.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You ask: “So if Esther Schwartzman says her mother, little brother, and little sister went to the gas chamber, she is either lying or mistaken?”
My response: Yes. There were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
I recommend you read my article at http://www.wearswar.com/2023/06/25/why-was-the-1985-ernst-zundel-trial-a-disaster-for-the-holocaust-narrative/ concerning the 1985 Ernst Zündel trial. The prosecution could find no Holocaust survivors who could withstand cross-examination in this trial.
There were, however, witnesses at Zündel’s trial such as Ditlieb Felderer, who is a revisionist researcher of Jewish descent. Felderer testified that he had conducted 27 separate visits to Auschwitz, where he snapped more than 30,000 color photographs, took soil samples, and conducted infra-red analysis of rooms and buildings. He examined the camp from top to bottom, and sneaked into areas which were off limits to tourists. Zündel testified that Felderer’s photographs were important in the formation of his understanding of the alleged gas chambers at Auschwitz. However, none of Felderer’s photographs was permitted to be offered as evidence by the judge in Zündel’s trial.
Felderer testified that the real Zyklon-B rooms at Auschwitz were delousing chambers. These facilities were designed to save lives by fighting typhus through the fumigation of bedding and clothing. He said that faked or reconstructed exhibits were placed on the guided Auschwitz tour. These fake exhibits included the infamous “execution wall,” which Felderer discovered did not have any bullet holes in the wall. Felderer described Auschwitz as it is now portrayed as being a “Hollywood set” which carries on Zionist and communist propaganda.
Joseph G. Burg, a Jewish author who wrote several books on the Holocaust story, testified at the 1988 Zündel trial that he had spoken to hundreds of people who had been at Auschwitz-Birkenau when he visited the camp in the fall of 1945. Burg formed the opinion that there were no German extermination camps, the gas chambers had never existed, and there was no plan to exterminate the Jews of Europe.
Joseph Burg also testified at the 1988 Zündel trial that he spoke to hundreds of people who serviced and operated the crematoria, but he could not find anyone who had operated homicidal gas chambers. Burg testified that the crematoria had been established for hygienic purposes as a result of typhus and other diseases. Burg also testified that he attended the Nuremberg trials in 1946 and met Ilya Ehrenburg, who had visited Auschwitz-Birkenau, as well as a Jewish publisher who had been interned in Auschwitz for several years. Both Ehrenburg and the Jewish publisher said they did not see any homicidal gas chambers while at Auschwitz-Birkenau. (Source: Kulaszka, Barbara, (ed.), Did Six Million Really Die: Report of Evidence in the Canadian “False News” Trial of Ernst Zündel, Toronto: Samisdat Publishers Ltd., 1992, pp. 259-262).
A credible eyewitness who states that genocide did not take place at Birkenau is the Austrian-born Canadian Maria Van Herwaarden, who was interned at Birkenau from December 2, 1942 to January 1945. Van Herwaarden testified at the 1988 Ernst Zündel trial that she saw nothing at Birkenau that resembled mass murder. The Jewish prisoners she saw at Birkenau were not treated differently from the other prisoners. She also testified that many of the inmates at Birkenau died of diseases, and some inmates committed suicide. (Source: Ibid., pp. 253-255).
I could go on and on. There were numerous people at Auschwitz-Birkenau who have testified that they did not see any homicidal gas chambers or a German program of genocide.
As to your last questions such as “How many of those 300,000 people do you think survived to May 8, 1945?” and “where were they on May 8, 1945?”, they are not relevant and worth my time to answer.
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littlereddot says:@Mark Bahner
Do you think any of that text is clearly incorrect or probably incorrect?
I have no idea. Too many unknowns at this point.
Also, here is an aerial photo identifying sections of the building as “gas chamber” and “undressing room.” Do you think those designations are not correct?
I have no conclusions what they were EVENTUALLY used for.
But is clear to me what they were INITIALLY designed for.
From the blueprints/plans alone, the Architects who designed it, did not mean for it to be a gas chamber. They designed it exactly as one would expect a crematorium to be. What could later have retrofitted and used by the military as gassing and undressing chambers, were clearly originally used as cool temperature holding spaces for corpses before they could be cremated.
It is also clear that the architects designed in viewing galleries for mourning relatives to witness the cremation process….an act of emotional closure similar to when grieving relatives throw token amounts of soil to “bury” the coffin at the bottom of a grave pit in an in-ground burial.
So the architectural design is a very conventional one meant for normal cremation functions.
Of course it could still have been later retrofitted to function as a gas chamber, in which case I have not yet seen blueprints/plans that record such a retrofit.
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@Fran Taubman
What a typically Jewish satanic inversion! Isaias 5:20-21 You are the one who offered faked photos as your “evidence.” You were called on it https://www.unz.com/article/an-appeal-to-readers-stop-the-obsession-with-jews/?showcomments#comment-6026575 and then just scurried off to plant more of your recycled lies in this thread.
You are not qualified to be the moral arbiter here. YOU ARE THE PURVEYOR OF EXPLICIT DEATH THREATS against Geocat62 and me. https://www.unz.com/article/denying-holocaust-denial/?showcomments#comment-5346968 https://www.unz.com/article/my-paper-on-jewish-influence-blows-up/?showcomments#comment-5140379 et al. You are the purveyor of incessant personal attacks and vile perversions as I have well documented in this thread (and again below). You are the purveyor of fake evidence.… and you, the hypocritical perpetrator playing victim lamely whine about your exaggerated victimhood—as if Unz should give you unfettered say in what makes the pages and what does not.
Run Al, run for your life
Tick, Tock. Every Catholic in the world will hunt you down.
And if any violence against Jews is a result of you website. You will be prosecuted.
Run Al, Run for your life. And pray that no crazy person viewing your website decides to buy a gun and kill a view Jews after reading your Catholic Plan.
The Catholic Plan against the Jews.
Pray Al then run for your life. https://www.unz.com/article/denying-holocaust-denial/?showcomments#comment-5346968I want you to go deep down where the corpses are. Find those corpses and fuck then until your dick false off. Then choke until you yourself become a corpse.
https://www.unz.com/article/the-9-11-double-cross-conspiracy-theory/?showcomments#comment-5607072to geocat62: we will come after you for denigrating and threatening the well being of Jews, Judaism our culture and our livelihood. We will hunt you down, every last one of you, and destroy you. Think Germany and the Jews. https://www.unz.com/article/my-paper-on-jewish-influence-blows-up/?showcomments#comment-5140379
Not only do I and most people reject your ideas about Jewish ethnocentrism, we will come after you for denigrating and threatening the well being of Jews, Judaism our culture and our livelihood. We will hunt you down, every last one of you, and destroy you. Think Germany and the Jews. https://www.unz.com/article/my-paper-on-jewish-influence-blows-up/?showcomments#comment-5140379
Go Jerk off on some S & M porno.
https://www.unz.com/article/out-thought-out-bought-out-fought-why-the-9-11-truth-movement-failed/#comment-4973381etc.. etc., etc.
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Patrick McNally says:@Rurik
Your favorite hoax seems to be the claim that somehow Woodrow Wilson had something to do with Trotsky being allowed to return to Russia. I’ve noted before that the Russian foreign minister Paul Milyukov, following the demands made by Russian trade unions, had insisted to the Canadians that Trotsky be released. That was how he got released, not because of the hoax about Woodrow Wilson.
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Dube says:@Fran Taubman
The correct question …. Is why in 1944 with all the fronts closing in on the Germans, and quite obvious the Germans were going to lose the war, did Eichmann create a staff and divert precious resources like fuel for trains used to resupply the front lines, divert these last resources to ship 475,000 Hungarian Jews (who were already rounded up in ghettos posing no threat to the Germans.) to Auschwitz? Why?
Response, please.
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Rurik says:@Patrick McNally
this post one short enough
file:///C:/Users/User/Downloads/Wall%20Street%20&%20The%20Bolshevik%20Revolution%20-%20Antony%20Sutton.pdf
https://justice4poland.com/2019/04/10/who-financed-lenin-and-trotsky/
https://jesusisprecious.org/books/antony_sutton/wall_street_and_the_bolshevik_revolution.pdf
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Tiptoethrutulips says:
Mr. Dot,
Would you be willing to speculate what would happen to a person, who enters the chamber, armed with only a cane, without following or adhering to any established protocols for decontamination, approximately 30 or 35 minutes after the expiration of 2500 to 3000 people?
Of course, we don’t know the volume of said toxin/chemical used, but it was enough to kill the aforementioned number of people in 4-5 minutes.
Pure speculation, of course.
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Mark Bahner says:@Dube
Response, please.
That’s an easy one. With the war lost, there wasn’t much the Nazis wanted to do beyond murdering Jews.
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Patrick McNally says:@Rurik
Just to note the obvious contradiction, one of your links repeats the hoax about Jacob Schiff supporting the Bolsheviks. I’ve noted Priscilla Roberts discussion of the historical facts before:
But then your next link is simply Sutton’s book. Sutton, whatever other confusion he suffers from, quite rightly dismisses the whole thing about Jacob Schiff.
“It is significant that documents in the State Department files confirm that the investment banker
Jacob Schiff, often cited as a source of funds for the Bolshevik Revolution, was in fact against
support of the Bolshevik regime.”
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Rurik says:@Patrick McNally
Jacob Schiff, often cited as a source of funds for the Bolshevik Revolution, was in fact against
support of the Bolshevik regime.”perhaps, but perhaps he changed his mind
and there were other NYC banksters
But I’m not a scholar on such things,
and more to the point, with all due respect, I consider you a troll.
So bantering about such things, are pointless, and a distraction.
If you like, you can call this little exchange a victory on your part, because I’m bowing out.
I prefer my previous method of dealing with your posts. No harm, no foul.
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Fran Taubman says:@Mark Bahner
To the very last minute to the very last day. Senseless. 350,000 Jews murdered in 4 months. There was no where to even place the Jews. Auschwitz was full to the brim. Outside standing only. And you have Mattogno scratching his head at the Auschwitz Album saying” why are all those Hungarian Jews hanging out at Crematorium 4. (Mattogno is a pro on the layout of the camps). Crematorium 2 is much larger”
The best and brightest revisionist on the fate of the Hungarian Jews after the Auschwitz Album showed non employable Hungarian Jews at the train platform at Auschwitz. Butz in his magnus opus The Greatest Hoax of the Twentieth Century claimed only employable Hungarian Jews were transported in the summer of 1944.
Here all those Revisionist speculate on what happened to the Hungarian Jews. John Wear knows they were not gassed because well he just knows.
TV( mister clueless) You should read Mattogno’s paper, he has every train, every day, every time, and every Hungarian Jew that was transported. I mean it is precise data from a leading revisionist. You always go for the silliest arguments, instead of paying attention to the basic facts. Like the Hamas Charter FACT!!! The photos from the Auschwitz are in Mattogno’s draft. I am not sure if Gemar Rudolf weighed in on the Hungarian Jews. Hot topic for the end of the war. A real WTF were the Germans thinking other than war crimes. Author Butz sure turned out to be a liar. A great great liar.
http://vho.org/GB/Journals/JHR/19/4/Graf4.html
Insights on the 1944 Deportations of Hungarian Jews
What Happened to the Jews Who Were Deported to Auschwitz But Were Not Registered There?
By Jurgen Graffhttps://codoh.com/library/document/the-deportation-of-hungarian-jews-from-may-to/en/
The Deportation of Hungarian Jews from May to July 1944
A preliminary account
by Carlo Mattogno
This content is also available in German
Published: 2001-01-12https://www.vho.org/GB/Journals/JHR/19/4/Butz19.html
IA Reply to Jürgen Graf:
On the 1944 Deportations of Hungarian Jews
Arthur R. ButzAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Fran Taubman says:
These photos are clipped from Mattogno’s paper on the Auschwitz Album. I love the arrows to the smoke stakes of Crematorium 2. “Look Ma no smoke.”
Why the fuck were there 5 crematoriums at Auschwitz Birkenau around a train station? Anyone got a good answer?
Mattogno’s paper on the Hungarian Jews at crematorium 4.
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Kali says:@Pierre de Craon
Dear Pierre,
I appreciate your concern, but this is not the first thread in which I’ve encountered and observed the Yeager woman in action, attempting to belittle, undermine and discredit the work of “holocaust” researchers/revisionists.
And whilst it’s common to find her doing just that, it’s incredibly rare to see her actually engaging with holocaustians in order to disabuse them. Thus I am quite sure that, friend if the Jews or not, she is a troll (albeit a rather sophisticated one).
I realise that I’m not entirely civilised at all times, but as a working-class British woman I do reserve the right to”speak as I find”, as the saying goes.
And it does seem that, since I did as she requested and used her own comments as evidence of her trolling, she’s departed this thread. It could be that she’s busy with other things, or it could be that she’s been outed. Either way, at least she’s gone for the moment.
In other news I’ve just been gifted a brand new phone with enough memory to deal with these long threads, so will be able to participate more fully from now on. Oh, happy me!
Best regards, Pierre,
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Mark Bahner says:
Hi Fran,
To the very last minute to the very last day. Senseless. 350,000 Jews murdered in 4 months. There was no where to even place the Jews. Auschwitz was full to the brim. Outside standing only. And you have Mattogno scratching his head at the Auschwitz Album saying” why are all those Hungarian Jews hanging out at Crematorium 4. (Mattogno is a pro on the layout of the camps). Crematorium 2 is much larger”
Yes, that’s something that I’m having a hard time explaining to John Wear and others.
When I worked as an engineer, one of the powerful analysis tools/concepts I used were “mass balances” and “energy balances”. Basically, a “mass balance” can be thought of drawing a box around a process, and accounting for all the inputs and outputs, and changes to what’s inside the box.
For example, draw a box around Auschwitz I, Auschwitz II (Birkenau) and Auschwitz III (Monowitz). The three total facilities have some initial population of living people on May 1, 1944. Let’s assume for simplicity there were 100,000 live people in the total combined Auschwitz I, II, and III, which we’ll call “Auschwitz” for simplicity. So that’s 100,000 live people in Auschwitz on May 1, 1944.
Now, add 440,000 people from May 15 to July 9, 1944…per the U.S. Holocaust Museum:
From May 15 to July 9, 1944, Hungarian gendarmerie officials, under the guidance of German SS officials, deported around 440,000 Jews from Hungary. Most were deported to Auschwitz-Birkenau…
Now, on July 9, if all those live people were added, and none died, and none were transferred out, the population of live people on July 9th would be 100,000 + 440,000 = 540,000!!!
That’s obviously not possible. So for simplicity, let’s instead assume that the population of live people “only” increased by 40,000…from 100,000 to 140,000. That means 400,000 live people (540,000 minus 140,000) between May 1, 1944 and July 9, 1944 *must* have either been transferred out of Auschwitz, or have been converted to “dead people” from “live people.”
Here’s what the Holocaust museum says about the 440,000 Hungarian Jews that arrived at Auschwitz between May 15 and July 9, 1944:
…where, upon arrival and after selection, SS functionaries killed the majority of them in gas chambers.
Thousands were also sent to the border with Austria to be deployed at digging fortification trenches.
So we have 400,000 live people between May 1, 1944 and July 9, 1944 that *must* be either shipped out of Auschwitz (for example, “…sent to the border of Austria to be deployed at digging fortification trenches”) or converted into dead people (for example, “…killed…in gas chambers”).
The math of this mass balance approach is absolutely unquestionable. If the initial population of Auschwitz on May 1 was 100,000, and the population is 140,000 on July 9, and 440,000 people were added, the total number killed/died or transferred out of Auschwitz *must* add up to 400,000.
The most reasonable way to get to the number 400,000 is to assume, for example, 300,000 killed/died (for example, by gas chambers), and 100,000 transferred. I don’t think anyone can possibly honestly claim that all 400,000 live people transferred out of Auschwitz.
I don’t think Carlo Mattogno and John Wear are credible, because, to my knowledge, they absolutely refuse to do this “mass balance” approach of analyzing what happened at Auschwitz between May 1, 1944 and July 9, 1944 (during which over 400,000 Hungarian Jews arrived at Auschwitz).
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Kali says:@Mark Bahner
What do you think happened to those people in those pictures
Again and again, Mark, John has told you what he thinks probably happened to the Hungarian Jews and has provided supporting evidence.
Obviously you do not accept his answer and you’d rather ignore the supporting evidence.
Because you WANT to believe that jews were systematically murdered. Though you can provide no evidence of the same.
Your intent seems to be to uphold the holocautian belief system, which in turn grants Jewish Power the blind-eye necessary for it to dominate Western culture, decimate national cohesion and genocide Palestine, amongst other evils.
So my question to you is, WHY do you choose to uphold a narrative that has no real evidence to support it, which paints your own people and culture as inherently bad, and which grants to your enemy the excuse it needs to destroy your people and culture?
Regards,
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littlereddot says:@Tiptoethrutulips
Please call me LRD or Dot or anything else. Appending Mr to it makes me feel like my school teacher. LOL.
Would you be willing to speculate what would happen to a person, who enters the chamber, armed with only a cane, without following or adhering to any established protocols for decontamination, approximately 30 or 35 minutes after the expiration of 2500 to 3000 people?
Of course, we don’t know the volume of said toxin/chemical used, but it was enough to kill the aforementioned number of people in 4-5 minutes.
I know you meant it to be tongue-in-cheek. But really I cannot say. I can only speculate that they would probably feel pretty sick…at least….assuming that the facilities were really used as gas chambers.
The thing is, I am no expert in the toxicity of the alleged poison.
But this highlights the problem with taking witness accounts and interpreting it with layman’s understandings. Firstly the witnesses may be recalling events that they noticed. There may be details which to them seemed irrelevant and they never reported.
So some examples of seeing shower heads….which they later interpreted as a ruse to get them to believe it was a washing facility…..may actually have been a means to deliver a liquid neutralising agent that would render the poison safe….this would be a factor in favour of the Holocaust adherents.
This is why I am forced to keep an open mind about it until I am satisfied with the evidence.
I will say this tho:
Having grown up in an environment where the Holocaust was taken as a fact, I used to consider it 100% accurate.
Then having come to UR and reading all the arguments back and forth, I gave a possibility that there was a slight chance that it might be true….so 90% chance it was true.
Now having examined what has been presented as blueprints of the INITIAL design of the facilities, I would say I am about 50% chance that the Holocaust is real.
Perhaps the only way for me to be more sure, is to go to the ruins themselves and see the layout of the rooms, examine the door seals, see where the air ducts and were, drain and sewerage layouts….but even if I go to Auschwitz, would I be allowed to access all the facilities?
So for now, I will wait and see what else turns up. If the universe wishes for me to know more, it will appear.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@littlereddot
LRD,
Fair enough, thank you.
I was also once in the exactly-as-they-say camp myself. Despite warnings from relatives in combat and first hand witnesses, some of them Jewish, that things were not as is historically presented. I thought, surely they can’t make this up without being caught?
You are a wise man.
Thanks again.
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Fran Taubman says:@Mark Bahner
I don’t think Carlo Mattogno and John Wear are credible, because, to my knowledge, they absolutely refuse to do this “mass balance” approach of analyzing what happened at Auschwitz between May 1, 1944 and July 9, 1944 (during which over 400,000 Hungarian Jews arrived at Auschwitz)
Incomprehensible that in 2023 anyone would continue to deny the Holocaust. Revisionist did have a hey day with Butz’s first book, and the Leucheter forensics on the Prussian blue or lack of it, in the 1970’s and 1980’s It took everyone by surprise, and really none bothered to refute it because it sounded so stupid. Of course the Holocaust happened. How could you make something like that up?
But since the 1990’s there has been a concerted effort on the part of forensic scientist and historians to full on refute H revisionist. You can just google Holocaust denial, and every claim about the Prussian blue, the leaky doors, the Germans merely wanted to resettle the Jews etc. has been refuted to all but the insane, stupid or delusional.
The best site.
https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com
The other revealing part over the years and so obvious on UR, is that H denial, is a Trojan Horse, for it is not nor ever was about the Holocaust per se. It is about reviving the Medieval conspiracy concerning the Jews that was spread by the Catholic Church, that the Jews thru magical satanical powers invented the Holocaust do defraud the world, on their way to world domination.
An honest historian has be objective about their subject, the same with a scientist that is why Holocaust denial is so dishonest. These people are not objective, they take remnants really fragments of science and turn it into pseudo science. It is so patently false. A lie. With the ongoing research and with the internet more facts have come to light to prove irrefutably that the Holocaust happened as told thru the perpetrators, the victims and eyewitness. There exist extemporaneous journals that describe exactly what Hoss describes, yet neither one new the others or their testimonies. How could that be? A doctor at Auschwitz keeping a journal in 1943, would be the exact testimony of Hoss? To the minute detail of how the gas was distributed with red cross trucks.
If Hoss were tortured and forced to confess, he could have written a letter posthumously stating that his confession was a lie. Not one perpetrators children ever came forward to deny what their parents admitted to. So what you have is Jew hatred and only Jew hatred. I have spent hundreds of hours working with John Wear on research data on the Hungarian Jews, the reparations, and the forensics, in exchanges on this thread lasting years. He has taken every bit of the research that I have given him and written articles that were flat out lies. If I was forced to admit to mass murder that I did not commit I would make sure the truth got out, if I had to bury the letter in a safe deposit box.
Your mass balance approach is interesting, I have never heard it before. especially when dealing with the area and the people it could hold compared to the incoming transports. I think the number was 475,000 Jewish Hungarians, 350,000 died on arrival, the rest survived or were transported for work.
The entire Holocaust is one of the most unbelievable events in history, not because it was the worst.30 million Russians and Germans died. It is just the most unbelievable event in modern history. You cannot explain to John Wear and others they are in some time warp. John especially seems really devoid of any modern context with regards to the Holocaust.
Holocaust revisionism is pretty much finished as a historical field of study, and with the death of the current revisionist, Mattagno, Graff, and Rudolf, that will be the bitter end of H denial and H revisionism. It is simply no longer a field of study with a foundation based on facts, that can be supported. None of the forensics of Rudolf or Mattognao has ever reached a scientific peer review.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “I don’t think Carlo Mattogno and John Wear are credible, because, to my knowledge, they absolutely refuse to do this “mass balance” approach of analyzing what happened at Auschwitz between May 1, 1944 and July 9, 1944 (during which over 400,000 Hungarian Jews arrived at Auschwitz).”
My response: I think most Hungarian Jews transferred to Auschwitz-Birkenau survived the war for the following reasons:
1) There were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau. You can read my articles at https://inconvenienthistory.com/9/4/5160 and https://inconvenienthistory.com/12/1/7200 for why I reach this conclusion.
For more detailed information on this subject, I recommend you read Germar Rudolf’s books “The Chemistry of Auschwitz” and “The Leuchter Reports: Critical Edition.” Rudolf has extensive scientific training and is a true expert on this subject.
2) Another factor making impossible the official number of Hungarian Jews dying at Auschwitz-Birkenau is the fact that thousands of corpses could not have been cremated every day at Auschwitz-Birkenau as is commonly claimed. There simply was not enough crematoria capacity at Birkenau to cremate so many dead Hungarian Jews in such a short period of time.
The authors of “The Holocaust in Hungary: Evolution of a Genocide” acknowledge this fact and write: “The Nazis’ main problem: they were killing more people in the gas chambers than they could burn in the furnaces. The crematoria simply could not keep up with the task.” Thus, they claim that the Germans decided to burn many dead Hungarian Jews in open pits. (Source: Vagi, Zoltan, Csosz, Laszlo, Kadar, Gabor, The Holocaust in Hungary: Evolution of a Genocide, Lanham, MD: AltaMira Press, 2013, p. 220).
3) However, aerial photographs taken during the height of the alleged extermination of the Hungarian Jews at Birkenau show an uneventful camp without smoke emanating from the crematoria or open pits. In his book “Auschwitz: The End of a Legend”, Carlo Mattogno writes regarding the Allied aerial photographs taken at Birkenau on May 31, 1944:
“It is pointed out also that the aerial photographs taken by the Allied military on 31 May 1944, at the crucial time of presumed extermination, on the day of the arrival at Birkenau of about 15,000 deportees, and after 14 days of intense arrivals (184,000 deportees, averaging 13,000 per day) and with an extermination toll (according to Pressac’s hypothesis) of at least 110,000 homicidally gassed, which would have had to average 7,800 per day, every single day for 14 consecutive days; after all of that, the photographs do not show the slightest evidence of this alleged enormous extermination: No trace of smoke, no trace of pits, crematory or otherwise, burning or not, no sign of dirt extracted from pits, no trace of wood set aside for use in pits, no sign of vehicles or any other type of activity in the crucial zones of the courtyard of Crematory V nor in the earth of Bunker 2, nor in Crematories II and III. These photographs constitute irrefutable proof that the story of extermination of the Hungarian Jews is historically unfounded.” (Source: Mattogno, Carlo, Auschwitz: The End of a Legend, Newport Beach, CA: The Institute for Historical Review, 1994, p. 32).
John C. Ball writes that the Hungarian Jews arriving at Auschwitz-Birkenau from May 28 through May 31, 1944 are said to have been killed on the spot and cremated. Since the crematories at Auschwitz-Birkenau could have cremated only a small fraction of these bodies, by necessity most of them would have been cremated on gargantuan pyres outdoors. Therefore, if the orthodox story was true, the area would have been blanketed in smoke. However, the Allied air photo of Birkenau on May 31, 1944 shows a peaceful and uneventful camp devoid of any smoke emanating from the crematoria or open pits. (Source: Ball, John C., Air-Photo Evidence, in Rudolf, Germar (ed.), Dissecting the Holocaust: The Growing Critique of Truth and Memory, Uckfield, UK: Castle Hill Publishers, 2019, pp. 275-277).
Thus, there were no massive open pits at Auschwitz-Birkenau where these dead Hungarian Jews were allegedly burned.
So, I don’t know where all of the Hungarian Jews were transferred to, how many of them were disabled or children, how many of them stayed at Auschwitz-Birkenau, or how many of them survived the war. However, I do know they were not mass murdered at Auschwitz-Birkenau as part of a German program of genocide.
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Mark Bahner says:@Kali
Hi Kali,
No, John Wear (and Carlo Mattogno) have *not* done a “mass balance approach” to the Hungarian Jews that arrived at Auschwitz from May 15 to July 9, 1944. See my comments (#1326) here:
If the population of Auschwitz was 100,000 on May 1st, and 440,000 people arrived by July 9th, and the population of Auschwitz itself increased from 100,000 to 140,000, then 400,000 people MUST have been either killed or transferred out. That’s from May 1st to July 9th, 1944.
I defy anyone to point out where Carlos Mattogno or John Wear show that all 400,000 people transferred out from May 1 to July 9th. For example, if only 100,000 people transferred out from May 1 to July 9, then 300,000 Hungarian Jews MUST have died in Auschwitz in that short time. That is the inarguable math of a “mass balance approach.”
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Fran Taubman says:@Carolyn Yeager
The fact that John Wear has Zero intellect is the only reason he can write the shite that he writes. anyone with a brain would be slightly nuanced. Not John.
There were no Homicidal Gassing rooms at Auschwitz because of Prussian blue by Fred Leuchter, therefore the missing Hungarian Jews cannot be dead. They are alive somewhere we just do not know where. But they could not have died by gassing.
That is the way a 10 year old writes a book report.
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
You write: “I don’t think Carlo Mattogno and John Wear are credible, because, to my knowledge, they absolutely refuse to do this “mass balance” approach of analyzing what happened at Auschwitz between May 1, 1944 and July 9, 1944 (during which over 400,000 Hungarian Jews arrived at Auschwitz).”
My response: I think most Hungarian Jews transferred to Auschwitz-Birkenau survived the war for the following reasons:
No, that’s not the issue. If 440,000 Hungarian Jews came into Auschwitz between May 1st and July 9th, and the population of Auschwitz increased from 100,000 to 140,000, and NONE of the other 400,000 died (for example by being murdered with Zyklon B), then you MUST show where all 400,000 people went.
You can’t just say, “I don’t know.”
Because the National Holocaust Museum and I and pretty much the rest of the world outside of Carlo Mattogno and you DO know: about 300,000 of them were murdered by Zyklon B, and the rest went to dig trenches in Austria, or to various other work camps.
If you say NONE of the 300,000 were killed in Auschwitz by Zyklon B, then you need to provide evidence of where those 300,000 people went. All 300,000 of them. Not just 50,000 or 100,000…or even 200,000.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@littlereddot
LRD,
If I may suggest, if you’re truly interested, you may find it helpful to start at the beginning rather than towards the end.To the extent possible, find objective sources about WW1, the Treaty of Versailles, the goings on in Berlin and Germany, leading up to 1939, and Danzig, Poland. It doesn’t require a historian’s dive, but look for sources published before the ideology/censoring rampant in modern publishing.
I’m sure you understand this process of discovery as well, but just in case, a little advice never hurts.
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littlereddot says:@Tiptoethrutulips
They say that “if you gonna tell a lie, make it a big one”. LOL
I see lots of folks like to pin the saying on Goebbels. I think they are missing the point.
Which is that modern misinformation and manipulation of public perception was actually pioneered by an American….Edward Bernays. Next to Bernays, Goebbels was a schoolkid.
The efficacy of his methods were tested extensively and proven consistently on the American public. We only need to look around and see how pervasive it is. It really pervades our whole lives.
If I had to vote on who was the most influential person of the 20th century, it would be Bernays.
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@Fran Taubman
Chabad Fran sez:
The fact that John Wear has Zero intellect… https://www.unz.com/runz/why-everything-you-know-about-world-war-ii-is-wrong/?showcomments#comment-6033373
Chabad Fran also sez:
Shame on Ron a… it is beyond contemptible that you would not censure personal attacks on any commentator. https://www.unz.com/article/an-appeal-to-readers-stop-the-obsession-with-jews/?showcomments#comment-6027637
Unabashed hypocrisy. So typically jewish.
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Seriously… the jews started the damned war, so who cares that a few of them died in a war they started? Far from being a “holocaust,” it seems more like “just desserts”! http://judaism.is/holocaust.html
1932:
1933:
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Wizard of Oz says:@John Wear
One of my stray agnostic thoughts has been to move on a bit from my confidence that the idea of gas chambers could easily have been thrown up and not imediately rejected with horror by the SS to wondering what we know about the generation of credible stories of non-existent gas chambers.
Who first got the idea of planting gas chambers ers on the record of some individuals or collective group? What do we know of how they did it and what prompted them. If we imagine Hoess’s alleged British Jewish torturer saying “gas chambers gas chambers: this doesn’t end until you admit the gas chambers” one still wants to know what set him off on that path.
What is known?
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “No, that’s not the issue. If 440,000 Hungarian Jews came into Auschwitz between May 1st and July 9th, and the population of Auschwitz increased from 100,000 to 140,000, and NONE of the other 400,000 died (for example by being murdered with Zyklon B), then you MUST show where all 400,000 people went. You can’t just say, “I don’t know.”
My response: Sure I can.
I know that 1) the Hungarian Jews were not mass murdered in homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau; 2) the crematoria capacity at Auschwitz-Birkenau was not sufficient to cremate thousands of corpses per day as is commonly claimed; and 3) aerial photographs taken during the height of the alleged extermination of the Hungarian Jews at Birkenau show an uneventful camp without smoke emanating from the crematoria or open pits.
Therefore, I can conclude with certainty that Hungarian Jews were not subject to a program of mass extermination at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
Let’s apply your “mass balance approach” to the German expellees after World War II. Historians agree that a minimum of 12 million and possibly as many as 18.1 million Germans were driven from their homes because of their ethnic background. This is a very wide variance; no one knows for sure how many Germans were expelled after World War II.
Now we get to the question of how many German expellees died after the war. American historian R. M. Douglas writes on page 1 of his book “Orderly and Humane” that 500,000 is at the low end of the spectrum. Douglas writes, “Calculating the scale of mortality remains a source of great controversy today…” He writes that much more research will have to be carried out before a death figure can be cited with reasonable confidence.
The higher end of the spectrum comes from Konrad Adenauer, the first Chancellor of West Germany, who estimated that 6 million German expellees died after the war. Adenauer wrote:
“According to American figures a total of 13.3 million Germans were expelled from the Eastern parts of Germany, from Poland, Czechoslovakia, Hungary, and so on. 7.3 million [German expellees] arrived in the Eastern zone and the three Western zones, most of these in the latter. Six million Germans have vanished from the earth. They are dead, gone. Most of the 7.3 million who stayed alive are women, children, and old people.” (Source: Adenauer, Konrad, Memoirs, 1945-1953, translated by Beate Ruhm von Oppen, Chicago: Henry Regnery Co., 1966, p. 148).
So, which death figure is correct? The low end of 500,000, or the high end of 6 million as stated by Dr. Adenauer? No one knows. No one has been able to determine even approximately how many German expellees died after the war.
So, where did all of the German expellees go? No one knows. All we have is the vague notion that they were transferred somewhere to the West. Your “mass balance approach” can not be used to determine either how many Germans were expelled after World War II, or to determine how many German expellees died after the war.
So, if your “mass balance approach” can not be applied to the German expellees, why do you think Holocaust revisionists should be able to use it to prove where all of the Hungarian Jews transferred to Auschwitz-Birkenau went?
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Mark Bahner says:@Fran Taubman
There were no Homicidal Gassing rooms at Auschwitz because of Prussian blue by Fred Leuchter, therefore the missing Hungarian Jews cannot be dead. They are alive somewhere we just do not know where. But they could not have died by gassing.
Yes. For example, Irene Fogel, a Hungarian Jew deported to Auschwitz, claims her mother and two younger brothers were killed in a gas chamber. Her brothers Reuven and Gershon Fogel are the two boys with caps in the left foreground of this photograph, and her mother is sitting on the ground behind them.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=555376876627703&id=100064661865080&set=a.370529531779106
If her mother and two younger brothers were last seen alive next to a gas chamber, it’s simply not acceptable to say, “Oh, the three of them didn’t go into the gas chamber. They went somewhere else. It’s just that nobody knows where it was they went.”
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Mark Bahner says:@Wizard of Oz
Who first got the idea of planting gas chambers ers on the record of some individuals or collective group? What do we know of how they did it and what prompted them. If we imagine Hoess’s alleged British Jewish torturer saying “gas chambers gas chambers: this doesn’t end until you admit the gas chambers” one still wants to know what set him off on that path.
What is known?
My problem is that I open up so many web pages that I end up losing track of some of them. I found a U.S. newspaper somewhere in the heart of the U.S. dated circa 1945 that talked about the liberation of Dachau.
All that follows are my *recollections*…not necessarily the actual words.
It talked about an American vehicle (tank?) breaking down a “wall” in Auschwitz, and the prisoner is quoted as saying something to the effect that, “We thought they were coming to take us to the gas chamber.”
Of course, Dachau did not *have* a gas chamber. But *apparently* there was one in…Austria?…maybe in a hospital?…and 2600???…prisoners from Dachau were apparently indeed taken to that nearby gas chamber. So what on initial reading seems like misinformed hype might have been a legitimate concern. It’s just I was reading it as “take us to the gas chamber **in Dachau**”.
But with regards to all the websites I open up…this sure seems to me like a “smoking gun”…so to speak:
I wonder what John Wear thinks about this document? Forgery? Misunderstanding? Seems pretty clear and pretty damning.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@littlereddot
Well, what do you know? Bernays was born in Austria. To a Jewish family. What was cooking around there so long ago?
I knew/read of him briefly long ago, but I remembered him as an associate, of some sort, of Freud, so I thought he was a psychopath, no, psychologist.
I’ll add him to my homework assignment.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
You’re clutching your pearls again, Mark.
I read through the eyewitness testimony transcribed within the official document. Was it sworn testimony? Not that it really matters….
Funny, it doesn’t really line up with the eyewitness testimony of one of those 900 men staffed at the crematorium. It’s actually contrary, in many ways, to that of Mr. Dario Gabbai, of said staff of 900. I believe he said the staff was only 100-200, but we can check his oral, videographed statement to be sure.
There are many contradictions, but that’s the problem when lots of people make up stories, willy nilly, without checking with each other first. Or keeping their stories straight, year after year.
It’s most likely Dario’s error; he forgot his bar mitzvah, after all. He says he’s sure it happened, but he can’t remember. But, he remembers, very well, how hard it was to stuff thousands of bodies in an elevator, every day, using a cane around their necks to haul them about and fling them onto a stretcher, four at a time, stacked one on top of each other.
Mr. Gabbai never mentioned the Red Cross. Do you have any official documents from the Red Cross? I’d like to see those records; I’ll wait for you to upload them.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Another question. There’s no date on Dr. Bendel’s transcribed statement, but he indicates he was 30 years old at time of statement. I’ll assume the statement was made after 1945.
When did go to medical school? I’m wondering, since he arrived at the camp in 1943.
Why is a medical doctor testifying about reinforced concrete and strong wood for construction he says was done a year before he arrived? Is there another page?
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Fran Taubman says:@Mark Bahner
You are arguing with delusional people, who know that they have lost the fight and will not give up.
There are thousands of smoking guns. The correspondence between Kurt Prufer and Bishoff about the specs for the new ovens, is proof enough along with Pressac’s blueprints. The design of the ovens and the ventilation system were all designed for assembly line efficiency for mass murder. They do not try and hide. Some denier says no way you can burn that many bodies in an eight muffle oven. Poof H denial at work.There are the Himmler tapes, calling for the killing of Jewish mothers and children to eradicate any future generations. The entire mass murder of the Jews is spelled out. Just ask anyone why did they transport those Hungarian Jews to Auschwitz in 1944 when the war was over, and they could not care for them in the camps?
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Fran Taubman says:@Mark Bahner
John will tell you that this doctor had to say what they wanted him to say, or he would be prosecuted for war crimes. That is what he will say. All of the eyewitness all of the Sonderkammandos who worked there are unreliable witnesses. Just because. Everyone who saw it lied. Everyone who did not see anything is telling the truth. Go on YouTube and punch in arrivals to Auschwitz. The same story told hundreds of times in different languages. How do you do that if it did not happen, how do you coordinate what people will say? The train ride with no toilet, the disembarking, the selection process, all the same descriptions.
And it usually goes like this. I was standing in line with my baby, and my mother was behind me. There was a lot of confusion. No one knew what was happening. A man approached me and said why don’t you let your mother hold the baby. So I did. I lost track of them they went in a different direction in back of us. I never saw my mother or my baby again.
There are thousands and thousands of these stories. Along with the smell of burning flesh, a sickly smell. Everyone told the arrivals that their relatives were gassed and cremated. Tell this to a denier and they shrug. They must have called an uber. Families were separated. That is a fact. Just look at Otto Frank, again the end of the war, months before liberation. He was the only survivor of his family and people he was in hiding with. How could you make this all up? When Anne Frank was sent to Bergen Belsen it was nothing more than an open air tent with straw on the floor. People got scabies and the then typhus, they fell out of their beds and died. After Anne’s sister died, she just gave up. Someone saw her thru the fence before she died, she was sick and shivering and just gave up, just months before liberation. Why? Why send the Franks to Auschwitz and Anne to Bergen Belsen makes no sense. These people could do nothing for the Germans.
I find Holocaust denial very creepy. Gemar Rudolf’s Visa is up and the US is not going to renew it, the Germans want to extradite him, and try him for all of his H denial books. He has been warned many times to stop. I hope he rots in jail. I hope he gives up like Anne Frank did. Just throws his hands up and says enough, and dies.
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Brosi says:@Patrick McNally
This meme perfectly sums up the pointlessness of trying to debate ((McNally)) and ((Bahner)):
— ShitpostGateway (@ShitpostGate) June 27, 2023
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Wizard of Oz says:@Mark Bahner
That certainly confirms one little part of my past speculations. It is indeed pretty obvious that the “no gas chambers” case is in no way supported by the idea that there might have been revulsion amongst SS people.
It would still be interesting to know th detailed story of the gas chambers
emerging so that the British torturer knew what to fabricate. BtW the over certain people who populated UR threads don’t seem to have the imagination to see that Hoess, resenting what was being done to him, and not yet reconciled to his fate, might well have thought of cunningly placing a bomb in his testimony obtained under torture. THUS the 2.5 million figure might have been planted to discredit all of what his signed statement said.• Agree: Fran Taubman• Replies: @John WearAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Kali says:@Mark Bahner
P.S. John Wear, all my questions to the hilariously ironically self-named “Truth Seeker” apply to you. Would you please answer the questions that I placed underlines after?
Dear Mark,
The commenter you are referring to calls himself Truth Vigilante, not Truth Seeker.
You keep on ignoring what’s right under your nose, ignoring the facts, ignoring the complete lack of physical or documentary evidence, whilst continuing to present fabulous testimony from agitated Jews despite that it has been largely or wholly debunked.
My question to you is, WHY??
Regards,
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Kali says:@Mark Bahner
Mark,
Maybe you were responding to someone else but addressed me by mistake. The question I asked you was:
“So my question to you is, WHY do you choose to uphold a narrative that has no real evidence to support it, which paints your own people and culture as inherently bad, and which grants to your enemy the excuse it needs to destroy your people and culture?”
So far, reading through your comments, it strikes me that you are simply repeating the same holocaustians narrative over and over again. You don’t bring anything at all to the conversation but narrative.
And it seems you cannot even agree to differ with your interlocutors, instead repeating the same questions and the same holcaustian beliefs ad infinitum, whilst describing yourself in at least one comment as a “truth-hound”.
Yet it’s obvious that you don’t care about the actual truth, you only care about the narrative.
WHY?
Regards,
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Kali says:@Mark Bahner
Because the National Holocaust Museum and I and pretty much the rest of the world outside of Carlo Mattogno and you DO know: about 300,000 of them were murdered by Zyklon B, and the rest went to dig trenches in Austria, or to various other work camps.
Mark,
Can you please provide evidence that those people were murdered at Auschwitz, by whatever means. Where are their remains?
You are making the claim, therefore you need to prove that claim. Where are the bodies or ashes of these hundreds of thousands of murder victims?
Regards,
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Kali says:@Wizard of Oz
Who first got the idea of planting gas chambers ers on the record of some individuals or collective group?
I don’t know who first got the idea, Wiz, but I understand it was born of the fact that ziclon-b was used in the camps for the purposes of delousing.
From “delousing chambers” to “murderous gas Chambers” isn’t such a stretch for people with an ax to grind, a nation to build and a bloody world war to justify.
Kali.
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John Wear says:@Wizard of Oz
You write: “It would still be interesting to know the detailed story of the gas chambers
emerging so that the British torturer knew what to fabricate.”My response: I will give you a brief overview of the gas chamber fabrication.
An important piece of evidence arguing against the existence of homicidal gas chambers is that the British broke the ultra-secret Enigma code used by the Germans to transmit secret communications. During 1942 and 1943 British intelligence intercepted daily coded messages from Auschwitz, Buchenwald, Dachau, and seven other camps. Every day the Germans recorded the numbers of dead and the method of death at each camp. The transmissions from Auschwitz mentioned illness as the primary cause of death, but also reported deaths attributable to shootings and hangings. There was no reference to homicidal gassings as a cause of death in any of the decoded messages. (Source: Hinsley, Frank H., British Intelligence in the Second World War: Its Influence on Strategy and Operations, New York: Cambridge University Press, 1984, Vol. 2, Appendix 5, “The German Police Cyphers,” p. 673).
So, the British knew from the Enigma codes they had broken that there were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau. However, this did not stop the Allies from claiming that Germans had homicidal gas chambers in their camps.
Majdanek was the first German concentration camp occupied by the Red Army in the summer of 1944. The Red Army found cremation furnaces, delousing chambers, and cans of Zyklon B at this camp. Although all of these items had life-saving functions, Soviet propaganda turned them into their opposite, and the press frenzy was accordingly huge. (Source: Rudolf, Germar, Lectures on the Holocaust, 4th edition, 2023, p. 295).
Germar Rudolf writes that the destruction of the crematories at Auschwitz by the Germans before their retreat was probably done because of the Soviet propaganda photos at Majdanek. No one in Germany wanted to see more propaganda photos appearing in the press similar to the ones from Majdanek. (Source: Ibid.).
The homicidal gas chamber story emerged again at the Bergen-Belsen trial.
SS Capt. Josef Kramer was the Commandant of Birkenau from May 8, 1944 to November 25, 1944, and of the Bergen-Belsen concentration camp from December 1944 to its liberation by the British on April 15, 1945. Kramer was the principal defendant in the Belsen trial conducted by the British in the autumn of 1945. This trial was concluded in November, just as the International Military Tribunal (IMT) was beginning. Kramer was hanged on December 13, 1945. (Source: Butz, Robert, The Hoax of the Twentieth Century, Newport Beach, Cal.: Institute for Historical Review, 1993, p. 175).
Kramer’s first statement to his British interrogators emphasized that he did not know of an extermination program at any of the German camps. Kramer said:
“I have heard of the allegations of former prisoners in Auschwitz referring to a gas chamber there, the mass executions and whippings, the cruelty of the guards employed, and that all this took place either in my presence or with my knowledge. All I can say to all this is that it is untrue from beginning to end.” (Source: Ibid., pp. 176, 271).
We know that Kramer and other defendants at the Belsen trial were tortured, sometimes to the point of begging to be put to death. (Source: Belgion, Montgomery, Victors’ Justice, Hillsdale, Ill.: Henry Regnery, 1949, pp. 80-81).
Kramer later changed his statement to his interrogators. Kramer’s change was probably made either in response to his being tortured, or because his defense attorney advised him that he had told a story that could not be accepted by the court. Regardless, Kramer did not receive a fair trial. His execution by hanging after the Belsen trial was a foregone conclusion before the trial even began.
So, by the time the IMT began in November 1945, the homicidal gas chamber hoax was firmly entrenched as part of Allied propaganda. Rudolf Höss’s testimony at the IMT was probably the most important and striking evidence presented there of a German extermination program. Höss’s testimony at the IMT helped the Allies claim that there were homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau, and that Germany had a program of mass murder and genocide against Jews.
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Wizard of Oz says:@John Wear
Thank you for a relevant response. But let me begin my quibbles.
So, the British knew from the Enigma codes they had broken that there were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau. However, this did not stop the Allies from claiming that Germans had homicidal gas chambers in their camps
That’s not enough for proof unless you at least can affirm that the deaths of those unfit for work were recorded despite being killed on arrival without identifying them.
Of course one would expect efficient or merely bureaucratic Germans to keep data on the health, strength and numbers of a workforce.
Furthermore your belief that Zyclon B was only used as a s
delousing agent seems naive when the fact that it had a duel use was an obvious advantage for those running the camps. What makes you think it was only used for deliusing and protection against typhus?• Replies: @John WearAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Wizard of Oz says:@John Wear
Also, if the Soviet Union started the talk of gas chambers as you say what do we know about how and why that came about? Surely someone in the 1990s would have explored that.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Kali
You point to an alternative. What could be better than to be able to use Zyclon B both for delousing the workforce a d killing those j fit to work?
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@Mark Bahner
As if there is a shortage of “eyewitness” liars??? The are “myriads” (to borrow from the Bavli, GIttin 57a-57b) of “eyewitness” liars: https://judaism.is/holocaust.html#eyewitnesses
Like the “gas chamber” at Auschwitz, the “gas chambers” at Dachau and Majdanek are also post-war fakes. http://holocausthandbooks.com/dl/1004.mp4
‘No Gassing In Dachau’ http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v13/v13n3p12_Broszat.html
Allied Committee of Inquiry: “no poison gas… torture was used to extract confessions, and witnesses have lied.”
Reproduced above in facsimile is the widely-quoted 1960 letter by Dr. Martin Broszat, as it appeared in the Hamburg weekly Die Zeit under the headline “Keine Vergasung in Dachau” (“No Gassing in Dachau”). It appeared in the German edition of August 19, 1960, and in the US edition of August 26, 1960 (p. 14). Dr. Broszat writes in the name of the prestigious Institute for Contemporary History (Institut fuer Zeitgeschichte). He later served as director of the Munich-based archive and research center, which is funded by German taxpayers.Here is a translation of the complete text of Broszat’s letter:
Neither in Dachau nor in Bergen-Belsen nor in Buchenwald were Jews or other prisoners gassed. The gas chamber in Dachau was never entirely finished or put “into operation.” Hundreds of thousands of prisoners who perished in Dachau and other concentration camps in the Old Reich [that is, Germany in its borders of 1937] were victims, above all, of the catastrophic hygienic and provisioning conditions: according to official SS statistics, during the twelve months from July 1942 through June 1943 alone, 110,812 persons died of disease and hunger in all of the concentration camps of the Reich. The mass extermination of the Jews by gassing began in 1941-1942 and occurred exclusively in a few facilities selected and equipped with appropriate technical installations, above all in the occupied Polish territory (but at no place in the Old Reich): in Auschwitz-Birkenau, in Sobibor on the Bug [river], in Treblinka, Chelmno and Belzec.
It is at those places, but not in Bergen-Belsen, Dachau or Buchenwald, where the mass extermination facilities, spoken of in your article [in an earlier issue of Die Zeit], were built and disguised as shower baths or disinfection rooms. This necessary differentiation does not, of course, change anything regarding the criminal character of the facility that was the concentration camp. However, it may perhaps help eliminate the annoying confusion that arises from the fact that some ineducable people make use of a few arguments that, while correct, are polemically torn from the context, and that, rushing to respond to them are other people who, although they have the correct overall view, rely upon false or mistaken information.
Dr. M. Broszat
Institute for Contemporary History
Munich“For good measure, I should add all the times that respected Holocaust professionals admitted to me (when they knew me as Stein) that the ‘gas chamber’ at Dachau was a fake, built for show by the U.S. Army after liberation.”
David Cole, Justifying My Existence, Taki’s Magazine, February 17, 2015
http://takimag.com/article/justifying_my_existence_david_cole/print#ixzz3Rz9tsvaWNote the 2015 date of Mr. Cole’s remarks. In 1998 the ADL publicized an alleged retraction in which Mr. Cole thanked Irv Rubin of the Jewish Defense League, widely recognized as a terrorist organization (Rubin died in jail in 2002 while awaiting trial on charges of conspiracy to bomb private and government property). We view Mr. Cole’s 1998 “retraction” and his 2015 retraction of the retraction as analogous to the “retraction” made by Prof. Ariel Toaff within one week of promising to hold strong on his findings confirming throughout Europe a cult of ritualistic Jewish child murderers.
All this begs the question, “Who cares? If someone starts a war, don’t we expect some of them to die?”
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Patrick McNally says:@Rurik
> perhaps, but perhaps he changed his mind
There’s no evidence of that. Schiff died in 1920. Of course, in later years someone like Henry Ford would willingly do business with the Soviet government. It’s not realistic to expect the world to maintain an endless boycott of the USSR after the Whites had shown that they had no popular support from Russians. But those developments came after Schiff’s passing.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:
From TOO:
The Forced War
David Hoggan
Institute for Historical Review, 1989The conflict between Warsaw and Berlin became the pretext in 1939 for the implementation of the antiquated English balance of power policy. This produced a senseless war of destruction against Germany. As it turned out, each Allied soldier of the West was fighting unwittingly for the expansion of Bolshevism, and he was simultaneously undermining the security of every Western nation. Never were so many sacrifices made for a cause so ignoble.
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Patrick McNally says:@Al Liguori
> 1932:
That smells like another fake quote. I tried doing a few quick searches on Bernard Lecache, but I could find nothing which referred to a “World Jewish League” anywhere. There had been an International League Against Pogroms, later changed to the International League Against Anti-Semitism. There, of course, was formed in 1936 a World Jewish Congress. There’s no indication that Bernard Lecache had much to do with that. Unless someone has some actual primary references to give, even just a story in a specific issue of the New York Times dated in 1932, or something similar, it seems obvious that that quote attributed to Bernard Lecache in purportedly 1932 is simply a fabrication.
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Rurik says:@Patrick McNally
Schiff died in 1920.
are you suggesting that NYC Jewish bankers did not fund Trotsky or the Bolsheviks?
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John Wear says:@Wizard of Oz
You write about the Enigma codes: “That’s not enough for proof unless you at least can affirm that the deaths of those unfit for work were recorded despite being killed on arrival without identifying them.”
My response: The German Enigma codes were used to transmit top-secret information. The Germans assumed that these code could never be broken. Thus, they would have no reason to hide any information in these transmissions.
The Holocaust story also claims that virtually all Jews who were too sick to work were immediately killed. The documentary evidence, however, indicates that a high percentage of the inmates at Birkenau were disabled. Oswald Pohl, in a secret report to Heinrich Himmler dated April 5, 1944, stated that there were 67,000 inmates in the entire Auschwitz-Birkenau camp complex, of which 18,000 were unable to work. In Birkenau there were a total of 36,000 inmates, of whom “approximately 15,000 are unable to work.” (Source: Nuremberg document NO-021, NMT (The “green series”), Vol. 5, pp. 384-385).
Such high percentages of disabled inmates at Auschwitz-Birkenau are not consistent with a program of mass extermination.
You write: “Furthermore your belief that Zyclon B was only used as a delousing agent seems naive when the fact that it had a duel use was an obvious advantage for those running the camps. What makes you think it was only used for delousing and protection against typhus?”
My response: Please read my articles at https://inconvenienthistory.com/9/4/5160 and https://inconvenienthistory.com/12/1/7200 for a detailed explanation.
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Bubba Rogowski says:
Hi there,
Guess what, the video didn’t work.
CHANNEL RESTRICTED
The parent channel of this video is unavailable at your location due to the following restrictions:Contains Incitement to Hatred
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Mark Bahner says:@Kali
Kali,
In general, what is your background, if I’m not being too personal? For example, what country are you in, what’s the country or countries of your ancestors, and what is your general age (for example, over 50, 30-50, under 30)?
The reason I ask is that there is virtually no doubt in my mind that hundreds of thousands of people were murdered at Auschwitz from 1942 to January 1945. So I want everyone to see why this *must* be so. The evidence is so overwhelming that hundreds of thousands of people were murdered at Auschwitz that I could literally fill a book just briefly listing and explaining the evidence.
Can you please provide evidence that those people were murdered at Auschwitz, by whatever means.
Let’s focus on the Hungarian Jews. It is known for a fact that hundreds of thousands of them were deported to Auschwitz in May, June, and early July 1944. By the end of the war in Europe only one year later, a *majority* of those hundreds of thousands were dead.
And not just dead. A *majority* of them were forced to strip naked in front of hundreds of people, most of them strangers. Then they were forced into an incredibly tightly packed gas chamber, and murdered with Zyklon B. Then their dead naked bodies were dragged out of the gas chamber, up to a crematorium in a pile of other bodies, and burned with other bodies. Then their ashes were just dumped…like someone would dump ashes from a fireplace or a waste incinerator.
I owe these people, and *you* owe these people, and everyone on the planet owes these people, to acknowledge that they were murdered.
But let’s get to the evidence:
1) Most people agree that 400,000+ Hungarian Jews were deported to Auschwitz. Even if *half* of them registered at Auschwitz, or transferred somewhere else without registering them at Auschwitz, that means *half* of them must have died at Auschwitz. The only possible explanation for 200,000 people dying at Auschwitz from when they arrived in May 1944 to when the camp was liberated in January 1945 is that they were murdered. There’s no way that 200,000 out of 400,000 people die of typhus or some natural cause in less than a year.
2) We know where all of these people came from. We have maps of the number of people taken from each city in Hungary:
3) We even have *photographs* of the people who were murdered, right next to the gas chambers where they were murdered, and the photographs were taken less than a few hours before they were murdered in those gas chambers:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=555376876627703&id=100064661865080&set=a.370529531779106
What more evidence could you possibly need or want? Do you want to see the bodies? They’re literally in ashes, literally spread in rivers and ponds:
https://panorama.auschwitz.org/tour2,2993,en.html
Do you think someone should get away with mass murder, simply because they burn the bodies and spread the ashes?
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Wizard of Oz
Since you are speculating, zyklon b was developed/formulated for insect control.
Let’s use an unrelated example to signify the differences in human physiology, as it pertains to tolerances, etc.; I can stuff my face with peanuts, all day, everyday, however there are many cases of people dying after the consumption of peanut oil, kissing a person who consumed peanut butter, or eating foods containing peanuts. These reactions are due to allergies, and some die, some become very ill, but survive.
When a building is tented for termite extermination, there are cases wherein people entered, before decontamination, and died rather quickly; some become ill, but survive and manage to exit. A reaction, oftentimes is varied, based on a person’s age, health, strength, lung capacity, overall tolerance, etc.
So, I speculate, if you want to kill EVERYONE quickly and efficiently, you will use a more lethal toxin than bug spray. I don’t doubt overexposure to insecticide could kill a human, but if you stuff a chamber with over a thousand people, not everyone will be equally exposed? And, they won’t all die in 4 or 5 minutes, in accordance with eyewitness testimony. Pure speculation, of course.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
“Do you think someone should get away with mass murder, simply because they burn the bodies and spread the ashes?”
Who is left to punish? Haven’t the perpetrators been executed/imprisoned? How much in reparations are still due from people who had no involvement, whatsoever, in the “shoah”? How much money does Israel give to Americans for all their trouble? And for the dead American boys? And, those blasted to bits, in a war across the ocean? No one believes Germany was ever a threat to America. According to Mr. Pollard, America should suffer, because she just didn’t do enough for European Jews. No one ever seems to do enough to satisfy Judea. I think that’s the point.
Historians/scholars have been imprisoned and bankrupted over expressing doubts and providing contrary evidence to the asserted claims. Why is legislation needed to protect said claims?
How many times has six million Jews been in danger of extermination? How many times before WW2, that is.
If you send me your address, I’ll send you a new strand of pearls.
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John Wear says:
Mark Bahner,
You ask: “What more evidence could you possibly need or want?”
My response: If hundreds of thousands of Hungarian Jews were murdered at Auschwitz-Birkenau, I would like to have the following evidence:
1) I would like to know how the homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau actually operated.
Chemists adhering to the orthodox Holocaust narrative have failed to explain why the walls of the delousing facilities at Auschwitz-Birkenau are permeated with Prussian Blue, while nothing of this sort can be observed in any of the alleged homicidal gas chambers. The only reasonable explanation is that Zyklon B was never used in the alleged homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau. Dr. Nicholas Kollerstrom writes: “…for any alleged human gas chamber found in a German World War II labor camp, let us merely measure cyanide in the walls: if it’s not there, it didn’t happen.” (Source: Kollerstrom, Nicholas, Breaking the Spell: The Holocaust, Myth and Reality, Uckfeld, Great Britain: Castle Hill Publishers, 2015, p. 70).
The alleged homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau could also not have been used to exterminate hundreds of thousands of people as described in pro-Holocaust literature for numerous reasons: 1) they did not have escape-proof doors and windows; 2) they did not have panic-proof equipment; 3) they did not have technically gas-tight doors and shutters; 4) they had no provision to quickly release and distribute the poison gas; and 5) they had no effective device to ventilate or otherwise render ineffective the poison gas after the execution. (Source: Rudolf, Germar, The Chemistry of Auschwitz: The Technology and Toxicology of Zyklon B and the Gas Chambers—A Crime-Scene Investigation, Uckfield, Great Britain: Castle Hill Publishers, 2017, pp. 174-175).
The roof of the semi-underground Morgue No. 1 of Crematorium II at Birkenau, which is said to have been the building’s homicidal gas chamber, remains intact to some degree today. Contrary to the testimony of some eyewitnesses, this roof has no Zyklon-B introduction holes. This has been acknowledged by pro-Holocaust researcher Robert Jan van Pelt. Since it is impossible to close holes measuring 70 x 70 cm from a concrete roof without leaving clearly visible traces, it is certain that Zyklon-B introduction holes never existed at Crematorium II. Consequently, Zyklon B could not have been introduced through the roof at this morgue, and Crematorium II was never used as a homicidal gas chamber.as claimed by pro-Holocaust historians. (Source: Ibid., pp. 143-147).
2) I would like to know how thousands of Hungarian Jews were cremated each day. There simply was not enough crematoria capacity at Auschwitz-Birkenau to cremate all of the dead bodies in such a short period of time.
The authors of “The Holocaust in Hungary” acknowledge this fact and write: “The Nazis’ main problem: they were killing more people in the gas chambers than they could burn in the furnaces. The crematoria simply could not keep up with the task.” Thus, the Germans decided to burn many dead Hungarian Jews in open pits. (Source: Vagi, Zoltan, Csosz, Laszlo, Kadar, Gabor, The Holocaust in Hungary: Evolution of a Genocide, Lanham, MD: AltaMira Press, 2013, p. 200).
3) I would also like to know why Allied aerial photographs taken at the height of the alleged extermination of the Hungarian Jews at Birkenau show an uneventful camp devoid of any evidence of a mass extermination program.
John C. Ball writes:
“The air photos of Auschwitz-Birkenau known to date from the period of December 1943 to February 1945 show no signs of fuel depots, massive smoke from chimneys or open fires, burning pits or pyres. The photos were altered: fake Zyklon-B input shafts and groups of inmates were retouched onto the photo negatives. One must assume that any actual mass-murder activities would not have escaped the notice of the air-photo interpreters, which would have resulted in the bombing of the camp – but this did not happen….To this day there is no air-photo evidence to support the alleged mass murder of the Jews at any location in Europe occupied by the Germans during World War II.” (Source: Ball, John C., Air-Photo Evidence, in Rudolf, Germar (ed.), Dissecting the Holocaust: The Growing Critique of Truth and Memory, Uckfield, UK: Castle Hill Publishers, 2019, p. 277).
In conclusion, the Hungarian Jews were not subject to a program of mass extermination at Auschwitz-Birkenau. No homicidal gas chambers existed at Auschwitz-Birkenau to carry out such a massive extermination process. The crematoria capacity at Auschwitz-Birkenau was also not sufficient to cremate the alleged dead Hungarian Jews in the time period claimed by Holocaust historians. Finally, Allied aerial photographs taken at the height of the alleged extermination of the Hungarian Jews at Birkenau show an uneventful camp devoid of any evidence of a mass extermination program.
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Brás Cubas says:@Patrick McNally
The quote was not invented out of thin air, yet is somewhat inexact, and taken out of context; the date is wrong. It was extracted from the opinion piece Grynspan, tu es absous (‘Grynspan, you are absolved’) by Bernard Lecache, published in his newspaper Le droit de vivre (‘The Right to Live’), edition of November 19, 1938. The subject is the murder of German diplomat Ernst vom Rath by Herschel Grynszpan. The article was published on pages 1 and 5 of the aforementioned edition. The excerpt from which the quote was extracted is on page 5, consisting of the final section of that article. To read the French original, you can access that newspaper’s digital archives:
https://archives.licra.org/droit-de-vivre-1932-plus-ancien-journal-antiraciste
The direct link to the archive file containing all 1930s editions is:
https://archives.licra.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/Journal-Droit-De-Vivre-LICRA-Annees-30.zip
Under the [more] tag I will provide an English translation of the entire final section:[MORE]• Replies: @Patrick McNallyAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Dube says:@John Wear
In conclusion, the Hungarian Jews were not subject to a program of mass extermination at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
If that’s so, the question remains, why were they assembled in Hungary and then delivered to Auschwitz?
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Fran Taubman says:@Dube
Using every last drop of fuel and resources the Germans had. Sending sick and elderly people to Auschwitz. WHERE THERE WAS NO ROOM TO FEED OR HOUSE THEM. You have to make some sort of common sense understanding of why. The why? To eradicate them.
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Mark Bahner says:
“Do you think someone should get away with mass murder, simply because they burn the bodies and spread the ashes?”
Who is left to punish? Haven’t the perpetrators been executed/imprisoned?
I phrased that improperly. They did get away with mass murder, although some of them were punished. What I meant was that it is very wrong to say that people weren’t murdered, just because the murderers burned their bodies and spread their ashes in a river, pond, or on or in the ground.
Have you ever seen Schindler’s List? If you haven’t, you should watch it. If you have, you’ll know about the “little girl in the red coat.”
This picture, to me, contains “the little girl in the red coat.”
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=555376876627703&id=100064661865080&set=a.370529531779106
The little girl standing on the right, looking into the camera…why the hell would someone murder her, simply because she’s Jewish? Or her little sister, sitting on the ground next to her? Or the two boys in caps in the left of the photo? Why the hell would someone murder little children, just because they’re Jewish?
Through the incredible power of searching the Internet, I’m pretty sure I at least know her name. Her name was Gerty Ackerman, and her sister’s name was Wally. And the two boys were Reuven and Gershon Fogel. And all four of those children, and their mothers, were murdered in a gas chamber in Auschwitz, shortly after that photo was taken. Because they were Jewish.
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Fran Taubman says:@Kali
Kali you seem remarkably childish and immature. I know that you are a decent person, but the nature of your questions seem just inappropriate for the amount of evidence written about the Holocaust.
Can you please provide evidence that those people were murdered at Auschwitz, by whatever means. Where are their remains?
You are making the claim, therefore you need to prove that claim. Where are the bodies or ashes of these hundreds of thousands of murder victims?
You accept John Wear as telling the truth. But John Wear nor anyone else can find what happened to the missing Jews. Do you know what Hungary was like in 1944? Do you have a feel for it. A country invaded by Germany in the death throes of the war so that Hungary would not make a separate peace treaty with the Allies.
The enemies of Germany were marching head first at every front. The Germans were desperate for armaments, for food, for fuel. They were on their last legs. The war was about to be over in less than one year.
So can you answer me this question kali. Why when you were down to empty on you resources would you with blinding speed 475,000 Hungarian Jews to a place Auschwitz that had no room for them. Literally standing in the open air. The sick, the disabled, the elderly, women with babies?
Why? What explanation do you have for that event? Now 300,000 of those transported were missing the day they arrived at Auschwitz. Someones mother, and father would go to crematorium and not come out. They are dead Kali, because that is the only possible explanation.
Please punch this photo up and read the caption. It is a group of Hungarian Jews waiting outside of Crematorium 4 in the woods. It was so busy that day it was waiting room only. This picture and the location are verified by Carlos Mattagno a famous H denier. These people were never seen again.
Then look at this photo. The Hungarian Jews in this photo were not registered in the camp. No room. They are on their way to one of the 5 crematoriums at Auschwitz to be murdered.
Listen to these people. Literally hundreds of videos. Who are you Kali, to say these people are lying.
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Mark Bahner says:@Dube
If that’s so, the question remains, why were they assembled in Hungary and then delivered to Auschwitz?
Yes, looking for slave laborers in a war that’s already obviously lost is bad enough. But why not *just* take fathers, or even mothers, or even fathers and mothers? Why take children and grandparents?
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John Wear says:@Dube
You ask: “If that’s so, the question remains, why were they assembled in Hungary and then delivered to Auschwitz?”
My response: Hungarian Jews were assembled in Hungary and sent to Auschwitz-Birkenau and other camps because the Germans regarded Jews as being generally hostile toward Germany. Many Jewish partisans were actively killing German troops. In addition to ghetto fighters, Jewish civilians fled to the forests and enlisted in partisan units, carrying out sabotage and intelligence missions. (Source: Batalion, Judy, The Light of Days: The Untold Story of Women Resistance Fighters in Hitler’s Ghettos, New York: Harper Collins Publishers, 2020, p. 5).
The authorities of the Third Reich reasoned that Jews had to be interned to protect against these sabotage and intelligence operations.
You might want to read my article at https://inconvenienthistory.com/14/1/8184 for more information.
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Alexandros says:@Mark Bahner
Because then jews like yourself would complain about evil Germans separating children from their families. Uprooted means to remove the whole thing.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
You actually just suggested I watch a Hollywood movie to learn about a historical occurrence.
I’m flabbergasted. And, amused.
You seem fixated on the Hungarian Jews. I will take your advice and more thoroughly research that particular point of Holocaust lore; I will try to avoid the university library.
By the way, how historically accurate was Braveheart? Or the Last of the Mohicans? (Frankly, Daniel Day-Lewis, with long hair and dressed in a loincloth, makes me want to travel backwards in time. Is he Jewish? I can get past it.)
Do you ever wonder what really happened in Whoville? You can watch “How the Grinch Stole Christmas” to find out.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Kali
Kali,
There’s something amok on the right side of the 2nd undoctored photo recently sent your way. You may need to invest in some sort of loupe….
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Mark,
I had another thought; are you a mole, turned loose amongst the Pushers of the Official Holocaust Narrative Society?
Based on your previous exchanges/arguments and stated credentials, I find it hard to believe you are seriously making an argument based on a Hollywood movie. By the “unbiased” Spielberg, no less.
All snark aside, I find it strange.
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@Patrick McNally
Thanks for motivating me to verify the quote. Though it was not one of my memes, I have revised it according to my search (see below), Leacache’s correct title and the date of the quote:
“Germany is our public enemy number one. It is our object to declare war without mercy against her. One may be sure of this: We will lead that war!” – Bernard Lecache, the president of the “International League Against Racism and Anti-Semitism,” in its newspaper “Droit de Vivre,” 9 November, 1938. There are numerous other jew quotes testifying to the jews’ declaring war on Germany long before a proverbial hair on any jew’s head was harmed: https://newamericangovernment.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/JewsDeclareWarOnGermany1933.pdfAs an aside—memes bearing my website URL have all been verified for accuracy (allowing, of course, for parodies of Chabad Fran and the like). Several hundred jew memes here: http://judaism.is/memes.html
Untermeyer’s quote is so thoroughly documented that it is incontrovertible (Chabad Fran, of course, ignores it), yet it is quite amusing how typically deficient Wikipedia is in its Untermeyer entry. That entry on Untermeyer discusses his gardening, but doesn’t mention that he was the first to declare World War 2 in 1933 (!!!) as a “holy war” of World Jewry against Germany. Neither does Wikipedia mention that Untermeyer (along with Bernard Baruch) was behind the Scofield Concordance that afflicted the world with the scourge of “Christian” Zionism. Wikipedia offers a one-liner mentioning Untermeyer’s occultism, albeit claiming “corroborating evidence remains nebulous.” Expectedly, the evidence of Untermeyer’s ritual satanism is not at all nebulous and explains the role of Untermeyer as Satan’s warmonger. As a Rothschild agent, Untermeyer blackmailed President Woodrow Wilson for a sexual affair to force his support of the Rothschild’s “Federal” Reserve Bank and the USA’s entry into World War 1—a blood sacrifice to Satan of 35 million Gentiles killed—and World War 2—an even greater blood sacrifice of 60 to 80 million Gentiles. What other jew can lay claim for so many dead Gentiles? And not a peep of that in jew-pedia.
A suspicious person might conclude that the jews had something to hide. (laughing)
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Fran Taubman says:@Tiptoethrutulips
There is nothing suspect about that photo. It is colorized. Famous Album. As a matter of fact
Mark posted the same in black and white.https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=555376876627703&id=100064661865080&set=a.370529531779106
These photos are from the same album. The photos were small, and have been blown up. This album of the Hungarian Jewish transport to Auschwitz has pretty much blown H denial out of the water. Cause they claimed only a handful of employable Jews were transferred. Look at the photos of the people at the crematorium. You cannot rationally explain why these Hungarian Jews were transported to Auschwitz. It was to exterminate them. What does the enigma code have to do with murdering Jews.
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Fran Taubman says:@Alexandros
There was no where to “uproot ” them do. Might as well have dropped them off on the road. There was not one inch of room, and no food. They were fine in their Budapest Ghettos and posed no danger to the Germans, who had already lost the war.
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@Dube
If that’s so, the question remains, why were they assembled in Hungary and then delivered to Auschwitz?
Have you never heard of the murderous rampage of the “Hungarian” Béla Kun (neé Cohen) and his minions? https://www.deathofcommunism.com/bela-kun/ Not all my relatives survived Kun’s holocaust of Catholics. Why pretend that the perpetrators and accomplices should not have been sought and then rounded up? Why pretend that jews can instigate, finance, and conduct deadly revolutions with impunity? What culpable self-blinding hypocrisy!
America apprehended and incarcerated many Japanese and many Germans. Why then be mystified why Germany would also apprehend and incarcerate her declared and proven enemies? Perhaps a new epithet needs to be coined—”enemy denial.”
• The jews were (and still are!!!) perpetrators, not innocent victims. http://judaism.is/perpetrators.html
• The jews murdered many thousands in their 1918-1919 Spartacist and Bavarian Socialist Republic revolutions.
• The jews murdered many millions in neighboring European countries, Russia, Hungary <<< ahem!— I ask again, "Have you never heard of the murderous rampage of the "Hungarian" Kun (neé Cohen) and his minions in their 1919 Hungarian Soviet Republic?"
• The jews declared global holy war on Germany in 1933, imposed economic blockade and sanctions that caused starvation in Germany.German would have been culpably remiss if they had not apprehended and incarcerated their declared internal enemies!
Why aren’t you lamenting the ¼ BILLION Gentiles who died at the hands of jewish-instigated wars and revolutions in the 20th century? http://judaism.is/perpetrators.html The jews are damn lucky that fewer than 130,000 of them died in a war they started. http://judaism.is/holocaust.html Why are you carrying water for the worst mass murderers of all time?
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Brad Anbro says:@Tiptoethrutulips
What did you expect? He cites MSM as “gospel” for the events of September 11, 2001 and he has yet to reply to my refutation of his “facts” concerning that day…
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@Fran Taubman
Chabad Fran sez:
You cannot rationally explain why these Hungarian Jews were transported to Auschwitz.
I just did explain the rationality of apprehending and incarcerating a declared internal enemy with a bloody global body count in the dozens of millions! http://judaism.is/perpetrators.html It is your feigned victimhood that is irrational.
The “Jews” and the Hungarian Soviet Republic: It is a widely known fact, and to this day still deemed important by the historical memory of the Hungarian right, that two-thirds of the members of the Hungarian Soviet Republic’s Revolutionary Government Council were of Jewish origin. According to surviving conspiracy theories centering on this fact, the Hungarian Soviet Republic was an attempt by an aggressive minority, hostile to the Magyars, to seize power in the country. A “rat revolution” that destroyed ancient Hungary.… https://fromharvesttoharvest.osaarchivum.org/chapters/10?lang=en
Having just suffered the murderous rampage of the commie jews, Hungarians were understandably alert, outraged, and deserving of justice.
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Mark Bahner says:@Tiptoethrutulips
I’ve already made a tremendous number of comments about who I am. (Far more than you’ve made about yourself, as far as I’m aware. :-))
I’m a retired mechanical/environmental engineer. My first ancestor on my father’s came to the United States before there *was* a United States…he was a Hessian soldier taken prisoner by Washington’s forces in the Battle of Trenton. He later deserted, got married, and settled down in PA.
I never even heard of Ron Unz (sorry Ron) until about two weeks ago. I was referred to him by another commenter on the blog, “Marginal Revolution” when I made comments about National Socialism and WW2, including this comment:
My point was that National Socialism (Nazism) was, is, and always will be profoundly evil. Just like communism.
It bugs the hell out of me when young whippersnappers (i.e., ignorant people under 50 years old) going around waving their disgusting Nazi flags, promoting an evil that their great-grandfathers and great-granduncles may even have *died* fighting against:
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Fran Taubman
Despite what you claim, Holocaust denial has not been blown out of the water; I’m sure Holocaust deniers (aka people with inquiring minds, lying eyes, or common sense) have certainly been cast out to sea, blown out of windows, thrown into dungeons, run over by jeeps, etc.). How many comments are on this thread alone? I think the official narrative is slipping.
A colorized photograph is not “undoctored”, technically. I’m not certain the photo in question appears the way it does due to colorization, but I’ll take another gander.
If I am not mistaken, wasn’t there a photograph, once in circulation, of a pile of bodies, presented as Polish(?) victims of German soldiers, but upon closer inspection, the eagle insignias on their clothing were identified upon magnification? I won’t swear to it as I read it during a cursory glance at some random reporting, but I can check on that too.
If rationality were the order of the day, regarding the Holocaust, we wouldn’t be here.
I’ll work on the Hungarian Question.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Mark,
I wasn’t questioning your credentials or your veracity regarding your engineering skills. Not at all.
I just find it odd, that a person with an “engineering” mind would resort to claims about a movie for accurate historical reference. I did watch the Holocaust movie (more than one); I also watched the movie, The Last of the Mohicans, based on a quasi-historical novel. A representative for the author/author’s estate of TLOTM, issued a statement upon release of the movie about the deviation from the original story. It’s quite different subject matter, but it happens all the time. Just verify the claims/assertions/representations made in Hidden Figures; the movie was absurd.
The fact that I believe you to be honest about your qualifications/background is the reason I found the movie reference odd or out of character.
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kb_2 says:@Fran Taubman
Your are so full of hate…
You give your opinion about the revisionists, let me give my opinion about you (and some background of me)
I tend to accept an orthodox story of Holocaust (despite my interest in revisionist studies), and I find an radical antisemitic atttitude of some people who are holding revisionist views as disgusting. In fact, I only 2 times wanted to wash my hands after reading a [part of a] book. One of this was pro-revisionist book including mockery of Jewish stories in unpleasant terms. (another was soviet propganda book full of lies about dissidents).
I sympathize with those who suffered from the Germans, for us – the Russians – the war remained a collective trauma. I don’t understand the Revisionists’ fixation on Anne Frank (and I denounce anti-Semitic memes with her). I used to think of Hitler as a villain (and still consider him a villain). And Stalin was also a villain. I do not want to devalue the feelings of people who have gone through difficult trials. I don’t understand people who deny Israel’s right to exist. I’ll be honзest, sometimes I feel bad because I read revisionist writings (as if I’m doing something wrong). This happens not only with revisionism – but also, for example, with books about the Shakespeare Authorship question etc. But this attitude is just a learned reaction that makes it difficult to approach the issue impartially. From my point of view, truthfulness of orthodox story of Holocaust is a purely scholarly question (despite existing correlation between revisionism and anti-jewish or anti-sionist sentiment). Yes, if revisionism is right, an explanation is needed as to why the incorrect view has been held for so long. But that doesn’t mean hatred for the all Jews.
Revisionism may be wrong in general, correct in particular, or generally correct. I agree that there are (or were?) false statements in revisionism (and I found them when I read Jurgen Graf’s book in Russian). But in order to evaluate everything, you need to read the original theses, the answers to them, the answers to the answers, and so on (or be able to evaluate them impartially). It’s difficult to most people including due to time consuming.
In Russia we have one popular conspiracy theory about history called New Chronology. According to it, world history begins in the 10th century, antiquity is the Middle Ages, Christ lived in the 11th century, the whole world was united by a world empire (Russian), and generally accepted historiography is the repeated duplication of events by falsifying historians. People were also duplicated – the Russian Tsar Ivan the Terrible = 4 different people, Jesus Christ was Pope Gregory, as well as Emperor Andronik Komnenos. Egyptian pharaohs, by the way, were Russian tsars (and some of them may have ruled in the 19th century).
Some might say that this is blasphemy, or a distortion of history. But a person familiar with the new chronology knows that it is based on some methods (statistical, astronomical, and so on). When these methods were tested by independent researchers, they were found to be unsuitable, unreliable, and giving false results. The creator of the New Chronology, academician Fomenko, has been working on it since the 1970s. Due to censorship, historians prevented him from releasing the book – and a detailed critical analysis of his theories appeared only in the late 90s. However, he did not give up on her and continues to release new books every year. Some people think he’s doing it for commercial reasons, but I think he sincerely believes it. His writings are written in a specific language (I would say somewhat schizotypal) – and as a prominent mathematician, he probably believes more in theoretical than in empirical reality.Some people have gone even further than he (and believe that world history began in the 19th century). I even saw a book by a person who believes that the first and second world wars are the same event (this is NOT a metaphor, he came to this conclusion, including comparing the mustaches of the rulers of countries and durations of wars). This is bordering on insanity.
For me, the New Chronology is an obsolete scientific hypothesis. There was a very small chance that it might be true – but it turned out that it wasn’t. (how one can believe in it is difficult to explain to a person who has not read Fomenko’s books in the correct sequence – I will say that this is an immersion in a fantastic new world that pretend to be baseed on science but turns into madness).
Those who are interested in science know that scientists work within the framework of research programs. Weaknesses can be improved, new hypotheses can be proposed. Fomenko, by the way, wrote a formal response to criticism. Theories rarely die immediately – and often they do when their proponents die. It`s naturally. The new chronology has already been completely refuted, but it will die with the death of Fomenko (in fact, he has one permanent and a couple of episodic co-authors, but it doesn’t matter). Another example is an AIDS dissidence (There are no young or prominent new biologists who accept it – as a scientific theory, it will die with the death of Duesberg, or a little later). Some will disagree with me, this question will be resolved by history.
Attitudes with personal testimonies is part of the research programs. There is such a thing as false memories, for example. People can sincerely recall incredible things, such as false past lives. Or non-existent sexual assault. If there is serious evidence, one can refer to such a possibility. I am NOT now blaming survivors or claiming they are automatically wrong (in fact, research shows that memory is much more reliable than false memory theorists believe). You just don’t see any reason to doubt these testimonies, but someone does. And of course, if you listen to the survivors a lot without prejudice, you will tend to believe them – also because (at least) many of them speak sincerely. But if someone has a different view of things than you, this does not automatically make him a monster.
Please remember that a) anyone can make mistakes – including you and me b) we don’t know exactly what’s going on in other people’s minds c) people are often irrational, and that there are defense mechanisms in our mind. I think you sometimes lack compassion for the person (Germar) who (in your opinion) is mistaken and deceiving himself. And when people think that revisionism is something based on hate, I know they are wrong from introspection (although I have never been a convinced revisionist). I have a split attitude towards the Jews, but for me these things are not connected. This is one of the many unorthodox theories that I have dived into a bit (and most of them seem wrong to me).
You want to punish a person for believing in an outdated (in your opinion) historical theory. This person has done nothing to you personally. He didn’t hit anyone, he didn’t kill anyone. He does not call for violence – he only defends his views, for which he has already suffered. Yes, these views may seem offensive to someone. But, for example, the attitude of some Jews towards the Palestinians may also seem like this. To some, Christianity seems anti-human.
You hate people for their “incorrect” views, and you may be right that they are wrong (or may be wrong). But personally, I hate people who want to ban (at the state level). And I think that people who aggressively interfere with the lives of other people should not go unpunished.
When you justify the possible death of a person for his thoughts and (non-violent) words, you become a pure evil. You deny him the right to have his own thoughts. There are revisionists who have become disillusioned with revisionism. When they believed in him – with a pure heart – did they deserve your hatred?
Germar Rudolf has a list of correct and wrong statements about revisionists’ beliefs. According his views on it, revisionists a) DON’T deny that the treatment of the Jews was unjust b) DON’T deny the victims their dignity c) DON’T deny the victims to be remembered d) DON’T deny to show compassion for the victims. It’s his words. (https://germarrudolf.com/en/germars-views-2/101-false-claims-about-revisionism/). When you wish him death in custody, you are worser than him (even if he is wrong).
P.S I would like to emphasize that I consider Holocaust revisionism to be necessary to point out dark places in the accepted history (even if it turns out to be 100 percent wrong)
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Mark Bahner says:@Kali
So my question to you is, WHY do you choose to uphold a narrative that has no real evidence to support it, which paints your own people and culture as inherently bad, and which grants to your enemy the excuse it needs to destroy your people and culture?
I’m not sure who you think my “own people and culture” are, but I was born in the USA, just like Bruce Springsteen.
I’m happy to have been born in the USA in part because the USA actually has a founding principle. As far as I’m aware, that’s unique among all countries in the world. That founding principle was articulated (but not practiced!) very well by Thomas Jefferson:
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.–That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, –
People may disagree, but what I interpret “all men are created equal” to mean is that all people everywhere are created equal under the law…that every person has has the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.
Further, like Jefferson said, I think the purpose of government is to protect those rights.
National Socialism (Naziism) is basically the complete *opposite* of that principle. The Nazis were absolutely clear in their view that all people are *not* created equal…deserving of equal treatment under the law. Communism is also the exact opposite of those principles articulated in the Declaration of Independence.
As far as the “evidence”…the evidence that many hundreds of thousands of innocent people were murdered at Auschwitz-Birkenau is overwhelming.
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Fran Taubman says:@kb_2
Kali’s husband. We hen the going gets tough. The mister shows up. I do not understand what the fuck you and Kali are talking about. You all smoke too much weed. Reread your post. It is an incoherent mess.
I hate holocaust revisionism. BecauseA. I am Jewish
B. Because of have Holocaust survivors in my familyIs that okay with you? And if not go fuck off. Who are you lecturing?
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@Mark Bahner
As a Catholic I am bound to oppose —and I do oppose—all socialism and all supremacist creeds, whether national socialism, it’s mirror image, international socialism. or supremacist talmudic judaism, like Fran’s Chabad. http://judaism.is/chabad.html Catholic or not, a thinking man should reject and ridicule the cartoonish H
llywd mis-representation of history, cause and effect, deadly revolutions, declarations of war and the expected outcome of perpetrating those true evils.…an evil that their great-grandfathers and great-granduncles may even have *died* fighting against…
Judging from the outcome, many of those great-grandfathers actually died fighting *for* evil, jewish supremacist evils like the banksters, war profiteers, depopulationists, abortionists, pornographers, weaponized “vaccines,” weaponized money, perpetual war, perversion, sexual slavery and sexual mutilation of children. Those tragically misled men died in vain. Look around you. Would you die to advance a world like the jews have built?
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Mark Bahner says:@Fran Taubman
I find Holocaust denial very creepy. Gemar Rudolf’s Visa is up and the US is not going to renew it, the Germans want to extradite him, and try him for all of his H denial books. He has been warned many times to stop. I hope he rots in jail. I hope he gives up like Anne Frank did.
I agree with kb_2.
Putting people in jail for Holocaust denial is wrong. Speaking or writing things that are ignorant and/or filled with hate should not be punished as a crime.
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Mark Bahner says:
Judging from the outcome, many of those great-grandfathers actually died fighting *for* evil, jewish supremacist evils like the banksters…
This is how I see what the U.S. fought for in WW2:
1) The Japanese government (military) attacked the United States.
2) The German government declared war on the United States.Both actions obviously proved to be big mistakes.
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@kb_2
In fact, I only 2 times wanted to wash my hands after reading a [part of a] book. One of this was pro-revisionist book including mockery of Jewish stories in unpleasant terms.
What rational person would not mock the hundreds of imbecilic testimonies by supposed “eyewitnesses”??? https://judaism.is/holocaust.html#imbecilictestimony The jews have been lying about their supposed victimhood for millennia (see the Babylonian Talmud Gittin 57b-58a below and here: https://judaism.is/holocaust.html#liarstradition ). Why not laugh at such quintessentially jewish bullshit? In both the Old (Osee 4:1-2) and New Testaments (John 8:44) GOD HIMSELF calls them liars. They hate that God outed them and that is precisely why they claim their damned talmud supersedes the “Written Torah.” http://judaism.is/torah.html
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Wizard of Oz says:@John Wear
I don’t mean to be rude but the inadequacy of your reply confirms my scepticism. No, if they didn’t know the messages were being cracked they wouldn’t need to leave anything out. But why suppose they were interested in reporting the deaths of non workers killed on arrival?
A similar point can be made about the figures for the disabled. “These are workers who, in varying degree, are disabled from work. How do we handle this?”
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Mark,
I’m going to butt in here, again, as I assume this is as good a place as any.
You say you are a random commenter, and I believe you. I, myself, have read Unz for years, but never commented. I am convalescing from serious soft tissue injuries, and home bound for a while under medical advice. So, I started talking, so to speak.
If I may, with all due respect, point out an issue with your method of discourse, using the official document you submitted as “evidence”of your position: the statement of Dr. Bendel. I will be as brief as possible.
1. No date on document.
2. It’s titled “duly sworn”, but no stated/written oath; no signature with certification/witness.
3. Witness provides age, but no date of birth for authentication/identification purposes.
4. Witness says he is a doctor. A note of educational history or place of practice must be included for authentication purposes.
5. Why is a doctor testifying about construction materials for a structure built prior to his arrival?; why would a doctor be asked to testify in this area regardless of build date?
6. Why is a doctor testifying about zyklon b administration, but makes no claims about actual involvement thereof?
7. Why doesn’t he testify about the condition of the victims, or other aspects of this particular area/practice, as it would be more in his wheelhouse/authority?The affidavit, you presented, would be tossed out of anything other than a kangaroo court. A lawyer would be ashamed to submit such a fraudulent document as proof of anything.
A person is not evil to point out these discrepancies; I asked you valid questions regarding same, but you vanished like a thief in the night. From my point of view, the vast majority of evidence presented by the establishment is not admissible in court, or would be stricken or easily defeated.
If you submit evidence, you must be prepared to defend it. No one really does so; we just move along to the next bone of contention, and nothing is resolved or withdrawn. It’s a circus. And, that’s no hyperbole. Bread and circuses, on and on.
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Al Liguori says:@Fran Taubman
I hate holocaust revisionism. Because
A. I am Jewish
B. Because of [sic] have [HoloHoaxers] in my familyI hate HoloHoax bullshit because:
A. I am Catholic
B. Because our family has bona fide survivors of the Judeo-Communist genocides
C. I am bound to hate EVIL, including your lies.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
1. FDR knew of the impending attack. The Japanese were responding to actions taken by US to deny access to resources; they were goaded, as unbelievable as that seems. The proof is out there….
2. Judea declared war on Germany. Then England and France did the same. Who fought/manipulated to get the US into the war, thereby assuring Germany’s defeat? The proof is out there….
Why would the US ally with and subsidize Russian’s communist regime?
Why did Churchill and Eisenhower, both, express regret over the war, years later, both alluding to “hidden forces?”
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@Mark Bahner
You have a cartoonish understanding of the history of the World Wars, the manipulations including blackmail, the Lusitania, concealed advance knowledge of Pearl Harbor, and you still ignore the Jews’ 1933 declaration of global holy war. http://judaism.is/world-wars.html Oh, as for mocking eyewitnesses… • different colored crematoria smoke for different ethnicities• mass graves expelling geysers of blood • child surviving six gassings in a gas chamber that never existed • woman survived three gassings because Nazis kept running out of gas • fairy tale of a bear and an eagle in a cage, eating one Jew per day • erupting and exploding mass graves • soap production from human fat with imprint “RIF ” – ‘Reine Juden Seife’ (pure Jewish soap) • solemn burial of soap • the SS made sausage in the crematoria out of human flesh • lampshades, book covers, driving gloves for SS officers, saddles, riding breeches, house slippers, and ladies handbags of human skin • pornographic pictures on canvasses made of human skin • mummified human thumbs were used as light switches in the house of Ilse Koch, wife of KL commander Koch (Buchenwald) • production of shrunken heads from bodies of inmates • acid or boiling-water baths to produce human skeletons • muscles cut from the legs of executed inmates contracted so strongly that they made the buckets jump about • an SS-father potshooting babies thrown into the air while 9-year old SS-daughter applauds and shrieks: “Papa, do it again; do it again, Papa!” • Jewish children used by Hitler-Youth for target practice • wagons disappearing on an incline into the underground crematoria in Auschwitz (such facilities never existed) • forcing prisoners to lick stairs clean, and collect garbage with their lips • injections into the eyes of inmates to change their eye color • first artificially fertilize women at Auschwitz, then gas them • torturing people in specially mass-produced “torture boxes” made by Krupp • torturing people by shooting at them with wooden bullets to make them talk • smacking people with special spanking machines • killing by drinking a glass of liquid hydrogen cyanide (which, scientifically considered, evaporates quickly and would endanger those who pouring it into said glass) • killing people with poisoned soft drinks • underground mass extermination in enormous rooms, by means of high voltage electricity • blast 20,000 Jews into the twilight zone with atomic bombs • killing in vacuum chamber, hot steam or chlorine gas • mass murder in hot steam chamber • mass murder by tree cutting: forcing people to climb trees, then cutting the trees down • killing a boy by forcing him to eat sand • gassing Soviet POWs in a quarry • gas chambers on wheels in Treblinka, which dumped their victims directly into burning pits • delayed-action poison gas that allowed the victims to leave the gas chambers and walk to the mass graves by themselves • rapid-construction portable gas chamber sheds • beating people to death, then carrying out autopsies to see why they died • introduction of Zyklon gas into the gas chambers of Auschwitz through shower heads or from steel bottles • electrical conveyor-belt executions • bashing people’s brains in with a pedal-driven brain-bashing machine while listening to the radio • cremation of bodies in blast furnaces • cremation of human bodies using no fuel at all • skimming off boiling human fat from open-air cremation fires • mass graves containing hundreds of thousands of bodies, removed without a trace within a few weeks; a true miracle of improvisation on the part of the Germans • killing 840,000 Russian POWs at Sachsenhausen, and burning the bodies in 4 portable ovens • removal of corpses by means of blasting, i.e., blowing them up • SS bicycle races in the gas chamber of Birkenau • out of pity for complete strangers – a Jewish mother and her child – an SS-man leaps into the gas chamber voluntarily at the last second in order to die with them • blue haze after gassing with hydrogen cyanide (which is colorless) • singing of national anthems and the Communist International by the victims in the gas chamber • a twelve-year old boy giving an impressive and heroic speech in front of the other camp children before being ‘gassed’ • filling the mouths of victims with cement to prevent them from singing patriotic or communist songs. • Underground mass extermination in enormous rooms, by means of high voltage electricity • Killing in vacuum chamber or with steam or chlorine gas • Gas chambers on wheels in Treblinka, which dumped their victims directly into burning pits; • Electrical conveyor-belt executions • Cremation of bodies in blast furnaces • SS bicycle races in the gas chamber of Birkenau • Removal of corpses by means of blasting, i.e., blowing them up • Blue haze after gassing with hydrocyanic acid (which is colorless) • Rapid-construction portable gas chamber sheds • Muscles cut from the legs of executed inmates contract so strongly that it makes the buckets jump about • Introduction of Zyklon gas into the gas chambers of Auschwitz through shower heads or from steel bottles • Breathed through a keyhole in a gas chamber door at Flossburg to stay alive, cursed the SS when they opened the door, then ran away • woman survived three gassings because Nazis kept running out of gas • mass murder by tree cutting: forcing people to climb trees, then cutting the trees down • killing a boy by forcing him to eat sand • gassing Soviet POWs in a quarry • beating people to death, then carrying out autopsies to see why they died • killing 840,000 Russian POWs at Sachsenhausen, and burning the bodies in 4 portable ovens • etc. https://judaism.is/holocaust.html#imbecilictestimony
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John Wear says:
You ask about the Germans: “No, if they didn’t know the messages were being cracked they wouldn’t need to leave anything out. But why suppose they were interested in reporting the deaths of non workers killed on arrival?”
My response: Why wouldn’t the Germans report the deaths of non workers killed on arrival?
If the reports were made using Enigma codes which the Germans assumed could never be broken, I think they would report all deaths that occurred in their camps. This would include non workers killed on arrival.
You write: A similar point can be made about the figures for the disabled. “These are workers who, in varying degree, are disabled from work. How do we handle this?”
My response: As stated in my post #1363, there were large numbers of disabled people at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
The Holocaust story also claims that virtually all Jews who were too sick to work were immediately killed. The documentary evidence, however, indicates that a high percentage of the inmates at Birkenau were disabled. Oswald Pohl, in a secret report to Heinrich Himmler dated April 5, 1944, stated that there were 67,000 inmates in the entire Auschwitz-Birkenau camp complex, of which 18,000 were unable to work. In Birkenau there were a total of 36,000 inmates, of whom “approximately 15,000 are unable to work.” (Source: Nuremberg document NO-021, NMT (The “green series”), Vol. 5, pp. 384-385).
Such high percentages of disabled inmates at Auschwitz-Birkenau are not consistent with a German program of mass extermination.
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Mark Bahner says:@littlereddot
From the looks of these plans, it appears that the facility was really used as a crematorium and would have functioned efficiently as such. If it were to be retrofitted as a gas chamber cum crematorium, some tell tale modifications would have to have been made.
I’ve already replied to this, but this is a modified reply.
I don’t think it’s possible to decide what a facility was used for, based on its design. One can hypothesize about its intended use, but one can’t determine its actual use.
To take an analogy out of thin air, suppose one sees a concrete basketball court, with baskets and lines and everything. One can say, “This was intended to be used as a basketball court,” but one can’t say, “This was not used a roller skating rink,” or “This was not used as a badmitton court,” or even “This was not used as an ice-skating rink.”
As I’ve pointed out in several previous comments, from May-July 1944, several hundred thousand Hungarian Jews seem to have been transported to Auschwitz and died, and their bodies vanished. Since there are a great many contemporaneous accounts that Crematorium II, III, IV, and V were used as gas chambers and crematoriums, the most logical conclusion for where the several hundred thousand living people went is that they were murdered in the gas chambers and their bodies burned in the crematoria.
This is the most logical conclusion for many reasons, but among the strongest has to be that the vast majority of those who disappeared would be considered “unfit for work” (e.g., children and the elderly). It simply wouldn’t make sense for Nazi Germany at the end of a war they were losing, to take those “unfit for work” out of Hungary (where those “unfit for work” could be cared for by friends and relatives) and to house them where housing and food would need to be provided. (Even though, obviously, the food was ridiculously limited, and the housing ridiculously overcrowded.)
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
My response: Why wouldn’t the Germans report the deaths of non workers killed on arrival?
Because there was no need. If the number of Hungarian Jews *arriving* was reported, and the number registered or transferred without registration was reported, the number killed on arrival could be determined by simple subtraction.
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Mark Bahner says:@Tiptoethrutulips
If I may, with all due respect, point out an issue with your method of discourse, using the official document you submitted as “evidence”of your position: the statement of Dr. Bendel. I will be as brief as possible.
I presented it as something interesting I found. I asked John Wear (and anyone else) if it was fraudulent or otherwise invalid.
I will be as brief as possible.
1. No date on document.
etc. etc. etc.
Yes, you’re absolutely right. Those are all valid points/criticisms.
A person is not evil to point out these discrepancies; I asked you valid questions regarding same, but you vanished like a thief in the night.
Look, “tiptoethrutulips,” I’m responding to at least a half-dozen other commenters, as well as concurrently reading multiple books on Auschwitz, as well as scouring the Internet for information. Plus, you know…I actually have other things going on in my life.
If you want your questions answered, you’re not likely to have *better* luck getting answers by writing things like, “…but you vanished like a thief in the night.”
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Shafar Nullifidian says:@Brosi
“…Hitler knew that if he lost that the German Volk would face Jewish lies at Nuremberg and the Red Rapist Army.”
Herr Hitler was dead before the unprecedented International Military Tribunals were established in August of 1945. He was prescient enough to realize inasmuch as the Allies indiscriminately bombed civilian population all across Europe there would be no limit to the barbarity to which Germans would be subject as a result of Unconditional Surrender as demanded by the truly bestial Allies. Eisenhower being one of the more Satanic. Ike the Kike, murdered German POW, redesignated as Disarmed Enemy Forces. Stalin had returnedRussian POWS slaughtered or sent to gulags where German POWs languished and died.
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
My response: Hungarian Jews were assembled in Hungary and sent to Auschwitz-Birkenau and other camps because the Germans regarded Jews as being generally hostile toward Germany.
Hungarian Jewish children were hostile to Germany? How could that possibly harm Germany?
Also, if Germany was worried about Hungarian Jewish children being hostile to Germany, why didn’t Germany just get out of Hungary? Wouldn’t that lower the level of hostility towards Germany quite a bit?
The authorities of the Third Reich reasoned that Jews had to be interned to protect against these sabotage and intelligence operations.
The Hungarian Jewish children and grandmothers and grandfathers needed to be transported from Hungary to prison camps in Poland to “protect against sabotage and intelligence operations”? Seriously, John? The German military can’t protect themselves against “sabotage and intelligence operations” by Hungarian Jewish children, grandmothers, and grandfathers?
No wonder the stinking Nazis lost the war!
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Kali says:@Fran Taubman
Hi Fran,
Using every last drop of fuel and resources the Germans had. Sending sick and elderly people to Auschwitz. WHERE THERE WAS NO ROOM TO FEED OR HOUSE THEM. You have to make some sort of common sense understanding of why. The why? To eradicate them.
Then why not just kill them where they stood? It would have been cheeper and easier, not to mention more efficient.
Transporting the mealy to murder them on arrival makes no sense at all.
Not to mention that their remains have never been found. Suggesting that they were simply moved elsewhere and survived the war.
The crime of murder usually requires proof of death in the form of a corpse.
Best regards,
Kali.• Replies: @Fran TaubmanAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Kali says:@Mark Bahner
The little girl standing on the right, looking into the camera…why the hell would someone murder her, simply because she’s Jewish? Or her little sister, sitting on the ground next to her? Or the two boys in caps in the left of the photo? Why the hell would someone murder little children, just because they’re Jewish?
In my opinion, they were NOT murdered.
Your constant, unrelenting, repeatative appeals to emotion do not make it so.
What my personal information or family background have to do with this discussion is beyond me. I think you may be deranged.
Regards,
Kali.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
kb_2 says:@Fran Taubman
I wrote a post above under the influence of your words about Rudolph – maybe that’s why it’s less clear than it could be) This attitude towards another person causes me strong hatred.
I will say a little about the revisionism that is popular in Russia. Some people like to whitewash Stalin – to write that a) he was not to blame for the repressions b) that he was a democrat c) that people were shot because they were to blame … and so on (by the way, we also have a theory that Katyn forged by the Germans – because the executions were carried out from German weapons). Our twin of Germanophilic revisionism. Some talk about Stalin’s struggle with the Rothschilds and Rockefellers.
Some of these people speak quite convincingly. I read a few of their books when I was younger but then gave up because they seem to me to be a distortion of history.
We in Russia lived through a period when (for lack of more reliable figures) the number of Stalin’s victims was greatly exaggerated. Some people told terrible stories about Stalin’s colleagues (about the dissolution of corpses in acid in their homes, etc.). Then, based on archival data, it turned out that everything was less scary. Some of those who exaggerated Stalin’s crimes had relatives who suffered in the repressions. And the “burden of history” prevented them from looking at it more objectively.
In fact, some of those who love Stalin know history quite well. They have their own arguments. Moreover, (at least) some of them are well-intentioned. They are labeled as conspiracy theorists, some write refutations (or “refutations”) of their work.
I added quotes because no one has a monopoly on historical truth. Perhaps there is a rational grain in the works of Stalin’s admirers – but I do not want to delve into them. Instead, I go to events dedicated to victims of repression.
In Russia, it is forbidden to compare Stalin with Hitler, and Nazi books are among the prohibited books. I would like to see Mein Kampf or somethings by Goebbels on store shelves, next to the Stalinists. Why? Because it’s called a free society. And if they ask me whether the work of the Stalinists should be banned, I will say no.
Theories in medicine and science differ from historical theories in the absence of a moral (or maybe emotional?) halo around them. We do not become traitors when we begin to deny the existence of microbes, believe in cold fusion, the existence of parallel universes, or continental drift.
This moral halo is quite natural. But, for example, in Russia the memory of the war (how it exists) hinders the revision of the role of collaborators with the Nazis in the public mind. Those who lost their relatives in the war often cannot talk healthy about those compatriots who fought on the “other” side. They will talk about the fact that in the war with Germany, the Soviet Union lost 26 million people (according to official figures). For them, collaborators are monsters for which there is no excuse. However, not all Russians think this way. It often takes courage to reject the conventional version of history that is emotionally charged.
By the way: can a person who is a) Jewish and/or b) has Holocaust survivors relatives be a revisionist?
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Kali says:@Fran Taubman
You accept John Wear as telling the truth. But John Wear nor anyone else can find what happened to the missing Jews.
THANK YOU!!!
At long last, Fran, you admit that nobody knows what happened to them.
How anyone can extrapolate “mass murder” from “nobody knows” beggars belief.
But here’s what we DO know:
Alleged “confessions” were obtained by torture and contrived to fit the propaganda narrative already established.
There were no homicidal gas Chambers at Auschwitz.
And I don’t care HOW emotional anyone gets in insisting there was. All this “oh the humanity”, “oh the suffering” emotional masturbation does NOT prove murder.
I know you, and especially Mark Bahner WANT them to have been cruelly murdered, but without proof of the same you would loose any fair, unbiased trial.
But because this obscene “holocaust” narrative grants Jews political and social predominance throughout the west, and Zion carte blanche to genocide Palestinians and steel their homeland, you stick with it.
That’s my own personal conclusion from all of these discussions and from my reading elsewhere.
On a personal level I if course wish you no harm, Fran. I only hope that you will one day find the courage to look at these things from an objective, unbiased perspective.
Best wishes,
Kali• Replies: @Mark BahnerAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You ask: “Hungarian Jewish children were hostile to Germany? How could that possibly harm Germany?”
My response: The Germans generally wanted to keep families together. This is why so many Jewish children were sent to Auschwitz-Birkenau and other camps.
Carlo Mattogno has prepared a long list of children and twins at Auschwitz who survived the camp. (Source: Mattogno, Carlo and Nyiszli, Miklos, An Auschwitz Doctor’s Eyewitness Account: The Bestselling Tall Tales of Dr. Mengele’s Assistant Analyzed, Uckfield: Castle Hill Publishers, 2020, pp. 391-407).
If Germany had an extermination program, why were there so many Jewish inmates of Auschwitz-Birkenau who were too young to help in the German work effort? One would not expect these young children to survive if there had been a German policy of genocide.
There were numerous other children who survived Auschwitz-Birkenau who are not on Mattogno’s list. For example, Thomas Buergenthal is a Jewish survivor of Auschwitz-Birkenau and Sachsenhausen as well as the Polish ghetto of Kielce. Buergenthal, a Harvard-educated lawyer who served on the International Court of Justice at The Hague, was only 10 years old when he arrived in Auschwitz. Buergenthal claims in his memoir, “A Lucky Child”, that his group was spared the selection process because it luckily arrived in Auschwitz instead of Birkenau. (Source: Buergenthal, Thomas, A Lucky Child: A Memoir of Surviving Auschwitz as a Young Boy, New York: Little, Brown and Company, 2009, p. 65).
Bernard Marks is a Jewish survivor of Auschwitz and Dachau who says he spent five and one-half years in these camps. Marks was 87 years old when he made this statement in March 2017, which means he would have been at most 10 years old when he entered Auschwitz. Similar to Thomas Buergenthal, Marks survived Auschwitz even though he was only a 10-year-old child at the time. (Source: https://www.yahoo.com/news/holocaust-survivor-to-ice-director-california-sheriff-history-is-not-on-your-side-162527241.html).
A Jewish man in a video on Facebook claims he was sent to Auschwitz at age 10 and survived. The man says that Dr. Mengele would make selections to determine who went to the gas chambers. He claims he told Dr. Mengele that he was 17 years old, and his life was saved because Dr. Mengele miraculously let him live. The man also claims in this video that 1.5 million children were killed in the gas chambers at Auschwitz. If this man survived at age 10, however, certainly many other Jewish children survived as well. (Source: https://www.facebook.com/LeibelMangel/videos/507430599427355/.)
On January 21, 2015, Reuters listed numerous Jewish survivors who were young children while in Auschwitz-Birkenau. These include Jacek Nadolny, who was only age seven when sent to Auschwitz-Birkenau, and Zofia Wareluk, who was born in Auschwitz two weeks before the camp was liberated. Other Jewish survivors who were no older than age 10 while in Auschwitz-Birkenau include Elzbieta Sobczynska, Henryk Duszyk, Danuta Bogdaniuk-Bogucka, Janina Reklajtis and Barbara Doniecka. (Source: https://www.reuters.com/news/picture/auschwitz-survivors-70-years-on-idUSRTR4MC0W).
The survival of so many young Jewish children at Auschwitz-Birkenau is not consistent with a German policy of genocide against the Jews.
The survival of young children at Auschwitz-Birkenau is not surprising since Auschwitz-Birkenau served as a transit camp for detainees unfit for work. This is proven by a note dated July 21, 1942, concerning a telephone conversation that took place the day before. SS Hauptsturmführer Theodor Dannecker wrote:
“The question of the evacuation of children was discussed with SS-Obersturmbannführer Eichmann. He decided that transports of children are to take place as soon as transports into the General Government are again possible. SS-Obersturmbannführer Nowak promised to provide about six transports to the General Government at the end of August/beginning of September, which may contain Jews of all kinds (also those unfit for work and old Jews).” (Source: Mattogno, Carlo, Auschwitz: The Case for Sanity, Volume Two, Washington, D.C: The Barnes Review, 2010, p. 654).
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Wizard of Oz says:@Tiptoethrutulips
You are overcomplicating something very simple. It didn’t need Google for someone to have been able to tell the camp commandant that he needn’t worry about carbon minoxide poisoning being slow and cumbersome. “No we just have to double our orders for the delousing stuff. Look what it says in the brochure:
Zyklon B (German: [tsyˈkloːn ˈbeː] ( listen); translated Cyclone B) was the trade name of a cyanide-based pesticide invented in Germany in the early 1920s. It consisted of hydrogen cyanide (prussic acid), as well as a cautionary eye irritant and one of several adsorbents such as diatomaceous earth.’• Replies: @TiptoethrutulipsAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Look, “don’tslingmybullshitbackinmyfaceBahner”, now your knickers are in a twist because you resent a proper challenge to said bullshit? This is your written assertion about the OFFICIAL DOCUMENT in question:
“I wonder what John Wear thinks about this document? Forgery? Misunderstanding? Seems pretty clear and pretty damning.”
………………………………………………………………..
Seems pretty clear and pretty damning. ??? That’s not exactly an unambiguous statement, is it? What it actually seems to be is a statement of fact.Sooner or later, someone grows weary of the righteous indignation and virtue signaling, and someone actually begins to read/listen/watch more carefully, and then someone concludes there’s a lot of bullshit flying around all over the place. So, someone pins someone else down and says, “what’s with all this bullshit?” (or maybe chickenshit on your side of the fence, Jews do have a thing about chickens, and flinging fowl in circles over their heads, or as the official dish for All Those Celebrations, you know).
Then someone else cries foul!, or makes excuses for “overlooking “ errors in previous claims they were once certain was absolutely accurate. Mark, someone can read. Someone can identify textbook signs of lying in an interview. Someone can detect and determine evidence of contamination or lingering residue. Someone does notice incessant contradictions and altering of claims once professed to be absolute. Fortunately, there are a lot of someones out there. And, you are clearly someone else. I’m speculating, of course.
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littlereddot says:@Mark Bahner
but one can’t say, “This was not used a roller skating rink,”
Agree and I know what you mean.
“This was not used as a badmitton court
Agree and I know what you mean
” or even “This was not used as an ice-skating rink.”
This one I do not understand.
As a mechanical engineer, how would you use a basketball court as an ice-skating rink?
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Mark Bahner says:@Kali
At long last, Fran, you admit that nobody knows what happened to them.
Many trials have resulted in convictions on far less evidence than we have in the case of the hundreds of thousands of Hungarian Jews deported to Auschwitz.
In this case, we even have a clear photo showing multiple people right outside a gas chamber and crematorium that was almost certainly taken within hours of their being murdered in a gas chamber and then cremated in a crematorium.
But here’s what we DO know:
Alleged “confessions” were obtained by torture and contrived to fit the propaganda narrative already established.
That’s absolute nonsense. We have a handwritten and signed confession by Rudolf Hoess dated May 14, 1946. No one can legitimately claim that confession was obtained by torture, because it was obtained more than *one month* after the torture that Rudolf Hoess received when he was captured on March 11, 1946:
https://collections.ushmm.org/search/catalog/pa1098312
There were no homicidal gas Chambers at Auschwitz.
Again, that’s absolute nonsense. We have multiple whole *books* written by Auschwitz Sonderkommandos describing in detail what went on at the gas chambers located at Krematoriums II, III, IV, and V at Auschwitz.
https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/sonderkommandos
There are literally dozens of trials of SS personnel at Auschwitz in which, to my knowledge, not even *one* defendant disputed that there were gas chambers (using Zyklon B) at Auschwitz. The most recent trial that I’m aware of is this one:
That man was accused *and convicted* of 300,000 counts of accessory to murder. You’ve accused me of insanity. But only an insane person would think that a person accused of 300,000 counts of accessory to murder would not defend himself by countering that none of the murders actually occurred.
Ron Unz titled this post, “Why Everything You Know About WWII is Wrong.” I could easily write a similar post, “Why everything Kali knows about Auschwitz is wrong,” or “Why everything Ron Wear says about Auschwitz is wrong.”
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Wizard of Oz says:@Tiptoethrutulips
Obviously the notes of Dr Bendel’s interrogation are not sufficient evidence for a criminal conviction but certainly well up to the Unz standard for smoking guns set by the the supposed statements in a probably non existent report of possibly cataclysmic disease in Wuhan that Ron still hasn’t abandoned. However counsel assisting the Commission of Inquiry into what really happened at Auschwitz-Birkenau is entitled to be pleased at the primary facie value that goes with the near certainty that it is a 1945 document and almost without flaw as a comprehensive note of what someone serving in a medical capacity, whether or not dully qualified as a doctor, said to an interrogating officer with no obvious axe to grind and willing to record any information about the camp that might later seem relevant.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Wizard of Oz
I’m not sure I understand your point. Are you suggesting that despite all the efforts of mass extermination, as cited by Al Liguori (I will assume those were assertions made by survivors, of which there are so many), that the Germans looked around and said, “Hey, we’ve got all these cans of bug spray just sitting around; let’s see what happens”, ok, then fair enough.
I will speculate that, as zyklon b was designed to kill small insects, it is not an effective toxin for mass murder. Especially, something toxic enough to render thousands of people asunder, simultaneously, in 4-5 minutes. This IS the claim, is it not?
Toxins, and the damage they cause, varies, due to too many factors to discuss herein. Hydrogen sulfide seems to be one of the most deadly; so is pure oxygen. Although, oxygen is not considered, normally, to be a toxin. But, high concentrations cause death. So, too, does nitrogen.
Regardless, actual chemists have analyzed the chambers for residual residue and other evidence of high chemical concentrations, and all conclusions indicate the claims are false. A large number of people refuse to accept this evidence; time passes; the structures erode or are destroyed, or “rebuilt”, and soon there will be nothing left to argue over as all physical evidence is gone. It’s an effective strategy. Pure speculation, of course.
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Wizard of Oz says:@John Wear
You omit discussion of the dates of Jewish children arriving at Auschwicz but surviving. When SS guards knew the Red Army was coming and the war lost it is hardly likely that they would keep pursuing an extermination policy
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Truth Vigilante says:
UR readers, get ready for a treat. I first saw this video around a decade ago.
It thoroughly debunks the ‘gas chambers at Auschwitz’ fantasy. (Skip the first 7 mins of the video because that just repeats the official preposterous narrative, and begin watching just after the 7 min mark):
Video Link
There are literally scores of reasons covered in this video as to why there could not possibly have been gas chambers here designed by the ultra efficient Germans, but I’ll just focus on one of those reasons. ie: the length of the cremation process.The video references ultra-modern and efficient cremation machines, and using them it takes around 1 hour to cremate a 45kg (around 100 lbs) body.
However, the technology around 80 years ago was MUCH less efficient and the process would have taken much longer.The lying Jew Dario Gabbai is featured in this video and he claims that four (4) bodies were placed in each oven muffle and that these four bodies could be cremated in around 30 mins.
Let’s just think about that assertion for a moment.
If we assume that each body is 45kg (100lbs) on average, then four bodies will weigh 400 lbs.
Does anyone think that 400 lbs of corpses could be cremated in 30 mins with low tech ovens of 40 years ago, when a MODERN cremation oven takes ONE HOUR for a 100 lb body ?Now bear in mind, we’re being VERY GENEROUS in assuming that each body is 45kg (100 lbs),
Yes, the Holohoaxers will bleat that a 70-80 kg healthy man of normal weight is now reduced to 45kg after months of starvation rations.
Well Holohoax fiction peddlers, you can’t have it both ways.Weren’t you telling us that they were unloaded from the trains and gassed the VERY SAME DAY they arrived ?
If so, they’d be pretty chubby as no significant amount of time had elapsed to enable emaciation.SUMMARY: Only a moron would entertain the idea that gas chambers and an extermination process existed based on the configuration of the Auschwitz crematorium/undressing room and alleged gas chambers, as per the original blueprints.
FOR CERTAIN, if the Germans had wanted to kill (and then cremate) great numbers of Jews and/or other undesirables, they would have used a SINGLE HUGE OVEN where scores (or even hundreds) of bodies could have been fed into it at once.
These Holohoaxers are such simpletons. One of them on this thread claims he’s Episcopalian and that one of his ancestors was a hessian sack of shit – when it is clear to all that he’s a rabid Jew.
Because no goy would carry on relentlessly the way he does over the fate of the Jews.• Agree: HdC• Replies: @TiptoethrutulipsAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Tiptoethrutulips says:@Wizard of Oz
What does Ron’s view on the wu flu have to do with anything?
Mark absolutely asserted the document was a statement of fact. I can read very well. The affidavit is written in English, by the way. Do we know that the testimony was offered in English? The witness claims he was born in Romania, and claimed to live in France when the statement was made. There’s yet another issue, not clarified. We can go round and round on this; I previously said I tried to be brief.
ANYONE can be a material witness for anything. A doctor’s general observations about goings on, in general, are valid. But he gave an analysis about a structure, built before his arrival. Alright. What qualifications does he have to make this determination? Despite saying he was brought in to provide medical care, he makes no claims, whatsoever, in that area regarding any inmates.
Besides all the other aforementioned flaws in the document, so, what was the point of stating he was a doctor? I will speculate it’s due to the fact that physicians are generally held in high regard; they are mostly smarter than the average person, and someone else would be more likely to accept their testimony at face value.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “We have a handwritten and signed confession by Rudolf Hoess dated May 14, 1946. No one can legitimately claim that confession was obtained by torture, because it was obtained more than *one month* after the torture that Rudolf Hoess received when he was captured on March 11, 1946…”
My response: Once a person has been brutally tortured, their testimony would not be accepted in any legitimate court of law.
In 1983, the anti-National Socialist book “Legions of Death” by Rupert Butler documented that Sgt. Bernard Clarke and other British officers tortured Rudolf Höss into making his confession. The torture of Höss was exceptionally brutal. Neither Bernard Clarke nor Rupert Butler finds anything wrong or immoral in the torture of Höss. Neither of them seems to understand the importance of their revelations. Bernard Clarke and Rupert Butler prove that Höss’s confession was obtained by torture. (Source: Faurisson, Robert, “How the British Obtained the Confessions of Rudolf Höss,” The Journal of Historical Review, Vol. 7, No. 4, Winter 1986-87, pp. 392-399).
Moritz von Schirmeister, a former associate of Joseph Goebbels, confirmed that Höss’s confession was obtained by torture. At Nuremberg, von Schirmeister sat in the backseat of a car together with Höss, with whom he could speak freely during transit. He remembered Höss’s following statement:
“On the things he is accused of, he told me: ‘Certainly, I signed a statement that I killed two and a half million Jews. But I could just as well have said that it was five million Jews. There are certain methods by which any confession can be obtained, whether it is true or not.’” (Source: Mattogno, Carlo, Commandant of Auschwitz: Rudolf Höss, His Torture and His Forced Confessions, Uckfield, UK: Castle Hill Publishers, 2017, p. 16).
You write: “We have multiple whole *books* written by Auschwitz Sonderkommandos describing in detail what went on at the gas chambers located at Krematoriums II, III, IV, and V at Auschwitz.”
My response: Carlo Mattogno has written books on the absurdity of the Auschwitz Sonderkommando testimony. If you don’t want to read Mattogno’s books, you can read my article on this subject at https://inconvenienthistory.com/12/4/7562.
You write: “There are literally dozens of trials of SS personnel at Auschwitz in which, to my knowledge, not even *one* defendant disputed that there were gas chambers (using Zyklon B) at Auschwitz.”
My response: Actually, Richard Baer adamantly disputed the existence of homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
Richard Baer, the last commandant of Auschwitz, did not live to see the beginning of his trial in Frankfurt, Germany. He was arrested in December of 1960 in the vicinity of Hamburg. Baer during his pretrial questioning adamantly refused to confirm the existence of homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz during World War II.
Baer died in June 1963 under mysterious circumstances while being held in pretrial custody. An autopsy performed on Baer at the Frankfurt-am-Main University School of Medicine stated that the ingestion of an odorless, non-corrosive poison could not be ruled out as the cause of his death. There was no further probe into the cause of Baer’s death, and Chief Public Prosecutor Fritz Bauer ordered his body cremated. Conveniently, the Auschwitz trial in Frankfurt, Germany began almost immediately after Baer’s death. The statements Baer made during his pretrial interrogations were not read into the trial record. With Baer’s death the prosecutors at the Auschwitz trial were able to attain their primary objective—to reinforce the gas chamber myth and establish it as an unassailable historical fact. (Source: Stäglich, Wilhelm, Auschwitz: A Judge Looks at the Evidence, Institute for Historical Review, 1990, pp. 238-239).
It has been widely known ever since the illegal abduction of Adolf Eichmann in Argentina that the Israeli Mossad has immense capabilities. Given the fact that Chief Public Prosecutor Bauer was a Zionist Jew, which should have precluded him from heading the pretrial investigation, it is quite possible that the forces of international Jewry were able to murder Baer while he was in jail. If anyone knew the truth about the gas chamber allegation, it was Baer, the last commandant of Auschwitz. Baer’s untimely death prevented him from giving testimony that would have contradicted the official Holocaust narrative. Baer’s death was certainly a relief for the promoters of the Auschwitz trial. (Source: Ibid).
The historical blackout forces have sought to intimidate German eyewitnesses from writing about their observations in the German concentration camps.
For example, when Thies Christophersen published “The Auschwitz Lie” in 1973, he was charged with “popular incitement,” “contempt against the state,” and defamation of the Jews. Christophersen spent a year in prison even though the charge of popular incitement was eventually dropped. All Christophersen had done was to write about his experiences while he was working in Auschwitz in 1944. (Source: Christophersen, Thies, “Reflections on Auschwitz and West German Justice,” The Journal of Historical Review, Vol. 6, No. 1, Spring 1985, p. 117).
Thies Christophersen said that the alleged genocide of Jews during the war never happened. Christophersen supervised about 300 workers, many of them Jewish, at Auschwitz from January to December 1944. On a number of occasions during this period he visited Birkenau where allegedly hundreds of thousands of Jews were being gassed to death. Christophersen wrote that during the time he was at Auschwitz he did not notice the slightest evidence of mass gassings. In March 1988 at the Ernst Zündel trial in Toronto, he also successfully answered numerous pointed questions by the prosecuting attorney about his experiences at Auschwitz.
After “The Auschwitz Lie” was published, Christophersen received thousands of letters and calls. He wrote in regard to these letters and calls:
“Many of those who contacted me can confirm my statements, but are afraid to do so publicly. Some of those are SS men who were brutally mistreated and even tortured in Allied captivity. I also immediately contacted those who claimed to know more about mass gassings. My experiences were precisely the same as those of French professor Paul Rassinier. I have not found any eyewitnesses. Instead, people would tell me that they knew someone who knew someone else, who talked about it. In most cases the alleged eyewitnesses had died. Other supposed eyewitnesses would quickly begin to stammer and stutter when I asked a few precise questions. Even Simon Wiesenthal had to finally admit before a Frankfurt district court that he was actually never in Auschwitz. All of the reports I have heard about are contradictory. Everyone seemed to tell a different story about the gas chambers. They couldn’t even agree about where they were supposed to have been located. This is also true of the so-called scholarly literature, which is full of contradictions.…” (Source: Ibid., pp. 117-118).
It should also be noted that the prosecution could find no credible witnesses to testify to the existence of homicidal gas chambers at both the 1985 and 1988 Ernst Zündel trials in Toronto.
The failure of Jewish eyewitnesses to provide credible testimony at the 1985 Ernst Zündel trial caused Harvard law professor Alan Dershowitz to write that the trial was “a total victory for Holocaust deniers and a total disaster for Holocaust survivors and the Jewish people.” (Source: Kahn, Robert A., Holocaust Denial and the Law: A Comparative Study, New York: Palgrave MacMillan, 2004, p. 119).
The failure of the prosecutors in the 1985 Zündel trial to find effective witnesses also caused Jewish political scientist Robert Kahn to write: “If the concept of ‘symbolic victory’ is sometimes difficult to apply precisely, the 1985 prosecution of Ernst Zündel clearly backfired. What had been an attempt to silence Zündel, and possibly use the legal system to repudiate denial, became instead a public relations coup for the Toronto publisher and his supporters.” (Source: Ibid., pp. 86-87).
So, if you study this subject in more detail, there are legitimate reasons why Holocaust revisionists state that: 1) there were no homicidal gas chambers in any of the German concentration camps; 2) Germany did not have a program of genocide against the Jews; and 3) the standard estimate of 6 million Jews who died during World War II is a ridiculous exaggeration.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Truth Vigilante
It’s so nice when the BS triggers your memory about things you learned long ago.
I SPECULATE Dario is not really Jewish, as he says on camera, he “thinks he had a bar mitzvah” as his eyes nearly pop out of the sockets, for all the pinging around they are doing. ( a little exaggeration there, I admit). Who can remember such a momentous occasion at the tender age of 13? I won’t mention the constant lip smacking, coughing, swallowing, nor the leading statements/questions, especially at the end, of the interviewer. Dario actually forgot his baby brother was ten years younger than himself. But, the interviewer set him straight.
He says many other things about Jewish traditions, or not exactly, which is strange for a man who grew up in a Jewish family in a Jewish community.
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Mark Bahner says:
You ask: “Hungarian Jewish children were hostile to Germany? How could that possibly harm Germany?”
My response: The Germans generally wanted to keep families together. This is why so many Jewish children were sent to Auschwitz-Birkenau and other camps.
John, that is absolute God-damned bullshit, and you of all people should know it.
When Anne Frank, her sister, her mother, and her father were deported to Auschwitz, *all four* were separated from each other. Anne was not even in the same barracks as her *sister Margot* at Auschwitz.
https://www.annefrank.org/en/anne-frank/main-characters/otto-frank/
And when Reuven and Gershon Fogel and their mother were murdered in a gas chamber at Auschwitz, Reuven and Gershon’s older sister had already been separated sent to perform slave labor at Auschwitz. Irene didn’t know about the murders of her two little brothers and her mother until *decades* later.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=555376876627703&id=100064661865080&set=a.370529531779106
So why do you write such bullshit? Is it that you really don’t know that Hungarian Jewish men and women were virtually *always* separated from one another? Have you never even seen the separation of men from women *right on the train platform* at Auschwitz?
If you don’t take back your statement that, “The Germans generally wanted to keep families together. This is why so many Jewish children were sent to Auschwitz-Birkenau and other camps,” I’ll know you to be an absolutely shameless liar.
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John Wear says:@Wizard of Oz
You write: “When SS guards knew the Red Army was coming and the war lost it is hardly likely that they would keep pursuing an extermination policy.”
My response: In my opinion, if the Germans had an extermination policy of the Jews, they would not have left so many Jewish survivors at Auschwitz-Birkenau to testify about their policy of genocide of the Jews.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
What’s up with that photo? Do you notice the evil Germans appear to be floating, a bit, just above the glistening, completely spotless snow (?) as opposed to everyone else standing on “dirty snow.”
WHERE ARE THE FOOTPRINTS of the evil Germans? Of course, if they are actually floating, no prints would be made, would they? No tracks anywhere; no evidence of mucking about.
Mark, I tried to tell you about what’s up with the OFFICIALLY accepted and verified evidence. You just don’t want to look for it, the truth, that is.
Perhaps I will scour the universe for the original photo. But, if I find it, it matters NOT.
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HbutnotG says:@NotAnonymousHere
saw your reply.
darn. Hoped you were Linda Flaherty. Or John Krotec.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
HdC says:@Mark Bahner
Your ignorance of the two WW is only exceeded by your stupidity.
I very much doubt that you were ever a competent mechanical engineer, otherwise you would understand the problems with the cremation of 6 million Jews (this is still the mass media narrative!) in the time and with the resources available.
One of the assertions made by Franny and her tribe is that the cremation process was “speeded up” by stuffing several corpses into one crematorium muffle.
You as a competent mechanical engineer should know the problems with that assertion. Or, are you also of the belief that placing 3 or 4 logs into a fire place that these will burn as quickly as one or two??You should also know that cremation of corpses does not produce ash, but leaves the teeth and long bones more or less intact.
Let’s see, 6 million times, say 16 teeth remaining per person, makes almost 100 million teeth. I’d be satisfied with seeing 1% of these.
Wait wait wait! It is also asserted that bodies were burnt in open pits! This would leave even more residue as evidence. Where is this evidence???
If you were a decent mechanical engineer (remember 1/2 graduated from the bottom of the class!) you’d appreciate the fact that at the nitty gritty scientific and engineering level of examination that wonderful tale of holocaustianity collapses like a house of cards.
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Mark Bahner says:@Tiptoethrutulips
What’s up with that photo? Do you notice the evil Germans appear to be floating, a bit, just above the glistening, completely spotless snow (?) as opposed to everyone else standing on “dirty snow.”
I don’t think it *is* snow.
There are photographs here:
https://www.yadvashem.org/yv/en/exhibitions/album_auschwitz/selection.asp
The point is, anybody who isn’t an ignorant or insane moron knows that men and women were separated right on the train platform at Auschwitz. So the only people who dispute that fact are ignorant or insane morons. So obviously the Nazis did not want to “generally keep families together.”
Good f*cking grief. Can’t you and John Wear acknowledge the most basic and unquestionable facts?
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Fran Taubman says:@Kali
Then why not just kill them where they stood? It would have been cheeper and easier, not to mention more efficient.
They tried that once or twice, and they had to dig huge mass graves. Like Hoss said the killing is easy it is the body disposal that is the problem. Thus a killing center, assembly like with the multi muffle ovens.
Did you listen to the videos. To these people sound as though they are lying when they say that their relatives just disappeared.
Transporting the mealy to murder them on arrival makes no sense at all.
Not to mention that their remains have never been found. Suggesting that they were simply moved elsewhere and survived the war.
It makes perfect sense, did you study the oven designs by Topf? Have you studied any of the data of how the Germans turned Auschwitz into a mass assembly like of murder, with 5 crematoriums. FIVE. The bodies were turned to ashes. Do you understand how incineration works. That was the whole idea that there would be no human remains left.
With all of the physical evidence, and eye witness accounts by the perpetrators and the victims, and the engineering and blue prints by Jean Claude Pressac. and The Topf and Sons engineering the incineration with multi muffled ovens. Why do you think you would need 65 ovens at Auschwitz?
WhyAnd what on the other side. John Wear saying that the cracked the Enigma code and no mention of the Jews? LOL. That is his proof. They never talked about murdering the unregistered Jews, because they did not want to acknowledge this fact to themselves. So Jews arrived some were registered and most were killed when they arrived. Who needs to discuss it.
If the Germans had transported the missing Jews to another place they would have punched those tickets and said. Look here are the missing Jews we did not murder anyone. I just do no understand how you have not understood the killing centers that the Germans designed.
Why else would you send Jews there that are not fit for work. John says the Jews were a threat, Fine they were locked in their ghettos and were not a threat. And old woman and babies are not a threat to anyone. Why transport these Hungarian Jews to Auschwitz where there is no room and no food?
They were fine in their ghettoes in Budapest.You have yet to acknowledged any studies on the engineering involved in the ovens, or the transports and how complicated and they spent so much of the precious little resources the Germans had. They could not kill Jews in Budapest there was no where to burry them, and the world was watching.
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Fran Taubman says:@Mark Bahner
It is the only logical rational, and irrefutable proof, that the:
-Germans did not need to ship babies and the elder to Auschwitz in the summer of 1944, they were fine in their ghettoes.
– The Germans couldn’t possible feed, cloth or house the amount of people they were sending to Auschwitz. So in essence they were already sentenced to death. Why not stay put in their ghettos.
-There was a conceived plan that was executed with precision to transport all of the Hungarian Jews to Auschwitz at warp speed. I mean blinding speed, with tremendous manpower, brainpower and fuel. One has to answer the question why.
– There were turned to ashes in crematoriums where the ovens were designed specifically for precision assembly line fluidity of burning thousands of people at one time. What else do you use an 8 multi muffled oven for.
– The Hungarian Jews were specifically transported to Auschwitz because Auschwitz was a designed killing center with five crematoriums and 65 ovens. What else do you need 5 crematoriums for.
– The Germans sent to old the old, the babies, the disabled to a killing center a designed mass murder killing center to be killed.
Who cares about the enigma code? Who really cares. When you hang your denial on the fact that nothing is mentioned in secret cracked by the enigma code you are on you are running on H denial fumes. Those unregistered Jews were murdered. Many, many people can describe to you in different languages how the gassing centers worked. No enigma code required.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
You are indeed, correct, Mark. I ACTUALLY went and looked at the source you cited, and it appears to be an accurate photo, with proper shadows, etc., therefore I stand corrected. No problem; I’m not afraid of the truth.
The original image appears much different than the one initially sent, so although I was WRONG, the error was honestly made; and fully admitted. I won’t just slink away and pretend nothing happened; moving on!
No one says men and women weren’t separated. Women/girls are nearly always separated from men/boys, for obvious reasons. Have you ever been to summer camp? Prison? A military base? Locker room?
You are assigning a meaning to his statement that is not appropriate or accurate, out of context, too narrowly defined….take your pick.
“ Good f*cking grief. Can’t you and John Wear acknowledge the most basic and unquestionable facts?”
The answer is yes. Yes, we can.
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@Mark Bahner
Hungarian Jewish children were hostile to Germany? How could that possibly harm Germany?
This is the kind of rubbish we expect of Chabad Fran. John Wear’s response to you is on target. Should the adult declared internal enemies have been allowed loose to wreak further death and havoc upon innocent Germans simply because the Judeo-Communists had children? No. It is suicidal nonsense to suggest otherwise.
Instead, showing the humanity utterly lacking in the genocidal revolutionaries, the Germans incarcerated the jewish adults in work camps that had hospitals, shops, swimming pools, movie theatres, orchestras, and other amenities. A preferred alternative might have seen the children raised in decent (Christian!) foster families, so that the children would have been raised decently instead of inculturating those children in talmudic values like supremacism, genocide, and perversion—such as happened with Otto Frank pimping his daughter Anne Frank while in the camp. https://judaism.is/holocaust.html#diary
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Dube says:@John Wear
Thank you for accepting my question and responding.
You [Dube] ask: “If that’s so, the question remains, why were they assembled in Hungary and then delivered to Auschwitz?”
My response: Hungarian Jews were assembled in Hungary and sent to Auschwitz-Birkenau and other camps because the Germans regarded Jews as being generally hostile toward Germany. Many Jewish partisans were actively killing German troops.
Thanks for adding the reference to your Inconvenient History article, “Why Hitler Put Jews in Camps and Ghettos,” which describes Jewish partisan activity, and concludes:
Jews were not interned because Hitler hated Jews. Rather, Jews were interned in camps and ghettoes to a large degree because the German authorities considered Jewish civilians, both male and female, a serious threat to German military operations during World War II.
If so, that might explain the internment. But my question is not about internment, but rather about the transport, or delivery, of the population from Hungary to Poland.
Why transport them to Poland?
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Kali says:@Mark Bahner
Ron Unz titled this post, “Why Everything You Know About WWII is Wrong.” I could easily write a similar post, “Why everything Kali knows about Auschwitz is wrong,” or “Why everything Ron [sic] Wear says about Auschwitz is wrong.”
Yes, I think you should definitely do that!
Or maybe you could title it “How I virtually know the holocaust is real in my heart”. Then you could fill pages and pages with holocaustian doctrine and dogma, and explain to us how you virtually know it’s real.
I have no doubt either John Unz or Ron Wear will be happy to publish it for you.
Sleep tight,
Kali.• LOL: John WearAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Brad Anbro says:@Mark Bahner
Quote:
“This is how I see what the U.S. fought for in WW2:
1) The Japanese government (military) attacked the United States.
2) The German government declared war on the United States.”This is how I “see” ALL WARS, since, and including the American Civil War:
You might just want to watch this video…
Thank you.
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@Mark Bahner
Thank you for a good belly laugh! Your “evidence” consists of tortured “confessions,” imbecilic science-defying “eyewitness” testimony, “eyewitnesses” that weren’t even where they claimed to be (including Wiesenthal and Wiesel), faked photos, faked movies, implausible “gas chambers” built by jews after the war, and convictions obtained in a kangaroo court dominated by jews that sought no facts and allowed no evidence. http://judaism.is/holocaust.html and http://judaism.is/nuremberg.html
You forgot to add the never-ending stream of H
llywd movies to your “evidence.” If you weren’t such a malevolent threat, you demons and your fables (Titus 1:13-14) and lies (Osee 4:1-2; John 8:44) would just be a bad joke.
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Kali says:@Fran Taubman
The bodies were turned to ashes. Do you understand how incineration works. That was the whole idea that there would be no human remains left.
Oh Fran, for goodness sake, ashes ARE remains. As are pulverised bones. And teeth.
Those photo’s you posted earlier, particularly the second one that Tiptoe mentioned, the people in them look perfectly healthy and well fed. Yet, recall our last conversation during which your focus was on the suffering if the Jews in the ghettos, how hungry and miserable they were, and how that was what “the holocaust” means to you. You even shared photo’s of knibbly-kneed children to “prove” your point.
Now here you share photo”s of perfectly healthy children to “prove” a different point.
And the first photo you shared in your earlier comment of a group of Jews waiting outside a crematorium/gas chamber because it was too busy to deal with them straight away. Why is there no smoke coming out if the chimneys?
Bedtime for me now. More tomorrow no doubt.
Good night, Fran,
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “If you don’t take back your statement that, “The Germans generally wanted to keep families together. This is why so many Jewish children were sent to Auschwitz-Birkenau and other camps,” I’ll know you to be an absolutely shameless liar.”
My response: I wrote an extremely lengthy comment #1421.
In this comment I showed evidence that 1) Rudolf Höss’s confession was obtained by torture and could not be used as credible evidence in a legitimate court of law; 2) Mattogno has written books about the absurdity of the Auschwitz Sonderkommando testimony; 3) Richard Baer, the last commandant of Auschwitz, adamantly refused to acknowledge the existence of homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau; 4) the historical blackout forces have sought to intimidate German eyewitnesses from writing about their observations in the German concentration camps; 5) the prosecution could find no credible witnesses to testify to the existence of homicidal gas chambers at both the 1985 and 1988 Ernst Zündel trials in Toronto; and 6) Alan Dershowitz and Robert Kahn have acknowledged that the 1985 Zündel trial was a victory for Holocaust revisionists.
You so far have chosen to ignore these points and now accuse me of being “an absolutely shameless liar” if I don’t take back my statement that “The Germans generally wanted to keep families together. This is why so many Jewish children were sent to Auschwitz-Birkenau and other camps.”
In the case of the Frank family, they were all sent on the same train to Auschwitz-Birkenau. Otto Frank was separated from his wife and two daughters at Auschwitz-Birkenau. However, per Wikipedia, Bloeme Evers-Eden, an Amsterdam native who had befriended Anne and Margot in Amsterdam, saw Anne, Margot, and their mother regularly in Auschwitz. (Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anne_Frank).
So, I would call this only a partial separation. The women were not separated from each other, but the father was separated from the women.
In regard to your statement that “when Reuven and Gershon Fogel and their mother were murdered in a gas chamber at Auschwitz,” this is at best hearsay evidence. I don’t find this statement to be credible because there were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
In my comment #1411, which you have not commented on, I listed some of the young Jewish children who survived Auschwitz-Birkenau. One of these is Thomas Buergenthal, who wrote a book titled “A Lucky Child” about his experiences at Auschwitz-Birkenau. Buergenthal writes that he was only 10 years old when he arrived at Auschwitz. He was later transferred to Birkenau and lived in Camp Sector E, which had housed many thousands of Gypsy families. (Source: Buergenthal, Thomas, A Lucky Child: A Memoir of Surviving Auschwitz as a Young Boy, New York: Little, Brown and Company, 2009, p. 66).
Buergenthal explains how he was spared the selection process at Birkenau:
“Soon after we had arrived in Auschwitz, my father, seeing how routine selections were conducted and that children were most at risk, came up with a strategy to beat the system. Every morning when we had to line up for the daily counting exercise, I would try to stand all the way in the back and very close to the entrance of the barrack. As soon as we had been counted and if it appeared that there might be a selection, I would try to slip back into the barrack and hide. That strategy saved me a number of times. It was not always easy to execute, however, because I had to disappear without being seen by the SS or the barrack boss, but I was never caught.” (Source: Ibid., p. 74).
So, based on this statement here, we see that young Thomas Buergenthal was still in contact with his father at Birkenau.
I will modify my statement to read “The Germans generally kept families together when they shipped them to Auschwitz-Birkenau. However, families were typically separated by sex when they arrived at this camp.”
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Fran Taubman says:@Kali
Those photo’s you posted earlier, particularly the second one that Tiptoe mentioned, the people in them look perfectly healthy and well fed. Yet, recall our last conversation during which your focus was on the suffering if the Jews in the ghettos, how hungry and miserable they were, and how that was what “the holocaust” means to you. You even shared photo’s of knibbly-kneed children to “prove” your point.
You are conflating two different incidences. Starving occurred when Jewish Polish citizens were interned into the Warsaw Ghetto for 2 years in 1942. The first year 100,0000 people starved, mostly children
The Hungarian Jewish transports to Auschwitz is another matter entirely. Germany just invaded Hungary in 1944. Within months Jews were rounded up into Ghettoes, and then transported to Auschwitz directly. They were not in ghettoes for a very long time before being transported. The Hungarian Jews were fine, and thought the worst of the war was behind them. The Hungarian Jews were not starving, or mistreated. They were just transported to be killed.
They were rounded up as fully healthy people and transported to Auschwitz to be murdered. What is the evidence against it. That the Enigma code had nothing about the Jews being eradicated in Auschwitz. That Fred Leuchter took a sample from one wall out of one of 5 crematoriums and it did not turn blue which has been proven to be bogus. The cyanide does not turn the wall blue, It is the substrate of iron that is in the walls that reacts to the cyanide that turns the walls blue. The blue theory of cyanide is bogus.
So you really believe John Wear that because walls he thinks were not blue, and the best of the best, because the Enigma Code did not mention the murder of unregistered Jews, you really think that that is proof Jews were not gassed and cremated. Seriously. Did you read how to speedily incinerate bodies from The Topf and Sons engineers or is that above your pay grade?
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John Wear says:@Dube
You ask: “If so, that might explain the internment. But my question is not about internment, but rather about the transport, or delivery, of the population from Hungary to Poland. Why transport them to Poland?”
My response: Auschwitz-Birkenau was the biggest of the German camps. It served both as a work camp and as a transit camp. Some Hungarian Jews stayed in Auschwitz-Birkenau to work, while many other Hungarian Jews were transited from Auschwitz-Birkenau to other camps.
Some Hungarian Jews were sent directly to other camps, although the majority of Hungarian Jews were sent first to Auschwitz-Birkenau. As to why Hungarian Jews were sent first to Auschwitz-Birkenau instead of another camp, I don’t have a definitive answer for you.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Brad Anbro
I watched the video, Mr. Anbro; thank you.
Although I am familiar with this subject matter, there’s always more to learn; I did not know the reason for establishment of the EPA, nor King Philip’s reason for killing the Templars. That’s quite a breadth of time, always the same basic story.
I resisted the “theory” of evil, central banking, and spent years trying to refute it; I could not.
“That there are men in all countries who get their living by war, and by keeping up the quarrels of nations, is as shocking as it is true.” – Thomas Paine, Rights of Man, 1791
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Alexandros says:@Dube
Auschwitz was the main hub. If you are going to distribute a large amount of people you send them to the hub first. Rail capacity, infrastructure, organizational efficiency etc.
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Alexandros says:@Fran Taubman
There is no evidence of any killing center in Auschwitz. That’s merely another jewish fantasy of which there are plenty to go around. Your entire existence is built up on the idea of persecution. Without anti -semitism there would be no jews. If there is no real persecution, which is usually the case, you invent it or commit the act yourself. See all the jewish leaders of white nationalist groups in the US for proof of that.
At this point the Auschwitz fairy tale is nothing more than the boy who cried wolf. All that’s left to do now is to wait for the end of that story.
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@Fran Taubman
Chabad Fran sez:
Starving occurred when…
…Satan’s Chosen declared global holy war on Germany. https://unrollthread.com/t/1204440949616791555/ You are perpetrators, not “victims,” no matter how many times your damned Talmud and you insist otherwise. http://judaism.is/perpetrators.html
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Dube says:@John Wear
Why transport them to Poland?
[John Wear] My response: Auschwitz-Birkenau was the biggest of the German camps. It served both as a work camp and as a transit camp. Some Hungarian Jews stayed in Auschwitz-Birkenau to work, while many other Hungarian Jews were transited from Auschwitz-Birkenau to other camps.
So A-B was the biggest camp, serving both for work and for transit, the latter function presumably for work elsewhere. And that is why they were not interned in Hungary, but instead assembled in Hungary and delivered by rail to Poland. This transport to Poland had to be done because the German authorities considered the Hungarian Jewish civilians, both male and female, a serious threat to German military operations.If I restated your claim fairly, it can be corroborated, if such transit records exist, or commands of record.
But as mentioned elsewhere, that hypothesis is severely undercut by the circumstance of the collapsing German military operations near the end of the war. So reasonably, one may consider other motives than for the partisan threat and Arbeit macht frei.
Further, the threat to military operations from dedicated partisans, both male and female, did not seem to manifest at all during the delivery action.
So I hope you can see that your hypothesis is questionable, and as such, is unacceptable.
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Fran Taubman says:@Alexandros
Auschwitz was the main hub. If you are going to distribute a large amount of people you send them to the hub first. Rail capacity, infrastructure, organizational efficiency etc.
You are joking? Babies, grandmothers, old people. Never saw their families again. Where would you send a baby and a grandmother to after the transit hub of Auschwitz lol? What camp and for what reason in 1944? You people talk like we are talking about horses. These people arrived at Auschwitz as families. The baby was held by the grandmother, and the mother never saw either one of them again. If you look at the Jews in the Auschwitz Album you will see people who could not survive on their own. So in what condition and what way would you transport a baby and a grandmother?
What is it about this story do you find so unbelievable. You arrive at a translation with your parents your sisters your brothers. And you are the only one who leaves alive, and you never see any of them again.??? What is about mass murder do you not understand. People know when their family members are gone. Their families asked questions. Wouldn’t you find your baby.
Why did the Hungarian babies, mothers and grandmothers have to be transported to Auschwitz.
Auschwitz was a mass killing center, that was all it was. With 5 crematoriums and 65 ovens.
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Fran Taubman says:@Alexandros
There is no evidence of any killing center in Auschwitz. That’s merely another jewish fantasy of which there are plenty to go around. Your entire existence is built up on the idea of persecution. Without anti -semitism there would be no jews. If there is no real persecution, which is usually the case, you invent it or commit the act yourself. See all the jewish leaders of white nationalist groups in the US for proof of that.
That is all Auschwitz was, a killing center. That is what the commandant said. Hoss said he murdered 1.2 million Jews. He left a memoir explaining it. Wouldn’t the head of the camp and all of the SS officers know better than you? That is what they all said it was. Auschwitz was a place for mass murder and the only people who disagree with it are not the SS officers, not the Germans, not the workers, not the Jews. The only people who have trouble with the mass murder at Auschwitz are Jew haters. That is really about it. Everyone else sees it for what it was, including Eichmann who was uncharge of the entire apparatus. So where do you get you fairy tale from?
Are you a Jew hater? I can smell it from here.
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@Fran Taubman
Babies, grandmothers, old people. Never saw their families again.
Of course, you are only concerned about jews. After all… only jews are human (Babylonian TAlmud, Bava Metzia 114b). https://judaism.is/who-is-human.html#memes The babies, grandmothers, and old people of the ¼ BILLION Gentiles killed directly and indirectly by jews in the 20th century never saw their families again. http://judaism.is/perpetrators.html And, of course, you blind yourself to the simple unvarnished truth, the jews started the war in 1933.
To Hell with jewish supremacist double-standards. We see the same satanic self-absorption in France today. Black Islamists are burning down France, but the jews are silent… until their precious HoloHoax monument was marred. https://bigcountryexpat.com/index.php/2023/07/01/even-the-nazis-didnt-burn-paris/
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@Fran Taubman
Are you a Jew hater? I can smell it from here.
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fufu says:@John Wear
#1375 John Wear
“Many Jewish partisans were actively killing German troops. In addition to ghetto fighters, Jewish civilians fled to the forests and enlisted in partisan units, carrying out sabotage and intelligence missions.”
Jews were no danger to German’s military operations.
Much more destructive for Germans were Soviet’s and Polish partisants and their intelligences.
But Germans didn’t build ghettos for Poles or Soviets. Strange, isn’t?In fact, Jews cooperated with Germans in early stages of war (see: Judenrats).
There were no Jewish partisiants or Jewish Resistance during war or it was negligible compared with Yugoslavian, Polish or Soviet’s Resistance Movements.Taking into consideration all these facts, there is one explanation of transporting Hungarian Jews to Auschwitz.
“Cultural” Germans just wanted to kill as many Jews as possible.
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John Wear says:@Dube
You write: “So I hope you can see that your hypothesis is questionable, and as such, is unacceptable.”
My response: Auschwitz-Birkenau continued to function as a transit camp even after the Hungarian Jews had been sent there. A famous example of this is Jewish psychologist Viktor Frankl.
Viktor Frankl’s book “Man’s Search for Meaning” has been ranked by the Library of Congress as one of the 20th century’s 10 most influential books in the United States. Frankl described his experiences at Auschwitz in this book as if he had spent many months there. In reality, Frankl was in Auschwitz only for a few days in October 1944 while in transit from Theresienstadt to a sub-camp of Dachau. Frankl has admitted this to the American evangelist Robert Schuller: “I was in Auschwitz only three or four days…I was sent to a barrack and we were all transported to a camp in Bavaria.” (Source: Frankl, Viktor, “Dr. Robert Schuller Interviews Viktor Frankl: How to Find Meaning In Life,” Possibilities: The Magazine of Hope, March/April 1991, p. 10).
Frankl’s short time in Auschwitz is substantiated by the prisoner log from the sub-camp of Dachau, Kaufering III, which listed Frankl’s arrival on October 25, 1944, six days after his departure from Theresienstadt. (Source: Pytell, Timothy, “Extreme Experience, Psychological Insight, and Holocaust Perception; Reflections of Bettelheim and Frankl,” Psychoanalytic Psychology, Vol. 24, No. 4, Oct. 2007, p. 646).
Thus, Frankl’s descriptions of his long stay at Auschwitz in “Man’s Search For Meaning” are false and inaccurate. Like many other Jews, Frankl stayed at Auschwitz only a few days while being transited to another camp.
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John Wear says:@fufu
You write: “Jews were no danger to German’s military operations.”
My response: I recommend you read my article at https://inconvenienthistory.com/14/1/8184 for more information.
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Brad Anbro says:@Tiptoethrutulips
TTTTT,
Thank you for your thoughts. I used to go to church regularly in times past, to Methodist and also Lutheran (ELCA) churches. But the more “educated” that I became, as to what has and is going on here in “my” country, the USA, and throughout the world, I stopped going. Everyone would attend church and would pretend that things were just fine. And the churches were basically silent on the happenings. So I stopped going.
When it comes to “faith,” I am sorely lacking. I guess you could call me a “doubting Thomas.” I TRY to live my life as if there were a God and if there is one, I hope that He shows me mercy on my sins. I do not need any church leader to tell me what my sins are; I am well aware of them. I try to live by the “Golden Rule.”
As far as mankind and “evil” are concerned, I truly believe that mankind is INHERENTLY evil; it is his human nature to be evil. I am the opposite of the so-called “Humanists” in their thinking. I DO NOT believe, that given enough time, mankind will become closer to perfection. I think that time has shown just the opposite to be true. If anyone can explain to me, in a logical manner, why my thinking is wrong, I would be glad to listen to them.
Regarding the link to the video that I provided, I think that video spells out EXACTLY what is behind practically every war. I have run across a series of videos on BitChute that I am in the process of watching. The series starts out as “The Fall of (the) Cabal” and there are additional “parts” that follow. You will have to do some searching for them, but they are there. You may want to watch that series of videos.
Thank you.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Fran Taubman
Hello, Fran,
I’m wondering if you can explain the meaning of the comments in this video. It is short; maybe 1/2 minute.
Thanks
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Brad Anbro
Religion is complex subject matter, indeed. I grew up in Pentecostal church; I now consider myself agnostic. But, there absolutely does seem to be some intelligence behind creation. I think it was Francis Crick, co-discoverer of dna helix, who said pure evolution is the equivalent of disassembling a jet airplane, tossing all pieces into the air, until they fall back fully assembled. He said life is just too complex to be random; what came first, the flower or the bee?
Christopher Hitchens said he balks at the idea of born in sin; I think “sin” is meant, we are born flawed, not evil. Although, there is definitely evil amongst us, for sure. No one suggests animals are evil for what they do; they kill for territory, kill to eliminate rivals; lions randomly kill the cubs of leopards, hyenas, etc. and vice versa. It seems nature is kill or be killed.
Somewhere along the line, humans developed into emotional/thoughtful beings, always struggling with the kill or be killed element to life. In my opinion, different people/groups vary regarding where they are in this struggle, and we waver back and forth. I used to think Hitler was an evil man; now I think he was trying to protect Germany and Europe. I resent the lies about what happened; nowhere in textbooks or mainstream history books, that I have seen, do they ever mention the peace offers he made over and over. Innocent people will always suffer for these struggles. If there is a benevolent creator, I wish he would come back and sort everyone out.
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HdC says:@Mark Bahner
Start with this one: The Myth of German Villainy. Written by a US air force officer.
Churchill and Hitler, the Unnecessary War, by Pat Buchanan.
Germany’s War, by John Wear
The Chief Culprit, Icebreaker, by Viktor Suvotov
A fascinating read was The Pity of War by Niall Ferguson. This book deals with the British activities leading up to WWI.
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HdC says:@Peter Akuleyev
Well, you might wish to read Polish Atrocities Against the German Minority in Poland. Rnjoy.
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
[John Wear] My response: Auschwitz-Birkenau was the biggest of the German camps. It served both as a work camp and as a transit camp. Some Hungarian Jews stayed in Auschwitz-Birkenau to work, while many other Hungarian Jews were transited from Auschwitz-Birkenau to other camps.
So I hope you can see that your hypothesis is questionable, and as such, is unacceptable.
Hi,
And you’re missing the biggest part of what renders his hypothesis “questionable, and as such, unacceptable.” If the were being transited to other camps for work, it would have made no sense to send whole families (including very young children and old people) to Auschwitz in the first place. Why put people on a train who can’t work, and also shuffle them around to another camp, if they can’t work.
The only thing that would make sense from a “win the war” standpoint would be to take only the “fit to work” men and women on the trains. The only plausible reason for sending Hungarian Jewish families to Auschwitz in May-July 1944 was to exterminate all the members of those families who were not fit to work.
And that’s exactly what the Nazi bastards did. There’s simply no legitimate historical question about that.
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HdC says:@Mark Bahner
Suggest you read the transcripts of the Zundel trials held in Toronto during the 1980’s.
During these trials any assertions of any homicidal gas chambers in German concentration camps were completely disproved.
The prosecution was unable to provide any authenticated documentation or credible witnesses to support any allegations of homicidal gassings or gas chambers.• Agree: John Wear• Replies: @Mark BahnerAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
fufu says:@John Wear
#1453 John Wear
“You write: “Jews were no danger to German’s military operations.”
My response: I recommend you read my article at https://inconvenienthistory.com/14/1/8184 for more information.
“Yugoslavians, Poles, Soviets, Greeks.. were danger to German’s military operations, not Jews.
But there were no ghettos for Yugoslavians, Poles, Soviests, Greeks etc.
Jewish Resistant Movement almost didn’t exist during WW II.
Your few examples of Jewish assassins don’t change statistic (do you understand difference between a few examples and statistic, right?).I repeat, Jews were no danger to German’s military operations.
Jews were gathered in ghettos only because “cultural and well educated” Germans wanted to kill as many Jews as possible.
Germans are barbarians, and they had got what they deserved.
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Mark Bahner says:@littlereddot
This one I do not understand.
As a mechanical engineer, how would you use a basketball court as an ice-skating rink?
You can can use engineering jargon, I will understand.Heh, heh, heh! It took a little thought for me to come up with that one.
But I think it’s an excellent analogy, so:First of all, I’m not saying a *year round* ice skating rink on a basketball court. I’m just saying the coldest part of winter, in a place like Canada.
What you do is to build a frame around the outer edge of the court with 2″ x 4″ wood. Then you seal the inside edge with an elastomeric sealant:
Then fill the frame up to the top with water, and after it freezes, you have an ice skating rink. (Important note: Do not try this on your home concrete basketball court!
It probably would cause freeze-thaw damage. Oh…unless you used a plastic liner so the water never could get into any cracks in the concrete)The important part of this idea is that, at the end of the winter, you take away the 2″ x 4″ frame (and scrape away the elastomeric sealant)…and nobody would every guess a basketball court was used (in the dead of winter) as an ice skating rink!
BTW…last night I received a 600+ page book called, “Anatomy of the Auschwitz Death Camp.”
It’s incredibly detailed. And I think you’re absolutely right…the design(s) started out as standard crematorium. I’ve already forgotten the details, but as I recall:
1) There was an original 2-oven crematorium over at Auschwitz 1. They were going to add another oven to that. Then even bought the thing and delivered it to the site, as I recall. But I don’t think they ever installed it.
2) Then they decided to build Crematorium II at Birkenau. But they’d started killing people so fast in the two temporary gas chambers in the buildings known as “Bunker 1” and “Bunker 2” that, they needed Crematoriums III, IV, and V at Birkenau.
I’m not sure exactly when the manufacturer of the Crematoriums II, III, IV, and V knew that what they were building were gas chambers feeding crematoriums. However, as I remember it, the head of the crematorium company was given a pass on being conscripted into the military, in order that he could keep designing/building crematoriums, so he didn’t rock the boat as far as what they got used for.
Another incredibly important note: When the massive influx of Hungarian Jews being gassed in May-July 1944, even all the crematoriums II, III, IV, and V…containing 46 ovens total (15 in Crematorium II, 15 in Crematorium III, 8 in Crematorium IV, and 8 in Crematorium V)…could not keep up with all the bodies.
So they built *incredibly large* “burning pits” near Crematorium V. I think at maximum they had nine of those burning pits going. They’d pile in literally thousands of bodies, and set fire to them. They used alcohol to keep things burning…and even had special channels to collect the fat/grease running off from the burning process, to throw back on the bodies. Absolutely sickening.’
https://www.hdot.org/debunking-denial/ab6-open-air-burning/#
Dr. Charles Sigismund Bendel was a Jewish physician who was sent to Auschwitz-Birkenau where he was assigned to the crematoria Sonderkommando. At the Bergen-Belsen trial in 1945, Bendel confirmed how quickly and efficiently these open-air burning pits worked. For instance, he recollected how a transport of Jews from Lodz, Poland had been murdered and burned in such way: “I came at seven o’clock in the morning with the others and saw white smoke still rising from trenches, which indicated that a whole transport had been liquidated or finished off during the night . . . behind the crematorium they dug three large trenches 12 metres long and 6 metres [39 feet by 20 feet] wide. After a bit it was found that the results achieved even in these three big trenches were not quick enough, so in the middle of these big trenches they built two canals through which the human fat or grease should seep so that work could be continued in a quicker way. The capacity of these trenches was almost fantastic. Crematorium No. 4 was able to burn 1,000 people during the day, but this system of trenches was able to deal with the same number in one hour.”[3]
If you really want to know what happened at Auschwitz-Birkenau, buy that book. (Or I’d be happy to mail you that book, or all of the close to 10 books I have on Auschwitz, if you want to read them and mail them back to me. My gmail address is my last name and first name, all one word.)
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
It is clear from your repeated, and nearly identical, assertions, you are not looking into the arguments Mr. Wear is making by referencing more detailed analysis in his links to further information. And, thereby submitting further objections based on any new information.
In a general view, Hitler/Germany fought to the bitter end after all attempts at peace negotiations were denied.
On the partisan issue, which is associated with family removals, it is somewhat similar to the Native American/European conflicts. The Europeans were astonished to observe the guerilla style warfare, which entailed the slaughter of women, children and the elderly, often left at home and considered off limits. This was common practice with nearly all native cultures, especially on the plains. Partisan warfare is along the same vein of guerilla warfare, wherein one party attempts to observe established rules of combat, but the other party does not, or has no such rules to consider. So, what then happens? Children and the elderly are a “cover”, so to speak, for militant women, teenagers, etc. The elderly may not be fighting, but they provide support to the partisans.
I suggest you actually read some of the arguments made in defense of removal, instead of foolishly making the same assertions over and over. And over. And over.
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[Stop clogging up this thread with your stupid images or all your future comments will be trashed.]
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Brad Anbro says:@Tiptoethrutulips
TTTTT,
I agree with everything that you wrote. In regard to “evolution” vs. “creation,” I, too, believe that life is just too complex for everything to have just conveniently “happened.” James Perloff, a Jew (!), has written extensively on this subject.
I, too, agree that Hitler did many evil things, but he also did many good things. The same can be said for practically every U.S. president that ever held office.
All these commenters arguing back and forth about who killed whom, who was getting ready to attack whom, the proof or lack of proof concerning the “holocaust,” etc. – NONE of these people were there and none witnessed any of it first-hand. They can continue their arguing, but I want no part of it. A person’s mind was never changed by arguing with another person, only by reasoning in a logical manner. And the other person needs to have an open mind, or even this will not yield the desired result.
Since even before the USA had become a country and later, to the present day, there have been individuals and groups of people who were out to destroy nations’ sovereignties and to create a One World fascist dictatorship, where there will be a few at the top who own everything and the rest of the population being their slaves – that is, the ones who are allowed to live.
Some of the groups and organizations that come to mind past & present – the “Illuminati,” the Bilderbergers, the Council on Foreign Relations, the Trilateral Commission, the United Nations, the Federal Reserve, the International Monetary Fund, the World Trade Organization, the World Bank, the Central Intelligence Agency, the Masons, and, sad to say, the upper echelon of organized labor, the AFL-CIO and last, but by no means least, the World Economic Forum.
Like you, I hope that if there is a “Benevolent Creator,” I wish that He would come back and set things in order. And it could not happen soon enough, as far as I’m concerned. I just hope and pray that He does show mercy on me.
Thank you.
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Mark Bahner says:@Tiptoethrutulips
You are indeed, correct, Mark. I ACTUALLY went and looked at the source you cited, and it appears to be an accurate photo, with proper shadows, etc., therefore I stand corrected. No problem; I’m not afraid of the truth.
Good for you. So if you have any ability to evaluate truth from fiction, it should be incredibly easily for you to see the truth that over 100,000 Hungarian Jews were murdered in gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau from May to July of 1944.
“ Good f*cking grief. Can’t you and John Wear acknowledge the most basic and unquestionable facts?”
The answer is yes. Yes, we can.
Your answer is bullshit (especially when you hilariously speak for John Wear!).
Here was John Wear’s statement:
My response: The Germans generally wanted to keep families together. This is why so many Jewish children were sent to Auschwitz-Birkenau and other camps.
That answer was to a question of why Hungarian Jewish children were sent to Auschwitz. Ron Wear said it was because “The Germans generally wanted to keep families together.”
So here’s a question to you and to Ron Wear. Of the 400,000+ Hungarian Jews transported to Auschwitz-Birkenau, how many of them do you think lived together as a family in the Auschwitz-Birkenau camp, or were sent to other camps as a family?
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Fran Taubman says:@Tiptoethrutulips
Every religion has their crazies. And certainty the Jews are no different. The guy is a fruitcake. What can I say. Do you hear Jews talking like that? No. We Jews have religious extremist. But really not that many. And I should not have to answer to this video no more then you have to answer for our own crazy catholic Al Liguori Can you explain his cartoons and memes concerning Jews? Or why Ron lets him post such crazy shit? Have you looked at his posts?
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Tiptoethrutulips says:
I did answer the question, within the context of our exchange, about acknowledging basic facts, on behalf of myself and Mr. Wear. However, I will clarify that I don’t presume to speak for him, nor does he need me to do so, in any general or specific circumstance.
…………………………
“That answer was to a question of why Hungarian Jewish children were sent to Auschwitz. Ron Wear said it was because “The Germans generally wanted to keep families together.”
…………………………….You are once again honing in on a statement, so narrowly, in your habit of assigning or implying a different meaning than what was intended. I am beginning to suspect you are “on the spectrum”; or deliberately obtuse. Or actually obtuse. Your responses are indicative of taking things out of context.
What about the Hungarian Jews? I’m not entirely sure, but I will attempt further studies in that area. Or, I could just watch Sophie’s Choice or Schindler’s List (as you once actually suggested), and then proclaim to the world “Ah Ha! So, that explains it!”
Ordinarily, I refrain from popping off about points of contention in order to avoid mistakes, however, after the Hollywood movie fiasco, I no longer take you seriously. I won’t make that mistake again, I assure you. There is a difference between being wrong/deceitful, inquisitive/deliberately obtuse, argumentative/combative, reasonable/emotional….need I go on?
Perhaps I shouldn’t tease you about all that pearl clutching; send me your address and I will ship a fainting sofa and a bottle of Midol to you.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Brad Anbro
I agree, with the exception of the arguing, although I understand your position.
I find it is, oftentimes, effective/necessary to speculate about whats happened/happening. Why do the tides pull back and forth? Why did teeny tiny Japan attack the US behemoth? Why does Mark Behnar keep talking in circles? Does John Wear have any hair left on his head from the hair pulling in utter frustration?
All historical and scientific knowledge started with observations/speculations/questions/then answers.
We fight the good fight until we are no longer able or willing.
You take care of yourself, Mr. Anbro.
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John Wear says:@fufu
You write: “Jewish Resistant Movement almost didn’t exist during WW II. Your few examples of Jewish assassins don’t change statistic (do you understand difference between a few examples and statistic, right?).”
My response: Jewish author Judy Batalion does not agree with you. For more information, I recommend you read her book The Light of Days: The Untold Story of Women Resistance Fighters in Hitler’s Ghettos, New York: Harper Collins Publishers, 2020.
You write: “Germans wanted to kill as many Jews as possible.”
My response: This is not true. If Germans wanted to kill as many Jews as possible, you would not have millions of European Jews survive World War II.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
See #1468.
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@Fran Taubman
The posted video is mainstream orthodox judaism, genocidal theology that remains unchanged for millennia. Your own Chabad teaches the same genocidal precepts: http://judaism.is/chabad.html In stereotypically jewish manner, you accuse others of what you yourself do. Readers are invited to examine your own malevolent craziness, including death threats:
Run Al, run for your life
Tick, Tock. Every Catholic in the world will hunt you down.
And if any violence against Jews is a result of you website. You will be prosecuted.
Run Al, Run for your life. And pray that no crazy person viewing your website decides to buy a gun and kill a view Jews after reading your Catholic Plan.
The Catholic Plan against the Jews.
Pray Al then run for your life. https://www.unz.com/article/denying-holocaust-denial/?showcomments#comment-5346968I want you to go deep down where the corpses are. Find those corpses and fuck then until your dick false off. Then choke until you yourself become a corpse.
https://www.unz.com/article/the-9-11-double-cross-conspiracy-theory/?showcomments#comment-5607072to geocat62: we will come after you for denigrating and threatening the well being of Jews, Judaism our culture and our livelihood. We will hunt you down, every last one of you, and destroy you. Think Germany and the Jews. https://www.unz.com/article/my-paper-on-jewish-influence-blows-up/?showcomments#comment-5140379
Go Jerk off on some S & M porno.
https://www.unz.com/article/out-thought-out-bought-out-fought-why-the-9-11-truth-movement-failed/#comment-4973381etc.. etc., etc.
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
John, you keep dancing around answering a simple question with a simple answer.
Here is the simple question:
Were the majority of Hungarian Jewish children (under the age of, say, 12 years old) who were transported to Auschwitz-Birkenau from May-August 1944, transported there so that they could live with their families, either at Auschwitz-Birkenau, or at another camp?
That’s a simple “yes” or “no” question.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “If they were being transited to other camps for work, it would have made no sense to send whole families (including very young children and old people) to Auschwitz in the first place. Why put people on a train who can’t work, and also shuffle them around to another camp, if they can’t work.”
My response: As previously discussed, Germans had always sent children and disabled people to Auschwitz-Birkenau.
The documentary evidence indicates that a high percentage of the inmates at Birkenau were disabled. Oswald Pohl, in a secret report to Heinrich Himmler dated April 5, 1944, stated that there were 67,000 inmates in the entire Auschwitz-Birkenau camp complex, of which 18,000 were unable to work. In Birkenau there were a total of 36,000 inmates, of whom “approximately 15,000 are unable to work.” (Source: Nuremberg document NO-021, NMT (The “green series”), Vol. 5, pp. 384-385).
Such high percentages of disabled inmates at Auschwitz-Birkenau are not consistent with a program of mass extermination.
Evidence also exists that the German authorities responsible for the camps ordered measures to reduce deaths of inmates due to disease. On December 28, 1942, SS officer Richard Glücks, who was the head of the camp administration office, sent a directive to commandants of the concentration camps. It ordered that “…camp physicians must use all means at their disposal to significantly reduce the death rate in the various camps…The camp doctors are to see to it that the working conditions at the various labor sites are improved as much as possible.” The directive also stressed that “the Reichsführer SS [Heinrich Himmler] has ordered that the death rate absolutely must be reduced.” (Source: Nuremberg document PS-2171, Annex 2, NC&A (The “red series”), Vol. 4, pp. 833-834).
Glücks followed up his directive in January of 1943 by informing the concentration camp commandants, “As I have already pointed out, every means must be used to lower the death rate in the camps.” (Source: Document NO-1523, NMT ( The “green series”), Vol. 5, pp. 372-373).
German camp administrator Oswald Pohl, in an order dated October 26, 1943, gave specific measures to ensure the health and productivity of the internees of the camps. A copy of the order was sent to Himmler. Pohl began by stating the importance of the camps in the war effort. In addition to stressing the importance of proper nutrition, clothing, and rest, Pohl specified that ill prisoners were to receive a special diet to help restore their health.
If Auschwitz-Birkenau had been a place of mass extermination of the Jews, you would also not have so many young Jewish children survive the war. I document this in my comment #1411 on this discussion thread.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You ask: “Were the majority of Hungarian Jewish children (under the age of, say, 12 years old) who were transported to Auschwitz-Birkenau from May-August 1944, transported there so that they could live with their families, either at Auschwitz-Birkenau, or at another camp? That’s a simple “yes” or “no” question.”
My response: I don’t know. Why do you regard this as such an important question?
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Mark Bahner says:@Tiptoethrutulips
See #1473…or I’ll repeat is here for you, “tiptoethrutulips”:
Here is the simple question:
Were the majority of Hungarian Jewish children (under the age of, say, 12 years old) who were transported to Auschwitz-Birkenau from May-August 1944, transported there so that they could live with their families, either at Auschwitz-Birkenau, or at another camp?
That’s a simple “yes” or “no” question.
What is your answer to that question?
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Fran Taubman
You agreed with this basic statement:
“ Germans are barbarians, and they had got what they deserved.”I will not assume or suggest your agreement is without nuance or context. However, these same statements from gentiles, throughout history, in relation to Jews, are always highly derided and attributed to utter malice; no context considered. Jews have been expelled from societies throughout history; at some point, a little self reflection is in order. Yes? Maybe gentile/Jewish society is not compatible.
I agree, there are “crazies” amongst all people. However, Judaism (and Islam) both assert rules/regulations for dealing with each other and different rules for other groups/religions. Aside from the rabbi in the video, I have heard many others saying exactly the same. Then, when you observe Jewish people/Jewish organizations providing aid/assistance to EVERY group of people crossing the Mediterranean into Europe, it’s reasonable to deduce it just may be deliberate and in heed of rabbinic instructions. I will assume you are familiar with Barbara Spectre’s dictate that Europe no longer belongs to Europeans, but she acknowledges Jews will be resented for their role in the necessary transformation. What is the average white person to make of that? She does not appear to be a lunatic.
Regarding Al Liguori, he is certainly clear about his opinion on Judea. But, is he completely inaccurate? I don’t think he is; I think his vitriol is more likely from frustration, and while I have not read everything he asserts, I don’t recall any calls for actual violence against Jews. My guess is he would prefer to scoop all the Jews up and drop them safely into Israel; for all eternity, never again to reside among western people. We can say (mostly) whatever we want; that’s the point of this forum. It used to be one of America’s finest attributes; it is no longer the case, and as Ms. Spectre suggests, Jews seem to be disproportionately responsible for that transformation as well.
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Mark Bahner says:@HdC
Suggest you read the transcripts of the Zundel trials held in Toronto during the 1980’s.
During these trials any assertions of any homicidal gas chambers in German concentration camps were completely disproved.I have a better idea. (That means better for me, not for you. ;-))
You summarize and/or excerpt key parts of the Zundel trial transcripts that you think “completely disproved” “any assertions of homicidal gas chambers in German concentration camps.”
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Fran Taubman says:@fufu
Lets just recap John Wear’s summary of the Hungarian Jews.
1. Jews were a threat to the Germans in the form of a resistance movement. They were therefore rounded up and placed into Ghettoes. Once the Hungarian Jews were rounded up at blinding speed after the Germans invaded Hungary. The Jews were no longer a threat to Germany, once under lock and key in their ghettoes. This is a true statement. As there were no incidences of Jewish resistance.
2. Jews in Ghettoes cooperated with the Germans, and were helpful in identifying and rounding up Jews, in the hopes of reducing the burden on the Jews, that if they cooperated the Germans would be more lenient. Every ghetto throat occupied Europe had a Judenraete in charge of Ghettos, this was a bureaucracy. Wealthy Jews could personal approach Eichmann give him money and be excluded. Eichmann was constantly selling Jews for money. In Hungary Eichmann tried to barter with the Zionist for trucks and weapons in exchange for 100,000 Jews. TO BE SAVED FROM EXTERMINATION.
German occupation authorities established the first ghetto in occupied Poland in Piotrków Trybunalski in October 1939. The largest ghetto in occupied Poland was the Warsaw ghetto. In Warsaw, more than 400,000 Jews were crowded into an area of 1.3 square miles. Other major ghettos were established in the cities of Lodz, Krakow, Bialystok, Lvov, Lublin, Vilna, Kovno, Czestochowa, and Minsk. Tens of thousands of western European Jews were also deported to ghettos in the east.
The Germans ordered Jews in the ghettos to wear identifying badges or armbands. They also required many Jews to carry out forced labor for the German Reich. Nazi-appointed Jewish councils (Judenraete) administered daily life in the ghettos. A ghetto police force enforced the orders of the German authorities and the ordinances of the Jewish councils. This included facilitating deportations to killing centers. Jewish police officials, like Jewish council members, served at the whim of the German authorities. The Germans did not hesitate to kill those Jewish policemen who were perceived to have failed to carry out orders.
-So if the Hungarian Jews were in Ghettoes why were they transported to Auschwitz in the summer of 1944. We are told that the non-employable Jews were transferred with their families for family unity. THIS IS A LIE. The families were separated upon arrival. Those employable Jews were registered in the camp, those that were not were sent to the crematorium.
-We are told that Auschwitz was a transit hub, like Grand Central Station. You know everyone got sent there to go somewheres else. Where were the decrepit Jews and babies the people in the below photos going to be transported to? Berlin to go shopping for some clothes, or Hanukah presents. These people could not survive on their own. They look like they need a lot of help.Did the cattle cars these Hungarian Jews were transported in to their other locations, did they have baby changing rooms, toilets, food. Again why transport them from Budapest to Auschwitz. It was not for family unity. No answer other than murder will suffice. Why were there 5 crematoriums at Auschwitz each across the street from the other at the train station?
– We are told there are no homicidal gassing rooms at Auschwtz because one wall out of the 5 was tested. The rest were destroyed and were not tested. So there very well could be gassing rooms for cyanided poising which causes affixation.
It appears to me that John Wear and the entire Revisionist movement is grasping at straws. We are told but look at the Zundel trail. The deniers won that trial. That was in the early 1980’s. A lot of research has been done.
The Auschwitz prove irrefutably that the Jews were transported from Budapest to Auschwitz for the sole purpose of extermination. The Hungarians new it, the Christian world new it, the pope new it. The neutral countries new it and only under threat of war crimes to Horthly stop the transports, for no other reasons. In 1944 there were 800,000 Hungarian Jews, by the end of 1945 there were 200,000 Jews left mostly in Budapest.
This is the straw grabbing of John Wear. The Jews were not murdered in Auschwitz because the enigma code had been broke and there was no mention of eradicating Jews. Something like this:
Hier Himmler today we gassed and incinerated 10,000 unregistered Hungarian Jews at Auschwitz.
How stupid is that. No one in the Reich is going to communicate the murder of unregistered Jews, that is the entire point of not registering them. They in essence did not exist.These unregistered Hungarian Jews were transported to Auschwitz for the following reasons. Below from the Auschwitz Album. What a joke. Holocaust denial is dead and belongs to the land of the lunatics but most of all it belongs to the Jew hating liars like John Wear. Lies all lies.
– A thereat to the German Reich. LOL
– Were shipped to Auschwitz from Budapest to be with the employable Jews for family? lol lol lol
– Were shipped to Auschwitz on route to another location, because Auschwitz was a transport hub, and the Germans had nothing better to do in 1944 but transport Jews in cattle cars all around the Reich. Let’s ship the Jews here, let’s ship these Jews there. LOOK at the people in these photos. LOOk at them. People like John Wear no they are lying. They no it. How can you look these Jews and say they were shipped for family unity. I am not boo hooing thsee poor Jews not at all. Many people suffered.I am saying what a bunch of liars, liars H deniers and revisionist are. These Jews in the photos would die and be incinerated in a few hours from when these photos were taken. That is the truth and the only logical truth. Their families never saw them again after the train entered Auschwitz and the selection process was finished.
Selecting
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
My response: I don’t know.
You don’t know? You’ve been “researching” the Holocaust for decades, and you can’t even answer that simple question? OK, if you don’t “know”…what do you think?
Why do you regard this as such an important question?
Because you made the (utter bullshit) claim:
The Germans generally wanted to keep families together. This is why so many Jewish children were sent to Auschwitz-Birkenau and other camps.
I want to know if you think that statement was true for the specific case of Hungarian Jewish children transported to Auschwitz-Birkenau in May-July 1944.
So again, yes or no, what do you *think* the answer is to this question:
Were the majority of Hungarian Jewish children (under the age of, say, 12 years old) who were transported to Auschwitz-Birkenau from May-August 1944, transported there so that they could live with their families, either at Auschwitz-Birkenau, or at another camp?
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Fran Taubman says:
These Jews were a threat to the German Reich, and were transported to Auschwitz in the summer of 1944 because:
-They were dangerous
-To be with their families
-To be transported to another camp.Why?????? All of those reasons are lies. The Hungarian Jews were transported to Auschwitz to be murdered and incinerated. From the Auschwitz Album. The end of Holocaust denial.
The unregistered Hungarian Jews.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Ok, “iwillaskthesamequestionregardlessofpreviousanswerBahner”, I shall answer your question, but with this caveat:
Sometimes there are no solutions, only trade-offs. And, some questions don’t have simple answers, and that’s a simple fact. I am not well read on the specific details of Jews from Hungary, but I will answer BASED ENTIRELY on what I do understand about German goals, policies and tactics, OVERALL.
You may need to recline on your worn out fainting sofa; the answer is:
Yes. Yes, they were.
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Brás Cubas says:@Tiptoethrutulips
The “airplane” fallacy was said by Fred Hoyle, an astronomer.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Hoyle
If you want to know a minimal amount about Francis Crick, read his Wikipedia page:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Crick
Now, here is a page discussing anti-evolutionism (I haven’t read all of it):
“A memorable misunderstanding”: Fred Hoyle’s Boeing-story in the Evolution/Creation literature
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Patrick McNally says:@Rurik
It is at least theoretically plausible that Trotsky’s brief stay in New York may have been aided by people who were opposed to US entry into World War I. Even here, there isn’t really any evidence. It’s just tempting to think that someone like Jacon Schiff, who was firmly opposed to US entry into the war the March Revolution overthrew Czardom, may have helped opponents of the war.
Beyond that, there’s nothing to speak of. The events which led to the overthrow of Kerensky in November had nothing to do with anyone in New York. It at least is theoretically plausible that the German government may have given some funds to Lenin, although the most important aid which Lenin ever received was simply the transportation back to Russia granted him Wilhelm II.
As far as attempts to assert that some kind of foreign money played a role in helping gain power, no one has ever been able to show a mechanism for this. Lenin was able to topple Kerensky because the public was fed up with the war and peasants were already seizing the lands of the large estates. There’s nothing to show that Lenin somehow produced a giant sum of money which enabled to take power. It was all small budget activity. Rallying soldiers, workers and peasants who were fed ip with the war and demanding some kind of revolution.
When Trotsky dismissed the elected Constituent Assembly, this opened the possibility for a smart anyi-Bolshevik opposition to rally in defense of the elected Assembly. But Admiral Kolchak expressed his agreement with the dismissal of the Assembly and carried out a coup d’état in Siberia which toppled the government that the Social Revolutionaries had set after Trotsky dismissed them. Since no one was interested in fighting for Kolchak as Supreme Ruler, the Bolsheviks were able to win. None of that was really determined by money from Germany, never mind New York.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You ask: “So again, yes or no, what do you *think* the answer is to this question: Were the majority of Hungarian Jewish children (under the age of, say, 12 years old) who were transported to Auschwitz-Birkenau from May-August 1944, transported there so that they could live with their families, either at Auschwitz-Birkenau, or at another camp?”
My response: I have seen no documentation that will answer this question. So again, I don’t know. Please answer my question: Why do you regard this as such an important question?
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Patrick McNally says:@Brás Cubas
Interesting. I guess if this is something which was derived from a quote that came in 1938 and was reframed into 1932, then that might just be able to avoid the description of “thin air” by some criterion. Obviously, the reason that the year 1932 stands out is because this was before Hitler came to power. So, changing the year changes the entire meaning of the quote.
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Mark Bahner says:@Tiptoethrutulips
Yes. Yes, they were.
‘
So you’re answering this question:
Were the majority of Hungarian Jewish children (under the age of, say, 12 years old) who were transported to Auschwitz-Birkenau from May-August 1944, transported there so that they could live with their families, either at Auschwitz-Birkenau, or at another camp?
…with, “Yes. Yes, they were.”
?
What is your evidence for your answer?
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Patrick McNally says:@Al Liguori
That’s more in line with Osama bin Laden’s declaration of a fatwa on the West in 1998. It is certainly true that many Jews, especially by 1938, were hoping to see some conflict between the West and Hitler. They generally did not have anything like the army of experienced fighters which Osama had when he made declaration in 1998. But, sure, there were many who were looking for the opportunity of a showdown with Hitler. If Hitler had not marched across Czechia on March 15, 1939, they would not have gotten the chance.
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John Wear says:@Fran Taubman
You write: “It appears to me that John Wear and the entire Revisionist movement is grasping at straws.”
My response: I thought we had mutually agreed to end our discussions. However, since you keep mentioning my name, I will answer some of your statements.
You write: “We are told that Auschwitz was a transit hub, like Grand Central Station. You know everyone got sent there to go somewheres else.”
My response: For certain Auschwitz-Birkenau served as a transit camp. This has been acknowledged by many traditional historians and is a well-documented fact.
You write: “We are told there are no homicidal gassing rooms at Auschwitz because one wall out of the 5 was tested.”
My response: There are numerous additional scientific and engineering reasons why homicidal gas chambers did not exist at Auschwitz-Birkenau. These include the following:
1) they did not have escape-proof doors and windows;
2) they did not have panic-proof equipment;
3) they did not have technically gastight doors and shutters;
4) they had no provision to quickly release and distribute the poison gas;
5) they had no effective device to ventilate or otherwise render ineffective the poison gas after the execution.
6) The roof of the semi-underground Morgue #1 of Crematorium II at Birkenau, which is said to have been the building’s homicidal gas chamber, remains intact to some degree today. Contrary to some eyewitness testimony, that roof has no Zyklon-B-introduction holes. This has been acknowledged by pro-Holocaust researcher Robert Jan van Pelt. Since it is impossible to close holes measuring 70 x 70 cm from a concrete roof without leaving clearly visible traces, it is certain that no Zyklon-B-introduction holes ever existed at Crematorium II. Consequently, Zyklon B could not have been introduced through the roof at this morgue as alleged by pro-Holocaust supporters.
You write: “The Auschwitz prove irrefutably that the Jews were transported from Budapest to Auschwitz for the sole purpose of extermination.”
My response: I am not clear what you are attempting to say here. Please clarify your statement and I will respond to it.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Brás Cubas
I did say “I think” about the sayer of the quote; if you are correcting me for the sake of accuracy, thank you, it’s good to know.
I do know a bit about Crick, but I avoid Wikipedia, unless I want basic info, such as date/place of birth.
Off hand, I’m not sure about Fred Hoyle, but I am interested in the subject matter, so thank you for the link. (the astronomy reference sounds familiar; something about telescope construction/ innovation?)
I have to prioritize my focus on Hungarian history, because Mr. Bahner is flinging pearls everywhere and his fainting sofa is on the brink of collapse.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Did you or did you not ask for a “yes or no” answer to the question you posed?
YES OR NO? JA ODER NEIN?
Are we corresponding in the same language? Perhaps you are not actually slinging your pearls, but clutching them because they are too tight and constricting blood flow to your brain.???
I don’t know what you actually want, other than complete acquiescence to the history, as revealed, in Sophie’s Choice or Schindler’s List.
To that statement/assumption of your objective, my answer is: NEIN.
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fufu says:@John Wear
#1470 John Wear
“My response: Jewish author Judy Batalion does not agree with you.”
Jewish resistance was close to zero in WWII.
“My response: This is not true. If Germans wanted to kill as many Jews as possible, you would not have millions of European Jews survive World War II. “
Sure.
Americans didn’t exterminate Indians because still are Comanches.
Spaniards didn’t exterminate Indians because still are Mayans.
Germans didn’t exterminate Slavs because still are Lusitzis.Germans wanted to kill as many Jews as possible but they were clumsy and therefore some Jews survived.
Have you ever consider idea, that Germans weren’t perfect?
I doubt.
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John Wear says:@fufu
You write: “Germans wanted to kill as many Jews as possible but they were clumsy and therefore some Jews survived. Have you ever consider idea, that Germans weren’t perfect?”
My response: Actually, millions of Jews survived the war. This includes large numbers of Jews who were in the German camps during the war.
The Germans were not perfect, but they certainly could have murdered virtually all of the Jews under their control if they had a policy of genocide against the Jews.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@fufu
Technically, more/or as many Comanches were killed by Apaches.
More Mayans were killed by Aztecs, and vice versa, long before Spaniards arrived.
Europeans have been killing each other, willy nilly, for eons.
Japanese and Chinese killed each other.
Have you heard of Mao Zedong? Or Pol Pot?
Zulus and Bantus killed each other in Africa.
Jews killed lots of people in their neck of the woods; have you read the Old Testament?
Persians, Greeks, Macedonians, Arabs, Berbers, all head-chopping-off proponents, although I think Alexander the Great tried to let as many people as possible keep their heads.
I don’t know where you live, but who’s killing whom, these days?
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Mark Bahner says:@Tiptoethrutulips
Perhaps you are not actually slinging your pearls, but clutching them because they are too tight and constricting blood flow to your brain.???
I have no pearls. And you shouldn’t be writing about my brain’s blood flow, when you write things that you apparently have absolutely zero evidence to support.
I don’t know what you actually want,…
I want you to please provide whatever evidence you have to support your position.
I’d be happy to provide you with abundant evidence to support my position that:
The majority of Hungarian Jewish children (under the age of, say, 12 years old) who were transported to Auschwitz-Birkenau from May-August 1944, were most assuredly NOT transported there so that they could live with their families, either at Auschwitz-Birkenau, or at another camp.
I thought you wrote you were interested in the truth? Or was that some other commenter?
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
My response: Actually, millions of Jews survived the war. This includes large numbers of Jews who were in the German camps during the war.
*Approximately* 1.2 million people were sent to Auschwitz-Birkenau at some time during the war. (Please provide a better number if you think there is one.) What percentage of them do you think survived to Victory in Europe day on May 8, 1945?
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You ask: “*Approximately* 1.2 million people were sent to Auschwitz-Birkenau at some time during the war. (Please provide a better number if you think there is one.) What percentage of them do you think survived to Victory in Europe day on May 8, 1945?”
My response: Your estimate of 1.2 million people sent to Auschwitz-Birkenau is close enough for me. Probably about 140,000 of these people died at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
After they left Auschwitz-Birkenau, many people died of diseases such as typhus and typhoid. A good example of such a person is Anne Frank, who along with her sister died of typhus at Bergen-Belsen. The virtual collapse of Germany’s food, transport, and public health systems and the extreme overcrowding in the German camps at the end of the war led to the catastrophe the Allied troops encountered when they entered the camps.
So, I don’t know for sure, but I would say at least 900,000 of the 1.2 million people lived to May 8, 1945. This equals a percentage of 75% or more of the Auschwitz-Birkenau inmates who survived the war.
In comment #1411 on this discussion thread, I list some of the children at Auschwitz-Birkenau who survived the war. Do you know why so many young children who were sent to Auschwitz-Birkenau survived the war? If Germany had a policy of genocide against the Jews, can you explain why so many young children were not murdered in Auschwitz-Birkenau?
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Well, what about your fainting sofa, Mark? Was I correct about its impending demise?
Do you not see the hilarity in your above responses? You did, in fact, ask for a yes or no answer. Did you understand my expressed caveat? Did you bother to read it? Do you know what a demand for a plain yes or no response actually means? Did you not suggest I watch Schindler’s List for historical information? Did you find out what really happened to Cindylou Who?
If Ron Wear can’t give a response to your satisfaction, I certainly will NEVER be able to do so. It is absolutely and utterly clear, to me, that you do not consider, or even bother to read on, the defenses he offers for his conclusions. I know this because your needle never moves, in any direction, with regard to your inquiries. For someone who claims a cursory knowledge, more or less, about these issues, you are certainly quite confident in blasting away against someone who has studied this subject for years. If you can bring yourself to at least consider what he says, maybe some level of resolution can be reached. You have to consider both sides. I have read/watched both anti-Germany and pro-Germany books, articles, lectures, etc. The truth is, the actual stories, spoken on camera, by “survivors” contradicted each other constantly and defied all reason; giving allowances for trauma and human memory, how can one Kapo say there was a staff of 900, while another says the staff numbered about 100 in the same building at the same time? How does a Jewish man forget his bar mitzvah? Someone’s lying, Mark. That’s just one of many contradictions and impossibilities. Their ridiculous accusations are the reason I looked to other sources.
At this point, we are on the brink of absurdity; other than the entertainment factor, I don’t know where else we can go. I’m sure you won’t bother to read my above dissertation in any thoughtful manner.
If I’m correct about your dilapidated fainting sofa, please forward your address, and I’ll send you another, reinforced. You didn’t object to the Midol, so I’ll assume you will be needing more of that as well.
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
I have seen no documentation that will answer this question. So again, I don’t know. Please answer my question: Why do you regard this as such an important question?
I regard it as an important question because I asked you why Hungarian Jewish children were deported to Auschwitz-Birkenau from May to July 1944, and you responded with a bullshit non-answer.
Then I asked you again, and now you say: “I have seen no documentation that will answer this question.”
Well, I’ve seen documentation. Plenty of documentation. I think I know why the many tens of thousands of Hungarian Jewish children were deported to Auschwitz from May to July 1944. I think the reason was to murder them.
Don’t you think it’s important for you to find some evidence that I’m wrong? Don’t you think it’s important for you to find documentation that those that those tens of thousands of Hungarian Jewish children were not deported to Auschwitz to murder them?
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
So, I don’t know for sure, but I would say at least 900,000 of the 1.2 million people lived to May 8, 1945. This equals a percentage of 75% or more of the Auschwitz-Birkenau inmates who survived the war.
What percentage of the Hungarian Jewish children deported to Auschwitz-Birkenau in May through August 1944 do you think survived to May 8, 1945?
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Mark Bahner says:
Do you not see the hilarity in your above responses? You did, in fact, ask for a yes or no answer.
If I asked you whether you think the earth is flat, yes or no, and you answered, “Yes, yes I do”…don’t you think it would be reasonable for me to ask you why you think the world is flat?
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Wizard of Oz says:@John Wear
Surely you can see that there would be a different view taken by higher authorities taking your theoretical view an lower level functionaries hoping to save their own skins.
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Mark Bahner says:@Tiptoethrutulips
So, I speculate, if you want to kill EVERYONE quickly and efficiently, you will use a more lethal toxin than bug spray.
Do you know what gas is released by Zyklon B? Do you know what gas was typically used in execution gas chambers in the USA?
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “Well, I’ve seen documentation. Plenty of documentation. I think I know why the many tens of thousands of Hungarian Jewish children were deported to Auschwitz from May to July 1944. I think the reason was to murder them. Don’t you think it’s important for you to find some evidence that I’m wrong?”
My response: The evidence that you are wrong is that so many children survived Auschwitz-Birkenau. I have documented some of these children who survived Auschwitz-Birkenau in my comment #1411. You would not have so many children survive Auschwitz-Birkenau if it had been a place of mass extermination.
The infamous Joseph Mengele is a case in point. Despite claims that Mengele performed cruel and lethal experiments on twins at Auschwitz, almost all of the twins Mengele enrolled in his research at Auschwitz survived the war. In fact, so many twins survived Mengele’s research that, in 1984, they helped form an association titled Children of Auschwitz Nazi Deadly Experiment Survivors (CANDLE). This association’s name is a misnomer, because if the experiments were deadly, how could there be so many survivors? Also, if young children unable to work had been immediately selected for gassing at Auschwitz as claimed by “Holocaust” historians, how could so many children at Auschwitz survive the war? (Source: Rudolf, Germar, “Josef Mengele—the Creation of a Myth,” Inconvenient History, Vol. 9, No. 2, 2017).
More evidence that you are wrong is that there were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau. I document this in my articles at https://inconvenienthistory.com/9/4/5160 and https://inconvenienthistory.com/12/1/7200.
More evidence that you are wrong comes from eyewitnesses. For example, a credible eyewitness who states that genocide did not take place at Birkenau is the Austrian-born Canadian Maria Van Herwaarden, who was interned at Birkenau from December 2, 1942 to January 1945. Van Herwaarden testified at the 1988 Ernst Zündel trial that she saw nothing at Birkenau that resembled mass murder. The Jewish prisoners she saw at Birkenau were not treated differently from the other prisoners. She also testified that many of the inmates at Birkenau died of diseases, and some inmates committed suicide. (Source: Kulaszka, Barbara, (ed.), Did Six Million Really Die: Report of Evidence in the Canadian “False News” Trial of Ernst Zündel, Toronto: Samisdat Publishers Ltd., 1992, pp. 253-255).
Joseph G. Burg, a Jewish author who wrote several books on the Holocaust story, testified at the 1988 Zündel trial that he had spoken to hundreds of people who had been at Auschwitz-Birkenau when he visited the camp in the fall of 1945. Burg formed the opinion that there were no German extermination camps, the gas chambers had never existed, and there was no plan to exterminate the Jews of Europe.
Joseph Burg testified at the 1988 Zündel trial that he spoke to hundreds of people who serviced and operated the crematoria, but he could not find anyone who had operated homicidal gas chambers. Burg testified that the crematoria had been established for hygienic purposes as a result of typhus and other diseases. Burg also testified that he attended the Nuremberg trials in 1946 and met Ilya Ehrenburg, who had visited Auschwitz-Birkenau, as well as a Jewish publisher who had been interned in Auschwitz for several years. Both Ehrenburg and the Jewish publisher said they did not see any homicidal gas chambers while at Auschwitz-Birkenau. (Source: Ibid., pp. 259-262).
Ditlieb Felderer, a revisionist researcher of Jewish descent, testified at the 1985 Ernst Zündel trial that he had conducted 27 separate visits to Auschwitz-Birkenau, where he snapped more than 30,000 color photographs, took soil samples, and conducted infra-red analysis of rooms and buildings. He examined the camp from top to bottom, and sneaked into areas which were off limits to tourists. However, none of Felderer’s photographs was permitted to be offered as evidence by the judge in Zündel’s trial.
Felderer testified that the real Zyklon-B rooms at Auschwitz were delousing chambers. These facilities were designed to save lives by fighting typhus through the fumigation of bedding and clothing. He said that faked or reconstructed exhibits were placed on the guided Auschwitz tour. These fake exhibits included the infamous “execution wall,” which Felderer discovered did not have any bullet holes in the wall. Felderer described Auschwitz as it is now portrayed as being a “Hollywood set” which carries on Zionist and communist propaganda. (Source: Rudolf, Germar (ed.), The First Zündel Trial: The Court Transcript of the Canadian “False News” Trial of Ernst Zündel, 1985, Uckfield, UK: Castle Hill Publishers, 2020, pp. 495-505).
More evidence you are wrong comes from Allied aerial photographs taken at the height of the alleged extermination of Hungarian Jews. In his book “Auschwitz: The End of a Legend”, Carlo Mattogno states in regard to Allied aerial photographs taken at Birkenau on May 31, 1944:
“It is pointed out also that the aerial photographs taken by the Allied military on 31 May 1944, at the crucial time of presumed extermination, on the day of the arrival at Birkenau of about 15,000 deportees, and after 14 days of intense arrivals (184,000 deportees, averaging 13,000 per day) and with an extermination toll (according to Pressac’s hypothesis) of at least 110,000 homicidally gassed, which would have had to average 7,800 per day, every single day for 14 consecutive days; after all of that, the photographs do not show the slightest evidence of this alleged enormous extermination: No trace of smoke, no trace of pits, crematory or otherwise, burning or not, no sign of dirt extracted from pits, no trace of wood set aside for use in pits, no sign of vehicles or any other type of activity in the crucial zones of the courtyard of Crematory V nor in the earth of Bunker 2, nor in Crematories II and III. These photographs constitute irrefutable proof that the story of extermination of the Hungarian Jews is historically unfounded.” (Source: Mattogno, Carlo, Auschwitz: The End of a Legend, Newport Beach, CA: The Institute for Historical Review, 1994, p. 32).
I hope this helps you understand that there was not a German program of mass extermination at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Tiptoethrutulips
As you clearly not a lawyer but indulging in smartish undergraduate level argument I am not going to waste more time except to point to your typical failures found in your last paragraph. Your rhetorical question is senseless without your nominating who made the choice to say he was a doctor. The shortest answer is that it would be regarded as absolutely standard by the lowest level law clerk to record, as part of the identification of a potential witness, what his occupation was.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
I don’t think ‘reasonable” applies to you in any form or fashion.
So, in your extreme narrow mindedness, you demanded a yes or no answer. So, I took a page from your book, disregarded all expectations or recognition of nuance, context, assumed meaning, speculative meaning, rational thought/deductions, scientific evidence, ability to count/add, blah, blah, blah and answered accordingly, just as you asked.
I wanted to close with a jab about your pearls, fainting sofa, brain tissue atrophy or Midol, but I’ll just recommend the series of books by Dr. Suess, for your further study. I don’t think Dr. Suess is Jewish, but he looks Jewish. And, I don’t think he’s a real doctor, unlike Dr. Bendel, who moonlights as a construction/structural engineer, when he’s not counting poison tablets.
I have to say, you take the jabs quite well, with very little in return, and unlike John Wear, I do deserve a few jabs. For that, you have my admiration.
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littlereddot says:@Mark Bahner
What you do is to build a frame around the outer edge of the court with 2″ x 4″ wood. Then you seal the inside edge with an elastomeric sealant:
So after a decade after the modified basketball court was abandoned, I would be able to look at the wood frame, and waterproofing sealant and surmise that it would have been suitable for a skating. This is what I mean by tell tale signs.
In the same way, if a building originally designed to have holding morgue facilities for dead bodies which was later turned into a gas chamber, there would also be tell-tale signs.
I have made it clear, ad nauseam, that I do not know what the buildings were used for EVENTUALLY. But it is clear what they were meant for INITIALLY.
Until I see physical evidence by way of photographs, or later blueprints showing the modifications/retrofitting, I remain agnostic.
BUT,….. iIf I may be honest, I find the plethora of books and Hollywood movies trying to force the Holocaust story down my throat rather suspicious. It seems that some parties are TRYING TOO HARD TO CONVINCE ME.
And that the HARDER THEY TRY TO CONVINCE ME, THE MORE SUSPICIOUS I BECOME OF THEM.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You ask: “Do you know what gas is released by Zyklon B? Do you know what gas was typically used in execution gas chambers in the USA?”
My response: Zyklon B was typically used in execution gas chambers in the United States. However, Zyklon B can not be effectively used for the mass executions of humans.
In March 1992, a prominent Austrian engineer named Walter Lüftl made headlines when a report he had written stated that the stories of mass extermination of Jews in gas chambers at Auschwitz and Mauthausen are impossible for technical reasons and because they are incompatible with observable laws of nature. At the time of his report, Lüftl was a court-recognized expert engineer who headed a large engineering firm in Vienna.
Lüftl stated that although the hydrocyanic acid contained in the Zyklon B can kill quickly and certainly, the handling requirements for Zyklon B rule out any significant use of Zyklon B for the mass killing of people. Lüftl stated that during the ventilation process after a gassing, Zyklon B would still retain approximately 92% of its hydrocyanic acid content, and would thus continue releasing hydrocyanic acid gas. Lüftl asked: How could the gas chamber operators get rid of the remaining Zyklon B from the midst of dead corpses, without lengthy ventilation periods, and without causing mass deaths outside the gas chambers? Lüftl concluded that because of operational and time considerations, quasi-industrial killing using Zyklon B would be impossible. (Source: Lüftl, Walter, “The Lüftl Report,” The Journal of Historical Review, Vol. 12, No. 4, Winter 1992-1993, pp. 395-401).
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fufu says:@Tiptoethrutulips
#1494 Tiptoethrutulips
“Who, exactly, is perfect? “
Nobody perfect.
Except Germans… and Jews… and the British … and Chineses … and Mr. John Wear who avoid answering simple questions.
Germans, Jews, the British, Chineses (and Mr. John Wear) are perfect. It’s a cosmic rule in whole Universe from beginning of time.
“Technically, more/or as many Comanches were killed by Apaches.”
My point was to show idiocy of theory made by Mr. John Wear that (paraphrasing)
“Germans didn’t kill all Jews so Germans didn’t plan genocide of Jews.”Nation A killed 90% of nation Z but 10% of nation Z survived so nation A didn’t want to exterminate nation Z.
This is so ridiculous reasoning that I don’t know how to answer that.
Germans wanted to kill Jews and Slavs.
Germans didn’t kill all Jews and Slavs because Germans weren’t perfect, Germans made mistakes (i.e. maybe Germans thought that they can exterminate Jews and Slavs after winning the war).
If some Jews and Slavs survived then it doesn’t mean that Germans didn’t have a policy of extermination of Jews, Slavs and other “subhumans”.
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kb_2 says:@Fran Taubman
Fran, you wrote
Babies, grandmothers, old people. Never saw their families again. Where would you send a baby and a grandmother to after the transit hub of Auschwitz lol? What camp and for what reason in 1944? You people talk like we are talking about horses. These people arrived at Auschwitz as families. The baby was held by the grandmother, and the mother never saw either one of them again.
In fact, this part of your argument is weaker than you think.
Suppose, deportation actually have place. There were a war around, probably food shortages, plagues etc. Many of the old people and children may have died of natural causes. Those of the elderly who did not die might not have the health to move on. In any case, it would be inhuman to arrange such deportations.
Suppose a family has a small child. How will he be reunited with his family? How will he find them? Especially if he is very small.
You are talking about the testimonies of those who could not find their relatives. If the revisionist theory is correct, it is natural to expect such evidence in this case as well. In addition, if the family was then at least partially reunited, this could be less traumatic and not lead to a desire to testify to the world about their difficult fate. Also the testimonies of such people could also be less widely disseminated in the media.
Of course, the question arises whether there are testimonies of those who then found their relatives (you say they are absent) – and this is a serious issue for the revisionists. They still need to be shown where all these people are (I doubt they will succeed – but I’m ready to reconsider my opinion).
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kb_2 says:@Mark Bahner
You wrote:
I think that human liberty is tremendously important In that regard, I consider both National Socialism and Communism to be unquestionably evil.
Yes, many people on this site are prone to germanophilia. In fact, both of these ideologies are evil (as a libertarian I will add: except when they are implemented voluntarily on private territory with the ability to leave it).
Several posts in this thread touch on the revisionist theory of deportations. Even if everything went as the revisionists say, it still remains a crime. With families divided and broken destinies.
But there is another question here. History is written by the winners. When revisionism began it was necessary to test whether the generally accepted story was true. There must have been good reasons to doubt her. Historical revisionism in general is a sound approach – after all, history is written by the victors. And libertarians of the past should not be ashamed of discussing controversial topics. The revisionists were courageous people who were willing to revise dogma. But as a result, almost no historian (including David Irving) went over to the side of the revisionists – especially in recent decades. It looks suspicious (unless you believe in a conspiracy among historians). And, for example, the former revisionist Jean-Claude Pressac made a major contribution to Holocaust studies (I have not read his book, so I judge by other people’s opinions). Revisionism has been generally rejected by the mainstream. The Germanophiles were sometimes wrong about other things as well – the generally accepted number of victims of the bombing of Dresden turned out to be significantly less (although John Wear does not agree with it and wrote an article stating the opposite).
But now the state comes on the scene – in different countries – and prohibits free discussion. “Revision” of history is banned, people are in prison for their beliefs. Even if revisionism in general is wrong, I think you and I – as libertarians – would agree that an attack on free speech is a flagrant crime against human liberty. This is a ban on the free exchange of ideas. Probably, in the eyes of many, the revisionists look vicious and evil people – and few will stand up for them. However, freedom of speech requires protection. The US is an exception in this context.
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John Wear says:@kb_2
You write: “But as a result, almost no historian (including David Irving) went over to the side of the revisionists – especially in recent decades. It looks suspicious (unless you believe in a conspiracy among historians).”
My response: Any historian teaching at a university who openly contested the official Holocaust story would almost certainly lose their job. Freedom of speech is not allowed on this subject.
Also, if you were employed by a major corporation and wrote a book and articles similar to mine, you would also be in danger of losing your job. While the United States has the First Amendment, this does not prevent an employer from firing employees for contesting the so-called Holocaust.
You write in comment #1510: “Of course, the question arises whether there are testimonies of those who then found their relatives (you say they are absent) – and this is a serious issue for the revisionists. They still need to be shown where all these people are (I doubt they will succeed – but I’m ready to reconsider my opinion).”
My response: Germar Rudolf on pages 48-53 of the 4th edition of his book “Lectures on the Holocaust” discusses Jewish survivors of the “Holocaust” who found their lost relatives after the war. It has happened in many hundreds of cases.
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Mark Bahner says:
My response: Zyklon B was typically used in execution gas chambers in the United States. However, Zyklon B can not be effectively used for the mass executions of humans.
In March 1992, a prominent Austrian engineer named Walter Lüftl made headlines when a report he had written stated that the stories of mass extermination of Jews in gas chambers at Auschwitz and Mauthausen are impossible for technical reasons and because they are incompatible with observable laws of nature. At the time of his report, Lüftl was a court-recognized expert engineer who headed a large engineering firm in Vienna.
John, Walter Lüftl is a joke. And how can I know this without even checking into the subject? I know because I know for certainty…to a 99.99+ percent probability, that many hundreds of thousands of people were murdered using Zyklon B at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
The reference you cite is: Lüftl, Walter, “The Lüftl Report,” The Journal of Historical Review, Vol. 12, No. 4, 395-401.
I know that seems impressive to you, but The Journal of Historical Review is a joke. It’s not a legitimate, peer-reviewed, historical journal. It’s like a (hypothetical) journal titled, “Journal for Young Earth Studies” that publishes articles centered exclusively around why the earth is 6000 years old.
It is a historical fact beyond legitimate scientific dispute there were seven places at Auschwitz-Birkenau with gas chambers at one time or another at Auschwitz-Birkenau:
https://www.auschwitz.org/en/history/auschwitz-and-shoah/gas-chambers/
You won’t find any peer-reviewed historical journal articles that claims there weren’t those seven places at Auschwitz-Birkenau that were used for mass executions (i.e. more than 100 people at a time) using Zyklon B that you won’t find a peer-reviewed journal article that claims the earth may actually be only 6000 years old.
I think, deep down, even you know you’re wrong. I think even you know homicidal gas chambers existed in Auschwitz-Birkenau. That’s why you keep dodging the question of whether the Germans tried to keep Hungarian Jewish families together to live at Auschwitz-Birkenau or other camps in 1944. I think, deep down, you know the Germans used homicidal gas chambers employing Zyklon B to murder over 100,000 Hungarian Jews in 1944.
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Mark Bahner says:@kb_2
But now the state comes on the scene – in different countries – and prohibits free discussion. “Revision” of history is banned, people are in prison for their beliefs.
Yes, I agree that it’s very wrong to put people in prison for writing or saying things they think are true, no matter how wrong they are. So I don’t think there should be criminal laws for writing or saying things people think are true.
But I am huge fan of civil laws like those that allowed the parents of the children who were murdered in Sandy Hook Elementary School to sue the serial liar and piece of human excrement, Alex Jones, for defamation, when he falsely claimed that their children really weren’t murdered:
https://www.jan-6.com/alex-jones-texts?gclid=EAIaIQobChMImMvvzYnw_wIV6S3UAR3fdgTUEAAYAiAAEgIO1PD_BwE
And I’m an even bigger fan of criminal laws against perjury for witnesses who knowingly state falsehoods under oath. So if Alex Jones made any deliberately false statements under oath at his civil trial–which he appropriately lost–then I think he should be prosecuted and imprisoned for perjury.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Wizard of Oz
You are entitled to your opinion.
The fact of the matter is, if you make a claim in an affidavit, such as, I am a doctor, I am a chemist, I am an engineer, etc., you must provide a method for verification, such as the school/university where studied, the firm/clinic of practice, etc. You can’t just say, “I’m a doctor”, and leave it at that. How do we know it’s truthful? Dr. Bendel “testified” he was born in Romania and currently resided in France, but the document is written in English; if the claim was made in the US, and he was an American, studied in America, etc, there would be no issue on translation. Was it properly translated? Without ALL of the elements described herein, and previously described, the affidavit would be tossed out.
Written testimony is used in lieu of oral testimony, whether by affidavit or deposition, and there are rules/protocols to assure, to the degree possible, the affiant/witness is who he says he is, as there is no cross examination aspect to refute his statements.
For the record, I was not comparing peanuts to poisons; I was merely asserting that humans have different tolerances for different exposures to irritants, allergens, and sometimes poisons. If you want to kill up to 2500-3000 people, within 4-5 minutes, AS CLAIMED, you must use a lethal substance that no one is likely to survive or linger on for longer than 5 minutes. This is my speculation, based on reasonable thinking.
The insults may be childish, but they were funny, in my opinion, which I am also entitled to have. And, he did wail about how mean we were to not care about the victims, apparently by wondering how 3000 corpses can be pulled around with a cane, stuffed in an elevator and incinerated in one day. He also defended his position by citing Schindler’s List as evidence. What can I say? It was very funny.
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Truth Vigilante says:@fufu
EffU-EffU writes:
Germans wanted to kill as many Jews as possible but they were clumsy and therefore some Jews survived.
If it was solely due to clumsiness, how is it that the vast majority of French Jews not only survived the war, but DID NOT EVEN LEAVE FRANCE to be deported east to these mythical ‘extermination camps’ ?
Are you claiming that it slipped the attention of the Germans that hundreds of thousands of French Jews remained unscathed and unmolested during the entire four years of German occupation ?
(Refer to the article below titled ‘How three-quarters of French Jews survived the Holocaust’):That headline is very misleading because something like well in excess of 95% of Jews that were actually French nationals, survived the war.
From the article above:Of the roughly 320,000 Jews established in France at the start of the war, an estimated 74,150 – most of them foreign nationals – were deported by Nazi Germany with the complicity of its allies in the Vichy regime, according to data compiled by the renowned French historian and Nazi hunter Serge Klarsfeld.
In other words, of the 320,000 Jews in France at the beginning of the war, around 74,000 were Jews from FOREIGN NATIONS that were temporarily residing there, and these were the ones that were deported east to the work camps.
In other words, the approx 246,000 Jews that were French citizens, WERE NEVER DEPORTED.
These French Jews overwhelmingly survived the war – other than for the countless thousands that were killed by ALLIED bombing* alongside all the other non-Jewish French civilians that the Anglo Zionist empire murdered during their indiscriminate bombing campaign.(*The Americans and British dropped SEVEN TIMES MORE TONNAGE OF BOMBS ON FRANCE during WWII than the Germans dropped on Britain).
So Mr EffU-EffU, if the Germans had really been intent on killing as many Jews as possible, how do you explain that they allowed the French Jews to remain where they were for the entirety of the war?
SUMMARY: Your flimsy hypothesis and that of the other Holohoaxers, that the Germans intended to genocide the small hats, has no basis in truth.
Once again John Wear has hit the nail on the head (as he invariably does), when he says:
‘The Germans …. certainly could have murdered virtually all of the Jews under their control if they had a policy of genocide against the Jews’.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “John, Walter Lüftl is a joke.”
My response: Walter Lüftl is not a joke. Lüftl was a court-recognized expert engineer who headed a large engineering firm in Vienna.
You write: I think, deep down, even you know you’re wrong. I think even you know homicidal gas chambers existed in Auschwitz-Birkenau.
My response: In my opinion, homicidal gas chambers did not exist at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
One reason I think homicidal gas chambers did not exist at Auschwitz-Birkenau is that no holes, small chimneys or other openings existed in the alleged homicidal gas chambers at Birkenau.
At the 1988 Ernst Zündel trial, Kenneth R. Wilson was tendered as an expert in photogrammetry, specializing in aerial triangulation, digital mapping and rectification of photographs. Wilson was asked by the defense to study aerial photographs of Birkenau and Auschwitz taken in 1944 by the Allies. Wilson determined that patches seen on the top of Kremas II and III were flat and did not have any elevation. Contrary to Henryk Tauber’s statement of four small chimneys above the gas chambers, none of the Allied aerial photographs indicated that there were any elevations on the roofs of Kremas II and III. (Source: Kulaszka, Barbara, (ed.), “Did Six Million Really Die: Report of Evidence in the Canadian ‘False News’ Trial of Ernst Zündel”, Toronto: Samisdat Publishers Ltd., 1992, p. 353).
The following is from the 2000 edition of the book “Dissecting the Holocaust” edited by Germar Rudolf:
“Regarding the evidence provided by Allied air photos, the reader is referred to the chapter by J.C. Ball in the present volume. Clearly this information suggests that either there were no input hatches on the roofs, or that these were so small that they did not show up on the air photos, so that probably someone deemed it necessary to resort to photo retouching in order to falsify the air photos accordingly.” (p. 344).
There are additional problems with the alleged homicidal gas chambers at Auschwiyz-Birkenau. The following is a brief outline of some of these problems from the 2000 edition of “Dissecting the Holocaust”:
1. “No less false are the times alleged for the ventilation of mortuaries 1 (the ‘gas chambers’) of crematoria II and III, since the witnesses proceeded on the mistaken assumption that a single air exchange would remove all the poison gas. The delay in the reduction of the remaining concentration of hydrogen cyanide means that in a realistic scenario the required ventilation time would exceed that recounted by the witnesses by a factor of 10 or more (diminished circulation due to the bodies, ‘short-circuit’ of air, aftergeneration of gas from the Zyklon B). As well, the problem of continued aftergeneration of gas from the remaining Zyklon B, which would have made it impossible to work within the chambers without protective clothing in anything less than 2 hours even with ongoing ventilation, also proves that the witnesses have not told the truth.” (p. 360).
2. “One must realize that near the alleged homicidal ‘gas chambers’ in Auschwitz there were highly efficient delousing facilities, with airlocks, heating, powerful ventilators etc., and all of them had been constructed prior to the alleged homicidal ‘gas chambers’. Further, at the time of construction of these alleged ‘gas chambers’ the technology for fumigating material objects had advanced greatly and the production of such facilities was in full swing. From everyday practical experience in delousing, the difference in time and material (Zyklon B) requirements between fumigations with and without air circulation will have been well-known. One might therefore expect the application of at least similar technological standards for the alleged homicidal gassing facilities, but clearly nothing even remotely approaching such standards was in fact used.” (p. 361).
3. “We will just comment briefly on the widely held belief that the poison gas entered the alleged execution ‘gas chambers’ via showerheads. In Zyklon B the active substance hydrogen cyanide is absorbed on the solid carrier substance, mainly gypsum, and is released only gradually. Since the poison is neither a liquid nor a gas under pressure, the hydrogen cyanide from this product could never have been channeled through narrow water pipes and showerheads. Any showers, real or fake, could thus only have served to deceive the victims, but never to introduce the poison gas. Even with all the arguing and dissension that characterizes the overall subject, there is a general consensus on this particular point.” (p. 361).
4. Rudolf concludes: “The examination of the formation and long-term stability of hydrogen cyanide residue in the walls of the facilities in question (‘gas chambers’ and delousing chambers for material objects), as well as the interpretation of the results of analysis of brick samples from these facilities in Auschwitz, have shown: 1. Hydrogen cyanide which reacts to form iron blue in the brick walls, etc. remains stable for many centuries. Its disintegration requires a time frame similar to that of the brickwork itself. Therefore, cyanide residue – if formed – ought still to be present in virtually undiminished quantities today, regardless of weathering effects. The outside walls of the delousing buildings BW5a/b in Birkenau, which are still blue on the outer surface today, as well as being high in cyanide content, serve to prove this. 2. Under such conditions as would actually be possible, the attested-to mass execution gassings with hydrogen cyanide probably would result in the rooms in question exhibiting cyanide residue on a similar scale as is the case in the disinfestation chambers for material objects, including the resultant blue discoloration of the walls. 3. In fact, however, the alleged ‘gas chambers’ exhibit only insignificant traces of cyanide residue, on the same order of magnitude as may be found in any other building. Therefore, it is my conviction that the only conclusion which can explain all factors involved is that in the facilities alleged, no mass gassings with Zyklon B can have occurred under the conditions attested to by alleged eyewitnesses, court witnesses, journalists, academics or other popularizers.” (p. 372).
So, there are numerous problems with the alleged homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau. In my opinion, homicidal gas chambers did not exist at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
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kb_2 says:@John Wear
You wrote:
“Any historian teaching at a university who openly contested the official Holocaust story would almost certainly lose their job.”
OK. But what about, for example, historians in Russia (my country), Belorussia and, let us say, China. What about private colleges in the US? Why, when the revisionist movement was not banned at the state level in the Europe, did it not attract massive support from historians?
In Russia there were several historians who supported Suvorov’s ideas or formally repudiate it but tried to develop similar themes. It was actively discussed in the 90s (of course, we also have many amateur researchers).
If there were people in Russia who thought that Stalin was to blame for the war (or that he was no better than Hitler), why didn’t they go further?
This is a serious question. One possible answer to this is that Holocaust revisionism does not meet the standard of evidence accepted in history. Perhaps they knew something from the history of World War II and Nazi Germany to consider it false. You brought another one (it can be expanded – to include, for example, an emotional component, etc.).
By the way, I have spent quite a lot of time studying the Shakespeare Authorship Question. If you are familiar with it, you might be interested in reading this little-known article: web.archive.org/web/20010820050030/http://www.elizreview.com/articles/chandler.htm
P.S I am now not taking into account the Arab countries, because they have serious conflicts with the Jewish people.
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Truth Vigilante says:@Mark Bahner
Mark ‘Mordechai’ Bahner-stein writes:
I know for certainty…to a 99.99+ percent probability, that many hundreds of thousands of people were murdered using Zyklon B at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
Your assertion above is proof that you’re a 100% ignorant moron.
The only thing the Holohoaxers have (let me repeat, the ONLY THING) that they can present as ‘evidence’, is the testimony of LYING JEWS (and Jews that have been manipulated into believing), who claim they saw the mythical gas chambers.
Some of those lying Jews appear in the video below – accompanied by more than a few honest Jews that told the truth about how places like Treblinka and Sobibor were indeed just transit stops where no one was murdered, but just places where Jews were transferred onto other trains bound for differing destinations:
https://archive.org/details/huntthechamber0000film
The video above is titled ‘The Jewish Gas Chamber Hoax (Documentary)’ and can be found at Internet Archive.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@fufu
Killing members of “nation A” is not the same as planning the mass genocide/extermination of members of “nation A.”
The fact that a very large number of Jewish people survived the war is indicative of no concerted effort at mass extermination. Hitler came to power in 1933; if extermination was his plan, would he/did he start killing immediately? He did remove Jews from positions of power/influence, but as far as I know, he did not execute them randomly.
There are Jewish inmates of the various camps who report on soccer fields, soccer games, orchestras, etc., or no visible evidence of large scale murders/gassing. These particular witnesses get very little attention.
It is impossible, in the context of this forum, to explain the multitude of circumstances/events and details about an occurrence spanning over ten years, which is the reason for a general statement, followed by a link to a more detailed analysis and source information, which apparently, no one bothers to follow. At some point, I speculate, he doesn’t bother to cite sources as no one does the actual follow-up. I am speculating, of course, and not speaking on behalf of John Wear.
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John Wear says:@kb_2
You write: “What about private colleges in the US?”
My response: It does not matter if the college is public or private. Any historian teaching at a university in the United States who openly contested the official Holocaust story would almost certainly lose their job. This would also apply to European countries and Canada. Freedom of speech is not allowed on this subject.
In regard to Russia, China, and Belorussia, I don’t know for sure. I know that David Duke earned his PhD in history from the largest university in Ukraine. So, free speech is probably allowed on this subject there.
However, except for these few countries and the Arab countries, most historians who question the so-called Holocaust will potentially lose their jobs.
You write: “This is a serious question. One possible answer to this is that Holocaust revisionism does not meet the standard of evidence accepted in history.”
My response: You seem to be a reasonably intelligent and open-minded person. I suggest you make that determination yourself. I recommend that you read Germar Rudolf’s 4th edition of his book “Lectures on the Holocaust,” which was published this year. This is the book I most recommend for a person who is relatively new to the subject. This book can be purchased at https://castlehill.shop/product/lectures-on-the-holocaust-4th-ed/.
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Mark Bahner says:@littlereddot
So after a decade after the modified basketball court was abandoned, I would be able to look at the wood frame, and waterproofing sealant and surmise that it would have been suitable for a skating. This is what I mean by tell tale signs.
No, the Nazis dismantled then blew up Crematoriums II through IV, that each contained the crematorium, gas chamber, and undressing room.
Didn’t you read everything that I wrote? I wrote:
The important part of this idea is that, at the end of the winter, you take away the 2″ x 4″ frame (and scrape away the elastomeric sealant)…and nobody would every guess a basketball court was used (in the dead of winter) as an ice skating rink!
That’s exactly analogous to what the Nazis did (well except for the blowing up part). The Nazis dismantled and took away some of the evidence, and blew up the rest.
And that the HARDER THEY TRY TO CONVINCE ME, THE MORE SUSPICIOUS I BECOME OF THEM.
So the more evidence you have that there were gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau that were used to murder hundreds of thousands of people, the less you believe that evidence? Isn’t that pretty much the exact opposite of the logical approach?
Think about this: Over 400,000 Hungarian Jews arrived at Auschwitz-Birkenau in May through July 1944. Probably more than 80,000 of them were children.
Then, less than a year later (in January 1945, when the camp was liberated), less than approximately 10 percent of those 400,000 people–and virtually none of the 80,000 children–were still seen alive. If a majority of them were *not* gassed and their bodies burned, where did they go? If they were still alive when the camp was liberated in January 1945, why didn’t the Auschwitz-Birkenau camp contain say, 40,000-80,000 Hungarian Jewish children aged 12 years old or less?
I’m not sure whether I’ve exchanged comments with you about Occam’s Razor. There are so many commenters and so many comments, I forget. But you need to use Occam’s Razor on this:
Approximately 80,000 children under 12 go into Auschwitz-Birkenau from May-August 1944, and then in January 1945, virtually none of them can be found, alive or dead. We have photographs showing some of the Hungarian Jewish children on the train platform at Auschwitz-Birkenau. And we even have photographs of some of the children with their mothers–who also vanished–right outside the Crematoriums (that virtually everyone agrees also contained gas chambers) at Birkenau.
What does Occam’s Razor tell you is the simplest explanation for that? Suppose someone told you:
1) From the train platform, or the woods near the crematoriums, they were forced to go to either Crematorium II, III, IV, V (or Bunker 1 or 2), take off all their clothes for “showers”, then murdered with Zyklon B, and their bodies burned in either Crematoriums II, III, IV, and V, or in “burn pits” constructed near Crematorium V, specifically for burning their bodies. Then their ashes were spread in the nearby Vistula River:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vistula … or,
2) They walked back from the woods near the crematoriums (which also have been testified in numerous courts to have contained gas chambers), and got back on the train and were given rides by the Germans to other camps, or
3) They stayed in Birkenau with their families, and all 80,000 children (and their mothers) happened to die of typhus or some other disease, in the time between May 1944 and January 1945, then their bodies were burned in the crematoriums (or the burn pits), or
4) They were transported to Hiroshima or Nagasaki, right to ground zero, and their bodies were obliterated when the atomic bombs were dropped on those unfortunate people, or
5) They entered another dimension, so they’re now invisible to us, or
6) Some other explanation (help me out if you’ve got one!).
Occam’s Razor tells you to look for the *simplest* explanation for 80,000 missing Hungarian Jewish children (and their mothers) who vanished from July 1944 to January 1945. Which of those five explanations is the *simplest* explanation?
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HdC says:@Mark Bahner
You wrote: “I know because I know for certainty…to a 99.99+ percent probability, that many hundreds of thousands of people were murdered using Zyklon B at Auschwitz-Birkenau.”
I doubt very much that you ever were a ptofessional engineer, writing assertions like that. Perhaps a “sanitation engineer”, collecting household refuse?
• Agree: Al Liguori• LOL: Tiptoethrutulips• Replies: @Mark BahnerAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
fufu says:@Tiptoethrutulips
#1520 Tiptoethrutulips
“The fact that a very large number of Jewish people survived the war is indicative of no concerted effort at mass extermination. “
Jews survived only because Germans lost the war. Germans didn’t have time to kill all Jews and Slavs.
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@Tiptoethrutulips
Regarding Al Liguori, he is certainly clear about his opinion on Judea. But, is he completely inaccurate? I don’t think he is; I think his vitriol is more likely from frustration, and while I have not read everything he asserts, I don’t recall any calls for actual violence against Jews. My guess is he would prefer to scoop all the Jews up and drop them safely into Israel; for all eternity, never again to reside among western people.
To be clear, I think we must return to the controls used effectively by Christendom for a millennium. Those controls were not perfect, but did limit the worst excesses of the Jews. Details here: https://judaism.is/the-church-on-the-jews.html
Before that can be done, justice must be done, hence a Catholic action plan: https://judaism.is/catholic-action.html
• educate the world about the fundamentally genocidal Master Race tenets of Judaism, the history inspired by that Jewish supremacism, and the future they have planned for us: http://judaism.is/chand.html and http://judaism.is/kabbalah.html
• apprehend all perpetrators and accomplices of crimes against humanity, including economic crimes against humanity—accomplices, enablers, agitators, enforcers, mouthpieces, talking heads, puppets, middle management, political prostitutes, change agents, and other shabbos goyim
• prosecute the perpetrators and accomplices in fair and open trials
• punish the guilty
• repatriate all ill-gotten gains, especially what has been stolen by usury, bribery, and other fraud by dynastic looters
• leave the innocent alone! Remember though that there are many ways that one may make oneself an accomplice to the Jews’ crimes against humanity: by counsel, by command, by consent, by provocation, by praise, by silence, by assistance, by concealment, by defending or excusing the crimes.Facts are not emotions. Facts are not “love.” Facts are not “hate.” Facts are not “vitriol.” To impute emotions to facts is a stereotypical Jewish tactic born of their inability to dispute incontrovertible facts, relying as Fran does upon faked evidence, lies, distractions, whataboutism, talmudized dounle-standard kangaroo courts, etc.
That said, I do lampoon Fran’s worst hypocrisies—refusing to condemn crimes against humanity while decrying exposure of those crimes—whining about “personal attacks” while engaging in personal attacks, including death threats. Chabad Fran epitomizes the worst traits of Judaism and Jews, everything from genocide to perversion and her degenerate “art.” See my post above. There are even moments when I wonder if Chabad Fran is a Nazi bot designed to bring opprobrium upon Satan’s Chosen.
If I had only a “second choice,” I sure wouldn’t ruin the Holy Land; I’d consider Pitcairn Island, no neighbors, no connection to the outside world, a more effective ghettoization than even Christendom enforced.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Wizard of Oz
I’m not sure the paragraph to which you are referring.
Regarding photographs for evidence, they can be legitimately altered, i.e., magnified, change in exposure to reveal details; but you must provide the original image, to verify the nature of the enhancement and avoid accusations of tampering with evidence.
Did I refer to Zyklon-b as bug spray? Yes. Was that an appropriate comparison? No. Did I state insecticide can kill people? Yes. Did I claim any expertise in chemistry/poisons? No. Do people survive poisonous gas exposure? Yes. Would I cite my peanut analogy in a proper legal hearing? No. Did Mark Bahner employ the tactic of appeals to emotion/sorrow, or lack thereof, in his arguments? In my opinion, yes. Is a reference to a Hollywood movie a proper defense? No. Am I a smart ass, sometimes? Yes. Would I pop off in a court of law? No. Would I have stopped Dario Gabbai’s interview immediately upon his inability to speak on routine Jewish customs/traditions after claiming he grew up in a Jewish family in a Jewish community? Yes, and I would have sent him back to Holocaust Indoctrination Studies, 101. Do you have any further inquiries? Yes or No?
Speculation springs eternal around here, with a few exceptions. Speculation leads to people pointing out why one is wrong or ridiculous. Which is fine by me. If you want answers, you must ask questions. If you are speculating, at least you are pondering on something. Speculation, typically, proves nothing, and I never claimed otherwise.
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Mark Bahner says:@HdC
Yes, I’m a retired mechanical engineer and environmental engineer who worked primary in the area of air pollution.
What is *your* background?
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@fufu
Germans didn’t have time to kill all Jews and Slavs.
Understand the implication of what you just asserted. The Germans didn’t have the time—or resources—to kill any “millions” of Jews and Slavs and the Germans certainly didn’t have the time—or resources—to hide the remains of any “millions” of Jews and Slavs.
World Jewry declared global holy war on Germany in 1933. World Jewry had already murdered millions in Russian and other European revolutions. Germans died in Jewish revolutions in Germany, the Berlin Spartacist revolution and Bavarian Socialist Republic. The Jews were—and still are—the perpetrators, not the “victims.”
In view of the 60-80 million Gentiles who died in the war that the Jews started, I say they are damn lucky that fewer than 130,000 of them died in a war they started. The Jews received far less than their crimes against humanity deserved. Look at what Nuland, Kagan, Blinken, Zelensky, Soros and sons, and the rest of the (((neocons))) are doing today to gin up the Third World War that they have envisioned and planned for centuries. Read about their Kabbalistic theology of genocide and “moshiach”: http://judaism.is/kabbalah.html Amongst themselves they speak quite freely of the things they deny to our faces. See also how Fran’s Chabad fits into these plans: http://judaism.is/chabad.html
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littlereddot says:@Mark Bahner
As I said, I can only form an opinion on what evidence I see before me.
Now do I correctly understand that you are saying that there were 5 crematoria, of which Crematorium 1 and 5 were not destroyed and did not contain the gas chamber facilities.
Crematoria 2, 3, and 4 contained gas chambers but these were destroyed.
Is this what you are saying?
Forgive me for appearing curt, but I am a product of my culture. In my culture, we do not appreciate lots of fluff. We appreciate direct, to the point form of communication. When something is described as “short and sharp”, that is high praise where I come from.
This may be a reason why I choose not to wade through volumes of anecdotal “he says, she says”. I prefer to cut to the chase and examine the hard facts like plans or photos.
For the sake of clarity, this is an example of what i consider anecdotal “he says she says”.
So the more evidence you have that there were gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau that were used to murder hundreds of thousands of people, the less you believe that evidence? Isn’t that pretty much the exact opposite of the logical approach?
Think about this: Over 400,000 Hungarian Jews arrived at Auschwitz-Birkenau in May through July 1944. Probably more than 80,000 of them were children.
Then, less than a year later (in January 1945, when the camp was liberated), less than approximately 10 percent of those 400,000 people–and virtually none of the 80,000 children–were still seen alive. If a majority of them were *not* gassed and their bodies burned, where did they go? If they were still alive when the camp was liberated in January 1945, why didn’t the Auschwitz-Birkenau camp contain say, 40,000-80,000 Hungarian Jewish children aged 12 years old or less?
I’m not sure whether I’ve exchanged comments with you about Occam’s Razor. There are so many commenters and so many comments, I forget. But you need to use Occam’s Razor on this:
Approximately 80,000 children under 12 go into Auschwitz-Birkenau from May-August 1944, and then in January 1945, virtually none of them can be found, alive or dead. We have photographs showing some of the Hungarian Jewish children on the train platform at Auschwitz-Birkenau. And we even have photographs of some of the children with their mothers–who also vanished–right outside the Crematoriums (that virtually everyone agrees also contained gas chambers) at Birkenau.
What does Occam’s Razor tell you is the simplest explanation for that? Suppose someone told you:
1) From the train platform, or the woods near the crematoriums, they were forced to go to either Crematorium II, III, IV, V (or Bunker 1 or 2), take off all their clothes for “showers”, then murdered with Zyklon B, and their bodies burned in either Crematoriums II, III, IV, and V, or in “burn pits” constructed near Crematorium V, specifically for burning their bodies. Then their ashes were spread in the nearby Vistula River:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vistula … or,
2) They walked back from the woods near the crematoriums (which also have been testified in numerous courts to have contained gas chambers), and got back on the train and were given rides by the Germans to other camps, or
3) They stayed in Birkenau with their families, and all 80,000 children (and their mothers) happened to die of typhus or some other disease, in the time between May 1944 and January 1945, then their bodies were burned in the crematoriums (or the burn pits), or
4) They were transported to Hiroshima or Nagasaki, right to ground zero, and their bodies were obliterated when the atomic bombs were dropped on those unfortunate people, or
5) They entered another dimension, so they’re now invisible to us, or
6) Some other explanation (help me out if you’ve got one!).
Occam’s Razor tells you to look for the *simplest* explanation for 80,000 missing Hungarian Jewish children (and their mothers) who vanished from July 1944 to January 1945. Which of those five explanations is the *simplest* explanation?
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Fran Taubman says:
You have been rejected by every Christian church, including the Catholic Church who rejects all of your ideas about Jews. All of your condemnations all of your suggestions. The Catholic Church would throw you out of the church on your ears if they knew your true identity.
You do not represent Christianity or humanity. You are a mentally ill person speaking about your own hatred, with cartoons and memes about Jews. You belong to nothing sacred or religious group. None. You are a solo Jew hater with a fake Christian identity.Who really are you? What is your name? Scared of what if you are a true Christian. I post under my real name as a proud Jewess. You are a fake.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
My response: What John Wear said.
And, I am 99.99999% sure he is accurate.
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Wizard of Oz says:@Tiptoethrutulips
I am again not wasting my time reading more than your opening confusion wherein you write of affidavits and testimony when all that we have is a pretty suggestive potential witness statement taken down by some more or less competent clerk or perhaps a lawyer. True, it is not in itself an adequate proof of anything but if it is found amongst a lot of potential witness statements apparently taken and recorded in the same way which are not such as to put its veracity in question the tendency of the light it throws on the facts is clear enough to make it reasonable to regard the burden of proof shifted a little in favour of requiring reasons to reject it asevidence of the truth. You could start by searching for evidence that there was no such Romanian Dr Bendl. And that there was no other medical or other student of the right age and name who might have talked his way into posing as a doctor. That would be what counsel assisting a commission of inquiry might start on. After which he might look wider to find out what language or languages the questioning was conducted in, how competent any interpreter was, what Romsnia or other idioms may have been misunderstood. And so on if it was known that there would be a lot of people like you carping in your criticisms of any pro Holocaust inferences drawn from such prospectively favourable material.
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Mark Bahner says:@Al Liguori
If I had only a “second choice,” I sure wouldn’t ruin the Holy Land; I’d consider Pitcairn Island, no neighbors, no connection to the outside world, a more effective ghettoization than even Christendom enforced.
Do you think Christ would have wanted his followers to forcibly remove Jewish people from their homes and take them to somewhere cut off from the rest of the world? Wouldn’t that be pretty bizarre, since he himself was Jewish?
But while on the subject of forcible removal, do you think Christ would have approved of forcibly removing Jews from their native lands like Hungary, and depositing them in prison camps (actually, in the case of Auschwitz, more “death camp” than “prison camp”)? If you do think Christ would have wanted that, what in Christ’s words in the New Testament lead you to that opinion?
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Mark Bahner says:@littlereddot
I prefer to cut to the chase and examine the hard facts like plans or photos.
And you can’t find them yourself? Did it ever occur to you to politely for help finding them (since clearly you’re the one who’s done virtually nothing yourself to find the truth about Auschwitz, and I think I know far more than anyone here about the subject)?
Here is a website with plot plans for Auschwitz I and Auschwitz II (Birkenau):
https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/gallery/auschwitz-maps
On that website, the Auschwitz II (Birkenau) plot plan is here:
a) Gas chambers 2 through 5 are numbers #2 through #5 on that plot plan.
b) The “cremation pyres” (also called “burn pits”) are shown as #6. Those were pits about 50 meters long, 5 meters wide, and 2 meters deep. There were nine of them at the height of the daily exterminations.
c) The “Provisional gas chambers 1 and 2” are items 14 and 15 on the plot plan.• Replies: @littlereddotAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Fran Taubman says:
There is only one reason to transport these Hungarian Jews to Auschwitz in the summer of 1944. As Eichmann said it was his duty to rid Europe of Jewry. That is the only reason. There is no other reason that makes any sense.
Gas’s prof doors, escape hatches, no homicidal gas rooms all bullshit. Pure made up fantasy ad Jew haters.
They were not transported to be with their families, not to be transported somewhere else.
They were transported to Auschwitz to be gassed and incinerated in one of the 5 killing centers that was the massive killing center that was Auschwitz.Sales receipts for the killing equipment are available on line. You cannot fix Jew hatred or stupidity.
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Rurik says:@Patrick McNally
are you suggesting that NYC Jewish bankers did not fund Trotsky or the Bolsheviks?
the Bolsheviks were able to win. None of that was really determined by money from Germany, never mind New York.
so NYC Jewish bankers did not fund Trotsky or the Bolsheviks
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littlereddot says:@Mark Bahner
I have tried to be polite and patient with you in our interactions. However I find that it is going nowhere.
I have had to explain my position over and over again, but you do not seem to try to understand my point of view, but rather insist on trying to convert me to yours.
All the references you have given me, and my own research and given me nothing to convince me that these were indeed used as gas chambers.
Indeed, the more interaction I have with you, the less I believe about the Holocaust.
The latest example is the burn pits. If I ask the question were human remains found in the burn pits? The answer form Holocaust proponents will be “yes” because they will say that ashes would have been pounded into fine dust. Imagine that, people climbing into the pits, picking up every little bit of remains and pounding them into dust so that there will be no evidence. But never the simpler explanation that ashes from the crematoria were emptied there for expediencey … Very detail oriented and conscientious as we expect Germans to be.
3 out of 5 Crematoria had attached Gas Chambers, and these were blown up so that no evidence would be left…… Very detail oriented and conscientious as we expect Germans to be.
Are there any blueprints to show that the morgues were retrofitted to become Gas Chambers? ….. Oh, the Germans were so sloppy that they forgot to draw up blueprints or archive them.
Thank you, I think I have enough evidence now to form an opinion.
I now think it is more likely than not that the Holocaust is a hoax.
This being said, there is no more point for our continued discussion as both our patience is at the end. Our continued interaction will only lead to mutual insults.
I thank you for your civility and wish you well.
Goodbye.
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Fran Taubman says:@Rurik
Who funded the Romanovs? Who funded the Austrian Hungarian Empire? The Hapsburg’s? Not all bankers are Jewish in the world. The robber barons. J.p.Morgan.
There is way more to these wars than Jewish bankers. Like starving peasants. Keep playing Battle Cry. Or whatever video games you play that lines up all the black hats against all the white hats. Bankers supply money.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Tiptoethrutulips says:@Al Liguori
I didn’t mean to speak for you, actually, I was speaking to Fran’s inquiry about you. You do come across as quite bitter, justifiably so, in light of historical/current events, but as I am sure you know, they will use that against you rather than speak on the facts you provide. And, of course, sometimes you must fight fire with fire.
I appreciate the links, and I will bookmark for future perusal.
Regarding the claims made by Jews about what occurred in the camps, I was familiar with many such claims, but not all on your list. I would say their eagerness to vilify Germans and outlandish lies would normally be their downfall. No actual court would have allowed such obvious refutable evidence to be entered, unless the “judge” is/was a kangaroo.
Modern Christianity seems, to me, much more subservient than in the past. I’m sure the current pope sends you into fits of incredulity and anger, as he does for many, but, unfortunately, not enough.
Fran defends herself and her group, as expected, as she should, for the most part. I have Jewish friends I care for; I attended bar mitzvahs and brisses. Do I think they say things amongst themselves they won’t say to me? Maybe. Do they want to kill me and all their gentile friends? I don’t think so, but as far as I know, they’re not part of the organized Zionist Cabal, which I absolutely believe exists and is hostile and destructive. And whom they may inadvertently support. So, it’s a problem.
Fran’s group, i.e. ADL, SPLC, AIPAC, et al, can offer defenses; gentiles, in general, don’t/won’t/can’t. And, for me, that speaks volumes about where we are in the struggle. You are an exception, of course. And to be commended for placing your head on the chopping block.
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Rurik says:@Fran Taubman
Or whatever video games you play
are you being snide Franny?
I’m shocked, shocked
Are you also saying that NYC Jewish bankers did not fund Trotsky or the Bolsheviks?
Or that maybe they did. But what of it, huh.
It has as much consequence or significance in this world as Victoria Nuland spending five billion dollars promoting ‘democracy’ in Ukraine. Or spending hundreds of billions on the war.
Money is spent, people buy gas and groceries. Sometimes people promote “democracy”.
What of it?
Huh Franny?
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Wizard of Oz
I don’t know what to make of your mostly incoherent rant, except to say, it is impossible to explain all legal processes and protocols, including exceptions, agreements and court rulings, which could allow suspect evidence, thereby possibly becoming a basis for appeal, etc, and considering international laws/rules, etc. I can’t do it.
The Nuremberg trials were a farce, by any standard, of any country, with a reasonably intelligent populace. I think even the Lorax, of star bellied sneetches fame, would agree. I did, in fact, check on Dr. Bendel’s credentials; I contacted the Romanian/French translator and she confirmed Dr. Bendel attended the University of Thneed-Ville, but there was a bit of controversy, as Dr. Bendel participated in all that tree chopping, and was expelled. Ms. Translator elected to exclude that information, for obvious reasons.
In my opinion, the above story is actually more believable than the official narrative. Just my opinion, of course.
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HdC says:@Mark Bahner
Nuclear and hydro power. Recovery boilers.
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HdC says:@Fran Taubman
Holy hell, now we have a Jewess pontificating on Catholicism!
Interesting change in theme for her; she could not prevail on the theme of cremation, thus she tries a subject where she thinks that caterwauling and vigorous arm waving may prevail.
Methinks the silver soldering and brazing fumes have affected her most seriously.
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kb_2 says:@John Wear
Thank you. But I have read a russian translation (perhaps, another edition) a decade ago. It’s an interesting book. By the way, I’m unlikely to be able to buy anything in this store due to the unavailability of foreign payment systems in Russia).
But I just downloaded new version from HH website (https://holocausthandbooks.com/dl/15-loth.pdf) and opened on few random pages. And I find some revisionist claims questionable. On pp 184-186 Rudolf discuss how much victims (both sexes including children) can be gased in the gas chamber:
In the Morgues #1 of Crematories II and III, which had a surface area of roughly 210 m² (2,260 sq ft), at least 1,000 victims are said to have been executed at a time. Other witnesses speak of 2,000 or even up to 3,000 victims.
2100/210 = 10 people/m^2.
He makes a remark (about the room where people undress):
Experience shows that people do not pack themselves tightly to the very edge of an enclosed area – unless, of course, they are quite willing to do so, like when they enter a bus and need to fill it tightly, so that other passengers can still get in.
Rudolph makes a drawing of a filled chamber and says
As you can see, already a “mere” 1,680 persons would pack the room as tightly as
sardines in a can. This is impossible to achieve without the willing, even eager and
skillful, disciplined cooperation of all.1680/210 = 8 people/m^2
So how did they get these 1,000 naked people to pack themselves tightly together,
touching other completely naked strangers? , I don’t think that fear and even panic can ccomplish more than cooperative discipline. After all, the SS men could not possibly go with the victims into the chamber and threaten them somehow in there. I think indeed that the entire scenario in and of itself is quite absurdThis reasoning (which I have greatly reduced) is
a) unconvincing psychologically – if you force people to enter the room faster, they will simply put pressure on each other – like in the subway at rush hour – and this does not require special discipline (but Rudolf thinks that “Not even that works most of the time”)
b) highly doubtful from a practical point of view. Charles D. Provan wondered how many people could fit in a gas chamber and set up an experiment: http://holocaust.skeptik.net/documents/provan_gerstein.htmlHe placed 7 people (3 adults, 4 children – age 2,4,6,8) + big doll in an area of 21 inches by 21 inches = 0.53 m x 0.53 m <= 0.3 m^2. All people in this experiment kept their clothes. He added:
All of the seven people in my experiment were healthy and well nourished.
It is clear that in a war, people are likely to not eat very well and take up less space. In the photographs that Provan took, people are really VERY densely packed. Let’s estimate the number of people LOWER than Provan experimentally showed. For example, in 4 people at 0.3 m^2. This will give 4*210/0.3 = 2800 possible victims. A 1600 people could fit there quite “comfortably”.
In the book there is no reference to Provan, but instead an attempt is made to “expose” the testimony of witnesses based mainly on bad psychology. I have greatly abbreviated Rudolf’s words – you can read his reasoning in full in the Lectures. Forgive me for focusing on this – when I was reading Jurgen Graf’s book in Russian (also quite a while ago) and he was talking about the impossibility of putting a large number of people in the gas chamber, I made a simple calculation. And I came to the conclusion about the opposite (Provan also makes calculations).
Early in the book (pp. 26-33) Rudolf discusses references to 6 million Jews prior to World War II. A well-known revisionist theme.
This gives the impression that we are dealing with a constant in Jewish suffering,
the figure of six million.But how typical was the use of the number 6 million? Maybe it’s just a sampling artifact. See the table in this article (I haven’t read the Heddesheimer’s book): https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2020/05/on-heddesheimers-first-holocaust.html
To be fair, Rudolf mentions the point of view that 6 million is the number of Jewish population in some lands. He also points to references to 5 million and 2 million, but somehow weaves them into his narrative. In any case, the discussion of this number in the current edition seems intriguing but unconvincing and incomplete (given that the blog entry appeared in 2020).
I am not writing this to attack Rudolph or the revisionists – although I am not satisfied with the relevant passages, in my opinion there is no scientific misconduct here. However, I hope this helps to understand why not everyone who has read Rudolph will take his point of view (especially since revisionist theory has a hole of at least ~million people).
P.S I hope that I will get around to reading in full the book written by HC bloggerrs and the answer written by Mattogno et al. – but it’s very big stuff = 500 + 1500 pp. It’s unlikely to happen anytime soon.
P.P.S By the way, you may be interesting to know that one important book written against the revisionists was (as I know) mainly ignored by them (except for a few mentions). It’s John C. Zimmerman’s “Holocaust Denial: Demographics, Testimonies and Ideologies”. I did not read it in detail – because I did not read, for example, Sanning. As I can see it’s quite expensive on Amazon – so I give you a link to russian version: https://www.jewniverse.ru/RED/Ostrowski_Zim/
P.P.P.S The site cut off my link to the Shakespeare authorship article – it ends with the extension “htm” (chandler.htm)
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kb_2 says:@Al Liguori
I would not like to enter into disputes with you, but from the outside it seems that you are forgetting that the Jews are not a completly monolithic group. This people, like any other, unites many people with different views and goals. Among them there are adherents not only Judaism but of Buddhism and Christianity, and many of Jewish are atheists.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_atheism :
Contrary to popular belief, the term “Jewish atheism” is not a contradiction because Jewish identity encompasses not only religious components, but also ethnic and cultural ones
Of course, there is a Jewish culture, and the Jewish people are indeed very different from others in some respects.
But among the Jews there are janitors and couriers, scientists and doctors. There are people who do not try to rule the world (if someone tries), but simply live for their own pleasure. Of course, many of them are patriots (as in other nations). And I am sure that among them there are a lot of those who consider other people as people.
When someone commits a crime or plans a conspiracy, he has a specific first and last name. So every time you say “Jews” you have to add “many” or “some” to it.
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Mark Bahner says:@littlereddot
Indeed, the more interaction I have with you, the less I believe about the Holocaust.
Did you ever even consider reading “Anatomy of the Auschwitz Death Camp,” edited by Yisrael Gutman and Michael Berenbaum?
It’s more than 600 pages, and contains the six parts and 29 chapters, with chapters written by experts including: Jean-Claude Pressac, Robert-Jan Van Pelt, Franciszek Piper, Raul Hilberg, Martin Gilbert, and more than 10 others.
Are there any blueprints to show that the morgues were retrofitted to become Gas Chambers?
That’s why I directed you to the book…so you’d be less ignorant. Obviously, I haven’t come close to reading and digesting 600+ page book with probably 3000 footnotes and references, but this reference #43 on page 179, in the chapter on “Gas Chambers and Crematoria”, is intriguing:
43. In a Bualeitung letter of March 6, 1943, mortuary 2 was referred to as “undressing room” (Auskleiderraum). In another letter, one of the underground mortuaries was designated as “gas celler” (Vergasungskeller); ASAM, Trial of Hoess, vol. 11, card 9; microfilm 1060, card 100. Hoess confirms that the underground spaces at crematoria II and III served as the undressing rooms and the gas chambers and were outfitted with automatic ventilation systems.
So sometime between when the initial plans started to be drawn up, circa October 1941, and March 1943, the buildings appears to have changed in purpose from conventional mortuaries and crematoriums, to undressing rooms, gas chambers, and crematoriums.
Thank you, I think I have enough evidence now to form an opinion.
I now think it is more likely than not that the Holocaust is a hoax.
What evidence do you have that Auschwitz was *not* a place where many thousands of people were murdered with gas, and then their bodies burned?
This being said, there is no more point for our continued discussion as both our patience is at the end. Our continued interaction will only lead to mutual insults.
My patience is not at an end. I’ll admit that it’s very frustrating to me to have you dismiss my efforts to help you see the truth. Particularly since you’re an architect who obviously has substantial expertise…in that you identified that the original purpose probably was a conventional mortuary and crematorium.
If you really want to know the truth about Auschwitz…and the *whole, long, long truth, then that book is where you should go. Or I can feed you little bits, but I’d much rather you read that book, and then come back in what I think is the incredibly unlikely event that you think that Auschwitz-Birkenau did not have homicidal gas chambers.
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@Fran Taubman
Fran offers the standard “all Jews/some Jews” straw man:
Not all bankers are Jewish…
From a review here: https://www.unz.com/article/review-of-the-jewish-onslaught-dispatches-from-the-wellesley-battlefront/
Martin makes an interesting point about the logic of “some Jews.” When Jews are forced to admit some collective failing, they insist that blame cannot be assigned to “the Jews,” but only that “some Jews” did this or that. …What the Jews have established, at least in terms of acceptable historiography of the Jews themselves, is that when we speak of laudable characteristics, we may speak of “the Jews”; yet when we speak of not-so-laudable characteristics or activities that are deplorable, we must speak only of “some Jews.” Only the good sticks to all, the bad is relegated to a few bad apples.
Every regular reader here knows that Fran would not object to anyone saying, “The Japanese bombed Pearl Harbor,” but here she is objecting to evidence about the Jews. Apparently she is just another ignoranus [sic] who rejects synecdoche.
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Mark Bahner says:@HdC
Nuclear and hydro power. Recovery boilers.
For me:
Bachelor’s degree mechanical (Va Tech), then: advanced coal-fired boilers, nuclear power*, municipal waste-to-energy plants, then:
Master’s degree environmental (air pollution option), then: research on a novel electrostatic precipitator (got paid, AND did my master’s thesis…sweet deal!); air pollution consulting work (including stack testing…not a sweet deal…bad, bad, stuff!);
…then 25+ years of research supporting regulatory development and R+D for the U.S. EPA; also much research on helping them develop their MARKAL (MARKet ALlocation) model of U.S. energy production and use, and related emissions.
Also, research to support Environment Agency Abu Dhabi…including extensive environmental reviews for the Barakah Nuclear Power plant (4 reactors totalling 5600 MW…dumping heat into the shallow and already dreadfully hot Persian Gulf…which Emiratis insist is the Arabian Gulf. What a mess. ;-)).
* P.S. That first stint on nuclear power was part of Babcock & Wilcox’s Nuclear Power Division in Lynchburg, VA (now it’s a Framatome building)…partially working on post-TMI modifications. (If you’re too young, you might not know that TMI was a B&W Nuclear Supply System.) The stories I could tell!
P.P.S. Oh! Too funny! My senior project was for design of a small hydroelectric dam. One of the four of us had an uncle or something who wanted to build a small hydroelectric dam on his property. I was about…40th in my class of 160. The guy who’s uncle wanted to build the thing was like 2nd or third in the class, and another clown I *think* was the guy who beat me out for a Cummins Diesel Engine job I wanted.
ANYWAY…this guy who’s SECOND IN OUR CLASS is saying we don’t need to build a dam, because the water running down the hill is going turn the turbine and generate the 5 kw that we wanted to produce. He was a peace-love-brussel-sprouts greenie, so he *wanted* it to work out that we didn’t need a dam. I think at one point I literally was almost shouting at him. “Don’t you even understand frickin’ Bernoulli’s equation, you ignorant twit?” It absolutely boggled my mind that a guy who’s 2nd in our class is so unbelievably ignorant in his senior year.
Plus, neither of those guys did anything to help on the final report, and the fourth guy and I pulled an all-nighter to finish it. That was actually my *first* (and last) all-nighter.
But I digress…
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John Wear says:@kb_2
You write: “P.P.S By the way, you may be interesting to know that one important book written against the revisionists was (as I know) mainly ignored by them (except for a few mentions). It’s John C. Zimmerman’s “Holocaust Denial: Demographics, Testimonies and Ideologies”.”
My response: John C. Zimmerman’s work is discussed by Carlo Mattogno in a more than 100-page section of the book “Auschwitz Lies: Legends, Lies, & Prejudices on the Holocaust.” Beginning on page 87 of the second edition of this book, Mattogno critiques Zimmerman’s work in the chapter titled “An Accountant Poses as Cremation Expert.”
Thanks for giving me the link to the 2023 edition of Germar Rudolf’s book “Lectures on the Holocaust.” Although I have a hard copy of this book, this link will allow me to reference sections of this book in future comments.
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kb_2 says:@John Wear
As far as I understand revisionists criticised only part of Zimmerman’s work (his articles).
You often mention different books – You can find new versions of many of these books on this site for free: https://holocausthandbooks.com/
See PDF button in “Online Reading and Download Options” section on concrete books’ pages.
I think it will be more convenient for you to discuss with PDF files at hand. However, not all books are available for downloading.
By the way, here is another little-known revisionist book that you might be interested in: http://www.samuelcrowell.com/wp-content/uploads/Sherlock-SamuelCrowelldotcom.pdf
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kb_2 says:@Al Liguori
You are right in the sense that people often use metaphors and simplifications instead of saying that “State X’s army, on the orders of the government of State X, which is supported by a (not very) large part of the population, attacked the territory/soldiers of State Y”. It’s okay as long as people use it in some limited way.
The trouble starts when people forget that it’s a metaphor. For example, when they think that if the Russians (the Russian army) attacked the Ukrainians (tried to forcefully change the Ukrainian government), then all Russians are bad, and that all Russians should be harmed. And that ALL Russians deserve to be hated. Or, for example, when people think that ALL Ukrainians are bad and should be punished (because they are traitors who have forgotten that they are Russians). Of course, an exception is often made for a few “good people” (friends), but only for them. One Ukrainian made an exception for Russians from Moscow (because he lived for some time in Moscow). I chose an example because I am Russian.
If you were to say that the Japanese organized both world wars, consider other peoples to be non-humans, have been preparing the arrival of the Antichrist for thousands of years, and so on … someone would point out to you that, in fact, not all Japanese are bad.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Those are impressive credentials, Mark Bahner.
How long did it take you to investigate, calculate, formulate, deduce and arrive at your brilliant thesis/argument of “Didn’t you watch Schindler’s List??” Or “They were all killed because I say so!”
You forgot to mention your internship at the Society for Snorts and Giggles, Brotherhood of Bloviators United, Virginia Chapter of Wailing Wall Wailers.
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HdC says:@Mark Bahner
My career path was much narrower.
Got my BASc degree as an adult student, from the University of Waterloo in Canada. My P.Eng. designation one year later, in Quebec.Was seconded to the nuclear reactor project group because of a unique set of skills. Several years later I was the project Engineer and Project Manager for this group, responsible for the timely completion and payments for schedule milestones, while meeting all contractual, technical, and jurisdictional requirements. (there is a lot of this for nuclear work!) All told I built 9 nuclear reactor assemblies, including 2 for export. Some of these assemblies were almost 600 tons shipping weight.
Upon completion of these projects I was assigned to the energy group hydraulic power turbines. As Manager of Manufacturing Engineering it was my and my department’s job to devise methods and procedures such that we were able to turn a profit. The last 4 Francis runners I built were welded up from cast 17-4 Ph stainless steel components and weighed over 200 ton.
When those projects ended I joined a corporation that, among many other things, revamped ancient paper mills to bring their emissions into line with state laws. This was largely achieved through custom designed Chemical Recovery Boilers. Big suckers, those things. Contract terms and conditions were a really big part of this job.
When that work ended I worked for a number of small businesses helping them get their act together with scheduling, invoicing, delivery, and design for manufacturability.
Did the stress analysis for the cable hoists, winches and chain jacks (2,000 Ton lifting capacity) for a new floating oil production platform off the east coast of Canada. The customer required that these devices be registered with Lloyd’s Register of Shipping in London, England, who would not accept finite element stress analysis for this work. Yours truly crunched the numbers by hand and my report was accepted with the first submittal.
When I got tired of this I hung out my shingle and offered my services to the unsuspecting public, including one of the world’s largest auto makers, and steam generator builders, until I decided to retire along with my wife.
Had a most enjoyable retirement since then.
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Mark Bahner says:
Occam’s Razor tells us to look for the simplest explanation for something. We know that:
1) Approximately 437,000 Hungarian Jews arrived from from roughly May 15 to July 15, 1944 (we know that from transport documents);
https://budapestbeacon.com/the-hungarian-holocaust-started-70-years-ago-today/
2) In Russia in 1941, 37 percent of the population (72.1 million out of 195 million) were boys and girls under 16 years old. Let’s linearly estimate that the percentage under 12 is 12/16ths of that amount. That would be 28 percent of the population is composed of children under 12 years old. But let’s add an *additional* level of conservatism, and estimate that only 20 percent are less than 12 years old.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/1260605/soviet-population-changes-wwii-gender-age/
3) If we assume 20 percent of the 437,000 Hungarian Jews who arrived are children under 12, that makes approximately 87,000 children under 12 that arrived between May 15 and July 15, 1944.
4) When Auschwitz-Birkenau was liberated, there were only 500 children under 15 left in the camp:
https://www.auschwitz.org/en/history/fate-of-children/the-fate-of-the-children/
Let’s be very generous, and assume that 300 of those 500 children under 15 were Hungarian Jewish children under 12 years old.
5) That means that sometime between May-July 1944 and when the camp was liberated on 87,000 live children went down to 300 live children. That’s 87,000 – 300 = 86,700 children who disappeared.
What is the simplest explanation for what happened to those 86,700 children in approximately six months?
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Mark Bahner says:@HdC
Last off-topic comment in this area: These reactors were CANDU reactors?
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@kb_2
I would not like to enter into disputes with you, but from the outside it seems that you are forgetting that the Jews are not a completly [sic] monolithic group.
You simply re-phrased Chabad Fran’s “all Jews/some Jews” straw man argument.
Would you chastise me for saying, “The Japanese bombed Pearl Harbor”? Would you rush to advise me, “Not every Japanese was in a plane on December 7, 1941”? What foolishness.
Why do you refuse to understand synecdoche? Their machers (“big shots,” powerful Jews like banksters et al. http://judaism.is/kabbalah.html) are committed to their genocidal malevolent Kabbalistic agenda and most of the mockie Jews like Fran follow in lockstep. Other Jews make themselves accomplices by their refusal to condemn Jewish genocide and supremacism while reaping their rewards in nepotism.
If you haven’t read the evidence aggregated about this Kabbalistic agenda, it’s really pointless for you to converse with me. Start here: http://judaism.is/kabbalah.html , then see how this agenda has already led to two world wars and the third is spoolibng up: http://judaism.is/world-wars.html
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@John Wear
Is the statement about Otto Frank’s abuse of his daughter true?
Do you have an opinion on that?
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
I think you are invoking Occam’s Broom…..
or Occam’s Toupee• LOL: Al LiguoriAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
@Mark Bahner
Your pseudo-syllogistic fantasies are worthless. Try as you might, your imagination does not overcome your utter lack of evidence.
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John Wear says:@Tiptoethrutulips
You ask: “Is the statement about Otto Frank’s abuse of his daughter true? Do you have an opinion on that?”
My response: I have never heard of this allegation until this discussion thread. I have no opinion on this matter.
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@kb_2
In both the Old and the New Testaments, God named His enemy and the enemy of “all men” as a nation, a group—repeatedly!!!. Why may I not agree with God? http://judaism.is/covenants.html Believing and acting upon the Kabbalistic theology of genocide is a culpable free-will choice, not a matter of DNA. Being born a Russian is not a free-will choice.
If you carefully read what I posted above regarding Catholic action to remediate and prevent Jewish malevolence, you will see that I prescribe punishment for the guilty and their accomplices. I explicitly state “Leave the innocent alone.” Yes, there are innocents—but witness the tribal dynamic. It has become virtually impossible to criticize Soros (and sons) without some Yid complaining about “antisemitic dogwhistles.” Fran has no problem lumping Nazis together though many were simply draftees without any malevolence. It is hypocrisy for her to generalize about Nazis, while denying us the mirror image right to lump “the Jews” together.
When you play the “all Jews/some Jews” straw man game, you fall into their trap. If we cannot name the enemy, we are lost. I ask again, God named His enemy and the enemy of “all men” as a nation, a group—repeatedly!!!. Why may I not agree with God?
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Mark Bahner says:@Al Liguori
Your pseudo-syllogistic fantasies are worthless. Try as you might, your imagination does not overcome your utter lack of evidence.
Oh, you know where the 80,000+ Hungarian Jewish children under 12 went to?
P.S. I don’t know if you saw them, but I had some questions about what you think Christ would think about transporting Jews from their homes to slave labor camps…see comment #1533.
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
Mattogno critiques Zimmerman’s work in the chapter titled “An Accountant Poses as Cremation Expert.”
And the Hypocrite of the Year goes to……
….Carlo Mattogno! (Cheers, clapping.)
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Fran Taubman says:@Rurik
are you being snide Franny?
I am merely suggesting that history and people are much more nuanced with regards to good and bad than your black and white view. There were many competing monies being spent for different ideologies, thru out history. The idea that communism which was anti capitalism strikes me as odd that both were supported by Jewish bankers.
How can Jews be both communist and capitalist. The revolutions in Europe were all designed to overthrown the aristocratic feudal land systems. Where birth guaranteed wealth, land and status. The French revolution, the Russian revolution were designed to raise up to create a viable working class. This were are not Jewish ideologies supported by Jewish bankers for control of the universe. These were historical changes in the evolution of the human condition, after the enlightenment. The Reds beating the white Russians is inexplicable and crazy. I cannot understand to this day how that happened. My entire family both sides were from Russia, and 90% of Jews hated the Bolsheviks. They Jewish Bolsheviks did not support communism as Jews but as agnostics.
The above is a more nuanced view of history and events than you profess when you are culling people out to look for Jewish bankers behind all of the evil doers and controllers of power, They were not. In Medieval times there were kings and the vatican, all corrupt as can be.
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@Mark Bahner
Oh, you know where the 80,000+ Hungarian Jewish children under 12 went to?
What “80,000+ Hungarian Jewish children under 12”? As the lawyers say, “Assumes facts not in evidence.” Absent actual incontrovertible evidence your assumptions and imaginary syllogisms are worthless. Occam’s Razor actually leads to the conclusion that the Jewish Holocaust narrative is buncombe.
slave labor camps
Incarceration with access to swimming pools, theaters, orchestras, shops, alleged bordellos, and camp script to pay for purchases is hardly “slavery.” With about 30% of the inmates being disabled (and not executed!), your snarky claim of “slavery” is weakened even more. Since the Jews were primarily responsible for the African Slave Trade https://judaism.is/jews-and-blacks.html and are among the worst sex slavers in the world today, including child sex slavery (!) https://judaism.is/pedophilia-and-sodomy.html#pedopimps , do you really want to continue a discussion about “slavery”? Readers begin to understand what I mean when I say, “Jews are perpetrators, not ‘victims.’”
Jesus’ only act of physical violence was to whip the banksters of His day to eliminate the den of thieves from His Temple (Matthew 21:12-13). Nothing Jesus said prohibits self-defense or defense of innocent life. In view of that, I think it is perfectly Christian to incarcerate a declared and demonstrably murderous internal enemy. More of the Catholic theology on defense of innocent life here: https://judaism.is/disarming-goyim.html#summa
It’s interesting that you claim an engineering background. In my experience, engineers are honest and logical.
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Fran Taubman says:@Al Liguori
Most Jews hate George Soros. Most Jews hate Adam Schiff and think he should b in jail, with Coney and McCabe. The world of Jewry is not monolithic, politically, religiously, or in any unified front to take over the word. Jewish conspiracies, like the one where the Jews invented the Holocaust to manipulate the world for power, is purveyed by delusional, incredibly ignorant Jew haters. No one could invent or make up the Holocaust, it is impossible unless the Jews could magically control time to go back and arrange events prior to them happening. If I had 1/8th of that power I would have someone get up at 5 am and walk my dogs.
Al Liguori’s views on Jews and Judaism is psychotic, and no church or true Christians would ever support it. It is in essence hate speech. His memes on Jews are designed to frighten both Jews and non Jews into some twisted idea that the Jews are a satanic cult. Al is a part of an occult that is outcast by Catholicism and the Catholic church views as dangerous. Don’t deny Al that you are not some submerse Catholic, that Catholic’s hate, that the Vatican and Christians do not support. Don’t deny that I have the right to call you evil incarnate, and most of the Christian world will agree with me. You have no power in the world which is why you need to post your creepy bullshit memes of Jews.
From the ADL
Traditionalist Catholicism
Traditionalist Catholics reject the reforms of the Second Vatican Council that was held in the early 1960s, including Nostra Aetate, the papal document which declared that modern Jews bear no guilt for the death of Christ. The Vatican has also rejected the idea of supersessionism, or the dogma that with the coming of Jesus and the New Testament the Jews’ covenant with God was broken—but traditionalist Catholics continue to support this doctrine and believe that there is no salvation outside of the Catholic church. Partly as a result, some Traditionalist Catholic circles have continued to incorporate explicit antisemitism into their theology, and a number of them may be characterized by a paranoid belief in Jewish conspiracies to undermine the church and Western civilization, as well as other conspiracy theories that are prominent in right-wing extremist subcultures.For decades after its founding in 1970, the Society of St. Pius X (SSPX), which is the foremost global Traditionalist Catholic organization, continued to preach that contemporary Jews are responsible for deicide, endorsed the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, and claimed that there was a factual basis for the medieval blood libel. One of its bishops, Richard Williamson, is a well-known Holocaust denier. In recent years SSPX has moderated its position to some extent, and expelled Bishop Williamson. However, the Traditionalist Catholic movement continues to wrestle with antisemitism and a tendency towards extremism.
One prominent Traditionalist Catholic is filmmaker and antisemite Mel Gibson, whose film, The Passion of the Christ, attracted controversy over its graphic depiction of Jewish responsibility for the death of Jesus.
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Mark Bahner says:
What “80,000+ Hungarian Jewish children under 12”? As the lawyers say, “Assumes facts not in evidence.” Absent actual incontrovertible evidence your assumptions and imaginary syllogisms are worthless.
Do you agree that 437,000 Hungarian Jewish people were transported to Auschwitz starting in May and ending in July, 1944?
From Edmund Veesenmayer, Hitler’s plenipotentiary in Budapest:
1) June 13: 289,357 “transported to their destination” on 92 trains, each with 45 cars.
2) June 30: 340,162.
3) July 13: 437,402 taken “to their destination.
From page 465 of Anatomy of Auschwitz Death Camp, Gutman and Bernbaum, editors.
Jesus’ only act of physical violence was to whip the banksters of His day to eliminate the den of thieves from His Temple (Matthew 21:12-13).
Yes, they were in the Temple…not in their homes.
It’s interesting that you claim an engineering background. In my experience, engineers are honest and logical.
And I’ve never met any Catholic as filled with anger and hatred as you seem to be.
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littlereddot says:@Al Liguori
To my mind, to draw conclusions like that is like a trial where the Accused is charged with murder. The Prosecution’s case is based on a
1. witness consisting of a doorman who saw a woman enter the the Accused’s apartment. but never saw her leave. The police found no dead body, no murder weapon.
2. another witness consisting of the woman’s sister heard from the Victim that she had an argument with the Accused. This is being used as the “motive” for the murder.
3. Based on the above, the Prosecution argues on the principles Occam’s Razer that the only possible explanation was that the Accused murdered the woman and disposed of the body.The Prosecution never bothered to consider factors like:
a. The victim could have left the building while the doorman was not paying attention
b. The doorman is a known liar and had a grudge against the Accused
c. The Victim’s sister’s testimony is hearsay and one sided, and prone to inaccuracies and exaggerations.
d. The Victim’s sister is a known liar, and further wanted fame and publicity to further her own personal agenda.• Thanks: Al LiguoriAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
@Fran Taubman
Hilarious. As if the (((SPLC))) is a credible source? http://judaism.is/hate-pimps.html Anyone interested in the catastrophe called “Vatican 2,” read here: http://judaism.is/new-order-of-pharisees.html
20 State Attorneys General: ‘SPLC Has Been Utterly Discredited as a Reliable Source’
https://www.cnsnews.com/article/national/michael-w-chapman/20-state-ags-splc-has-been-utterly-discredited-reliable-sourceSPLC Attorney Among 23 ANTIFA Rioters Arrested On Domestic Terrorism Charges
“If Jurgens’ arrest says anything about the non-profit, it’s that their offices are a place where hate groups are apparently being cultivated instead of persecuted.” (perpetrators, not victims!)
https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/splc-attorney-among-23-antifa-rioters-arrested-domestic-terrorism-chargesSPLC founder Morris Dees — Child Molester, Pervert, and Liar?
http://www.deeswatch.comSPLC Implodes: President and Legal Director Resign Amid Sexual Misconduct Scandal
by Tyler Durden, Zero Hedge, March 23, 2019
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-03-23/splc-implodes-president-and-legal-director-resign-after-co-founder-ousted-overSeven Reasons to Beware the Southern Poverty Law Center
Carol Swain PhD, American Thinker
http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2018/seven_reasons_to_beware_the_southern_poverty_law_center.htmlThe Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC) says its primary mission is to fight hatred, teach tolerance, and seek justice. These are noble goals for most Americans, but this is not a noble organization. It is the exact opposite. Given the SPLC’s power and influence over the media and members of Congress, this once highly-regarded civil rights organization deserves fresh scrutiny. Here are seven reasons why the SPLC fails to serve the public interest:
1. The SPLC ignores basic standards of scientific research in selecting and classifying hate groups and extremists. The SPLC’s definition of “hate” is vague. It defines a hate group as one with “beliefs or practices that attack or malign an entire class of people, typically for their immutable characteristics.” SPLC President Richard Cohen testified in December 2017 that its assessment of hate is based on opinion, not objective criteria. (See minutes 43-48 of his testimony.)
George Yancy, a University of North Texas sociologist, documented the SPLC’s subjective nature in a 2014 study, “Watching the Watchers.” Yancy said the group’s methodology seemed more geared to mobilizing liberals than cataloguing hate groups.
2. The SPLC uses guilt by association to engage in ad hominem attacks against individuals. Hannah Scherlacher, a Campus Reform worker, found her name listed in the SPLC’s “Anti-LGBT Roundup of Events and Activities” after the conservative Family Research Council interviewed her. Surprisingly, Scherlacher’s interview had nothing to do with LGBT issues. In 2009, soon after I criticized the SPLC for having mission creep, it labeled me “an apologist for white supremacy.”
3. The SPLC ignores threats posed by leftist, anti-American groups such as ANTIFA, ISIS, and the Muslim Brotherhood. Despite the growing threat of jihadist violence, the SPLC has been reluctant to add Islamic groups with terrorist ties to its list of extremists. It also ignored how, in 2004, the FBI found plans for a “grand jihad” in America within the archives of the Muslim Brotherhood in North America. Yet, the SPLC has applied the hate label to Muslim critics of Islam, such as Maajid Nawaz and Ayaan Hirsi Ali. Both are listed in its Field Guide to Muslim Extremists.
4. The SPLC attacks and smears mainstream public service organizations, including churches, ministries, and various pro-family entities. Targeted organizations include the American Family Association, Alliance Defending Freedom, Act for America, the Center for Immigration Studies, Center for Security Policy, D. James Kennedy Ministries, Family Research Council, Liberty Counsel, and the Traditional Values Coalition. These groups are lumped together by the SPLC with the Aryan Nations, KKK, and neo-Nazis. Preposterous.
Note: labelling an organization as a hate group hurts its fundraising and hinders access to credit card-processing vendors, search engine rankings, and ministry partners.
5. The SPLC bashes conservatives while pushing a liberal agenda that empowers and supports leftists, communists, and anarchists. The SPLC regularly bashes President Trump, blaming him for the growth of white nationalism. Their analysis fails to acknowledge that the rise of white nationalism predates the election of Trump by more than two decades. Much of what the president says or does is framed as an attack on civil rights.
Curiously, after violence in Charlottesville, Va., in August 2017, the SPLC republished a map detailing the location of more than 1,500 Confederate monuments and symbols. Consider the map a field guide for anarchists.
6. The SPLC’s labeling of groups and individuals has inspired acts of violence against its targets. The SPLC is the common thread in two violent hate crimes against conservatives. After the SPLC listed the Family Research Council (FRC) on its hate map, Floyd Lee Corkins II entered FRC headquarters in August 2012 intending to commit mass murder. He was subdued by a security guard who was shot in the process. Likewise, James T. Hodgkinson, who in 2017 shot House Majority Whip Representative Steve Scalise (R-La.), was an SPLC social media fan.
7. The SPLC is an irresponsible public charity. The SPLC has violated the public trust. Nonprofit, tax-exempt organizations are expected to operate in a nonpartisan manner with the public interest at heart. The SPLC, however, is a radical activist group dedicated to suppressing political dissent.
As of 2016, the SPLC had $319 million in net assets with $69 million parked in offshore accounts. Despite its name, the SPLC does not fight poverty. Its salaries are bloated, and only a fraction of its annual contributions are used to support its programs. Writing for Philanthropy Roundtable, a nonprofit group informing the public on philanthropic activity and groups, executive director Karl Zinsmeister wrote:
The SPLC is a cash-collecting machine. In 2015 it vacuumed up $50 million in contributions and foundation grants, a tidy addition to its $334 million holdings of cash and securities and its headquarters worth $34 million. They’ve never spent more than 31 percent of the money they were bringing in on programs, and sometimes they spent as little as 18 percent. Most nonprofits spend about 75 percent on programs.
A strong case can be made to strip the SPLC of its nonprofit, tax-exempt status.
Congress and the media need to take a fresh look at the SPLC. It no longer serves the public interest.
RNC Officially Repudiates Discredited Southern Poverty Law Center
by Allum Bokhari, Breitbart, August 24, 2020
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2020/08/24/rnc-adopt-resolution-repudiating-splc/SPLC transferring millions to offshore tax havens: Report
by Valerie Richardson, The Washington Times, Friday, September 1, 2017“…the tax-exempt Alabama-based group, known as much for its fundraising prowess as its civil-rights work, sent more than $4 million to entities incorporated in the Cayman Islands, according to 2014 tax documents. Financial consultants described the overseas dealings, which include financial interests in the British Virgin Islands and Bermuda, as ‘extremely unusual’ and ‘a huge red flag’ for a 501©3 organization. The SPLC holds $328 million in net assets and raised more than $50 million in contributions in 2015 despite spending just $61,000 on legal services. ‘It’s a totally fake organization,’ said Fox News host Tucker Carlson in a Thursday night segment on the report.…”
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/sep/1/splc-transferred-millions-offshore-tax-havens/
etc., etc. etc.
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Fran Taubman says:@Mark Bahner
And deeply mentally psychotic. Alone in his psychosis backed by no one, or any religion, yet insisting on speaking in imaginary religious terms. Al and his imaginary religion of Jesus and pretend Catholicism. Only on UR could a psychotic like Al continue to post.
Fabricating that Anne Frank’s father sexually abused her, in graphic detail, and accusing Jews of sex slavery.
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@Mark Bahner
Do you agree that…
No. In view of the extensive evidence of faked photos/documents, tortured “confessions,” and lying “eyewitnesses,” and millennia of Jewish lying, I remain skeptical.
Yes, they were in the Temple…not in their homes.
Oh puhleez! Bela Kun (neé Cohen) and his murdering “Hungarian” Jews of the Hungarian Soviet Republic were “in their homes” sometimes too. So what? Are murderers exempt from capture “in their homes”? And, if parents are arrested, are minor children not placed in foster care of some kind?
Rosa Luxemberg, Kurt Eisner, Paul Levi, Siegfried Mühsam, Eugen Levine, Ernest Toller, Gustav Landauer, Karl Radeck (neé Sobelsohn) and their murdering “German” Jews of the Spartacist revolution and Bavarian Socialist Republic were “in their homes” sometimes too. So what? Are murderers exempt from capture “in their homes”? And, if parents are arrested, are minor children not placed in foster care of some kind?
Adolph Eichmann was at home in Argentina on Garibaldi Street in San Fernando, Buenos Aires when he was kidnapped by the Jews. Would you argue that he should not have been taken? Your hypocritical pilpul and opportunistic emotionalism are a bunch of sewage from Hell.
And I’ve never met any Catholic as filled with anger and hatred as you seem to be.
Facts are facts. Facts are not emotions. Facts are not “love.” Facts are not “hate.” Only those bereft of credible evidence are desperate enough to project their own emotional instability into matters of fact. Get used to people speaking plainly.
Do you “love” the Nazis who you claim murdered “6 million”? Are the deaths of ¼ BILLION innocent Gentiles directly and indirectly murdered by the machinations of 20th century Jews like Samuel Untermeyer not deserving of anger? Evidently you have not met well-catechized Catholics. We Catholics are bound to hate evil:
“Hatred …in so far as it implies the reprobation of what is actually evil, is not a sin and may even represent a virtuous temper of soul.”
Catholic Encyclopedia, entry on ‘hatred’
https://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07149b.htm• Thanks: John Wear• Replies: @Mark BahnerAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
kb_2 says:@John Wear
I know that David Duke earned his PhD in history from the largest university in Ukraine. So, free speech is probably allowed on this subject there.
According to Wikipedia, he earned his PhD from private university (some sources use word “largest”) in which PhD program wasn’t accreditate by state.
You can read more about this university here (including details about Jewish theme): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interregional_Academy_of_Personnel_Management
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fufu says:@Truth Vigilante
#1516 Truth Vigilante
“So Mr EffU-EffU, if the Germans had really been intent on killing as many Jews as possible, how do you explain that they allowed the French Jews to remain where they were for the entirety of the war?”
Central and Eastern Europe were different than Western Europe (i.e. France).
Hidding Jews in France cost a fine and jail.
Hidding Jews in Poland was a death penalty. For person who has hidden Jews. And for his family. And even for his neighbours.Germans didn’t want to make Lebensraum in France so they were more tolerant to French Jews and Frenchmen.
Germans wanted to make Lebensraum in Central and Eastern Europe so it is obvious that they wanted to exterminated as many local population (Slavs and Jews) as possible.
“On 24 March 1944, in Markowa, Poland, the Germans murdered the whole family of Józef and Wiktoria Ulma along with the Jews they were hiding. (…) Within a few minutes – Józef Ulma, his heavily-pregnant wife Wiktoria, their six children and all the hidden Jews perished at the hands of the Germans. “
https://ipn.gov.pl/en/news/10474,Poles-Who-Rescued-Jews-The-Story-of-the-Ulma-Family.html
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Brad Anbro says:
Please add to your comment the Jewish Anti-Defamation League. I am sure that there are other (Jewish) organizations that are just as evil and corrupt as the ADL and the SPLC.
Thank you.
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fufu says:@Al Liguori
#1528 Al Liguori
“Look at what Nuland, Kagan, Blinken, Zelensky, Soros and sons, and the rest of the (((neocons))) are doing today to gin up the Third World War that they have envisioned and planned for centuries.”
They do it unpunishly because average Americans don’t want to stop them.
Since 1913 (creation of FED), for over 100 years, average Americans have done nothing to regain control over their country from financial and military gangs (corporations).
Americans can only cry like a baby and blame others (Jews, Masons, Communists etc.).
“World Jewry declared global holy war on Germany in 1933. “
Jews from USA declared econimic war on Germany so Germans had right to kill Central-Easter Europe Jews and much more Slavs.
American Jews declared economic war so Germans kill Slavs- perfectly logic (I call this “reasoning” a “New German Logic”).
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Wizard of Oz says:@Mark Bahner
Hitler’s plenipotentiary’s figures add up to far more than the 437,000 Jews you posit. So what are they referring to?
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Mark Bahner says:
“littlereddot”…your analogy of a trial is a good one.
Let’s have a mock *civil* trial, right here on the Ron Unz Review website, in the matter of Families and Friends of Hungarian Jews and Sephardic Jews of Greece versus Rudolf Hoess (aka Hoss, with an Umlaut) and SS personnel at Auschwitz.
Ron Unz, are you reading comments anymore?
Ron Unz, are you there? Are you interested in doing a separate posting on your website regarding this mock trial? What I’m think of would be a posting that has comments, starting with comment #1, that are exclusively devoted to:
Families and Friends of Hungarian Jews and Sephardic Jews of Greece versus Rudolf Hoess and SS personnel at Auschwitz
Do you want to be on the Defense, “littlereddot”, or on the Jury.
Al Ligouri, Defense or Jury?
HdC, Defense or Jury?
Fran Taubman…you can join me on the Prosecution, but I don’t need much help, because we both know this i
and Al Ligouri…and John Wear…and you, Ron Unz…
…and Carlo Mattogno…could somebody call him here? John Wear, can you get him here?
…and David Cole…I’m trying to get him…
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Brad Anbro says:
Quote:
“Hoess (aka Hoss, with an Umlaut)”
That’s Höss…
Quote:
“because we both know this i”
Because we both know this i (?) What is the “i”?
By the way, you & Ms. Taubman – two peas from the same pod.
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Mark Bahner says:@Wizard of Oz
Hitler’s plenipotentiary’s figures add up to far more than the 437,000 Jews you posit. So what are they referring to?
I haven’t tried to find the original source documents, I’m just going by page 465 of Anatomy of Auschwitz Death Camp, Gutman and Bernbaum, editors.
The way it’s written up in the book, the values were possibly reported as a cumulative count. In any case, the vast majority of sources agree on approximately that 437,000 value:
https://budapestbeacon.com/the-hungarian-holocaust-started-70-years-ago-today/
P.S. Would you like to be on the Jury?
• Replies: @TiptoethrutulipsAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Mark,
I would say, unequivocally, Nuremberg, was a mock trial. As prosecutor (chief Head Hunter), be sure to call Mr. Gabbai, Jew extraordinaire, as your first witness. But, please first, revisit his 2 hour Shoah interview, which will be in evidence, and if there is actually a defense permitted, you will fail right out of the gate.
Let’s have a mock, pre-trial interview, Christian style:
So, Tulip, tell us about your childhood. I grew up in a Christian home in a lovely Christian village in America.
Did you celebrate American/Christian holidays? Oh, yes.
Which ones? Oh, all of them.
Like? The high ones. My mother did it all. (Tulip glances off camera, co-conspirator flashes picture of rabbit and Santa Claus)
Don’t you remember? Yes, Easter and Christmas.
Did you have any traditional holiday foods? Yes.
What did you have? You know, what everyone has. (Tulip glances off camera, co-conspirator holds up picture of a turkey and a pumpkin.
Like? The chicken. We had a big chicken. Rice, beans. And we always played basketball.
Interviewer is silent. Tulip’s eyes are darting around and she is on verge of tears.
Interviewer says, I know how hard this is for you after what you’ve been through, but surely you mean pumpkin pie?
Tulip says, yes, yes of course. It was a pumpkin.
Did you go to church? Not really.
Didn’t you appear in an annual Christmas pageant at church? I think I did. I must have, but I really don’t remember because that party, with all those trees, happened once, every year, and I was 19 when I left home, so I was just to young to remember what by mom made us do every November. (Tulip glances at co-conspirator again, who is now crying; Tulip begins to cry, and asks, can we take a break?It will be an uphill battle next time around, Mark. Be prepared.
• Replies: @littlereddotAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
littlereddot says:@Mark Bahner
Yes, that would be fun, and informative. I would agree
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Mark Bahner says:@Al Liguori
No. In view of the extensive evidence of faked photos/documents, tortured “confessions,” and lying “eyewitnesses,” and millennia of Jewish lying, I remain skeptical.
The number of 437,402 Hungarian Jews by July 13th, 1944 is taken from Hitler’s plenipotentiary in Budapest. If it was stated that the number was “over 200,000” would you accept that? Or is there no number above zero that you would accept for Hungarian Jews deported to Auschwitz?
Oh puhleez! Bela Kun (neé Cohen) and his murdering “Hungarian” Jews of the Hungarian Soviet Republic were “in their homes” sometimes too. So what?
“So what?” So aren’t they both wrong?
Are murderers exempt from capture “in their homes”?
Are you saying Gerti Ackerman’s mother or father murdered someone? You seem to be saying community punishment is OK…that it’s OK to send a whole community to prison (and death) if one member of the community committed a crime. Do you think it’s OK to punish an entire community for the crimes of some members of that community?
And, if parents are arrested, are minor children not placed in foster care of some kind?
The Hungarian Jewish children weren’t “placed in foster care of some kind”! They were taken to Auschwitz prison. (And then executed without trial.) Do you think it’s right to force children to go to prison with their parents?
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Fran Taubman says:@Brad Anbro
By the way, you & Ms. Taubman – two peas from the same pod.
Correct!! We are non delusional people who know the truth about the Holocaust and are not psychotic Jew haters like Al Liguori who pretends he represents Christians and Catholicism. Do you think Al represents Christianity and the Catholicism?
We represent the best of humanity, and are not mentally deranged. 99 percent of the world believes Al is mentally deranged, including his family and friends if he has any. Why does he hide his identity?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traditionalist_CatholicismRight out of the Da Vinci Code. Sickos
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Mark Bahner says:@Brad Anbro
Because we both know this i (?) What is the “i”?
That was supposed to be, “Because we both know this is a straightforward and clear case of kidnapping and murder.”
P.S. Do you want to be on the Jury?
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littlereddot says:@Tiptoethrutulips
First you will need to set up some rules.
Like does the jury get to ask questions?
Who will be the judge?
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Mark, you are slipping.
There are no jurors at this sort of kangaroo style, on going quest for thousand years long retribution, oh, no, I meant justice, quest for Justice.
The impartial judges are Greensplatt, Allseeing Kristolball, Boot-onyourneck, and ConJobe.
But, swing away, Mark, swing away, like the guy in the movie with the lovely Mel Gibson. Do you think those aliens were symbolic Jews? Movies usually tell us everything we need to know.
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Mark Bahner says:@Fran Taubman
We represent the best of humanity, and are not mentally deranged.
Speak for yourself, Fran.
I make no claim to “represent the best of humanity”. Just, as Marge Simpson said of her kids, I’m “at least average.” But I do agree I’m not mentally deranged. 99 percent of the world believes Al is mentally deranged, including his family and friends if he has any.
I don’t believe he’s deranged. It does seem to me he’s filled with hate, and firmly committed to the idea if some members of “Community A” do something do bad to members of “Community B”, then it’s OK for members of “Community B” to do something bad to members of “Community A”. In other words, “An eye for an eye,” “Two wrongs make a right,” and “Group punishment is OK.”
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Patrick McNally says:@Rurik
No. The only little caveat which I may repeatedly allow to that is that one can plausibly suggest that Trotsky as an antiwar speaker in New York might have been given some assistance by someone who had been opposed to US entry into World War One until the February Revolution. Even if that were true, it wouldn’t say anything about Trotsky’s later ability to rally Russians who were fed up with the war.
If Kerensky and Kornilov had been smart, they should have signed a peace with Germany in April 1917 at the latest. Then Kerensky should have declared the enactment of a radical land reform, with Russian peasants taking over all of the big estates. Elections to the Constituent Assembly should have been held, and this would have brought to power a coalition government in which the Social Revolutionaries (Kerensky’s party) would have been the biggest winners, the Mensheviks would have scooped up most of the urban working-class vote, and probably some Bolshevik dissenters from Lenin (such as Kamene and Zinoviev) would have formed their own little splinter group. In that context, it would have been impossible for Lenin and Trotsky to overthrow the government. But persisting with the war while postponing the real popular demands was insane.
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HdC says:@Mark Bahner
There were 2 real trials of Ernst Zundel in Toronto during the 1980’s.
Zundel was charged with “spreading false news” when he published the booklet “Did 6 Million Really Die?”
The claims of homicidal gas chambers were debunked during these trials. Defence attorney Doug Christie had a field day with any evidence or witness the prosecution was able to table.Despite the lack of evidence, the jury found Zundel guilty! The Supreme Court of Canada overturned both of Zundel’s convictions.
Before we get into a pissing match here, Mr. Zundel’s name in German was Zuendel, the u with the Umlaut. I was advised that Mr. Zundel dropped the Umlaut in Canada.
There is information on-line about these trials including the transcripts. Some of it makes fascinating reading.
Methinks it worthwhile to at least review the information available about these trials before engaging in another (mock?) trial.
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Mark Bahner says:@littlereddot
Yes, that would be fun, and informative. I would agree.
That’s the spirit!
Here’s how I see it working out. Keep in mind that this is a *mock* trial, and the rules will be unusual, to say the least.
In a civil trial in the U.S., the verdict is based on a “preponderance of evidence”. That is, if the jury thinks that more than 50 percent of the evidence supports one side, they’ll vote for that side.
There won’t be any judge.
I’ll be the Plaintiff’s lawyer. I will present the details of my client’s complaint. I will also present the Defendant’s lawyer(s) with the complete list of my witnesses and the evidence I plan to present. After the Defendant’s lawyers see my list of witnesses and the general evidence I plan to present, the Defendant’s lawyer(s) will present me with their list of witnesses and the general evidence they plan to present.
Then we’ll select the jury. The jury will have to answer questions truthfully. I’m thinking now that the Plantiff and the Defendant can refuse to allow *one* juror each…but even one should be strongly discouraged.
After we’ve selected the jury, we’ll begin the trial. I’ll present my witnesses, the Defandant’s lawyer(s) can respond, I can re-direct, and the Defendant’s lawyers can re-re-direct. Jurors can ask questions or even make comments, but hopefully they’ll be somewhat limited.
I’ll present my clients’ complaint, my pre-trial list of witnesses and *general* evidence by the end of today.
In the meantime, we need to get:
1) Defendant’s lawyer(s) decided. (I REALLY would like Carlo Mattogno to be one of the Defense’s lawyers. I presume John Wear is already on board as a defense lawyer.
I’d like to get Ron Unz on board as either a Defense lawyer or a juror. I’d also like to get David Cole to come as…something…but not a Plaintiff’s lawyer.2) Jurors to volunteer.
Best wishes,
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@littlereddot
According to Mark ‘Mordechai’ Bahner-stein’s version of a proper venue for a fair trial, there is no jury.
The rules will be made up as they go along, and they will change if they see any advantage on the horizon for the defendants (victims), sort of like we did as kids when we lost the official rules for board game, Monopoly, which, by the way, is the true life story of Lucky Larry Silvertongue, who will most certainly be a consultant for the proceedings, who, out of the kindness of his dark, twisted little heart, will offer accommodations to any member of the defense, if a defense is permitted, that is, who appears to be somewhat capable of identifying bullshit, in a luxurious downtown skyscraper, constructed in such a manner, to defy all laws of physics, combustion and reality, and will definitely NOT collapse, in any way, similar to a controlled demolition, within 4-5 seconds, which is the same numeration for the amount of time it takes to annihilate 3,000 people with Zyklon B tablets, but in that case it’s 4-5 minutes, and wasn’t there some occurrence in Germany, with Hitler, that happened on September 11?, but I’m not sure, so I must end here to consult my collection of Dr. Suess textbooks on Jewish protocols for a fair trial for Gentiles, which is somewhat different than the protocols of/for Zion.
Sorry for the excessive length of text, but defensive strategy is complex.
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Mark Bahner says:@littlereddot
Hi,
First you will need to set up some rules.
Like does the jury get to ask questions?
Who will be the judge?See my previous lengthy comments about rules.
Yes, jurors get to ask questions. They also will be required to answer questions from the Plaintiff’s and Defense’s lawyer(s) before they sit on the jury.
For example, one question I would ask all potential jurors is, “Regardless of your current opinion, do you think you can change your mind if the evidence is strong enough?
No, no judge.
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@Fran Taubman
FACT: child sex slavery is from the Jews • then, as now How do you spell “Epstein”? http://judaism.is/epstein-mossad.html Here is a representative sample of the evidence. Dozens more examples are here:
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Jurors, in fact, don’t get to submit questions, until the deliberation process, and then the questions are submitted, in writing, to the court. The answers are returned, in writing, and the jurors may refer back to transcribed testimony, but they are not permitted to speak to any trial lawyers, and they are instructed to refrain from speaking to ANYONE other than other jurors with regard to the case.
But, this is irrelevant, as the only way you will prevail is by tribunal, with the four, unbiased Dark Overlords I previously named, and no jury whatsoever.
Stick to movie reviews, Mark…..swing away, Mark, swing away!
You may have success at clown school; sometimes we need to go with our innate strengths.
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Mark Bahner says:@HdC
Methinks it worthwhile to at least review the information available about these trials before engaging in another (mock?) trial.
Would you like to be on the Defense team?
If you are on the Defense team, you’d need to summarize or excerpt or provide a trial transcript such that I, as the Plaintiff’s lawyer, could respond to whatever you presented.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
You are referring to voir dire, Mark, and they are not yet jurors, but potential jurors, and you don’t get to question them about specific aspects of the case to be tried.
Stick to movie reviews, where your skills at analysis are more appropriate. As you, yourself, admitted, upon the evocation of the Schindler’s List defense, which everyone else abandoned after mock trials in grade school.
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@Mark Bahner
Quote verbatim where I have proposed doing “something bad to members of ‘Community A,’” “An eye for an eye,” “Two wrongs make a right,” or “Group punishment is OK.”
I have called only for legal prosecution for crimes against humanity in open and fair trials. I have explicitly stated, “Leave the innocent alone.” Is that your talmudic idea of “doing something bad”??? Legal prosecution is what the Jews claimed they were doing—but failed to do—at Nuremberg 1.0. http://judaism.is/nuremberg.html The Jewish standard of “justice” at Nuremberg was “no evidence” and “no proof of facts”: Nuremberg Trial Proceedings Vol. 1 Article 19 https://avalon.law.yale.edu/imt/imtconst.asp#art19 and Article 21 https://avalon.law.yale.edu/imt/imtconst.asp#art21
Do you believe that Jews may only be prosecutors and judges, never defendants in a gentile court? Do you believe that Jews guilty of crimes against humanity should not be punished legally? If so, your double-standard is perfectly in keeping with talmudic “Noahide” halakah. https://judaism.is/noahide-deceit.html
Absent verifiable evidence, you have proffered only faked photos, tortured “confessions,” fevered pseudo-syllogistic fantasies, and most recently the basest of ad hominem smears. In so doing, you and Fran have exemplified Judaism. Unable to provide credible verifiable evidence, you can only try desperately to smear the messenger reporting the crimes. Do you think that your desperate deceits are not transparent to readers who are “on the fence”?
Q.E.D.
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Mark Bahner says:
OK, here is my *preliminary* complaint, as the Plaintiff’s lawyer. The defendants, between 1942 and January 1945, engaged in at least 40,000 instances of:
1) Kidnapping (from Yugoslavia and Greece);
2) Wrongful transport of my clients out of their countries;
3) Wrongful imprisonment in Auschwitz;
4) Wrongful death;
5) Wrongful death specifically through use of Zyklon B in a homicidal gas chamber.Note: I separated the complaint so the jury can decide whether there was any wrongful death at all, and specifically whether it was wrongful death by Zyklon B in a homicidal gas chamber.
My clients include (but are not limited to): Shlomo Venezia, a Sephardic Jew who was taken from Greece to Auschwitz with his two sisters and mother; the family of Reuven and Gershon Fogel and their mother, who were taken to Auschwitz in 1944; the family of Gerty Ackerman and her sister Wally and their mother, who were also ; and 40,000 Jewish children who were taken from Hungary to Auschwitz from May to July 1944.
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Mark Bahner says:
and you don’t get to question them about specific aspects of the case to be tried.
You think this question to a potential juror would not be allowed in a civil trial:
Regardless of your current opinion, do you think you can change your mind if the evidence is strong enough?
?
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
While you’re at it, Mark, be sure to include war criminals, FDR and Eisenhower, in your complaint.We can impanel Patton’s descendants on the jury, it there is one, that is. As well as the descendants of the German soldiers languishing in American POW camps, or whatever category to which they were illegally relegated.
Rules for war and civilian matters are somewhat different; you will need to consult the Hollywood War Crimes Trope, volume 1, to get started.
Do nations get to decide who can stay or who needs to go, due to destructive habits or behaviors? Let’s ask the Palestinian (potential) jurors during Voir Dire, and hear what they say.
We can also impanel a few French elders and ask them how those pesky Germans compared to the lovely new inhabitants brought to France, courtesy of the Tikkun Olam crowd.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Ok, Mark, your question is lacking subject matter. Their opinion of what, exactly? Let’s lead them to form some sort of opinion before the trial.
Their opinion on universal German villainy and universal Jewish innocence?
In your version of proper voir dire, I guess that’s ok to ask. Enough already. I’m sure the Joo Crew want you to stop embarrassing everyone.
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Mark Bahner says:@Tiptoethrutulips
“Tiptoethrutulips”…are you interested in being on the jury? On being on defense team?
If you’re not interested in either one, I won’t respond to you any more.
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@Mark Bahner
There is no crime. It is just and moral to incarcerate and punish declared internal enemies and perpetrators of genocide and other crimes against humanity, including economic crimes against humanity.
No amount of your sputtering pilpul, tortured pseudo-syllogisms, talmudic kangaroo courts, or ad hominem makes it otherwise: https://judaism.is/big-lies.html#pilpul You Jews arrogate authority to punish gentiles http://judaism.is/noahide-deceit,html , but rend your garments and wail when gentiles seek justice for Jewish crimes. Hypocrites. “The Jew shrieks in pain as he strikes you.”
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Israel among worst human traffickers Named in UN’s list of ‘top 10’ destinations for forced labor, sexual slavery. by Ruth Eglash, The Jerusalem Post, 04/25/2006 http://www.jpost.com/Israel/Article.aspx?id=19974 • Israel’s Sex Trade Escalating by Kevin Hechtkopf, CBS News, Jerusalem, March 23, 2005
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John Wear says:@HdC
You write: “The claims of homicidal gas chambers were debunked during these trials. Defence attorney Doug Christie had a field day with any evidence or witness the prosecution was able to table.”
My response: I agree. If anyone would like to read about the 1985 Ernst Zündel trial, you can read an article I wrote about this trial at http://www.wearswar.com/2023/06/25/why-was-the-1985-ernst-zundel-trial-a-disaster-for-the-holocaust-narrative/.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Oh, “graspingatstrawsMordechaiBahnerstein”, do you really have to ask that question after all we’ve been through?
I will miss you. But, it will be OK because Dario Gabbai, professed Jew extraordinaire, has been delivered to my lair, and I will attempt to convince him to join me, in whichever role I choose to take in the imaginary farce, no trial, for which you seem, after all this time, to have no idea, where I might choose to engage.
Please consider clown school.
I’m waiting for your address to ship the shiny, new fainting sofa, pearls, Midol; I can’t think what else. Maybe Mr. Liguori has a few ideas about what you need.
Toodles!
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HdC says:@Mark Bahner
No, I would not wish to partake in any such “trial”.
In my considered opinion the issue of the holocaust has been completely settled: No gas chambers, no holocaust. Period. This was PROVED in 2 legal trials in Canada!
In any murder trial, it must first be proved that there was a person murdered! Since it was proved that there were no homicidal gas chambers in any German camp, how were these people murdered in such quantities?
Since the quantities of the alleged corpses, still 6 million according to the mass media (I invite you to check this) were too many to cremate in the available crematoria (I invite you to do the arithmetic using the agreed-upon resources available in each camp) alleged burning pits needed to be employed to dispose of the corpses.
Where were these burning pits, and where is the residue therefrom???
To get information on burning pits I invite you to review the burning of animals in Britain during the last hoof and mouth epidemic. Pigs, sheep, goats, etc. are close enough in size to humans to give some indication of the residue encountered.
You have failed to address these and similar issues as I have raised them in my earlier posts on this thread. Fine, that is your choice.
But that sure as hell does not give me any confidence that a mock trial would produce anything of value, and be reproduced in the mass media.
How often have you read the details of the Zundel trials in the mass media?
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@Mark Bahner
Will your farce adhere to the “no evidence” “no proof of facts” as Nuremberg 1.0?
Nuremberg Trial Proceedings Vol. 1 Article 19 https://avalon.law.yale.edu/imt/imtconst.asp#art19 and Article 21 https://avalon.law.yale.edu/imt/imtconst.asp#art21see also: http://judaism.is/nuremberg.html
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Brad Anbro says:@Fran Taubman
“Ms.” Taubman,
I DO NOT trust Wikipedia as a source for truth when it comes to ANYTHING that is the least bit controversial. That includes the Holocaust and a subject of which Mr. Bahner seems to do his best to avoid discussing – the events of September 11, 2001.
Anyone who has done REAL research and studying of the events of that day will find that Jews were heavily involved in the events of, and also beneficiaries of, that particular day. And they are still reaping the benefits, while the American people and the rest of the people of the world are the real losers.
Thank you!
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Mark Bahner says:@Mark Bahner
If you’re not interested in either one, I won’t respond to you any more.
After I wrote this, I saw you mention about Palestinian juror or other jurors. So this final piece to you, since I see you’re not interested in being on the jury or on the defense team: find some Palestinian jurors. The more the better. Seriously. If you found 5, 10, or 100+ Palestinian jurors, that would be great. Or any other juror of any race, creed, color, or religion.
If you don’t look for any potential jurors, then *this* will be the last comment I’ll address to you until the mock trial is over.
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Mark Bahner says:@Al Liguori
Al, I really think you should be on the defense team. Especially since I’m not even sure Ron Wear is going to show up. And I think getting Carlo Mattogno is just a dream of mine. Ditto for any Holocaust “revisionist” researcher.
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Brad Anbro says:@Mark Bahner
Mark, I think that you talk just to hear yourself talk…
Brad
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Mark Bahner says:
In my considered opinion the issue of the holocaust has been completely settled: No gas chambers, no holocaust. Period. This was PROVED in 2 legal trials in Canada!
It was not proved in Canada that no homicidal gas chambers existed. What was proved in Canada was that whomever was representing the State or the Plaintiff(s) was incompetent. Do you think the O.J. Simpson murder trial “proved” that O.J. Simpson did not kill Nicole Brown Simpson and Ronald Goldman? If it “proved” O.J. Simpson did *not* kill Nicole Brown Simpson and Ronald Goldman, then how could O.J. Simpson have been found liable for their wrongful deaths in a civil trial?
The evidence of the existence of gas chambers has been proven in many trials in many places, including:
1) Reinhold Hanning was found guilty of 170,000 counts of accessory to murder in Germany:
2) Oskar Groening was found guilty of 300,000 counts of accessory to murder, also in Germany:
https://www.chicagotribune.com/nation-world/ct-german-nazi-guard-appeal-20161128-story.html
3) Rudolf Hoess was found guilty in Poland, and hanged mere meters from Crematorium 1, a place of some of the earliest executions by gas chamber at Auschwitz:
https://www.auschwitz.org/en/museum/news/auschwitz-commandant-rudolf-hoess-on-the-gallows,461.html
I could literally go on for over an hour, but I’ve got other things to do right now.
P.S. I don’t recall…did I invite you to join the defense team, and are you interested?
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Mark, Mordechai Ratfinkelstein, whatever, are we still arguing or not? You made your exit, and have now returned.
You do realize we are actually arguing over an imaginary tribulation that is happening under Occam’s Toupee, aka, Mark Bahner’s head? Or don’t you?
You are an enigma, and do I smell a ratfink? For your own sake, you should stick to the controversy in Thneed-Ville. Or at the very least, toggle on over to one of Mr. Wear’s links, of which there are MANY, for a more measured view of this tragic historical event. I am currently reading the info on Mr. Zundel’s trials and actual tribulations. I’ve read from other sources before, but I like to read on to improve the accuracy of my recollections. I still double check sometimes, but I never find deceit or inaccuracy.
You may not believe what you read therein, but go ahead and check on it, as I once did. I could NOT, by any measure, refute the “revised” narrative, aka The Truth.
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HdC says:@John Wear
Mr Wear, I just re-read your referenced article, and I recommend that Mark Bahner read it too, as it is quite the compelling analysis of the Zundel trials.
But, he appears to studiously avoid the debate of opinions that do not support his narrative.
You probably noticed that I do not partake in any discussion regarding the number of people that supposedly were shuffled all over eastern Europe because none of those numbers are provable, thus leading to endless debates.
However, the methodologies of the alleged killing and cremation lends itself to superb and unquestionable scientific and engineering analysis.
And Mr Bahner avoids any discussion of these topics like the plague. One would think that an engineer of his stature would enjoy airing his opinions on such scientific topic.
This lack of interest speaks volumes about Mr Bahner’s sincerity and abilities.
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HdC says:@Mark Bahner
The jury in Canada found Zundel guilty too, so what? I submit most juries in the western world would find a ham sandwich guilty of having murdered umpty million Jews if Jews were to accuse it of holocaustianity.
The issue at hand is the EVIDENCE!
You have NEVER commented on the evidence furnished in these trials. Go and read Mr Wears’s article that he referred to in his post #1606, above. Memorize those paragraphs of Jewish commentators on the long-term effects of those trials. “Holocaust completely disproved” is a paraphrase of one of them!
Many of your responses are of the copy-and-paste format, since you keep repeating arguments that have long been refuted, not only in this thread but in numerous others, too. Here is one: “Rudolf Hoess was found guilty in Poland and hanged…”. Please read my first paragraph above, again.
FYI Hoess was severely tortured and signed “his confession” that had been written in English. And you offer such nonsense as evidence?
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Mark Bahner says:
Mock Trial status so far:
1) Plaintiff has given a *preliminary* complaint. (Willing to amend it, depending whether/how Defendant wants complaint amended.) (Don’t see *that* very often in a civil trial.)
2) I think we’ve got one juror volunteer (“littlereddot”). Plaintiff’s counsel does not even need to ask the question I said I’d all potential jurors. I accept without any questioning that “littlereddot” is capable of changing his mind if the evidence warrants it.
3) We have *no* defense counsel. Seems pretty surprising…unless, of course, everyone knows the defense doesn’t really have a legitimate case.
4) I’ll give a list of my what evidence/testimony I plan to present, either tonight or tomorrow morning.
Hopefully, we’ll get one or more volunteers for the Defense Team. For potential volunteers for that position, I just want to remind them, nobody will blame them if they lose a weak case.
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Mark Bahner says:@HdC
I *did* comment on that evidence. In comment 1478.
You:
Suggest you read the transcripts of the Zundel trials held in Toronto during the 1980’s. During these trials any assertions of any homicidal gas chambers in German concentration camps were completely disproved.
Me:
I have a better idea. (That means better for me, not for you. ;-))
You summarize and/or excerpt key parts of the Zundel trial transcripts that you think “completely disproved” “any assertions of homicidal gas chambers in German concentration camps.”
The best thing you can do for the defense would be to find a transcript of the trial, or at least a transcript of the parts that support Zundel’s position.
As Plaintiff’s counsel, I expect to be able to show the weaknesses in whatever you find that you think supports Zundel’s position. But keep in mind, this is a civil trial about what happened at *Auschwitz*…not any other death camps or concentration camps.
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Fran Taubman says:@Brad Anbro
Well I do not trust you. Typical clown Jew hater with the hot breath of old sock. You have never had a new idea, you believe what Jew haters tell you which is odd, because it is so obviously bullshit.
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Fran Taubman says:@Al Liguori
All those pedophile priest raping those young boys, and the entirety of the Spanish conquest of South America with their revolting enslavement and rape of the Mayans. Catholicism has a lot of evil. You being subject number one for the sexual accusations of Leo Frank regarding his daughter. You will guarantee burn in hell for that one. You know when they cremated Eichmann there was almost zero ashes, Not much physically left of him. With you Al you may go up in smoke with zero ashes. The evilness in you will implode your soul.
You Al will go up in smoke you are so revolting as an inhuman specimen.Tell me again Al. What sexual perversion did Leo Frank do to his daughter Anne. What did you accuse the Frank’s of, you know the other stuff. Tell us Al.
Tell us about the cock sucking priest!!!
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Mark Bahner Delusional Spiral, thus far:
1. I think you mean Original Petition. In point of fact, they are amended all the time. (What’s with all the bold text and asterisks?)
2. Good luck with that. I speculate, bigbraindot, has got your number, already. If you actually knew what you were doing, you would never allow him on your jury panel.
3. No defense is needed. You can just blabber away, to your hearts content, and anyone who bothers to listen will figure it out. I’ll release Dario from my lair, to come to your aid, and he can wax sentimental about Jewish traditions, such as The Big Chicken Dinner, from Kosher Fried Chicken, the beans, the fat man in the red suit….besides, there were no homicidal gas chambers.
4. In a civil trial, there is no legal requirement to hand over all evidence to the defense. If you are an idiot, you may place all your cards on the table for your adversary to see, and thereby, Defense will be prepared, in advance, to dispute every argument you assert.
Other than the entertainment value, this exchange is not productive. I’m beginning to worry for you, and you are wasting your time. In all seriousness, you may be well intentioned, but I think you are spinning your wheels, and at this point, there is no benefit to further discussion.
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Fran Taubman says:
The problem with Holocaust Revisionism as a field of study, and the cat and mouse games Revisionist play which drives us all crazy. The constant nibbling around the edges with no substantial rationale answer to what happened, makes it impossible to deal with.
“The problem of all factionalism,” philosopher Hans Sluga pointed out in this analysis of the Heidigger controversy “is that it already knows the answers to the questions it raises” (1993, p. 5). To fullyparticipate in a valid historical examination of the Holocaust revisionists cannot continue to simply “nibble at the edges” of the accepted version, seizing upon any discrepancy or seeming contradiction between proponents of the accepted view as proof that the whole thing never happened, in the manner of creationists and Kennedy conspiracy theorists.
A defense lawyer need only create a reasonable doubt in the mind of at least one juror to deny the prosecution a conviction. In academic argument, when challenging the “received version,” at some point one must provide an alternative interpretation of greater plausibility. And this is precisely what most serious skeptical literature on ESP, faith healing, and the like does. Likewise, Holocaust revisionists
must provide their own detailed account of what actually did happen to all those Jews if they did not die the way we have been told they did. To date, their best attempt is Butz’s (1976) virtually unreadable The
Hoax of the Twentieth Century.In particular, to be taken seriously and not be dismissed as
“conspiracy theorists,” revisionists cannot invoke the machinations of
powerful, nefarious Zionist controlled entities to explain away any
testimony or evidence that supports the received version. Rather,
revisionists must demonstrate independent, falsifiable (in Popper’s
sense of being capable of being disproved) evidence that a small group
of Zionist Jews could so effectively put one over on all the rest of
us, at no small cost to us, and yet have proved singularly unable to
rescue the bulk of their coreligionists from the horrors that befell
them (even if only the limited set of horrors conceded by the
revisionists).If and when Holocaust revisionists produce such material they must be
provided full liberty to write, speak, and distribute it, and be
accorded the opportunity to present it in respectable journals and
academic fora. They should be extended the opportunity to engage in
open, fair, and lengthy debate before knowledgeable audiences (rather
than “hit and run” appearances before self-selected groups) along with
anyone of a contrary view who chooses to appear opposite them. If such
opportunity is refused, they should self-publish their work along with
the rejections and accompanying correspondence and thereby, as Mr.
Jefferson said, “let good sense have fair play.”GIVING THE DEVIL HIS DUE: HOLOCAUST REVISIONISM AS A TEST CASE FOR FREE SPEECH
AND THE SKEPTICAL ETHICBy Frank Miele
https://www.mit.edu/activities/safe/writings/holocaust-revAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Mark Bahner says:
For those wanting to know about “discovery” prior to civil trials:
It allows each side to prepare for trial. During discovery, the parties gather the evidence (documents, witness testimony, and the like) they will need to submit at trial to prove their case or defend against the other side’s claims.
It allows parties to explore the strengths and weaknesses in the case. Using discovery tools, the parties have the chance to talk to the other side and to witnesses, to see what documents and evidence the other side has that may help or hurt the case, and to learn the other side’s position on critical facts and legal issues.
It allows the parties to evaluate settlement. Once each party knows what evidence exists to support or undercut the claims and defenses in the case, they are in a good position to talk about settling the case without going to trial.
I’m working on behalf of my Plaintiffs. It’s far too late to finish today. And I have other things to do tomorrow, so it might be tomorrow night before I can gather everything. I’ll be cutting back severely on what evidence I could present, in order to obtain a quick victory for my clients, who’ve been waiting far too long.
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John Wear says:@Fran Taubman
You quote Frank Miele: “Likewise, Holocaust revisionists must provide their own detailed account of what actually did happen to all those Jews if they did not die the way we have been told they did. To date, their best attempt is Butz’s (1976) virtually unreadable The Hoax of the Twentieth Century.”
My response: Dr. Arthur Butz does not think that his book is the best book to date on the subject of Holocaust revisionism. While “The Hoax of the Twentieth Century” was a groundbreaking effort, research since 1976 has greatly added to our understanding of the subject.
As I previously stated on this discussion thread, the 4th edition of “Holocaust Controversies” is one of the best books available on the subject of the so-called Holocaust. This book can be read online at https://holocausthandbooks.com/dl/15-loth.pdf.
You quote Frank Miele: “If and when Holocaust revisionists produce such material they must be provided full liberty to write, speak, and distribute it, and be accorded the opportunity to present it in respectable journals and academic fora.”
My response: I totally agree with this. However, Holocaust revisionists have often been put in jail in many countries for expressing their views. In the United States, where the First Amendment prevents such punitive measures, Holocaust revisionists can be fired from their jobs merely for expressing their views on an historical subject.
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Truth Vigilante says:@John Wear
John , thanks for that link to your excellent article.
I recommend all UR readers not familiar with the specifics of what went on, take the time to read it so that they can get up to speed on what transpired during the 1985 Ernst Zündel Trial.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Fran Taubman
I don’t know, Fran, all that mumbo jumbo in the box is an extraordinary method of stringing together words and phrases, that taken as a whole, basically says “we don’t want any challenges to our evidence because we are victims and it’s not fair to question our story.” Don’t your eyes cross when you read it?
Have you ever heard Michael Eric Dyson speak? He does something very similar, but he’s not nearly as clever. It’s hard to argue with him because you can’t figure out what he’s actually saying.
If the truth were so obvious and easily discerned by the average person, and clearly and accurately described by former inmates, there would be no need to legislate in order to prevent the official story from unraveling.
I assume you’ve read some of my comments on this thread; do you think I’m a Jew hater, with no concern or care for people caught up in the WW2 conflict?
I would really appreciate it if you would actually watch Dario Gabbai’s shoah interview, just the first twenty minutes, and honestly tell me if you believe that man grew up in a Jewish family in a Jewish community. You can also forward to the end, wherein he fails to properly identify an ID card, issued to him, by the Germans, but the interviewer helps him along. Watch it and tell me what you think.
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Fran Taubman says:@John Wear
Cat and mouse, tick tack toe, and a lot of bullshit nipping around the edges. They went there, they were a threat. no gassing. You sound like and asshole John pure and simple. Any intelligent person with a rational brain can not follow one single thread of reality that you are talking about, without some just pie in the sky idea about what happened. It is too stupid to discuss with you. We did not make this up. You play games, for what reason I will never know.
I would really appreciate it if you would actually watch Dario Gabbai’s shoah interview, just the first twenty minutes, and honestly tell me if you believe that man grew up in a Jewish family in a Jewish community. You can also forward to the end, wherein he fails to properly identify an ID card, issued to him, by the Germans, but the interviewer helps him along. Watch it and tell me what you think.
I sure believe him more that Al Liguori, John Wear, and HdC combined you all sound like a bunch of lunatics trying to catch a thread and pull it loose. The Holocaust is a long long story of thousands of pieces of evidence that tie it all together.
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Fran Taubman says:@John Wear
My response: I totally agree with this. However, Holocaust revisionists have often been put in jail in many countries for expressing their views. In the United States, where the First Amendment prevents such punitive measures, Holocaust revisionists can be fired from their jobs merely for expressing their views on an historical subject.
That is because you are all Jew haters that make no common sense. People just want to put you away, listen to the earlier quotes from Zundel in that article. The big Zionist conspiracy to no where. No where. You have to have a competent story, you have to make sense. Otherwise people like me think you are Jew haters, trying to blame Jews for the Holocaust. That conspiracy is DOA. Think of another one.
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Mark Bahner says:
For those wanting to know about “discovery” prior to civil trials:
It allows each side to prepare for trial. During discovery, the parties gather the evidence (documents, witness testimony, and the like) they will need to submit at trial to prove their case or defend against the other side’s claims.
It allows parties to explore the strengths and weaknesses in the case. Using discovery tools, the parties have the chance to talk to the other side and to witnesses, to see what documents and evidence the other side has that may help or hurt the case, and to learn the other side’s position on critical facts and legal issues.
It allows the parties to evaluate settlement. Once each party knows what evidence exists to support or undercut the claims and defenses in the case, they are in a good position to talk about settling the case without going to trial.
I’m working on behalf of my Plaintiffs. It’s far too late to finish today. And I have other things to do tomorrow, so it might be tomorrow night before I can gather everything.
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@Fran Taubman
…sexual accusations of Leo Frank regarding his daughter.…What sexual perversion did Leo Frank do to his daughter Anne.
Leo Frank didn’t have a daughter. He raped and murdered 13-year-old Mary Phagan.
100 Reasons Leo Frank Is Guilty—Proving That Anti-Semitism Had Nothing to Do With His Conviction — and Proving That His Defenders Have Used Frauds and Hoaxes for 100 Years https://theamericanmercury.org/2013/04/100-reasons-proving-leo-frank-is-guilty/
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littlereddot says:@Mark Bahner
There won’t be any judge.
This may be an issue. Because there will be occasions when procedural disagreements arise. Such as when one side dwells too long on any one subject, and the other side wants to continue, someone, or some committee needs to make a decision.
I think Ron Unz might be the best candidate for the judge. Either him, or someone we can regard as being impartial….or at least fair minded. Hopefully he will have a little knowledge of how trials are run too.
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littlereddot says:@HdC
Do you mean Keegstra and Kundel?
Perhaps it is better to review these trials than to try to re-invent the wheel.
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kb_2 says:@John Wear
John, you cited a book about 1988 Zundel trial in one (or several) of your comments.
If someone is interested, here is a full text of it online: http://ihr.org/books/kulaszka/falsenews.toc.html
• Thanks: littlereddot• Replies: @littlereddotAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Fran Taubman says:@Al Liguori
Otto frank not Leo Frank.. You said Otto frank sexually abused Anne Frank. And the Franks were into theft. Cock sucker
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Brad Anbro says:@Fran Taubman
It is very unfortunate that you have to resort to using profanity. Not very lady-like is it? My dear mother used to tell me that people who use profanity are not intelligent enough to express themselves in conversation that does not include profanity. In other words their limited intelligence is the cause of their use of profanity. Kind of describes you, doesn’t it?
I don’t care whether you “trust” me or not. It is not my place to “have a new idea.” Many historians have come up with “new ideas” which expose history as it was taught to me in schools as fraudulent. Likewise with the mainstream media (MSM) – circulation of outright lies or half-truths, at best.
I likewise do not trust YOU, Wikipedia, any of the so-called “fact checking” websites or anything that the MSM passes off as truth. It is YOU and Mr. Bahner who are in denial. And by the way, he has yet to reply to my post which exposes his ridiculous endorsement of the U.S. government’s own “story” of what happened on September 11, 2001 – and HE is supposed to be a college-educated individual.
For your information, I do NOT “hate Jews. In my hobby of amateur radio (ham radio) I continually have on-the-air conversations with foreign stations. In my 40+ years of being in this hobby, I have never once ignored an Israeli station that has ever called me. I will respond to them, engage them in a short conversation and then move on. I realize that Israeli citizens are “not their government,” just as United States citizens are “not their government.”
In my 72 years on this earth, I have done a fair amount of studying history and events. I have come to the conclusion that practically anywhere there is trouble in the world, one will find Jews and their Zionist accomplices stirring up the trouble.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Fran Taubman
Yes, indeed, it’s a long, long story, which is why I asked you to just focus on one story of one witness and give your opinion on what this one person has claimed.
It’s too stupid to discuss with me? It’s too obvious, you mean.
Your response is more or less what I expected; I know more about Jewish customs than Gabbai did at the time of his interview. The very fact that his interview was permitted to be viewed in public reveals how little the concern is for backlash/pushback, which is not an actual concern when the media is controlled by whomever is controlling/directing it.
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Mark Bahner says:@littlereddot
This may be an issue. Because there will be occasions when procedural disagreements arise. Such as when one side dwells too long on any one subject, and the other side wants to continue, someone, or some committee needs to make a decision.
Children and adults play sports events all the time without referees. We’ll manage. The Plaintiffs have so much evidence in their favor that they literally could present for a year, and not come close to presenting everything. The Plaintiffs counsel understands no one wants to sit through a year-long trial, or even a month-long trial. I’ve already wasted too much of my life on what is essentially a lunatic 6000-year-old-earth theory.
I think the fact is, littlereddot, that this sort of mock trial would be the worst thing in the world for “revisionists.” That’s why I think it’s actually going to be:
1) Just the Plaintiffs announcing what evidence they’re going to present by the end of today.
2) Then silence, unless you ask some questions.
3) Then only one juror will be sworn in (you).
4) Then I’ll present Plaintiffs opening argument (then silence).
5) Then I’ll start to present the Plaintiff’s evidence. Then silence.
6) Then I’ll get done. Then silence.
7) Then you’ll ask any questions.
8) Then you’ll deliberate, asking any further questions.
9) Then you’ll say what your vote is (or each count of the five counts of the complaint).
10) Then all the revisionists will complain what a sham trial is if the judgements on each complaint are in favor of the Plaintiffs (particularly on complaint #5, wrongful death due gassing by Zyklon
11) And if the verdict is in favor of the Nazi Defendants on any count of the complaint, I’ll ask you how in the world you could come up with that verdict when literally scores of *criminal* trials–where the burden of truth has been “beyond a reasonable doubt”–have been against Nazi Defendants. And in fact, in those trials the Nazi Defendants, who often literally faced the death penalty, have ***never even contested*** that hundreds of thousands of people were murdered via Zyklon B at Auschwitz-Birkenau.AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
RUR says:
Hitler’s final demand, that 95% German Danzig be returned to Germany just as its inhabitants desired, was an absolutely reasonable one,
The German name Danzig is a germanized version of the Slavic/Polish name Kdansk(1148)/ Gdansk(1173-86), the earliest germanized version – Dantzig was attested in 1292, and the German name – DANZIG – has no German/Germanic etymology… It is the same with such names as Pomerania – an autonomous Slavic duchy within Germany till 1918 , Silesia and even… Prussia..,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pomeranians_(tribe)
In the 19 century, when that part of Poland became a part of Prussia the city of Gdansk/Danzig was connected by railway to German states at that time• Replies: @RURAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
littlereddot says:@Mark Bahner
Actually, my fear is that if it gets too long, I will lose interest.
• Replies: @Mark BahnerAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
RUR says:@RUR
In the 19 century, when that part of Poland became a part of Prussia the city of Gdansk/Danzig was connected by railway to German parts of Prussia which led to quick germanization of the city… And the mass emigration of Germans from Russia after 1917 revolution also was mainly directed to the city of Gdansk… Interesting that these Russian Germans constituted a considerable part of the Russian ruling elite, which was mainly substituted by a new, communist Russian-Jewish elite in the USSR
Thats why we have these 95% in the city in the period before WW2. And also its interesting that Brandenburg-Prussia (German: Brandenburg-Preußen; Low German: Brannenborg-Preußen) between 1618 and 1701 was mainly populated by Slaws and non-German Prussians… and such non -German state finally united Germany…
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littlereddot says:@kb_2
Thanks, that is very valuable link.
The more I delve into this, the less convincing the H story is.
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RUR says:@Carolyn Yeager
Just about all Poles are liars, just like Jews.
Well, see… it is Germany and the Germans that have Goebbels and Baron Münchhausen – the greatest liars of all times on Earth
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RUR says:@Ron Unz
My point was that he was probably willing to reestablish a (reduced) independent Polish state as part of a peace agreement with the Allies.
Your point and Fuhrer’s as well is that a Great Germany is everywhere where Germans settlers like to choose to live a wonderful and important German life…
The German name Danzig is a germanized version of the Slavic/Polish name Kdansk(1148)/ Gdansk(1173-86), the earliest germanized version – Dantzig was attested in 1292, and the German name – DANZIG – has no German/Germanic etymology… It is the same with such names as Pomerania – an autonomous Slavic duchy within Germany till 1918 , Silesia and even… Prussia..,
See my previous post #1639 & 1641 if interested
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HdC says:@Fran Taubman
Franny wrote: “Tell us about the cock sucking priest!!”
This is pathetic Transferrence, especially from a Jew.
Tell us about the Jewish babies that died in New York city after they contracted hepatitis from a blood sucking rabbi doing his thing after the baby was circumcised.
• Thanks: Al LiguoriAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Alexandros says:@RUR
Joseph Goebbels was probably one of the most honest propagandists of all time. A random statement from him reads today like gospel compared to what counts as “serious information” from jewish outlets.
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HdC says:@littlereddot
I agree.
That’s what I have been advocating to Mr Bahner.
But he wants his kangeroo trial and did not respond.
I am prepared to argue various points of the Zundel trials here, but will not be part of or contribute to any mock trial. We had enough of those, beginning with the Nuernberg war crimes trials.
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HdC says:@Alexandros
Even Churchill wrote in his memoirs that German propaganda and news stories were much more truthful than the stuff printed in the democratic countries.
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Mark Bahner says:
Here is a *preliminary* list of the evidence I intend to present. Note that this list may change, based on whatever evidence the–at this point entirely hypothetical–Defense plans to present. I will include more details to allow the Defense more time to prepare…*if* a Defense Team ever even presents itself.
1) Ruldolf Hoess
a) Confession of Hoess, May 14, 1946
b) Section of Hoess memoirs where he recaculates death toll at Auschwitz to 1.13 million.
c) Statements from Hoess’s memoirs that make it clear he wasn’t suffering from torture either in May 1946 or while he was writing his memoirs.
d) Further statements from Hoess memoirs that show he personally witnessed many instances of operation of the gas chambers2) Testimony from Nazi doctor Fritz Klein at his trial (at which he was convicted)
3) Excerpts from book, “Auschwitz: A Doctor’s Eyewitness Account”, by Jewish prisoner/doctor, Dr. Miklos Nyiszli
4) Conviction of Auschwitz SS guard Oskar Groening for 300,000 counts of accessory to murder
a) News reports of the conviction
b) Interview in which he describes knowing about the gassings, but only accidentally personally witnessing one gassing.5) Conviction of SS guard Reinhold Hanning for 170,000 counts of accessory to murder
6) Layout of the gas chambers at Auschwitz and explanation for the procedures used
a) Plot plans of the Auschwitz I, Birkenau, and Morowicz
b) Plot plans of Crematoria II, III, IV, and V
c) Language from7) Description of the preparations at Auschwitz for “Aktion Hoess,” the Hungarian Jewish extermination
a) Reports to Berlin on the number of Hungarian Jews put on trains over time (totaling 437,000)
b) Construction of the “burn pits” with channels for collecting human grease
c) Description of the procedures from the book of Sonderkommando Filip Muller, “Eyewitness Auschwitz”8) Explanation for why Hungarian Jewish children and old people must have been murdered and their bodies burned
a) Explanation of the concept of Occam’s Razor
b) Reports to Berlin of number of Hungarian Jews transported (437,000 by July 15)
c) Accounts of multiple people, including Shlomo Venezia, Irene Fogel of how they last saw family members on the train platform (and that their family members couldn’t work)
d) Explanation of the desperate plight of the Nazis at the time
e) Explanation why it would be illogical to deport children and old people from Hungary to Auschwitz, and then deport them again to other places within the Reich.
f) Explanation how there is no evidence of an increase in population in Auschwitz that could account for the importation of 437,000 people in less than 2 months without most of them being murdered and crematedAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER -
Tiptoethrutulips says:@HdC
I think the problem is, somewhat, with the terms propaganda/indoctrination; and the intent matters.
If you tell your children everyday, from the moment they begin to communicate, that they must look after their siblings/family, they must work/study hard, they must take pride in themselves and their community, but also accept others may not similarly do so, they must be grateful for what they accomplish or are given, etc., that is, in my opinion, indoctrination for the good.
Rudyard Kipling’s poem, “If”, is a beautiful and poignant message for everyone, and if we were all thusly indoctrinated, life would be much better for everyone.
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Mark Bahner says:@littlereddot
Actually, my fear is that if it gets too long, I will lose interest.
Yes, I’m willing to come to any agreement with the Defense and jurors on number of days of the trial, and total number of words and references the Defense proposes.
One thing the I want to protect my clients from is nonsense like, “Here are the transcripts of the Zundel trial. Read them. They prove that there were no gas chambers at Auschwitz.”
I’m very happy kb 2 presented a link to the Zundel trial:
http://ihr.org/books/kulaszka/falsenews.toc.html
But simply from reading a tiny bit of the cross examination of Fred Leuchter, I think the Crown (the prosecutor in the trial) did a terrible job. I would have presented Fred Leuchter with sworn statements from Nazis who were prosecuted (like Rudolf Hoess) and asked him whether he thought those sworn statements were lies…considering that many of the men were put to death directly as a result of those statements.
Also, that trial was about the entire Holocaust, not just Auschwitz. I don’t want to talk about any other concentration camp until everyone is clear that, at Auschwitz, hundreds of thousands of people were executed in gas chambers and their bodies burned, and their ashes scattered in a tributary of the Vistula river, as well as in ponds, and dispersed on the ground.
Also, since the farcical Zundel trial, we have multiple former Nazi guards who have been convicted of hundreds of thousands of counts of accessory to murder, specifically Oskar Groening and Reinhold Hanning.
P.S. kb 2! Are you interested in being a juror?
(Please don’t even consider it, if doing so might present any risk to you.)AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Tiptoethrutulips says:@HdC
“If”, Rudyard Kipling
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “I’ll ask you how in the world you could come up with that verdict when literally scores of *criminal* trials–where the burden of truth has been “beyond a reasonable doubt”–have been against Nazi Defendants.”
My response: Actually, the Allies reversed the burden of proof after World War II against alleged German war criminals. I have written several articles on this matter. I recommend you read my article at https://www.inconvenienthistory.com/11/4/6950 for a more complete explanation.
In the Mauthausen trials, for example, Chief prosecutor Lt. Col. William D. Denson argued that simply serving in any capacity at Mauthausen or any of its sub-camps constituted a war crime. Denson contended that Mauthausen was a “Class III extermination camp” with a common design to torture and kill its prisoners. Denson implied that any defendant who had served at Mauthausen was guilty unless proven innocent. (Source: Jardim, Tomaz, The Mauthausen Trial, Cambridge, Mass.: Harvard University Press, 2012, pp. 172, 186).
As with the other trials conducted at Dachau, the Mauthausen trials were totally biased against the German defendants. The use of torture and deception to produce false confessions, lax rules of evidence and procedure, the presumption that defendants were guilty unless proven innocent, American military judges with little or no legal training, obviously false eyewitness testimony, the nonexistence of any appeal, and the nonexistence of any independent reviewing authority ensured the conviction of all the Mauthausen defendants and the execution of most of them.
Even Benjamin Ferencz acknowledged the unfairness of the Dachau trials:
“I was there for the liberation, as a sergeant in the Third Army, General Patton’s Army, and my task was to collect camp records and witness testimony, which became the basis for prosecutions…But the Dachau trials were utterly contemptible. There was nothing resembling the rule of law. More like court-martials…It was not my idea of a judicial process. I mean, I was a young, idealistic Harvard law graduate.” (Source: Stuart, Heikelina Verrijn and Simons, Marlise, The Prosecutor and the Judge, Amsterdam: Amsterdam University Press, 2009, p. 17).
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RUR says:@Alexandros
I’m not so well-versed in Jewish history as you, but read some Goebbels thoughts:
“A lie repeated a thousand times becomes the truth”, “Propaganda loses its power as soon as it becomes clear”, “The worst enemy of any propaganda is intellectualism. Propaganda should always be addressed not to the intelligentsia, but to the masses”, “Propaganda should affect the feelings, not the mind”, “We are not seeking the truth, but the effect”, – the famous statements of Joseph Goebbels, which are actively used by some modern politicians .
“Give me the media, and I will make a herd of pigs out of any nation.”
Goebbels is sometimes credited with another saying: “The more monstrous the lie, the more willingly they will believe in it.” But it does not belong to him, but to his patron, Hitler.
…Goebbels and Baron Münchhausen, Hitler… – probably its unique on a global scale
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Truth Vigilante says:@Mark Bahner
Mark ‘Mordechai’ Bahner-stein writes:
I don’t want to talk about any other concentration camp until everyone is clear that, at Auschwitz, hundreds of thousands of people were executed in gas chambers
Seeing as it’s CRYSTAL CLEAR that there were NO gas chambers at Auschwitz, and hence not a single person died from Zyklon B, I guess you won’t be talking about much of anything.
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “But simply from reading a tiny bit of the cross examination of Fred Leuchter, I think the Crown (the prosecutor in the trial) did a terrible job. I would have presented Fred Leuchter with sworn statements from Nazis who were prosecuted (like Rudolf Hoess) and asked him whether he thought those sworn statements were lies…considering that many of the men were put to death directly as a result of those statements.”
My response: We have been over this before, but to reiterate, Rudolf Höss had been brutally tortured. No testimony made after someone has been tortured would be acceptable as evidence in any legitimate court of law.
The Allies used sleep deprivation to break Höss. British Pvt. Ken Jones confirmed that the British used sleep deprivation to break Höss. Jones stated:
“We sat in the cell with him, night and day, armed with axe handles. Our job was to prod him every time he fell asleep to help break down his resistance. When Höss was taken out for exercise, he was made to wear only jeans and a thin cotton shirt in the bitter cold. After three days and nights without sleep, Höss finally broke down and made a full confession to the authorities.” (Source: Mattogno, Carlo, Commandant of Auschwitz: Rudolf Höss, His Torture and His Forced Confessions, Uckfield, UK: Castle Hill Publishers, 2017, pp. 16-17).
The fact that Höss was a thoroughly broken man has been confirmed by numerous Allies. While Höss waited in his cell to be called as a witness at the IMT, he was visited by psychologist Dr. Gustave Gilbert, a New Yorker born to Jewish-Austrian immigrants. Gilbert wrote about Höss:
“In all of the discussions Höss is quite matter-of-fact and apathetic, shows some belated interest in the enormity of his crime, but gives the impression that it never would have occurred to him if somebody hadn’t asked him. There is too much apathy to leave any suggestion of remorse and even the prospect of hanging does not unduly distress him. One gets the general impression of a man who is intellectually normal but with the schizoid apathy, insensitivity and lack of empathy that could hardly be more extreme in a frank psychotic.” (Source: Gilbert, Gustave M., Nuremberg Diary, New York: Farrar, Straus and Company, 1947, p. 260).
Dr. Gilbert later wrote after Höss’s testimony at the IMT: “He gave his testimony in the same matter-of-fact, apathetic manner as he had related it to me in his cell.” (Source: Ibid., p. 264).
American Maj. Leon Goldensohn, a U.S. Army psychiatrist, also remarked that “Höss looked blank and apathetic.” (Source: Mattogno, Carlo, Commandant of Auschwitz: Rudolf Höss, His Torture and His Forced Confessions, Uckfield, UK: Castle Hill Publishers, 2017, pp. 119, 329).
As he had done at Nuremberg, when Höss was tried in Poland, he remained stoic, answering all questions in a brief, precise manner, without emotions. Similar to Dr. Gustave Gilbert and Dr. Leon Goldensohn at Nuremberg, both Polish lead investigator Dr. Jan Shen and lead prosecutor Dr. Tadeusz Cyprian described Höss as being apathetic.
In my opinion, Höss’s “schizoid apathy” and “apathetic manner” were caused by his brutal torture by British soldiers. Höss was not usually described as apathetic before he was tortured.
Now we get to the last commandant at Auschwitz, Richard Baer, who did not live to see the beginning of his trial in Frankfurt, Germany. He was arrested in December of 1960 in the vicinity of Hamburg. Baer during his pretrial questioning adamantly refused to confirm the existence of homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz during World War II.
Baer died in June 1963 under mysterious circumstances while being held in pretrial custody. An autopsy performed on Baer at the Frankfurt-am-Main University School of Medicine stated that the ingestion of an odorless, non-corrosive poison could not be ruled out as the cause of his death. There was no further probe into the cause of Baer’s death, and Chief Public Prosecutor Fritz Bauer ordered his body cremated. Conveniently, the Auschwitz trial in Frankfurt, Germany began almost immediately after Baer’s death. The statements Baer made during his pretrial interrogations were not read into the trial record. With Baer’s death the prosecutors at the Auschwitz trial were able to attain their primary objective—to reinforce the gas chamber myth and establish it as an unassailable historical fact. (Source: Stäglich, Wilhelm, Auschwitz: A Judge Looks at the Evidence, Institute for Historical Review, 1990, pp. 238-239).
It has been widely known ever since the illegal abduction of Adolf Eichmann in Argentina that the Israeli Mossad has immense capabilities. Given the fact that Chief Public Prosecutor Bauer was a Zionist Jew, which should have precluded him from heading the pretrial investigation, it is quite possible that the forces of international Jewry were able to murder Baer while he was in jail. If anyone knew the truth about the gas chamber allegation, it was Baer, the last commandant of Auschwitz. Baer’s untimely death prevented him from giving testimony that would have contradicted the official Holocaust narrative. Baer’s death was certainly a relief for the promoters of the Auschwitz trial. (Source: Ibid.)
Now we get to SS Capt. Josef Kramer, who was the commandant of Birkenau from May 8, 1944 to November 25, 1944, and of the Bergen-Belsen concentration camp from December 1944 to its liberation by the British on April 15, 1945. Kramer was the principal defendant in the Belsen trial conducted by the British in the autumn of 1945. This trial was concluded in November, just as the IMT was beginning. Kramer was hanged on December 13, 1945.
Kramer in his first statement to his British interrogators emphasized that he did not know of an extermination program in any German camps. Kramer said:
“I have heard of the allegations of former prisoners in Auschwitz referring to a gas chamber there, the mass executions and whippings, the cruelty of the guards employed, and that all this took place either in my presence or with my knowledge. All I can say to all this is that it is untrue from beginning to end.” (Source: Butz, Robert, The Hoax of the Twentieth Century, Newport Beach, Cal.: Institute for Historical Review, 1993, pp. 176, 271).
We know that Kramer and other defendants at the Belsen trial were tortured, sometimes to the point of begging to be put to death. (Source: Belgion, Montgomery, Victors’ Justice, Hillsdale, Ill.: Henry Regnery, 1949, pp. 80-81).
British journalist Alan Moorehead, for example, described the treatment of camp personnel at Bergen-Belsen after the British takeover of the camp:
“As we approached the cells of the SS guards, the [British] sergeant’s language became ferocious…. The sergeant unbolted the first door and…strode into the cell, jabbing a metal spike in front of him. ‘Get up’ he shouted. ‘Get up. Get up, you dirty bastards.’ There were half a dozen men lying or half lying on the floor. One or two were able to pull themselves erect at once. The man nearest me, his shirt and face splattered with blood, made two attempts before he got on to his knees and then gradually on to his feet. He stood with his arms stretched out in front of him, trembling violently.
‘Come on. Get up’ the sergeant shouted [in the next cell]. The man was lying in his blood on the floor, a massive figure with a heavy head and bedraggled beard… ‘Why don’t you kill me?’ he whispered. ‘Why don’t you kill me? I can’t stand it anymore.’ The same phrases dribbled out of his lips over and over again. ‘He’s been saying that all morning, the dirty bastard,’ the sergeant said.” (Source: Moorehead, Alan, “Belsen” in Cyril Connolly (ed.), The Golden Horizon, London: Weidenfeld & Nicolson, 1953, p. 105f).
Kramer later changed his statement to his interrogators. Kramer’s change was probably made either in response to his being tortured, or because his defense attorney advised him that he had told a story that could not be accepted by the court. (Source: Butz, Arthur R., The Hoax of the Twentieth Century: The Case Against the Presumed Extermination of European Jewry, Newport Beach, Cal: Institute for Historical Review, ninth printing, 1992, pp. 189-190).
Regardless, Kramer did not receive a fair trial. His execution by hanging after the Belsen trial was a foregone conclusion before the trial even began.
Since we are by mutual agreement are discussing only Auschwitz-Birkenau, I will stop there. We have Rudolf Höss being brutally tortured, so his confession should not count as evidence. We have Richard Baer adamantly refusing to confirm the existence of homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz during World War II. We also have Josef Kramer saying he did not know of an extermination program at any German camps.
So, we have two Auschwitz-Birkenau commandants saying there were no homicidal gas chambers, while Höss said there were gas chambers after he was tortured. Since testimony from someone who has been tortured does not count in any legitimate court of law, we have two Auschwitz-Birkenau commandants to none saying there were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
John, I’ll be happy to address any comments you have *after* I present my evidence regarding Rudolf Höss. So you’re welcome to refer me to these comments *after* I present my evidence.
But speaking of which, there’s still no one representing the Defense. Are you interested in representing the Defense? If not, are you interested in being on the jury? (Note: If you’re not on the Defense, I’m not sure there will even be a Defense, because at this point no one has volunteered.)
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Fran Taubman says:
There were 1.1 million mostly Jews gasses and cremated at Auschwitz, and another 1 million combined in the rest of the camps. Everyone on this thread is so hung up on Zykon B. In the East in Belarus and Ukraine. The Germans would come into the Ghettos were they rounded up the Jews, the Einsatzgruppen would come in and shoot the ghetto up in one day. My mothers cousin was out of the ghetto trying to get food, and someone came and found her and told her not to come back because most of her family had been shot.
The Rovno Ghetto (also: Równe or Rivne Ghetto, Yiddish: ראָװנע)[1][2][a] was a World War II Nazi ghetto established in December 1941 in the city of Rovno, western Ukraine, in the territory of German-administered Reichskommissariat Ukraine. On 6 November 1941, about 21,000 Jews were massacred by Einsatzgruppe C and their Ukrainian collaborators. The remaining Jews were imprisoned in the ghetto. In July 1942, all remaining 5,000 Jews were trucked to a stone quarry near Kostopol and murdered there.[1][3]
The ghetto was liquidated on July 13, 1942. Only a handful of Jews managed to escape deportation.
Sienkiewiczówka, Poland
78 years ago 2nd day Chol Chol Hamoed Sukkot, the Nazis “liquidated” the ghetto in Senkevichevka, Ukraine. Among those murdered were:

My mother’s grandfather, Moshe Dovid Fine (age 80)
My mother’s father, Avrohom Beitsch (age 57)
My mother’s sister, Molly Beitsch (age 18)
My mother’s aunt & uncle, Sara Fine Wollich (age 51) and Yosef Wollich (age 55)
My mother’s first cousin, Cheike Wollich Chechman (age 32), her husband Mendel Chechman, and their daughter Devora Chechman (age 7)
My mother’s aunt, Baila Fine (age 45)
My father’s parents Avrohom Tzvi Diamant (age 65) and Tzivia Suttleman Diamant (age 54)
My father’s sister and brother-in-law Kreina Diamant Mazurik (age 26) and David Mazurik
My father’s niece Rivka Mazurik (age 5)
My father’s brother Shlomo Diamant (age 14)AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Fran Taubman says:@John Wear
So, we have two Auschwitz-Birkenau commandants saying there were no homicidal gas chambers, while Höss said there were gas chambers after he was tortured. Since testimony from someone who has been tortured does not count in any legitimate court of law, we have two Auschwitz-Birkenau commandants to none saying there were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
Stop denying, tell the story of what you think happened to all the missing Jews, whose families say were gassed and cremated, the workers say were gassed and cremated. People told the same story Hoss tells which you say was extracted by torture. Perry Broad tells the same story some 4 years before.Tell a story that makes sense and stop denying.
Holocaust revisionists must provide their own detailed account of what actually did happen to all those Jews if they did not die the way we have been told they did.
In particular, to be taken seriously and not be dismissed as “conspiracy theorists,” revisionist cannot invoke the machinations of powerful, nefarious Zionist controlled entities to explain away
testimony or evidence that supports the received version. Rather, revisionists must demonstrate independent, falsifiable (in Popper’s sense of being capable of being disproved) evidence that a small group of Zionist Jews could so effectively put one over on all the rest of us, at no small cost to us, and yet have proved singularly unable to rescue the bulk of their coreligionists from the horrors that befell them (even if only the limited set of horrors conceded by the revisionists).AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Alexandros says:@RUR
Yes, Joseph Goebbels was a propagandist. His official place of work was literally called “the propaganda ministry”. And his take on effective propaganda is the golden standard in every country skilled in the art.
But he was still honest, and he was concerned that his propaganda not be outright lies. He believed the masses could in fact handle the truth. The jews and the western allies suffered no such compunctions. They recognized, also rightly, that the masses will believe anything, and that lies are better for this purpose because lies can be tailored to your specific needs.
The last, incomplete quote, is indeed Hitler. You can search up the full quote in Mein Kampf. Then you will see that he is speaking about the jews and liars in general, he is not speaking about himself.
People tend to forget that most of what “they know” about Hitler and the Nazis come from western and jewish sources, ie. complete liars.
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kb_2 says:@Mark Bahner
Mark, John, Fran, littlereddot and other ladies and gentlemen (I don’t name the rest, not because I don’t respect, but because of bravity).
This thread is very large and slow to load. What about to move in https://www.unz.com/runz/more-falsehoods-of-world-war-ii/
It only has 500 comments, but here there are already 1660. I think it will load faster if we move…
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Brad Anbro says:@John Wear
John,
I just finished watching (for the first time – I am 72 years old!) “Judgment at Nuremberg.” As most people know, this movie was in black & white and came out in the year 1961.
At the end of the movie, the lawyer for the defense was giving his closing arguments to the jury as to why the defendants should be found innocent. In his arguments, he mentioned that the REAL war criminals were (in addition to Hitler, who was already dead) Churchill, Roosevelt and Stalin and all of the leaders of the American corporations which supplied armaments (TO BOTH SIDES).
I concur completely with the lawyer’s arguments. Had I been on the jury, I would have found them all INNOCENT. Other war criminals, which were not mentioned specifically in the movie, were the American and British banks and the REAL powers-that-be.
Thank you.
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Mark Bahner says:@Fran Taubman
Hi Fran,
I’m so sorry for your family’s horrible losses due to the absolute evil of Nazi ideology.
I’m “hung up” on Zyklon B and Auschwitz because:
1) Unlike mass shootings spread across several countries, the murders in Auschwitz-Birkenau occurred right in that one place.
2) We have much more documentation about exactly how, when, and where the murders at Auschwitz-Birkenau occurred.
3) Especially for the 437,000 Hungarian Jews arriving at Auschwitz-Birkenau from May-July 1944, we have an insanely large number of people arriving, in a very short period of time, just months before liberation of the camp. Therefore, there is absolutely no way there would be any reason to for the Nazis to send any of them who were “not fit to work” to Auschwitz-Birkenau, except to murder them by Zyklon B and burn their bodies. And the fact that there is absolutely no evidence that even of a significant fraction of them ever appeared outside the camp again means they absolutely must have been murdered there.
But once again, I’m so sorry for the horrible losses of your family. From your account, it seems that both your mother and father survived the war. I’m sure when you were born and as you grew to adulthood, it was a great comfort to them.
Best wishes,
MarkAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
John Wear says:@kb_2
You write: “This thread is very large and slow to load. What about to move in https://www.unz.com/runz/more-falsehoods-of-world-war-ii/
My response: I think this is a good idea. I will start making comments on this discussion thread.
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Mark Bahner says:@kb_2
Hi, kb_2:
Oh, my. I can understand the slow load might be frustrating. (I’m not seeing that problem on my computer. I guess my Internet connection must be faster.)
I wanted Ron Unz to create a separate post that only addressed the mock trial. That would have been the most convenient and clear way to do it. But now that I’ve already started comments that outline the evidence I’ll be presenting, I hate to move to another comment thread. This is particularly true because a fair amount of the evidence I present at the trial will include references back to previous comments I’ve made on this thread.
Another thing is that I’ve really taken vastly more time with this discussion than I ever intended. So when this mock trial is over, I don’t expect I’ll be coming back to Ron Unz review much anymore. So that is another reason I’d like to keep all my comments here on this post.
So I’m very sorry, but I think I’ll stay on this post. I probably won’t have more than 20-30 more comments, anyway.
Best wishes,
Mark• Replies: @kb_2AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
HdC says:@Mark Bahner
Good to know Mark that you are ready to accept any Jewish caterwauling and synthetic outrage as evidence of German evil doings.
Not this engineer, by a long shot.
I insist on authenticated forensic evidence for every single allegation made against Germany.
If you had the intellectual honesty to read John Wear’s article on the Zundel trials in Toronto (referenced earlier, above), you would understand why I and others insist on authenticated evidence or other scientific proof offered by trustworthy personnel or institutions.
Not ONE of the prosecution eye witnesses testifying during those trials had first hand knowledge of any gassings. The “eye witnesses” could not even get the colour of the corpses correct, or how to safely handle corpses gassed with Zyklon B.
You are free, of course, to disbelieve what John has written in his article. It would be very easy for you to verity what John has written. I suggest you begin with the colour of the corpses, which the witnesses described as various shades of grey-blue-green.
Peruse a handbook for forensic examination for this.
I’m sure you have heard of the Lipstadt – Irving trial in Britain. In his summation the learned Judge accepted the testimony of a Jewish witness that it took only 3.5Kg of coal-coke to cremate one corpse! Again it is very easy to verify how much fuel it takes to cremate one corpse.
Your bosom buddy Franny has never addressed these questions, which were tabled in another thread on this forum. I certainly expected better from you; alas, I was wrong.
• Thanks: John Wear• Replies: @Mark BahnerAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
kb_2 says:@Mark Bahner
Do you read a debate between revisionist Dr. Thomas Dalton and PhD student in history Matt Сockerill?
https://codoh.com/media/files/images/cockerill_holo_debate_-_full_text-compressed.pdf
It may be interesting to you as an example of the debate between the mainstream and the revisionists.
P.S With regard to the debate in this thread… I’ve read here at least 10 times the same questions and answers) Perhaps some or many of them are not yours (I will not reread the whole thread to check)
For everyone’s comfort – the brief content of the previous episodes (I hope this is funny and doesn’t offend anyone):
– Where did the Hungarian Jews go? Babies and old people.
– There were no gas chambers. Check out the aerial photo!
– Here’s the testimonial
– He was tortured
– He then said the same
– But he was tortured
– Others said similar things!
– Where is the physical evidence?
– Look into their eyes, are all these witnesses lying?
– it was not an extermination camp. Leuchter – engineer
– Leuchter is a liar!
– Leuchter is an engineer!
– I am an engineer
– You are a liar!
– You are a liar!
– The more I talk to you, the more I doubt!
– Where did the Hungarian Jews go? Why do you deny the Holocaust?
– [quote referring to Carlo Mattogno]
– You are an anti-Semite!
– You are a Jew! How can you believe in the Holocaust?
– I hate deniers! I am a Jew! Read this book about Auschwitz! Zero intellect!
– Read the court transcript. By the way, I wrote an article about it. You can read it on my website.
– Hungarian Jews!
– Transit camps!
– Why do you deny the Holocaust?
– [quote referring to Mattogno, Carlo]
– You are an anti-Semite!
– That’s what the Bible says.
– You are psychotic!
– Jews! Jews! So many Jews around!
– … Where did the Hungarian Jews go? -
@Mark Bahner
It was not proved in Canada that no homicidal gas chambers existed.
It was NOT “proved” anywhere that “homicidal gas chambers” existed, or that they were used by the Nazis.
It was “proved” in the 1985 Zundel trial that Raul Hillberg, the world’s leading authority on “the Holocaust” and the prosecution’s expert, was a hack, who lied under oath and perjured himself on the stand.
The evidence of the existence of gas chambers has been proven in many trials in many places, including:
No, the “evidence of the existence of gas chambers” has NOT been “proven in many trials in many places”, including those three “trials” you linked to, which don’t even mention “gas chambers”.
I could literally go on for over an hour, but I’ve got other things to do right now.
There is no doubt, and a shit ton of evidence, that absolute fucking idiots like you and Fran Taubman can literally go on talking utter fucking shit, for hours, for days, for weeks, for months and for years even, but there isn’t a single shred of evidence, not even one, proving that “homicidal gas chambers” existed.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@anon
Well, now you’ve gone and disqualified yourself for Mark’s jury panel.
• LOL: John WearAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
Mark Bahner says:@HdC
In his summation the learned Judge accepted the testimony of a Jewish witness that it took only 3.5Kg of coal-coke to cremate one corpse! Again it is very easy to verify how much fuel it takes to cremate one corpse.
OK, what do you think?
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Fran Taubman says:@Mark Bahner
It was not my mother and father. The list was made by my first cousin’s whose mother, Sonia Diamond was a survivor of the Senkevichevka Ghetto. First it was in Poland, then Russia now Ukraine. My parents sponsored her and her husband from DB camps. A small ghetto of maybe 7000 Jews from small villages around the area were gathered into this one ghetto. It was bad but nothing like the Polish ghettoes. The non Jewish families and the Jews were close neighbors, and many families helped the Jews get food etc. Polish Christians hid my cousins until the end of the war. They came to my home town to be honored. So you would be calling the Christian Poles that saved my cousin liars also? Because these Polish friends of my family went into the woods and warned my cousin that her family had all been shot to death. Do revisionist believe those stories?
Does the Revisionist movement deny that Ghettoes and their inhabitants were shot to death when Ghettoes were liquidated by the Germans? Who would should someones grandfather or older relative. This happened in Ghetto after Ghetto in the Eastern regions. The survivors formed a resistance movement in the forest, run by two brothers the Belski Brothers.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bielski_partisans
This resistance was formed from survivors of the Einsatzgruppen. Sometimes one survivor would run into the forest, and meet other survivors. This partisan group were ruthless to the Germans. They had seen their entire families be killed, when they captured a German the tore him limb to limb.
Do revisionist deny liquidation’s of ghettoes resulting in the mass shooting of the inhabitants. I guess you would be calling my family liars, and story tellers. Oh well. Revisionist have no answers to the dead Jews so they dance and side step their way along.
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Fran Taubman says:
I cannot go to the other thread it is to toxic.
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kb_2 says:@Fran Taubman
You can choose another and offer others (if Mark agrees).
I think that switching to another thread doesn’t mean we can’t refer to this one – it just needs to be kept open in another tab
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kb_2 says:@Fran Taubman
Your family history sounds terrible. I’m sorry for your losses.
I don’t know what the revisionist view of this is but probably their response to this would either a) point out that the survivors did not see the shootings in the ghetto (which leads to a paradox) or b) acknowledge the shootings (to some extent or completely) but doubt other parts of the Holocaust or c) to doubt (or disbelief) your words.
The weakness of the first point – like all attempts to disprove witnesses – is that people who were not there doubt the words of people who were nearby.
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ivan says:@Malla
Hitler didn’t think much of Indians. I read third-hand that in some coffee book or other, Hitler suggested that the Indians fighting under the Waffen SS before Moscow be sent back to India to spin wheels with Gandhi. He was full of admiration for the Spanish Aznar Division, but for the Indians he had nothing but contempt.
SC Bose was of course a fighter, but the legends around the INA was unwarranted by their actual performance on the field. The British Army in Burma, more or less routed both them and their Japanese sponsors in their great fightback. The Forgotten Army as they became known were prepared to go down all the way to Malaya to redeem their honour, but didn’t have to on account of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. It would be very odd for Hitler to consider Indians anything other than Untermenschen. He had time only for the European blondes. This Aryan thingy about Indians was more along Himmler’s line, for which Hitler had nothing but derision.
You might be interested in this:
Interesting that Balasaheb Ambedkar “The Father of the Indian Constitution” had such a jaundiced view of MK Gandhi “The Father of the Indian Nation.” The things one learns on the internet!AGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD -
RouterAl says:
Interesting threads, it’s a pity David Irving did not settle this matter once and for all. My take on this is from the Wannsee meeting the Germans had approx 4.5 million Jews under their control and after the war they paid out reparations to 4.3 million Jews so there must have been some survivors. Second in his book 200 years together Solzhenitsyn states the Soviets transported 1- 1.5 million jews out of Poland and the Pale deeper into Russia , most to the Urals where they I assume they worked in the Soviet war effort industries. The main reason you cannot find the “missing” Jews is they were trapped behind the Iron Curtain , rather ironic to be trapped by their own creation the Soviet state.
Now almost no one believes that any of the German camps had “gas chambers” and that the ones that persist are mainly in former Polish communist territories but to me Majdanek is the best proof nothing happened except in the Jewish imagination. The communist post war figure’s for the deaths was 1.7 million but subsequent revision has brought that down to 78,000 2/3 of which were polish Catholics who died of disease. If you watch a certain Steven Spielberg film when the Jews enter the shower room at a camp which is clearly Majdanek they are showered not by poison gas but by water , as E Michael Jones points out is this not Holocaust denial?.
Mr Joseph Ginsburg at the Zundel trial was asked how do you make a Jew testify in court to the real truth? he said ,
Jew-wise Gentiles know about the “jews’ oath” or Kol Nidre prayer, which all devout jews say every year to absolve them from telling the truth in the year to come. But there is a way to make a religious jew tell the truth, according to Josef Ginsburg, who was himself the son of an orthodox rabbi.“First, all Christian symbols must be cleared from the room. Then, a Hebrew bible and a rabbi must be present. The jew must don a skull cap and take a rabbinical oath which nullifies the Kol Nidre anti-oath oath.” After this procedure, Josef Ginsburg claimed that “99.5% of all the sick holocaust stories would become truthful silence!” Jews are not otherwise bound to tell the truth, because their courtroom oath (as well as their pledge of allegiance) is deemed by them to be of no account, whatsoever!
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Truth Vigilante says:@Fran Taubman
Does the Revisionist movement deny that Ghettoes and their inhabitants were shot to death when Ghettoes were liquidated by the Germans?
I can’t speak for the whole ‘Revisionist movement’ but there is ample evidence that the bulk of Jews killed in the eastern territories were NOT killed by the Germans, but by the local inhabitants as retribution for the tyranny and genocide imposed by Soviet Jewish Kommissars during the Holodomor and similar Jewish led terrorism and exploitation of the population.
These pogroms against the Jewish communities occurred in the Baltic nations (Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia), and especially in Ukraine.
Take for example the Lvov pogroms, which were the consecutive pogroms and massacres of Jews in June and July 1941 in the city of Lwów in German-occupied Eastern Poland/Western Ukraine (now Lviv, Ukraine). The massacres were perpetrated overwhelmingly by Ukrainian nationalists (specifically, the OUN).According to estimates by contemporary historians, the number of victims in Western Ukraine was probably between 10,000 and 40,000.
As another example, the Arajs Commando, a Latvian volunteer police unit, for example, shot 26,000 Latvian Jews, at various locations.Add in the pogroms that took place elsewhere in Ukraine, together with those that occurred in the Baltic nations, and this accounts for almost the entirety of those Jews that were killed in the eastern territories.
Got it Fran ? It WASN’T the Germans doing it.
The bulk of Jews killed in the east were at the hands of local communities. They were vengeance attacks in response to the brutal treatments (starvation/genocide), that they were subjected to under Soviet occupation in the 1920’s and 30’s.
In other words, because of the murderous actions of a small portion of Jewry (the bloodthirsty Jewish Soviet Kommissars and Jewish Bolsheviks in high political positions), the rank and file innocent Jews (like your relatives that were later murdered), would pay a heavy price.
If at the time that the Holodomor was being perpetrated, the Jewish community rose up as one and forcefully opposed it, called out those members within their community that were taking part in it as Kommissars and other political apparatchiks, then perhaps there would have been no Holodomor in the first place.However, for propaganda purposes and in pursuit of advancement of the fictional Hlocaust narrative, these Jewish deaths during WWII were blamed on the Einsatzgruppen.
Fast forward to the present and the same thing is happening today.
The Jewish community as a whole (although there are a few courageous and notable exceptions), has been too GUTLESS to call out those within their ranks that played pivotal roles in the 9/11 False Flag. ie: the Michael Chertoff’s, Larry Silverstein’s, Dov Zakheim’s, Philip Zelikow’s of the world.And let’s not forget the husband of one of your client’s Fran.
Yes, I refer to that coward Howard Lutnick. (‘Howard the Coward’ has a nice ring to it. After all, this bastard, who was the CEO of Cantor Fitzgerald at the time of the 9/11 False Flag, lost 658 employees in the Mossad orchestrated controlled demolition of the North tower on that day.
But, by some miraculous cohen-cidence, he (like Larry Silver-Stain and luck Larry’s progeny), was not at work in the WTC towers that fateful day – almost as if he’d a premonition or forewarning of danger (a forewarning he chose not to share with his 658 employees who perished that day).
Take a look at this video of Lutnick taken soon after 9/11, and tell me if you think that is sincere grief he’s expressing for the [alleged*] loss of his brother and other staff members:
(*Lutnick’s brother was alleged to have been among the Cantor Fitzgerald employees that died that day, but for all we know he may have been ushered out of the U.S in the days that followed and is now living in an adjoining seaside villa to Jeffrey Epstein in the Apartheid Israeli state).
Bottom Line: Fran, in your capacity as ‘useful idiot’, you are covering for the crimes of ZOG, the cabal who actually engineered both WWI and II, the phony Holohoax, the JFK coup d’etat and thereafter the 9/11 False Flag and the recent Covid Psyop.
ZOG sacrificed the lives of tens of thousands of rank and file innocent Jews during WWII (like your relatives), in pursuit of their greater agenda.
They’ve done likewise in orchestrating 9/11 and the Covid Psyop.It is important that you wake up from your stupor and acknowledge that a depraved subset of Jewry (ie: the Zionist Usury Banking Cartel/aka ZOG) is giving all of your brethren a bad name.
It is not enough that you just call them out. It is imperative that your community act as one in apprehending them and ensuring that they’re prosecuted.You can take the first step yourself Fran and make a citizen’s arrest of ‘Howard the Coward’ Lutnick.
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Brad Anbro says:
I really cannot get over all this childish banter, fueled by individuals such as Mark Bahner, Fran Taubman and the others who continually respond to their inconsequential nonsense. ARGUING about things such as how many were “gassed,” what happened to this group or that, etc. is just playing into the hands of the “Global Elite” – their latest effort to establish a One World fascist dictatorship being the “World Economic Forum” and their JEWISH PAWNS, Klaus Schwab and Yuval Harari.
I have NEWS for you people. They are coming for YOU. And me. They will stop at nothing until they own EVERYTHING and you & I own NOTHING and are their abject slaves. That is, the ones who will be allowed to live. They don’t give a damn about any of us, only of themselves. If you, Mr. Bahner or you, Ms. Taubman, think that you and your families will somehow be “spared” from this upcoming disaster, you are very much mistaken.
Sad to say, the Unz website also plays right into their hands – providing a forum for discussing and arguing about (relatively) inconsequential matters, while the Global Elite firm up their plans of complete world conquest.
This is just my opinion, but if Mr. Unz was serious about helping people and waking them up to their impending DOOM, he would promote columns about this very subject, not about subjects that are of essentially little consequence.
There have been many groups who have taken it upon themselves to try to educate the public as to what is really going on and they have come out with many worthwhile videos. I will provide links to a few of them –
https://stopworldcontrol.com/cabal/
https://stopworldcontrol.com/monopoly/
With the advent of CBDC (Central Bank Digital Currency), if this does get implemented, your freedom, and mine, will be gone forever. Because the Global Elite will then be in complete control of everything and there will be nothing that any of us can do about it.
Something to think about, rather than arguing among yourselves…
Thank you.
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littlereddot says:@HdC
I just looked at one witness testimony at random; that of Legace. And from that alone, it fits comfortably with my own observations about the design of the place. Plus he inputs his own expertise as to the operations of crematoria. If all the other witnesses were like Legace, I can’t see how any jury would convict.
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littlereddot says:@Mark Bahner
Also, that trial was about the entire Holocaust, not just Auschwitz.
My opinion is that in order for the Mock Trial to be as succinct as possible, the Prosecutor should choose a single piece of evidence, and prosecute on that. If Auschwitz is the strongest, then concentrate on that. That would be better than going through the voluminous arguments involved if it were to involve the whole Holocaust.
At this point, I had a look very briefly at the Kundel trial witness testimonies, and picked one testimony at random. I must say that it doesn’t look good for the Prosecution.
However for the sake of fairness, I am willing to listen to the Prosecutor’s arguments.
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littlereddot says:@Fran Taubman
Thank you for your candour.
I live half a world away, and my people suffered the Japanese occupation. There was also systematic slaughter of young or educated men that the Japanese thought would be risky to have around. In total about 1 in every 10 men “disappeared”. They were simply taken to the beaches and shot….no concentration camps for them.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sook_Ching
Now despite revisionists who deny this ever happened, I know it did FOR A FACT. I have relatives and friends whose uncles and sons where taken away and “disappeared”. I know a bishop who walked with a terrible limp for life because as a young man he was tortured by the Kempeitai military police. My own parents, as young kids, knew to bow deeply to every passing Japanese soldier, or risk a rifle butt in their stomach.
This is why I am especially careful when reviewing the facts involved in the Holocaust.
I am very mindful of the fact that in war, there is information and misinformation out there. As an independent observer, I am trying sort through what is what.If you will allow me, I will ask some questions. Please do not take is as doubting what you say, but only trying to come to an understanding of what happened.
Your description of the shooting at the ghetto seems very plausible to me. It is one of those horrors that would happen in war time. Do you have any other accounts of people in one of the concentration camps?
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RUR says:@Ron Unz
The Kingdom of Prussia (German: Königreich Preußen, pronounced was a German kingdom that constituted the state of Prussia between 1701 and 1918. It was the driving force behind the unification of Germany in 1866 and was the leading state of the German Empire until its dissolution in 1918. Although it took its name from the region called Prussia, it was based in the Margraviate of Brandenburg. Its capital was Berlin.
Brandenburg – Originally Slavic Brenna, a stronghold of the Stodoran tribe, from 948, with breaks, the seat of the bishopric. In the years 1154-1157, a stronghold of Prince Stodoran Jaksa of Kopanica, a vassal of Poland. In 1157 it was conquered by the Margrave of the Northern March Albrecht the Bear [5] and established as the capital of the Brandenburg March. In the years 1373–1415, together with the Mark of Brandenburg under the rule of the Czech Crown, within whose borders it bore the Czech name of Branibor. In 1417 the city lost its capital status to Berlin. Member of the Hanseatic League[4]. It suffered significantly during the Thirty Years’ War. In 1715, the Old Town and the New Town were merged. From 1871 within the borders of Germany.
Brandenburg and Prussia, later known as Brandenburg-Prussia, were populated predominantly by non-German, partly Germanized population till approximately 1866 (Danish and Austrian wars),, though the elite was mainly of German/Germanized origin… Prussia was the driving force behind the unification of Germany, so it was somewhat an artificial achievement, that couldnt last long
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Mark Bahner says:
My opinion is that in order for the Mock Trial to be as succinct as possible, the Prosecutor should choose a single piece of evidence, and prosecute on that. If Auschwitz is the strongest, then concentrate on that. That would be better than going through the voluminous arguments involved if it were to involve the whole Holocaust.
An important first point. This mock trial will be based on U.S. laws/customs (though there will be substantial differences, such as no judge).
This U.S.-law/customs-based mock trial is not a criminal mock trial. It’s a civil mock trial. There’s a huge difference in U.S. law between a criminal trial and a civil trial.
In a U.S. criminal trial, the burden of proof is “beyond a reasonable doubt”. In a U.S. civil trial, the decision is made based on a “preponderance of evidence”. That means that if even just 51% of the evidence points one way or the other, that is the way the juror should decide. And by 51% of the evidence, I don’t mean *amount*, I mean 51% in terms of, “I think the Plaintiff is more right,” or “I think the Defense is more right.”
That’s if we even have a trial. Right now, there is no Defense…probably because they know they’d lose. And just one potential juror. (I’ve accepted you as a juror, but the Defense hasn’t…because there is no defense.)
Also, I’ve stated the general evidence I plan to present, but the Defense hasn’t…because there is no Defense so far.
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Mark Bahner says:@kb_2
Hi,
I wanted to stay on this thread, but if there’s another thread that others can agree on, I’d go to it.
What I think would be *really* good is if Ron Unz would make a posting about why he thinks there were no gas chambers at Auschwitz.
Ron Unz…are you there? Would you please make some comments just related to Auschwitz?
I have my own blog on Typepad, but frankly, this website’s setup (with the “this commenter” and “this thread” and “hide thread” buttons is much better).
Mark
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Have you lost your mind, Mark?
Will you be sending Notices for all your discovery to the imaginary Defense?
You are correct, LRD will not be stricken from the panel, as he is not a raging idealogue, who would otherwise run circles around you regarding your overwhelming “evidence” and engineering abilities. If you actually knew what you were doing, YOU would strike him from the panel.
Juries run roughshod over evidence ALL THE TIME. Especially if they are mostly stupid, which is an accurate description of most Americans, these days.
So, go round up the former OJ panel, then head to a synagogue, and compile the appropriate balance of stupid/idealogue for your imaginary panel, who will hand over your imaginary victory.
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Mark Bahner says:
I don’t plan to respond to you anymore, “tiptoethrutulips”. You’re not interested in participating in this mock trial, so I won’t answer or respond to any comments you have about it.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Brad Anbro
On that note, Mr. Anbro, I came across a blip of a speech delivered by Bill Cooper (I think it was him) years ago wherein he surmised the reason no one (politicians/government) really works to stop third world immigration is due to the need to import a permanent underclass who will eventually “vote” for socialism, thereby getting their foot in the door for abject servitude of the populace.
It’s just so hard to believe, and yet, that’s exactly what’s happening. I’m in Texas, in an area with virtually no black population; then the Haitians swarm over a few years ago, and now I see blacks everywhere everyday. Have I been carjacked or assaulted? No, but for the first time in local history, security guards are posted in parking lots, and inside stores, at night just about everywhere. And some local idiot is whining all the time about the need for affordable housing.
My question is, when the most intelligent amongst us is dispatched or bred out, who is going to run everything, i.e., design/fly passenger jets, highway construction/maintenance, advanced communications, etc. The “elites” already run the show; what more do they want? Something else is going on here. Who wants to be the overlord of a shit show? Someone could offer me 100 million to run a show, but if it’s the equivalent of a show in The Congo, I’d say no thanks.
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Mark Bahner says:@RouterAl
The main reason you cannot find the “missing” Jews is they were trapped behind the Iron Curtain , rather ironic to be trapped by their own creation the Soviet state.
Are you saying that if Hungarian Jews had survived Auschwitz–instead of being murdered and cremated at Auschwitz–could never have made it back to Hungary after the war?
If that’s what you’re saying, how do you account for the Hungarian Jews who did survive Auschwitz, who did go back to Hungary after the war (many to Budapest)?
And the Iron Curtain fell circa 1990. There were plenty of people who were young adults with young children in 1944, who still were alive in 1990. The ones who weren’t alive were the ones murdered and cremated in Auschwitz in May through July 1944.
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HdC says:@Mark Bahner
What do I think? I want to know what you think! That’s why I wrote my post #1667!
You can calculate the fuel requirement yourself. A fresh corpse is about 75% water, and for that to be boiled off takes so many BTU. 1 Kg of coal-coke contains so many BTU. A prisoner’s body weight might be 125 lbs on average. You look up the required values and do the arithmetic.
You might ask your buddy Franny as she can copy and paste reams of papers for you to wade through.
I also want to know what you think about the other point I posted in regards to the colouration of the supposedly gassed corpses, as per my post #1667.
Then there is the problem that none of the eye witnesses to the gassings were able to describe any gas chamber, and were forced to admit under cross examination that everything they had testified to were rumours that they had overheard.
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Mark Bahner says:@kb_2
Hi,
No, I hadn’t seen this debate. I was particularly interesting in the parts about Auschwitz.
Here’s what Thomas Dalton says in his *conclusion* about Auschwitz:
If the Auschwitz bunkers killed only 100,000 (citation for this?), then 900,000 died in the crematoria. K1 in the main camp killed 20,000 max, which is peanuts; K4 and K5 combined have never been claimed to kill more than 80,000; which leaves 800,000 killed in K2 + K3. Wow—an impressive figure! I would like to see anything that even remotely sustains such a figure. And God forbid we should ask for a monthly breakdown (see my Table 27, Debating, p. 203).
As pointed out by his debate opponent, Mike Cockerill, this is nothing more than “debate by incredulity”. For example, “You’re telling me the United States went to the moon and just planted a flag, hit a golf ball, and collected some moon rocks? For all that money, that’s what they got?”
Plus, it’s very bad debating form–from a debating honesty standpoint–to leave the questioning of details of Auschwitz to the conclusion of the debate, when he’s the last one presenting. That doesn’t allow his opponent to address his question.
P.S. “Dr.” Thomas Dalton isn’t really a medical doctor, or a doctor of philosophy, is he? He didn’t get a doctorate at any university did he?
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John Wear says:@Mark Bahner
You write: “That’s if we even have a trial. Right now, there is no Defense…probably because they know they’d lose.”
My response: I will serve as defense attorney. I think we might want to move the mock trial to the site kb_2 suggested at https://www.unz.com/runz/more-falsehoods-of-world-war-ii/ so that he and perhaps others can follow along.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
Fair enough, and good luck to you.
But take my expert advice and kick LRD off the jury panel, as he is neither gullible nor over emotional. Nor Jewish. Nor a guilt ridden, indoctrinated German.
Also, queue up Schindler’s List during your opening statement, which is the same statement you made in voir dire, according to you, to knock your jurors over with a feather, which just so happens to be an accurate description/analogy of your evidence and persuasive abilities; a bit “feathery”, I would say.
Mr. Anbro is right; this is ridiculous, but it’s hard to resist because YOU are quite entertaining. In my opinion.
However, I look forward to observing you take on Mr. Wear. Good luck.
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Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
And, I look forward to observing you take on Mr. Wear.
Good luck. You are going to need it in spades.
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Mark Bahner says:
What do I think? I want to know what you think! That’s why I wrote my post #1667!
No, you wrote:
In his summation the learned Judge accepted the testimony of a Jewish witness that it took only 3.5Kg of coal-coke to cremate one corpse!
I’d like you to please calculate how many kilograms you think it would take to cremate the average body of a Hungarian Jew who was labeled as “unfit for work,” and thus put in the left line after “selection” at the Auschwitz railroad platform. (The left line went to the gas chambers and then to cremation.)
And I’d like you to please “show your work,” including a few remarks defending each assumption you make.
Again, I’d like your final answer to be in the number of kilograms *you* think is the right answer.
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Gabreal Jones says:@saggy
“Absolute rubbish. The holohoax is preposterous in every regard. For years the story was the 10,000 Jews per day were killed and cremated in Auschwitz and 10,000 per day in Treblinka. Absolutely everything about it is preposterous and there is not a shred of physical evidence for it.”
Right on the Shekels ( shackles)….
” Eisenhower foresaw a day when the horrors of the Holocaust might be denied and hear about his vigilance to preserve its truth.” (in above vid)
Check out : https://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/?p=270651 the gj comment ping pong (still in the moderation filter )
@ Black Pete
You will know Eisenhower was a Swedish j…../ for those not in the know:
http://theamericanchronicle.blogspot.com/2014/04/was-dwight-eisenhower-jew.html
https://cdn.preterhuman.net/texts/unsorted/JewWatch/jew-leaders-eisenhower.html
https://www.biblio.com/book/ike-eisenhower-swedish-jew/d/1456004759
” The flyer includes a photostat copy of Eisenhower’s 1915 West Point yearbook page, in which he’s facetiously described as the “terrible Swedish-Jew.”
http://historyreviewed.best/index.php/the-true-about-dwight-d-eisenhower-the-terrible-swedish-jew/
“Ike, the kike! Eisenhower’s Holocaust! “God, I hate the Germans…” –Dwight David Eisenhower in a letter to his wife in September, 1944.”
“he hated the German people as a race. It was his personal intent to destroy as many of them as he could, and one way was to wipe out as many prisoners of war as possible”
Peter Worthington, of the Ottowa Sun / in his column on September 12,1989 :
“…it is hard to escape the conclusion that Eisenhower was a war criminal of epic proportions. His policy killed more Germans in peace than were killed in the European Theatre.”
Eisenhower / Eisenhauer…? Anyway /Another zionide j. potus later on…
CIA O
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Mark Bahner says:@John Wear
Hi John,
OK, I’ll start posting all of my comments over at:
https://www.unz.com/runz/more-falsehoods-of-world-war-ii/
NOTICE TO EVERYONE: FROM HERE ONWARD, ALL MY COMMENTS REGARDING THE MOCK TRIAL WILL BE AT:
https://www.unz.com/runz/more-falsehoods-of-world-war-ii/
Best wishes,
Mark -
Tiptoethrutulips says:@Mark Bahner
I know you’re no longer conversing with me, but the burden of proof is on you.
You provide the evidence and calculations FIRST. That’s how it usually works, unless you are using Hollywood War Crimes, Tropes & Remedies, Volume 1, for reference.
As you claim you have an airtight case, you should have those handy dandy calculations/data laying around somewhere, and easily accessible to sling in everyone’s face.
Watch out for flying pearls!
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Ron Unz says:@Mark Bahner
OK, I’ll start posting all of my comments over at:
Actually, that discussion-thread isn’t really about the Holocaust, so I’ve now created a special Open Thread for all of you to continue your debate. Here’s the link:
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Mark Bahner says:@Ron Unz
Hi Ron,
GREAT! SUPER!
Thanks so much for doing this. Your website is truly wonderful for promoting discussion.
Everyone:
Now I’m over at: https://www.unz.com/announcement/the-holocaust-debate/
Thanks again,
MarkClick to Edit – 569100 minutes and 19 secondsAGREE/DISAGREE/ETC. THIS COMMENTER THIS THREAD HIDE THREAD
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